:nono: Discipline, I find it very easy to discipline my other children, we do time-outs and talk about what was wrong and how they should have handled themselves. But Cadence since he doesn't totally understand language, I disapline him differentlly, I don't know if its working or if I'm doing more harm than good. I am tired of locking things up, having to get out ladders for things I need everyday and stacking baby gates on top of eachother. Am I wrong to say he needs to learn what to touch and not to touch just like my normal children do? Yesterday- When I was in the bathroom, he decided to make cookies on the floor was 6 broken eggs, a whole bag of flower, smeared butter and brown sugar. As I was cleaning that mess I heard a crash- it was my pictures hanging on the wall in the bathroom, he climed the counter and knocked them down while he was drawing pictures on the mirror with his spit! Then later as I'm nursing my baby I hear the window open and catch him popping the screen off to go out side! I set up an activity for him in our art room so I can cook dinner, I leave him alone for 5 min- when I check on him he has taken all my sewing thread and unrolled it all over the room- out side if I don't fallow behind him he will eat anything (but when it comes to real food-picky) he has figured out all baby locks and he is a master climber! I guess what I'm asking is, is it wrong when he is climbing over our fence to spank his butt and put him into bed for a time-out? I go in there after a few minutes and try to reinforce what happened in a calm voice I say No Climbing Fence, stay by Mama. Or when he smears butter on the floor, I say no in my mad voice hand over hand get out a towel and make him clean it up. Am I too harsh has any one else disapline this way and does it eventually work! How do you disapline?

How old is he? :confused:

I am the "grandmother" of an autistic child who just celebrated his 7th birthday. I have disciplined him as well as his parents just like any other ordinary child.

However, me personally, I do not believe in "Time Outs". I am Old School. :D Believe me, my grandson knows exactly who he can get away with "stuff" with.

When Nana comes visiting or he visits me, he is a perfect :angel: cause he don't want no OLD SCHOOL discipline. Believe me, he knows the difference. :eek:

:nono: Thank you for replyng- He will be 5 years old in a couple of weeks. It's hard for me to be strong with him, when most of the time he is not trying to be defiant he just simply would like some cookies! But in a lot of cases he is endagering himself. He needs to know right from wrong and when I can't use language to reason, I find that my way may be the impoliticly correct way. Is it impoliticly correct or harmfull to spank butt? Does it work? Is it going to make him not trust me? I was spanked as a child and I knew the difference between getting a spanked for something I did wrong and being beat! I knew my parents loved me, but they were able to talk to me about why I was spanked. Spanked as in with the hand and only on the butt. Cadence- he is smart enough to know when he is bad, but I'm also affraid that he doesn't know why my face is so ugly right now or why I get so mean and strongly guid him to a chair and make him sit! I just wonder what your opinion is and what works for you.

Time outs work for my dd sometimes. Yelling works, too. She gets real quiet and stops whatever it is she was doing. I used to give her a pop on the thigh to emphasize that she did something wrong, but that isn't necessary anymore.

She knows what is right and wrong and does stuff around her father that she would never do around me - he doesn't discipline.

On the other hand, I just came from an behavior modification lecture about antecedent, behavior, consequence. The behavior mod people say to keep a chart of the misbehaviors - what happened right before, the behavior, and what happened after the behavior. After a couple of days, the chart should reveal what your child's trigger is or why he's seeking the attention, etc.

We struggle with this too. When there are children that are neurotypical in the family it is hard because they all seem to need to be disciplined differently. I remember putting our PDD-NOS son at age three on his bed for a time-out. He kept getting off and thought it was just funny. He could not (and still doesn't) sense when I am angry, sad, etc. One time I had some toy handcuffs and I cuffed him to his bed for a time-out. Of course that didn't work. I felt better, but he thought it was a game even more. I feel like I have to follow him around the house constantly so he doesn't get into/destroy everything. One thing that does help is getting a friend/cousin to come over to play. At least it gives me a little break. Also, an immediate positive reward system has helped us. It's hard to be so structured! Good Luck to you.

