I was wondering if anyone has had disc reatachment surgery to unlock the jaw? my disc is anteriorly displaced( forward).

I would be greatful if any one has had this type of surgery and if you have, was it a success?

Take care,
Carey

Does anyone have any advice on this type of surgery?

Carey

Carey ..I had a displaced disk for several years and was locked shut for a long time.It just got worse over the years.I went from Migraine Dr's to Nero Spl.to ENT's..and all types of Dentist.
After years of x-rays and medication I went to a great Oral surgeon recommend by a friend with tmjd.

You must have a MRI done to find the exact placement of the disc.I had this done last Oct. They found the right joint totally ahead of the socket( hence lock shut) well I was in alot of pain and was fighting my INS provider at the time for a surgery date..I was rear-ended sitting still in traffic. I had the Arthoplasty done 2 weeks later.They(open joint) placed the joint back where it was supposed to be and stitched it there in place. When I awoke in recovery I could tell a big difference.It felt like a rubber band had been cut from around my head...I went through it fine..I was healing very well and just last week I was in another accident ( rear-ended).I feel horrible now,The pain they say is from all the swelling in my joints.We will know in few weeks if anything permenant is damaged. So its kinda hard to say how I'm healing.
I will say You have to be the Perfect Canidate for this surgery.. Its not for everyone...But I was better for the last 6 months,until I was hit.

But the surgery part was a breeze after the pain of splints and everything I went through.

Please let me know more about your case and what you are going through,,,,Its hard I know.

Good luck...Bren

Bren,

Thanks for replying. I am sorry to hear your tmj troubles are back again. Thanks for the insight on the surgery and what to expect, even though i am still quite terrified about the whole thing. for over 3 years i have been battling with tmj. the cause of my tmj was from after having a general anaesthetic, where they put a tube down my throat for an air way and they were rough with my jaw doing so. I have tried all conservative treatments from 3 splints which i think made my tmj worse, physio, chiropractor, acupuncture and 2 arthrocentesis (washout of the joint). it was when i had my first washout when i became totally locked shut, and have been ever since (one and a half years) with an opening of 5mm.

I give many many thanks to my pain management specialist who not only knew the right surgeon for me, but has managed my pain, which no other doctor did anything about. although i am heavily sedated at night and i am in bed at 7:30pm, and take 11 different tablets, i am just about pain free, except for the odd days in which my pain is unbearable.
I went to se 5 different surgeons for opinions in my state (Melbourne) and they wanted to remove my disc completely. i was not impressed with that at all, i am only 22 years old and i could see what would follow if i went ahead with that surgery, joint degeneration and arthritis. but the surgeon i have found is the best in the country and one of the best in the world, so in think i will be in good hands.he said that i am too young to have the disc removed and there would be no way that he would even consider removing it, instead, as you read from my post he will reatach my disc. so i will just see what happens, and hopefully there will be light at the end of the tunnel for me..

Take care, and keep me posted on how you are going.

Carey



[This message has been edited by moderator1 (edited 08-06-2002).]

Carey..I am so sorry to hear of all the pain you have gone through yourself..It is very hard to handle and with an opening of 5mm..I just cant imagine it.
I had heard that the washing (flushing ) of the joints was painful as surgery..I wore the splints and all the other that comes with it ..But I did find a Doctor that told me if we are going into the joint for any reason it is to repair it..I know he has helped me alot..But the injury I'm dealing with now ... All I have to wait on is time.. to see if it will get better, He did see a MRI in the near future.. I hope it will show all Is great when the swelling goes away.


Please be careful about the scar tissue and exercise your mouth..I find moist heat when doing the stretching helps alot and Never over do it.

I know how life deals hard challenges .. At 22 you are really being tested..Please be strong...I have known the ugly face of TMJ for many years too...Its hard for others to see it and even understand.

But we all know... It is real.
...Hang in there.

Bren,

Thanks for the tips on scar tissue and the exercises. I find that waiting is a killer. a certain doctor in an ER has delayed 4 months of my surgery b/c she labelled me a psychiatric case. this doc knew nothing about my history of tmj and would not even listen to my GP or pain specialist. it began 4 days after my washout of my joint when i developed severe spasms of my mouth and neck. i was in agony so i went to my local emergency room and since i didn't respond to their meds they immediately labelled me a serious psych case, where a letter has been sent to all my doctors and my surgeon (who i no longer see) who said to me i need urgent psychiatric assessment!! i couldnt believe it either could my GP or pain specialist, they knew that i wasnt nuts, but the only thing to get the ball rolling again was to have this damn psychiatric assessment to make every one happy, so i did and the psychiatrist could not believe what i went through, and he labelled me sane! Hooray.

