Hi I have come here hoping that someone can please give me some advice. My 21 month old daughter has ALWAYS hated going to bed at night. I have tried everything known to man to try and get her to go to sleep peacefully at night and NOTHING has worked so far. Most nights she will cry and scream for anywhere between 30 minutes up to a few hours. Occasionally she would get that upset that she would vomit. I always go into the room to check on her and give her reassurance that I am there and she does calm down, but then as soon as I leave the room she starts back up again. Anyway for about the last month or so, the vomiting seems to be happening more often and on Sunday night I heard her gagging and walked into the room and caught her with her fingers in her mouth trying to make herself vomit :eek: This happened 4 times in one night. I had to change all the linen in her cot including quilt, pillow, sheets, pjs 4 times. Monday night she did cry herself to sleep after crying for about 30 minutes and I think the only reason I had a good night that night is because she was exhausted from the night before and I also didnt give her nap during the day. Then last night we went through our normal routine of dinner, bath, pjs, then bed. As I was walking into her room with her in my arms she started putting her fingers down her throat before I even got her into the cot :( I put her into bed with her screaming her head off and she was still trying to make herself vomit. The only way I managed to get her to sleep was by sitting on the floor by the side of the cot in the dark. I am too afraid to leave her alone now because I know she is trying to make herself sick. I have never ever heard of a child so young doing something like this and I just dont know what to do. I took her to the doctor and he says its nothing physical and that she is doing it for attention. Anyway I am hoping that maybe I can find someone who has gone through a similar thing and if anyone can give me any advice on how to deal with this. I also have an 8 month old son so this is very difficult. PLEASE HELP !

Hi there, im sorry about whats happening...

I have to tell you that there is an underlying issue going on with her, im very serious because ive had an eating disorder for most of my life, even through 3 kids.. aged 11,4 and 6 weeks.....

it would be a very smart idea to talk to your doc and maybe to a cousellor... as silly as this masy sound, even at her age (god bless her) something is upsetting her...

I wish i could explain this but please talk to your doc or a cousellor, i want to keep in touch with you..

I started at 5 years, vomiting....

I had problems with my father, emotional and verbal abuse, im 33 now and am still struggling.. my hreart goes out to you and your daughter... i will pray for you, is it ok that we keep in touch through these threads?

sincerely, Angela

i forgot to mention that im appauled that you doc said its just for attention, for him to push it under a rug so to speak is ridiculous... Trust me this is more than just attention....

I am just a little suprised that she would be doing something like this at such a young age?How in the heck would she even connect that putting your fingers down her throat would make her vomit?Is it at all possible that she could have actually seen someone do this at one time or another?If she thought of this on her own at that age, i agree that she should probably be looked at by a doc who knows about these kinds of things.i am just not too sure what kind of doc that would be.i wish i could be of more help to you.please keep us posted on her.Marcia

Hi and thanks for the replies. I have actually booked an appt with our family doctor who we have been seeing for years as I know he wont just fob me off. Feelbad, no she has never ever seen anything like that in her life. I have actually been thinking about it and what happened was she had tonsilitis about a month ago and at the time she was putting her hands in her mouth ( her way of telling me that she had a sore throat )Im wondering if it is tied in somehow as its been since she had the tonsilitis that she has been vomiting more. Before that it had only happened VERY occasionally. Maybe a hand full of times in her whole small life. The doctor I took her to the other day ( around the corner from where we live ) had a look at her throat and said there was no sign of tonsilits , so I guess that rules out why she would be putting her fingers in her mouth. But maybe when she had the tonsilits and WAS putting her fingers in her mouth it made her sick and that could be how she has put 2 and 2 together if you know what I mean. She just doesnt seem the same and is very very demanding right now. I know its normal for a toddler, but she use to be such a happy little girl and now she has turned into an unhappy little girl :( Extremely clingy etc. Its definately not because of any outside influences as I never ever get my babies looked after. We also rarely go out as its quite difficult at the moment having the 2 of them. When I say go out I mean go out to other peoples homes. We go out everyday to the supermarket etc. The only people that come to my home are my mother about once a month, my father about once or twice a fortnight and he normally only stays for an hour or so and my oldest son about once or twice a week for a fleeting visit. My children are never ever left alone with anybody. So I know its not because she is being abused or hurt. I just cant help but feel it is some kind of medical reason. Anyway hopefully our family doctor will be able to set the wheels in motion for finding out exactly what the problem is. She is also VERY finicky with her eating. She had really bad reflux and colic for about the first 6 months of her life, so I wonder if its anything to do with that :confused: Some babies that have bad reflux end with permanant damage in their osophogas (spelling sorry ) so it could even be because of that. But because she only seems to be doing it when I put her to bed at night, tells me she has worked out if she makes herself ill she gets to get out of bed ( even if it is only briefly ).Like I mentioned earlier she has always hated going to bed. I just hope I can find out what is wrong with her. I want my baby girl back that use to be so happy. The way things are at the moment everyone in the house is being neglected because she is just so demanding at right now. Anyway again thanks for the replies and I will keep you updated on the situation.

The Ferber "Cry it out book" says that babies may make themselves throw up when crying it out. Sounds like she found that she can choke herself when sticking her fingers in her mouth when she had tonsilitis. I really think she is getting you to come in when she doesen't want to go to bed by doing this. I am a huge NON advocate of crying it out and this would be one of the reasons why. You have no control as a parent. The only way you can get your child to sleep, is by having them cry themselves into exhaustion. She sounds like she really has been tormented by this whole bed thing. I am sure you thought you were doing the right thing so I am not trying to put you down. I think she really needs to learn that bedtime is not a scary time. I would lay with her when you put her to bed until she falls asleep. Do this until she is old enough to talk to her about sleeping on her own. She may be 5 but at least you are not putting her through this. How terrible to feel like you have to throw up, to get out of bed at night. My son is 21 months and sleeps better than any other baby I know. That's becasue every other baby we know had been left to cry it out. I have never let him cry it out. He goes to bed easily and sleeps the entire night without waking. No offense to those who CIO and it seemed to work for them.

Good luck - sounds like you are having a hard time I hope it gets better.

Hi Rouge and I appreciate your reply. Believe it or not I totally agree with you !!! But having the 2 babies sometimes I have been left with no other alternative but to let her cry. I never ever leave her crying for a long extended time. She is still in a crib ( cot ) so the last 2 nights I have sat on the floor by the side of her cot. When she was a younger baby I use to try and nurse her ( rock her ) in my arms. But she would never ever settle :( She use to think it was play time. I just feel terrible :( So do you still have to lay down with your son to get him to sleep or does he just go to sleep on his own now ?? Believe me I am quite happy to sit on the floor next to her bed to help her go to sleep, but obviously having an 8 month old as well I wouldnt be able to do it for hours at a time. I will keep on doing what I am doing ie sitting on the floor and hope that helps. The real test will be on a day that she has had a nap in the afternoon. Thats normally when I find she has a REALLY bad night and just DOES NOT want to go to sleep at night no matter what time I put her to bed. But in saying that I know she still needs a nap during the day as if she doesnt she is EXTREMELY grumpy from about 4 pm until bedtime. Again thanks for your reply.

I imagine it must be hard to have an 8 month old with a toddler. :eek: I used to rock my DS to sleep but he started getting really squirmy about it, so I layed him in the crib one day and just left the room. He fell asleep in a few minutes without a peep. Now, I just tell him it is bedtime about 5 minutes before we go in. I stand and cuddle with him next to the crib for a minute or so, and then lay him down and leave. Sometimes he talks or sings himself to sleep sometimes he goes right to sleep. I have a white noise machine in there with him and also a lullaby cd playing.

He also takes a 3 hour nap everyday!! He never misses a nap. I do rock him to sleep for his nap which can take up to an hour and a half on a bad day. I do not give up though. I think naps are very important. He naps from 1:00 until 4:00 and goes to bed at 9:00. He does not seem tired at all when it is bedtime, but he pretty much goes right to sleep when I put him in his crib. I have read that kids need naps until they are 4-5 years old. I think enforcing naps will really help you out.

It sounds to me like she is a little overtired from not napping and this is causing her to become overstimulated a bit. It seems like the opposite is happening but I think it would change after consistant naps. Also, when she does nap you may want to put her down a little later at night? What time do you put her down now? If you put them down too late they get overstimulated and have a hard time falling asleep. It's all so complicated lol. :p I have found that putting my DS down for the night 5-6 hours after he wakes from his nap works the best for us.

It 's great that you sit by the crib with your DD. I can see that being very complicated with a baby also. BTW how is your 8 mo sleeping? I found that the best age to develop good sleep habits is at 8 months. If they are establised at that age, more than likely you will not have to go through the toddler sleep problems. They are old enough to "get it" but still young enough to shape them them without as much hassle.

Good luck!! I feel like I have the sleep thing down, it's the disapline thing I need help with. ;) DS is hitting other kids, me and the dog. Grrr. The screaming thing is also really fun. :eek: Some say 3 is worse than 2, I just cannot beleive that!!

Take care - I hope things get better for you all. :angel:

My DS naps by himself during the day. I just lay him in his crib and play is lullaby and he falls asleep. I do the same at night and yet he if he wakes up in the middle of the night he is not able to fall asleep till i go to him. I give him little water and sit by his crib for sometime but he takes a long time to fall asleep. He does that every alternate day. I wonder why he sleeps well one night and not the other even though we have done the same things on both days :(

I am sure its hard with a 8 month old and a toddler. Do you think she feels insecure or left out since the new baby came along?

I was also thinking about this the other day. And Nicki mentioned it also. Do you think that she is having problems with the baby and being jealous? You said you have a hard time sitting with her to fall asleep cuz of your 8 month old. Does your 8 month old go to bed after your toddler? Your toddler may be really upset by this. Like why does she get to stay up and I have to go to bed. I would think an 8 mo old would go to bed around 7 or 7:30 and a toddler at 8 or 9. That would also give you the freedom to help out your toddler without having to worry about the baby. I hope things are getting better for you. :angel:

Hi again, I actually have my son in an excellent routine 99.9% of the time. He is an absolute angel to go to bed and its normally around 7 pm. He goes off to sleep without a peep out of him all night :) Occasionally he will wake during the night, but this is rare and normally because he has been woken by Haley crying :( I do sometimes have the odd night where he hasnt gone to bed with his routine, but thats only if we have been out that day or for some other reason our routine has been put out of wack. So its definately not a jeolousy thing with Haley. In regards to attention, the way things have been the past month or two she is getting the majority of the attention to the point that I am feeling EXTREMELY guilty about my son :( I feel like I cant win sometimes. I actually took Haley to our family doctor today and she had to have a chest xray done and I am trying to get out urine sample out of her, not an easy task believe me. I explained everything that has been going on to him and he seems to think she may still be suffering from reflux. She had chronic reflux as a young baby. Anyway with chronic reflux apparantly the acid can overflow into the lungs which make a great breeding ground for bugs , so that could be why she has seemed to be constantly sick the past 6 months. He has assured me if the tests comes back clear that he wont fob me off and will refer me to a paediatrician. He also thinks that the reason she could be making herself sick is because of the reflux. He says it probably makes her feel better afterwards. Well at least I know I wont be fobbed off telling me she has a virus. That is al lI have been told each time I have taken her to the doctor over the past 6 months. I just want my baby girl happy and healthy again. In regards to going to bed at night, I had to lie on the cold hard floor for an hour last night, and even then she was STILL awake, I snuck out of the room and she did realise after a few minutes and started to act like she was going to start screaching, but she did go off to sleep thankfully. Tonight she went off to sleep without a problem, but she didnt get to have her nap today with having to have all the tests etc, so she was probably tired. We actually had a really good day today and she seemed much more like her old self. Im sure its because of not being exhausted. You are right Rouge, Im sure it must have been very exhausting for her the way things were before and the last 3 nights of me staying in the room with her, so she doesnt cry herself to sleep must be having some kind of benefit on the way she is feeling :angel: Dont know so much about my back LOL I could hardly move after an hour on the deck :) Anyway I must go to bed, its almost midnight here and I am exhausted. Will keep you updated on everything and thanks again for the replies :)
P.S Rouge I noticed you started a thread October mommies 03, I was actually on that thread in the pregnancy boards when I was pregnant with Haley except I had a different name then. It was mysurprisebaby :)