Kissa
08-15-2004, 03:29 PM
Another post got me to thinking about this. How often on average are taking BT meds? I guess I was under this impression that BT's should be used sparingly, as in not every day but it appears that my impression of that isn't quite correct.
Could you all give me a feel for the frequency they've been prescribed vs how often you might actually take them?
Right now I am finding I take extra meds or BT meds some 2 - 3 times a day, but my ms contin is a low dose only 30mg 3x's. Unfortunately I can't take them 3x's a day because when I do I do not sleep well at all which in turn causes this cycle of more pain.
Also does anyone know if it's ok to cut a LA med in half? I know we are not supposed to crush them, but I"m wondering if it would be ok at night to cut the ms in half and try to see if I can sleep a little better instead of taking a whole one
Thanks!
Could you all give me a feel for the frequency they've been prescribed vs how often you might actually take them?
Right now I am finding I take extra meds or BT meds some 2 - 3 times a day, but my ms contin is a low dose only 30mg 3x's. Unfortunately I can't take them 3x's a day because when I do I do not sleep well at all which in turn causes this cycle of more pain.
Also does anyone know if it's ok to cut a LA med in half? I know we are not supposed to crush them, but I"m wondering if it would be ok at night to cut the ms in half and try to see if I can sleep a little better instead of taking a whole one
Thanks!
Sponsor
Snails
08-15-2004, 05:18 PM
Hi Kissa,
I am not 100% sure about this, but I think that while it is ok to split short-acting pain meds, you should always take meds with a time-release system like MS Contin, Avinza, Oxycontin, etc whole. If you split one, you would get all the medication at once rather than over a period of time which wouldn't give you long-acting relief and would also give you too high a dose all at once. Maybe you could ask your doctor to write you for (twice your usual amount of) 15 mg ms contin instead of the 30 mg, then you could take only half your usual dose before bed?
When I first went on oxycontin my doctor gave me oxy IR as bt meds to use 2-3 times per day. Now that I am taking the oxycontin more times per day, he said I won't need bt meds more than 1-2 times per day, and so far at least he's been right. I think if you are needing bt meds more than 2-3 times per day, that is a sign that the dose of your long-acting meds needs to be adjusted. I hope you get your meds worked out to give you satisfactory relief soon, and hopefully your doctor will know what to do if you need some adjustments.
Best Wishes,
Stacy
I am not 100% sure about this, but I think that while it is ok to split short-acting pain meds, you should always take meds with a time-release system like MS Contin, Avinza, Oxycontin, etc whole. If you split one, you would get all the medication at once rather than over a period of time which wouldn't give you long-acting relief and would also give you too high a dose all at once. Maybe you could ask your doctor to write you for (twice your usual amount of) 15 mg ms contin instead of the 30 mg, then you could take only half your usual dose before bed?
When I first went on oxycontin my doctor gave me oxy IR as bt meds to use 2-3 times per day. Now that I am taking the oxycontin more times per day, he said I won't need bt meds more than 1-2 times per day, and so far at least he's been right. I think if you are needing bt meds more than 2-3 times per day, that is a sign that the dose of your long-acting meds needs to be adjusted. I hope you get your meds worked out to give you satisfactory relief soon, and hopefully your doctor will know what to do if you need some adjustments.
Best Wishes,
Stacy
scotty12
08-15-2004, 06:25 PM
the problem with taking most bt meds daily is that when you have added pain then the bt wont help much as your body has become accustomed to them as part of your routine.if you take all the bt meds daily then your base med is too low.
if you are thinking of breaking the ms you are setting yourself up for added pain as your tolerance will go up due to the larger dose by ruining the time release.besides its dangerous
why dont you ask the dr for something to help you sleep?there are some meds that are safe for long term use.i take ambien,which although is not reccomended for long term use,i find works quite well.ive been on it for about 9 months.
no matter how bad the pain is it still knocks me out for atleast 4 hours.used to last 6 hrs but im getting tolerant to it.
