:wave: I injured my back on 2-20-05 and have been in pain since then. It started out feeling like a muscle sprain, but soon started feeling like the sciatic/leg pain I'd had in 1998 for which I had an epidural. So, off to the drs, and he prescribed celebrex and skellaxin (no pain meds at all, though). So, I took that, along with alleve or motrin for a few weeks with no luck. It was then hurting more than before. I woke up one morning and was unable to move without being in excruciating pain. I called my husband to take me to the er. They did nothing but drug me and sent me back to my pcp. I begged for an MRI (and some pain meds finally), and they conceded. I had that done on 4-1-05. Reports showed disc problems, and I was sent to a neurosurgeon, whom I finally saw yesterday. I have a herniated disc at L4-5, with the one below it bulging. My surgeon said that pt and chiro would likely not work for me, but said I could try the epidural again, or opt for surgery. I chose the epidural, which I'll have on 5-4-05. So, I'm still taking celebrex and vicodin for the pain. Is there any other drugs that have proven to be more effective for my constant 24/7 back and right leg pain? I'm a work at home mother to 2 boys ages 20 months and 4 yrs. It is really hard to function some days. I'm only 32, so I'm really saddened that I'm in such a bad shape at such a young age. Any advice for me? Any words of wisdom? I called today to see if they do sedation for the injection and my nurse said they don't. Well, I want it. Should I demand it? TIA and I am so sorry to have company on this board. This back pain stuff is debilitating. :dizzy:

When I had my esi, I did not have sedation and it honestly wasn't needed. The most I felt was a little pressure in my back. If I had to have another esi, I would do it without sedation. Good luck to you.

I am sorry to hear of your recent problems. Take heart, there are people here who are younger than you and have adapted. We all know how hard it is and you will find these boards to be invaluble.

With that said, there are a lot of other drugs that you can try for pain ( ie oxy, pain patch etc) however although it is hard to it is much better to take this process slowly. You do not want to jump into hard core narcotics right off the bat, you should try everything in progression and hope that you find something lower on the ladder before you get to the hard stuff. I would also recommend that you 1) do everything you can before consenting to surgery, there really is a lot out there to try and a lot of it works for a lot of people, surgery is not 100% and is very very difficult to recover from 2) get a second oppinion, also try to get into a pain doc, they can stream line a lot of the test that you will ultimately face (disco, injections).
The best advice that I can give you at this early stage (other than get a second opinion frm a spine surgeon) is start working on yourself emotionally. Go get books on the subject ( I highly recommend why bad things happen to good people) and start to come to terms with your injury and how it is affecting your life. In my experince the emotinal turmoile is just as debilitating as the pain, eventually they will get the pain under control however you are the one that has to deal with your emotions.

I wish you the best of luck, and remember we are all here for you.

Peach

Thanks for the replies. I'm not ready to jump to surgery yet, anyway, and am hoping the esi works. The last time I had one done, they didn't use fluroscopy. I doubt they will this time, either, as it's the same hospital. Is it necessary? I am guessing no since it worked the last time. I'm really hoping for some kind of sedation. I had an epidural when I birthed my son in '03 and it was horrible. I don't know if the anesthesiologist was bad, or what, but it hurt worse than the labor itself. I begged her to just let me lay back and push the baby out at that point because it wasn't going to hurt any worse than the pain she was causing me. I was ready to push when I got the epi, btw. So, I guess I'm a little gunshy.

hi sry that u r here on this board,but glad to meet u :wave:
i would demand somthing with a esi too i have had 4 and they are not fun and ur back already hurts.be careful and mindful of ur back care.learn all u can.as far as meds i still take only vicoden and i am 4 months post-op.my surgery failed. but i dont want to increse any med til its a must.the vicoden only takes the edge off but its best i feel not to be so medicated that i am numb.it is very hard but i am adjusting to this monster in my back. :D

best wishes:tracer

:wave: Welcome Katina

are you still on a muscle relaxer?

as for having sedation for the ESI, I strongly reccomend you get it. Just because doc that your scheduled to have it done with doesn't do it you can find one who does.

