notpain
09-20-2005, 08:47 PM
I know I have NOT tried it all (But I have tried many modalities and have a lot to share). I am doing everything I can to avoid fusion surgery - too many horror stories (although there are successes as well). I have a 3 level problem and my fingers are crossed while I continue to educate myself to the options. Suffering is not my cup of tea (I'm a pain wuss!), but I'm willing to fight it out a bit longer to hopefully avoid full blown fusion or at least wait until artificial cervical discs are fully approved. Unfortunately for most we can not find easy access to many of the treatment modalities available.
Here is a link of possible neck/cervical treatment modalities (More than 30 at the time of this writing - many of which you may have never heard of!) including information about artificial discs:
http://www.healthsynergyrx.com/neck-pain.htm
Preapproved by moderator1
This list includes mainstream and alternative options. If you have a good or bad experience with any of these treatments please feel free to comment. This list is growing each day (with the hopes of helping people who think they have tried it all see more options). Perhaps some of these options you can talk with your own physician about. Feel free to add to the list anything that is not on the list so everyone can find out more easily what they may want to consider.
Caveat: While this list is large and growing it is NOT intended to be a list of "for sure" cures. This list should instill hope for those who think surgery is the only option (Make it your last option). These are treatment modalities only. Who knows what will truly work. But don't give up until you have at least read them over and considered many options that may work for you. For example: I have been to 3 different Chiropractors all specializing in different treatments within the modality and for me it has not offered me any relief... so I am moving on. And I gave it plenty of time to work over the course of the year - I actually think the last visit injured me more than before I started seeing that particular Chiro.
My next step is to see a Physical Therapist that specializes in Balance Issues followed by another Physical Therapist that specializes in Spinal Problems of the Neck. My old PT was a nice person but was very general in her approach to my condition. Once I have completed evaluations from these PT's I have an appointment back with my Physiatrist to discuss referall to a Orthopedic surgeon, the possibility of a proceedure to heat the disc with lasor or radiofrequency or? to shrink the offending disc (If we can figure out the real culprit) and the possibility of endoscopic surgery to just cut off the offending portion of the disc or disc material that may not have resorbed after a year. I'm probably up against another MRI to compare to see if my condition is really worse or if it's just worse symptoms. I have hope that at least one of my discs may have resorbed (resorption?). I am also under the guidence of a nutritional doctor eating only particular foods that should help my condition. There is nothing easy about this process - it's very slow and frustrating. But the best option I have for now is to keep learning and keep trying - the knife will always be there! And I know endoscopic surgery is still surgery (I've already had 2 outpatient proceedures) but it's better than fusion for now.
So please participate so that others may learn from your experiences, but if you are early on in your recovery process at least give this a read and maybe you will find some help.
Remember the most important part of Treatment is an ACCURATE DIAGNOSIS, and that is pretty tough with neck problems - at least for me. So keep trying and keep sharing.
Thanks
Here is a link of possible neck/cervical treatment modalities (More than 30 at the time of this writing - many of which you may have never heard of!) including information about artificial discs:
http://www.healthsynergyrx.com/neck-pain.htm
Preapproved by moderator1
This list includes mainstream and alternative options. If you have a good or bad experience with any of these treatments please feel free to comment. This list is growing each day (with the hopes of helping people who think they have tried it all see more options). Perhaps some of these options you can talk with your own physician about. Feel free to add to the list anything that is not on the list so everyone can find out more easily what they may want to consider.
Caveat: While this list is large and growing it is NOT intended to be a list of "for sure" cures. This list should instill hope for those who think surgery is the only option (Make it your last option). These are treatment modalities only. Who knows what will truly work. But don't give up until you have at least read them over and considered many options that may work for you. For example: I have been to 3 different Chiropractors all specializing in different treatments within the modality and for me it has not offered me any relief... so I am moving on. And I gave it plenty of time to work over the course of the year - I actually think the last visit injured me more than before I started seeing that particular Chiro.
My next step is to see a Physical Therapist that specializes in Balance Issues followed by another Physical Therapist that specializes in Spinal Problems of the Neck. My old PT was a nice person but was very general in her approach to my condition. Once I have completed evaluations from these PT's I have an appointment back with my Physiatrist to discuss referall to a Orthopedic surgeon, the possibility of a proceedure to heat the disc with lasor or radiofrequency or? to shrink the offending disc (If we can figure out the real culprit) and the possibility of endoscopic surgery to just cut off the offending portion of the disc or disc material that may not have resorbed after a year. I'm probably up against another MRI to compare to see if my condition is really worse or if it's just worse symptoms. I have hope that at least one of my discs may have resorbed (resorption?). I am also under the guidence of a nutritional doctor eating only particular foods that should help my condition. There is nothing easy about this process - it's very slow and frustrating. But the best option I have for now is to keep learning and keep trying - the knife will always be there! And I know endoscopic surgery is still surgery (I've already had 2 outpatient proceedures) but it's better than fusion for now.
