pipermac
02-01-2006, 01:36 PM
A Lot of Diets base their theories on Insulin Levels. And that you want to keep Insulin levels down because it is a fat storing Hormone.
but do you realize that When you have an insulin spike because of eating a High GI food that the spike is only for a very short time?
Also That inorder for the insulin to store Fat there needs to be an excess of Calories available to store? meaning if your calories are less then what is being burned then Insulin will not store any as fat!
Also the Difference between a high GI carb and low GI carb really is not the amount of insulin needed to bring your blood sugar down....It is that a High GI Carb will raise it Faster then the Low GI Carb. If both are 15 grams of carb then the same amount of insulin will be released. With the low GI carb it will just be released more slowly.
Insulin is completely Misunderstood by Most people when it comes to Weight loss. It truly is not something that one should need to be overly concerned about.
but do you realize that When you have an insulin spike because of eating a High GI food that the spike is only for a very short time?
Also That inorder for the insulin to store Fat there needs to be an excess of Calories available to store? meaning if your calories are less then what is being burned then Insulin will not store any as fat!
Also the Difference between a high GI carb and low GI carb really is not the amount of insulin needed to bring your blood sugar down....It is that a High GI Carb will raise it Faster then the Low GI Carb. If both are 15 grams of carb then the same amount of insulin will be released. With the low GI carb it will just be released more slowly.
Insulin is completely Misunderstood by Most people when it comes to Weight loss. It truly is not something that one should need to be overly concerned about.
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auntjudyg
02-01-2006, 02:58 PM
What I read that makes sense to me is a little different from what you have explained. It is not just a matter of insulin levels, but the interplay of glucose and insulin. Gaining even a little understanding of that is what helped me understand my overeating and FINALLY get it a little under control (most of the time, at least :D ).
So the story goes (very simple version, of course) . . . some of what we eat turns into glucose once it is digested. Glucose provides energy, so the body uses some of it immediately. But when there is more glucose than the body can use right away, the body shoots out some insulin to help store the glucose for future use (some as fat - hence the insulin/fat storage connection).
Problems start with some of our modern food. Much of the refined, processed stuff turns into glucose very quickly, much quicker than most things we homo sapiens would have eaten in the "wild". Compound this with overeating, and tremendous amounts of glucose are being introduced into many of our systems; much more than the body evolved to handle. For all this excess glucose, the poor body attempts to keep pace by producing insulin to "store" the glucose. Some people's systems seem to do okay with this and handle all the excess; some don't.
Some bodies have so much trouble keeping the glucose and insulin balanced, that the minute they detect glucose coming they overcompensate, pumping out insulin without regard to how much glucose is actually there. What can happen then is that there is too much insulin in the system. When there is too much insulin in the system, the body then wants glucose. How does the body get more glucose quickest? Eating! So the body then puts out a call for food, not because it is hungry, but because it needs the glucose to get rid of the insulin. Then the whole cycle starts again.
Indeed, a common phenomenon among some overeaters is the compulsion to eat even when they are not hungry, even when they have just eaten, and being practically powerless to stop. Traditionally, this has been explained (condemned) as lack of will power. Of course, it is self-serving of me to favor an out-of-balance hormone model, but I think it does a better job of explaining the situation than "lack of will power". It also holds out better hope for solutions.
Personally, I would recommend people learn about insulin. Some may find answers in the course of their learning. And with so much type 2 diabetes around, most of us will probably benefit from knowing something about insulin. At the very least, they will learn something about their bodies.
So the story goes (very simple version, of course) . . . some of what we eat turns into glucose once it is digested. Glucose provides energy, so the body uses some of it immediately. But when there is more glucose than the body can use right away, the body shoots out some insulin to help store the glucose for future use (some as fat - hence the insulin/fat storage connection).
Problems start with some of our modern food. Much of the refined, processed stuff turns into glucose very quickly, much quicker than most things we homo sapiens would have eaten in the "wild". Compound this with overeating, and tremendous amounts of glucose are being introduced into many of our systems; much more than the body evolved to handle. For all this excess glucose, the poor body attempts to keep pace by producing insulin to "store" the glucose. Some people's systems seem to do okay with this and handle all the excess; some don't.
Some bodies have so much trouble keeping the glucose and insulin balanced, that the minute they detect glucose coming they overcompensate, pumping out insulin without regard to how much glucose is actually there. What can happen then is that there is too much insulin in the system. When there is too much insulin in the system, the body then wants glucose. How does the body get more glucose quickest? Eating! So the body then puts out a call for food, not because it is hungry, but because it needs the glucose to get rid of the insulin. Then the whole cycle starts again.
Indeed, a common phenomenon among some overeaters is the compulsion to eat even when they are not hungry, even when they have just eaten, and being practically powerless to stop. Traditionally, this has been explained (condemned) as lack of will power. Of course, it is self-serving of me to favor an out-of-balance hormone model, but I think it does a better job of explaining the situation than "lack of will power". It also holds out better hope for solutions.