I found out that whilst in the ER, doctors dont like it when patients know more about their condition than they do. I was telling the doc at the time about my tmj and that i am on massive doses of meds, hence the reason why i didnt respond the the minute doses that they gave me and give "normal" people. this was told to that doc many times by my specialists but ignored what they had to say and labelled me instead. so for me all of this waiting is killing me, 4 months ago i could have had my surgery and be on the mend, but that was not to happen. there must be something out there that says that i can live with a locked jaw for ever.lol
So i can relate with you in regards to waiting. are you on any regular meds at the moment?
I hope you are going ok.

anyway sorry that was so long, but that is where i am at today, and still waiting on the surgery date.
Keep me posted,

Take care,
Carey

Yes I know Carey.. the pain can be too much.I understand how people can say "Gosh yo take alot of pain medication or you complian an awful lot about your neck, face ,joints" or they think you crave attention or just like to complain. TMJD is something that cannot be seen to the naked eye (except for somedays when you look like a chipmunk)
If you get into a accident and you can see the blood its a bit easier to get treatment. People just dont understand the pain you go through,,and will never know.
I take Darvocet on occasion to take the edge off and lots of Ibupro. for the swelling from my wreck. I can see how you can get addicted to feeling,,so I 'm tapering off..I stopped taking the Paxil a few weeks ago and I'm taking Zanax 2x a day half at a time.
I'm coping ...Thats all I can say.
I hate to tell you..the muscle problems..I still have a huge knot on my shoulder and stay tied up in knots all over all the time ..It's really hard.. but you are supposed to stretch everyday.. I was going to Phy. Therapy after my other wreck before my surgery and they found it travels all over.. on day one place and one day another...

Well I hope you have better days hun....Let me know whats going on....and anthing else we can compare.."I'm CrAzY too" or so they tell me.

Well Bren, this is my latest news: I recieved the long awaited letter from my surgeon saying he will not perform any surgery on me b/c my mri scan showed that my left side which is the one that is affected or has been keeping me locked shut for the past year and a half is normal and my right side is anteriorly dislocated,!! so no surgery. i am totally devastated, i cried just about all day yesterday when i heard the news.
what the hell do i do now? the top surgeon in the country has turned me away, i am at my witts end here. am i supposed to live with a locked jaw and live on meds for the rest of my life am i?!!!! i truly don't know what to do. but i do want to have another mri taken, they must have stuffed up somehow.

Carey

No Carey.. You must get another opinion..I hope you keep a copy of x-rays and MRI results you have been taking.I took everything I had to three different Doctors before I found someone to help me.And yes displacement on one side can cause the other side the pain.In my case he keep telling me my the side with deteration was causing my entire jaw to been out of line and the close lock.The bone was ahead of meniscus( the soft tissue that belongs in between the two).

Please don't give up...I know how you must feel.
...let us know... Please..

Bren

Bren,

I do have all of my xrays and MRI's on me, and i got the last mri double checked but they say that it is my right side that is the one displaced. But i am going to demand to have another MRI scan to make sure and get it checked by at least 2 different people. i am much calmer today than i was the other day when i heard the news. there has to be an explanation and i am not going to give up until i find that answer. If anything, having a locked jaw has made me a much stronger person. if i think of anything and compare it to my TMJ i think nothing beats that, and i become stronger every time when setbacks like the last one happens.

I will hang in there, it gives me the absolute s$#%s, but what else can i do?

Carey

God bless you Carey,,,

I hope you can get relief soon...I know from experience...

Attitude makes all the difference...Don't give up..

Hugs*********** Bren

Bren,

Thank you for your kind words. this is the only support group i have, apart from my family and friends. there is nothing in terms of any support group in my state, let alone the country.

Take care,
Carey

Carey,

I too am in Melbourne and have had 2 arthroscopies on my right TMJ. My situation is nothing like yours but I can only just fathom the discomfort and pain you suffer.

What is the name of the OMFS you have seen in Melbourne. Mine is Michael Hase in Collins Street. He is extremely good and has taught in the UK and Australia.

