Is this a normal day of food:

Breakfast: 1/2 cup lowfat cottage cheese, 1 cup cereal, banana
Lunch: 3oz turkey, roasted beets, baby corn, cucumbers, tomatoes (small assortment of random things)
Afternoon: Iced coffee with nonfat milk
Dinner: Mexican shrimp skewers (2 with 6 shrimp and veggies), black beans, mexican cole slaw and 1 corn tortilla
Dessert: Frozen yogurt with heath bar topping

I feel SO full right now and I am just so confused at what is NORMAL!!! Is it normal to actually FEEL full after a meal or are you supposed to be just not hungry? I feel like I eat so much more than my friends that I live with, but mabye that is because I am taller or maybe it is because I am eating too much or maybe it is because I am obsessed with food!?!? I have all these thoughts running through my head and I cannot decide what is the truth.

I guess I just need a little bit of a reality check....

Hellllllllll no is that enough food. what is up with that lunch?!?! wheres the bread and mayo?? how bout some real dressing for those veggies? I know the feeling of thinking that your eating more than everyone around you!! Whenever i come across a feeling like that, i remind myself that im supposed to be gaining weight, i have a different metabolism, i am a different height, i do different activities ect. CONCLUSION: I have different NEEDS. Dont go by other people on what "regular" eating is. Most of the time "regular" people dont even know how to eat. YOUR doing the right thing! promise..

I completely agree..way too low for someone who should be a) recovering from anorexia and b) GAINING WEIGHT. This is, at best, a diet of someone double your age and 5 inches shorter than you. I can't believe this is an example of a day where you followed your mealplan, and if it is then you need a new dietician. As for your questions? You are likely full because you ate a ton of ultra low cal things in larger quantities- anyone would be full on beans and veggies..that's not what you should be eating though, you aren't dieting.

Yesterday (the day that I posted what I ate) didn't fully meet my meal plan, to be honest, but I feel like I did eat a LOT. I understand that dense, low-calorie foods can be more filling than the less filling high calorie alternatives, but it just feels better to fill up on chicken, broccoli and brown rice than a quesadilla or something, you know? But only SOMETIMES. Sometimes I think "wow - maybe I'd be more satisfied and not as FULL if I just ate 2 pieces of pizza instead of a huge quantity of other low-calorie things." Light bulb goes off!!!

It's just hard living with 2 girls (best friends of mine) that literally don't have to worry about food at ALL. The first thing I think about when I wake up is breakfast and they sometimes don't even eat until lunchtime simply because they aren't hungry until then. And then when they do eat, it's not even that much! They aren't trying to lose weight and definitely aren't eating disordered. It just makes me feel like at first my preoccupation with food was bad because I wouldn't eat certain things and now it's even WORSE because all I think about is food and I am going int he complete opposite direction!!

Oh, and not to mention my ever-present obsession with frozen yogurt EVERY SINGLE NIGHT after dinner. It almost makes me sick how much I look forward to it. Is that normal? I feel like it is so important to me and makes me so excited to think about! It makes me want to declare it "off limits" so I could see if I could handle being away from it, but that scares me too.

I just don't know how much to give in to right now. Do I contine to indulge in frozen yogurt every night b/c I just WANT to, or do I need to show SOME sense of self control? Do I vary my lunches and breakfasts more or do I stick to what I know meets my meal plan and I'm comfortable with (but usually turns out to be the same thing each day)???

Well, first of all you are full because when you restrict your stomach shrinks cause you are not eating enough and then when you actually start to eat more your stomach is small and is full quicker.
I don't think you are eating nearly enough if you are trying to recover. But I am sure you know that, right?
I know how hard it is when you live with people who don't have to ever worry about what they eat. I too was in the same position a couple of years ago and I had a really hard time. I completely stopped eating and lost a ton of weight cause I didn't want anyone to see me eating and I couldn't eat the food they ate. (fried food, take out, pizza all the time)
Just remember that they may not eat breakfst but they eat a lot more than you do at dinner and lunch time and probably snack throughout the day so they aren't hungry in the morning.
Don't compete (easier said than done) and don't compare yourself to them. You are trying to recover and you HAVE to eat more than you are right now.
Frozen yogurt is not bad for you, its ok to have it every night. When I was seeing a nutritionist she told me that instead of a fruit after dinner I could have some ice-cream or frozen yogurt. Also, try adding some more fruit to your diet. One banana a day isn't enough. As a previous poster mentioned your lunch is really small, try eating a little bit more. Or in the afternoon with your latte why not have a slice of toast or an apple with peanut butter or some cottage cheese and some crakcers.
I know its hard but try to focus on other things during the day.

