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Old 02-11-2011, 07:47 PM   #1
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Inattention ADHD

My 10 yr old son is currently undergoing diagnosis for this type of ADHD. His symptoms don't fit the category but his forgetfulness for one has his teacher baffled and we've tried everything. He's very smart and gets good grades, but his behavior is erratic and not appropriate for a child his age.

Symptoms Include:
Being distracted or forgetful
Losing things that are needed to complete tasks
Failing to pay attention and keep on task
Not listening
Interrupting
Tantrums and crying
Argueing

I have had a horrible night and am just beside myself. My son was stomping his feet and being dramatic about putting on his pajamas. He'd raised his voice at me a couple of times about nothing over the afternoon. It seems just like bad behavior but it's more than that. His teacher of 30 yrs has tried everything to get him to remember to bring his school work home and not misplace things at school. She doesn't know what's going on and neither do we.

I had to raise my voice to a ridiculous degree to get him to stop tantruming. He's 10 now. I'd be mortified if anyone heard me and I hate it. My husband said it's putting him in an early grave.

Can anyone relate or give me words of advice. I'm almost crying but just too warn out to.

 
Old 02-11-2011, 08:25 PM   #2
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Re: Inattention ADHD

mominbucks- so sorry for your situation. My son is 9, and I think he has ADD. He is very forgetful as well, and he'll stare out the window during class and not pay attention. It's very hard to organize him and keep him on task. My son doesn't have any disruptive behaviors, though.

It's good that you are getting him tested. ADHD can continue on into adulthood, it shouldn't be overlooked. Just wondering if your son is able to stay on task with something he enjoys; or shows a creative side? I can only speak for my son (Who I believe is ADD without the disruptive behaviors) but he has a problem staying on task with homework when the room is too loud or there are other blatant distractions. He tries so hard; if there is a drip in the sink he finds himself distracted and will try to shut down my entire house and make it quiet to be able to finish it. He knows what he's supposed to do; he just can't when there is anything going on. He'll tell his sisters "Stop bothering me, I can't do this when you are in the room!" or you will tell him to do something simple and he'll come back into the room 2 minutes later and say "I forgot what you just asked me". His organizational skills are horrible although he desperately tries to pay attention and do as told. He's very flexible; he can think about many things at once if there isn't any pressure to. Give him something that doesn't require a schedule/set rules/time limit, and he's so content- things like drawing pictures, or making things that he can create vs. follow directions (In his case, building those Lego Bionicle toys). He'll jump from one thing to the next, never finishing the last.

Short term/working memory can be low in ADD children (my son scores at the 3% percentile, super low!) I've met one disruptive ADHD child that sounds similar to yours- the tantrums are actually pretty common I hear.

I wish I had some magical words of wisdomt to convey; I don't. What I guess I can say is that with my son, what works is constant reinforcements. Trying to get him to do something that nets a worthy prize; "Put your PJ's on quickly! The ice cream will melt if you take too long!" and he d*mn near trips over himself to get it done! I don't have struggles like you have with your son, but I try to throw consistency out the window with him. He gets much needed "alone" time to do whatever he wants; if I take that time away from him, he can be very distracted all day long because his mind is wandering to what he truly wants. His mind is hyperactive in a way; although it never organizes itself, it's always going. He doesn't sleep well at night as a result unfortunately. With school work, I sit with him and keep him on task and try to make it as quiet as possible.

Have you considered taking your son to a therapist? My son sees a school counselor; he can talk about anything and everything that's bothering him and he gets stuff off of his mind and maybe a little reinforcement from another adult that what I do for him isn't wrong. Does he have a venue to release internal grief? I tell my son "Relax, calm down, go jump on the trampoline and cool off" LOL!

I hope I helped, feel free to vent to me anytime.

 
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Old 02-11-2011, 09:15 PM   #3
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Re: Inattention ADHD

Thank you for your quick reply. I really appreciate it. It's been such a frustrating day that ended in an awful night. Everyday seems to be difficult for one reason or another and it's so tiring. It sounds like your son and mine definely have some things in common.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Verucalise View Post
He is very forgetful as well, and he'll stare out the window during class and not pay attention. It's very hard to organize him and keep him on task. My son doesn't have any disruptive behaviors, though.
Same with my son. His emotional difficulties come out with his father and I, but not at school. He cries during homework, has trouble controlling his emotions and argues. It's exhausting.

