Hi,
I'm not new to this health board, but have a couple of questions that I'm not sure where to post.
I've jumped around the board this morning and "Kamden" seems to have a lot of experience and answers. I hope he sees this post.
I am a life long sufferer of TMJD. That's where I usually hang out on this board. I am 50, I have had multiple surgeries for this problem. All caused more problems.
I'm pretty much an expert on the physical aspects of this disease, but have questions regarding the mental or emotional aspects of chronic head, neck, back & facial pain. Surgically induced trigeminal neuralgia and other damage. TMJD induced Tinnitus. Constant muscle spasms and the list goes on. I've pretty much been a wreck for about the last 10 years.

I can find most of the information I need on the web or on health boards, but one problem that comes and goes is a mystery. I caught a glimpse of it in the sleep disorder forum.

My question is, do you know anything about "brain zaps"
or hearing loud noises just as you are waking up?
I do not have them frequently, but I can't find much about this problem. I did see one brief article that said TMJD can cause it. I have on occasion had some other symtoms that might resemble sleep paralysis, but not to the extent that these other folks have.

I am not a candidate for any more surgeries. I see a massage therapist, do relaxation exercises, use splint therapy and am in "pain management" at the moment. I try not to take meds for too long without a break.

My next question is, could Tylenol #3 and/or Klonopin cause the "zaps"? That's what I'm taking now. Very low dosage.

I don't suffer from lot of anxiety, I've kind of learned to live with this "monster", but the "zaps"
do scare me a little.

I hope I have not posted in the wrong place and would appreciate any help.

Cymy Sue

Hi, I just came across your post today. I have been taking a break from the boards for a bit! I am not sure i can help you only because my treatment for my problem was chiro. and physical therapy treatments, no surgery. My upper back, neck, and skull were worked on, because I even had an area at the bottom of the back of my head where there was a lump, just like a muscle spasm, that needed to be worked out, and had been causing alot of symptoms. About the brain zaps, what does the noise sound like? I have had a problem with hearing noises occasionally, even when I had no other physcial problem. I have come across others that have heard noises or felt like they had a brain spasm, and nothing was found to be wrong. Also, do the treatments you are receiving help you? What are all your symptoms right now? I will be back in a few days again to reply and try to help.

Thanks for your reply. I realized after I made this post that I had just started with a new splint therapy.
It does seem to be helping. On thinking back, it seem that I have heard these noises when there were changes going on in the TMJ area. It's possible this was the cause.

My head, face, neck, shoulders, & back do give me a lot of muscle problems. I get enormous relief from Theraputic Massage. Muscle spasms, Tinnitis and nerve pain (from surgical damage)are the worst of my symtoms.

I'm still very curious about these strange noises. In the past, I have heard loud popping, sometimes almost explosive noises and then the "zaps" that are like an electrical arc, that's about the best description I have. I've had every kind of scan and test under the sun and other than the damage from long-term TMJD and the surgeries I've had, they find nothing.

I also am curious about brain spasms. I see posts regarding this and am not sure what it is. Occasionally, it feels like my brain jerks or does something weird and Doctors sometimes make you feel so stupid, I've never mentioned it. Could you tell me what a brain spasm is?

TMJD presents with many strange and seemingly unrelated symtoms. Especially when you have had multiple surgeries and nerves have been cut and damaged. Those of us who have this problem have been kind of left to our own resources in searching for answers.

Any information you have would be appreciated.

Cymy Sue

Cymy, I don't know about brain spasms or noises, and have only read about others having these symptoms on here. I guess I would suggest reading through the posts on here and seeing if you come across one titled about the same. I do know that numerous symptoms come with problems with the upper back and neck and untill the therapy you are getting is done, you could see if there is an improvement in your symptoms, and the noises. I only have experience with muscle problems, and trigger points, causing many brain symptoms, and got relief through physical therapy.

I also wanted to know how long you have been getting the theraputic message, because you mentioned terrible muscle spasms.

I was referred to a theraputic massage therapist by a Chiro about 3 years ago. The Chiro worked wonders with my back, neck and posture, but the muscles in my face were so tight and none of the treatments he tried worked. I had also read that people with long term TMJD were getting good results with massage. My therapist has training in working with head & facial muscles. I was skeptical at first, however she uses the same technique that is used by Physical Therapists after TMJ surgeries. After some of these surgeries (3 in my case) patients are unable to open their mouth enough to talk or eat. Several weeks of PT usually will relax the muscles a little. I was very fortunate to be sent to one of the best in my area, who in the 80's was already working wih TMJD patients.
According to my former Surgeons, I have totally dysfunctional joints and they do not understand why I still am able to eat and talk as well as I do. My belief is that due to the physical therapy and now the massage therapy, which in the facial area, is a "muscle release technique" has allowed me to maintain a little more function than most. If I do not go to her for a few weeks, I am back to "talking through my teeth". Another problem that people with multiple surgeries, implants and severe TMJ problems have, is that their face will draw to one side. My face was terribly drawn to one side. This therapy has completely done away with that problem.

