It appears you have not yet Signed Up with our community. To Sign Up for free, please click here....



Aneurysm Message Board
Post New Thread   Closed Thread
LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 11-09-2010, 09:34 AM   #1
Junior Member
(female)
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Canada
Posts: 14
chatterbugs77 HB User
8mm Aneurysm and scared...

Hi everyone. I'm new to this site and I tripped across it while searching the net for some support.

I was just diagnosed with an 8mm aneurysm located on the middle cerebral artery, frontal lobe. I don't even know what that means or where that is! Anyway, they saw the aneurysm on a regular CT scan and stated it was 7mm and then 2.5 weeks later I had an MRI done which showed it to be 8mm. I don't know if that means that it had grown in that time or? I have an appointment next week (Nov.18) to see a neurosurgeon and I can't tell you how scared I am! I don't know what's worse, the fear that I've been living with since finding out about this and the unknown OR hearing what the surgeon has to say. I really don't know at this point. All I know is, I'm feeling more anxiety the closer my appointment gets. I have so many questions and have had but then I'm afraid to hear the answers. Is it operable, will it be coiling, clipping?? Every night before I go to sleep, I think about 'what if I wasn't here anymore"? I think about friends that have passed on, I think about so many things. I'm sure that I don't have a monopoly on all of these thoughts and living in fear so any help, advice, anything! would be so much appreciated. I think I just need to talk to people that really get it ya know?

 
The following user gives a hug of support to chatterbugs77:
sjb (01-14-2011)
Old 11-11-2010, 08:22 PM   #2
Newbie
(male)
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Greenville, SC
Posts: 1
Pawwed HB User
Re: 8mm Aneurysm and scared...

Chatter
I think I know a little of what you are going through. A few weeks ago i had an MRI come back with several small "lesions". One that is 8 mm in size. I was referred to a neurologist that was looking to rule out MS. She feels confident that I do not have MS and wants me to have a MRA in early January. She did not mention an aneurysm but from what I understand that is what you usual get a MRA to determine. I have not mentioned the possibility to family but I myself am freaking out as well. As I have not been diagnosed I can't exactly say I can relate but I do know some of that fear you are feeling. Today God gave me a health day, if I get another tomorrow I'll take it, but I can't ruin the good ones I have left worrying about what may be bad ones in the future.

 
Sponsors Lightbulb
   
Old 11-12-2010, 05:51 AM   #3
Junior Member
(female)
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Canada
Posts: 14
chatterbugs77 HB User
Re: 8mm Aneurysm and scared...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pawwed View Post
Chatter
I think I know a little of what you are going through. A few weeks ago i had an MRI come back with several small "lesions". One that is 8 mm in size. I was referred to a neurologist that was looking to rule out MS. She feels confident that I do not have MS and wants me to have a MRA in early January. She did not mention an aneurysm but from what I understand that is what you usual get a MRA to determine. I have not mentioned the possibility to family but I myself am freaking out as well. As I have not been diagnosed I can't exactly say I can relate but I do know some of that fear you are feeling. Today God gave me a health day, if I get another tomorrow I'll take it, but I can't ruin the good ones I have left worrying about what may be bad ones in the future.
Thanks for your reply Pawwed. I"m sorry that you are going through this. I've been firmly diagnosed with the aneurysm. As I said, I see the surgeon next week to go over my options. In some ways, that day can't get here fast enough, in others, I would like time to slow down just a little bit. Having said that though, I"m very VERY lucky that they have found this prior to rupture and I have that going for me. It's just a scary process, so many variables. It's possible that the surgeon will want to do another test, (angiogram or something) where they shoot dye into your artery through your groin. It goes through your heart and to your brain. Apparently this test gives the surgeon an even better look at the area of the aneurysm and shows them what blood vessels are affected? I don't know, I guess I'll find out next week. Thanks again for replying, it means a lot. Good luck with your situation! Not being diagnosed is just as diffiuclt as knowing sometimes. I found waiting hard.

 
Old 11-15-2010, 03:53 AM   #4
Newbie
(female)
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Australia
Posts: 2
spearmint HB User
Re: 8mm Aneurysm and scared...

Accept your terror and fear - but do not let it make you incapable of fighting this. Do all you can to try to strengthen your circulatory system. An aneurysm is a weak tiny section of a blood vessel. A lot of people have aneurysms which never rupture (and are only found by autopsy when the death was caused by something unrelated). Attempt to strengthen the blood vessel walls by diet and exercise. Any supplement or essential oils (herbal oils) that improve the condition of the circulatory system would be helpful. Cypress organic essential oil strengthens capillary and vascular walls. To work, the oil must be organic and full strength.(Try Young Living Essential Oils). You can rub this over the area of the scalp above the aneurysm 4-6 times daily.
You need to get regular gentle exercise (long walks), eat well - lots of old-fashioned nutritious salads and fruit. Do anything you can think of to help physically improve your body. As you do so, constantly imagine yourself in a totally healthy body. Miracles do happen but they take hard work and a belief that you can do it. Start now.

 
Old 11-15-2010, 09:39 AM   #5
Senior Veteran
(female)
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 10,133
feelbad HB Userfeelbad HB Userfeelbad HB Userfeelbad HB Userfeelbad HB Userfeelbad HB Userfeelbad HB Userfeelbad HB Userfeelbad HB Userfeelbad HB Userfeelbad HB User
Re: 8mm Aneurysm and scared...

believe me chatter, i know what your going thru. my annie was discovered back in 2005 and thankfully was coilable too. what treatment options are even a possible when it comes to anuerysm is basically, where it is, how big it is, what 'type" it is and does the annie have a good 'neck' on it? a neck on an annie just makes it much more likely coilable vs having to undergo a major surgery just to slide a small clip over it?