Teaching generally works better than discipline. Reward good behavior. If you don't have planned activities for your child, he will devise his own. Teach him how to play when you have to be occupied w/the baby. Our kids often have to be taught how to play & rewarded for doing it.

When your kids on the spectrum are young, just pack up, box, stuff you don't want them to get into. Keep out maybe one token item you want to teach them not to touch. Don't make extra grief for yourself. Structuring the environment is lesson one. There are a variety of locking mechanisms on the market. You will have to go beyond "baby-proofing." Our kids are often very clever mechanically.

We did not have a dx on my son until he was 14 yo. Had we had one sooner, it would have helped us structure discipline. As it was, we had to use trial & error. And we made many mistakes as parents.

My son is now a 15 yo w/high-functioning PDD-NOS. When he was much younger he did get a few spankings. In retrospect they were not helpful, & more harmful than spankings would be for a neurotypical child. Due to his sensory issues (which we understand now in retrospect), spankings caused our son to 'shut down,' -- they made him less sensitive to our discipline, rather than more so. Our spankings were never severe, just hand to butt & never left a mark for more than 2 minutes. Spankings were rare & reserved for behaviors that had true injurious potential. My son was an electronics genius & was forever trying to rewire the house ... it was positively scary. We had to lock up all of our screw drivers for almost a decade.

Time out, ditto, did not work. What did? Well, first of all, putting tons of effort into making sure he was taught, led, instructed in constructive leisure activities. For years, we used token systems (redeem for reward/privilege) to reward him for constructive activity. Then, when there was a need for discipline, keeping it related to the problem worked best. Like cleaning up the mess. As he got older, writing/printing lines. Writing apologies.

Yelling was probably the worst thing I did, and I strongly regret it in retrospect. Sometimes I just lost it & blew my stack. But the yelling made for terrible shut-downs. Quiet chats were the most effective.

Another thing that worked was "close supervision," which meant that DS had to be with me, wherever I was, doing activities of my choosing, or staring off into space. You work out of close supervision through good behavior & compliance. You don't have the run of the house. With a young child, it's hand-holding & time consuming, but effective.

Once we got into the habit of asking our son to explain "what's going on?" we had fewer misbehaviors. It wasn't lecturing. He hated having to talk about stuff he'd done, and it made him more careful not to repeat them.

I hope that some of you can learn from my mistakes.

I'm a grown up with Autism. This is a serious subject, but I have to say this post made me smile to myself - some parents can be a bit over-protective of a child with Autism and let them get away with things the other siblings don't get away with. Kids with Autism do tend to need more structure and boundaries in their environment - new situations and environments can overwhelm them and make their behaviour worse. I apparently had some terrible screaming fits in public areas until about the age of four or five. I can only clearly remember the last one. However, I grew up knowing the difference between right and wrong. I can't say I'm an experienced expert in this area, so the only comment I would perhaps make is that maybe a parent should consider whether a child is deliberately being difficult or naughty, or is overstimulated/overwhelmed, in which case putting him in a quiet environment for awhile should get things under control. But don't let him play on it all the time - which kids are usually expert at doing, even at an early age. (I believe that after awhile, most parents are able to discern the difference!)

The key to the word "discipline" is the word "disciple." A child, ASD or not, is a student, or disciple, of the parents. We learn best by a good example. My parents set a good one for me and, if I am ever so fortunate to have children, I hope to provide a good example for them.

I'm a grown up with Autism. This is a serious subject, but I have to say this post made me smile to myself - some parents can be a bit over-protective of a child with Autism and let them get away with things the other siblings don't get away with. Kids with Autism do tend to need more structure and boundaries in their environment - new situations and environments can overwhelm them and make their behaviour worse. I apparently had some terrible screaming fits in public areas until about the age of four or five. I can only clearly remember the last one. However, I grew up knowing the difference between right and wrong. I can't say I'm an experienced expert in this area, so the only comment I would perhaps make is that maybe a parent should consider whether a child is deliberately being difficult or naughty, or is overstimulated/overwhelmed, in which case putting him in a quiet environment for awhile should get things under control. But don't let him play on it all the time - which kids are usually expert at doing, even at an early age. (I believe that after awhile, most parents are able to discern the difference!)