We have tried everything to help him do simple things like bring home his homework and not lose things but nothing helps. His teacher is perplexed and wanted him tested asap. She said she often has trouble getting his attention. He wants so much to do well - and he gets very good grades - but he can't do some very basic things.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Verucalise View Post
It's good that you are getting him tested. ADHD can continue on into adulthood, it shouldn't be overlooked. Just wondering if your son is able to stay on task with something he enjoys; or shows a creative side? I can only speak for my son (Who I believe is ADD without the disruptive behaviors) but he has a problem staying on task with homework when the room is too loud or there are other blatant distractions.
He loves doing creative things and can stay focused on things he likes to do. He can even sit and read for long periods of time, but like your son if there is any distraction during homework he can't do it. He always wants to stop what he's doing and tell me something unrelated.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Verucalise View Post
He knows what he's supposed to do; he just can't when there is anything going on.
That's also what's frustrating. They want to do well but struggle so much.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Verucalise View Post
or you will tell him to do something simple and he'll come back into the room 2 minutes later and say "I forgot what you just asked me".
Yep.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Verucalise View Post
His organizational skills are horrible although he desperately tries to pay attention and do as told. He's very flexible; he can think about many things at once if there isn't any pressure to. Give him something that doesn't require a schedule/set rules/time limit, and he's so content- things like drawing pictures, or making things that he can create vs. follow directions (In his case, building those Lego Bionicle toys). He'll jump from one thing to the next, never finishing the last.
My son can finish what he's doing under those same circumstances, but his organizational skills are terrible too. It's so perplexing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Verucalise View Post
what works is constant reinforcements. Trying to get him to do something that nets a worthy prize; " Put your PJ's on quickly! The ice cream will melt if you take too long!" and he d*mn near trips over himself to get it done!
Thank you, those are very good ideas. I guess the hard part is that he's 10 now and those are things we had to do when he was so much younger. We feel like he should be beyond that now and not argue about brushing teeth or simple things like that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Verucalise View Post
He doesn't sleep well at night as a result unfortunately. With school work, I sit with him and keep him on task and try to make it as quiet as possible.
My son has a very hard time going to sleep and I get so exhausted with all of the getting up and asking questions. I feel like I only have so much energy to give before I'm depleted. I have to sit and do homework with him as well a lot of the time. Again, it's one of those daily activites that you feel like your son should just be able to sit down and do every night without tears and drama and he can't.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Verucalise View Post
Have you considered taking your son to a therapist?
We tried a few years ago when certain things were going on, but he hated it. We're getting him evaluted at a good hospital and hopefully we'll get some answers and help. We need it. My husband said that he feels like all of this is putting him in an early grave and he can't wait for my son to grow up. And he's a wonderful man and father. He feels bad about it. Everyday is just such a chore over the simplest things.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Verucalise View Post
My son sees a school counselor; he can talk about anything and everything that's bothering him and he gets stuff off of his mind and maybe a little reinforcement from another adult that what I do for him isn't wrong. Does he have a venue to release internal grief? I tell my son "Relax, calm down, go jump on the trampoline and cool off" LOL!
Getting threw to my son and getting him to calm down feels like an imposibility. We're patient and help him try to get focused. When he's corrected in any way he starts to cry. It's inappropriate behavior for a child his age and it's overwhelming hard to cope with.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Verucalise View Post
I hope I helped, feel free to vent to me anytime.
Well I guess I just did. It's very helpful to know that someone else is dealing with many of the same issues. I don't feel like anyone else will really understand.

Anyway, I suppose this is a very long reply but so much heartache has built up. Thanks for your help.

 
Old 02-11-2011, 09:30 PM   #4
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Re: Inattention ADHD

I'm not the right person to be offering advice about how to deal with an ADHD child, as I have no children of my own. As a result, I'll be leaving that part to more qualified respondents.