you described the angio pretty well there too. both an MRA and an angio only look at the arteries in the brain with no other soft tissue structures getting in the way of the view of it, but that angio is soo much better since it(the aneurysm pic) can be turned and looked at from all angles by the INR who is doing it too? the angio is usually kind of more of that defining moment when the INR(interventional neuroradiologisat) decides whether or not it 'looks' coilable, or may have to be clipped, or some, depending upon location and other factors have to simply be monitored. but with all of what just is availiable today in neuroradiology and surgically, monitoring does not have to happen as often like it used to be. the 'just' monitoring option is the one that really scared me the most actually. i just wanted it gone, out or taken care of so i did not have to sit and think about it being there, ya know?

i thankfully have had no issues at all from my annie once it was coiled. hopefully you will be able to have yours coiled. it really was rather amazing to me at how quickly i was in one day and out the next with doing it that way. please do let us know what you find out. and good luck.

pawwed? did your doc happen to mention just why the wait til january to simply obtain that MRA vs just doing it like now?? it is done exactly like an MRI with the 'changes" at the tech end and not on the being in the tube end just like a plain old MRI is? its just such a simple test that is needed to find out whether or not you have an actual aneurysm in your brain, i just am kind of suprised that ANY doc would WANT to wait til 'later' when it comes to defining what appears to be possible aneurysm here, thats all. like i mentioned above, the only things that show up on MRA is the arteries so they can really see the arteries and the suspect area much more clearly since sometimes other structures can obscure or partially obscure annies. mine did NOT show up on plain MRI since it was "hidden' in the bend of an artery, but showed very clearly upon MRA and of course the angio i had a few weeks later.

i am just wondering exactly what the reasons were she gave you to wait til january and not simply refer you now instead and get it IDed if it is? getting a good look at how an annie just 'is' and when it is in a much smaller state, usually is just so much better in a few different ways. the bigger they get in most cases, if they DID happen to once have that nice neck on it, that gets more reduced as it grows in there? ya know what i mean? and the neck really IS an important component when considering possible treatment options. its kind of like if you looked at a balloon before it gets blown up? it has that neck at the top thats nice and long with the bottom much bigger, but as you blow air into it, that bottom continues to get bigger/expanded while that neck starts to get smaller and smaller, til you get to that full expansion of that balloon and you have no more neck there? does that make sense? this really just needs to be looked at the earlier the better ya know? having that neck on any annie is almost always much much better than not having it when it comes to any real possible treatment options.

was this just your actual primary who you saw or some other type of doc? i really would see about trying to get that MRA sooner vs later for many different reasons that all have to do with you, and if it is, the best possible choices and outcome if this IS indeed an annie. just my opinion here. but i would love to know the docs actual resoning for waiting on this. good luck, hopefully its not an annie, but do please keep us posted too. Marcia
__________________
3-22-01,herniated C-6-7
11-20-01,placement of hardware for failed fusion
9-22-03,removal of cavernous hemangioma that was inside spinal cord. Neuro damage to L hand L leg and R leg.

 
Old 11-15-2010, 10:16 AM   #6
Junior Member
(female)
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Canada
Posts: 14
chatterbugs77 HB User
Re: 8mm Aneurysm and scared...

Quote:
Originally Posted by feelbad View Post
believe me chatter, i know what your going thru. my annie was discovered back in 2005 and thankfully was coilable too. what treatment options are even a possible when it comes to anuerysm is basically, where it is, how big it is, what 'type" it is and does the annie have a good 'neck' on it? a neck on an annie just makes it much more likely coilable vs having to undergo a major surgery just to slide a small clip over it?

you described the angio pretty well there too. both an MRA and an angio only look at the arteries in the brain with no other soft tissue structures getting in the way of the view of it, but that angio is soo much better since it(the aneurysm pic) can be turned and looked at from all angles by the INR who is doing it too? the angio is usually kind of more of that defining moment when the INR(interventional neuroradiologisat) decides whether or not it 'looks' coilable, or may have to be clipped, or some, depending upon location and other factors have to simply be monitored. but with all of what just is availiable today in neuroradiology and surgically, monitoring does not have to happen as often like it used to be. the 'just' monitoring option is the one that really scared me the most actually. i just wanted it gone, out or taken care of so i did not have to sit and think about it being there, ya know?

i thankfully have had no issues at all from my annie once it was coiled. hopefully you will be able to have yours coiled. it really was rather amazing to me at how quickly i was in one day and out the next with doing it that way. please do let us know what you find out. and good luck.

Marcia
Thank you so much Marcia for your reply. You sound very knowledgable about all of this and yes, of course you would be as you've gone through it! From your response it sounds as though I'll meet the neurosurgeon on Thursday and I suppose talk about things but the likelyhood is he'll book me for this angiogram and it won't be until then, when I'll know exactly what they intend to do. I was hoping for answers on Thursday because the waiting has been so hard. :-( Marcia do you think he will at least know the type of annie it is and all of the things you mentioned above? Or does that information come from the angiogram? I'm sorry, I feel like I'm bombarding you with questions but you do seem very knowledgable as I said and you have the experience as well. Another thing I've been trying to figure out is the accuracy between CT scan measurements and MRI measurements. CT stated 7mm, then had MRI done 2.5 weeks later and it stated 8mm. Is it possible that it had grown in the time?
I'm so glad that you came through the surgery and doing very well...ty for sharing that information with me.
I also agree with you in what you said to Pawwed. I don't understand why they are waiting so long to have another scan...I think you should be getting on that one Pawwed. I really do.
Again, sorry to bombard you Marcia!! But I do appreciate this.
Tina

 
Old 11-16-2010, 06:19 AM   #7
Senior Veteran
(female)
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 10,133
feelbad HB Userfeelbad HB Userfeelbad HB Userfeelbad HB Userfeelbad HB Userfeelbad HB Userfeelbad HB Userfeelbad HB Userfeelbad HB Userfeelbad HB Userfeelbad HB User
Re: 8mm Aneurysm and scared...

no problem tina. believe me, i too was looking for anyone who had had an annie to ask questions to too when mine happened to just pop in. my cousin had had one that was also coiled like five years or so before mine, so i hit HER up with LOTS of questions,lol.

i am thinking the difference in size and it possibly growing might have more to realistically do with the difference in the way CT is done using x ray and the MRI using magnetism, among other things with scans? most just don't grow that quickly? so more than likely it was probably the "same size' on both, it just got 'scanned' a bit differently? it would be more likely anyways.