Stick with whatever you feel most comfortable with and what you WANT to eat, even if its eating the same exact foods everyday. If that means you meet the requirements of your meal plan, it's the ONLY option, isnt it? You're trying to take on too many aspects of healthy, normal eating at once- once you've mastered eating the right AMOUNTS, you can move on to experimenting with different foods, substituting and so on, but only then because you will be confident enough to do so without risking eating way less than you should. Baby steps..baby steps..don't run, walk.

USAM- thanks for the advice. I usually eat more fruit. Today, for example, I had a banana, mango and blueberries at breakfast. And after lunch I had an apple and an apricot. But I must say, it was a lot easier to eat more fruits and vegetables when I wasn't on a meal plan that filled me up with grains, fats, etc. I used to think "wow -I eat WAY more than the daily recommended amounts of fruits and vegetables everyday. I am so healthy!!," but now I find myself counting the lettuce and tomato in my sandwich as my only vegetable for the day - and that barely even passes!

I am glad you think it's ok to have frozen yogurt every night b/c I absolutely love it. I am just scared of how much I look forward to it. Sometimes I find myself thinking about it even before LUNCH and I plan on it alllllll day until it is finally "time" (after dinner). I hope this obsessive thinking will end, but what if it doesn't? What if I am just always this dessert-hoarding glutton who just can't get enough?!?!

I'm surprised that you all think that I am not eating enough. Today I woke up and had a banana, lowfat cottage cheese, mango and blueberries and a nonfat latte. Then as a snack, a granola bar. For lunch I had a big turkey sandwich on wheat bread with lettuce, tomato, sprouts and avocado and an apple and an apricot afterwards. Not sure what I'm going to do about dinner, but don't you think that's a good day so far?

GIRLY - you are absolutely right. I think I am wanting to go from anorexic to completely normal, never thinks about food, and that is almost impossible. This in-between phase is so hard though because I AM still preoccupied with food and I AM still struggling with my meal plan, but I'm also doing a lot of things right and I'm thinking differently, too. It's so much harder than I imagined it would be.

ALSO, my outpatient program ends on THURSDAY. It has been 12 weeks already! No matter what, it ends after 12 weeks. I am excited, but I am also scared to be on my own. I still feel like I have a lot of support, but it will be weird not to be in the program anymore....I don't know exactly how I feel about that. I don't even know if I'm ready to be done, but I guess I don't have a choice....

Hey ls! ok i want to talk about your little obsession with your frozen yogurt. ok..i kow exactly how you feel. i used to be like that with my big iced coffee with the real french vanilla cream stuff. i would only have that after dinner and i could not wait for it. i think its just one of those ed behaviors that WILL pass. mine did. after a while, i guess you just get used to actually knowing that your gonna eat the frozen yogurt. its hard to explain but like..we've deprived ourselves so long of that stuff so now its like "yay im "allowed" to finally eat something yummy." you know what i mean. like, since you've kept it "off limits" for so long, its kind of like a happiness that your able to set that food to "on limits." i hope you get what i mean.!! and about your program ending...you will ALWAYS have support here :D

as for me, i went to the doctor yesterday and i put on 2 more pounds. believe it or not, im actually happy about the number going up..but im currently unhappy with how i look. i feel like im gaining all over my hips and belly. the doctor says i need 4 more pounds and then ill be done but i feel like these are gonna be the hardest 4 pounds mentally on me. :( ugghh we'll see.

o and ls one more thing. i wouldn't call your entire day exactly "good." no way is that enough breakfast. wheres the grains? cereal? toast/butter? get away from that lowfat/nonfat crap. YOU NEED FAT!!!

well im going now..House is coming on tonight. omg im so excited, i got sooooooooooooooo into that show this summer, ive become obsessed. lol..well take care evryone :D