What I can do, however, is confirm for you that all the symptoms and behaviours you listed are consistent with the inattentive subset of ADHD.

The arguing, tantrums and general emotional difficulties are normally a function of the lack of impulse control that comes along with ADHD. Interrupting, loud talking, not listening/lack of attention generally stems from the fact that something else has his attention (often an internal train of thought), and it can be extremely difficult for an ADHDer to shift their attention.

Interrupting is something I continue to struggle with, personally, and I find it's less about not caring what the other person has to say, than it is that I had planned to say something, and once the process has begun, it takes huge effort to stop it, and once stopped, that train of thought can be irretrievably lost, which adds to difficulty in holding back in someone that has problems with impulse control. Did you follow all that? It felt like a ramble, lol, and is probably indecipherable.

But yes, misplacing things, forgetting instructions, daydreamy behaviour (i.e. fails to listen, can't stay on task), these are all hallmarks of Inattentive ADHD. The only advice I will offer is, be firm. Because we have little control of our impulses, we can benefit greatly from a firm hand that keeps us in line, even when we don't like it. When I think of the abuse I heaped upon my own mother (we didn't know what ADHD was in the '70s and '80s), but her strength kept me on track into my second year of University (at which time I moved out and the wheels came off, but that's a story for another day). Continue with the evaluation, and consider all treatment options carefully, because of the advances in our understanding of this disorder, your son still has the opportunity to live a full and productive life.

Best of luck.

 
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Old 02-11-2011, 09:35 PM   #5
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Re: Inattention ADHD

Definitely, get him tested. Also, insist on getting help with non-drug therapies as well as medication. A professional may have many ideas on motivation, discipline, schoolwork, etc.

One very interesting school of thought on ADHD, supported by recent brain research, is that it is a developmental delay in the parts of the brain responsible for things like self-control. Which means your son is 10, and he can read and do a lot of other things as well as most 10-year-olds, but when it comes to focusing and controlling his behavior, he might be quite a bit younger.

Never fear, he will learn in time. ADHD adults may forget their keys a lot, or get impatient, but they generally ARE able to pass as functioning adults. In fact, they used to believe that ADHD went away at puberty, because that was the age at which most ADHD kids matured enough to follow basic classroom discipline and generally pass for normal, even if they were still struggling in other ways.

 
Old 02-11-2011, 10:02 PM   #6
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Re: Inattention ADHD

Thank you all for your advice and compassion. It's more helpful than you know. I am at such a low moment right now.

Thunar, thank you so much for sharing your story. You are doing a great service to me. I feel like I understand him better now. What you described sounds exactly like my son. Your advice on what worked for you is very helpful. I had to put my foot down so hard tonight to get his attention when he was having a tantrum that I feel like the worst mother in the world. I so don't want to have to do that, but I have to. I don't like myself when I do.

I don't feel like I have the skills, knowledge or energy to cope with this. You're right in that there is much more we can know about this condition. I pray that the doctors can give us the help we need to help him. It's such a struggle on a daily basis.

You're sharing all of that is making me feel more hopeful and less bad about myself. Knowing what worked for you will improve my outlook. It's just sooooooooo hard having to go to such lengths for the simplest things.

Thank you.

And janewhite1 thank you for your quick response too. Knowing that there are compassionate people ready to help is wonderful.

I'm waiting to get an appt within the next few days. I know that it's overdue. As a parent you just feel like if you did more he'd get better and it's your fault somehow.

Your description also fit the bill exactly. We hope that some of these things he will outgrow. Certain aspects of my son being so mature, and that other parts are not, is very true. It's like he's two different people sometimes.

He feels bad about not being able to remember things like his classmates and he can never remember what he needs to bring home or turn in at school. I ask him why he behaves the way he does and he has no idea why and neither do we. He's very loving and sorry for it afterward. His not being able to do simple things and at the same time being so smart in so many ways has us all befuddled.

Anyway, sorry to be going on like this but it's been such a struggle and it's good to be able to talk to people who understand.

I guess one of the other things we worry about is what will be able to help him What behavioral therepies are there that will change any of this? We really wonder. The drs appt will be soon however and we pray that will help.

