Guitar Lover
08-12-2004, 11:09 PM
I saw a headline with something about pain meds and FDA. Expecting the worst, I was shocked to see the article was about how the FDA is going to back off of docs who use opioids to treat chronic pain. I wish I had the article to wirte some quotes but in summary it stated that Dr's are afraid to use Oxycontin and morphene when it is the answer to give people their lives back. It stated that addiction is rarely an issue when oxycontin and fentenyl are used properly. Also it said that docs just don't want the hassles that go along with an investigation and they just don't perscribe it. It also said the FDA would back off and not make doctors lives a hassle just because he uses opioids to treat pain I was waiting to see " Article by SHORELINE" LOL
Has anyone else read anything?
GL
ps everybody together " Happy birthday to me Happy birthday to me111 :bouncing: :) :) :) :)
Has anyone else read anything?
GL
ps everybody together " Happy birthday to me Happy birthday to me111 :bouncing: :) :) :) :)
Sponsor
carol632
08-13-2004, 12:15 AM
Yes, I read the article....I think I will post it tomorrow so all can see it.
Carol
Carol
Kissa
08-13-2004, 12:21 AM
I haven't seen it yet but heard it was around! I'll have to search for it see if I can find it. I'm very interested in reading it. I am glad to hear that the FDA is really looking at things in a new light. This could bring a lot of hope for many people who need it.
Funny thing is, there's been articles and news stories out for years and even studies proving or showing that the percentage of people who become addicted is very slim.
BTW looks like shore is banned, check any post with his name and look under it.
and a very very happy birthday to you Guitar I hope your day was good to you!
Funny thing is, there's been articles and news stories out for years and even studies proving or showing that the percentage of people who become addicted is very slim.
BTW looks like shore is banned, check any post with his name and look under it.
and a very very happy birthday to you Guitar I hope your day was good to you!
scotty12
08-13-2004, 01:26 AM
yes,i read the article.
its very good news if in fact the dea is going to back off from investigating drs.so many drs have been harassed and bullied and because of that so so many cp patients have suffered.
there has been talk that hydrocodone will be changed to a class II med.maybe this publicity will calm a wary dentist from prescribing a triplicate rx for vicodin to cover routecanal pain.
i only hope this news affects the chronic pain patients, not just those who are revovering from a surgery,but those who are not getting better.many of us have empathic drs but still have their pain undermanaged.
i do believe that if patients were to choose a good daily analgesic and proper dosing schedule,many would stay with the same drug. maybe a SA med every 3 1/2 or 4hrs.i think alot of opiate dependant patients just want round the clock dosing.im not sugesting raise everyones dose til they are painfree and cant function.just figure 24 hours to keep the pain down.
im one of these patients.still taking SA meds.my dr doesnt feel comfy changing to a long acting med just yet.oxycodone has always worked well and maybe he doesnt want to change to oxycontin,which in all probability would make my life alot better.i wouldnt wake up feeling so achy i cant straighten up.
my first few minutes of each day area agonizing.either i wake up in the middle of the night and hold out as long as i can to take my first dose of the day at 4 or 5 AM, setting myself up for another night of the same now that i started so early, or somehow fall back asleep and be in much worse pain if i sleep a few extra hrs.
.....sorry,i needed to vent.if opiates are accepted practice in the treatment of chronic pain then a waiting room of pain clinic patients who all happen to be walking out with scripts shouldnt raise any flags at the dea or your neighborhood pharmacy.everyone who walks into a bakery walks out with cake.the thought of accusation should not cross your pain docs mind if you need an increase in the number of pills for a given time.weve suffered enough........scotty :wave:
its very good news if in fact the dea is going to back off from investigating drs.so many drs have been harassed and bullied and because of that so so many cp patients have suffered.
there has been talk that hydrocodone will be changed to a class II med.maybe this publicity will calm a wary dentist from prescribing a triplicate rx for vicodin to cover routecanal pain.
i only hope this news affects the chronic pain patients, not just those who are revovering from a surgery,but those who are not getting better.many of us have empathic drs but still have their pain undermanaged.