along with a muscle relaxer, the regimen of meds your on is basically the norm. If your in more pain than these meds manage, by all means discuss this with your Dr. Have you tried ice? I VERY often have to use it and you can find nice cheap small thingeee's to place in your freezer and use.

sorry your having back problems at such a young age, I can only imagine how difficult this must be. Luckily my kids were grown when mine began.

glad you've found this board
and I wish you well
BW

hi sry that u r here on this board,but glad to meet u :wave:
i would demand somthing with a esi too i have had 4 and they are not fun and ur back already hurts.be careful and mindful of ur back care.learn all u can.as far as meds i still take only vicoden and i am 4 months post-op.my surgery failed. but i dont want to increse any med til its a must.the vicoden only takes the edge off but its best i feel not to be so medicated that i am numb.it is very hard but i am adjusting to this monster in my back. :D

best wishes:tracer
Bless your heart! I am sorry your surgery failed. That's awful. I called around and no one does sedation with the esi, but the nurse at my surgeon's office said she could call me in some valium. So, I guess that's what I will do. I just need something, yk?

:wave: Welcome Katina

are you still on a muscle relaxer?

as for having sedation for the ESI, I strongly reccomend you get it. Just because doc that your scheduled to have it done with doesn't do it you can find one who does.

along with a muscle relaxer, the regimen of meds your on is basically the norm. If your in more pain than these meds manage, by all means discuss this with your Dr. Have you tried ice? I VERY often have to use it and you can find nice cheap small thingeee's to place in your freezer and use.

sorry your having back problems at such a young age, I can only imagine how difficult this must be. Luckily my kids were grown when mine began.

glad you've found this board
and I wish you well
BW

i am not on any muscle relaxers now. I just took them when I felt spasms and now it's all nerve pain. I called my drs office and she said no one around here does the esi with sedation.The most they will do is call me in some vallium. So, I guess that's my only option. I have done ice some, and it does help somewhat. Thanks for the support. I'm sorry you're here, too.

Katina,

Flurooscopy is "standard" for epidural injections. If your provider is not using fluoroscopy then you should request it. This makes me worry that he is not a well trained pm specialist. When you have disc bulges/herniations determining that the solution of anesthetic and corticosteroid reaches the possibly inflammed nerve roots is absolutely mandatory. This cannot be determined by a blind epidural injection. Studies have been done that show that a high percentage of what doctors thought were "successful" epidural injections were not actually in the epidural space or the medication did not reach the target level. This chance is reduced greatly by the use of fluoroscopy.

I know that blind ESI's can work for some but it is not the accepted standard.

Ask for the fluoro or a new doc is my opinion

Good Luck

Oh,thanks for that info. I doubt they'll be using it, only because it's being done at a surgery center by an anesthesiologist, and if they don't do sedation, they probably don't do fluroscopy. I'll have to call and find out. I bet they're sick of me already. LOL

I wouldn't have it done without fluoro, but that is just my opinion. Is your doc a board certified pain specialist? I would worry that they have a regular anesthesiologist with no additional training in spine doing your epidural. That would be unfortunate as you would not be receiving the best possible chance at improvement. I have spoken to so many people who failed to get relief from epidurals and when I ask what their doctor's credentials were they aren't sure.

Many regular anesthesiologists try to dabble in performing epidurals. However, their technique is very limited and I believe this is why so many patients don't get as much benefit as they could have.

I agree, get someone who is trained in ESI, I wasen't sedated, and it wasen't that bad, they used fluroscopy as well. It was actually kinda fun to watch! I'm only 28 and have had back pain for 10 months now, I'm getting married in 5 months, so I understand your frustration at not being able to do the things you used to. Instead of working out to lose some weight for the wedding, I've been putting it on, which is so very depressing!
I am currently waiting to see a surgeon, in the meantime I'm going to massage therapy, which helps relieve all the tension I have, it also lets my mind relax which can effect your back pain too!
I wish you lots of luck, and these boards are my best friend, especially when my fiance doesn't understand..take care and best of luck!

