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Old 05-23-2012, 11:37 AM   #1
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Seeking some Insight, Please!

Hi guys, I'm hoping you can answer a question or give me some insight into what I'm looking at here.

I know everyone's length of time to get through W/D with Opiates is different, Depending on what they were taking, quantity, etc.

I've been on Norco's 10MG for the better part of 8 years. Within the past year I was taking about 4 10MG tabs a day. Within the past 2 weeks, I've been weening off these things and have been taking about 1 and a half of those Norco's a day. I'm at the end of day 1 with none and I feel not so bueno. Stomach is upset, No energy what so ever, No sleep, All I do is toss and turn, And worst of all, I feel like there is electrical shocks and chills going throughout my skin and body. How long should I expect these symptoms to persist before they get better? With the dosages I was on recently, Will I still be looking at multiple weeks of the physical aspects?

Any replies would be immensely appreciated.

Thanks,

TestedFaith.

 
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Old 05-24-2012, 02:05 PM   #2
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Re: Seeking some Insight, Please!

First off, hang in there but I'm not sure if tapering will do it, there has to be time to just stop and it's not fun( not like the movies where it's 2 hours long, days my friend). 10 year hx of norco, percs, diluadid-15 to 20 tabs qd for at least the last 3 years-maybe longer. I did 6 day detox without subox, methadone-they gave me clonidine-bp medication only. Yup, I didn't sleep, eat, or enjoy life for a while as my body paid me back and my brain was trying to reboot itself. During my residential stay, there is no easy was for us opiate addicts I have heard of. It does get better but the beginning is not fun. I couldn't have done it in the world. I needed to be someplace where I wasn't able to get my fix( this was a voluntary stay for me, could have walked out at any time). For me, it probably took solid 2 1/2 weeks before I was really able to sleep at night, able to be hungry again to eat normal, and start to be able to think again.

 
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Old 05-24-2012, 04:43 PM   #3
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Re: Seeking some Insight, Please!

hi there tested faith and welcome. congratulations on your decision to become clean. i completely understand what you are going through. every person is different in their decision on how to stop using. wether its cold turkey, tapering, institutions, suboxone, methadone, whatever. i have personally been through more withdrawals than i care to admit but i know for me, it was a little different every time. my habit was very similar to yours so maybe your length of wd's will be similar. i started wd's about 12 hours after my last dose when i went ct. (i could not taper because i just didnt have the willpower to not take an extra pill). the symptms seemed to peak around the 3rd day and start subsiding around day5. however, the sleeplessness and anxiety seemed to linger. when i had two years clean i still went through phases here and there where i couldt sleep and would have bouts of anxiety. but to answer your question, all in all, i felt almost back to normal around two weeks after my last dose. the physical part seems to subside and all of a sudden i was blindsided with all of these mental symptoms... cravings, depression, anxiety, obsessing etc... may i respectfully suggest getting a strong support system on yourside. na, aa, church, family, close friends, just whatever you know will work for you when you have your moments of weakness. i recently started on suboxone. ive tried ct, rehab, tapering, aa, na, and this seemed to be the only option left. i am very hopeful. and that is something i didnt get, even from a 90 day voluntary stay at a rehab. every single person is so different. there are a lot of great people on here with great advice. might i suggest looking up posts from icehouse, phoenix, reachout, katlin09, they have some great advice, great support, and time under their belts clean. best of luck to you! you can do this. we all can, we just take different roads to get to the same destination. hugs to you!

 
Old 05-24-2012, 04:47 PM   #4
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Re: Seeking some Insight, Please!

The safest way to get off of narcotics is tapering or weaning down as you've been doing. Withdrawal is a rough process on the body, your going to feel not so "bueno" for a while. There are things besides Prescription meds that you can do to help yourself out while you go through the worst of it.

Hydration is key, drink, drink, drink water, juice, gatorade, not sugary, carbonated stuff. Try to keep some bland, bulky type food in your stomach to keep the nausea down some, crackers, dry cereal, etc. For sleep you can use Melatonin, Valerian Root or benadryl (all non-addictive) available at any local pharmacy or superstore, for diarrhea issues, Immodium.

Try to get some fresh air and excercise each day, take a few short walks in the sunshine, replenish your Vit. D levels, it will help fight the blues and blahs. And just getting out of the house, even though you don't particularly want to at the time, will make you feel better.

Take each day as it comes, don't worry about what's going to happen tomorrow. Hang in there and keep your focus on why your doing this....if you have to write down the reasons and stick them to the Fridge so you can read them when you get weak and want to stop.