Anyway keep your head up and keep us posted.

Michael

[This message has been edited by MichaelW (edited 08-14-2002).]

Michael,

What type of surgery did you have, was it for your discs? I have seen many Surgeons in Melb for second opinions and i did see Michael Hase for one. i was under the care of Prof John Ferguson, but not any more (long story). I have been to adelaide to see Prof Alaistair Goss who was meant to perform surgery on me.

is your tmj taken care of now or do you still have problems? It is good to hear from someone in the same state. where abouts are you from?

Take care,
Carey

[This message has been edited by Carey (edited 08-14-2002).]

[This message has been edited by Well-come (edited 08-14-2002).]

Bren,

I am having another MRI in 3 weeks. when i spoke to my pain specialist he only recieved the letter from my surgeon the same day i did and he was the one (pain specialist) who said that i need another MRI done. he said that my last one didn't show my discs. i asked him then why did they say my right side was displaced and not my left? he didn't know and both myself and him think that there is something fishy going on in regards to pursuing with my surgery.

meanwhile, yet another waiting game.

Carey

Carey,

I suffered for about 5 years with constant cracking and clicking and more imparticular pain in the joint. Some days it was good despite alot of activity others it was bad despite no activity :(

I had a splint which helped for a while then it came back. I then saw M Hase and had arthograms done on both sides which showed no displacement but a lack of movement of the disc (can recall this was in 1992). The right disc was sort of squashing on opening.

I was taking Panadeine Forte like a snack with no 100% reduction in pain. Decided to go ahead with arthroscopy in 1993. The video shown to me showed lots of lesions floating around and extensive blood vessels all over the disc. This procedure was like a miracle for 18months. Then one night the joint made an aweful noise and started hurting from that point onwards. Pain was getting worse each day. Put up with it for 2 and 1/2 years.

It was affecting everything I did, didn't want to do anything! as you can imagine. Decided to have another arthroscopy in Dec 1997. OMFS found that the disc had attached itself to the top of the fossa and the condyle was moving around underneath the disc. The improvement from the 2nd procedure took couple of months (unlike the 1st within a week!). That worked well for 3 years, and continues to do so, but I have had a couple of flare-ups (one lasted 7months and actually was going to have another cleanout but it actually came good again. The 2nd flare up recently lasted about 1 month).

All in all things are ok now. The only time it bothers me is if the joint cracks or clunks (ie when opening wide such as a yawn). I have some celebrex that I will hold off on until things get worse. I take Glucosamine every day which I think keeps things at bay - maybe).

Sorry for the long post but yes it's good to hear from others in the same area. I work in the city but live in Williamstown (just over the bridge).

Cheers
Michael

Originally posted by Carey:
Michael,

What type of surgery did you have, was it for your discs? I have seen many Surgeons in Melb for second opinions and i did see Michael Hase for one. i was under the care of Prof John Ferguson, but not any more (long story). I have been to adelaide to see Prof Alaistair Goss who was meant to perform surgery on me.

is your tmj taken care of now or do you still have problems? It is good to hear from someone in the same state. where abouts are you from?

Take care,
Carey

[This message has been edited by Carey (edited 08-14-2002).]

[This message has been edited by MichaelW (edited 08-14-2002).]

[This message has been edited by Well-come (edited 08-14-2002).]

Michael...I like to know what others have been through..It helps me see what happens when you decide on the surgical side of treatment.So far..Besides a car accident ..I have the feeling I made the right choice having the open-joint surgery.(post- op 7 months)I'm getting better..Just the whiplash and new pain are hard to handle at times.But the Migranies I was having were hell.They are gone now.

I know they say surgery is ONLY for the select few...But is was a hard choice to make....They say once you have any thing like that done..It just leads to more surgery later..What do you think?


*****Bren

Bren,

It's one of those things where when your semi-well you say 'Yes no surgery for me, surgery is bad news' but when your in terrible pain and you cannot concentrate on anything other than what's happening and thinking what next, you quickly change your mind.

I would like to say that open joint surgery for me would be only a last resort and only if opening became an issue. From my perspective (some may agree against me) I think that an arthroscopy through a pinhole doesn't really classify as radically invasive. That why I was, and still am, prepared to have another cleanout if there is the possibility that it extends the fucntionality of the joint and thus reduces chance of something more invasive.