did they happen to use a contrast dye when they did your MRI or not? that would also help in seeing what type it is too. that contrast just really helps alot in defining or highlighting the arteries in the brain so you get better pics. i would think, and this really kind of depends more on just where your annie actually just 'is" inside your brain, that they should be able to see enough to let you know the 'chances' of this being coilable or possibly need a clipping? mine was just very hard to really fully see in the proper way to tell with my MRA since it was in a bend in an artery, so i REALLY needed that angio to really allow the rad to see it in 'his' way to tell. they unfortunetly can just pop in anywhere there is arterial flow up there. i will be hoping it IS a coilable one for ya tina.

the coiling vs clipping is just sooo different in what needs to be done, and actually having to undergo a major brain surgery vs having them snake the platinum coils up thru that femoral artery in the groin on up to the brain? it truley IS amazing at what those interventional radiologists can just 'do' within vessels and the neurorads with vascular malformations these days. i was very lucky that i somehow managed to end up with like one of the tops around where i live in MN here who was absolutely amazing too. his colleague i ended up having to see for the consult the day of my appt since MY neurorad had been called away for another in hosp consult that day actually told me it was NOT going to be coilable because it simply even being in that bend that any coils placed into it would more than likely herniate right back out, and not simply 'stay in' the actual annie? well when i saw MY wonderful neurorad for my angio, and i was sooo freaked out already and waiting for him to take that good hard look at my annie and just SAY something, all of the sudden i heard him say,"aw hell, i can coil THAT". whew those were lovely words trust me considering what the other less experienced rad told me at my appt? experience in the actual INR who would be the one who more than likely will also do your angio is soo crucial too.

during the angio, they actually snake a catheter up to just before the brain, THATS when they shoot that dye into the brain? not FROM the groin? they just usually will use that R side of your groin area too and that femoral artery since its easier for the rad from that artery on the R vs L? it really does not take too long for the actual angio once they get you and everything all set. they also will give you a combo of fentanyl and versed to help keep you relaxed and cover any pain you may have too so it really is not too bad of a procedure hon. i have now had to have five angios total since i had another vascular malfomation that i did not even know i was born with just sitting inside my spinal cord? it was a cavernous hemangioma and was taking up over half my cord space. did NOT know it was there til i had to have my first ever MRI on my c spine for a herniated disc, it just showed up on my MRI. at first they assumed it was arterial and very similar to having an annie, but IN my cord would be? it took an angio to see if it would "light up" or not to tell them it was not arterial but venous. but thats a whole nother story.

hopefully they will be able to tell you alot more than i was able to find out at my consult when you go thursday. i know the waiting just sucks too. just wanting to know anything solid, other than you have an annie? i just kept trying to keep myself busy til my angio was due. if i remember right it was like only two weeks later that they actually did that coiling once my rad felt he could manage a coiling in it. everything worked out amazingly well after too. the coils all filled in my annie and with the follow up year later angio, there was NO light up within the annie and that IS what they want to see.

good luck on thurs tina. hopefully it is totally coilable and this will all be taken care of soon for you too. if you have anymore questions for me, just ask hon. i KNOW how it is, trust me. marcia
__________________
3-22-01,herniated C-6-7
11-20-01,placement of hardware for failed fusion
9-22-03,removal of cavernous hemangioma that was inside spinal cord. Neuro damage to L hand L leg and R leg.

 
Old 11-22-2010, 08:56 AM   #8
Junior Member
(female)
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Canada
Posts: 14
chatterbugs77 HB User
Re: 8mm Aneurysm and scared...

Hi Marcia...I just wanted to give an update after seeing the neurosurgeon last Thursday. Long story short, he thinks there may be a second one, and the 8mm annie he said looks to be a little complicated. So he wants me to go for yet ANOTHER test, this time CT with contrast. I'm just waiting on a call from the hosptial to go have that done and then we'll sit down and make a plan from there. I was really hoping for a definitive plan that day but nope. The waiting continues...and I'm starting to feel that this thing is never going to get taken care of. :-(
Tina

 
Old 11-23-2010, 08:13 AM   #9
Senior Veteran
(female)
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 10,133
feelbad HB Userfeelbad HB Userfeelbad HB Userfeelbad HB Userfeelbad HB Userfeelbad HB Userfeelbad HB Userfeelbad HB Userfeelbad HB Userfeelbad HB Userfeelbad HB User
Re: 8mm Aneurysm and scared...

geez tina, sorry for THAT bit O news on top of what you already knew. the thing you just have to really think about here tina is it sounds like you actually have a really good thorough NS, and that does mean TONS. he wants to get a better idea of what they will be dealing with here before they even CAN truely come up with a "good plan' to take this out of the circulation. and YEP, the waiting and the ongoing testing sucks, lol, but it does give them much more detailed info as to what they have there inside your brain which most certainly will dictate the very best ways to fix this for you too. so there is that good and bad side, but its for YOUR best outcome, ya know?

i am wondering exactly why this NS is NOT simply sending you for that angio to FULLY define just what IS or is not an actual second annie and get that good hard kinda 3D look at the one they seem to think already IS? did he happen to mention the word AVM at all to you? is the supposed second one really close to that 8 mm one or in another location(this just DOES matter alot)? if it is really close to the one they have kinda confirmed already, this just "could be' what he is referring to as a bit more "complicated"?

the ONLY reason that i can think of, and keep in mind i am NOT in any way shape or form any type of doc here, could be they may feel this other "structure' they are seeing, since it DID show up on the CT, may be a different 'form' of a vascular malformation, possible venous fed like mine was(there just ARE quite a few very different types of possible vascular malfs one can get, not just the more heard about standard 'aneurysm"?)? any venous fed lesion would NOT show up on an angio at all so this is why i am thinking that are doing CT vs angio right now? this would just be something(only IF venous fed not arterial) that you could ONLY see upon possible MRI(just more likely since it does show the soft tissue too vs MRA or angio), or an MRV which looks ONLY at the veinous fed vessels and not the arteries like MRA does and in a very much more in depth way?