I wouldn't have it done without fluoro, but that is just my opinion. Is your doc a board certified pain specialist? I would worry that they have a regular anesthesiologist with no additional training in spine doing your epidural. That would be unfortunate as you would not be receiving the best possible chance at improvement. I have spoken to so many people who failed to get relief from epidurals and when I ask what their doctor's credentials were they aren't sure.

Many regular anesthesiologists try to dabble in performing epidurals. However, their technique is very limited and I believe this is why so many patients don't get as much benefit as they could have.
As far as I know, he is just a neurosurgeon, not a pain specialist. The local anesthesia group at the surgery center will be doing it, for now. I just don't think my area is well versed in the newer technology, really.

:wave: I injured my back on 2-20-05 and have been in pain since then. It started out feeling like a muscle sprain, but soon started feeling like the sciatic/leg pain I'd had in 1998 for which I had an epidural. So, off to the drs, and he prescribed celebrex and skellaxin (no pain meds at all, though). So, I took that, along with alleve or motrin for a few weeks with no luck. It was then hurting more than before. I woke up one morning and was unable to move without being in excruciating pain. I called my husband to take me to the er. They did nothing but drug me and sent me back to my pcp. I begged for an MRI (and some pain meds finally), and they conceded. I had that done on 4-1-05. Reports showed disc problems, and I was sent to a neurosurgeon, whom I finally saw yesterday. I have a herniated disc at L4-5, with the one below it bulging. My surgeon said that pt and chiro would likely not work for me, but said I could try the epidural again, or opt for surgery. I chose the epidural, which I'll have on 5-4-05. So, I'm still taking celebrex and vicodin for the pain. Is there any other drugs that have proven to be more effective for my constant 24/7 back and right leg pain? I'm a work at home mother to 2 boys ages 20 months and 4 yrs. It is really hard to function some days. I'm only 32, so I'm really saddened that I'm in such a bad shape at such a young age. Any advice for me? Any words of wisdom? I called today to see if they do sedation for the injection and my nurse said they don't. Well, I want it. Should I demand it? TIA and I am so sorry to have company on this board. This back pain stuff is debilitating. :dizzy:


I have been away for a week or so, so have not had time for imput. I am the one who always jumps in with the * just say no to ESI's*. :nono:

Unless they are going to use a flouroscopy, do NOT let them touch your back with a needle. I would not let them do it anyway, but it helps some people. Since you know that it is a disc, I don't see why they are doing it as they usually use the ESI as a diagnostic tool. They could just as easily give you oral steroids, but then, they would not make the same kind of money with that method.

They are going in blind w/o the flouroscopy. Who does that? You might want to take the time to read the on line publication, The Burton Report, before you let them touch you with a needle in your spinal area. Ask to read the inserts that come with the shots. They were never meant to be used in the spinal area. There are consequences that far outweigh the temp relief that some find with the shots.

I hope that you find alternative relief and a second opinion. Surgery should always be your LAST option.

:)

Katina,

please be very careful in reviewing the Burton Report. Dr. Burton means well but has definitely adopted some "way out there" ideas. There is a post on here today that gives a little more insight into this issue.

Good Luck!

Ed

Right, I gotcha. I don't want to be pita for my dr, as he is the one who's gone to school for a long time and has the knowledge and expertise, not me. I trust him, at least right now. I have no reason not to. It's the anesthesia groups that are lacking in knowledge, I guess.

They gave me Versed (pronounced Ver-said) before my ESI and they could have honestly cut off my head and I don't think I would have even cared! But, I had to get an IV for it.

LOL, I don't think they'll do an IV, though. That's what they want to avoid, I think. I am totally fine with that, as I am already needle-phobic. :eek:

No IV? Your kidding right?

Ok, lets say he is doing that epidural and while attempting to place the epidural needle he gets a little to deep and injects his local anesthetic into the intrathecal space. This is the space that contains your spinal cord and spinal fluid. If he were to inject the local anesthetic here then you could experience severe hypotension that would be a medical emergency.