I'm glad to hear Im not the only one that has obsessive type of thinking. This really drives me crazy and what eventually made me want to get better. For me it was 1/2 cup of fat free chocolate chip mint ice cream after dinner almost every night. Right from the time I got up in the morning I would look forward to when I could finally get my little 1/2 of ice cream. I could hardly wait and it really depressed me that I would be wanting that so bad and still have to go through the rest of my day. I even had a certain time I had to eat it and it ALWAYS had to be on time or I would freak out so I would count down the hours till I could allow myself the ice cream. The time after dinner was "my time" and sort of my reward for following my "diet" I had for the day. Its so weird. Im also pretty obsessive about whole weat bread or any kind of bread. I can easlily eat a whole loaf if I allowed myself to. Its so strange before ED bread was just another food but now I look forward to eating it everyday.. Im so strange

Do you still feel the same way about your ice cream or have you gotten over that obsession? Does it go away? I don't even stop to think after dinner anymore and ask myself "do I really want it?" because I just assume that I do. I feel like I have lost control, in a sense. It really scares me.

I have also not been able to make myself be as dedicated to exercise anymore and that really scares me, too. I just plain don't FEEL like it a lot of the time and that is good enough of a reason not to do it. But before it never was. I would wake up and go before work, go on my lunchbreak, lie about going...and now I can't make myself do that as often. I know I should see that as a positive thing, but I can only see it as negative. Am I losing all of my willpower and control? Will I never be able to say "no" to myself ever again?

I've pretty much got over the ice cream thing but have moved to slices of bread. I dont know why but like Ive said I can never get enough of it. That scares me because of all the recent talk about carbs and stuff I try to limit myself to once slice a day usually with dinner. Its like I HAVE to have bread w/ dinner if I dont I sort of get mad. As I'm typing this it all sounds very strange but thats how I am. And Im still very obsessed with time. Every day dinner has to be at a certain time no later or earlier or it almost ruins my whole day. I'm trying to get over that but it just seems like my whole life is controlled by the clock. I wish I could just forget time and eat when ever and have no problem like other people do. But in time Im sure this obsessive thinking will go away - I mean nothing lasts forever right? I can also relate to the exercise thing, I use to play DDR like 5-6 hours a day every day and now I can barely get myself to do 1 hour. I just dont feel like it and its so hot where I live that its hard to do any kind of workout. I wanted to join the gym at my school hoping that doing that will motivate me into exercising again but my mom wouldnt let me and I cant afford it on my own. I guess thats a good thing since Im still a good 15 lbs underweight

Ls-i feel the same way about my excersice habits too!! i used to workout like 3-4 hours a day. now i only do like 30 min. and sometimes i even slack off from that. i think we should DEFINETLY see that as a good thing. Think about it. That obsessiveness we used to have about working out is leaving us!!! "Normal" people dont obsess about excersising. and now we're beggining not to! were on our way to "normalness". and about the fear of loosing complete control..try to remind yourself that thats just an ed fear. your not going to lose control. Think about this..how were you pre-ed? did you loose control with your eating everyday? did you pig out and NEVER excersise everyday before ed came into your life? see, recovery is all about going back to a "normal" daily life. Its not about turning you into a pig. i mean sure, we may have days we're we stuff ourselves just for the pure joy of overeating..like on a holiday for instance. but thats more that fine. just keep going and keep thinking about that light at the end of the tunnel.:)

hey dudes, i'm here and i've got a lot to say (mainly to ls, but the stuff i'm planning on writing will probably be helpful to all of us, even me, lol!)

so back to the beginning of this thread, no way, ls, that was not enough food and i know you know that. i think you even knew that as you posted it, am i right? you know what is/is not enough/healthy by now, right? in terms of fullness, honestly, i don't really buy it. or if i DO buy that you were "so full," then i feel more worried for you because i fear that your treatment hasn't helped you as much as it should have. here's why: by this point in your treatment, IF you'd followed your meal plan even relatively regularly, then that day would NOT have made you full. i'm sorry, it just wouldn't have. that was not NEARLY enough food for someone your age/weight/exercise habits/height, and if you had actually worked on retraining/refeeding your body, you would realize that now (ie: you'd feel HUNGRY eating that little food). that makes me worried, cuz i feel like your hesitance to follow the plan you've been given is REALLY screwing up your perception of a "normal" day's worth of food, you know?