scotty
if you are thinking of breaking the ms you are setting yourself up for added pain as your tolerance will go up due to the larger dose by ruining the time release.besides its dangerous
why dont you ask the dr for something to help you sleep?there are some meds that are safe for long term use.i take ambien,which although is not reccomended for long term use,i find works quite well.ive been on it for about 9 months.
no matter how bad the pain is it still knocks me out for atleast 4 hours.used to last 6 hrs but im getting tolerant to it.
scotty
Kissa
08-15-2004, 09:21 PM
I've only split the ms one time just to see what would happen, nothing major did. I know that crushing it is a no no for sure.
I take high doses of an antidepressant to sleep in addition to allergy pills, I fall asleep, I just can't stay asleep, I wake up like every 30 minutes in a huge fog, it's terrible.
If it's been 4 hours since I took my ms contin, chances are I'll sleep really well for the next 8-10 hours, but if I take it within 1 hour of going to bed forget it.
It takes a good 4 or 5 hours before I actually fall into a deep sleep after taking MSC. Once' I'm asleep I sleep for a good solid 6-8 hours after tossing and turning for a good 2-4 hours prior. So I'm ok with the MSC twice daily, doesn't help the pain as much as I need it, but obviously I'm having problems with taking it 3 times daily like I need it. And now I"m taking more BT because the pain is so bad when I get up in the morning from not having anything in my system for well over 12 hours. Make sense?
Ambien and similiar products don't work for me at all, they get me into an initial sleep stage but they don't ensure deep sleep at all which is what I truly need.
Far as BT my thought as always been as well to take them infrequently and that like you said taking them every day will end making them less effect over time when severe pain sets in. like mentioned above, I think my problem at this point is I can't take the MSC 3x daily if I plan on sleeping so I end up taking it twice 8 hours apart and then nothing until the next morning leaving a huge gap of unmedicated time.
I don't see my doctor for about 3 more weeks so I may have to bite the bullet this week and just start taking the MSC again 3'x daily and hope that after a few weeks pass my body will have adjusted and I can sleep OK and not need to use BT meds as much either.
It's quite a predicament indeed!
I take high doses of an antidepressant to sleep in addition to allergy pills, I fall asleep, I just can't stay asleep, I wake up like every 30 minutes in a huge fog, it's terrible.
If it's been 4 hours since I took my ms contin, chances are I'll sleep really well for the next 8-10 hours, but if I take it within 1 hour of going to bed forget it.
It takes a good 4 or 5 hours before I actually fall into a deep sleep after taking MSC. Once' I'm asleep I sleep for a good solid 6-8 hours after tossing and turning for a good 2-4 hours prior. So I'm ok with the MSC twice daily, doesn't help the pain as much as I need it, but obviously I'm having problems with taking it 3 times daily like I need it. And now I"m taking more BT because the pain is so bad when I get up in the morning from not having anything in my system for well over 12 hours. Make sense?
Ambien and similiar products don't work for me at all, they get me into an initial sleep stage but they don't ensure deep sleep at all which is what I truly need.
Far as BT my thought as always been as well to take them infrequently and that like you said taking them every day will end making them less effect over time when severe pain sets in. like mentioned above, I think my problem at this point is I can't take the MSC 3x daily if I plan on sleeping so I end up taking it twice 8 hours apart and then nothing until the next morning leaving a huge gap of unmedicated time.
I don't see my doctor for about 3 more weeks so I may have to bite the bullet this week and just start taking the MSC again 3'x daily and hope that after a few weeks pass my body will have adjusted and I can sleep OK and not need to use BT meds as much either.
It's quite a predicament indeed!