all of ther above is kind of only based upon the "type' of test he is requesting vs going right to the 'usual" definition needed using an angiogram FOR only aneurysm/or arterially fed malformations? it just comes down much more to what docs actually order as tests and what you simply know those particular types of tests even can pick up or simply see much more clearly vs other types? do ya get what i mean tina? right now i am simply thinking he cannot really see or tell what that other 'object/structure" simply IS and what it feeding it with blood supply. that really is kind of the only thing that would make any real 'common sense' considering you confirmation of the annie already being there, or he would have more than likely gone directly to the interventional neurorad for the angio?

but if he mentioned just 'where" this other "sructure' actually is within your brain,let me know if this just is way away from the annie or right next to it. it DOES matter and can determine just what this thing actually consists of as far as the blood supply overall? and make darn certain you obtain EVERY single copy of any and all testing results tina. it really IS crucial, esp when you have anything 'odd/different" either in your brain or spinal cord. this just IS a solid part of your medical history that you NEED to keep any info and documentation of.

there just also can be, and this was my case with what was found inside my spinal cord, certain 'types' of actual vascular malformations that we can easily be born with already there? you just have no real clue anything is even there until it either starts to show itself with particular symptoms, or in my case, my cavernous hemangioma was simply 'found as they say,'incidentally" upon having my very first ever MRI simply done to find what disc i KNEW from symptoms i actually had? i herniated my c 6-7 and this lil glob of blood vessels was just a sittin there IN my flippin cord kinda chillin(at first tho, the rad who read my films actually definitively stated what this was was the arterially fed AVM and not what it actually was? that really was where the angio REALLY played the biggest part for me in fully defining it as venous fed and not arterially fed, BIG huge differene there). freaked me out let me tell ya for four to six? months or so while simply 'waiting' to first see ANY NS for answers then them ordering that very defining angio. but this is another good reason you need as much of the documenting info as possible since some of these more bizzarre vascular malfs can be something that could be familial or inherited only becasue the blood vessels themselves as in my case, actually have less give to them and are much more fragile in the vascular walls. and that is ONLY due to the type of kidney disease i inherited too, dammit, lol.

the thing is tina, and this kind of goes with just about anything that can be "found' inside our bodies? no one truely even knows just exactly what "can be going on" inside their own bodies til symptoms present it or it just pops in on a scan you are having done for a totally unrelated reason like mine was. the bigger thing here tho hon, is that this WAS found and it sounds like you just DO have a good thorough NS, and that really IS wonderful and crucial too. i myself got VERY lucky with mine as well. it sucked when he retired tho.

so just keep hangin in til you get thru this particular "round' and make certain to get those copies, which i too really want to see at least the very back page where they list the "pertinent findings" in the conclusion/summary area at the end of the report too if you don't mind? the way ANY interpretting rad actually even 'words' certain findings really can help alot is how they see something too? so if you can post for me that part of all the summarys from any testing done already(along with mentioning what 'type' of test those findings were from too) and also in the future too, make certain it IS word for word as that interpretting rad actually typed his report, K? it just DOES matter how they fully describe anything found upon any real scan.

sooo, just go with the flow here, get this round of testing done and we will go from there. i AM here for ya tina for whatever i can do to try and help, K? just DO obtain any "back testing reports" and all new ones. you can actually ask your NS while he is going over things on ay test,"can you have a copy for me made right now for MY medical files i am keeping at home too"(then make darn sure to not even leave that place without THAT report copy in hand)? this should NOT be any problem for them to simply do what IS yours afterall ya know? good luck hon and DO please keep me posted here. marcia
__________________
3-22-01,herniated C-6-7
11-20-01,placement of hardware for failed fusion
9-22-03,removal of cavernous hemangioma that was inside spinal cord. Neuro damage to L hand L leg and R leg.

 
Old 11-26-2010, 09:22 AM   #10
Senior Member
(female)
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: cable, Ohio USA
Posts: 127
studey HB User
Re: 8mm Aneurysm and scared...

chatter,
So sorry to hear about that,,I truly do not know why they do not get a Angio done ASAP..And they could check on both things quickly..And then your stresses would not be for as long..As I see it , you are going to have to get it done anyway..Why the hold up..I have had 8 angios..4 in 1 year..I am a old hat at them..I was DXed with a with Inoperable 1cm by 8 mm fusiform L cerebral artery aneurysm..I have had this nightmare for 10 years..And pray no one EVER walks down my road with me..Will be saying a prayer for you for strength and comfort..Hugs, Cindy
__________________
thuderbolt headahe Jan3,01 DX with a inoperable aneurysm. severe headaches everyday for 9 years. SSDI for severe pain R/t inoperable aneurysm pulsating on cranial nerves.

 
Old 12-01-2010, 11:13 AM   #11
Junior Member
(female)
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Canada
Posts: 14
chatterbugs77 HB User
Re: 8mm Aneurysm and scared...

I can't believe this...

I just have to get this off of my chest. Yesterday I had to go and see my family Dr for him to fill out insurance forms. The secretary had taken copies of my CT Scan and my lastest scan of my MRI because they have to go with my forms. I had read my CT report but hadn't seen my MRI report and so of course, I read it. I was blown away at what I saw...neither my family Dr nor my surgeon has mentioned this to me as yet but my report said "within the left aspect of the pituitary glad, there is a 5 mm rounded T2 hyperintense focus, suspicious for a microadenoma. Further investigation with dedicated microadenoma protocol MRI is recommended". I know that microadenoma is another word for tumor.

Tomorrow I am scheduled for a CT with contrast and then I see my neurosurgeon next Thursday to discuss treatment options for my aneurysm. They also think I may have a second one and want a closer look at that one as well as a closer look at the "laterally directed" aneurysm of my right MCA.

Can anyone help me to understand why I haven't been told about this other suspicion they have?? And this may sound like a stupid question but what does 'laterally directed mean"?