Personally, I would recommend people learn about insulin. Some may find answers in the course of their learning. And with so much type 2 diabetes around, most of us will probably benefit from knowing something about insulin. At the very least, they will learn something about their bodies.
pipermac
02-01-2006, 03:13 PM
I think you are fairly close. What happens is that when you eat something that is High GI you get a spike in Blood sugar levels...your body then produces insulin to lowere it. what can happen is that a bit too much insulin is produced and the Blood sugar level then gets a bit too low. One possible symptom of Low blood sugar is Increased Hunger. The Body will fairly quickly Fix the Low Blood sugar...so if you weight the Hunger/craving will subside. It is this Sequence that will cause some people to Be hungry right after eating High GI Foods. This is what can cause over eating. this does not happen with everybody and can easily be prevented by Eating some Low GI foods at the same time (fat,Protein) As when you combine foods the Overall GI of what you eat decreases.
As for The Aspect that many state about The fat storing capabilities of Insulin.....Insulin will not Store Fat unless there is an excess of Calories.
All Foods, Protein and Fat included. Will get broken down to glucose an then be stored as Glycogen. The Average person can store 2000 calories of Glygogen. It is when the glycogen is full that any excess Glucose is then stored as Fat.
As for The Aspect that many state about The fat storing capabilities of Insulin.....Insulin will not Store Fat unless there is an excess of Calories.
All Foods, Protein and Fat included. Will get broken down to glucose an then be stored as Glycogen. The Average person can store 2000 calories of Glygogen. It is when the glycogen is full that any excess Glucose is then stored as Fat.
auntjudyg
02-01-2006, 03:48 PM
The Body will fairly quickly Fix the Low Blood sugar...so if you weight the Hunger/craving will subside. It is this Sequence that will cause some people to Be hungry right after eating High GI Foods. This is what can cause over eating.
In a relatively healthy body, yes. The view of some is that some people get so out of whack that it is not fixed so easily as you say.
this does not happen with everybody
Agreed. That's why I used "some people"; "some bodies" an awful lot in my post.
and can easily be prevented by Eating some Low GI foods at the same time (fat,Protein)
Gosh. That sounds like low carbing!!!
As for The Aspect that many state about The fat storing capabilities of Insulin.....Insulin will not Store Fat unless there is an excess of Calories.
I'm not quite sure of the reason for saying this (again) since I think most of us are/were eating excess calories if we are reading a weight loss board. But as long as you brought this up, one of the "low carb experts" (actually two, the Hellers) found a connection between excess insulin levels and heart disease even in people who were not overweight.
In a relatively healthy body, yes. The view of some is that some people get so out of whack that it is not fixed so easily as you say.
this does not happen with everybody
Agreed. That's why I used "some people"; "some bodies" an awful lot in my post.
and can easily be prevented by Eating some Low GI foods at the same time (fat,Protein)
Gosh. That sounds like low carbing!!!
As for The Aspect that many state about The fat storing capabilities of Insulin.....Insulin will not Store Fat unless there is an excess of Calories.
I'm not quite sure of the reason for saying this (again) since I think most of us are/were eating excess calories if we are reading a weight loss board. But as long as you brought this up, one of the "low carb experts" (actually two, the Hellers) found a connection between excess insulin levels and heart disease even in people who were not overweight.
pipermac
02-01-2006, 03:59 PM
No...Not low Carbing...I said to combine Proteins and Fats with the Carbs.
One thing to keep in mind about insulin levels......Being overweight causes insulin levels to be higher. High Insulin levels do cause you to be overweight.
The People that are out of whack and it doesnt get fixed as easily are considered to have HypoGlycemia.....Which Like diabetes is a Problem in itself.
This Is more to Debunk the Myth that Carbs and Insulin levels cause you to be fat! Which I am not sure from what youo have said if you believe or not. :)
One thing to keep in mind about insulin levels......Being overweight causes insulin levels to be higher. High Insulin levels do cause you to be overweight.
The People that are out of whack and it doesnt get fixed as easily are considered to have HypoGlycemia.....Which Like diabetes is a Problem in itself.
This Is more to Debunk the Myth that Carbs and Insulin levels cause you to be fat! Which I am not sure from what youo have said if you believe or not. :)
anitak1982
02-01-2006, 04:04 PM
I will comment that I haven't had one bite of sugar in two years except one time and that was enough to cure me!
We went on vacation and my son wanted us to stop at Starbucks. My son's drink looked good so I thought well why not. It was a carmel, frap thingamabob. I drank it and it tasted wonderful but suddenly I felt like I had taken a sleeping pill and was shaking so violently.
I had to go to bed and the minute my head hit the pillow I was out until the next morning and woke up with a violent headache.
It isn't worth it!