i do believe that if patients were to choose a good daily analgesic and proper dosing schedule,many would stay with the same drug. maybe a SA med every 3 1/2 or 4hrs.i think alot of opiate dependant patients just want round the clock dosing.im not sugesting raise everyones dose til they are painfree and cant function.just figure 24 hours to keep the pain down.
im one of these patients.still taking SA meds.my dr doesnt feel comfy changing to a long acting med just yet.oxycodone has always worked well and maybe he doesnt want to change to oxycontin,which in all probability would make my life alot better.i wouldnt wake up feeling so achy i cant straighten up.
my first few minutes of each day area agonizing.either i wake up in the middle of the night and hold out as long as i can to take my first dose of the day at 4 or 5 AM, setting myself up for another night of the same now that i started so early, or somehow fall back asleep and be in much worse pain if i sleep a few extra hrs.
.....sorry,i needed to vent.if opiates are accepted practice in the treatment of chronic pain then a waiting room of pain clinic patients who all happen to be walking out with scripts shouldnt raise any flags at the dea or your neighborhood pharmacy.everyone who walks into a bakery walks out with cake.the thought of accusation should not cross your pain docs mind if you need an increase in the number of pills for a given time.weve suffered enough........scotty :wave:
sgibson
08-18-2004, 04:04 PM
Scotty,
I understand your frustrations. I'm also suffering right now. I stopped seeing my PM after 2 years about 2 months before my fusion. My ortho took over rx'ing my meds at that point. I think that's highly unusual but I had already been his patient for a couple years. Well, I had my fusion in January of this year and my ortho has continued to rx my pain meds. The problem is I have become tolerant to my meds because I have been on the same dose for years. (Fentanyl 50mcg @ 48hrs and oxy 20mg @ 4-8hrs) My ortho hasn't increased my meds to accomodate my pain. He has however continued to rx my pain meds longer than I would think most surgeons would. It's been 8 months now. He has been trying to get me into a very good (in his mind) PM doc and they have finally set my appointment for the 13th of Sept. Supposedly this is the best PM in the area and that is why he is so booked and is only accepting me as a favor to my surgeon. My surgeon wanted me in with a PM that is not afraid to use high dose opiates. My last PM was what Shore called a needle jockey. I had so many steroid injections before I got smart enough to do any research. I just accepted the fact that the doc knew what he was doing. It wasn't until they told me that I was at my limit for injections and the only other thing they could do for me was IDET barring a fusion. Well, insurance company said no way to IDET so I was fused a couple months later. I have done some research on this doc and found out he is the head of the Massey Cancer Center pain clinic and several other pain clinics including one at a rehab hospital. He has numerous modalities available. I will however tell him up front that I will not subject myself to anymore of those steroid injections. I am scared that I have already allowed damage to be done by them. Both of my parents have osteoporosis, and I have malaborbtion problems and have to take high doses of calcium daily and am still deficient. I am horrified that my other PM didn't see all of this as warning factors before injecting me numerous times. I had no less than 10 sets of injections consisting of at least 6 injections at a time. There is no way another doc will subject me to that again. The bad part is I was getting no relief from those injections. My PM however continued to inject me because everytime my PCP had me on high doses of Prednisone for my asthma my leg pain would improve. He took this as a sign that his injections could eventually work. I am so worried by the fact that I still have to take high doses of Prednisone on a monthly basis due to my severe asthma. That combined with the injections I received plus my family history of osteoporosis is just plain scary. They risked all this to avoid upping my fentanyl patch. Perhaps if these guidelines had been in place sooner I would not have been subjected to that lunacy. Unless of course this doc was just doing these injections for the money. (MY opinion) Because he was using an "operating room" with that guided flouroscopy to do the injections my insurance was billed 5,000 dollars every time I had injections. I just pray that this PM will prove to be a lot better than that one. I was incorrectly sent to another PM about 2 months ago. It turned out that he was another one of the "diagnostic" type PM's and told me after about 5 minutes that I was already on higher doses of opiates than he prescriped. He was actually very nice though and even refunded my copay. My ortho apologized profusely for the mix up. I just hate jumping through damn hoops to get the help I need. I'm hoping these new guidelines will help the CP'ers here in Virginia get the help we need and deserve. It seems ever since the witch hunt in Northern Virginia with the PM docs there that we CP'ers here are having a harder and harder time finding the relief we so deserve. I'm just praying my new PM is compassionate and dedicated to the patient instead of his wallet. Take care everyone.
