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Old 02-09-2009, 03:31 PM   #1
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Have been professional detoxed off of Actiq? Suboxone?

I read some of Angels post here regarding symptoms of being on, or that is, the symptoms of withdrawl of suboxone which struck me as odd at first, then after some thought, not so much, and so have questions for those who have been through detox program via the use of Suboxone.

Short of my story: Three lumbar surgeries and two cervical surgeries '98-2001. Month after double-fusion cervical surgery, massive cervigenical (hope that is correct terminology) headaches began. They begin at top of neck near bottom of skull. Or better said, perphaps, around C1 vert/joint and bottom of skull. In and out of ERs. Dropped out of college. Life consumed by these daily neck/headaches. After all types of meds exhausted, placed on Actiq. About three years on it. As with any med, I guess I built a tolerance, and was taking quite a lot of the lolipops. Placed into detox '07 undercare of professional detoxer at a hopital not a drug addiction clinic or other.

Suboxone chose as that med that would be used to ween me off. The doc assured me that there wouldn't be any screaming or violent reaction. Well, just the opposite happened.

When I read Angel's post about restless legs, or legs reacting to withdrawal, I related save I experienced something much more intense than "restless legs."

I all ready have terrible electrical pain throughout body. Why? Docs don't know. Grown worse over last two years.

Night off detox: In hospital bed waiting for withrdrawl to begin before Suboxone treatment administered. I became nuts/violent. I was screaming from so pain pain. But something very odd occured, my legs begin to kick without wanting very violently. I kicked and kicked the bed, the walls, the floor--same with arm/fist (right side). I ended up injurying myself, but that went ignored by WC.

I used up all Suboxone that was meant for two days within a matter of hours I'm told. I awoke the next morning, complainning of distended stomach (to me stomach, but reality, belly, so colon, right?) I did not void for six or seven days. I was taken off the Suboxone and released early for hospital.

I marks two years this week since then. I have been sick every since then.

Acute pancreatitis caused by not voiding for 12 days. Calificied gallstones and now told need gallbladder removed, though I am not convinced that my digestive problems will be resloved after it for I am more inclined to believe, that like my bladder, not gall, the other, it has been dysfunctional since '99 after double-fusion surgery.

I have had to use pain meds here and there to fight the pain (what is one to do after they are picked up by ambulence that someone called when they find you collapsed on side of road from pain? Tell docs at hospital not to administer pain meds because been through detox?), and some docs convinced that I have been in some kind of withdrawal all these years because after about a month and a half from released fro detox the first use of pain med used--so in their minds not clearly detoxed. I don't get that. Why would treating detox doc think you are and release you?

Anyway, late told that I should have been kept on Suboxone. What? I didn't even know it was a pain med. I guess the docs though after seven years of massive headaches they'd just stop after detox.

Long winded here.

So, sound like anyone here? Anyone use pain meds (legally) for a decade, including Actiq, then go through violent detox, only to find yer body breaking down the following two years since?

Really could be in withdrawl without really knowing it? I know withdrawl, this don't seem like it, it just seems like digestion doesn't work, and was hit with high cholestral/high tryglides soon after detox. Then the acute pancreatitis. The still inability to void even with mass amounts of fiber and pancreatic enzymes. The calificied gallstones found in June '07, not present til then. And now just last night learned that something wrong with lung. Mininimal colapse of some sort that I don't quite understand yet. Also discovered in '07, but only learning now. It doesn't seem odd to me that all the things have occured since detox, well, now they don't after reading this and that. But, ya think it probably that body starting shutting down from the shock of it, the violent withdrawl, etc etc etc.

 
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Old 02-10-2009, 05:21 AM   #2
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Re: Have been professional detoxed off of Actiq? Suboxone?