We went on vacation and my son wanted us to stop at Starbucks. My son's drink looked good so I thought well why not. It was a carmel, frap thingamabob. I drank it and it tasted wonderful but suddenly I felt like I had taken a sleeping pill and was shaking so violently.
I had to go to bed and the minute my head hit the pillow I was out until the next morning and woke up with a violent headache.
It isn't worth it!
pipermac
02-01-2006, 04:20 PM
I will comment that I haven't had one bite of sugar in two years except one time and that was enough to cure me!
We went on vacation and my son wanted us to stop at Starbucks. My son's drink looked good so I thought well why not. It was a carmel, frap thingamabob. I drank it and it tasted wonderful but suddenly I felt like I had taken a sleeping pill and was shaking so violently.
I had to go to bed and the minute my head hit the pillow I was out until the next morning and woke up with a violent headache.
It isn't worth it!
Not sure what you are talking about. what does that have to do with the topic?
We went on vacation and my son wanted us to stop at Starbucks. My son's drink looked good so I thought well why not. It was a carmel, frap thingamabob. I drank it and it tasted wonderful but suddenly I felt like I had taken a sleeping pill and was shaking so violently.
I had to go to bed and the minute my head hit the pillow I was out until the next morning and woke up with a violent headache.
It isn't worth it!
Not sure what you are talking about. what does that have to do with the topic?
OutToLunch
02-01-2006, 04:33 PM
pipermac, once again we disagree. I would love to know where you get your information cause a lot of is full oversimplifications or half-truths. Weight management and insulin management go hand in hand. Insulin is something you should absolutely be concerned about.
Whenever you eat something, your blood sugar levels rise. How fast that level rises depends on the food's GI and the composition of the meal. The rise in blood sugar triggers the release of insulin. Insulin will move glucose into muscle cells, liver cells, and if there's any leftover, into fat cells. So the trick is to never let your blood sugar rise too rapidly. Instead, your aim should be to moderate how fast glucose enters your blood stream. The problem with high GI foods is that they cause a rapid blood sugar increase. Insulin overreacts under these circumstances and actually lowers your blood sugar too much. So you feel tired and hungry. This is hypoglycemia and is the sugar crash we all feel after candy or drinking soda. It doesn't matter how long the insulin spike lasts. Give the body too much sugar at once and the result is fat gain.
Whenever you eat something, your blood sugar levels rise. How fast that level rises depends on the food's GI and the composition of the meal. The rise in blood sugar triggers the release of insulin. Insulin will move glucose into muscle cells, liver cells, and if there's any leftover, into fat cells. So the trick is to never let your blood sugar rise too rapidly. Instead, your aim should be to moderate how fast glucose enters your blood stream. The problem with high GI foods is that they cause a rapid blood sugar increase. Insulin overreacts under these circumstances and actually lowers your blood sugar too much. So you feel tired and hungry. This is hypoglycemia and is the sugar crash we all feel after candy or drinking soda. It doesn't matter how long the insulin spike lasts. Give the body too much sugar at once and the result is fat gain.
pipermac
02-01-2006, 04:51 PM
pipermac, once again we disagree. I would love to know where you get your information cause a lot of is full oversimplifications or half-truths. Weight management and insulin management go hand in hand. Insulin is something you should absolutely be concerned about.
Whenever you eat something, your blood sugar levels rise. How fast that level rises depends on the food's GI and the composition of the meal. The rise in blood sugar triggers the release of insulin. Insulin will move glucose into muscle cells, liver cells, and if there's any leftover, into fat cells. So the trick is to never let your blood sugar rise too rapidly. Instead, your aim should be to moderate how fast glucose enters your blood stream. The problem with high GI foods is that they cause a rapid blood sugar increase. Insulin overreacts under these circumstances and actually lowers your blood sugar too much. So you feel tired and hungry. This is hypoglycemia and is the sugar crash we all feel after candy or drinking soda. It doesn't matter how long the insulin spike lasts. Give the body too much sugar at once and the result is fat gain.
Technically you are right that what ever is left over gets stored as fat. The problem is that there wont be any left over if you are eating less calories then you burn. Your Glycogen stores can hold about 2000 calories in glucose...you would have to go above that amount.
You have fallen for the myth about insulin levels.
You are completely wrong....Fat will not be stored just by eating a carb. Your Glycogen must be full before any fat will be stored. This is Fact....Look it up from a reputable source.
Being a Type1 Diabetic I have plenty of experience with Insulin, Blood Sugar Levels and Hypoglycemia.
Another fact about Hypoglycemia is that The More it happens the less you will actually feel the effects. This is Fact. When My Blood Sugars were consitently high I would feel the effects of Low Blood sugar at around 4. Since I have been keeping better Levels and Exercising more I have gone low much more ofton. Now I dont feel the effects until I am below 3.
The Insulin Level/CArbs make you fat myth has in Widely Spread to Primarily confince people to Follow Low Carb Diets.