regardless of anything else, you have GOT to learn to follow that plan, hon. day in and day out, no excuses. look at how long it's been and you still feel "so full" eating probably 50% of what you're supposed to eat?!? it's hurting your recovery, babe, and it worries me. i think girlygirl is right when she says that, even if it means eating nearly the EXACT same foods every day for weeks, you have to do it to learn to properly feed your body. when i first started eating more, that's pretty much what i did. for example, breakfast was cereal or oatmeal with a yogurt and fruit. EVERY SINGLE DAY. now? i'll eat (and do regularly eat) anything! cereal (any kind), oatmeal, eggs, toast with whatever on it, bagels, pop-tarts, donuts, you name it. but i didn't START there. i started on A) cereal or B) oatmeal. anything else was WAY too scary, so yeah, for a couple weeks at least (probably more), i ate one of those two every single day. then i worked up the nerve for bagels with cream cheese and added them into the rotation. then later, toast with peanut butter, then donuts, etc. but it took TIME to do that and regardless of ANYTHING else, i made sure i was always sticking to my plan, you know? so i didn't haul off and start twisting and turning my meal plan right away, cuz i knew it'd make me WAY too nervous and anxious and i'd probably "skip" some things in my plan. i started safe and VERY monotonous and comfortable, but i routinely branched out in little ways.

so basically what i'm trying to say is that you NEED to start out following that strict plan and eating those same few foods every day if necessary. and not until you can regularly do that (which you haven't done yet) can you start playing around and varying things, k?

in terms of "fullness," make a rule: if you ate EVERYTHING on the plan, then you can moan to yourself about how full you are. if you didn't, check that voice and tell yourself that regardless of how you think you feel, you did NOT eat enough. you keep letting that feeling (which i'm 99% sure is ED-driven, not LS-driven) stop you and that needs to stop. if ED is full and telling you not to eat all the food, tell him to bugger off. if you eat all the food on your plan, then you can feel a little bad if you've gotta (but i've got a feeling you won't feel so crappy, cuz like i said, it's ED that feels "stuffed," not you)

Carbs. you need to talk to your dietician about this. THEY ARE NOT BAD. yet you routinely avoid them. that needs to stop and you and your dietician need to find a way to get you eating them regularly and feeling comfortable with it. (and by the way, the "comfortable" feeling usually COMES from eating a food enough times that you stop fearing it. so fight it off, hon!)

okay, last but certainly not least, the OBSESSION with dessert. i TOTALLY used to have this (and have gotten over it), so i feel like i've got a lot of 1st hand experience ya'll can draw from. i always had ONE big dessert every night (and NO others), and i'd plan them out days in advance, look forward to them all day, barely taste my dinner because i was so excited for Ho-Hos, etc. so yes, i FULLY understand and remember what you all are talking about. will it go away? yep, it will! quickly? probably not (at least it didn't for me) but the good thing is that it WILL go away, but you've gotta get healthier first.

a few of my thoughts on the subject: why do you crave it SO badly? well first, because you deprive yourself all day. you A) aren't eating enough REGULARLY, so your body is hungry and B) aren't allowing yourself ALL foods, so your body wants those "off limits" foods. and since you won't even give it ANY off-limits foods (like ice cream), it'll crave the next best thing (frozen yogurt) like CRAZY until you get it. until you're at a healthy weight and eating enough every single day, i don't think that obsession will start to fade. and also, until you ALLOW yourself ALL foods (not just SUPER healthy ones), you won't stop being obsessed with your ONE dessert. get me? would you ever eat oreos or ICE CREAM instead of frozen yogurt? until you will, you won't stop obsessing over it. would you ever eat a Hershey's after lunch AND plan on having dessert after dinner? until you have that FREEDOM in allowing yourself those foods when you want them, then you will continue to be completely OBSESSED with your one TREAT throughout the day.