Flycatcher
08-15-2004, 10:47 PM
My LA med is 25mu Duragesic with 7.5/500 Percocet for BT twice a day. I try not to use my second BT pill unless I absolutely have to because if I take that second pill what do I do if four hours later I'm in more pain than I was when I took it? I also know that there are days when two aren't nearly enough so I try to have at least a few BT doses in reserve (extreme temperature changes, heavy rain, too much physical activity, etc.). I take 600mg doses of ibuprofen in order to not run short of my BT meds but that quickly adds up to 3600 to 4200 or more per day and that's not good either. There are plenty of days that I take both BT pills and still use over 4000mg of ibuprofen just to get through the day without screaming. I had my PM follow up last Thursday and the doc didn't give me the chance to discuss problems with the pain meds so I'm stuck for another month with this ibuprofen regimen.
Not sure what to say about your LA problems, I know I had serious physical fatigue issues when on 40mg of oxycontin twice a day so I had to request a med change, that's when they started me on the patches. I ended up missing three weeks of work within less than two months and was very close to losing my job. My PA also recommended Zanaflex for muscle spasms and to help with sleep issues, it's been wonderful! I take a very low dose of 4mg around 9:00pm or so and within 30 minutes I'm off to bed. The doc said he could go as high as 32mg if needed but he'd start low. You might ask about it if what you're currently taking for sleep isn't helping. I haven't noticed any hold over effects in the mornings to speak of so I'm happy with it.
Breaking LA meds in half really scares me. I know you said that you'd tried it with no ill effects but any time you try that you're pushing the odds for something bad to happen. What worked fine last night could very easily be dangerous tonight, make sense? Please be careful with that, okay? I recommend the previous suggestion of asking the doc to write a portion of your LA script for a 1/2 strength dose at bedtime, I know it's more expensive each time they add a different bottle to your refill but it's safer.
Let us know how things work out,
Jack
Not sure what to say about your LA problems, I know I had serious physical fatigue issues when on 40mg of oxycontin twice a day so I had to request a med change, that's when they started me on the patches. I ended up missing three weeks of work within less than two months and was very close to losing my job. My PA also recommended Zanaflex for muscle spasms and to help with sleep issues, it's been wonderful! I take a very low dose of 4mg around 9:00pm or so and within 30 minutes I'm off to bed. The doc said he could go as high as 32mg if needed but he'd start low. You might ask about it if what you're currently taking for sleep isn't helping. I haven't noticed any hold over effects in the mornings to speak of so I'm happy with it.
Breaking LA meds in half really scares me. I know you said that you'd tried it with no ill effects but any time you try that you're pushing the odds for something bad to happen. What worked fine last night could very easily be dangerous tonight, make sense? Please be careful with that, okay? I recommend the previous suggestion of asking the doc to write a portion of your LA script for a 1/2 strength dose at bedtime, I know it's more expensive each time they add a different bottle to your refill but it's safer.
Let us know how things work out,
Jack
Kissa
08-15-2004, 11:29 PM
I agree Jack about breaking the med and won't do it again that's for sure. It's too high of risk and agree with that. I will have to call the PM, not sure I can wait till the next appt on Sept 3. I have plenty of meds till then prob is they just aren't effective. It seems I've been spirialing down with pain lately, not sure what's going on.
I think I'll call a nuero to check my back again to make sure that the herniations aren't getting worse thus causing all the pain.
Unfortunately I can't use patches of any sort, I am allergic to the glue they use to adhere them to the skin, it actually pulls my skin right off. I've got quite a few scars from where I had to have a heart monitor put on in recent surgeries. It's a no win situation.
I may ask for him to just go ahead and give me 15mg (do they make them that low) or something lower only for bed time and then just keep the msc 30 mg 2x daily, maybe that'll work out for me.
Thanks guys for all your support, I always appreciate it
I think I'll call a nuero to check my back again to make sure that the herniations aren't getting worse thus causing all the pain.
Unfortunately I can't use patches of any sort, I am allergic to the glue they use to adhere them to the skin, it actually pulls my skin right off. I've got quite a few scars from where I had to have a heart monitor put on in recent surgeries. It's a no win situation.
I may ask for him to just go ahead and give me 15mg (do they make them that low) or something lower only for bed time and then just keep the msc 30 mg 2x daily, maybe that'll work out for me.