So please participate so that others may learn from your experiences, but if you are early on in your recovery process at least give this a read and maybe you will find some help.
Remember the most important part of Treatment is an ACCURATE DIAGNOSIS, and that is pretty tough with neck problems - at least for me. So keep trying and keep sharing.
Thanks
Sponsor
hugo eve
09-20-2005, 09:03 PM
"This list includes mainstream and alternative options. If you have a good or bad experience with any of these treatments please feel free to comment."
Hi there. I had a pneumatic collar that I had sent over from China that was very affective in alleviating the pain and enabled the discs to plump themselves up. It has a hand pump but no meter so one has to careful in not hanging oneself! I've heard of a pulley system hanging from a door top attached to collar can give some relief but sounds as tho it could be dangerous... yep, need to lock the door <ouch,grin>
Hugo
Hi there. I had a pneumatic collar that I had sent over from China that was very affective in alleviating the pain and enabled the discs to plump themselves up. It has a hand pump but no meter so one has to careful in not hanging oneself! I've heard of a pulley system hanging from a door top attached to collar can give some relief but sounds as tho it could be dangerous... yep, need to lock the door <ouch,grin>
Hugo
notpain
09-20-2005, 10:27 PM
pronex is a pneumatic cervical traction device that you use while lying on your back. I have one. It has not helped me to date, I also have the over the door neck pro ratcheting kind. Many swear by these devices so I know they help some. The Pronex is available in the USA from a company in montana called Glacier Cross, Inc. This is a fairly well known device among the PT community (Although mine never mentioned traction to me). They are around $300. Some of the other pneumatic collars I've seen (Japan/China) are worn while standing which may or may not be better but worth checking out. The Neck Pro over the door device uses a velcro strap so it's fairly easy to release. I think the water bottle kind are scarey. The nice thing about the Pronex is you are lying down and you pump it with a bulb so you can easily control the amount of pressure and can get out easy if you start to feel ill. The main problem with these devices is you need to be taught how much pressure to apply by someone who knows. Thanks
dennisgb
09-22-2005, 11:31 AM
I used the water bag over the door type, and it never gave me any relief at all.
It was strange, because the traction at the Chiro worked!
Maybe I was using it wrong...
It was strange, because the traction at the Chiro worked!
Maybe I was using it wrong...
dmaloy
09-23-2005, 06:21 AM
Hi, just found this site and I'm glad I did. I have had a c5-6 problem for a year now and I have been to PT for over 6 months I have a pneumatic cervical traction device and it doesn't help I also have a electric pluse device also that feels good while using it but it doesn't really do anything for my pain. I have taken all kinds of pain meds and my surgen has been wanting me to have the surgery all along, I'm afraid to have the surgery. Last month when I got a refill of my pain meds there was a message on it that I needed to see a pain doctor so I went to my surgens office about the message on my meds bottle and what they told me is that the doctor will no longer give me pain meds if I won't have the fuson. So to day I went and saw the pain specialest and what he did is put me on different meds, which have nothing to do with pain, and he wants me to have a stariod shot in my neck that they do in day surgery, which I had asked me surgen about and he said no they don't work have the surgery. So now I am really confussed. My husband has been really good about this past year as I'm not working and on disability but it doesn't pay much, and he wants me to have the surgery but reading about the out come I'm so sure. Seems like everyone ends up having more surgeries and or pain still.
Please help I don't know what to do.
Please help I don't know what to do.
hugo eve
09-23-2005, 06:40 AM
Yo D.
Go for it. Single fusion is a walk in the park and puts very little strain on the rest of the discs. You will be kicking yourself a few weeks after for not doing it sooner. Put it another way the body will eventually fuse the two vertebra together anyway but you will still have the pain so, hey, use modern technology to enjoy life. You will be sweet by Christmas... what a gift.
Hugz.
Go for it. Single fusion is a walk in the park and puts very little strain on the rest of the discs. You will be kicking yourself a few weeks after for not doing it sooner. Put it another way the body will eventually fuse the two vertebra together anyway but you will still have the pain so, hey, use modern technology to enjoy life. You will be sweet by Christmas... what a gift.
Hugz.
rob_zzz
09-23-2005, 07:18 AM
dmaloy,
I haven't had neck surgery (haven't needed it so far) but have been following this board for a bit over a year and there are a lot of people that come on here, have surgery then you don't really hear from them after a few months after surgery because they've gotten on with their lives because the surgery has worked for them. There are others that have ongoing problems after the surgery.
There are definitely risks with the surgery and the most important thing is to be absolutely sure that you have a very good and experienced spinal surgeon that has good results - so do your research on the surgeon before getting surgery. A good surgeon will know the right type of surgery for your situation, will do a good clinical analysis to make absolutely sure that your symptoms correspond to the radiology and the intended surgery and will (luck permitting) perform a good surgery.
Also if you have surgery make sure you are prepared for the recovery part and are very careful in the first weeks and months following the surgery (and that everyone around you understands the importance of this and supports you).