The reason IV's are started are to have IV access just in case something goes wrong. I wouldn't want to be trying to give someone IV meds to bring their pressure up without an IV. Plus, trying to start an IV on someone with severe hypotension would be quite difficult.

I am not trying to cause fear. However, I worry about docs that do these like it is no big deal. I can honestly say that I have encountered only one individual who was in this position but without that IV the outcome could have been disastrous.

Katina,

please be very careful in reviewing the Burton Report. Dr. Burton means well but has definitely adopted some "way out there" ideas. There is a post on here today that gives a little more insight into this issue.

Good Luck!

Ed


Of all of the reseach that I have done on the ESI's this report was a summation of what the general consensus is amongst doctors who are not shot factories. Once you read the information on the shots and the inserts and then ask a doctor, face to face, the truth, they usually fess up.

I guess that *way out there* is all in the mind of the beholder. This doctor has gone to great lengths to try to educate the public on the dangers of the shots. If I were you, I would do my own research on the shots, like I did. There are a million sites where they are pushed as being okay, but they are not. The bottom line is the dollar.

At no time were the shots meant to be used in the spinal area.

I was talking to a person the other day who had a injury and had gotten one shot a year until he developed the side effects. He is crippled for life.

The shots are just offered as an appeasement. If you turn them down they have to offer you an alternative. I have found that Advil and ice works just as well for inflammation and I am talking crawling to the freezer for the ice pack.

Why put something into your body that can potentially harm you more than you are now??????

Dr. Burton's findings are not accepted by the AAOS (American Academy of Orthopaedic Surgeons), (AANS) American Association of Neurological Surgeons, (IASP) International Association for the Study of Pain, (AAPM) American Academy of Pain Medicine), (AANOS) American Academy of Neurological and Orthopaedic Surgeons or the (WPS) World Pain Society.

I guess all of these very educated associations are just involved in one big conspiracy? It is also interesting that the surgical organizations don't join Dr. Burton. If ESI's were taken out of the mix, surgery numbers would grow rapidly. I wonder why they haven't joined. Most of them don't do the injections themselves so it isn't financial. Maybe, it is because the information in Burton's report is flawed?

Oh no, I started a debate.

there are many ppl out there with so called failed back surgery and they deserve better than just to be pushed aside.the problem is that fbss has become a excuse for doctors it should not be the case. many welcome ppl who question wats causeing fbss i am one of those ppl,i know there is little hope for me but the next person may have better care if ppl with fbss keep pushing this. Dr. Burton is one of many ppl who question todays standards.i welcome these questions and hope for a clear answer soon.

Katina

I am sorry to hear of your problems. I am only going to weigh in on your questions....

Before you have the ESI please check the exact creditianls of your dr, it should be performed by a board certfied PM. It should also be approached by you and the dr as a diagnostic tool. Not a cure, the information from this shot can and should help determine a more exact diagnois and treatment plan.

Flouroscopy is a MUST, if they do not do it DO NOT HAVE THE INJECTION. However if the dr is a bc PM than they will use the appropriate measures.

Now as far as sedation (and the iv issues that was posted) you do not need either. What you need to tell your dr is to use a lot of novocaine. This will cause the proceudre to take longer but if done correctly you will not feel anything but the bee stings from the novacaine and the pressure of the injection (barring any accidental nerve touches). Drs are not trying to be mean by not giving you sedation but the risks outweigh the benefits for this procedures. THe same is true with the iv, whenever you have something stuck into a vein there are numerours risks. As a society we tend to not think about that since ivs have become so commonplace. As far as the medical emergency statement, god forbid, but if something happens they can get an iv into you in a matter of minutes. So please don't worry about that.

The best advice I can give you is don't let anyone touch you until you are confident in their abilities and training. Get a good dr in the begining and this will be a much smoother process.

If you need anymore info, rather more specfic info give me a shout.

Good luck, prayers and happy thoughts

Peach

Dr. Burton's findings are not accepted by the AAOS (American Academy of Orthopaedic Surgeons), (AANS) American Association of Neurological Surgeons, (IASP) International Association for the Study of Pain, (AAPM) American Academy of Pain Medicine), (AANOS) American Academy of Neurological and Orthopaedic Surgeons or the (WPS) World Pain Society.