Thanks guys for all your support, I always appreciate it
laurawithcats
08-15-2004, 11:39 PM
Kissa,
My sleep trouble sounds so similar to yours, except that I have trouble getting to sleep, then sleep well for a good 1-2 hours before the "fun" begins. It's so disconcerting to keep waking up feeling groggy and agitated at the same time. I never considered that it could be related to the LA meds.
I can say that I've found nothing that helps for very long. Ambien, Sonata, tricyclics, Restoril, OTCs, Valium, Klonopin - they all worked initially, but now it's like I took a sugar pill. Tomorrow, though, I'm putting a call in to my PM to see if changing my LA could help. I remember when I was taking Methadone my sleep was worse than ever.
I've always been told never to break LAs for the reasons already posted.
Re: BTs. When I started needing more and more BTs, my doctor tried supplementing the narcotic meds with various anti-seizure meds. What worked best for me turned out to be LAs and Neurontin, although I did gain a little weight after a while. It took a bit to get used to the anti-seizure meds (at first, I was clumsy and foggy during the day), but eventually I could tolerate all but Trileptal, which I tried when I got sick of gaining weight. Adding Neurontin or similar meds has been very helpful to me for taking some of the edge off, though.
-Laura
My sleep trouble sounds so similar to yours, except that I have trouble getting to sleep, then sleep well for a good 1-2 hours before the "fun" begins. It's so disconcerting to keep waking up feeling groggy and agitated at the same time. I never considered that it could be related to the LA meds.
I can say that I've found nothing that helps for very long. Ambien, Sonata, tricyclics, Restoril, OTCs, Valium, Klonopin - they all worked initially, but now it's like I took a sugar pill. Tomorrow, though, I'm putting a call in to my PM to see if changing my LA could help. I remember when I was taking Methadone my sleep was worse than ever.
I've always been told never to break LAs for the reasons already posted.
Re: BTs. When I started needing more and more BTs, my doctor tried supplementing the narcotic meds with various anti-seizure meds. What worked best for me turned out to be LAs and Neurontin, although I did gain a little weight after a while. It took a bit to get used to the anti-seizure meds (at first, I was clumsy and foggy during the day), but eventually I could tolerate all but Trileptal, which I tried when I got sick of gaining weight. Adding Neurontin or similar meds has been very helpful to me for taking some of the edge off, though.
-Laura
Kissa
08-16-2004, 10:51 AM
Nuerontin made me quite groggy in the past even though I took it at bed time.
Some of us are sensative to various medications, especially narcotics. Instead of putting us to sleep like most folks we end up getting wired or have restless sleep. I barely slept at all last night, didn't get to bed till after 3am and didn't fully fall asleep till about 5. Of course I had to get up at 7:30 to get my husband off to work. This is pretty much the normal pattern for me anymore and it's terrible. It's not helping the pain, it's making it worse at this point. In general I haven't gone to bed before 1am and 2am is usually the average for me anymore. Again I sleep sound to a degree when I don't take the LA meds anywhere near 4 hours prior to going to sleep.
I had this initial prob when I was on vicodin for a while but it eventually subsided. Hoping this does too as I'm about to pull all my hair out.
I've been so moody and grouchy lately and snapping at everyone for no reason and I really think its a combo of the pain I'm in and not sleeping properly. I'm definately not feeling myself these days.
Well lets hope this week is better!
Some of us are sensative to various medications, especially narcotics. Instead of putting us to sleep like most folks we end up getting wired or have restless sleep. I barely slept at all last night, didn't get to bed till after 3am and didn't fully fall asleep till about 5. Of course I had to get up at 7:30 to get my husband off to work. This is pretty much the normal pattern for me anymore and it's terrible. It's not helping the pain, it's making it worse at this point. In general I haven't gone to bed before 1am and 2am is usually the average for me anymore. Again I sleep sound to a degree when I don't take the LA meds anywhere near 4 hours prior to going to sleep.