My thoughts are that a joint which is not functioning properly (like mine and I dont mean people with open or closed locks) is slowly degenerating the joint. If by cleaning it out it may reduce the damage then I am prepared to do it.

As I mentioned in my earlier longwinded post, the recovery following my 2nd procedure was longer and it was almost like 'this hasn't worked'. It did eventually come good but the extra recoup period I perhaps attribute to the 2.5 years of problems I had following the 1st procedure (which was good for 1.5 years)as during this 2.5 years damage was being done.

Anyway I will finish up now.

Be well and stay well.

Michael

Michael,

Do you still have your discs? I am currently on a lot of meds and have been on for the past year. i take clonazepam, tramal (as panadiene forte did nothing for me either)and doxepin which i take every night and puts me to sleep within aone and a half hours. I am going to try to cut down on them if i can b/c i dont even like the fact that i am taking them , but that is what has helped me a great lot in terms of pain management.

I am under the care of Prof. Jack Gerschman for pain management. he is absolutely fantastic i dont know where i would be without him. he specialises in TMJ and seems to know all the right people. he is situated at the end of Commercial Road opposite the Alfred Hospital. just a suggestion if you ever need to see someone with your pain.

Take care,
Carey

Bren,

How are you going? what's the latest news on your front?

Carey

Michael,

you mentioned that you take celebrex. What type of medication is it? just curious.

Carey

Carey, thanks for the update on the prof. I will keep that in mind.

Celebrex is a newer form of anti-inflamatory.

Yep I still have my discs....they function ok now..

Cheers
Michael

Michael,

How did you find Michael Hase in terms of your opinion of him? when i went to see him he straight away didnt really seem too interested in me or my situation and sent me to a physio down the hall from him. I was not happy with that b/c i had been there , done that, and tried all conservative treatments available. in terms of thinking of surgery, my opinion was that i would not want this guy to perform any surgery on me. but that was one year ago when i saw him, and maybe, now that i am at my witts end with having the top guy in Aus dumping me and won't do the surgery, maybe i do need to visit Michael Hase again. I would also like to know your opinion on his bedside manner. he didnt really seem to care about my situation, maybe that was b/c i only went to see him for a second opinion.

I went for my other MRI scan on tuesday (yesterday) and they are having trouble interpreting the scans. this has happened twice now and i am running out of patience!!!! the head honcho of radiology wont be back until next week. I am so sick of waiting. it just seems like everyone thinks that i can go on living with a locked jaw forever, and when they say that your appointment is in a few weeks time, i just cannot believe it b/c i am the one who is counting down the days until i am seen. i am just so frustrated and i just want all of this to end!!!


any info would be greatly appreciated. thanks Michael.

Take care,
Carey

Carey,

I really feel for you. As far as Michael Hase goes I did find that (in my case) he too was very conservative and really wanted physio, physio, splint, splint type treatment before anything else. The two times I had the arthroscopy I went in in the morning and left in the afternoon before I even saw him. I hate hospitals and was told I could go home when I wanted. All I had was a small patch on the side of my face so nothing major.

I do recall from reading of another person in Melbourne who had a similiar problem to yours seeing another OMFS in collins street and having surgery. I am sorry but I cant recall his name....I read this over on a forum that is now defunct. If I can recall anything I will certainly drop you a line.

I do hope things improve for you....

Michael

[This message has been edited by moderator2 (edited 08-27-2002).]

Thanks Michael,

It really comforts you when your surgeon has a bad bed side manner.lol. but i think i have gotten used to it after having a total of 6 surgeries 2 on my jaw and 4 on my feet and i am only 22 years old,and studying to become a nurse but this year i deferred b/c i missed too many important classes when i had the washouts. i also have a degree in disability studies and care for children with severe disabilities. i think my work keeps me kind of sane. i see how worse off these kids are and how they struggle with their hralth problems and live day by day to try improve their quality of living, it just breaks my heart. and then i compare it to my situation. but still i too am seeking a better quality of life as well. I dont have a life at the moment, and havent for the past year since i have been on medication b/c i am knocked out and in bed at 7:30pm every night. i do not go out at night and during the day i am exhausted. i have tried to not let TMJ control my life, but at the moment it is. the mri scan that i had during the week will determine if i will have surgery or not. but yet again i am still left frustrated and waiting!!