I know my 4 1/2 year old gets away with some stuff. He cries a lot. Almost every morning he cries if he doesn't get his way. If we are not at his beck and call. If we don't come downstairs when he wants us to or he doesn't get breakfast fast enough. If his brother doesn't play a video game with him, he just flips over not getting his way. I believe that is more spoiled than anything. So we have started time outs and he hates them but we've got him to sit while he screams. But how to stop him from crying over every little thing. I'll ask him "What is wrong?" He will say "I'm crying." Yes I know you're crying, but please tell me why? All I want to do is shut him up. Sorry to be so blunt but I can't stand it. It's as if someone has taken their nails accross a chalk board. Do you think he knows his crying and fussing effects me this way? And that he can get his way by crying? Overall he is pretty good and doesn't make messes or run into the road or anything. We still keep a good eye on him though.

Kolby- I hear you! When Cadence does this I simply say, “ No, Cadence” and I put him in his bed, “ No yelling” and I shut the door- this has worked for us. He hates when I shut the door and the only time his door is ever shut is when he is yelling. I decided a while ago that, I was not going to yell or stress out, It has kind of worked- I no longer yell but- stress! No one can hear what a person is saying when they yell! Plus it makes me hate my own voice! I told my 7 year old if I hear a wine come out of my mouth your in big trouble!

Kolby- I hear you! When Cadence does this I simply say, “ No, Cadence” and I put him in his bed, “ No yelling” and I shut the door- this has worked for us. He hates when I shut the door and the only time his door is ever shut is when he is yelling. I decided a while ago that, I was not going to yell or stress out, It has kind of worked- I no longer yell but- stress! No one can hear what a person is saying when they yell! Plus it makes me hate my own voice! I told my 7 year old if I hear a wine come out of my mouth your in big trouble!


I yell and then I feel like dirt for it. My older son tells me it hurts his ears. But sometimes it's the only way to stop all that is going wrong at that point.
But you are right, yelling isn't the way. Just calm time outs. The more we stay calm the better!!!

Kolby- Sometimes it helps me to put him in his room, grab some chocolate and my other kids and go outside, It stresses my other children out when Cadence Blows his top! Don’t feel bad to just not let it bother you! Our kids need to figure out on their own how to deal with themselves, hopefully sooner than later!

Kolby
My son seems to cry alot when he doesn't get his way, I found with him, he didn't seem to know how to stop until he got his way, so first we worked on him sitting with me when he cried, and I would tell him in a calm voice to settle down and breath in and out several times until he calmed down. Now when he starts, I can usually just give him a stern but soft STOP. It took awhile, but is effective most of the time now. Of course not all the time, but a lot less crying makes me a happier camper. He still gets upset alot, but it's quieter than it used to be. Of course taking away his video games works on some problems too. :D Teaching him to calm himself was alot of help here, he would cry forever, it seemed, before.

Kolby
My son seems to cry alot when he doesn't get his way, I found with him, he didn't seem to know how to stop until he got his way, so first we worked on him sitting with me when he cried, and I would tell him in a calm voice to settle down and breath in and out several times until he calmed down. Now when he starts, I can usually just give him a stern but soft STOP. It took awhile, but is effective most of the time now. Of course not all the time, but a lot less crying makes me a happier camper. He still gets upset alot, but it's quieter than it used to be. Of course taking away his video games works on some problems too. :D Teaching him to calm himself was alot of help here, he would cry forever, it seemed, before.

That sounds good. I know my children get stressed out when my son cries and fusses. And we do take the video games away too. He lives for them and TV.