Are you asking because you think it might add to the problem or as I, did not know that Massage Therapy had become a very important part of treating chronic muscle problems?

I would not advise anyone to "run to their nearest Massage Parlor" for muscle problems. I did a lot of research first and was able to make an educated comparison regarding her techniques, due to my over 10 year, on & off, experience with the best PT in my state.

Cymy Sue

I was asking out of curiosity, and I know that massage is the best form of therapy, as you are talking to somebody who highly recommends PT over any other form of non invasive treatment, as I have had them all. I am glad it is helping you. I always recommend a person learn the cause of their symptoms before advising them on any treatment, just like you. I am glad this therapy is helping you, and sorry i can't help you with the other symptoms.

I had an experience with the zaps you speak of.. I was actually on klonipon and paxil.. low doses for awhile.. but as I came off them I experienced these shocks throughout my body.. felt as if my brain released a lightning bolt through my body. It can be a common occurence with anti-depressants/anti-anxiety medication. It actually got pretty bad for me. I ended up staying on paxil for 6 months.. When I came off it I had the zaps for up to a month and a half. Sleep was my only remedy. Anyways, good luck.

I've read a lot about this happening with anti-depressants. Especially when trying to come off of them. I've never taken them.

I could not find anything about it with the Klonopin.
I'm on a low dose, and have not tried to stop it.

I take the Klonopin for muscle spasms due to TMJD.
Same amount everyday. I've only experienced the zaps occasionally and always after a short day-time nap as I'm waking up.

I guess any medicine that acts on your central nervous system and your brain could cause it.

Thanks for the information.

Cymy Sue

I wanted to give just a little insight on those brain zaps seeing that I've had them for a few years and believe them to be no more than an phenomenon caused by the brain. The brain is an electrical warehouse full of sparking nerves and some of us just so happen to have a little extra. It's alright and they don't mean that something terrible is going on with you. I characterize mine as this: It mostly happens to me upon waking or falling asleep. It also happens when I'm extremely tired. All of a sudden you will hear this loud noise and you might even see bright white for the split second that it occurs. And it does only last for a split second. At first it's like "what in the world was that?!?" Down the road, many episodes later, you come to realize that it is just a new symptom that becomes a part of your life and it doesn't bother as much anymore. My MRI only showed that my brain has more blood vessels than the average person. That might be the reason but the doctors do not know. Nothing is wrong with me given these symptoms and the same is probably the case for all of those who were wondering. Chin up and live your life.

I'll be darned--you can find out about anything here!! I have had those "zaps" for two years now. I had spial cord surgery from brainstem to C7. Also have two large hearing tumors still in there. I have these trying to fall asleep and sometimes get them steadily every few seconds after I wake up. This goes on for 10 minutes or so. I called them "short circuits" My doc seemed to think they might be small seizures but haven't done anything for them yet. I tke large doses of dilaudid---72mg 3 times daily. I will have to read the other posts. Anyone can tell me whwere they are? Should've looked for this board years ago!!

God at last i'm not nuts, I've been having those zaps for 2 years, like others dont tell doc because how would they look at you "this time". One thing though I know when they are comig because I get waves like impusles, very slow then "zap", I also get very cold waves go through my body. Dont know if this is any help, I know I'D like some answers.

This post was very interesting to me. For years now I have what these folks call ZAP's, where I see a light, twitch or at times in bed hear loud noise. But mostly twitch or see light. As some stated here this happens alot of the time as I fall asleep, but also if I am in a dark room watching TV or at the movies. The flashing of light kicks these off also, in these cases I only notice the zaps and the twitches as my eyes are focused on the movie, or driving in the car.
Not sure what all this means, I did tel the Dr about it and I did get a look of like what?? But he was cool about it.
Good luck

This is very interesting. It must be normal if so many people have this. I had this constanly when coming off of PAXIL.
NOw I get simular shocks" when trying to sleep and and just dozing off and somthing makes a noise, like my darn heater going click! I hate it. I think I have more situations like this but I cant think of it now. Maby it does have to do with neck/back injury or maby its normal?

[This message has been edited by whuteva (edited 09-28-2003).]

wow i get stuff like that too like when my boyfriend crushes a can or when i am setting my alarm or any loud unexpected noise it send a shock to my brain i am glad other people have this too i donot feel like a freak any more. or that i have a big probleme.

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christina

Hi,
I am new to this board, but was thankful to find it after this strange loud noise that woke me the other night. I'm not quite sure if its a brain zap, but it might be. It didn't actually feel like an electric surge. The noise sounded like when someone walks past one of those doorstoppers and it vibrates. Can anyone familiarize with this one? It scared me because I woke up immediately, heart pounding, and wondering what the heck happened.
Any input??
Thanks!!