Chev

Oh my god, I feel so bad for you. I understand your story more than you can ever understand. I wish we could talk. I know you have read my posts about "suboxone" withdrawl and you know most of my story but.....I still need to post several things to you. I understand that first night in the hospital withdrawl clinic waiting to get the opiates out of your system before they give you suboxone. I was put in the clinic in the afternoon and I am pretty sure the ward was closed but I was so desperate and in withdrawl (a long story again) that I think they just stuck me in there. It was under a "construction zone" and everything was torn up (they were doing the kitchen over, the shower and the rooms you sit in everyday to visit with everyone). It was dark and I was alone. They sent my husband home immediately and he couldn't even get me settled in. I laid there all night, screaming and yelling and crying and calling out for my family and shaking and my legs wouldn't stay still and of course "no sleep". I paced up and down the lonely halls not even a nurse in sight. The nurses desk was all apart too as they were doing that over again. The nurses were on the other side of the closed double doors that were locked with only them having keys. It was so dark and quiet and I paced and screamed and cried and nobody even came in. I was so scared!!!!! I was in some kind of hell and my family doctor had done this to me and then was in a car accident and "died"!!!! I am in chronic pain and had a Cervical Fusion and Discetomy in 2003 on C5/6 6/7 for bulging discs, arthritis and bone spurs and was in so much pain and tried everything humanly possible to get rid of this pain until a top "Neurosurgeon" said he could help me. I have titanium pins and plates and donor bones also. I was told afterwards that the 2nd donor bone did not fuse or had disintegrated and that the surgery did not do anything for my pain. I was on Percocet in the hospital and when I came home was put on Vicodin and after a while that didn't work for my pain. My doc kept on adding medication which never really helped a lot with my pain but I took them any way just in case. I never once felt high just a bit better with my pain management. He then started my on oxycodone and I used Vicodin for breakthru pain. You say that your body might have been in withdrawl for all of this time and you didn't know it. Well I started getting "restless legs" really bad and couldn't take it. My doc treated me with "requip" which didn't help at all. As I said I never took an extra pill or never even took one early, "All of a sudden one day I realized that this wasn't restless legs, it was in fact "WITHDRAWL", if I just took more pain meds my restless legs would go away!!!!! Well I wouldn't take any more and went to the new doc that was taking over for my doctor that had died. She was absolutely floored at the amount of medication my doctor had me on and I was also on Xanax and Ambien. She said she would try to help me get off of the pain pills. She told me to switch my afternoon Vicodin for an 8 hour tylenol. She had a plan to start switching my pills around and to wean me off at home. The first day I tried that my system went into "complete withdrawl" and that is when my husband to me to the ER and with the help of an "addictionologist" I got into the "withdrawl clinic". My story is long, sorry. The night that I detoxed by myself the nurses checked me every 1/2 an hr. or so to see if I was still breathing and then left me there in hysterics all by myself. They were very cold in there. They all treated me like "something on the bottom of their shoe" and so did the docs until I decided to tell one of the top docs what I thought of the way the nurses and doctors were treating me (another story) but I stood up for myself and it helped. Anyway they were also making sure that I wasn't having a "SEIZURE". It sounds to me like you were having a SEIZURE on your first night. Did anyone ever tell you that it could be possible? You sound like you were shaking too much and having violent reactions. Mine were bad but not as bad as yours.
I don't want to go on much more but if you say you read my story then you know about my suboxone withdrawl which was absolute hell and I don't wish that on anyone. They say, and this is my opinion and after reading these boards for over 6 weeks that is the opinion of other people that have just gone through this. They don't tell you in the clinic what the "suboxone" is all about they just give it to you and of course you trust them or you wouldn't be there. They also gave me "feenabarbitol" and Serequel which was a real trip, I didn't even know where I was half the time, it was terrible. (another story). Anyway they say that Suboxone is just another opiate and that you are trading one bad drug for another one. Please read up on these boards. I too have digestive problems and probably have IB. I was diagnosed with Fibromyalgia because the operation did work and they don't know where my pain is coming from. I also have myofascial pain, chronic fatigue syndrome, Epstein Barr Virus and CMV. Right now I am working with a Pain Management Doc. and am getting Injections. I have had 2 sets of test blocks done and next Monday am having the "Nerves Burnt" in my neck under radio frequency. I have had that done before and it helped about 40% for approx. 6 months until the nerves grow back again. They do one side at a time after doing two sets of test shots on each side. It takes too long for me to get relief.

If you have any questions feel free to ask. My posts are over 5 weeks old but they are still on the boards.

Take care of yourself Lyn in Michigan

 
Old 02-10-2009, 09:03 AM   #3
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Re: Have been professional detoxed off of Actiq? Suboxone?

Welcome Chev!