Whenever you eat something, your blood sugar levels rise. How fast that level rises depends on the food's GI and the composition of the meal. The rise in blood sugar triggers the release of insulin. Insulin will move glucose into muscle cells, liver cells, and if there's any leftover, into fat cells. So the trick is to never let your blood sugar rise too rapidly. Instead, your aim should be to moderate how fast glucose enters your blood stream. The problem with high GI foods is that they cause a rapid blood sugar increase. Insulin overreacts under these circumstances and actually lowers your blood sugar too much. So you feel tired and hungry. This is hypoglycemia and is the sugar crash we all feel after candy or drinking soda. It doesn't matter how long the insulin spike lasts. Give the body too much sugar at once and the result is fat gain.
Technically you are right that what ever is left over gets stored as fat. The problem is that there wont be any left over if you are eating less calories then you burn. Your Glycogen stores can hold about 2000 calories in glucose...you would have to go above that amount.
You have fallen for the myth about insulin levels.
You are completely wrong....Fat will not be stored just by eating a carb. Your Glycogen must be full before any fat will be stored. This is Fact....Look it up from a reputable source.
Being a Type1 Diabetic I have plenty of experience with Insulin, Blood Sugar Levels and Hypoglycemia.
Another fact about Hypoglycemia is that The More it happens the less you will actually feel the effects. This is Fact. When My Blood Sugars were consitently high I would feel the effects of Low Blood sugar at around 4. Since I have been keeping better Levels and Exercising more I have gone low much more ofton. Now I dont feel the effects until I am below 3.
The Insulin Level/CArbs make you fat myth has in Widely Spread to Primarily confince people to Follow Low Carb Diets.
gladestrekker
02-01-2006, 06:58 PM
It took several posts but finally someone mentioned that word, dare I say it, EXERCISE. While we try to figure out the best diet, I'd like to make a plug for physical activity. There are dozens of studies that show the positive effects of exercise on controlling insulin and glucose levels, and promoting fat loss. In a nutshell, exercise does the following:
Provides a means to increase fat oxidation, thus reducing adipose fat stores (and I say adipose, because fat stores in the muscle are actually higher in athletes compared to non-athletes). And specifically, exercise reduces abdominal fat.
Increases insulin sensitivity (muscles require less insulin to do the job), thus insulin levels are reduced and this is most evident in type II diabetics. The effect may also be related to increased muscle mass in some, but the effect is transient (something about the exercise itself that does the job)
Reduces glucose levels in type II diabetics and pre-type II diabetics
Increases glycogen stores, whereby you have increased ability to store glucose without turning it into that nasty fat
Reduces triglyceride levels (possibly associated with reduced insulin and glucose levels)
Raises HDL and lowers LDL levels
So if you trip up and eat that high GI snack, exercising helps to counter the effects.
Provides a means to increase fat oxidation, thus reducing adipose fat stores (and I say adipose, because fat stores in the muscle are actually higher in athletes compared to non-athletes). And specifically, exercise reduces abdominal fat.
Increases insulin sensitivity (muscles require less insulin to do the job), thus insulin levels are reduced and this is most evident in type II diabetics. The effect may also be related to increased muscle mass in some, but the effect is transient (something about the exercise itself that does the job)
Reduces glucose levels in type II diabetics and pre-type II diabetics
Increases glycogen stores, whereby you have increased ability to store glucose without turning it into that nasty fat
Reduces triglyceride levels (possibly associated with reduced insulin and glucose levels)
Raises HDL and lowers LDL levels
So if you trip up and eat that high GI snack, exercising helps to counter the effects.
pipermac
02-01-2006, 07:45 PM
When You are talking about Insulin levels in this Case (Exercise) you are referring to Overall Sustained Levels. Not specifically Spikes from eating Carb.
Over all Levels being high are something you want to lower as Higher overall Levels can make losing fat a bit harder. But Over All Levels are Not greatly effected by Eating Carbs. Being Overweight will cause you to have overall Higher levels which is greatly caused by Insulin resistance.
The Amount of Insulin your body produces Even if you were to eat nothing is ofton much more then what is Produced when you have eaten something.
But the MAin point still is that Insulin will only store fat if there is an excess of calories.
Insulin is not an evil hormone that Causes fat to be stored. It is the tool that stores fat...it doesnt cause it to be stored.
Your body has insulin being produced all the time...so when there are excess calories it will store them as Fat...when there isnt...it wont.
But to add...you are right That Exercise does wonders for you.
Over all Levels being high are something you want to lower as Higher overall Levels can make losing fat a bit harder. But Over All Levels are Not greatly effected by Eating Carbs. Being Overweight will cause you to have overall Higher levels which is greatly caused by Insulin resistance.
The Amount of Insulin your body produces Even if you were to eat nothing is ofton much more then what is Produced when you have eaten something.