Thanks again so much to everyone. You've done more for me than you know.

 
Old 02-13-2011, 11:22 AM   #7
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Re: Inattention ADHD

Quote:
Originally Posted by Thunor View Post
The only advice I will offer is, be firm. Because we have little control of our impulses, we can benefit greatly from a firm hand that keeps us in line, even when we don't like it. When I think of the abuse I heaped upon my own mother (we didn't know what ADHD was in the '70s and '80s), but her strength kept me on track into my second year of University (at which time I moved out and the wheels came off, but that's a story for another day). Continue with the evaluation, and consider all treatment options carefully, because of the advances in our understanding of this disorder, your son still has the opportunity to live a full and productive life.
Thunor may I also ask you how it was that your mother helped you if you can site anything specific? By a firm hand did you mean that she made you adhere to the house rules and things like that? How did she encourage you with everything going on? I feel so clueless.

If you can think of anything that may help I'd appreciate it very much. Take care and thanks again.

 
Old 02-13-2011, 02:26 PM   #8
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Re: Inattention ADHD

I also believe my parents did a great job with me.

Structure, rules, definitely key. From a fairly early age I was expected to set the table for the family's dinner and help clear away afterward, put away my own clothes after they were folded, get myself ready for school on time, and the chore list grew as I got older. After school, I would either come straight home to check in, go to an organized activity or go to a friend's house, and in any case my parents would know where I was.

Homework was tough a lot of the time. Sometimes I struggled through it, sometimes I dropped the ball. After the ball was dropped, there were consequences. My parents almost always backed up the authority of my teachers, barring a few instances of real teacherfail. Didn't keep me from messing up again, but it kept me trying my best, and as I grew my best got better.

I think that's really the key. You can't expect him to be just like his peers overnight, but you can and must demand progress.

 
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Old 02-13-2011, 05:18 PM   #9
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Re: Inattention ADHD

I think Jane summed it up pretty well, structure is key for ADHD. In my house, the rules were set down, and were simple, but non-negotiable. The times we woke up, ate breakfast, got out the door, had dinner, did homework and went to bed were all set and didn't vary (except on weekends). Homework was completed at the kitchen table before any play or television; tantrums and fights with siblings weren't tolerated.

I honestly don't recall a time that I fought the system in any meaningful way, it was a hegemony and didn't know any other way. Of course, homework was a struggle on some days (and I became rather adept at lying about it, but again, a story for another day), and I shirked my chores with the best of them, not that I got away with it.

That's not to say that I feel Mom was hard on me, I recall a happy childhood, and was something of a mama's boy until I lost her in 2008. But she kept me on the straight and narrow, even when I didn't respond kindly to it.

 
Old 02-14-2011, 04:12 PM   #10
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Re: Inattention ADHD

mominbucks- Like I said, I only believe my son has ADD. But, don't feel bad that you "lose it" or yell. It's frustrating as a parent to see how easy it is for other kids; even harder for us to try and understand why our children can't do it.

With myself, it's much repetition, list making, etc... my son has a list on his door of everything he should be doing on a day to day basis. Doesn't mean he always remembers it, but it's always there. "Did you do your list?" "Oh, yeah!". Another thing we like to do is focus games with him that net rewards. My son has 2 baby sisters who still drink out of bottles/sippy cups and those babies are nightmares- they like to HIDE them! So instead of searching my house for an hour, I tell him "For every bottle you find, I'll let you stay up 10 minutes past your bedtime". He focuses, he knows what he'll earn as a result, and he might forget what he's supposed to be doing, but he'll remember what his reward is, which then brings him back to what he's supposed to be doing. Constantly having to use his memory is great. He's gotten much better over the years- my son thru similar fits about the same things a few years ago. It WILL pass. He IS getting better- but I can't control the environment at school. I can only tell the teachers what works.

