Wendy379
11-26-2004, 05:57 AM
I've had elevated enzymes (ALT, AST) for awhile now, and my doctor thought it was time for me to see a liver specialist. My AST on the last test was 58; ALT was 129; AMA 1:80. ALK Phos. was in the normal range at 110.
I have high cholesterol and osteopenia, and I'm in my late 40's.
Does this sound like PBC?
I have high cholesterol and osteopenia, and I'm in my late 40's.
Does this sound like PBC?
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butterflytrans
11-28-2004, 04:45 PM
I've had elevated enzymes (ALT, AST) for awhile now, and my doctor thought it was time for me to see a liver specialist. My AST on the last test was 58; ALT was 129; AMA 1:80. ALK Phos. was in the normal range at 110.
I have high cholesterol and osteopenia, and I'm in my late 40's.
Does this sound like PBC?
I forget if you were the one who posted on another forum about something like this. Anyway, the answer to your question is that this COULD be PBC. Being a woman, you are at much higher risk for developing PBC than a male your age would be. Your ALT is slightly raised, and the fact that your AMA is positive does point towards the disease; however, it's still hard to say.
Have you had any of the symptoms of PBC? For those of you reading this thread, PBC stands for Primary Biliary Cirrhosis which is a disease of scarring of the bile ducts in the liver.
I have high cholesterol and osteopenia, and I'm in my late 40's.
Does this sound like PBC?
I forget if you were the one who posted on another forum about something like this. Anyway, the answer to your question is that this COULD be PBC. Being a woman, you are at much higher risk for developing PBC than a male your age would be. Your ALT is slightly raised, and the fact that your AMA is positive does point towards the disease; however, it's still hard to say.
Have you had any of the symptoms of PBC? For those of you reading this thread, PBC stands for Primary Biliary Cirrhosis which is a disease of scarring of the bile ducts in the liver.
Wendy379
11-28-2004, 09:57 PM
I forget if you were the one who posted on another forum about something like this. Anyway, the answer to your question is that this COULD be PBC. Being a woman, you are at much higher risk for developing PBC than a male your age would be. Your ALT is slightly raised, and the fact that your AMA is positive does point towards the disease; however, it's still hard to say.
Have you had any of the symptoms of PBC? For those of you reading this thread, PBC stands for Primary Biliary Cirrhosis which is a disease of scarring of the bile ducts in the liver.
Thanks butterflytrans for your response :)
No, I didn't post on another forum. There is another post on this forum by someone with a similar situation, but that person did not have an elevated AMA.
As far as symptoms....I have high cholesterol, almost @ 300. I've ALWAYS had a tendancy towards it. In my early 30's, 120 lbs, ate very healthy, non-smoker, I still had a cholesterol reading of 198.
I also have thinning of the bones. I didn't expect to get that at such an early age.
For the last couple years I've had itching on my abdomen. I figured it was from dry skin. It's not constant, as sometimes months go by and it doesn't bother me. Looking back though, it does seem like that started about the same time my ALT/AST started to be elevated.
So, is the doctor just going to wait until my ALK phos. goes up to give me the dreaded diagnosis? Is there a chance that the rise in the AMA was just a fluke, and it will be fine on the next blood test? (the doctor did say that a reading of 1:80 for the AMA was not real high) This waiting game is very hard.
Have you had any of the symptoms of PBC? For those of you reading this thread, PBC stands for Primary Biliary Cirrhosis which is a disease of scarring of the bile ducts in the liver.
Thanks butterflytrans for your response :)
No, I didn't post on another forum. There is another post on this forum by someone with a similar situation, but that person did not have an elevated AMA.
As far as symptoms....I have high cholesterol, almost @ 300. I've ALWAYS had a tendancy towards it. In my early 30's, 120 lbs, ate very healthy, non-smoker, I still had a cholesterol reading of 198.
I also have thinning of the bones. I didn't expect to get that at such an early age.
For the last couple years I've had itching on my abdomen. I figured it was from dry skin. It's not constant, as sometimes months go by and it doesn't bother me. Looking back though, it does seem like that started about the same time my ALT/AST started to be elevated.
So, is the doctor just going to wait until my ALK phos. goes up to give me the dreaded diagnosis? Is there a chance that the rise in the AMA was just a fluke, and it will be fine on the next blood test? (the doctor did say that a reading of 1:80 for the AMA was not real high) This waiting game is very hard.
butterflytrans
11-28-2004, 10:56 PM
Your doctor has a point...a titre of 1:80 for AMA isn't that high, but the thing is, it really shouldn't be positive to begin with. The itching on your abdomen obviously goes with PBC, and the fact that you're a woman (I think you are at least! *heehee*) goes towards the diagnosis as well. In terms of your cholesterol, sorry, it's hard for me to help you because the units are not the same ones we use here in Canada.