just think: when everything else you eat is light/healthy/diety/BORING, then you're gonna WAIT till your one chance to ENJOY your food. i know it sounds weird, but i believe that your reluctance to eat something like pizza is directly related to your frozen yogurt obsession. because you choose the "grilled chicken salad, dressing on the side" when you REALLY want the burger and fries, then your brain will just start obsessing over when it gets something it actually WANTS (ie: the dessert)

so what can you do? wait it out and keep trying. keep sticking to the plan and pushing yourself, both in terms of the foods you eat for meals and in terms of dessert. it doesn't ALWAYS have to be frozen yogurt, you know? when's the last time you ate oreos? seriously, when? i think you need to PLAN 3 non-frozen yogurt desserts this week and then actually eat them, you know? so just keep challenging yourself and switching things up and i promise, it WILL fade eventually. (now that's not to say i DON'T look forward to my chocolate cake at night, lol! i'll always love my sweets! it's just that i don't start thinking about it the minute i fall out of bed, you know?)

okay, i really gotta go! talk to you all soon and hope this helps!

Joni-
Your advice always helps me so much b/c I feel like we have such similar thought patterns. I'm sure you're absolutely right about the dessert thing, but I guess I deny the fact that I deprive myself during the day b/c I truly feel like I'm eating so much! I don't remember the last time I said "I'm going to have a brownie after dinner tonight!" and felt 100% ok with that. The frozen yogurt is something I really love, but it's also SAFE. I started telling people in my group the other day that it was ice cream I was addicted to b/c I was embarassed that it was just frozen yogurt and I knew they would say it was fine. So I told them it was ice cream to see what they would say then. That is not normal b/c I made them think I am eating ice cream every single night and I'm not!...it's frozen yogurt!!
Let's take today for example...
Breakfast was Egg beaters scrambled with LF cheese in a wheat tortilla and orange juice
Then I had coffee with nonfat milk and a granola bar as a snack
Lunch was 3 rye crackers with 1/2 cup LF cottage cheese and 1-1.5c of this waldorf chicken salad (walnuts, grapes, celery, LF mayo - at least I think lowfat)
Then I had an apple as a snack later.
And dinner was a teriyaki rice bowl. I just got home from being out (had about 2 drinks) and was really hungry (but I HATE eating when I get home so late) so I had some crackers and a bowl of cottage cheese, mango, and blueberries. WHY DO I FEEL BAD?
I think it's because I have these strict guidelines in my head as to what is "normal" and when I stray from them, I feel gross. But, like you said, I should be able to fight those feelings off now that I am through with my Outpatient Program and have learned new coping skills. The truth is, I am MUCH better at identifying my emotions, I HAVE restored some weight, and I am all-around "better," if you want to call it that...but I still have Ed asserting his opinion right and left!

I sort of get scared sometimes, Joni, because I honestly think you are right. I've almost convinced myself and lied to myself that I follow my meal plan 100% and I'm on my way to "normality," but really, I don't and so therefore I am not. My MP breakfast is 2 carbs, 2 protein, 1 fat, 1 fruit and 1 dairy. That started out as 2 pieces of toast, 2 eggs, cheese, and fruit and has slowly dwindled to 1 wheat tortilla, egg beaters, LF cheese and sometimes juice. I know that's not THAT different, but it's those little changes that I can't afford to make b/c they are what I NEED to push me over the edge right? I just can't imagine my life being controlled by this ED any longer. It makes me sad to even imagine. Yeah, maybe I'm not deathly thin anymore and obviously sick, but I am still very conscious of this disease and it still affects me tremendously day in and day out. I truly wish I could meet you and you could help me tackle this b/c it's SO hard. Especially when I compare what I HAVE to eat to what my friends eat and I feel like a huge cow. Howcome I HAD to eat dinner tonight before we went out drinking, but they didn't? Howcome I make eggs every single morning and they can run out the door on empty? It just frustrates me!
I'm scared now that my program is over and I'm on my own, basically. I guess this will be the true test to see if I can keep it together on my own. I'm honestly praying that I can.

How are YOU? How is the job going? Acting? Boyfriend? Still in Chicago? Have things gotten easier with your ED? Have you restored more weight? I hope you're happy and healthy - write again soon....
XO
LS

I dont have time to write out a huge long response, but just a comment-

how on earth is egg beaters, a tortilla, LF cheese and juice 2 protein, 2 carbs, 1 fat/fruit/dairy?? Realistically, NOTHING, save for mayeb a slight amount in the cheese, has any fat, the tortilla ..depends on the size I suppose but thats barely 2 carbs..I suppose the egg beaters supplied the protein, depending on hw much your eally had, and the juice made the fruit alright. But wheres the FAT? Again, you're skimping..your breakfast is and was much better when you had 2 toast, 2 eggs and the whole thing before..