Thanks again Michael,

Take care,
Carey

[This message has been edited by moderator2 (edited 08-27-2002).]

Well everyone, this is my update:

I finally got my MRI results from my dr. and they say that both my discs move back and forward. As for surgery, i was told that it would not be in my best interest to have surgery, let alone have someone do the surgery on me!! I am so devastated and depressed. I am told that i just have to live with a locked jaw with a 5mm opening and be drugged for the rest of my life and have no life. I have fought and fought my TMJ, but i don't think i can fight any more, there is nothing positive left in my life.

Carey

Carey,
Some days I feel like you, nothing left positive in life. Then I see someone in a wheelchair and paralyzed, it is then I count my blessings. I know TMJD is a nightmare, I have lived it for 17 years. I am one that surgery did nothing for so from my view, the fact that your doctor won't do surgery, I think he may be doing you a favor. I got relief from the headaches after each surgery but it didn't last. I really think the reason the pain goes away is because during surgery they cut the nerves, when they grow back it is twice as bad. People develop arthritis after having surgery, "some" doctors say have surgery to prevent that from happening and it happens anyway???? Once the joint is operated on, surgical intervention will more than likely be required again and again. It is discouraging and I wish I could tell you there is a miracle cure because I "was" looking for one too. I keep telling myself things have to get better, its the only way I can keep going. I am going to pain management too, all else has failed. Pain is the pits but so far no one really has the answer, that is why so many doctors have so many different opinions when it comes to this surgery. Ugghh!!!!
Sorry you are going through this...
Take care,
Elaine

Elaine,

Thanks for your support. i work with kids with disabilities and one child which my family and i care for has CP (cerebral palsey) and i think what kind of life is he going to havein the future. he is in a wheel chair and i too thank my blessings b/c there are others out there worse off than i am. but i have no quality of life, i am drugged and sedated from my meds each night that i cannot go out and be with my friends, and during the day they are all at work so i hardly get to see them.

it is just difficult accepting the fact that i will be locked permanently and live on my meds for the rest of my life!!i should be living a life like a 22 year old should but that is not the case. i also wish that there was a miracle wand that could rid all of us suffering from TMJ.

Take care,
Carey

Michael,

What did you have surgery for? was it to unlock the jaw or something else?

Carey

Michael,

Disregard my previous post. I just found my answer in one of your previous posts. Sorry.

Take care,
Carey

Carey,
None of my business but what kind of meds are you on?
Just wondering what they are treating you with.
Elaine

Elaine,

I take:
Tramadol 200mg (Pain killer)
Clonazepam 4mg (muscle relaxant)
Baclofen 10mg (Muscle relaxant)
Doxepin 125mg (Pain killer)
Deralin 80mg (for migranes)

It took months last year to try to find something that would control my pain. i tried numerous amounts of meds but most of them didn't agree with me, and the ones that finally worked are the meds i take today. i have tried to reduce the amount of meds i take, but my pain is too severe without them.

How are you going Elaine? let me know.

Take care,
Carey

[This message has been edited by Carey (edited 08-31-2002).]

Michael,

Do you have any idea about the book called "Taking control of TMJ?"

I have looked in many book stores but have not had any luck.

Take care,
Carey

Carey,

The moderators here have edited SO many of my posts (even delting) trying to give some info. I can't even post a website URL.

Goto amazon's website in the US and search under BOOKS then for TMJ. It is the first one to come up. Just purchase it online from there.

Hope this helps.

All the best
Michael

Carey,

The moderators here have edited SO many of my posts (even delting) trying to give some info. I can't even post a website URL.

Goto amazon's website in the US and search under BOOKS then for TMJ. It is the first one to come up. Just purchase it online from there.

Hope this helps.

All the best
Michael

Michael,

Thanks for the info on Amazon, I found the book and will be ordering it. it is hard to place info on this site. the moderator does not even let you put your email address in the posts.

Thanks again Michael.

Take care,
Carey

Elaine,

I think ages ago you gave me Dr. Upgaard's email address, and he actually wrote to me, but i have since lost it.

If you have it would you be able to send me his address? Thanks.