I had this initial prob when I was on vicodin for a while but it eventually subsided. Hoping this does too as I'm about to pull all my hair out.
I've been so moody and grouchy lately and snapping at everyone for no reason and I really think its a combo of the pain I'm in and not sleeping properly. I'm definately not feeling myself these days.
Well lets hope this week is better!
madhatter
08-16-2004, 10:54 AM
try changing your time of dosage. When i first was on oxycotin,i would dose at 8 and 8 and i couldn't sleep! So slowly i went to 7-7 6-6 and finally 5-5 and by bedtime i took my b.t med,and i was fine.Just a thought.
Kissa
08-16-2004, 10:57 AM
Problem is 12 hours doesn't work at all so I am supposed to take it 3x's daily, or every 8 hours, which is what has put me in this mess in the first place. If I do the 12 hrs I suffer for at least 4 hours between dosing. Make sense?
My current schedule is supposed to be 8am, 4pm, 12 am.
My current schedule is supposed to be 8am, 4pm, 12 am.
scotty12
08-16-2004, 11:27 AM
kissa,
i have the same problem sleeping.even with the ambien i get 4 hrs straight sleep on a good night.the pain wakes me all the time.i took 20 mg of ambien last night at 11pm and slept from 1 to 4am.the past few days have been so bad.i took a fall last week and broke a couple of ribs and i must have aggravated my back too.also,with the rainy weather i feel the extra pain as soon as the barometric pressure drops.i couldnt understand sat why i was hurting so much until the remnants of hurricane charley hit the northeast.
when the pain gets bad and im not sleeping well i also get grouchy.the ups and downs of living with pain just get to me.im having a really hard time managing on the 4xday dosing of roxi.i have to do something soon as i cant continue like this.it seems that every 6 months the i build up a tolerance to my pain med dose.last time was in jan when i switched from 7.5 percs to 15mg roxi.
for the 4 or 5 months following the change i felt really good.its funny how as bad as the pain gets when i get a few days of feeling good i say to myself"great, im cured"....i do know better after the past couple of years that there will be bad times where the pain is untollerable.
hope the pain lets off a bit and you start sleeping well.it makes all the difference in the world when your getting enough sleep its so much easier to deal with the pain.
take care,scotty
i have the same problem sleeping.even with the ambien i get 4 hrs straight sleep on a good night.the pain wakes me all the time.i took 20 mg of ambien last night at 11pm and slept from 1 to 4am.the past few days have been so bad.i took a fall last week and broke a couple of ribs and i must have aggravated my back too.also,with the rainy weather i feel the extra pain as soon as the barometric pressure drops.i couldnt understand sat why i was hurting so much until the remnants of hurricane charley hit the northeast.
when the pain gets bad and im not sleeping well i also get grouchy.the ups and downs of living with pain just get to me.im having a really hard time managing on the 4xday dosing of roxi.i have to do something soon as i cant continue like this.it seems that every 6 months the i build up a tolerance to my pain med dose.last time was in jan when i switched from 7.5 percs to 15mg roxi.
for the 4 or 5 months following the change i felt really good.its funny how as bad as the pain gets when i get a few days of feeling good i say to myself"great, im cured"....i do know better after the past couple of years that there will be bad times where the pain is untollerable.
hope the pain lets off a bit and you start sleeping well.it makes all the difference in the world when your getting enough sleep its so much easier to deal with the pain.
take care,scotty
Kissa
08-16-2004, 12:54 PM
I go through similiar things Scotty, it and it's frustrating to say the least. I try to keep a positive outlook and I'm fairly good at it. Lately I've been trying to focus my attention elsewhere and not on the pain but it's been a bit difficult.
I've noticed that many of us seem to be going through a bad spell of pain right now, I actually am thinking it is the change in weather for us all.
I've noticed that many of us seem to be going through a bad spell of pain right now, I actually am thinking it is the change in weather for us all.