God Bless,
Sherry :wave:
I understand your frustrations. I'm also suffering right now. I stopped seeing my PM after 2 years about 2 months before my fusion. My ortho took over rx'ing my meds at that point. I think that's highly unusual but I had already been his patient for a couple years. Well, I had my fusion in January of this year and my ortho has continued to rx my pain meds. The problem is I have become tolerant to my meds because I have been on the same dose for years. (Fentanyl 50mcg @ 48hrs and oxy 20mg @ 4-8hrs) My ortho hasn't increased my meds to accomodate my pain. He has however continued to rx my pain meds longer than I would think most surgeons would. It's been 8 months now. He has been trying to get me into a very good (in his mind) PM doc and they have finally set my appointment for the 13th of Sept. Supposedly this is the best PM in the area and that is why he is so booked and is only accepting me as a favor to my surgeon. My surgeon wanted me in with a PM that is not afraid to use high dose opiates. My last PM was what Shore called a needle jockey. I had so many steroid injections before I got smart enough to do any research. I just accepted the fact that the doc knew what he was doing. It wasn't until they told me that I was at my limit for injections and the only other thing they could do for me was IDET barring a fusion. Well, insurance company said no way to IDET so I was fused a couple months later. I have done some research on this doc and found out he is the head of the Massey Cancer Center pain clinic and several other pain clinics including one at a rehab hospital. He has numerous modalities available. I will however tell him up front that I will not subject myself to anymore of those steroid injections. I am scared that I have already allowed damage to be done by them. Both of my parents have osteoporosis, and I have malaborbtion problems and have to take high doses of calcium daily and am still deficient. I am horrified that my other PM didn't see all of this as warning factors before injecting me numerous times. I had no less than 10 sets of injections consisting of at least 6 injections at a time. There is no way another doc will subject me to that again. The bad part is I was getting no relief from those injections. My PM however continued to inject me because everytime my PCP had me on high doses of Prednisone for my asthma my leg pain would improve. He took this as a sign that his injections could eventually work. I am so worried by the fact that I still have to take high doses of Prednisone on a monthly basis due to my severe asthma. That combined with the injections I received plus my family history of osteoporosis is just plain scary. They risked all this to avoid upping my fentanyl patch. Perhaps if these guidelines had been in place sooner I would not have been subjected to that lunacy. Unless of course this doc was just doing these injections for the money. (MY opinion) Because he was using an "operating room" with that guided flouroscopy to do the injections my insurance was billed 5,000 dollars every time I had injections. I just pray that this PM will prove to be a lot better than that one. I was incorrectly sent to another PM about 2 months ago. It turned out that he was another one of the "diagnostic" type PM's and told me after about 5 minutes that I was already on higher doses of opiates than he prescriped. He was actually very nice though and even refunded my copay. My ortho apologized profusely for the mix up. I just hate jumping through damn hoops to get the help I need. I'm hoping these new guidelines will help the CP'ers here in Virginia get the help we need and deserve. It seems ever since the witch hunt in Northern Virginia with the PM docs there that we CP'ers here are having a harder and harder time finding the relief we so deserve. I'm just praying my new PM is compassionate and dedicated to the patient instead of his wallet. Take care everyone.
