ItHurts!
10-07-2004, 10:21 PM
I am a 6 ft 150 pound male. I have been working out, weights and cardio, for about a month now. My muscle mass is increasing but it was never very much to begin with. My body fat level is going down but i am still flabby around the mid section. My problem is that all my fat seems to go to my stomach and posterior and my arms and legs are like noodles. I am doing a good job at making my arms and legs bigger but i cant seem to get at this stomach. Im not fat just flabby and i guess the increased ab muscle size makes it look worse. My bones also seem to be much thicker in my chest and torso than in my arms and legs. My problem is that i feel like losing this would take losing all that fat i have since it is all in that area. I would be all the way down to 140 lbs by then! My question is what is a good way to lose fat and increase muscle at the same time. I dont want to lose anymore wieght but i do want to lose fat. I am weaker than most other men at the gym but i try and i have gone up about 30 lbs in resistance since i started! I typically go 3 times a week. Each time i start with a 5 mile run, then i do either upper or lower body weightlifting (altenates each time i go), then a 15 minute cool down on a stair machine - totaling in about 4 hrs per visit. What more do I have to do? I am to exhausted and sore to go more than 3 days a week and i really dont have time being that i am in school right now. Will i need a special diet like aitkens to get what i want. I do have a snacking problem but i dont think i eat more than 1300 calories a day. Anything work for you? :confused:
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Jimmy King
10-07-2004, 11:52 PM
Hmm, alright, first off... gaining muscle AND losing fat at the same time is difficult. It takes a very well planned diet and workout and some luck with the genes sure helps. You sound to be pretty much an almost pure ectomorph... that should help you out with losing that flab once you make some changes to the workout (and possibly the diet) but you guys tend to have a tough time putting on the muscle, so I don't know how well doing both at the same time will go for you.
Now, for your workout. 5 mile run, then weights, then more light cardio to cool down? 4 hours total? That's going to cause a few problems. With a 5 mile run before lifting weights, it's pretty questionable that you are able to lift enough weight and with proper form to do much for building muscle. You're also almost definitely burning up a lot of muscle at that point (especially on a 1300 or less calorie per day diet) and shooting cortisol levels through the roof. I highly recommend doing your weights before cardio and preferably just doing weights then the light cardio to cool down, keeping it to no more than about an hour total. Then the next day do your running, again, keeping it to an hour at most and preferably a little less, unless you're training for something specific such as a marathon. That should help with your being exhausted and sore and your time if it's only 30 minutes to an hour per workout instead of 4 hours.
Now, your diet. 1300 calories per day? Dude, I eat 2000 calories on a light day when cutting and generally closer to 2500 or 3000 calories. Now I'm not saying you need to eat that much, I'm a good bit bigger than you, but I think it makes a good point to people who are either eating too few calories while trying to lose or gain weight, either one. The general rule is 10 to 12x your bodyweight in calories per day to lose weight. Anything less than that and you're at risk of your body deciding that it's starving. This causes your metabolism to slow down, reducing weight loss, and causes your body to try to preserve fat rather than use it for energy and use more muscle instead, again, reducing metabolism even more, plus keeping you fat/flabby and making it pretty much impossible to gain muscle as you are trying to do. This lack of food is also contributing to your soreness after workouts as your body isn't getting enough nutrients to repair itself in a timely manner.
Now, for your workout. 5 mile run, then weights, then more light cardio to cool down? 4 hours total? That's going to cause a few problems. With a 5 mile run before lifting weights, it's pretty questionable that you are able to lift enough weight and with proper form to do much for building muscle. You're also almost definitely burning up a lot of muscle at that point (especially on a 1300 or less calorie per day diet) and shooting cortisol levels through the roof. I highly recommend doing your weights before cardio and preferably just doing weights then the light cardio to cool down, keeping it to no more than about an hour total. Then the next day do your running, again, keeping it to an hour at most and preferably a little less, unless you're training for something specific such as a marathon. That should help with your being exhausted and sore and your time if it's only 30 minutes to an hour per workout instead of 4 hours.
Now, your diet. 1300 calories per day? Dude, I eat 2000 calories on a light day when cutting and generally closer to 2500 or 3000 calories. Now I'm not saying you need to eat that much, I'm a good bit bigger than you, but I think it makes a good point to people who are either eating too few calories while trying to lose or gain weight, either one. The general rule is 10 to 12x your bodyweight in calories per day to lose weight. Anything less than that and you're at risk of your body deciding that it's starving. This causes your metabolism to slow down, reducing weight loss, and causes your body to try to preserve fat rather than use it for energy and use more muscle instead, again, reducing metabolism even more, plus keeping you fat/flabby and making it pretty much impossible to gain muscle as you are trying to do. This lack of food is also contributing to your soreness after workouts as your body isn't getting enough nutrients to repair itself in a timely manner.