I also do not hold back on my son- I will speak to him clearly, concising, anything that works to get to him. I force eye contact, and tell him "I told you to clean your room, and you weren't. What were you doing?" "Playing with my toys." "What did I ask you to do?" "I don't remember." Then I point to his list on the door and he goes "Oh, YEAH!" and gets back on track. Sometimes, it's not that easy. But I use subtle clues and try to force him to remember, like "What happens when you leave your toys on the floor?" "Oh, crap, (insert baby sisters name) gets them!" "So what are you supposed to do to avoid that?" "Pick them up!"

I like actions & consequences- I want him to understand that if he doesn't remember things, that he might have an unintended result. I will tell him multiple times, what happens IF he does this, does that... and leave it up to him to decide. But I will make TRUE to my promises... he will have to go to bed early, or whatever. Another thing: very IMPORTANT with my son. I give him choices, but only choices that suit ME if he decides to get all uppity with me. "Please bring your laundry downstairs." "I'll do it later." (Which we know WON'T happen) "You have two choices: You either bring your laundry downstairs now and then go back to playing, or you can go to bed right now." "Ok, ok... i'm doing it." No power struggles- and if I say it, I mean it. If he misbehaved when he was younger, I sat him on the stairs, told him what he did was wrong, why it was wrong, and actually left the punishment to him. "You are going to sit here and think about what you've done. When you decide to act your age, you may get up. If you misbehave again, I will sit you down for the rest of the night." Clear cut works best with him, and never backing down! I've rarely had to raise my voice in 2-3 years, he knows not to mess with mom- she means business!

I really think a little structure works the best with ADD- again, these are what I've done with my child, and it's worked great. He's super well behaved, and he knows I'm not putting up with it LOL.

Just a few thoughts... not sure if any of this will help, but I hope it will. It'll take some time before he understands if you try this- not a miracle worker, but a great behavioral tool. Being strict is NOT a crime- raising your voice is NOT a sin. So don't feel bad- Being a parent is not about being nice, it's about ensuring our kids grow up to understand and learn what the worlds all about!

 
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Old 02-21-2011, 10:36 AM   #11
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Re: Inattention ADHD

Hi mominbucks, I maybe not very qualify professional to give you some helpful pointers but currently had read this psychology book under ADHD. There was a case study where this kid had good result from his school readiness testing, it was not till end of his first grade that his inattention and poor concentration become obvious. He was more accustomed to work on things that interest him at a pace that suited his temperament but found it hard to work under CONSTRAINT imposed by his teacher. Fidgeting, easily distracted and incompletion of his assignment on time were some of the symptoms shown.
He was scheduled for a physical examination, his pediatrician recommended him to a clinical psychologist and medication was postpone.
According to his psychologist, he fit the DSM IV criteria for ADHD and program were developed for his teacher and parent to help him focus hid attention on his task effectively.
A trial of Ritalin was used in conjunction with the program develop by his psychologist. He was taught to 'talk to himself' as a meant to keep his attention focused so on and so forth.

Ritalin was used widely in the US for the treatment of ADHD but there's a wide range of feasible intervening techniques that could be far more better than just using medication.

Speak with a professional in this matter and things will just get better in your home.
Having Rules and regulations in the house will definitely make him learn the effective work habits rather than letting children be indecent of adult authority at a very young age.

Kinda long and maybe a bit out of point but they are your kid afterall, don't give up hope!
Good luck!

 
Old 02-21-2011, 11:16 AM   #12
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Re: Inattention ADHD

Hi there,

Thanks to everyone as always for all of the help and input.

We're in the process of having my son fully evaluated through a program at a local hospital. We filled out surveys, as did my son's teacher, and submitted them. They referred us to a psychiatrist who will do some further evaluating and then make some recommendations.

Keeping up a consistent routine helps a lot and any deviation from it, especially at nighttime, causes problems. Emotional difficulties, so I do whatever I can with that.

It's a helpless feeling because on a daily basis activities that should be easy are not: nightly homework is a struggle, having him remember to turn things in/bring things home, do things for himself.

I'm really hoping that there will be behavioural methods of treatment that we can start with first before medication, but friends remind me that we need to do whatever will work.

I've had some very helpful replies from members here and always appreciate whatever advice is given. Some days just get really tiring and worrying a lot in addition to the stress can make life hard.