 
Old 12-02-2010, 08:38 AM   #12
Senior Veteran
(female)
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 10,133
feelbad HB Userfeelbad HB Userfeelbad HB Userfeelbad HB Userfeelbad HB Userfeelbad HB Userfeelbad HB Userfeelbad HB Userfeelbad HB Userfeelbad HB Userfeelbad HB User
Re: 8mm Aneurysm and scared...

CB, honestly, this IS the 'biggest why' in why i always tell anyone and everyone to make darn certain that they, themselves just ALWAYS obtain their very OWN copies of any and all testing results, on anything that just gets tested(even basic labwork too?). you really wont know for certain til you at least are able to read thru any given report, even what may be in it, ya know? but you ALSO have to always keep in mind here too with reading ANY rad interpretted results, that this IS what they "only are' the rads "impression" and not the neurosugeon looking at your hardfilms and telling you this,ya know what i mean?

i had my very first ever MRI done also on my c spine state, BY the interpretting rad, that i had without a doubt, a very scarey AVM inside my spinal cord. it turned out that it was NOT that scariest of scenerios, but a much less "impactful" venous fed type lesion instead, AFTER angio was performed and it did not light up like it should have if it WAS arterially fed like the reposrt stated it was with AVM as my Dx there? so that is something you also NEED to keep in mind too here hon. only the RADS interpretation.

according to what i VERY quickly searched on adenomas,and then MICRO adenomas, anything UNDER 10 mms IS considered to be 'micro" or smaller than average type thing? and this 'object' is actually only 5 mms in size, so that IS a good thing. and these ARE considered to be benign tumors and nothing more than that. esp your particular size? believe it or not, MANY people actually have therse in the very same place you do and NEVER ever even know that they are there.

they can also form in ANY body organ that simply HAS GLANDS too. i have a liver disease alomng with kidney so i do pop into those boards quite often. i see many people with the very same thing you have'ademonas' within their livers too. these just CAN be found in anyplace that has glandular tissue or epithelial tissue.

depending upon what further testing decides, you really wont know true specifics til all that simply gets done, compiled and your NS gets a chance to really study ALL of the material on this. but this IS VERY small comparted to what it could be, so that IS positive CB.

honestly CB, i did NOT know either that my NS who kept sending me for all kinds of different brain scans actually was pretty convinced that i actually even HAD an annie somewhere(i had NO actual headpain EVER, just heat flushes from top of head down back). it was not until my hubs and i had to go wayy out to some other rad facility for me to obtain what is called a 3 T or tesla scan and the nurse handed me my stack O films along with her saying "i DO wish you lots of luck with this" (WTH?), that i EVEN suspected just "what the he** is going on in my brain"?? i mean who 'wishes you "luck' unless they KNOW something that you may not going on? she simply did KNOW something that i so obviously did not. but you can bet your but that i DID call my NSs nurse like the second we got home and thru that door and asked. and she DID confirm what appeared to be a smaller type of actual annie in my L superior cerebellar artery. ya could have knocked me over with a feather at that particular moment. but i had NO real clue either as to what was actually being checked out and checked for either CB. i had not yet learned how to "connect dots" back then, i do kind of now, and finding out the hard way too(like you are) with a brain annie, another vasc malf in my cord i was simply 'born with" and alll the wonderful neuro damage that came from having to have my cord malf resected. no issues at all with the annie coiling tho.

what they mean by the term 'laterally" is actually off to the side? these medical posistional terms i would very highly advise you to try and learn? it just IS very basic anatomical posistional terms used to ID an area where 'something' actually just 'is' located but ususally it is in reference to YOUR bodys 'midline'?? look up anatomical terms glossery and is should give you some good info. we used this stuff alot when trying to tell who we were handing off any given patient to like in the ER(i used to work as an emt/ff) exactly where any given injury or problem area just was located so they would know the exact location of injury? and also simply writing up those fun and exciting post call reports too.

now in THIS particular situation CB, it appears that they are actually using your annie AS that 'reference point" in your brain? so this adenoma is 'left of(the "laterally"?) and to the side of your actual annie location and in that pituitary gland? they can use many different things as that true reference point as long as it is actually worded like this actually is in your report? they can do this with organs or blood vessels or just about anything inside or outside our bodies,but it will ALWAYS state WHAT the reference point they are using is first?

just as a 'quickie' here. lateral means to the side, proximal means "closer" to midline of the body or specific reference point stated, distal is simply further away from reference point(as in our fingers are the MOST distal from midline in upper torso??). anterior is front, while anything posterior is back.

when trying to really pinpoint anything within the brain, they DO use alot of these types of terms since its kinda hard to NOT use them in giving specific locations in there,ya know what i mean hon?

so, i would most definitely speak with your main treating doc here and the one who has been sending you for all these tests as to what that adenoma actually 'means' for you? the fact that you ARE actually a female gives us a bit higher risk of actually developing adenomas too which i just found out when looking up stuff here. it has something to do with our prolactin and progesterone and also possibley any past pregnancys too? this is simply what i found trying to understand what it was that was found in your report hon, so just passing it along.

just keep in mind that what you have is actually only HALF of what even qualifies as 'micro" here? it IS rather small and may be much more conducive to certain types of treatment possibles. you mentioned your annie is in the MCA? is that 'main cerebellar artery" or something else(just assuming the C is cerebellar)? i could not think of any other "M" that would fit there, ya know? my annie was/is actually in my L superior cerebellar artery.

what i do NOT really understand here is you mentioned that you just 'could' have an actual second annie too? why in the heck don't they simply DO an angio that WOULD show those arteries in the very best ways? that would rule it in or out right there in the radiology suite where they do them?? but you DO NEED that CT for further definition of that 'suspected adenoma' too. but they NEED to get an angio done here very soon so they can even TELL YOU what ANY true treatment options actually are. it all depends more upon how the annie simply looks itself and where it is ya know?

i really DO wish you luck with all this. just know that if you need some help, i AM here for ya as much as i can be, K? but DO get yourself very familiar with the anatomical terms i mentioned? it WILL help YOU to just better define certain things when it comes to where they are simply located within your body areas? and get out a notebook and set it like on your kitchen counter like i do, where you can simply go DIRECTLY to anytime, and i DO mean anytime, even the middle of the night(i just do my best thinking then), lol, whenever you simply think of one of those really great questions you want answers to? if i waited on the "good questions" and writing them down, i kept forgetting them later, so now i go there asap and always have that notebook out WITH a pen sitting on top of it. trust me hon, it DOES help alot or i would NOT be telling you to even go there.

good luck and DO please keep me posted CB, marcia
__________________
3-22-01,herniated C-6-7
11-20-01,placement of hardware for failed fusion
9-22-03,removal of cavernous hemangioma that was inside spinal cord. Neuro damage to L hand L leg and R leg.

