Posted by Yes, I agree wih both these posts-Grandma Peg
on November 15, 2000 at 16:39:25:
In Reply to: Not the expose we wanted - but exposure on a reputable news program posted by Liz Robbins on November 13, 2000 at 10:53:39:
: I think that Thimerosal may have been Joe's problem. However, it needs to be said that he received the MMR at 15 months and between 15 mos and 2 years he went from the 90% for height and weight down to the 60% despite the fact that he had no change in his eating habits. He was chowing down on food. He would have about three poopy diapers a day and I would think that it was just because he was eating so much. He had to have another check up at 2 1/2 just so they could make sure he was growing OK. He did grow, but he started to have terrible sinus infections, strep that led to scarlet fever, and had an allergic reaction to amoxycillin during this time frame. After a healthy month he tagged along to his brothers well exam and it was at that time that both my boys were immunized for chicken pox. Two weeks later, Joe had a three day screaming spell. I took him to the doctor and he found nothing. A day later I took him again and he had ear infection in both ears and was put on a sulfur antibiotic. After this, the regression was undeniable. My mother in law thought maybe he had lost his hearing.
: Anyway, sorry for unloading this but I don't think that MMR is the whole deal but in my red headed angel's case, it was certainly part of the equation. Granted, 60 Minutes was not an expose, but it was exposure on a very reputable news program.
: : Well, certainly not the expose that one would have hoped for, and yet it is exposure. I was not surprised with the format; I am glad that CBS chose to play it as an inquiry and not an inquisition; God Bless Ed Bradley for being a very level headed person. I do think they could have dedicated a bit more time to the segment, to better explore exactly what Wakefield's theory is, instead of the vaguemention almost as an aside that it received, but I guess the world needed to know about those naked Brits and their pin-ups for charity.
: : (Disclaimer: I do not mean to make light about anyone who comes up with a novel and basically harmless and fun way to raise nearly 3/4 of a million dollars for cancer research, or any other similar cause. I salute these women for their courage, their ingenuity, and the remarkable good taste they displayed in the layout of their calendar. I can envision as many if not more sales actually going to women, as it was more an exercise in empowerment of the female in her less than perfect form than it was in titlation of the male organ.)
: : It is interesting to note thatin their efforts to debunk Wakefield, the vaccine police are using the very tactics (unwarranted fear campaign) they accuse we parents of using to defame their sacred MMR. They claim that by promoting doubt of the safety of the triple shot, Wakefield is guilty of causing millions to not get vaccinated, thereby risking major outbreaks of measles. I don't know what these good "drs." are listening to, but I clearly heard Wakefield say he did not advocate not getting vaccinated, but rather to break the shots down and space them out. His (Wakefield) argument about the govt's responsibility to use the safer method is sound both logically and morally.
: : Their (the bullies) argument that breaking it down will cause parents to fail to follow thru with the regiment is also fallacious. 21 shots in the current battery, 21 shots before age 5, 21 shots before you are cleared to enter school. I believe most parents will get the three individual shots with little problem. We take our babies to the doctor at least twice a year until they are schools aged. I trust the doctors to remind us which letter of the alphabet we are on.
: : I did not hear them refute any of Wakefield's theory per se, except to dismiss it as so much heresy in its entirety. I recall from history that the locked up Galileo for suggesting not all heavenly bodies revolved around the Earth, and they laughed at Columbus for suggesting the Earth was round. One day science will catch up and we shall see who was correct and who was wrong.
: : I do not trust the govt. agencies to always tell us the truth, nor to have conducted proper studies. I believe they rely too heavily upon in-house studies conducted by the makers of the vaccines; remember the lessons of the once-thought safe Rotashield, and the current anthrax debacle.
: : My proposal still stands as a way to test Wakefield's hypothesis. Take three states with negative opulation growth (I would chose Alaska, North Dakota and West Virginia as suitable) and do not use MMR, but rather single shot vaccines spaced 6 mos. apart. Then after 3 years or so, see if the rate of prevalance there is less than in the "control" states. That will go a long way to supporting or disproving Dr. Wakefield.
: : Oh yeh, and I was also disappointed that they didn't mention the work (so recently published) by Dr. Singh which also suggests there is a very direct connection between MMR and some autism. Perhaps on another show.
: : Just for the record, I do not think my boy, my beautiful little red-head, my strange, silent cherub is indeed spawned of the MMR. Looking back, he did not regress after receiving this shot. That does not mean I do not think that some children may indeed be the product of a faulty innoculation.
: : My boy is the way he is due to Thimerasol damage.
REPLY; WARNING - SOAP BOX MATERIAL; yes, I was also disappointed that mercury poisening wasn't even hinted at. In our grandson's case, it's been nearly impossible to say 'when' IT started, he seemed to have problems from the time he came home from the hospital; Muscle weakensses which the ped. Dr. decided were 'borderline' and not to worry, the usual. We live in Indiana, one of the states with MANDATORY NEWBORN INFANT immuizations of flu Hib shots and Hep. B shot. Parents are not asked if they want this, this Frankenstien-ian program is a state mandate. His little sister is very bright in many areas, beyond her age in some, moderate in others and some milestone indicators, she just doesn't 'grasp' yet. She has other sensory problems but otherwise is not in the same condition her brother has. This is hindsight of course, but I don't think the type of name-disease-vaccine used would have made any difference, it was the content of the vaccines and the timing of them. They are both affected. Also in hindsight, if they had asked, we, being then totally trusting in the health care 'system', would probably have given consent. After all, we wouldn't want to place our kds at risk if they could be immunized against such deadly diseases. We didn't know that both those diseases are more apt to affect older people, mature adults, we just had no info. I was aware that USA standards for HIV, aids, many SIB's, those infected with any of those, could still be working in food areas, possibly health care positions, because of federal laws prohibiting even asking if a person might have any of those, much less reuire blood tests, etc. Those are Federally protected diseases because of the social aspects of the people involved. The fact that you or I or our kids could be at risk by sources other than sex or drug use direct contact isn't often mentioned. However, when the gov't. wants you to get your kids 'jabbed', they will threaten you with a possibility that 'some health care provider' could pass 'something' on to your infant. My question is obvious, what the heck are they doing still working in those public supply fields if they have those diseases? Well, that was an aside but I feel it's related to the whole vacinne program. There are also many peope who feel that the governments OWN your kids. You already know that many in gov't. think we don't have the sense to do that job either. Yes, the TV program ignored or left out a lot. It was supposed to be for beginners but it was still terribly one-sided, in favor of gov't. programs and to heck with the kids and the parents. I think that anytime such mandatory programs come out of any government, there's something more to it and evil is 'afoot'. Grandma Peg