ItHurts!
10-08-2004, 12:19 AM
Thanks for such a detailed and informative reply! I wasn't expecting that but i will take your advise. Opon further evaluation of my calorie intake i forgot to factor in all the stuff i drink like milk and gatorade. I also go nuts with snack food like today where i ate a whole family size bag of Tostito's with a whole jar of con quesa sause. I also tend to drink alot of calories like i drank a galon of milk yesterday. I guess the truth is there are days i eat 1300 calories but for the most part it is in the 2000 calorie range or even higher. I guess i do need to tone it down a bit. I make sure to eat plenty of protien though. I dont want to look like my pasta loving friend who is so skinny he practically 2-D. :jester: As for the cardio, i tend to run kinda fast so i get 5 miles in about 35 minutes. I do find that i cannot do as much weight the further i run before lifting. I try to do an equal balance of cardio and anarobic. I dont know if i am truely an ectomorph because i dont really get sore upper body no matter how much weight i do. But i did start off rather weak and muscleless. The thing is i started a new exercise, squats, and that is what has been making my legs sore. Plus i tend to do all my upper body in one session then all lower body in the next. That is about 15 different exercises at 3 sets each per session! I have been gaining muscle and my upper arms are getting much larger so this method must be working for me. I wish i could say the same for my forearms. I dont want to break it up and go everyday. Not enough time. I guess the key for me would be less snaking or perhaps i need a different combination of food? Is there any particular diet good for those wanting fat loss and muscle gain? My stomach is flat it is just that the skin is a little loose and noticable when i am sitting, when i stand my abs are hard. I'm by no means fat i just want to be a bit leaner. I would like my stomach to be hard even while im sitting. Thanks again for the reply!
Jimmy King
10-08-2004, 12:53 AM
You'll almost certainly need to ditch the junk food (that even includes gatorade other than perhaps directly after or during a workout, there are better things to drink than gatorade though, imo). There's no real specific food to eat, but the diet of most people who are serious about working out and are in good shape tends to include oats, veggies, chicken, tuna, and lean beef. Dairy stuff like milk and cottage cheese are also common, but you can find those who swear they'll screw up your weight loss. Personally, I pretty much every day eat whole wheat bread, eggs, chicken, tuna, corn, broccoli, lettuce, hormel turkey chili w/beans (a bit high in sodium, but amazingly good for you overall), tilapia, cottage cheese, and milk. Occasional peanuts and quality beef sticks (ie. not slim jims... ones that are very low saturated fat, no carbs, high-ish protein) for snacking.
Also, don't avoid the carbs by any means... the good, clean, whole grain and/or veggie carbs, that is. Your muscle needs carbs just as much as protein (some people say more than protein) for building muscle.
I know you said you don't have much time to workout more days/week, but seriously, 4 hours straight working out is going to hurt you in the end. It may work for awhile, but in the long run, it's going to burn you out and keep you from making gains in muscle. It's really hard on your body to work out that long. After about an hour your body starts using a lot of protein (your muscles) for energy. It releases cortisol to cope with the stress, which aids in using up muscle for energy and in storing fat on your body.
Oh, the ectomorph thing. That has nothing to do with being sore or not. Being an ectomorph just means that your body is naturally skinny, relatively easy to lose fat, generally hard to gain muscle, usually long limbs and body, etc. Most people are usually some combo with a tendency towards one, it looks like your tendency is probably strongly towards the ecto side of things from your height and weight.
Also, don't avoid the carbs by any means... the good, clean, whole grain and/or veggie carbs, that is. Your muscle needs carbs just as much as protein (some people say more than protein) for building muscle.
I know you said you don't have much time to workout more days/week, but seriously, 4 hours straight working out is going to hurt you in the end. It may work for awhile, but in the long run, it's going to burn you out and keep you from making gains in muscle. It's really hard on your body to work out that long. After about an hour your body starts using a lot of protein (your muscles) for energy. It releases cortisol to cope with the stress, which aids in using up muscle for energy and in storing fat on your body.
Oh, the ectomorph thing. That has nothing to do with being sore or not. Being an ectomorph just means that your body is naturally skinny, relatively easy to lose fat, generally hard to gain muscle, usually long limbs and body, etc. Most people are usually some combo with a tendency towards one, it looks like your tendency is probably strongly towards the ecto side of things from your height and weight.