 
Old 12-02-2010, 01:38 PM   #13
Junior Member
(female)
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Canada
Posts: 14
chatterbugs77 HB User
Re: 8mm Aneurysm and scared...

Marcia thank you so much for all of your help here. You certainly know you're way around the medical world and I very much appreciate all of your efforts.
I had my CT with contrast today and now I wait to see the surgeon next Thursday. He actually told me that I won't need an angio because this scan will tell us all that we need to know. ?? I sure hope he's right.
My confirmed aneurysm is located on the right middle cerebral artery. The questionable aneurysm is involving the left middle cerebral artery. The rad stated that this may relate to a tortuous M2 branch. So now that the scan has been done, I'll get the answer to this next week.
I called the surgeons office and spoke with the secretary and she printed off my MRI report and will be talking the doctor about this suspicious thing and possible microendenoma. The Dr that signed off on the report is recommending further investigation with "dedicated microedenoma protocol MRI. Whatever that will entail, who knows! The one thing I find a bit odd though is I have never had problems with my thyroid. Now, I know you can devolop problems at any time in life but when my family Dr sent me for blood work about 2 months ago now, everything seemed to be ok except he said your thyroid is a bit out of whack...and it's hypothyroid. I'm wondering if this may be because of this 'suspected' tumor on my pituitary gland? I"m also wondering if this will require another specialist..endocrinoligist maybe? Spelling I'm not sure of. Won't they have to see whether it's active or non active or secreting or non secreting? I read something about this but I'm not sure that I understand. I find with every appointment Marcia, only leads to more questions and I never quite feel that I have a handle on anything!

 
Old 12-03-2010, 08:57 AM   #14
Senior Veteran
(female)
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 10,133
feelbad HB Userfeelbad HB Userfeelbad HB Userfeelbad HB Userfeelbad HB Userfeelbad HB Userfeelbad HB Userfeelbad HB Userfeelbad HB Userfeelbad HB Userfeelbad HB User
Re: 8mm Aneurysm and scared...

nope nope nope CB, you DO most definitely require an angio just given the one confirmed annie and the possible other? the CT,unless he is doin something more in depth that i am not aware of, just cannot give you the really good 3 D all around clarity of what simply ONLY shows up on an angio, the arteries ONLY hon, "just" arteries alone. i really do not understand the 'whys' in why he will not simply send you for the angio cb, i really don't. esp since in order for certain treatment options to EVEN BE told to you or even considered, you simply NEED an angio to see about possible coiling options too? it just IS that angio that tells the interventional neuroradiologist whether or not your annie, or annies even ARE coilable so it HAS to be done at some point here, ya know what i mean? its pretty 'standard protocal" for this type of thing? it is just one of those things that would simply HAVE TO be done at some point? maybe he is trying to better define the other issues first?? just a possible.

so the "M" actually stands for middle. it would make sense since i KNOW we Do have a superior(where mine is) and inferior cerebellar, so i woulsdd suppose there has to also be a 'middle' one too? lol.

CB, i am going to be honest with you here? and i think that IS what you want too? as i was reading and the sentence "may relate to a 'torturous' M2 branch"?? that just 'could' possibly mean that this may be more related to a congenital issue and the formation of something more similar to what is called AVM or arteriovenous malformation(but this does NOT 'sound' like the standard full blown variety here since those would be IDed like immediately only becasue there are simply put, "too many arteries all kind of 'globbed" into one tiny or smaller little area", which YOURS IS NOT)? but this IS ONLY the rads interpretation too, so DO also keep that in mind too. just like mine stated back in 2001? when i actually had a venous fed lesion in my spinal cord called a cavernous hemangioma), the rad 'confirmed it as AVM, with like NO freakin doubt when it was NOT? it took the angio then for my little vascular malf to be better defined and when it did NOT light up with contrast, it was labled as 'only' a venous fed cavernous hemangioma? so some interpretting rads can go a bit off the deeper end when it simply comes to what is 'their own" interpretation of ANY given findings and not always the reality?

but i do not like seeing that word tortuous simply because it(your scans) are more than likely showing arteries in that particular area that are just a bit more "to" curved, curled and more 'twisted' than the usual are(this is simply what would be defined as 'torturous" when it comes to arteries, esp within our brains)? while the arteries within our brains seriously look sooo insanely 'set up" with soooo many twists and turns it makes you wonder how in gods name they EVER really 'know" what is just what(and that IS the 'normal'), that word torturous is just telling things may be a bit MORE 'like that" in that M2 branch area? i would ASK this NS about why that is even in the report and have him FULLY explain this to you as to what HE feels? you just DO need to know cb. this one word is in many cases just 'how' some possible levels of AVMs are described in reports, thats all so you just need a good explanation for YOUR own benefit, and also that angio too? just having that ONE WORD even show up in that rad report "should be" like a no brainer to send this patient for an angio type thing, and it does not appear that is even the case with this NS?

i do NOT understand the 'why' in what is taking this NS soo long to just get that one angio done considering the findings? this just IS the best, most definitive type of 'test of definition" you can have done with what you have vascularly? its simply BEFORE ANY real treatment options can realistically even be considered or "discussed, that angio NEEDS to be done along with the interventional neurorads actual highly needed/experienced opinion too?