Nothing works for my son at the moment time outs don't work I even change the locations so as not to leave him in his room filled with toys, bribery doesn't work, taking away favorite toys videos etc doesn't work, spanking doesn't work. I have several things at play here at home so I try hard to have patience but shoot I'm human. Talking to him afterwards isn't helping either I'm at a loss and to top it all off I just quit smoking so I'm BANANAS :bouncing:

PDD- mom is right sitting with my son does help, he will sit on my lap and we will have our foreheads touching. But that is normally when he just has some kind of emotional surge. We will all be having a great time or be doing nothing at all when all of a sudden he just breaks down and crys like his heart is broken. It kills me, I don't know what to think and I just try to hold him and calm him. But then there are the times when he is just mad, and not having his way- that is when I find it better to hug him and talk with a calm but stern voice and, give him his space. We need to go outside from the noise. He needs time to figure out himself what is going on with him. Like most kids when they get upset. I do this with my other children as well. When they are ready, they come and throw themselves in my arms and whimper, then I talk about what happened and try encouraging words. Cadence doesn't talk yet, but I still think he understands at least by my tone.

Liamsmom- I know how you feel, but just hang in there and do what you think is right. I would work on things with Cadence for a very, very, very, very long time, before it would make a difference, but I know now if I hang in long enough it will finally work. Patience and the Fallow through- the hardest things of good parenting!

Honestly, when children start making trouble, words mean little or nothing to them, and most of the time the only way they'll understand to not do something is if they are somehow shown physically. You can tell them until you're blue in the fact how dangerous a knife is, but when you look away for a minute and they cut themselves with a knife, they'll learn that knives mean pain and they're bad. Now I don't advocate letting kids hurt themselves all the time, but from the sounds of your situation with your son, I think a spanking would be beneficial as a last resort for when he makes messes.

I say when he makes a mess or does anything bad, give him a warning. Do not coo him and say, "Oh please don't do that Junior. That's a good boy, now go play nice"...meaning don't ask him to behave. Tell him, because when you ask him, you give him options, and when it comes to your sanity and his safety, there should be no alternative course deviating from the positive one. If he does the same thing again, give a more harsh warning by repating yourself and giving him a little smack on the hand. Three is a great number...if the first two times yield no success, put him over your knee and tan his hide. Autistic or not, make sure he knows what is acceptable and what is not acceptable. If you allow him to get away with things like throwing eggs and flour on the floor now, he'll be walking all over you for years to come.

Don't let your son's mental condition prevent you from putting your foot down occasionally.

:nono: Discipline, I find it very easy to discipline my other children, we do time-outs and talk about what was wrong and how they should have handled themselves. But Cadence since he doesn't totally understand language, I disapline him differentlly, I don't know if its working or if I'm doing more harm than good. I am tired of locking things up, having to get out ladders for things I need everyday and stacking baby gates on top of eachother. Am I wrong to say he needs to learn what to touch and not to touch just like my normal children do? Yesterday- When I was in the bathroom, he decided to make cookies on the floor was 6 broken eggs, a whole bag of flower, smeared butter and brown sugar. As I was cleaning that mess I heard a crash- it was my pictures hanging on the wall in the bathroom, he climed the counter and knocked them down while he was drawing pictures on the mirror with his spit! Then later as I'm nursing my baby I hear the window open and catch him popping the screen off to go out side! I set up an activity for him in our art room so I can cook dinner, I leave him alone for 5 min- when I check on him he has taken all my sewing thread and unrolled it all over the room- out side if I don't fallow behind him he will eat anything (but when it comes to real food-picky) he has figured out all baby locks and he is a master climber! I guess what I'm asking is, is it wrong when he is climbing over our fence to spank his butt and put him into bed for a time-out? I go in there after a few minutes and try to reinforce what happened in a calm voice I say No Climbing Fence, stay by Mama. Or when he smears butter on the floor, I say no in my mad voice hand over hand get out a towel and make him clean it up. Am I too harsh has any one else disapline this way and does it eventually work! How do you disapline?


It is very hard to discipline a child when you A - don't know if he understands why he/she is being disciplined, and B - they really aren't trying to misbehave -- they really do not see why you don't think it is the most exciting and fun thing on earth to play in the toilet! What you might want to do, especially because of the language barrier is use pictures/social stories and show pictures of "safe" and "unsafe". I literally would put a sign with a giant red circle with a line through it on places my daughter was not allowed to go/touch (i.e., the cabinet under the sink, etc). Sometimes a visual representation helps alot and you can couple the visual with verbal -- always use the same language "No -- not safe" in the simplist language possible, and always, when possible offer a safe/appropriate alternative. For example, when your son was drawing with spit -- that is not clean and "not safe" and offer him crayons and a piece of paper at the table -- you can even put a small symbol card you use as a "safe" symbol next to him as he is coloring to visually reinforce acceptable behavior. I know it helped with my destructive one quite a bit. Hope this is helpful.