God Bless,
Sherry :wave:
madhatter
08-18-2004, 04:12 PM
Lets hope doctors read it also!
scotty12
08-18-2004, 04:35 PM
sherry,
i hope this appt works out for you.im fortunate that my pain dr is not a needle jockey.the first 3 did nothing and he feels there is little chance of any more offering relief.i think alot of these dr do not understand tolerance.ive found after 6 months on the same dose the pain gets worse and i get less duration of relief from the meds.
ive been considering the fusion.ive only been working 2 days a week and when i do work i get home and i have to lay down.when laying down doesnt ease the pain its so discouraging continuing like this.my wife is getting very frustrated and our marriage has been rocky to say the least.we have 1 4 year old and a 9 month old and i do what i can but the pain often gets the best of me.how can she understand what its like to hurt all the time.thats what is so good about this board,we understand...unfortunately,what the impact chronic pain has on us and hopefully we have pain drs that do also.
im trying to get the disco done but my surgeons radiologist doesnt take my insurance so im still looking.my dr said if i have discogenic pain from the discs above the spondy he can do nerve blocks,should help.im ready to try anything but no more esi's.although my last mri shows herniations from L3 thru S1 im still curious to know where the pain is coming from.
youve been poked and prodded enough.dont let youself be talked into any more esi's.the general feeling ive gotten from all the surgeons or drs ive met is that if they havent helped in the past theres no reason to think they will help.once again good luck with this appt.....take care, Scotty
i hope this appt works out for you.im fortunate that my pain dr is not a needle jockey.the first 3 did nothing and he feels there is little chance of any more offering relief.i think alot of these dr do not understand tolerance.ive found after 6 months on the same dose the pain gets worse and i get less duration of relief from the meds.
ive been considering the fusion.ive only been working 2 days a week and when i do work i get home and i have to lay down.when laying down doesnt ease the pain its so discouraging continuing like this.my wife is getting very frustrated and our marriage has been rocky to say the least.we have 1 4 year old and a 9 month old and i do what i can but the pain often gets the best of me.how can she understand what its like to hurt all the time.thats what is so good about this board,we understand...unfortunately,what the impact chronic pain has on us and hopefully we have pain drs that do also.
im trying to get the disco done but my surgeons radiologist doesnt take my insurance so im still looking.my dr said if i have discogenic pain from the discs above the spondy he can do nerve blocks,should help.im ready to try anything but no more esi's.although my last mri shows herniations from L3 thru S1 im still curious to know where the pain is coming from.
youve been poked and prodded enough.dont let youself be talked into any more esi's.the general feeling ive gotten from all the surgeons or drs ive met is that if they havent helped in the past theres no reason to think they will help.once again good luck with this appt.....take care, Scotty
sgibson
08-18-2004, 06:06 PM
Thanks Scotty,
I know what you mean about the marriage thing. My husband and I have been married 15 years next month. He has been basically good about all this but he really can't understand chronic pain. He tries but he does get frustrated some times I know. We have 3 children of our own and another child that is living with us at the moment. It's financially hard on us with me not working and everything combined can really put a strain on a marriage. I try to understand that he is trying but sometimes it really gets frustrating. I'm hoping that when I finally get my disability it will take some of the pressure off of him, and if this new PM can actually help me this time, maybe I will be able to be more of the old me. I know he misses the active fun wife he married. I'm 32 and I'm stuck in the body of a 90 year old. It can be so depressing sometimes.
Thanks for your reply.
God Bless,
Sherry :wave:
I know what you mean about the marriage thing. My husband and I have been married 15 years next month. He has been basically good about all this but he really can't understand chronic pain. He tries but he does get frustrated some times I know. We have 3 children of our own and another child that is living with us at the moment. It's financially hard on us with me not working and everything combined can really put a strain on a marriage. I try to understand that he is trying but sometimes it really gets frustrating. I'm hoping that when I finally get my disability it will take some of the pressure off of him, and if this new PM can actually help me this time, maybe I will be able to be more of the old me. I know he misses the active fun wife he married. I'm 32 and I'm stuck in the body of a 90 year old. It can be so depressing sometimes.
Thanks for your reply.
God Bless,
Sherry :wave:
Longfusion
08-19-2004, 04:25 PM
Hi Scotty, Although a discogram would determine if your pain is discogenic in nature it does not indicate that you would benefit from a nerve block, RFA or chemical ablataion.