Have you e'er been jaundiced before?
Have you e'er been jaundiced before?
Wendy379
11-28-2004, 11:38 PM
Yes, I am a woman! (heehee) No, I have never had jaundice. Bilirubin total is 0.3 (0.2-1.3), and the bilirubin direct is 0.1 (0-0.4).
What are other reasons a person may have an elevated AMA, other than PBC? If it was PBC, wouldn't my ALK Phos. already be elevated?
What are other reasons a person may have an elevated AMA, other than PBC? If it was PBC, wouldn't my ALK Phos. already be elevated?
Wendy379
12-11-2004, 10:46 PM
still bothered...and it will be months before I see the doctor for another blood test.
Is it possible to test postive for AMA (1:80) and NOT have PBC? What are other possible causes for the AMA to be positive? :confused:
Is it possible to test postive for AMA (1:80) and NOT have PBC? What are other possible causes for the AMA to be positive? :confused:
Wendy379
12-21-2004, 03:54 PM
Still hoping someone can answer my question..............
What are other reasons a person may have an elevated AMA, other than PBC?
If the ALP is NOT elevated, will the diagnosis (whether it is PBC or not) still be apparent with a liver biopsy?
What are other reasons a person may have an elevated AMA, other than PBC?
If the ALP is NOT elevated, will the diagnosis (whether it is PBC or not) still be apparent with a liver biopsy?
vamp36
12-25-2004, 02:24 PM
Meds can cause the liver enzymes to increase as well. Autoimmune disorders also can cause it.
butterflytrans
12-25-2004, 03:28 PM
Hi Wendy...sorry for not answering you before. If your ALP is not elevated and you don't have symptoms of PBC, it is unlikely you actually have it, or if anything, have a very early stage of it. Yes, a liver biopsy can confirm whether you have it or not.
I agree with vamp36 that enzymes can increase due to meds and due to autoimmune disorders, but that's a little inaccurate. Your transaminase enzymes increase (i.e. AST, ALT) and your "obstructuve enzymes" (GGT, ALP) may increase with certain meds, but your AMA shouldn't go up--it is a special autoimmune marker. Certain autoimmune conditions are related to rises in certain autoimmune markers, but not all.
Sometimes people have a certain rise in their autoimmune markers, but don't have any symptoms their entire life. It sounds like this might be your case if you're not having any distressing symptoms.
I agree with vamp36 that enzymes can increase due to meds and due to autoimmune disorders, but that's a little inaccurate. Your transaminase enzymes increase (i.e. AST, ALT) and your "obstructuve enzymes" (GGT, ALP) may increase with certain meds, but your AMA shouldn't go up--it is a special autoimmune marker. Certain autoimmune conditions are related to rises in certain autoimmune markers, but not all.
Sometimes people have a certain rise in their autoimmune markers, but don't have any symptoms their entire life. It sounds like this might be your case if you're not having any distressing symptoms.
feelbad
12-26-2004, 08:09 AM
Hey Butterfly,you sound very knowledgeable regarding liver issues so i thought you might know the answer to this.What is the difference between PBC and primary sclerosing cholengitis(PSC)??What you described Re the PBC sounds exactly like the PSC that caused my sons liver to totally fail and required a transplant.He had horrid infections in the bile ducts and no matter how they tried to get to them to try and drain them with a tube, they could not seem to penetrate the ducts.His doc said that it was like trying to push a tube into a rock.not good.Just curious,thanks,Marcia
butterflytrans
12-28-2004, 02:15 AM
Hi there Marcia:
PBC stands for Primary Biliary Cirrhosis and PSC, as you probably know (I'm doing this for the benefit of others reading this) stands for Primary Sclerosing Cholangitis. The big difference between the two is the former affects the small biliary ducts which are in the liver tissue itself. There is not as much inflammation as PSC. With PSC, you get destruction of bile ducts both inside AND outside the liver, but it tends to be the larger sized ducts. Though both are very serious diseases, PSC tends to present much more severely (in terms of how ill the patient is) than PBC does. Additionally, when you visualize the biliary tree with ERCP in someone with PSC, the ducts look like a "string of beads" because of the strictures that form secondary to inflammation. You don't see this in PBC because it is the much smaller bile ducts which are affected, and these can usually only be visualized with a liver biopsy under the microscope.
Does that make sense?