I have yet to figure out how to discipline Cara (who just turned 3). Spanking does not work - she doesn't even notice it! I mean she really doesn't notice it! Yelling doesn't work - either she doesn't hear it in her world or she ignores me. Explaining and reasoning and time out - we haven't even gone there! Cara doesn't seem to have the capacity for those yet.

Our house has baby gates on the stairs and kitchen, and doors to rooms where we don't want her are closed. That will work until she can get over baby gates and/or open doors. Then I will have to find a new tactic. Otherwise our house is pretty "baby proof". It's just easier that way.

Our biggest problems are:

1. Running away.
2. Putting everything (except food) in her mouth. I usually sneak up on her to get it away becuase if I announce my intentions she runs away giggling and I am terrified she is going to choke.
3. Sharing/playing with her older sister.

Unforunately I think I put to much burden on my older daughter at times. Josie is 4 1/2 and I often tell her to let Cara have the toy because Cara doesn't understand. If Josie were leaving Cara's toys alone I might not do this, but when Josie plays with Cara's toys and then yells at Cara for playing with Josie's toys - well, it goes both ways. When Josie starts leaving Cara's stuff alone then I may change this tactic. Frankly I don't care if they play with each others toys!

One thing I do enforce is sitting still at church. If Cara acts up during service I take her out into the area set up for restless children and hold her on my lap - no matter how she screams. It makes for a very unpleasant service for me, but it happens about once every two months.

Mealtime is another sit still time and sometimes that involves screaming. If we are in a restaurant, though, I am considerate of other patrons and we tag team to eat and take Cara out of the building.

Bedtime is strongly enforced - no matter how much she screams.

The wisest words my pediatrician ever gave me were "pick your battles".

I just try to keep Cara's world as safe as possible - wherever we are.

Liz H.:blob_fire

May sound crazy, but I use the Dr. Phil approach (kids need to know with 100% certainty the consequences of their actions, and will modify their behavior accodingly). My husband told me this would never work with Zach, who is ASD, but it did. Dr. Phil devoted a lot of programs about 3 years ago to parenting, and there are still links to adivce and tapes of old shows on his website.

Because of his language delays, Zach really couldn't understand the why of things, but he did understand that if I consistently gave him a time out, or took a favorite toy away for a time out, that the behavior he was engaging in wasn't worth the consequences. It required being really consistent, and for the first couple of weeks, was super hard, but then it got easier - when he realized the tantrums wouldn't work, I noticed some of the behaviors disappearing. As for time outs, I used his pack and play pen and put him in that (when they get big, you need to keep an eye to they don't tip it over). It gave him a physical sense of isolation, and kept him in one place for the time out. Not to say disabline still isn't an issue - it is, but I think Zach is easier to manage then he would have been. :) (And I understand about all the door locks, etc. - we've got those too!)

Hope this is useful.

It does look like taking Cara away from church works, since you say it only need to happen every couple of months. So maybe think about what it is about removing Cara from church - is it being in isolation with you, or away from someone that stays behind at church, or just not being in church - and see if you can expand it to other areas.

It does look like taking Cara away from church works, since you say it only need to happen every couple of months. So maybe think about what it is about removing Cara from church - is it being in isolation with you, or away from someone that stays behind at church, or just not being in church - and see if you can expand it to other areas.

Wow! I hadn't thought of it that way - that something might have actually worked! Oh boy!

It seems that what bothered Cara about being taken out of church was the fact that I was restraining her and not letting her play or run around. I just sat there and held her on my lap - no matter how much she screamed or struggled. How do I apply that elsewhere? Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated. And is there anyway to avoid the screaming? (Silly question, I know)

Liz H.