swf,

I'd first like to say to you, please try to take a breath and calm down, there is no reason to be so angry because of my post. If you can see the beginning of my post it was addressed to you and anyone else who thinks herbs do not work. I'm sorry if you think it was rude or angry, it certainly was only meant to show some facts and inform others against what some people say. Sometimes being direct is offensive to others, but I promise you that I am hardly an offensive person, never do I try to be.

Yes, everyone is entitled to their opinion, but not everyone's opinion is based on fact. That was one basic meaning of my post. Of course, you can post your "opinion", but it doesn't mean that I can't come along and defend some of those things you say. It's fine for either one of us to do that.

Now would you kindly show me where in my post that I said all herbs and plants are made for human consumption? Please quote me as to where I said that. You surely cannot, because never did I come even close to saying that. In fact, when you say that herbs are dangerous and talk about drugs and medicince, you are basically only repeating some of my original points. I carefully stated that herbs must be taken very carefully, with caution. I am the one who stated that medicines come from plants. I am the one who stated that these medicines can be dangerous. Of course I already know about diet pills being unsafe (you are probably referring to the ones that contain ephedra,a among so many others). Of course I know that cocaine comes from a plant, as well as morphine and heroin and most every other drug that exists. You are not telling me anything new, you are merely elaborating on what I have already stated. So you bring up no new valid points, only repeating what I have said.

The pills I take do not contain hormones, they contain things that affect hormones. Saw palmetto berries have been known to be safe for many, many years. I do trust my Native American ancestors. However, just with any other food or plant, some people cannot use them.

Yes, reading is very necessary in order to know if something is basically safe or not. That is why I mentioned "reading" so much in my post. And if you're watching "CNN", I'm pretty sure you're not likely to get much credible information anyway. There are much greater sources of information on the internet. And it IS true that many people do not read. Whether you read or not, I do not know, but I do not think you have researched any of these specific herbs. I have never found any case of someone having a "heart attack, stroke, or blood clot" while taking these certain herbs. It is a very good idea to see a herbologist or alternative doctor to gain further information. Regular MDs do not know much at all about herbs, it is often dismissed in Western society. There are many very knowledgeable alternative doctors and herboligists that could provide you and other women with even more information and will gladly back the saftey of many herbs.

I do not think you know too much about herbs at all. Just to say that some of them are dangerous and then dismiss ALL of them as being dangerous is such a silly attitude to have, and not very educated.

Also, I never stated that YOU said that women should just "deal with the way they are", my post wasn't only directed at you, as I said in the beginning.

Telling me that I am "obviously a very insecure person" is such a childish attitude. I did not "devote an entire page to making sure everyone knows how secure a person I am". My second post was to back up the reasons some people give for not taking herbs, which is often to tell women that they are not happy with themselves or confident enough, and I merely stated in one or two sentences that that was not the case at all. You clearly must feel like I was attacking you or something, I'm sorry you feel that way, but it certainly was not my intention. I don't feel the need to say that you are an insecure person, because I'm a woman who doesn't focus on petty issues pertaining to other women. Besides, I do not know you, and you do not know me.

Now, to make this novel even longer... It's completely ironic that you went so out of your way to say how unsafe herbs can be, but then you are so nonchalant about breast implants. That is quite astounding. Many, many women have died from breast implants or died from complications pertaining there to. Many women's bodies have deteriorated due to breast implants, their own immune systems attacking them and wrecking havoc on their health. So I can confidently say that the women choosing to take herbs (as long as they are doing their research and monitoring their bodies) are the one's making a MUCH more cautious and wise decision than those choosing implants. Yes it's true that is my "opinion", but it is an opinion based very strongly on logic and intelligence and wisdom, and I know many others would agree with me.

This board is for health issues, and I have the right to inform others of FACTS, that includes facts about the saftey or the possible danger of herbs, and if they actually work. You may inform them of your opinion that they are dangerous, but I'm informing them even farther. And, basically, your original post was more specifically to say that herbs don't work or don't work permanently, and that is completely unbased on facts, and I was obviously disputing that.

Again, don't forget that these herbs are taken by many women to balance their hormones SAFELY and used for so many other reasons, not just for breast enlargement. They are an alternative to pharmaceuticals, which can be ever far more dangerous. These same herbs are the same that are given out by herbologists and alternative medical doctors to help many ailments and imbalances. Their safety far out weighs their danger, and most of them are not used forever. So many people safely use herbs every single day and have been for thousands of years, many herbs are life savers for some. But many of them are terribly dangerous and should only be taken with a very knowledgeable herbologist or other expert watching over them, however, these specific herbs being discussed in this forum are not those type of dangerous herbs. However, they can affect everyone differently and some people cannot take them. So, just like I stated all along, everyone should always be careful with what they are choosing to put inside their bodies, and that most definitely includes women who choose to put breast implants inside their body as well.

Wow, so you've gotten a whole book out of me. But I'd much rather debate politics or discuss issues related to what's going on around our world. So I think this is enough for now. I'm sure you will find something "incorrect" in my post. That's fine. And thanks for telling me to have a wonderful day, I wish you one as well, but honestly so.