Snails
08-16-2004, 10:48 PM
Kissa,
I'm so sorry you're having such a tough time. I know that sleep makes all the difference in controlling pain. If you can't sleep because the pain is worse, then your problems are compounded the next day because you're in more pain than your usual meds can handle. I wish I knew what to tell you in terms of sleep, except maybe to try to go to bed earlier? I don't know if it is just the la med that keeps you up or the timing of a pretty high dose.
One thing my doctor said was to avoid terrible morning pain, I could wake up in the middle of the night to take 3rd (now 5th, I am taking 10 mg oxycontin 5x per day) dose of LA meds. Maybe you could ask about taking your 15 mg spread out 4 or 5 times over the day--I know a lot of doctors are adament about the 8-12 hour timeframe, but if it's not an increased dose, it might give you better and more consistent coverage without the sleeping problems. This way you could take it in the am, noon, afternoon, and evening--still before bedtime. You might then sleep better especially because of less bt pain during the day from the smoother coverage. Not all doctors are receptive to this which I think can be inhumane--if you're not changing the daily dose, just attacking bt pain before it starts, why is that bad? It is always best to prevent pain with pain meds before it gets bad than to bring it under control once it escalates.
Keep in mind that it could be pain from the la meds not lasting the full 8 hours that is causing your additional pain and trouble getting to sleep. In my experience it was more the drop in drug serums levels than the actual med that gave me sleeping trouble at bedtime, though I do completely understand your concern about your body naturally "getting wired" in response to painkillers. Even if this is the case, I think you can find a better solution regarding your pain meds and some sleeping aids than you've found so far. I really hope you find a better combination of whatever meds you need to function normally soon! Ultimately, until you get enough sleep, it will be really tough to get your pain under control. This is a tough situation, but I think you will be able to find some relief if you are able to experiment with your dosage and dosing schedule.
Good luck, and best wishes,
Stacy
I'm so sorry you're having such a tough time. I know that sleep makes all the difference in controlling pain. If you can't sleep because the pain is worse, then your problems are compounded the next day because you're in more pain than your usual meds can handle. I wish I knew what to tell you in terms of sleep, except maybe to try to go to bed earlier? I don't know if it is just the la med that keeps you up or the timing of a pretty high dose.
One thing my doctor said was to avoid terrible morning pain, I could wake up in the middle of the night to take 3rd (now 5th, I am taking 10 mg oxycontin 5x per day) dose of LA meds. Maybe you could ask about taking your 15 mg spread out 4 or 5 times over the day--I know a lot of doctors are adament about the 8-12 hour timeframe, but if it's not an increased dose, it might give you better and more consistent coverage without the sleeping problems. This way you could take it in the am, noon, afternoon, and evening--still before bedtime. You might then sleep better especially because of less bt pain during the day from the smoother coverage. Not all doctors are receptive to this which I think can be inhumane--if you're not changing the daily dose, just attacking bt pain before it starts, why is that bad? It is always best to prevent pain with pain meds before it gets bad than to bring it under control once it escalates.
Keep in mind that it could be pain from the la meds not lasting the full 8 hours that is causing your additional pain and trouble getting to sleep. In my experience it was more the drop in drug serums levels than the actual med that gave me sleeping trouble at bedtime, though I do completely understand your concern about your body naturally "getting wired" in response to painkillers. Even if this is the case, I think you can find a better solution regarding your pain meds and some sleeping aids than you've found so far. I really hope you find a better combination of whatever meds you need to function normally soon! Ultimately, until you get enough sleep, it will be really tough to get your pain under control. This is a tough situation, but I think you will be able to find some relief if you are able to experiment with your dosage and dosing schedule.
Good luck, and best wishes,
Stacy
Kissa
08-17-2004, 10:01 AM
It's a combo of the med and timing. I have similar problems with any narcotics, they make me pretty wired. I was able to work through the vicodin 6 times a day every 3 hours but it took a few weeks, then it stopped working at all or my pain increased, not sure which of those it was, had been on vicodin for about 9 months total I think and the every 3 hours was a last resort try on them back in June.