If you feel like support would help and work for you, look up and al-anon meeting in your area.

There are "stickies" at the top of this Board with many other ideas and folks here to support you as you go.

Take care,

kat

 
Old 05-24-2012, 06:42 PM   #5
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Re: Seeking some Insight, Please!

Thank you soo much for the support and advice guys, It's means more than you know.

A little more background on my situation. About 8 years ago I had a sparring accident while sparring at the Dojo and injured my back. Long story short, Doctors started me off on 5/500 of Vicodin. After about 4 years of that they cut me off and sent me to a Pain Management Center which subsequently prescribed me 10/325 - 4 times daily. Then the Economy hit, Lost my job, health insurance, etc and I was forced to go elsewhere for my medication. Most of my money was going to supply myself with my meds because I still needed them as I have chronic back pain 24/7. As this went on my bills were not getting paid, I'm now seriously in debt because of such. I was essentially working for my meds..Was left with little money for life really.

Back in 1998 I gave my life to Christ. It has been an unbelievable ride, With it's ups and downs. But one thing remained the same...The Lord NEVER left my side.

Within this past year, Looking at my situation, I've constantly prayed to the Lord..Please, Let things work out so I can buy another 50 so I'm OK..Then I promise I will ween off and drop em. I constantly prayed for the Lord to turn my situation around, My debt, my physical pain, my relationship with him, etc. Yet things never changed, I kept getting my meds and I stayed in what I would call a cycle, Week after week, after week. 9 days ago I was getting low on supply so I made a call to get more...This time...All I have gotten the past 6 days is, "I'm out, Nobody has them"...GREAT! So I began to ween off what I had as I had no idea what was ahead for me.

This I do know...As a Christian, If we constantly encounter failure, Trouble, or lack of success, There very well may be something in our lives that MUST GO...And until it is let go, The Lord will not change your situation because he is trying to remove something from our lives that is getting in the way of a lesson and better things the Lord is trying to give us. So the only way I think I can look at this is that the Lord is now "showing" me what must go before things get better in my life, and with my relationship with him.

Yet I am terrified at how I'm going to cope with my back pain. I don't know, a lot of things are going through my head at the moment. But I'm atleast trying to see if this is in fact what must go.

I have the Lord's protection, So I know I will be O.K, and Loved regardless.

I'm now at hour 36 with no meds. I feel relatively well with the exception of my entire body wanting to crawl out of my skin and the chills. I've taken Immodium to help with the other symptoms, but I would love to know when these chills and electrifying feelings will go away...It's thee WORST!

 
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Old 05-24-2012, 07:09 PM   #6
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Re: Seeking some Insight, Please!

Unfortunately eveyone reacts to withdrawals differently and on there own timeline, there's not really a way any of us can tell you how long it will last, an estimate would be 2 - 4 days...the problem is your back pain and possible nerve involvement from your accident is a very real factor and that can and may contribute to your pain and what you may perceive as "withdrawal" symptoms. Yes God is always with you, he will never leave your side, he also gave Dr.'s and scientists the ability to create medications and therapies that help us manage disease, injury and pain. You're going to have to have a plan to manage your back pain, if not with medication than some other form of therapy, it will have an effect on your success detoxing and trust me that won't depend on whether you trust in God or not.

To be able to afford insurance and healthcare you have to work, to work you have to control your pain, to control your pain you need to be able to afford healthcare and insurance.....do you follow me here? If you don't get your pain under control, by some means, it will rule how you live the rest of your life, I can guarantee you that.

Not wanting to take narcotics is a valid option and many do it, but thinking the injury is going to heal itself and everything will just "work out" is not.


Kat

 
Old 05-24-2012, 07:22 PM   #7
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Re: Seeking some Insight, Please!

Your right. Maybe the Lord is trying to get me to understand I don't need to take 4, 5, or even 6 a day you know. Maybe I'm going to get to the point where I'm shown..By him...It is possible to get relief by taking drastically less. Either way, I don't have much for options right now, Heh. Truthfully my back problem is not very serious..There is a minor bulge in my back from inflammation, what is causing it is beyond me and thus far any doctor I've seen. I often wonder, If while were on these meds for soo long, if they can sometimes trick us into thinking our pain is worse than what it truly is if we were in a normal state you know.

 
Old 05-24-2012, 08:03 PM   #8
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Re: Seeking some Insight, Please!