What a story!!! I wish I had an answer for you.. I am no way even close to being an expert of w/d or detoxing so I don't want to give you an anwers that may not be correct.. In my mind anything is possible or... it could be coinsidence that all of these things went awry after the w/d.. I truly don't know... What I do know is that you have been thru a HECK of a time and I am sorry for that. What I can tell you is that I just had my gallbladder out in Oct. and it was pretty easy.. I had a complication after surgery that landed me back in the hospital but if that would not have happened... it in my mind would have been a piece of cake! So... if you have to go thru that.. GOOD LUCK!!! Also, they say that after the gallbladder is out it for some people losens your stool. So this may help you.. For me... It only did that the first couple of weeks and then.. back to normal.

I just wanted you to know that you are in my thoughts and prayers and I really hope for your sake.... you get the help you so badly need.

Stick around!!
~Secrets

 
Old 02-10-2009, 06:49 PM   #4
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Re: Have been professional detoxed off of Actiq? Suboxone?

I reread what I wrote. With all the spelling errors, etc, I'm amazed ya two were able to make sense of it.

 
Old 02-10-2009, 07:20 PM   #5
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Re: Have been professional detoxed off of Actiq? Suboxone?

Yeah, you have one heck of a tale of horror. I was shocked when I read some of your post here. Your the first person I've come across to speak of the leg deal and bad detox experience, well other than those who have done the cold turkey deal from street drugs. And even then, I have never heard of violently kicking one's legs against a wall at full force without wanting.

I was told by doc there I wouldn't experience any screaming or violent reaction because the suboxone is being used. I don't know. Next morning said he had seen/heard of only four tales of what I went through in his whole long career.

In Oct '06, I was in ER, I had plenty of fentanyl with me and in me. As I lie there in bed being examed, my legs started kicking out of control. I mean really kicking hard. Way up in the air. That was the first time it happened. They said something about seizure, but it stopped and nothing was said, reported, done about it. I was caught up in too many things at time to really pay much attention to it, then I entered detox in a top hospital. I was detox in the oncology ward. Poor nurses had no idea what to do. First they came in and told me to stop screaming because of the other patients--folks dying of cancer. Yeah, there reality lies, in the oncology ward. A place where mercy and peace is longed for. Anyway, then all I remember is at one point a doctor holding me. There was no walking around. Only screaming and violently kicking or swinging.

So even while on the fentanyl (back to ER '06) it happened. I have alot of nerve issues going on--been going on and getting worse; and, it is unexplainable presently. Arachnoiditis? CRPS? Two conditions put forth by doctors, but, have yet to prove it either than what I have reported to doctors over the years.

I have to leave. Yeah, my gut hurts.

I'll be back.

We'll talk.

Blessings.

 
Old 02-15-2009, 08:03 PM   #6
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Re: Have been professional detoxed off of Actiq? Suboxone?

[QUOTE=ANGELINMICHIGAN;3880301]Chev

Oh my god, I feel so bad for you.

I've been reading posts here and elsewhere and one can become quite overwhelmed even more than all ready when he leaves his insular bubble and feeeeels (strivin' for a Bob Dylan feel there) the sorrow of others suffering. Not that I didn't "feel" it before, but the years sure seem have gone by quick without much bumping into the other travelers limping and rolling along in pain. Perhaps the meds kept me in haze.




I understand your story more than you can ever understand. I wish we could talk. I know you have read my posts about "suboxone" withdrawl and you know most of my story but.....I still need to post several things to you. I understand that first night in the hospital withdrawl clinic waiting to get the opiates out of your system before they give you suboxone.

Yeah, that was odd. I was told that was the protocal, but didn't think about it I guess. I just lay there waiting for whatever is to be the calm transition to the nonopiated world. No calm though. Two years later, the riot of the aftermath of that night are seeming to find it way back into hospital, if the ER tomorrow, to finally do away with whatever is causing me to be sick all these years.



I was put in the clinic in the afternoon and I am pretty sure the ward was closed but I was so desperate and in withdrawl (a long story again) that I think they just stuck me in there. It was under a "construction zone" and everything was torn up (they were doing the kitchen over, the shower and the rooms you sit in everyday to visit with everyone). It was dark and I was alone.


You read here as does the opening of a horror tale. Yeah, one should not be left alone even if they think all will be well. I have no answer.


They sent my husband home immediately and he couldn't even get me settled in. I laid there all night, screaming and yelling and crying and calling out for my family and shaking and my legs wouldn't stay still and of course "no sleep".