Take care,
Carey

[Carey, please no more personal contact information like your email address. You can receive information about doctors or dentists here, but not to personal email address sites. It's against healthboard rules. Thanks. Well-come Moderator]

[This message has been edited by Well-come (edited 09-02-2002).]

carey,
I think I gave you Doctor Boyds address, he is good at answering peoples questions. We can't post info like that on here but if you would just put his name in search maybe you can find it.
I just read your post about the meds you are on and I haven't tried any of them. I am sure it is the muscle relaxants that are knocking you out. They tried me on flexeril(muscle relaxant) and I couldn't wake up for three days.
I take Lortab for back pain, fioricet for breakthrough headaches, if I am lucky it will ease it up before I get a migraine. Nothing I take for migraines helps, I just throw up through them. They have a med out called neurontin that is suppose to help with nerve pain. They start you out on a low dose and build up. Like most things it put me in a fog but not near as bad as the muscles relaxants. Pain is pain and all we are doing is masking the pain! I hate TMJD and its UGLY face!!!!!
Elaine

[This message has been edited by Elaine (edited 09-02-2002).]

Elaine,

It is the muscle relaxants plus the Doxepin that knocks me out, but if i dont take them i will get severe muscle spasms and the pain is unbearable that even breathing is so painful. the meds you are on i have not heard of but i did try neurontin for pain in the beginning of trying to work out some pain management last year and my doc said that this drug works for 99% of people with pain. But i started taking 2 tablets and i was a zombie, walking into walls, not remembering what i did one minute ago, and it certainly did nothing for my pain.

The Deralin really worked for my migranes, they actually stopped them . i would have a constant migrane that never went away.
But this med is not a pain killer. my doc said he didn't want me on more meds for pain and i agreed, instead this is a blood pressure med. since headaches and migranes occur from blood vessels being constricted etc. he tried me on it and it has worked wonders. but i guess it is different with every individual and how we react to certain types of meds.

Thanks for your new email address, all messages i sent to your old address came back to me.

Take care,
Carey

Carey,
I quit taking the neurontin for the same reason. From what people say in the back forum, it takes awhile for it to get in your system and the foggyness will go away. I hate feeling drugged so I didn't give it a chance. I wouldn't take anything for pain for the longest time until the pain got so bad, I couldn't stand myself anymore. My back is such a mess and between that and the TMJD, somedays I wonder why am I here. Good thing I am tough or I would have commited suicide a long time ago. My mom really worries about me but I said "never fear" I have to stick around to irritate people." :p
Hang in there, when you feel your worst, think about people who are worse off than you. I know it is hard but I have to do the same thing. This TMJD is tough and when the going gets tough, the "tough keep going."
Take care,
Elaine

Elaine,

it is tough and i too hate being so sedated, but that is the only way to keep my pain under control. i hate it also b/c i feel like i am letting my friends down b/c i can't go out with them at night, although they say the exact opposite and try and catch me during the day sometime.

Today i am seeing my psychologist to get a whole heap off my chest,like no surgery etc, and maybe that will improve the way i think about things.

Take care,
Carey

[This message has been edited by Carey (edited 09-05-2002).]

Elaine,

Do you still have a 10mm opening or has it improved?

Carey

Carey,
I still have a 10mm opening and it is a struggle to keep it. I stretch my jaw everyday and everytime I do, I hear bone crunching. The implant gets stuck and I have to pop it to get it to release, that is when I hear bone breaking. I did talk to the OS that did the last surgery about this yesterday. His words were, "you had relief for awhile". That is just what I wanted to hear, how many thousands of $$$$ to have relief for awhile? To begin with,I closed down after they put my own disc back in place,(twice) then with the implant which is my third surgery, I am at 10mm. The opening part I could live with, it is the headaches that do me in. I am seeing a neuro on Thursday so will let you know what I find out. I am done with dentists and oral surgeons, so far they have done nothing for me when it comes to TMJD,except cost me a lot of money.
Take care,
Elaine

Elaine,

You poor thing. hopefully you will find something out when you see the neurologist.
I am the same old story, still a 5mm opening and no surgeon will do any surgery on me, saying i will have to live with it and be medicated for the rest of my life!!! anyway what life? i haven't had a life for the past year b/c i am in bed asleep at 7:30 every night b/c my meds are so sedating!!
i see my pain specialist in 3 weeks, so i will just have to wait until then to see if he has any news for me.

Take care,
carey

I have had 5 open joint surgeries. 2 grafts, 1 repair and now bilateral total replacements. Have any of oy gone through the same thing with success??