But the MAin point still is that Insulin will only store fat if there is an excess of calories.
Insulin is not an evil hormone that Causes fat to be stored. It is the tool that stores fat...it doesnt cause it to be stored.
Your body has insulin being produced all the time...so when there are excess calories it will store them as Fat...when there isnt...it wont.
But to add...you are right That Exercise does wonders for you.
auntjudyg
02-01-2006, 07:57 PM
Yeah, you are talking about the standard, textbook explanation of insulin. What I was offering was ideas that go beyond that to explain what is happening with some people. You explanation does not cover everything. No, eating proteins and fats in combination with carbs does not solve insulin/glucose imbalances for everyone.
Just because something has not gone through all the scientific scrutiny to enter mainstream thought does not mean it is a myth. Many breakthroughs emerged from the fringes and were initially battled vigorously by mainstream "expert".
One thing to keep in mind about insulin levels......Being overweight causes insulin levels to be higher. High Insulin levels do cause you to be overweight.
So even at that, you say too many are overly concerned about insulin?
The People that are out of whack and it doesnt get fixed as easily are considered to have HypoGlycemia.....Which Like diabetes is a Problem in itself.
There is more to it. The idea of "insulin resistance" is starting to show up even among "mainstream" doctors. Given time, the mainstream with caught up. They usually do, at least.
Just because something has not gone through all the scientific scrutiny to enter mainstream thought does not mean it is a myth. Many breakthroughs emerged from the fringes and were initially battled vigorously by mainstream "expert".
One thing to keep in mind about insulin levels......Being overweight causes insulin levels to be higher. High Insulin levels do cause you to be overweight.
So even at that, you say too many are overly concerned about insulin?
The People that are out of whack and it doesnt get fixed as easily are considered to have HypoGlycemia.....Which Like diabetes is a Problem in itself.
There is more to it. The idea of "insulin resistance" is starting to show up even among "mainstream" doctors. Given time, the mainstream with caught up. They usually do, at least.
auntjudyg
02-01-2006, 08:03 PM
It took several posts but finally someone mentioned that word, dare I say it, EXERCISE. While we try to figure out the best diet, I'd like to make a plug for physical activity.
Oh, this has come up at various times. Somehow it has usually worked out that exercise matters go to the Fitness (or whatever it is called) board and food matters stay here. Of course, that can change. There are food discussions over there, too.
Oh, this has come up at various times. Somehow it has usually worked out that exercise matters go to the Fitness (or whatever it is called) board and food matters stay here. Of course, that can change. There are food discussions over there, too.
auntjudyg
02-01-2006, 08:07 PM
You have fallen for the myth about insulin levels.
My general impression is that you have read these things in books, but real life does not always fit what one reads in books. You have a number of people here telling you that their life experience is different, yet your reaction is to tell them they have fallen for a myth. No, I have not fallen for any myth; or if one must view it that way, I am the myth, so the myth is the way to restore me.
The Insulin Level/CArbs make you fat myth has in Widely Spread to Primarily confince people to Follow Low Carb Diets.
Do you really believe that? How about the low carb people who aren't saying anything about insulin levels?
My general impression is that you have read these things in books, but real life does not always fit what one reads in books. You have a number of people here telling you that their life experience is different, yet your reaction is to tell them they have fallen for a myth. No, I have not fallen for any myth; or if one must view it that way, I am the myth, so the myth is the way to restore me.
The Insulin Level/CArbs make you fat myth has in Widely Spread to Primarily confince people to Follow Low Carb Diets.
Do you really believe that? How about the low carb people who aren't saying anything about insulin levels?
auntjudyg
02-01-2006, 08:15 PM
But the MAin point still is that Insulin will only store fat if there is an excess of calories.
Insulin is not an evil hormone that Causes fat to be stored. It is the tool that stores fat...it doesnt cause it to be stored.
You are looking at one small piece in the puzzle. And this is the sort of viewpoint that has been completely unhelpful for many people to lose weight, telling them that the only problem is that they eat too much, and they just need to eat fewer calories. Nope, that wasn't the answer for me. That's the sort of approach that kept me overweight for many, many years, when the solution was really quite simple.
Insulin is not an evil hormone that Causes fat to be stored. It is the tool that stores fat...it doesnt cause it to be stored.
You are looking at one small piece in the puzzle. And this is the sort of viewpoint that has been completely unhelpful for many people to lose weight, telling them that the only problem is that they eat too much, and they just need to eat fewer calories. Nope, that wasn't the answer for me. That's the sort of approach that kept me overweight for many, many years, when the solution was really quite simple.
pipermac
02-01-2006, 08:22 PM
Yeah, you are talking about the standard, textbook explanation of insulin. What I was offering was ideas that go beyond that to explain what is happening with some people. You explanation does not cover everything. No, eating proteins and fats in combination with carbs does not solve insulin/glucose imbalances for everyone.