Of course they can, "Opiod-induced Hyperalgesia" is a very real condition. It simply means that you develop an increasing sensitivity to noxious/poisonous stimuli, even evolving a painful response to previously non-noxious/non-poisonous stimuli. In laymen's terms it is believed that constant use of narcotics can make your pain worse because of the way your body reacts to them. The way this is determined is by putting the patient on a "narcotic holiday" and then re-introducing the narcotic or a different narcotic to the system slowly and seeing how the pain levels react.

The hard part is the "narcotic holiday" because you do have to go through all the withdrawals, but after you do that, you can get a good feel for what your "real" baseline pain is. When your on narcotics for a long time, it can be hard to tell what your actual pain level is...

In the meantime while your detoxing off the meds, once the worst of it is over in a week or two, you might try some other ways to manage your pain, like massage, PT that you can do at home, heat/ice therapy, things like that.

Kat

 
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Old 05-24-2012, 08:18 PM   #9
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Re: Seeking some Insight, Please!

I can't thank you enough kat for the time your taking to talk with me...I very much appreciate it.

It's funny you bring up therapy....My sister just dropped by and dropped off something she bought at Albertsons. There was a booth there marketing a product...This product is multiple different head blankets if you will. One for the shoulders and neck, One for the back, etc. I cracked the neck and shoulders one and popped it on...A lot of the electrifying chill effects are masked as if I was in a hot bath all the time. They are not gone, but most definitely tolerable. Quite a bit of heat too. I find heat to be the the only true fix for the chills and skin thrills.

 
Old 05-24-2012, 09:01 PM   #10
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Re: Seeking some Insight, Please!

I love heat therapy, it's always worked well for me. I've been a chronic pain patient since I was 17...I'm now 43, 26 years and 30 + surgeries later....

I usually take 2 to 3 scalding hot baths, (straight hot water) a day, my sons always say "moms boiling her knees again". I also use the disposable heat wraps you get at the drug store, probably similar to what you sister picked up for you. Post surgeries I have to use cold therapies, I have these ice cooler/knee brace contraptions that keep icy cold water circulating around my knees, that I could live without...not a big fan of cold, but it works for it's purpose.

There's pretty much always something you can do in conjunction with meds or instead of meds to manage your pain, it's just a matter of finding what works...not always an easy process, but usually worth it.

If you can do it without narcotics it really is the best thing and great, because there is the dependence/addiction issues to deal with...sometimes it's feasible, sometimes it's not, everyone is different. And another thing you have to remember, just because you take pain meds everyday, it doesn't mean your an addict or your abusing them....dependence and addiction are 2 very different things.

If you use this forced detox to figure out how much pain your really in, and what measures you can use to manage it, then your taking a really big step in the right direction.

kat

 
Old 05-25-2012, 09:21 AM   #11
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Re: Seeking some Insight, Please!

Just woke up to Day 3 of Sobriety. Took about 4 hours to go to sleep, but after some benadryl and 1 Klonopin,I was able to finally get to bed. Woke up feeling noticeably better, but I'm a little skeptical if it will last..I wonder if it has anything to do with what I took last night to help me sleep as I'm still a little groggy. Anyways, I do see some progress none the less.

 
Old 05-25-2012, 02:22 PM   #12
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Re: Seeking some Insight, Please!

The Klonipin may very well help you feel better, definitely lessen the anxiety of the situation...but hey why look a gift horse in the mouth, just enjoy the fact that you feel human for now.

Glad you got some sleep last night, that's definitely a good thing.

Kat

 
Old 05-25-2012, 06:20 PM   #13
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Re: Seeking some Insight, Please!

Nearing the end of day 3 and I still have the same symptoms as before. Thus far I have not had the upset stomachs, loose intenstines, headaches...*Knocks on wood* The ONLY symptoms I have had thus far are lack of energy, anxiety, and worst of all the skin chills and thrills.. Aside from that my body feels not bad. Not having too much for aches and pains...Again *knock* on wood, Although I would love to know when the chills and thrills will atleast START to subside and go the other way (Better). I have to work tomorrow, So I atleast hope I can muster up some energy to get through the day.

 
Old 05-25-2012, 06:24 PM   #14
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Re: Seeking some Insight, Please!

Hey,

Just a thought, not sure if your a "red bull" kind of guy, but be careful with those kinds of things...they can make the jittery/jolty/thrills worse.

Hope you sleep well tonight.

Kat

 
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Old 05-25-2012, 06:40 PM   #15
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Re: Seeking some Insight, Please!

Noted, Thanks Kat! Do you think by tomorrow morning, The start of day 4, I should notice the chills and thrills subsiding...Even if the slightest bit.

 
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