Thanks again.

 
Old 02-21-2011, 02:11 PM   #13
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Re: Inattention ADHD

My son had all of those symptoms. We had him tested in 1st grade and the doctor thought part of the issue is that he is one of the youngest in his class. Went through 2nd and 3rd with teachers who must have been scared to say anthing to me and I get that because so many people get angry at them.

This year, in 4th, he has the best teacher in the world. She's taught 29 years. She told me of the behaviors he was exhibiting in class. I finally asked her if she thought he should be tested again and she said without a doubt. She has taught a lot of adhd kids and has one of her own. I did not want my son on meds but when I realized he has missed so much of the basics because he could not focus, I reluctantly let the dr give him Adderall XR. It has made a world of difference. He can sit at his desk (not hovering over it) to do an assignment. He can grasp the material. He doesn't shout out anymore. He has gone from average to below average in grade to As and Bs.

 
Old 02-21-2011, 10:15 PM   #14
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Re: Inattention ADHD

ParanoidnWorry,

Thank you for the information. I consider your advice to mominbucks
to be among the best I've seen posted on this board.

I've been exhaustively researching ADHD. ADHD symptoms are caused by genetics interacting with environment.

The "wide range of feasible intervening techniques" you mention [are] far better than just using medication. Medication alone is useless more often than not. Medication does control the biological (genetic) end. In more severe cases of ADHD, intervention (environmental) alone is useless more often than not. Medication + Intervention = the child successfully overcomes ADHD and its symptoms permanently, more often than not.

ADHD's biological (neurological) dysfunctions inhibits the child's ability to learn how to control their thoughts and actions to produce coherent behavior. How do "we" control our thoughts and actions? Self-talk. We have an ongoing conversation with ourselves on the topics of: Getting ready for what lies ahead in time--our goals; our plans; our assignments; and weighing potential future outcomes of acting on immediate impulses and desires. "It be so funny to plop a wad (spitball) on 3rd grade Mrs. Goodteacher's back." I missed but got detention anyway. Did I learn? No. Dr. Halowell, co-author of "Driven to Distraction" - a must read - replies for all children (and many ADHD adults) to the question "How many times do I have to tell you?" with "A few hundred times, at least."

"Driven to Distraction" discusses the advantageous characteristics of ADHD and how to build on them.

Two of those advantageous characteristics are me-to-a-T.
  • A zany sense of humor, an unpredictable approach to anything and everything
  • Highly intuitive style

Those qualities make it impossible for me to learn under CONSTRAINT imposed by any teacher. When I'm studying, I'm relying on my intuitive deductive reasoning, not on rote memory or remembering the facts and figures on the subject. I do best consuming large chunks, several chapters to several volumes, as I seek just one thing - the big picture - that is, an overall grasp of the subject I knew little about. For a certainty I need the guidance of a teacher to ultimately gain mastery and the interface of other students to hone and correct my progressive understanding. I get both the teachers and other students interface right here on this board with my study on the neurology and psychology of ADHD.

Dr. Halowell teaches how to overcome the disadvantages of my advantageous ADHD characteristics.

1. Impulsively reaching conclusions prematurely. Then posting them here. Then having to retract the next day. Then feeling like dumb bozo with severe ADHD. Don't do that.

2. Checking my conclusions by reviewing the facts. The best method for me is to do a little write-up just as I'm doing now.

Oh, don't worry, be happy, I have carefully checked my facts and conclusions - this case.

My purpose for researching ADHD is too help me control my ADHD. I'm pleased with my progress. Frankly, I think very few could get to my level in such a short time. If I enrolled in a night course at Community College, I would not have gained nearly as much. IMHO educators expect students to grasp disconnected details while studying Brain-Bugs 101. Give me the framework first, then hanging the billions of details becomes more doable once I knew where they go.

Let's draw links to the advice you've given.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ParanoidnWorry View Post
He was more accustomed to work on things that interest him at a pace that suited his temperament but found it hard to work under CONSTRAINT imposed by his teacher. Fidgeting, easily distracted and incompletion of his assignment on time were some of the symptoms shown.
-- Powerful

Quote:
Originally Posted by ParanoidnWorry View Post
He was scheduled for a physical examination, his pediatrician recommended him to a clinical psychologist and medication was postpone.