PBC stands for Primary Biliary Cirrhosis and PSC, as you probably know (I'm doing this for the benefit of others reading this) stands for Primary Sclerosing Cholangitis. The big difference between the two is the former affects the small biliary ducts which are in the liver tissue itself. There is not as much inflammation as PSC. With PSC, you get destruction of bile ducts both inside AND outside the liver, but it tends to be the larger sized ducts. Though both are very serious diseases, PSC tends to present much more severely (in terms of how ill the patient is) than PBC does. Additionally, when you visualize the biliary tree with ERCP in someone with PSC, the ducts look like a "string of beads" because of the strictures that form secondary to inflammation. You don't see this in PBC because it is the much smaller bile ducts which are affected, and these can usually only be visualized with a liver biopsy under the microscope.
Does that make sense?
feelbad
12-28-2004, 08:59 AM
Why yes it does.and thank you for the really good explanation.you would make a great teacher,lol.Marcia
bobcat93
01-06-2005, 09:21 AM
Have you Doctor check for Hemochromatosis which is a High Iron Disorder. This can cause elevated AST & ALT liver enzymes.
butterflytrans
01-06-2005, 05:08 PM
bobcat....there are a TON of things that can cause elevated AST and ALT levels. You could ask the doctor to check also for: Wilson's Disease , Alpha1-antitrypsin deficiency, Autoimmune Hepatitis, Viral Hepatitis etc. etc. but just because you can check for them doesn't mean you have to. The above conditions have many other associated features, and without any of those features (i.e. in feelbad's case) there is no reason to suspect them.
wimzie
01-06-2005, 05:36 PM
To add to butterfly's post... normally when they are doing an ALT/AST work-up, they check iron and other elements in the blood anyway. I'm sure we've all had that checked - however - your comment is appreciated, and you never know right?
butterflytrans
01-07-2005, 02:13 AM
True true true....
cleopatra`
01-22-2005, 03:24 PM
Yes, I am a woman! (heehee) No, I have never had jaundice. Bilirubin total is 0.3 (0.2-1.3), and the bilirubin direct is 0.1 (0-0.4).
What are other reasons a person may have an elevated AMA, other than PBC? If it was PBC, wouldn't my ALK Phos. already be elevated?
Hi wendy, I have PBC and my liver enzymes were not even elevated when we first diagnosed it. I was not feeling well and they ran a bunch of tests, I had that pain in the right rib cage area. They tell me AMA is specific for PBC
my liver enzymes have since elevated as my original diagnosis was 2 years ago. I also have a sister with it, she was diagnosed before me. Are you seeing specialist?
What are other reasons a person may have an elevated AMA, other than PBC? If it was PBC, wouldn't my ALK Phos. already be elevated?
Hi wendy, I have PBC and my liver enzymes were not even elevated when we first diagnosed it. I was not feeling well and they ran a bunch of tests, I had that pain in the right rib cage area. They tell me AMA is specific for PBC
my liver enzymes have since elevated as my original diagnosis was 2 years ago. I also have a sister with it, she was diagnosed before me. Are you seeing specialist?
Wendy379
01-25-2005, 02:27 AM
Hi wendy, I have PBC and my liver enzymes were not even elevated when we first diagnosed it. I was not feeling well and they ran a bunch of tests, I had that pain in the right rib cage area. They tell me AMA is specific for PBC
my liver enzymes have since elevated as my original diagnosis was 2 years ago. I also have a sister with it, she was diagnosed before me. Are you seeing specialist?
I saw a specialist who ran blood tests, which is when I found out I tested positive for AMA. I don't care for that doctor though, and will be seeing a hepatologist. There is no doubt in my mind that it is PBC, even though the ALP is not elevated. I have high cholesterol, high triglycerides, low white blood count,osteopenia, and slightly elevated AST/ALT. My legs hurt and I am very fatigued. I also have a sister that was diagnosed with an autoimmune disease quite a few years ago.
my liver enzymes have since elevated as my original diagnosis was 2 years ago. I also have a sister with it, she was diagnosed before me. Are you seeing specialist?
I saw a specialist who ran blood tests, which is when I found out I tested positive for AMA. I don't care for that doctor though, and will be seeing a hepatologist. There is no doubt in my mind that it is PBC, even though the ALP is not elevated. I have high cholesterol, high triglycerides, low white blood count,osteopenia, and slightly elevated AST/ALT. My legs hurt and I am very fatigued. I also have a sister that was diagnosed with an autoimmune disease quite a few years ago.
cleopatra`
01-27-2005, 12:36 PM
I hope the hepatologist can give you the answers you need. I know when my AMA was positive they said it was specific for PBC. like I said my blood work was good at first but since has elevated. I thought finding out early would be to my advantage cause they could start me on the URSO but my doctor gastro guy didn't want to start it until my enzymes went up. hahah
I hope you get your answers soon.
cleo
I hope you get your answers soon.
cleo