you CAN also go for a second opinion too hon(right now, if things do NOT change with this NS, i WOULD at least seek out another opinion here soon. possibly at any good university type teaching hosp where they simply DO see A TON of the types of things you just have much more often than ANY private practice would or even could? this is where i 'found' the best of the best NS for my cavernoma too?), and that is in almost every single case also covered by your ins as well. i have had to do this with a couple pre op needed crappy things, including my cavernoma where i DID obtain three seperate opinions(other two were pretty clueless) til i actually found the ONE and only out of those three(this actually WAS opinion number 3 too) that had over 30 years of hands on working knowledge and experience in simply treating, resecting, and also monitoring patients with the same exact vascular type 'globs" that i had in my spinal cord, and man did this NS EVER know his stuff compared to the other less experienced in what I had knowledge and the overall charachteristics of what these little suckers just are more likely to even 'do' over time? i was dang lucky there CB to even FIND this ONE head of neurosurgery up at the U of MN before he actually would have retired on me a few years after he resected my cav out of my cord. then, just as a lil bonus, sent me for the MRA and tesla that found my annie in 05 based ONLY on MY one real symptom of the 'heat flushes" down my head which i think i have mentioned before? since there was absolutely NO actual headpain from my annie probably becasue it was still on the smaller side, god only knows 'when' this would have beeen discovered like when it ruptured years later?

good NSs have gut instincts about things based upon simply treating and experiencing every single patients presentations of symptomologys and how things just 'go'. so the more patients they see(which IS true with almost any doc) the MORE in tuned and great experienced knowledge they also just have too? the day my amazing NS retired in 06, i just cried cb, he had done sooo much more for me than i ever could have imagined when i first met up with him upon referral to the U of MN back in late 02 and REALLY found out what i was dealing with that the two other NSs that i HAD been seeing just did NOT 'get' at all? the bigger issue 'there' was what i actually had in my cord and not in my brain like most just are, was also simply a very rare type of thing,and i WAS born with this just did NOT have a flippin clue til my c spine had to be MRIed for the very first time. so getting a good knowledgable and experienced type of NS for MY problem, well it had to be an NS that had at least ALOT/MANY years of overall experience to even have seen enough to fully even understand them like my NS at the U had with well over 30 years in?

in any medical type situation cb, esp when involving the brain and spinal cord, that docs/specialists overall actual hands on experience and knowledge seriously can make all the difference in the world for 'us' the patients. i really would nail this NS to the wall here and ask him why he is not referring you for what you simply KNOW by research and speaking with other people with strange vascular malformations within their brains appears to be THE big defining test to really even KNOW what any given possible treatment options just are for you? you simply HAVE TO include that interventional neuroradiologist here in this CB to even "truely' know if this IS a coilable annie(and if you just DO even have one more? that WOULD show upon angio) and what you are truely dealing with too? i am just a bit mind boggled at the why is it taking soo flippin long to even get there by now?

while a "contrasted" CT will show anything that is simply arterially fed within the brain, it will NOT show the very needed more minute details in that all by itself 3 D way that is simply a NEED to determine possible treatment options, ya know what i mean? with a CT, this also brings up all surrounding soft tissue type structures too unlike the angio that ONLY brings out and highlights the arteries alone, all by themselves? it looks rather crazy just seeing ONLY your brains arteries when they do this, like a very highly congested highway map of large squiggley running vessels? but that IS the norm there for how our brains are simply set up vascularly. just looks a bit insane to see it all.

the bigger thing here CB is at SOME point here hopefully soon, your NS will simply HAVE TO finally send you for that one angiogram to get you 'in' with a good interventional NR and to really allow that specialist to see what he or she thinks are all the possible 'inner/vascular treatment options"(you would be simply amazed at what any good experienced INR can simply 'do' as far as treating annies goes, ALL from within the actual vessels). so it WILL be done, it just HAS to, its just taking an awfully long time to get you to THAT point hon. i just DO really feel here based upon the types of scans he is ordering and doing here that he IS trying to, right now anyways, get some better definition of the 'other stuff" like the adenoma first before sending you to the INR for the angio since THAT stuff will simply NOT show itself at all upon the angio? just arteries alone will show on THAT angio alone and nothing more. so in THAT case, i can understand the whys in the CTs/MRIs, but he also will, like i mentioned already, also HAVE to eventually send you to even KNOW for certain about treatment options, to the INR too for that much more defining angio.

and i agree with ya there on probably having to also see an endo just becasue this IS just supposedly within the pituitary gland at all? it just very much can impact anything that the pituitary governs, so its kind of one of the 'needs' for your best overall care here CB.

but at some point here soon, that NS better send you for that needed angio and just the eval/consult with the interventional NR, or i would seriously RUN from your current NS hon(it seriously should have been done by now as standard practice with what you have in your brain that has already been Dxed). that IS a MUST with what has already beed found in your brain? and if your vascular in that M2 area actually has a 'tortuous type of vascular set up, that NEED for angio is just much more critical to FULLY see within that area with as much clarity and detaial as possible too. and THAT can ONLY truely be done with a good INR doing the angio on your brain. there just is NO way what that NS told you about a mere contrasted CT as being true, not with angio being that gold standard here when it comes to better defining,seeing and dxing anything within the brain vessels just totally availiable? put it this way CB, if your current NS actually truely believes that only a contrasted CT "will tell him everything we need to know"? he is NOT as good as what you simply do realistically NEED here in an NS for this.

i do hate to have to tell you that, but honestly CB, i just do NOT really even understand this mans thinking in all this and not just sending you out for that needed angio too? why NOT simply refer you for that one needed test? whats HIS problem, like he is not the one who has to go there or 'do' anything BUT simply write the dang referral FOR you here(just like the CTs and MRIs)? thats why i just do not 'get it'? its so simple for him to just 'do', ya know? i really seriously would start looking for other 'possible' NSs hon. i just do think this may be actually over this NSs head here? believe me CB, the one thing among others that i have had to find out the hard way during all my medical crappy stuff is not all specialists or even plain old docs are even close to being created equal. usually the older, more experienced specialists do make the better specialists since they just have been around that block way more many times and have learned tons FROM treating sooo many more patients than someone who has not? it is kind of a more logical thing, but i simply, wayy back when, assumed every doc is the same pretty much? no friggin way.