According to his psychologist, he fit the DSM IV criteria for ADHD and program were developed for his teacher and parent to help him focus hid attention on his task effectively.

A trial of Ritalin was used in conjunction with the program develop by his psychologist. He was taught to 'talk to himself' as a meant to keep his attention focused so on and so forth.
I'm shocked. The psychologist managing this boy's care is one of the very select few that actually does something good for his patients.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ParanoidnWorry View Post
Having Rules and regulations in the house will definitely make him learn the effective work habits rather than letting children be indecent of adult authority at a very young age.
- Absolutely

I am so disgusted with the worse than worthless, dangerous "care" most of the shrinks, psyches and bozo MD's dish out on the ADHD.

Researchers have learned so much about ADHD in the past decade that could be used by doctors that would produce beneficial results just like those you reported.

It is sickening. Thank you so much for your report. I'll be danged, there are a few good doctors after-all, damn few, but few is better than none.

Bob

 
Old 02-22-2011, 02:45 PM   #15
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Re: Inattention ADHD

mominbucks,

Verucalise, Thunor and JaneWhite, in fact everyone this thread, has contributed rock-solid advise on what ADHD children really need to overcome this potentially quality-of-life destroying disorder. ADHD is complex. The variations in the symptoms vary widely from person to person. "Degree" is another variable. ADHD is not like pregnancy - you are or you aren't. ADHD symptoms can range from mild to severe. Most of the variables affect medication choices. Mild cases, IMHO, can be managed without meds especially when the diagnosed at a young age. In my layman's opinion, your son has high moderate to severe ADHD. Most likely, again in my layman's opinion, medication will be needed. I so hope you get a shrink that understands which medications are most likely to help your son.

It angers me how few shrinks apparently cannot correlate the specific symptoms manifested to the medications most likely to help. Make sure the pdoc gets your son's medical history as well as his behavioral history based on your observations and those of his teachers. A good psychiatrist can draw from his history a good picture of the specific causes of your boy's ADHD. Psychiatry does not yet have tests that can detect the biological causes of ADHD. Nevertheless, a good doctor can see the causes through the window that our medical and behavioral history opens into the brain, that is, if said "good" doctor looks through that virtual window. Failure to "look" can result in a medication prescription that does so much harm that parents curse the day they took their child into the shrink chamber.

A question directed to all if you care to respond. How many were diagnosed with ADHD by a doctor that never looked at your medical or behavioral history?

The ADHD questionairs do provide useful information when answered by parents and teachers. Parents objectively base their answers on observations over a time span of years. Adult patient answers are based on highly distorted perceptions of the past two days. On each question, literally EACH question, I could honestly reply "depends."

I read "Driven to Distraction" years ago. I missed nearly all the great information the book contains on that first read. I read it again last week. Damn, it is a very good book and has tons of accurate beneficial information I can use now. My physical health problems at the time were badly worsening my unknown-to-me ADHD symptoms. I couldn't see clearly how the book described me before the chemo. My liver doctor suggested that I look into ADD. I read "Driven to Distraction."

My first few "shrinks did not ask for my medical records. The dumb stupid bozos had no clue that physical health problems were exascerbating my symptoms. No doctor can manage our health care without our medical records.

One of the symptoms listed in Driven to Distraction: "Inconsistent performance despite great effort. People with ADHD do great one hour and lousy the next, or great one day and lousy the next, regardless of effort and time in preparation. They go from the penthouse to the outhouse in no time at all!

On each question, literally EACH question, I could honestly reply "depends." Now I could add, "depends on whether I'm in the penthouse or the outhouse on the day I'm answering the questions that will be used to determine whether I'm ADHD.

Does anyone else feel something just ain't right with mental health care?