Well I tried an experiment last night, I put off going to sleep until my 8 hours drew near so I could take my MSC again. So I stayed up till 2am and was very tired, took my pill and fell right to sleep no problem.. lo and behold I woke up at 6:30 am with no pain and feeling refreshed LOL, I couldn't go back to sleep even though I tried. I'm not sure 4 hours of sleep is gonna cut it and I'm feeling tired again, I'll just nap for a short bit. There's got to be a way to straighten this out sheesh!
Maybe I'll just work my dosing times down some, if I do 8am, 4pm and 12pm I might be able to get in 4 hours and then take something to conk me out again until my body is used to it. I certainly don't want to get used to taking something I don't need to sleep though. I already take high doses of an antidepressant similiar to elavil but without the morning grogginess, I can't go any higher on it even if I wanted to.
Thanks guys for listening to me rant on and on as I try to work through this. I really don't want to change meds again without giving the mscontin a good try, it's only been 4 weeks, and only 2 weeks or so since he upped the 30mg to 3x's daily instead of 2.
Well I tried an experiment last night, I put off going to sleep until my 8 hours drew near so I could take my MSC again. So I stayed up till 2am and was very tired, took my pill and fell right to sleep no problem.. lo and behold I woke up at 6:30 am with no pain and feeling refreshed LOL, I couldn't go back to sleep even though I tried. I'm not sure 4 hours of sleep is gonna cut it and I'm feeling tired again, I'll just nap for a short bit. There's got to be a way to straighten this out sheesh!
Maybe I'll just work my dosing times down some, if I do 8am, 4pm and 12pm I might be able to get in 4 hours and then take something to conk me out again until my body is used to it. I certainly don't want to get used to taking something I don't need to sleep though. I already take high doses of an antidepressant similiar to elavil but without the morning grogginess, I can't go any higher on it even if I wanted to.
Thanks guys for listening to me rant on and on as I try to work through this. I really don't want to change meds again without giving the mscontin a good try, it's only been 4 weeks, and only 2 weeks or so since he upped the 30mg to 3x's daily instead of 2.
madhatter
08-17-2004, 12:34 PM
When i was on oxycotin 20 mg 2x a day,i was taking lortab ,but i was taking it every 4 hrs.For some reason he wouldn't up the oxycotin dose.From what i've heard,you shouldn't have to take b.t med. no more than twice a day,if you have to take more,than the base dosage is to low.
trowftd3
08-17-2004, 01:59 PM
Kissa, Maybe it's because you've only been on the 3x a day for two weeks. Maybe your body just needs more time to adjust??
I think everyone with pain has sleep issues. I've always had trouble getting to sleep but no trouble sleeping(pre-pain). Now I do better getting to sleep but wake up miserable in the morning. I've thought about taking a bt med early in the morning but I'm afraid I won't be able to get my kids up for school. I am not a morning person in any way, shape or form so I don't need anything else to slow my brain function in the am.LOL
Good luck, I hope you figure out something that works.-Mush
I think everyone with pain has sleep issues. I've always had trouble getting to sleep but no trouble sleeping(pre-pain). Now I do better getting to sleep but wake up miserable in the morning. I've thought about taking a bt med early in the morning but I'm afraid I won't be able to get my kids up for school. I am not a morning person in any way, shape or form so I don't need anything else to slow my brain function in the am.LOL
Good luck, I hope you figure out something that works.-Mush
Kissa
08-17-2004, 04:04 PM
Yeah I agree Mad. Prior to this MS Contin I've never been on an LA med at all, it was vicodin previously by itself so I wasn't sure what all your thoughts on it were.
NeedANewJaw
08-18-2004, 03:57 AM
I havent read all the posts so forgive me if I duplicate what someone else said.
Wanted to add a few comments to the ones I did have time to read. First I wanted to know if you ever tried a combo of anti-d's to help with the sleep issue? I was having lots of problems staying asleep...waking every hr or less until my doc put me on 2 meds...a high dosage of elavil and 100 mgs of trazadone. this helps a lot!