Just because something has not gone through all the scientific scrutiny to enter mainstream thought does not mean it is a myth. Many breakthroughs emerged from the fringes and were initially battled vigorously by mainstream "expert".
So even at that, you say too many are overly concerned about insulin?
There is more to it. The idea of "insulin resistance" is starting to show up even among "mainstream" doctors. Given time, the mainstream with caught up. They usually do, at least.
You are slightly misunderstanding things. I am Mainly talking about the role Insulin has in storing fat and making one gain weight...Which it does not.
Insulin Resistance is an Issue.....It is estimated about 25% of people experience it. But Insulin Resistence is not caused by High Insulin levels, High Insulin levels are a result of Insulin resistance. the Number one factor contributing to Insulin resistance is Weight. Lose the weight and you will be less resistant.
I do not disregard other Important reasons to keep Overall insulin levels down. But the role that High Glycemic Foods have on that is not great. As I said before 15 grams of carb will require the same amount of insulin regardless of if it is from a High GI carb or a low GI food. The difference is How Fast it is produced.
The Number one way to Lower overall Insulin levels is to lose weight. It is not by avoiding high GI foods.
I am Type 1 Diabetic and I can see firsthand how Insulin levels are by how much I need to take and by what I eat.
When I started Eating well I needed much more insulin for the same amount of food as I need now, 50lbs lighter. By Diet has not changed but my insulin requirements have.
Also what many people dont realize is that Protein will also have an effect on insulin levels. Protein will not cause spikes but It will cause insulin to be produced at a slower rate. thus raising your overl insulin levels.
Even if you do not eat anything your body will still produce a large amount of insulin. If I didnt eat a thing and didnt take any insulin my Blood sugars would still be very high.
there are also many other factors that will cause Blood sugar levels to rise and thus more insulin to be produced. Stress and Sickness being two of them.
Just because something has not gone through all the scientific scrutiny to enter mainstream thought does not mean it is a myth. Many breakthroughs emerged from the fringes and were initially battled vigorously by mainstream "expert".
So even at that, you say too many are overly concerned about insulin?
There is more to it. The idea of "insulin resistance" is starting to show up even among "mainstream" doctors. Given time, the mainstream with caught up. They usually do, at least.
You are slightly misunderstanding things. I am Mainly talking about the role Insulin has in storing fat and making one gain weight...Which it does not.
Insulin Resistance is an Issue.....It is estimated about 25% of people experience it. But Insulin Resistence is not caused by High Insulin levels, High Insulin levels are a result of Insulin resistance. the Number one factor contributing to Insulin resistance is Weight. Lose the weight and you will be less resistant.
I do not disregard other Important reasons to keep Overall insulin levels down. But the role that High Glycemic Foods have on that is not great. As I said before 15 grams of carb will require the same amount of insulin regardless of if it is from a High GI carb or a low GI food. The difference is How Fast it is produced.
The Number one way to Lower overall Insulin levels is to lose weight. It is not by avoiding high GI foods.
I am Type 1 Diabetic and I can see firsthand how Insulin levels are by how much I need to take and by what I eat.
When I started Eating well I needed much more insulin for the same amount of food as I need now, 50lbs lighter. By Diet has not changed but my insulin requirements have.
Also what many people dont realize is that Protein will also have an effect on insulin levels. Protein will not cause spikes but It will cause insulin to be produced at a slower rate. thus raising your overl insulin levels.
Even if you do not eat anything your body will still produce a large amount of insulin. If I didnt eat a thing and didnt take any insulin my Blood sugars would still be very high.
there are also many other factors that will cause Blood sugar levels to rise and thus more insulin to be produced. Stress and Sickness being two of them.
pipermac
02-01-2006, 08:26 PM
You are looking at one small piece in the puzzle. And this is the sort of viewpoint that has been completely unhelpful for many people to lose weight, telling them that the only problem is that they eat too much, and they just need to eat fewer calories. Nope, that wasn't the answer for me. That's the sort of approach that kept me overweight for many, many years, when the solution was really quite simple.
Eating Less Calories then You burn is the ONLY answer. That is the only way to lose weight. Regardless of what type of diet you are on...if you are losing weight you are burning more then you consume. Now Certain Foods will help you keep a higher metabolism and thus burn more calories. But the Formula of Calories in vs calories out does not change.
Eating Less Calories then You burn is the ONLY answer. That is the only way to lose weight. Regardless of what type of diet you are on...if you are losing weight you are burning more then you consume. Now Certain Foods will help you keep a higher metabolism and thus burn more calories. But the Formula of Calories in vs calories out does not change.
anitak1982
02-01-2006, 08:46 PM
Not sure what you are talking about. what does that have to do with the topic?
When I eat sugar my pancreas reacts like diabetic's does when they drop from too much insulin. So this does have everything to do with this topic!