My father claims that the treating doctor told him he had never heard of a withdrawl such as mine, though I remember him showing up the next morning saying maybe four times in his 20 odd year career. And here you are, one of the others. What is the deal with the leg thing? It was horrible. Yeah, I cried, shouted (nurses would come into my room and tell me not to scream)....yeah, I feel ya.



I paced up and down the lonely halls not even a nurse in sight. The nurses desk was all apart too as they were doing that over again. The nurses were on the other side of the closed double doors that were locked with only them having keys.

Most definately a nightmarish tale unfolding here. It's one of those deals where because ya have been there, it's all the more scarier and through it the whole no nurses and locked doubled doors, yeah, not good.

The truth: I paced up and down the halls during my stay there--I believe 8 days. When I finally made a doctors appointment after being released, which was almost a month later, I was told by doc that I was reported as "dancing around the halls." Bullocks.




It was so dark and quiet and I paced and screamed and cried and nobody even came in. I was so scared!!!!! I was in some kind of hell and my family doctor had done this to me and then was in a car accident and "died"!!!! I am in chronic pain and had a Cervical Fusion and Discetomy in 2003 on C5/6 6/7 for bulging discs, arthritis and bone spurs and was in so much pain and tried everything humanly possible to get rid of this pain until a top "Neurosurgeon" said he could help me. I have titanium pins and plates and donor bones also. I was told afterwards that the 2nd donor bone did not fuse or had disintegrated and that the surgery did not do anything for my pain. I was on Percocet in the hospital and when I came home was put on Vicodin and after a while that didn't work for my pain.


"Vicodin is a worthless med for those suffering severe pain."


My doc kept on adding medication which never really helped a lot with my pain but I took them any way just in case. I never once felt high just a bit better with my pain management.


Yeah, the whole "high" thing is not what I experienced either. Maybe the first time given pain meds back in '99, but one forgets that and like you say move along from one med to another til like me, seven years after first spine surgery, taking thousands of mcgs of Actiq/fentanyl a day."


Be back...

 
Old 02-15-2009, 08:34 PM   #7
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Re: Have been professional detoxed off of Actiq? Suboxone?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Secrets1983 View Post
Welcome Chev!

What a story!!! I wish I had an answer for you.. I am no way even close to being an expert of w/d or detoxing so I don't want to give you an anwers that may not be correct.. In my mind anything is possible or... it could be coinsidence that all of these things went awry after the w/d.. I truly don't know... What I do know is that you have been thru a HECK of a time and I am sorry for that. What I can tell you is that I just had my gallbladder out in Oct. and it was pretty easy.. I had a complication after surgery that landed me back in the hospital but if that would not have happened... it in my mind would have been a piece of cake! So... if you have to go thru that.. GOOD LUCK!!! Also, they say that after the gallbladder is out it for some people losens your stool. So this may help you.. For me... It only did that the first couple of weeks and then.. back to normal.

I just wanted you to know that you are in my thoughts and prayers and I really hope for your sake.... you get the help you so badly need.

I'm sitting here, 36 hours without sleep, even with sleepin' pills, and my, whatever it is that is in the middle of your chest (how can it be stomach when it is on the side of ya?) is in so much pain that I think it is going to implode. I am just waiting til the moment I can't take another moment then off to ER. I have taken so much fiber and pancreatic enzymes, and yet, no relief from pain and no voiding. Heck, over last week and a half have only slept a few days. Some much pain. To think this started two years ago this month. And W/C just ignored it. Ignored it all.

Peace to you...


Stick around!!
~Secrets

 
Old 02-16-2009, 09:11 PM   #8
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Re: Have been professional detoxed off of Actiq? Suboxone?

When I was on Actiq the only thing I remember was some twitching and violent jerking but that was while I was on it, not detoxing, and I still get that from time to time every since I am assuming because I had nerve damage. I did also get a heartbeat in my ear basically 24/7 and it never went a way and that started when I as on the Actiq too but again, I had head and ear trauma. I have had it looked at and no one can give me answers about that though. At one point when they took me off the Actiq and gave me the duragesic patches, I got really sick. They didn't know why, it lasted a week. I told them I was going through WDs but they kept telling me that wasn't possible because it was the same drug just trans dermal delivery as opposed to transmucosal. Later, I found out from another doc and from talking to others both on this board and in my support group that others had the same thing happen because apparently your body will actually go into WDs if you change the method of delivery, because it knows the difference. But I have only heard this with the fentynl.

