Tree bark from an Indian tree, an element of which prevents the binding of herpes to cells. (a t least in the test tube) Its been two years now, and while I'm not dizzy, this thing drags me down every day. Head ringing, tinnitus, just feeling lousy. Docs send me to the shrink. Isn't there some Medical doctor who ever got this? I think its a virus, thats so well established, my only hope is to try to keep it on the down low. Any response is appreciated. I'd put my head in the microwave, if I thought it would help.

Hi MSG,

That sounds really interesting. Where did you get the info? Is there a journal you can point me to at all.....or a search term to pull up the study?

Thanks...Scott

Me again....I actually found these abstracts on Pubmed:


Antiviral activities of medicinal plants of southern Nepal.

Taylor RS, Hudson JB, Manandhar NP, Towers GH. J Ethnopharmacol 1996

Department of Botany, University of British Columbia, Vancouver, Canada.

In a screening of plants used traditionally in Nepal to treat diseases that could be caused by viruses, twenty-one methanol extracts from twenty species were quantitatively assayed for activity against three mammalian viruses: herpes simplex virus, Sindbis virus and poliovirus. Assays were performed in ultraviolet (UV)-A or visible light, as well as dark, and cytotoxicity was also noted. Impressive antiviral activities were exhibited by species of Bauhinia (Fabaceae), Carissa (Apocynaceae), Milletia (Fabaceae), Mallotus (Fabaceae), Rumex (Polygonaceae), Streblus (Moraceae), Terminalia (Combretaceae) and Tridax (Asteraceae). The Carissa extract was the most active, showing activity against all three viruses at a concentration of 12 micrograms/ml. Many of the other extracts showed partial inactivation of one or more test viruses.

Antiherpes simplex virus type 2 activity of casuarinin from the bark of Terminalia arjuna Linn

Cheng HY, Lin CC, Lin TC. Antiviral Res 2002

Casuarinin, a hydrolyzable tannin isolated from the bark of Terminalia arjuna Linn. (Combretaceae), was investigated for its antiviral activity on herpes simplex type 2 (HSV-2) in vitro. Results showed that the IC(50) of casuarinin in XTT and plaque reduction assays were 3.6+/-0.9 and 1.5+/-0.2 microM, respectively. The 50% cytotoxic concentration for cell growth (CC(50)) was 89+/-1 microM. Thus, the selectivity index (SI) (ratio of CC(50) to IC(50)) of casuarinin was 25 and 59 for XTT and plaque reduction assays, respectively. Casuarinin continued to exhibit antiviral activity even added 12 h after infection. During the attachment assay, casuarinin was shown to prevent the attachment of HSV-2 to cells. Furthermore, casuarinin also exhibited an activity in inhibiting the viral penetration. Interestingly, casuarinin was virucidal at a concentration of 25 microM, reducing viral titers up to 100,000-fold. This study concludes that casuarinin possesses anti-herpesvirus activity in inhibiting viral attachment and penetration, and also disturbing the late event(s) of infection.


I might see if my girlfriend can hunt this stuff down in her clinic since every time I get a dose of herpes, my lab symptoms go wild!

Scott

Yes, Scottsman, Thats the article I saw. It was in the Alternative Medicine review. I'm waiting for the bark to come in the mail. That other quote is very interesting. I had really great results a year or so ago by eating horseradish, just about knocked it totally out of my system, but then it came back, and the horsradish no longer worked. To me that suggested that the virus had found a way to resist it. So I am excited to see all those other things. I would be inclined to take a bunch of them at once, except for the fact that would seem a little risky, without really knowing how they might all react together. I just cant help but think that if a cause could be found, it would make everything so much more straitforward. I personally don't even know how viruses are found. I was under the impression that it was the antibody which was normally identified. DO you know anything about this? If it is in fact a virus, does it circulate in the blood? or just hang around in the nerves? I have read about trigeminal neuralgia, which seems similar to me, but in a different nerve. Perhaps the body is able to contain it once it has dug in. But its curious to me the way it seems to be in both ears. How would it have got from one to the other? And why doesnt it infect other places?

Hi MSG,

Like you I really have to stop these herpes attacks. They used to come every 6 months but now it's about every 4 weeks or less. And with the attacks, my lab symptoms get much worse - onset usually starts with feeling really low for a day followed by an increase in dizziness and just an overall ill feeling. Is that the sort of thing you're putting up with (minus the dizziness)?

The herpes virus is a double-stranded DNA virus that inserts its DNA directly into yours in the dorsal root ganglion (ie. nerve cells). For whatever reason it becomes reactivated and moves down the nerve to the skin surface. But it must bind to the cells at certain points and I think this is where the herbs work (apparently Zinc 2+, 0.05% works too). It doesn't circulate in the blood but travels by physical external contact. However, I wonder if the labyrinthitis has something to do with the virus. There is evidence to show that herpes DNA has been found inserted in the cells of the inner ear. How would it travel to the inner ear? I suspect they don't fully understand its transmission. Herpes is detected by identifying positively matched antibodies in the blood as you said.

Check out this article, a little technical but explains it in more detail:

http://www.tulane.edu/~dmsander/WWW/335/Herpesviruses.html

Where did you get the bark from? Is there a search I can do to find the link?

Cheers....Scott

'because of the universal distribution of the virus, most individuals are infected by 1-2 years of age; initial infection is usually asymptomatic, although there may be minor local vesicular lesions. Local multiplication ensues, followed by viraemia and systemic infection. There then follows life-long latent infection with periodic reactivation.'