When I eat sugar my pancreas reacts like diabetic's does when they drop from too much insulin. So this does have everything to do with this topic!
gladestrekker
02-01-2006, 08:57 PM
Oh, this has come up at various times. Somehow it has usually worked out that exercise matters go to the Fitness (or whatever it is called) board and food matters stay here. Of course, that can change. There are food discussions over there, too.
What is your point? As I see it, this is the "Weight Loss" section and this particular thread is a discussion of insulin and glucose as they relate to fat storage. Whether you prefer or not, exercise is a topic that always has a place in a discussion related to weight loss.
What is your point? As I see it, this is the "Weight Loss" section and this particular thread is a discussion of insulin and glucose as they relate to fat storage. Whether you prefer or not, exercise is a topic that always has a place in a discussion related to weight loss.
pipermac
02-01-2006, 09:07 PM
When I eat sugar my pancreas reacts like diabetic's does when they drop from too much insulin. So this does have everything to do with this topic!
That has nothing to do with the topic..it has nothing to do if Insulin will cause you to gain weight.
If you hadnt had any Carbs in That long and then had that drink...It would be your body reacting to something it hasnt had in it for a very long time.
That has nothing to do with the topic..it has nothing to do if Insulin will cause you to gain weight.
If you hadnt had any Carbs in That long and then had that drink...It would be your body reacting to something it hasnt had in it for a very long time.
gladestrekker
02-01-2006, 09:17 PM
the Number one factor contributing to Insulin resistance is Weight. Lose the weight and you will be less resistant.
Studies have demonstrated improved insulin sensitivity and reduced insulin resistance in men and women who exercise only once (this is a transient effect that is sustained with continuous training). Further, a few studies have shown improved insulin levels without a change in weight over several weeks (diet-controlled to maintain energy balance). Thus, your statement is not convincing.
Studies have demonstrated improved insulin sensitivity and reduced insulin resistance in men and women who exercise only once (this is a transient effect that is sustained with continuous training). Further, a few studies have shown improved insulin levels without a change in weight over several weeks (diet-controlled to maintain energy balance). Thus, your statement is not convincing.
chevyman
02-01-2006, 09:30 PM
I been readying these posts and find them very interesting" , I don't know much about how insulin levels are raise or lowerd...just some common facts, I take what pipermac has to say about this subject very informative, it's obvious the man has did some reading and study of this, being he is dibetic and very concern about his weight and health, insulin levels play a major part for all and even further for a dibetic.
Its true on some things is myth and some things we read is fiction, but I happen to believe what pipermac has to say...to me what better person to get information about this type of subject (excluding medical Dr's) knows a great deal about insulin and how the body metabolises the insulin or stores it what ever the case maybe..than a dibatic.
In my opinion he is trying to help others that maybe diebetic/and help us all lose weight in a safe and well plan out manner.
Its true on some things is myth and some things we read is fiction, but I happen to believe what pipermac has to say...to me what better person to get information about this type of subject (excluding medical Dr's) knows a great deal about insulin and how the body metabolises the insulin or stores it what ever the case maybe..than a dibatic.
In my opinion he is trying to help others that maybe diebetic/and help us all lose weight in a safe and well plan out manner.
pipermac
02-01-2006, 10:07 PM
Studies have demonstrated improved insulin sensitivity and reduced insulin resistance in men and women who exercise only once (this is a transient effect that is sustained with continuous training). Further, a few studies have shown improved insulin levels without a change in weight over several weeks (diet-controlled to maintain energy balance). Thus, your statement is not convincing.
I didnt say those things dont affect it. They definately do. But the thing that affects it the most, is weight. Since Dropping 50lbs I have dropped my insulin usage by about half of what it used to be.
I didnt say those things dont affect it. They definately do. But the thing that affects it the most, is weight. Since Dropping 50lbs I have dropped my insulin usage by about half of what it used to be.
pipermac
02-01-2006, 10:09 PM
IF you really want to know about Insulin...you dont talk to nutrionist's. Talk to an Endocrinologist....that is their expertise, i have been seeing one for the last 26 years.
I will Also Correct myself someWhat.....For Immediate short time Insulin reduction...Exercise Will have the Greatest effect. Since Exercising requires energy..it will get much of its energy from Glucose in the blood...thus loweringBlood sugars and the amount of insulin at the time of exercise. But the Results for the rest of the time as aresult of exercise are not nearly as great.
This Can be seen by myself when I exercise Immediately have Breakfast in the morning. the amount of insulin I need at that time is reduced by a good amount.
I will Also Correct myself someWhat.....For Immediate short time Insulin reduction...Exercise Will have the Greatest effect. Since Exercising requires energy..it will get much of its energy from Glucose in the blood...thus loweringBlood sugars and the amount of insulin at the time of exercise. But the Results for the rest of the time as aresult of exercise are not nearly as great.