if you do just happen to live near ANY good university type teaching hospital CB, i seriously would go there for that second opinion. they would probably also be wondering where your angio reports are that were NEVER done on your brain yet too? something about the way this NS is doing things considering the actual findings, just does not 'feel/seem right' to me? i think its what this doc 'feels" are prioritys in all this and esp the not actually just allowing you to consult or even be seen and evaled by the 'right type" of the best specialists for vascular crappy stuff and with the angio he would do too? i seriously just do NOT get that at all here considering, esp when its just a simple easy referral for HIM to just 'do' too? i would just ask this NS exactly HOW are anuerysms 'treated' and see what he says? he would HAVE to mention coiling which would bring in that needed consult and angio with the INR you just DO need?

just DP prepare yourself CB with at least checking out,and per your ins co right now, any othwer potential NSs who you may be able to see if this NS still insists you do not 'need' an angio? this just is NOT in YOUR best possible interest right now with what you have hon, esp now with what appears to be 'tortuous' vascular area up there too? that truely can only be best defined with an angio being done so they can take that pic of the area and actually turn it in all directions too? that IS the amazing thing about what angios also allow, the turning of any given vascular pic they do within the brain simply to even be able to fully 'see' all of it from every possible angle? i DO hope things go well CB, i am really trying here to really think of you in all this and just give you the best possible advice, just knowing what I now know too? what i am telling you is the exact same things i would do if this were me in your shoes hon, seriously. sometimes we just HAVE TO advocate for ourselves against certain 'things" our specialists "decide" to even do or seem to think is okay when its clearly not the best possible choice for US(most cases, it IS lack of real true experience that dictates the wrong decisions. and this WAS what i dealt with too). always remember, it is ONLY any given specialists overall knowledge and experiences that will dictate most of what they even actually 'know'. having experience in what WE actually have wrong, or goin on is CRUCIAL for us to just obtain the very BEST overall care and treatment options. i just do feel this man just may be way in over his head to some degree here CB. its just like he is not fully 'getting it"? sooo ask as many really hard questions of this NS to kind of see how well he even answers things, or even just what HIS actual 'plan' for you just 'is' too? THAT you should get from him hon, a plan of action. and also ask 'when am i FINALLY going to have the needed angio"?

good luck hon, and as usual, i AM here if you need me. just REALLY try and 'gage" this mans overall level of real knowledge? you can kind of tell just by how they answer your questions too? do they have to REALLY 'think" do they hesitate, or stammer alot or give very vague answers to your questions that should be more in depth and knowledgable? i just really DO want you to have the very BEST possible treatment and outcome here CB, and that, in many cases IS in the hands of the specialists who you just have, too. keep me posted CB, marcia
__________________
3-22-01,herniated C-6-7
11-20-01,placement of hardware for failed fusion
9-22-03,removal of cavernous hemangioma that was inside spinal cord. Neuro damage to L hand L leg and R leg.

 
Old 12-04-2010, 04:24 AM   #15
Senior Member
(female)
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: cable, Ohio USA
Posts: 127
studey HB User
Re: 8mm Aneurysm and scared...

CB and Feelbad, I have been reading your responses,, feelbad as allways you give some very great and detail thread,,interesting as allways. and helpful too. But what I fear here is CB is from Canada and that may be why she is not getting the gold treatmeny for all aneurysm..The cost is just amazing for one,,My last one was Jan of this year and it cosy me, or my insurance 16 thousand for the 4 vessel..and for everything involved..No hospital stay Got a plug so I stayed in hospital for 4 hours..My Aneurysm is in the L MCA and they are very complicated over on that side of the brain..It could nean a couple of mm's to getting a surgery or things are so not srtaight it is SO tough to get a coiling or a stent in that area without something bad happening because of all the curves of the LMCA (mine was at the M-2 section ) Still after 10 years..I have a stent..But it didn't work..(but I had to try..) It was called fusiform or looked like a cigar shape..Still does to this day..With a stent through the middle,,I was suppose to have coils put in that same day..But Bad things happened..So it will never happen..This does not happen to , to many people,,In my 10 years I saw 3..besides me,,But it is neccassary to get a angio..I got what you had 5 of them,,So many scans..it is so unreal..For one kinda big monster (for me ) Hugs and wishing you both well, Cindy
__________________
thuderbolt headahe Jan3,01 DX with a inoperable aneurysm. severe headaches everyday for 9 years. SSDI for severe pain R/t inoperable aneurysm pulsating on cranial nerves.

 
Closed Thread

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Board Replies Last Post
I had an aneurysm coiled and stented 6 weeks ago Warama Aneurysm 1 11-09-2010 04:17 AM
Aortic Aneurysm? B143C Aneurysm 7 07-28-2007 08:35 PM
Brain aneurysm...I am so scared! AngieBaby77 Aneurysm 5 03-07-2007 10:17 AM
Brain Aneurysm Shogirl Aneurysm 3 01-25-2007 06:18 AM
Very scared about possible aneurysm! ryanandmaran1 Aneurysm 9 09-14-2005 09:51 PM





Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off




Join Our Newsletter

Stay healthy through tips curated by our health experts.

Whoops,

There was a problem adding your email Try again

Thank You

Your email has been added








TOP THANKED CONTRIBUTORS



feelbad (3), jennybyc (3), writeleft (2), mooniewolf (2), nancyco14 (1), Alupo (1), manofgifts (1), sivad (1), chatterbugs77 (1), Mallorymarie88 (1)

Site Wide Totals

teteri66 (1166), MSJayhawk (999), Apollo123 (898), Titchou (833), janewhite1 (823), Gabriel (758), ladybud (747), sammy64 (667), midwest1 (665), BlueSkies14 (610)



All times are GMT -7. The time now is 01:31 AM.



Site owned and operated by HealthBoards.comô
Terms of Use © 1998-2014 HealthBoards.comô All rights reserved.
Do not copy or redistribute in any form!