Rob
I haven't had neck surgery (haven't needed it so far) but have been following this board for a bit over a year and there are a lot of people that come on here, have surgery then you don't really hear from them after a few months after surgery because they've gotten on with their lives because the surgery has worked for them. There are others that have ongoing problems after the surgery.
There are definitely risks with the surgery and the most important thing is to be absolutely sure that you have a very good and experienced spinal surgeon that has good results - so do your research on the surgeon before getting surgery. A good surgeon will know the right type of surgery for your situation, will do a good clinical analysis to make absolutely sure that your symptoms correspond to the radiology and the intended surgery and will (luck permitting) perform a good surgery.
Also if you have surgery make sure you are prepared for the recovery part and are very careful in the first weeks and months following the surgery (and that everyone around you understands the importance of this and supports you).
Rob
notpain
09-23-2005, 02:23 PM
If you only need a single level fusion you are probably a candidate for the PCM disc which is in clinical trials. The Prestige Disc has been used for 11 years in Europe. If it were me (It's not) I'd consider discussing a couple of things with your doctor first:
Minimally invasive outpatient proceedure like:
Percutaneous Discectomy
There are a couple of different treatments with a couple of different names where they enter the disc with a needle. They can then make chanels in the disc to remove material and release water content (discs have fat in them too) and possible some of the fat content. I'm not exactly sure how it works. Another uses a laser light to remove the fluid. Yet another places a wire in the disc and heats it to 90 degrees Centigrade. The whole purpose of all these proceedure is to shrink the disc material so it will get sucked back into place moving the herniation or protrusion off of the nerves. The discs have to have "contained" herniations (meaning the herniation can not have broken off and fragmented). Another theory on why this can work aside from pulling the disc off the nerve include removing a source of chemical irritation from the nerves (discs can leak their contents onto nerves creating irritation supposedly).
This is surgery but it does not remove the disc material, it addresses the point of the problem which at a single level should be definable. Multi level problems are complicated because a disc which is herniated may not actually be the source of the pain. You'll read over and over about MRI's showing herniations and the patients have no pain at all, while other have horrible pains. Who knows? That is why this is so tough the doctors have great difficulty determining the main source of the pain. Sometimes they get lucky and hit on it first try, if not there are many diagnostics (most involving needles and blocks of some kind). Diagnostics are expensive and painful too.
I would also consider the fusion, espeically after a year - keeping in mind that even though it is only one level it will put additional pressure on the remaining discs - How much pressure and how much of a problem it will create in your own body is the real question. In what kind of condition are your remaining discs now? What kind of work do you do. Will you correct your posture to prevent further injuries. Do you have muscle imbalances which pull on your neck. Do you have dental or TMJ problems which contribute. What's your diet like - few people address diet, they just keep on eating like they did before. Diet plays a role in disc hydration. There are a lot of variables. I personally don't fear surgery, I fear not knowing what is really wrong and having to continue to suffer because the MD's can't figure it out.
I hope whatever you choose to do things work out for you.
Minimally invasive outpatient proceedure like:
Percutaneous Discectomy
There are a couple of different treatments with a couple of different names where they enter the disc with a needle. They can then make chanels in the disc to remove material and release water content (discs have fat in them too) and possible some of the fat content. I'm not exactly sure how it works. Another uses a laser light to remove the fluid. Yet another places a wire in the disc and heats it to 90 degrees Centigrade. The whole purpose of all these proceedure is to shrink the disc material so it will get sucked back into place moving the herniation or protrusion off of the nerves. The discs have to have "contained" herniations (meaning the herniation can not have broken off and fragmented). Another theory on why this can work aside from pulling the disc off the nerve include removing a source of chemical irritation from the nerves (discs can leak their contents onto nerves creating irritation supposedly).
This is surgery but it does not remove the disc material, it addresses the point of the problem which at a single level should be definable. Multi level problems are complicated because a disc which is herniated may not actually be the source of the pain. You'll read over and over about MRI's showing herniations and the patients have no pain at all, while other have horrible pains. Who knows? That is why this is so tough the doctors have great difficulty determining the main source of the pain. Sometimes they get lucky and hit on it first try, if not there are many diagnostics (most involving needles and blocks of some kind). Diagnostics are expensive and painful too.
I would also consider the fusion, espeically after a year - keeping in mind that even though it is only one level it will put additional pressure on the remaining discs - How much pressure and how much of a problem it will create in your own body is the real question. In what kind of condition are your remaining discs now? What kind of work do you do. Will you correct your posture to prevent further injuries. Do you have muscle imbalances which pull on your neck. Do you have dental or TMJ problems which contribute. What's your diet like - few people address diet, they just keep on eating like they did before. Diet plays a role in disc hydration. There are a lot of variables. I personally don't fear surgery, I fear not knowing what is really wrong and having to continue to suffer because the MD's can't figure it out.
I hope whatever you choose to do things work out for you.