This Can be seen by myself when I exercise Immediately have Breakfast in the morning. the amount of insulin I need at that time is reduced by a good amount.
auntjudyg
02-02-2006, 10:07 AM
What is your point? As I see it, this is the "Weight Loss" section and this particular thread is a discussion of insulin and glucose as they relate to fat storage. Whether you prefer or not, exercise is a topic that always has a place in a discussion related to weight loss.
I'm aware I can be rather oblique at times, but I hadn't thought this was one of them. You brought up the word "exercise" as though it were a new discovery. Of course, exercise is part of weight loss or ANY life plan aiming at better health. I was merely pointing out that is has come up (numerous times) and how the topic had usually been played out and directing you where you might find a more fruitful discussion of exercise - didn't say anything at all about my preferences. It was just a bit of history since you have a low number of posts. Certainly there was no intention to rustle feathers!
Do you follow a low fat regime, by chance?
I'm aware I can be rather oblique at times, but I hadn't thought this was one of them. You brought up the word "exercise" as though it were a new discovery. Of course, exercise is part of weight loss or ANY life plan aiming at better health. I was merely pointing out that is has come up (numerous times) and how the topic had usually been played out and directing you where you might find a more fruitful discussion of exercise - didn't say anything at all about my preferences. It was just a bit of history since you have a low number of posts. Certainly there was no intention to rustle feathers!
Do you follow a low fat regime, by chance?
gladestrekker
02-02-2006, 12:08 PM
IF you really want to know about Insulin...you dont talk to nutrionist's. Talk to an Endocrinologist....that is their expertise, i have been seeing one for the last 26 years.
This Can be seen by myself when I exercise Immediately have Breakfast in the morning. the amount of insulin I need at that time is reduced by a good amount.
I don't talk to nutritionist or endocrinologist specifically; I study the research performed by various experts (exercise physiologists, endocrinologists, nutrititionists, etc); usually performed by a team. Exercise's effects are profound, the evidence is all over the scientific research.
As for your personal experience, that's great that you have been successful at weight loss (and with controlling your diabetes I assume). I think it is a great accomplishment and speaks well for you. But personal experience can hardly represent the entire picture.
This Can be seen by myself when I exercise Immediately have Breakfast in the morning. the amount of insulin I need at that time is reduced by a good amount.
I don't talk to nutritionist or endocrinologist specifically; I study the research performed by various experts (exercise physiologists, endocrinologists, nutrititionists, etc); usually performed by a team. Exercise's effects are profound, the evidence is all over the scientific research.
As for your personal experience, that's great that you have been successful at weight loss (and with controlling your diabetes I assume). I think it is a great accomplishment and speaks well for you. But personal experience can hardly represent the entire picture.
gladestrekker
02-02-2006, 12:12 PM
Do you follow a low fat regime, by chance?
No feathers russled; but I will always try to plug exercise whenever I get the chance. The reason being is I know it is effective (as you seem to know as well). When something as complicated as insulin and glucose metabolism is discussed, it is difficult to dwell on only one variable as there are many that impose effects. I thought I would throw another into the mix just to remind folks there is no one easy answer. That is the essence of scientific debate which I love.
As for my personal diet or weight loss history, that's no one's business. What works for me, works for me only (a study of one!).
No feathers russled; but I will always try to plug exercise whenever I get the chance. The reason being is I know it is effective (as you seem to know as well). When something as complicated as insulin and glucose metabolism is discussed, it is difficult to dwell on only one variable as there are many that impose effects. I thought I would throw another into the mix just to remind folks there is no one easy answer. That is the essence of scientific debate which I love.
As for my personal diet or weight loss history, that's no one's business. What works for me, works for me only (a study of one!).
pipermac
02-02-2006, 12:17 PM
I don't talk to nutritionist or endocrinologist specifically; I study the research performed by various experts (exercise physiologists, endocrinologists, nutrititionists, etc); usually performed by a team. Exercise's effects are profound, the evidence is all over the scientific research.
As for your personal experience, that's great that you have been successful at weight loss (and with controlling your diabetes I assume). I think it is a great accomplishment and speaks well for you. But personal experience can hardly represent the entire picture.
havent you been reading my comments????????
I am not Putting down the value of exercise. I have largely agreed with you about the value of exercise. But the number one Reason for sustained high levels of Insulin are due to Insulin resitance which Is Largely caused by Weight. The number 1 way to Lower insulin resistance is to lose weight.
As for your personal experience, that's great that you have been successful at weight loss (and with controlling your diabetes I assume). I think it is a great accomplishment and speaks well for you. But personal experience can hardly represent the entire picture.
havent you been reading my comments????????
I am not Putting down the value of exercise. I have largely agreed with you about the value of exercise. But the number one Reason for sustained high levels of Insulin are due to Insulin resitance which Is Largely caused by Weight. The number 1 way to Lower insulin resistance is to lose weight.