Hi Scotsman,

I think I searched on 'Arjuna' and 'casuarinin', one of the components. the vendor was V itame en prov &ider co &m Anyways,
I am just trying to figure out whats wrong with me, or better yet, how to get better. I don't have other herpes symptoms, it was just my suspicion, that my ear troubles were caused by it, by process of elimination. I did read the article by some German scientists, where they used cadavers, and high tech dna tecniques to find residues of herpes in ears of persons who had traumatic deaths. I don't believe that these persons were suffering from any inner ear syndromes, the point of the study was just that herpes viruses are present.

I have heard of 'neuralgia' maybe that would be the best description of my symptoms. I have suspected that perhaps my discomfort is just a vestige of a previous infection. But when every fourth day or so, when it sneaks up on me, it seems very real and present. I just can't seem to find a pattern to it. No matter what I seem do do, to try and relax, or any sort of vitamen I take (lots of C and E ) It just seems to come and go as it pleases. And when it hits, I just think my life is over. I worry that I may infect some future partner with 'it' but I don't know what 'it ' is!! I am also curious about the epidemiology of this. I wish a cause could be identified, because I am suspicious that an epidemiological survey might flush out some interesting data, esp as it relates to the British Isles.

I was dizzy at first, does the vestibular nerve branch at some point? It is my belief that itjust wasn't that point of my ear nerve that was infected. But still the question of why if it was a virus, how did it find its way to the other side of my head???

Finally, thank you so much for your time of replying, and all the useful links you have sent.

Best regards
Michael

Hi Michael,

It's all very interesting stuff that you're touching on and also a little bit scary to think that this thing can just linger on and on causing such lousy and uncomfortable symptoms....especially as it seems to have for you. I really feel like this "bug" that I've contracted has not only caused some serious inner ear disturbance but may also have entered nerves that directly affect my central nervous system. Although I can't be certain as it may just be an off-shoot of lab or some post-viral thing. Presently, though, I keep getting muscular aches and pains that I've never experienced before with this and flu like symptoms off and on. Sure my neck hurts and that could be balance stuff but it extends down to my legs and arms sometimes, especially if I give those muscle groups more use than normal (but not over-use). Again, this stuff never happened before this bug hit.

Well I sure hope you find out what it is that is giving you so much grief. I just hold on to the belief that our bodies are usually pretty good at getting things right again even if it takes months and months. So many on these boards thought they would never see the light and they did in the end....the same must happen for us too.

All the best.....Scott

Hey Scott and Micheal,
are you all saying that labs is caused by the herpes virus or did I miss something in my speed reading?

If it is I am going to have a little chat with the wife! LOL.

Hi Bothrops,

I wish I could answer that for certain but based on what some past studies have found, the herpes virus has been found in the tissue of the inner ear! And I know that everytime I get a herpes attack, the dizzies and all other lab symptoms are greatly exaggerated. I'm *really* hoping it happens because it's simply a virus causing the stir just like a cold would and not because there is some herpes virus lurking in my inner ear. The best I can do at this stage is prevent attacks as much as possible to stop the lab symptoms from driving me mad!

Cheers....Scott :cool:

Ate my reply, so here goes again. :mad:

Yes, Both, the herpes in the ears was the jist of it. Just keep in mind that chicken pox is a herpes virus too. I would imagine ear herpes are somewhat specialized, and don't infect other precious organs. We are apparantly swimming in a sea of viruses on this planet. And it looks so clean. But what do I know? Anyways Scot, I was also interested about your remark about it feeling like it was in the rest of your brain or something. I can totally relate to that. I have felt it in my hands for as long as I have had it, as if they are crossed up or something. Then I get these weird sensations across my forehead. And lets not forget the painful teeth thing either. I know people have been on about that here alot too. Sometimes I worry I'll come down with encephalitits, when I'm having a bad time of it, and the Doctors will be at a complete loss (sort of like they are now). BUt if that was likely, I think we would have heard. Still waiting for the Arjuna, think maybe its lost in the mail. I see a sponsered link now on this thread, thats the folks where mine is coming from. I took a bunch of Klonipin the other night to sleep, that calmed things down for quite a few days, at least I think that was it, unless it was the crack I had smoked earlier :jester: I won't make a habit of it, but its nice to have in the medicine chest just in case. (Klonipin, that is)

Hi Michael,

Thought I should let you know that my girlfriend is a naturopath and has been speaking to some herb gurus about arjuna for me. None of them thought arjuna would be very effective for herpes because the studies are in vitro only (ie. in a test tube). The effect in the human body is a totally different deal. Sometimes these drugs/herbs never even make it to the where they are needed in the body. What's more none of them had heard of it being effective for herpes. Instead they said to concentrate on boosting the immune system with various herbs to limit the attacks. Just what those herbs are, I don't know yet but I'll get back to you on this.

Best...Scott :cool:

yes thats interesting. I will try it when I get it anyway. I had a thought that maybe it is the immune system itself that is making me feel bad. So when I take vitamens and all that, I just feel worse. (or atleast not any better) As if maybe I'm actually better, but the troops haven't got the word yet. After I dosed myself with the Klonipin, I have been feeling much better, going on several days. I wonder if it has something to do with dopamine, because the tofrinil apparantly affects the same system, and that has helped me. I just can't stand the side effects. I guess I was thinking about how when you have an outbreak, your lab symptoms get much worse. This would suggest that perhaps its your own immune response which is causing the distress. Just a thought.

Hi Michael,

Just wondering how you're doing? Did the arjuna ever arrive and have you tried it? Still getting wiped out every 4-5 days? I still seem to be getting hit with flu-like symptoms every other week at the moment. Although the dizziness is almost gone I still don't feel anywhere near like my old self yet. I'm starting to suspect it may in fact be the SSRI drug I'm on that may be causing these symptoms and not a virus. Problem is I can't stop taking them yet otherwise anxiety starts creeping back in and I don't want to go down that road again. Catch 22.

Hope you're feeling better.

Cheers.....Scott :cool: