Hi everyone,

I know I have posted a lot today, but... I need some advice or stories or help. I went to my parents today. We had a good talk about their POAs and Living Wills. I think I have them talked into letting a lawyer do their POAs, just need to keep after them and not let my dad forget. He really wants to do it and correctly!

My mom thinks they can do a living will, without the lawyer. She has copies of ones that their normal hospital gives them everytime they go in for a procedure or operation. It has the name of the hospital at the top and is only 2 pages long. She wants to use that form and get her own witnessess and make copies and hand them to us and dr. She did not know she at least had to do all of this, if that is enuf! She wants to cut off the name of the hospital, so it could be used elsewhere.

I talked to our (my DH & mine) lawyer today. I asked ?s for my parents. And they can call him and ask more ?s. The secretary said, that the lawyers forms (there are 2 for health), are statuatory and made according to the State laws of Texas. I think my moms copies are just made by the hospital for if you want one right before a procedure or operation.

Ok, I could go on and on. Can anyone give me some clarification on this subject? I realize we are in different states, but I know a lot of the things apply to most states. I sometimes hear that if the living will is not done perfectly, by the law, that drs. and hospitals will sometimes choose not to honor them! I know I talked with some of yall about this before, but I could not remember if it was the living will or the POA?!

Thanks for all that reply. Yall take care. Wannabe

Okay this is how it works in Nevada. In order for you to have a living will here it need to be drawn up by a lawyer and most health facilities prefer for it to be a recorded document. My fathers living will stated in plain english exactly what they did, and did not want. I would really suggest that you sit down with your parents again and talk to them and ask exactly who, when, where, how much, how little, any special circumstances, and ensure that you have a executor. If mom is still able to do this then its reasonable he should be hers and she should be his. If you are the only child then your name can also be added as a coexecutor if need be. If you have siblings be very careful that they are all told clearly and up front of all the arrangements, the last thing that you will want at that time is a family fued. Trust me on that one.
The paper that your mom signs is a legal document that covers the hospital not your parent. It basically lets them know that while you are in there care if something happens they have the authority to act or not act.
I would strongly suggest whether or not your state requires it to be a recorded document that you do record it with the state, also having a co executor after mom or dad is a smart move, if something happens to their life partner you really dont know what effect that is going to have on them. For example when we discovered that my mom had non operatable cancer, was comotose and the doctors needed to know what we wanted done, my father had a nervous breakdown. Thankfully we had talk about this a few months prior, I knew what my mother wanted and didn't want and my father was still able to state in front of them that they were to follow all my directives in his place.

If you have any other question feel free to ask.

Casey

Hi carat414,

Thanks for the advice and info. I am sure I will have more ?s in the future!

Do you record at the county courthouse or where? I guess I could ask my lawyer.

It is my dad that has alzheimers. I think we would put me 1st on my mom and my sister 2nd. On my dad, we would of course put my mom 1st and me second. I am the closest daughter, in hrs. and my sister does not care. We trust each others. It is my mom that does not trust anyone!!!

So in your opinion, my mom should either use the hospitals and the lawyers or just the lawyers forms? What if they are in another town when something happens or needs done? They would not go to that hospital (the one whos name is on the form).

Did you do this with a relative (POA and/or Living Will)? How did you handle the getting them to go and the actual lawyer visit/signing? Was everything fine - assuming that you did go thru this. I also have to make sure that my dad goes on a good day and a good time of day. So there would be no ? of his mental ability to know what he was doing. I think he is ok. But there is always that need to hurry with and alzheimers person. You never know when they will digress!

Thanks again. Wannabe

Here you go to the county courthouse, recorders office. I would assume it would be the same there. Your lawyer would know for sure.

If mom has one drawn up by a lawyer and it is recorded as a legal document every hospital in that county has to by law abide by it. Other counties can argue it, but its highly doubtful they would in a situation such as that, but they may have the patient or the power of attorney executor fill out one of their company forms for additional insurance. Hospital are really finicky with paperwork.

I unfortunate have been the durable power of attorney for 6 relatives, four within the past 18 months, and current am for my terminally ill brother. I also have been the executor of their living and estate wills.

My brother and I went together before he became to impaired and we argued, debated and discussed every single detail. I am just the inforcer in his case, if and when the time comes that I need to step in against doctors advice to make sure what he wanted is done. He made all of his own decisions. A few of his decisions are not of the norm, so in his case we hired two seperate lawyers but from the same firm, one handled the power of attorney, financial and estate issues, and the other handled the medical and moral issues. This was to ensure that no one was acting out of malice or with intent. My children are the sole benificiaries, with me as the guardian, so it makes it more solid.

My father was the original executor for my mother, I was not mentioned, so when he literally fell apart in front of the doctors, he stated that he verbally transferred executor to me since I was aware of my moms end of life wishes. For my father, he was by this time mentally aware so long as he was within my home and around me. He couldnt handle outside stimulation.
I did all the arrangements on my fathers behalf, I would talk to him to make sure that he felt comfortable with them, but we had previously discussed all this at the same time as my mother. Then when the actually papers needed to be signed I paid a pretty large amount to have his lawyer, secretary, and two witnesses come to my house where they read and discussed his POA and living will to ensure he agreed to what it said. My parents wishes were fairly common and raised no real moral issues.

And yes, you will need to go on a good day with dad. It might be helpful if you were to try and do similiar as I did. Have your parents, and you meet with the lawyer, have dad give just general information as into what his wishes are, but that you and your mother will handle the tweaking (so to say) of the wording. You can then go home discuss and hash out what he wants during his good times, outside of the ear of the lawyer. Then on a separate date a couple weeks later he can go and read the will and sign it. So long as his behavior is similiar during both visits and he agrees to the wording and he signs I dont see a problem. This way his mind is not stressing on the details in front of a lawyer causing a question of his mental ability.

Casey

Hi Wannabe,

In Virginia, the downloadable Living Will is fine, with 2 witnesses (best if not relatives; Mom had ladies at her bank be the witnesses) to the signature and it has to be notarized. My mother and aunt used this, then had the originals put in their safety deposit boxes and mailed copies to all of the relatives and to their doctors. This form did not need to be registered with the county. The ALF kept a copy with Mom's records as did the nursing home.

Again, in VA, the Durable Power of Attorney is drawn up by a lawyer and they do ask questions to make sure the person knows what they are signing. This legally enables you to act for the parent in business, legal, financial, and health matters. It does have to be registered at the courthouse and the financial institutions (investments) will need a certified copy (supplied by the court for a fee and you can request as many as you need) before allowing you to conduct business.

Each parent will need an individual Living Will and Durable Power of Attorney.

Perhaps an eldercare lawyer would be most helpful to you so you know you have been thorough and taken care of every eventuality.

As you said, time is critical.

Wishing you well - Barbara

Hi Ladies,

Thanks for your advice and help. I will print these. I have printed past advice on the same subject and reread it a lot. It helps make things clear in my mind.

Does the Living Will on the internet cost $ ? If so, we would be just as well off, using the lawyers copies. My mom said that they were just too long and she could not read and understand it all. I told her I would read it to her and explain, as we went along. I think she is just using this as an excuse, to put it off. It really upsets her to talk about it. I guess, she could see these papers as a sign that my dad is really going to get worse?!

My sister has offered to come back down here for 2 - 3 days. She would help prod them along and help explain things to them. It would help if she went to the lawyers with us. My husband might go too. He is the one that knows the secretary and lawyer the most. That might sway them to say he is competent. Which, I still believe he is (except at his very very worst).

Do you think it might sway the lawyer (about competency) if they were not clean and neat? (meaning the wrong way) I guess I can tell them the day before that they have to have baths that day, and brush their teeth and to wear semi-good clothes?!

Thanks again Ladies. Wannabe

Hi again,

I wanted to tell you that you can tell your mother this legal stuff is just part of making her estate safer from taxes. Amazingly, my mother took herself to a lawyer to get the POA perpared in 1988 - more than 10 years before I needed to step in and help. It's not giving her possessions or choices away. It's preparing you to take on the responsibility if she cannot do it for herself due to illness or injury. It may never be needed, but it's important to have ready just in case. Like my mother did, bless her.

I don't know if the on-line forms cost anything.

Hope all goes well - Barbara