I don't know if that is relevant, just sharing my experience with this drug. Oh and I ended up with 20 cavities from the Actiq too which I think is pretty normal because of the sugar. I can say that it was the best for my migraines though. It used to get rid of them like when I would get a shot of Toridol, I am not sure why.

 
Old 02-17-2009, 05:33 AM   #9
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Re: Have been professional detoxed off of Actiq? Suboxone?

just so you know, suboxone use is not indicated for use in people with a clinical need for pain management. its on the manufacturers box.

 
Old 02-17-2009, 09:26 AM   #10
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Re: Have been professional detoxed off of Actiq? Suboxone?

Chev.....I just found your post from the other day that you were quoting my post and giving your own story of what you went through!!!! Yes, the whole process was absolutely terrifying!!!!! These boards DO help me but, the image of that night and what I went through after tapering slowly off of "suboxone" for 3 1/2 weeks with about the same withdrawl symptoms,will always be in my mind.

How are you feeling now? I hope you are feeling better.
Take care

ANGELINMICHIGAN Lyn

 
Old 02-17-2009, 10:30 AM   #11
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Re: Have been professional detoxed off of Actiq? Suboxone?

Quote:
Originally Posted by makai808 View Post
When I was on Actiq the only thing I remember was some twitching and violent jerking but that was while I was on it, not detoxing, and I still get that from time to time every since I am assuming because I had nerve damage. I did also get a heartbeat in my ear basically 24/7 and it never went a way and that started when I as on the Actiq too but again, I had head and ear trauma. I have had it looked at and no one can give me answers about that though. At one point when they took me off the Actiq and gave me the duragesic patches, I got really sick. They didn't know why, it lasted a week. I told them I was going through WDs but they kept telling me that wasn't possible because it was the same drug just trans dermal delivery as opposed to transmucosal. Later, I found out from another doc and from talking to others both on this board and in my support group that others had the same thing happen because apparently your body will actually go into WDs if you change the method of delivery, because it knows the difference. But I have only heard this with the fentynl.

I don't know if that is relevant, just sharing my experience with this drug. Oh and I ended up with 20 cavities from the Actiq too which I think is pretty normal because of the sugar. I can say that it was the best for my migraines though. It used to get rid of them like when I would get a shot of Toridol, I am not sure why.
Interesting. Yeah, I had violent kickings and the like while on Actiq, though nothing like what happened in detox.

What ya said about the patches and the lolis etc, yeah, it's true. The patches never worked for me. The lolis did, though ended up taking thousands of mcgs a day. Now insurance won't cover it. Am told to get pain pump. I would rather not. The rush to ER began again after the Actiq taking away (which friends and family were happy to see. Yeah, some folks you just can't reach when it comes to the subject that yer in terrible pain) and I lost on what to do.

I lost seven teeth (or is it "tooths)--Na, can't be) in a years time. No total of two years to deal with the dental issues. Yeah, 16 cavities found first visit to dentist after detox. I wonder now if W/C responsible for this given that I don't have the funds to fix teeth. Yeah, how is one suppose to live on 600 and change a month in Cali? I do it. Aaah, Hawaii, my home of youth.

There is new fent that doesn't have sugar, but learned, probably here, that only for diabetics.

Yeah, best for "migraines" though I don't consider what I have as migraines, well, only in a general sense of it. I have massive headaches caused by a cervical problem that doctor can'f figure out. They started one month after double fusion surgery (cervical) back in 2000. Life for the most part ended there.

Lastly, on the use of, the side effects of, I'm sitting awaiting a rush to ER to deal with a failing endocrine system that began the first night/morning of detox.

I'm in so much pain. My stomach, colon, and now my liver which is also causing this terrible itching sensation all over my body. One cannot help but wonder if the Actiq has anything to do with all this and whether or not this is also a matter for W/C to deal with.

Yeah, seems to me a quesion of causation, but I don't have an attorney any longer--he took the money and ran. Leaving me alone to fight. I can't do that while I fight for my health with my own government ran health insurance.

Glad you posted.

I haven't seen it, but if anyone reads this and knows that healthboards hosts a Work Comp forum, please provide link.

 
Old 02-17-2009, 12:23 PM   #12
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Re: Have been professional detoxed off of Actiq? Suboxone?

Hey again,

How are you doing now? I have been reading more and more and I feel for the position you are in. It must be so hard!

Just know I am here for you to lean on!!! You will be in my prayers!
XOXOXOX
__________________
~Secrets

 
Old 02-17-2009, 02:28 PM   #13
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Re: Have been professional detoxed off of Actiq? Suboxone?

Hi Chevmal......I feel so bad for you!!!! I have a few questions for you and also MAKAI808. What is Actiq and what kind of patches were they that you were on. Were they for "inflammation" as that is what I am using. When I first started using them they made me feel sick and the doc (neurologist) said that they shouldn't make me sick as they don't go through your gut!!!!! I know you have read my story and you probably forget that I also had a "cervical fusion" in 2003 on C5/6 6/7 with titanium pins and plates and donor bones. It did not take away my pain and still have the same pain after withdrawl from my opiates and suboxone. I have headaches all the time. They never go away and the pain doc thinks it "migraines". Have you been told that? Nothing takes them away except it went away while I was on the pain pills and didn't realize that is what took it away and now that I have gone through withdrawl and am free of all drugs, my headache is back. It is getting on my last nerve and the same as you, they don't know what is causing it. Just thought I would complain while I was here!!!!

I might be on the wrong boards to ask you these questions so maybe the moderator will move it.

Take care and talk to you soon
Hope you have a "pain free evening"

AngelinMichigan Lyn

 
Old 02-18-2009, 04:10 AM   #14
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Re: Have been professional detoxed off of Actiq? Suboxone?

Angel,
Yes I have been struggling with headaches as well. At first I thought they were rebound headaches from tapering but they get very severe and make it very hard to taper (when you have pain like that, it makes it hard to reduce your meds!). I have tried just about everything for migraines which is what my doc said they were but since nothing is working, I don't think that is it. At one point topomax seemed to work but only for a month. What drives me crazy is that i don't believe that pain comes from nowhere, and when I get a headached I think it is my bodies way of telling me something is wrong and because they are very severe headaches it is strange to me that no one can figure out what they are! I tend to believe they are hormonal but I just am not sure how to fix it.

Actiq are a cancer pain med. They are fentynl lollipops usually used for breakthrough pain along with the duragesic patches which are fentynl in a transdermal (through the skin) patch that time releases the meds in a 72 hour period. They are very strong meds and very addicting and VERY VERY expensive. They used to be $1000 for a box of 30 and insurance will not cover them unless you have cancer. I wouldnt have been on them if my insurance hadn't covered them. Most docs wont prescribe them unless you have cancer although I am hearing that more and more docs are using them for severe migraines because they work immediately and like I said even though it doesn't seem to be a reasonable med for migraines being that they are quick delivery and the they don't last long, they did work well for me because I felt they broke the cycle. They allowed me to get out of pain right away and it is almost like my body just needed a couple of hours to recover to fight whatever it was causing my headaches.

Also Chev, regarding your issue with money and your meds, did you know that the company that makes actiq has a program you can apply for where they will give you your meds free if you can't afford them? In fact almost every company has this for just about any drug, and if you meet certain requirements you can get the meds you need for free. When my insurance decided to not cover actiq for me anymore, I did this and it saved me! <removed>

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Old 02-18-2009, 12:55 PM   #15
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Re: Have been professional detoxed off of Actiq? Suboxone?

Howzit. 808 was my area code, but lived up malka, though "live" makai.

Anyway, my experience different then yours with headaces and the meds. It worked, that is the Actiq. Still, detoxed and door shut and left to my own accord. I haven't looked back into taking Actiq because of the fact that rotten teeth and some mysterious bowel problems developed after detox. In fact as I write this, or when I finish, heading over to the digestive board to post because I have emergency situation on hands. Still, when faced with an inplant of some medicine delivery deal, I would rather medicate orally then go to that extreme, though that extreme is said to be not as extreme then taking Actiq. I don't know.

As far as meds being paid for, heard about it, never looked into it. The only fentanly type product would want to use now (patches were terrible for me) like the loli would be the sugarfree cough drop type.

Yep, the headaches of pain even in paradise brings me down.

Last edited by mod-anon; 02-19-2009 at 05:11 AM. Reason: Please use the Quick Reply button instead of Quote Reply.

 
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