I guess all of these very educated associations are just involved in one big conspiracy? It is also interesting that the surgical organizations don't join Dr. Burton. If ESI's were taken out of the mix, surgery numbers would grow rapidly. I wonder why they haven't joined. Most of them don't do the injections themselves so it isn't financial. Maybe, it is because the information in Burton's report is flawed?

I would guess that, and this is just a guess, that the ones who do the surgery, would not value a person who questioned the whole process. I don't really believe that the number of surgeries would go up if the ESI's were taken out of the mix. There would just be more people like myself, who refuse the shots, who look elsewhere for relief.

My husband was offered the shot. He refused. He was going to need surgery anyway. Why add the shot to the mix? His nerve was being pressed on by a bone. No amount of ESI's was going to fix that.

I had the ESIs in my shoulder a long time ago. The doctor did it. Each and every doctor that I have seen about my back except for one, was going to do the procedure himself. The one who wasn't was a DO and did not believe in the shots. Every one of these doctors stood to gain, financially. The Neuro who offered my husband the shot was going to do it himself. Who else would have done it? The nurse? The thought of that scares me. I want no one short of a Neuro sticking anything into my back. I even refused the shots when I had my children. NO SHOTS IN MY SPINAL AREA, PLEASE :nono:

Dr. Burton has a huge following and was willing to stick his neck out. He is one of the few people who are willing to say that the earth is round, not flat. He is a pioneer.

Katina

I am sorry to hear of your problems. I am only going to weigh in on your questions....

Before you have the ESI please check the exact creditianls of your dr, it should be performed by a board certfied PM. It should also be approached by you and the dr as a diagnostic tool. Not a cure, the information from this shot can and should help determine a more exact diagnois and treatment plan.

Flouroscopy is a MUST, if they do not do it DO NOT HAVE THE INJECTION. However if the dr is a bc PM than they will use the appropriate measures.

Now as far as sedation (and the iv issues that was posted) you do not need either. What you need to tell your dr is to use a lot of novocaine. This will cause the proceudre to take longer but if done correctly you will not feel anything but the bee stings from the novacaine and the pressure of the injection (barring any accidental nerve touches). Drs are not trying to be mean by not giving you sedation but the risks outweigh the benefits for this procedures. THe same is true with the iv, whenever you have something stuck into a vein there are numerours risks. As a society we tend to not think about that since ivs have become so commonplace. As far as the medical emergency statement, god forbid, but if something happens they can get an iv into you in a matter of minutes. So please don't worry about that.

The best advice I can give you is don't let anyone touch you until you are confident in their abilities and training. Get a good dr in the begining and this will be a much smoother process.

If you need anymore info, rather more specfic info give me a shout.

Good luck, prayers and happy thoughts

Peach

He's not a pain doctor, he's a neurosurgeon. Board certified NS. Why would it not be a cure? I had one done in 1998 and it was a cure, until now. So, if I get that kind of success again, I'll say it's a good thing. I'm sure it'll flare up again, because I'm sure to bend wrong or something and hurt it again in the future. But, for now, I just want to be out of pain and avoid surgery. I know you say to look for someone with a fluroscope, so I'll do that monday. But, honestly, I don't think I'll find it around here. I just don't know what to do. :(

A board certified neurosurgeon is just as qualified to perform ESI's, so if you are comfortable with your neurosurgeon, go with him. An ESI is not always a cure because the purpose of and ESI is to relieve inflammation. If your pain is a result of inflammation because you have a herniated disc, the ESI may relieve some of the inflammation, but will do nothing for the disc. If your disc is compressing a nerve, an ESI will not help. If your pain is mainly from inflammation then an ESI may relieve your pain. I hope this clears up your question.

Well, the NS isn't doing it, an anesthesiologist is. So, I guess it the anes. that I should be concerned with, but I don't know who will be doing it. I just know I'm going to the surgery center here, but have no idea who the anes. will be. Does that make sense?

You want it done with a flourascope because of the area. You want it in the *exact* area. It is so common place these days that you are sure to find one that does it. I would drive a few hours to have it done before I would have it done without. But then, I would not have it done at all.

If the pain went away the first time and did not return until now, it is probley not a disc problem, just a torn muscle or ligament. Herniated discs don't always cause pain.

I would ask for oral steroids. They only take a week to work and meantime you can take pain meds, use ice, and take Advil.

Back pain hurts, but with time it subsides if it is not arthritis or a nerve problem. If it is either of those, steroids are only a temp fix or not a fix at all.

But, you have a herniated disc, right? Is the herniation impinging on a nerve? Ask to see the films. Get more opinions. Surgery should always be the LAST resort. I would ask for a round of oral steroids while I research my options.

I have a bulging disc that has not caused any problems at all. I have back pain, but not from that disc. The two don't always go hand in hand.

Make sure that surgery is what you really need before you go under the knife.

Yes, it's a herniated disc. Any dummy can see it on the mri films that I have here. It's totally impinging the nerve. The pain is really bad today, even after a vicodin-all the way down to my toes and my leg is weak from it. I can't get comfy at all. I'll do some calling around to see if I can find someone who does it with fluroscope, but I don't know that I'll find anyone in this area. I'm in Knoxville TN, if anyone knows someone who does it.

I can't imagine having an ESI W/O fluroscopy, seems strange to me. Next will be a discogram, the "gold standard" test, and then surgery. I've had all the tests done under sedation and it was no big deal (trust me...pain free). I had buldges L4-5-S-1 (5-6 MM each) with 40% loss of disc height b/t L4-5, both spaces showed black on the MRI. My choices were a fusion or an IDET. I had the IDET and I'm post surgery 6 months. The hardest part has been the PT, but the PT is by far the most important part of of recovery from an IDET. It's a tough and slow road, trust me.

Now for the good part....I've worked up to using the treadmill twice a day. Each time for 45 minutes. I warm up by walking for 10 minutes, then jog for 30 minutes. I finish with a 5 minute cool down. I still get sore, but I'm improving every week. As for meds, I take 200 mg celebrex in the AM, 800 ibuprofen in the afternoon (if needed) and 100 mg neurontin at bedtime (wild dreams but solid sleep). I've also been using andro-gel every morning for the last month. This has given me the energy (and strength) to improve the most. Amazing stuff, although it's not for women. I'm almost 50 and I feel 25...Listen up guys.... ;)

I think you have already gotten a lot of info but I thought I would check in anyway. If the MRI shows that the disc is impinging a nerve than the ESI may relive some symptoms but more than likely that will be it. You said that you had and ESI prev that worked? Perhaps your back condition has worsened, I can't really say. If you really want to avoid surg. then I would suggest PT. If the bulge is minor you may be able to strengthen your back muslces to the point that they take pressure off of the disc and relive the pinch. It is worth a try.

Don't worry about the ESI, if it is a good center than it will be a dr that is experinced. But if you get there and for any reason something seems wrong to you don't be scared to tell them that you want to do more research and come back. It is always your choice to consent to treatment, if you are uncomfortable for any reason just tell them to reschedule for a later time.

I really hope that you feel like you are getting a lot of good information here. I know that it can be overwhelming sometimes with all the responses. Keep your chin up and give your family really big hugs!

I think you have already gotten a lot of info but I thought I would check in anyway. If the MRI shows that the disc is impinging a nerve than the ESI may relive some symptoms but more than likely that will be it. You said that you had and ESI prev that worked? Perhaps your back condition has worsened, I can't really say. If you really want to avoid surg. then I would suggest PT. If the bulge is minor you may be able to strengthen your back muslces to the point that they take pressure off of the disc and relive the pinch. It is worth a try.

Don't worry about the ESI, if it is a good center than it will be a dr that is experinced. But if you get there and for any reason something seems wrong to you don't be scared to tell them that you want to do more research and come back. It is always your choice to consent to treatment, if you are uncomfortable for any reason just tell them to reschedule for a later time.

I really hope that you feel like you are getting a lot of good information here. I know that it can be overwhelming sometimes with all the responses. Keep your chin up and give your family really big hugs!

Thanks Peach. The disc is herniated and is spilling its contents onto my nerves and spinal column. I am sure my back problem now is much worse than last time, just judging the symptoms. I never had an MRI back then, so I am not sure exactly what it was, but I am guessing it was bulging then, and has now herniated. Basically, the way I understood the surgeon, he thinks the esi will give me enough pain relief to allow for the disc material to dissolve itself if it is going to. That's the purpose of the esi for me. I am open to PT, but I did PT in 1998 for 3 months before I had the ESI, and it didn't work then. So, I'm skeptical. Also, it would likely require me to go to PT 3x a week and I don't have the financial capabilities to do it that often-1x a week, but not 3x. The surgeon didn't think PT would work, but said he'd write the orders if I wanted to try it. I trust his judgement in that he doesn't think it will work. I guess what he sees on the MRI is making him doubt its effectiveness. :confused: I am finding out lots of info here. It's a great site! I'm thankful for all your responses and most of all, a friend to talk to. :)

Thanks Peach. The disc is herniated and is spilling its contents onto my nerves and spinal column. I am sure my back problem now is much worse than last time, just judging the symptoms. I never had an MRI back then, so I am not sure exactly what it was, but I am guessing it was bulging then, and has now herniated. Basically, the way I understood the surgeon, he thinks the esi will give me enough pain relief to allow for the disc material to dissolve itself if it is going to. That's the purpose of the esi for me. I am open to PT, but I did PT in 1998 for 3 months before I had the ESI, and it didn't work then. So, I'm skeptical. Also, it would likely require me to go to PT 3x a week and I don't have the financial capabilities to do it that often-1x a week, but not 3x. The surgeon didn't think PT would work, but said he'd write the orders if I wanted to try it. I trust his judgement in that he doesn't think it will work. I guess what he sees on the MRI is making him doubt its effectiveness. :confused: I am finding out lots of info here. It's a great site! I'm thankful for all your responses and most of all, a friend to talk to. :)

If the herniation is spilling onto a nerve, then isn't that a tear? That would be what would be causing the pain. But you don't mention a tear. Again, once the cut, they cut. There is always that chance of FBSS, scar tissue, or still pai, just a different pain, so weigh your options carefully.

I have never heard of the disc material disolving itself. I would opt for the PT. Have you had an EMG yet?

If the herniation is spilling onto a nerve, then isn't that a tear? That would be what would be causing the pain. But you don't mention a tear. Again, once the cut, they cut. There is always that chance of FBSS, scar tissue, or still pai, just a different pain, so weigh your options carefully.

I have never heard of the disc material disolving itself. I would opt for the PT. Have you had an EMG yet?
He made no mention of a tear, just said it was herniated. I'm not saying I'm going to have surgery tomorrow. I'm having an epidural done first. I'm not rushing into this, believe me. I'm such a big chicken, that it would take a LOT to push me into surgery.

There is always that chance of FBSS, scar tissue, or still pai, just a different pain, so weigh your options carefully.
Sorry, I have no idea what those conditions are, so it's greek to me. I haven't had an emg yet, don't even know what that is either.

He made no mention of a tear, just said it was herniated. I'm not saying I'm going to have surgery tomorrow. I'm having an epidural done first. I'm not rushing into this, believe me. I'm such a big chicken, that it would take a LOT to push me into surgery.


Sorry, I have no idea what those conditions are, so it's greek to me. I haven't had an emg yet, don't even know what that is either.


FBSS: Failed back surgery

Tear, when the fluid, which is much like battery acid leaks out into the tissues and onto the nerve.

EMG: a test that the Neuro does to prove that there is a problem with a nerve. Even if the MRI or CT scans show it, they re-affirm it with an EMG.

I just posted some information on the ESI's. You might want to read it. Scary stuff.

more on my idet: i had tears on both L-4,5 and L-5,S-1, 180 degrees on both. I'm doing fine and think the tears were sealed....