Science can now say with certainty that genetics predisposes us to ADHD. Just a few months back, researchers discovered one of the many genetic abnormalities. Each of the many possible suspected genes have been described as having minor effect. Our ADHD genome comes about from the interaction between the specific abnormal genes each of us with ADHD possess. The is a lot of variations between each result set. Those variations powerfully influence the specific set of symptoms each of us display. Some are hyperactive. Some aren't. -- one of the many possible symptom variations. The genetic interaction result sets can and often do create the potential for other disorders along with ADHD.

Stressful environmental factors break the ADHD genome weak link. The physical environmental factors can include toxic chemicals. Kids without the ADHD weak link survive toxic poisoning unscathed. In my case, evidently birth problems deprived my little brain of O2 long enough to break me at my weakest link. Psychiatrists need to know about every event that can cause brain injury including accidents that did not merit a trip to the doctors office. Include seemingly inconsequential head impact events. Show me a kid that hasn't landed on his head a couple times? It is what us boy type kids do.

And, of course, there a few zillion environmental factors of the psychological type. You can diminish their impact by understanding how your son operates and then working with it. I'm not talking about parenting skills. You obviously are a good parent. Try implementing methods that utilize your son's ADHD method of operation.

Method 1: We do interaction well. No way to this day I can pay attention to a teacher's lecture. On the other hand, if the teacher lead me in a Q&A discussion, I'd find same topic so interesting I wouldn't know I learned, grasped and understood plus enjoyed the same subject material that painfully bored me while teach rattled on.

Method 2: Turn study into play. I made a model to help me understand the relationships between brain parts. I wrote a little code to see how voltages trigger neuron action. I had fun. And I learned. Cool.

I purposefully commented on ParanoidnWorry's post to underscore how well the methods she reported on work.

One of the causes of ADHD are genes that contain corrupted instructions that govern how neurons in the neuro-chemical signal transmission paths recycle norepinephrine and dopamine neurotransmitters. The signal sent fails to reach brain concentration support modules causing attention to behave like the attention of a mentally exhausted person. Executive functions that a bad hit from ADHD. Under developed executive centers inhibit a child's ability to learn how to control their thoughts and actions. Interestingly, Dr. Russ Barkley, a prominent research psychologist, recognized self-talk as our means of controlling our thoughts and actions -- especially those required to accomplish tasks, reach goals at that time when they should be completed. Self talk enables us to make decisions that keep us on track toward achievement and resist urges to satisfy immediate gratifications at the cost of our future.

May I suggest that you help your son "talk to himself." I'm in awe of the replies you received on this your thread. There is no way, anyone, can improve on the teaching methods Verucalise is using to help her ADHD son.

Read this quote carefully: "I also do not hold back on my son- I will speak to him clearly, concising, anything that works to get to him. I force eye contact, and tell him "I told you to clean your room, and you weren't. What were you doing?" "Playing with my toys." "What did I ask you to do?" "I don't remember." Then I point to his list on the door and he goes "Oh, YEAH!" and gets back on track. Sometimes, it's not that easy. But I use subtle clues and try to force him to remember, like "What happens when you leave your toys on the floor?" "Oh, crap, (insert baby sisters name) gets them!" "So what are you supposed to do to avoid that?" "Pick them up!"

Verucalise's artful use of questions will positively enable her son to master the self talk skills he'll need as an adult. She doesn't say, "I told you not to leave your toys on the floor. Bad boy. Smack, smack." Just kidding. Instead, "What did I ask you to do?" "I don't remember" is not a lie. Her boy doesn't remember. She says no more just points to the list. "Oh, yeah." Actually that sounds like me. He's back on track. "What happens when you leave your toys on the floor?" Believe me, her boy had not considered the consequences. I know cuz I was a boy once with ADHD. "Oh, crap, (insert baby sisters name) gets them!" I'd say the same except I'd euphemistically use "poop" instead. I like the kid already. Got him thinking about the consequences of his actions. Then Mom comes in with the knock out question: "So what are you supposed to do to avoid that?" "Pick them up!" Now the boy is thinking about how to prevent the evil sitter from stealing his valuable assets.

Really good stuff, Verucalise. I hope every parent with ADHD children study, no, memorize word for word, your sage parenting ADHD children advice. You probably love the kid too, don't you? That helps a lot too.

Bob

 
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