Also on the BT issue...for the last 2 yrs i have had to take my maximum dose of BT each day. I thought of it more as another daily med rather than something I took sparingly. Since Im finally on a dosage of the right med that works great on my pain I no longer need them everyday. I think that is ideal but for those of us that need them everyday I dont see anything wrong with that either.
One more thing on the breaking of mscontin. I have done this several times...when I felt as though I could make it on a lower dose...and wanting a few extra pills for when I have the really bad days. I found that the morphine did NOT lose its time release function for me. I would NEVER cut an oxy but as i said, ive never had problems doing this with mscontin. i am not condoning it just sharing my experiences.
I wonder if adding an extra BT pill either right before bed or even when you wake up in the middle of the night. Sounds as though your times may need a lil tweaking but overall its a good thing the morphine is working well...its been my miracle drug!
Wanted to add a few comments to the ones I did have time to read. First I wanted to know if you ever tried a combo of anti-d's to help with the sleep issue? I was having lots of problems staying asleep...waking every hr or less until my doc put me on 2 meds...a high dosage of elavil and 100 mgs of trazadone. this helps a lot!
Also on the BT issue...for the last 2 yrs i have had to take my maximum dose of BT each day. I thought of it more as another daily med rather than something I took sparingly. Since Im finally on a dosage of the right med that works great on my pain I no longer need them everyday. I think that is ideal but for those of us that need them everyday I dont see anything wrong with that either.
One more thing on the breaking of mscontin. I have done this several times...when I felt as though I could make it on a lower dose...and wanting a few extra pills for when I have the really bad days. I found that the morphine did NOT lose its time release function for me. I would NEVER cut an oxy but as i said, ive never had problems doing this with mscontin. i am not condoning it just sharing my experiences.
I wonder if adding an extra BT pill either right before bed or even when you wake up in the middle of the night. Sounds as though your times may need a lil tweaking but overall its a good thing the morphine is working well...its been my miracle drug!
Kissa
08-18-2004, 09:47 AM
I take an anti-depressant in the same class as Elavil. I can't take Elavil because at even extremely low doses , the type the give small children in an eyedropper, I wake up groggy the next day and am in a fog for many hours. What I do take is pretty effective however I am at the max dosage of it right now. Trazadone works great and I've taken it in the past for sleep, I will talk to him about this option when I see him next.
I'm trying to adjust my schedule so that I'm taking the 3rd dose right when I go to bed and hopefully soon I'll sleep at least 6 hours solid. I am hoping to get to a point where BT meds are not needed daily as you said. I think it will be an issue of them titrating the MS Contin up slowly due to the sleep issues. I really don't want to switch meds, especially to Oxy because I won't sleep at all then! I've been on it before when my shoulder was worked on last fall, it makes me pretty hyper. Right now as it stands the MSC is what is waking me. I get groggy at first then I get this groggy/awake sensation about 4 hours into the medication regardless of when I take this.
I can manage OK during the day by resting my eyes a few minutes till it passes but at night it really impacts me bad.
Thanks for the suggestions, I appreciate everyone's moral support and advice!
I'm trying to adjust my schedule so that I'm taking the 3rd dose right when I go to bed and hopefully soon I'll sleep at least 6 hours solid. I am hoping to get to a point where BT meds are not needed daily as you said. I think it will be an issue of them titrating the MS Contin up slowly due to the sleep issues. I really don't want to switch meds, especially to Oxy because I won't sleep at all then! I've been on it before when my shoulder was worked on last fall, it makes me pretty hyper. Right now as it stands the MSC is what is waking me. I get groggy at first then I get this groggy/awake sensation about 4 hours into the medication regardless of when I take this.
I can manage OK during the day by resting my eyes a few minutes till it passes but at night it really impacts me bad.
Thanks for the suggestions, I appreciate everyone's moral support and advice!