It would indicate disc replacement or fusion may be beneficial but if your leaning towards blocks for temp relief You can skip a painful disco and have your PM doc or anesthesiologist do a medial branch block to determine if blocking or destroying the nerve will actually help. Remember, blocks only last 3-6 months and when destroyed with RFA or chemicals the nerves grow back in about 6 months as if a branch has been sawed off untill they find something to reconnect too. Blocks are not a long term answer unless you p[lan one for every 6 months for the rest of yourt life.
There is always the CPM Sherry. :cool:
Z___
Longfusion
It would indicate disc replacement or fusion may be beneficial but if your leaning towards blocks for temp relief You can skip a painful disco and have your PM doc or anesthesiologist do a medial branch block to determine if blocking or destroying the nerve will actually help. Remember, blocks only last 3-6 months and when destroyed with RFA or chemicals the nerves grow back in about 6 months as if a branch has been sawed off untill they find something to reconnect too. Blocks are not a long term answer unless you p[lan one for every 6 months for the rest of yourt life.
There is always the CPM Sherry. :cool:
Z___
Longfusion
scotty12
08-19-2004, 04:39 PM
Longfusion,
what is a medial branch block?how and where is it performed?id endure a disco if it would aid in treatment but if there is an alternative im all for it...
what is a medial branch block?how and where is it performed?id endure a disco if it would aid in treatment but if there is an alternative im all for it...
sgibson
08-19-2004, 05:42 PM
My discogram indicated that a fusion would help me. Unless you are ready for some major decisions, then I wouldn't do the disco. It is a very painful and invasive test. Well, my understanding is the disco is very painful if they find what is actually wrong. It turns out they found annular tears and some other stuff when they did mine. I didn't really get into all that technical stuff at the time because I was just doing what the doctors told me and not asking any questions. I wasn't very proactive in my care but I have changed my attitude now.
What is a CPM? Is that the implanted morphine pump? If it is I have decided I'm not quite ready to go that far. I read about the troubles that a member here (Shoreline) was having from his implant surgery. I'm just not ready to take the chance of more complications. I may change my mind soon but I can't say when right now.
Take care and,
God Bless,
Sherry :wave:
What is a CPM? Is that the implanted morphine pump? If it is I have decided I'm not quite ready to go that far. I read about the troubles that a member here (Shoreline) was having from his implant surgery. I'm just not ready to take the chance of more complications. I may change my mind soon but I can't say when right now.
Take care and,
God Bless,
Sherry :wave:
Longfusion
08-20-2004, 09:56 AM
Hey Scott, A medial branch block is a diagnostic short acting block, the medial branches connect one vertabrea to the next. If a branch block is succesfull then root blocks would likely help for as long as they can. It does start a cycle of blocks but if it helps or gives you enough relief to recondition it may jmp start a recovery, you have to take advantage of the relief given by a block and have trust in your doc that he has the touch.
By the way, although Flouroscopy is certainly the safest way to guide a needle near or around the spine you do want to limit the amount of exposure to Flouro, It radiates you about 100X more than a single Xray in the same amount of time, especially if it's a procedure that takes time under flouro.
Sherry, the CPM is in Portsmouth, we don't have quite the same attitude a little further south. :wave:
Shhhhhhhhh
Z___________ :cool: The sun glasses preserve anonymity but don't help this sticky keyboard :D
By the way, although Flouroscopy is certainly the safest way to guide a needle near or around the spine you do want to limit the amount of exposure to Flouro, It radiates you about 100X more than a single Xray in the same amount of time, especially if it's a procedure that takes time under flouro.
Sherry, the CPM is in Portsmouth, we don't have quite the same attitude a little further south. :wave:
Shhhhhhhhh
Z___________ :cool: The sun glasses preserve anonymity but don't help this sticky keyboard :D
trouble32
08-24-2004, 02:56 AM
WELL ITS ABOUT TIME! Abusers have stopped us in chronic severe pain from getting the help we need!!!I write our government every week! makes me so angry when i hear these kids slamming their hands in car doors,having a friend beat them up,so they go to er and get meds!But im up all night,crying begging for help,and i get the druggie look when i go to my doctor.Even though i have 7 doctors who all agreed no surgery due to clot damages.and no help to have surgery?Good to know!