A word of advice..for me, breakfast (and lunch) was made a little easier because I set it up so I always had a yogurt, a glass of milk, and a fruit with an "entree..the entree being a bagel and cream cheese, eggs and toast, 2 bowls cereal, pb/j and toast, a big bowl oatmeal/sugar, 2 waffles and syrup, 2 french toast and syrup, etc...that way my entree varied but I always had that yogurt, milk (or juice sometimes I guess) and fruit, no matter what.

For lunch, similarly, I stuck to an entree, a salad (with real dressing for my 'fat'..or veggies with oil/butter), fruit, milk and dessert- the entree was admittedly usually a sandwich, but could easily be soup and crackers, meat and a starch, etc. The dessert was 2 cookies or a scoop of ice cream, a granola bar, cereal, yogurt..etc..anything really. I found this plan really good because it allowed for structure and variety.

But then again, these are only suggestions and you must step up your eating so youre eating enough daily before you attempt to change anything. I also think you should increase the amt you eat btwn lunch and dinner, because for whatever reason you always eat dinner really late and are really hungry, so no matter what you eat you feel guilty because you feel you've overeaten. If you had more than just an apple, you'd be able to tide over yoru hungry much better. Try having some sort of protein and carb or fat in there..like cheese, crackers and an apple..or yogurt, a fruit and nuts..etc...whatever you feel most comfrtable with, do it- even, like i said, if you eat the exact same thing every day, you need to do it to get better.

Hey girls,

i too don't have a ton of time, but i wanted to post a few quick things. ls, i'm really glad you're recognizing where your fallbacks and major challenges are right now. you aren't in a state of complete denial about where you're "skimping" on meals and what's holding you back, so that's good. now the next step is acting on that, which is a lot harder than just noticing it, but i KNOW that you can do this. i really believe the key is establishing STRUCTURE for every day and taking one small step at a time. i'm thinking about it sort of like saving money, you know? it's too much too think about all at once (ie: saving for a house one day, oh my!), but when you start to establish some structure and habit with it (ie: every paycheck, i will put $200 in the bank) and then work up from there, it really becomes more manageable. AND it becomes more AUTOMATIC, so you don't have to worry and stress out about it. you just do it, what you know you should be doing, and in the end, it isn't that painful. PLUS, because it becomes an automatic habit, you don't run any risk of screwing up, you know? like, because you already put the $200 in the bank, you can't change your mind last minute and spend it on shoes. you've already set up a structure that you follow every day (or paycheck in the money situation), so you actually have to WORK to break it, instead of working just to MAKE it happen, you know?

anyway, don't know if that really made much sense, but basically, i think that establishing that structure with food and GRADUALLY (not suddenly) adding and changing and improving things is the best way to go.

and on that note ... the grocery store! This is the primary place that i think you can REALLY take some steps forward. here's why: if low-fat cheese isn't in the house, you can't eat it, right? if egg beaters aren't there, you've gotta have real eggs, right? since you're living on your own now, this is the PERFECT opportunity for you to start making those changes. i'm assuming that you buy all your own food for your meals/snacks, right? (that's what my roomates and i always did) well now, hon, you've gotta set up "grocery store rules." it's time for you to get down to the nitty-gritty technical stuff, cuz i think you're doing GREAT with the emotional side of things, but now you've just gotta tackle the technical aspects of recovery, right? and honestly, it isn't that hard. you just turn Ed to "OFF" in the grocery store, follow your pre-set "rules" of grocery shopping and DO IT. don't think, just DO. wear an i-pod while you shop maybe (music really helps me shut Ed's voice out) and just buy what's on your grocery list. Leave, put the stuff away at home and then eat it. honeslty, i think you'll find this is a LOT easier and less painful than it seems.

so now, some "Grocery Store Rules" suggestions from me! first, use a list. decide what you're going to buy in advance and then buy it. all of it. (even if there's something scary on the list!) make sure the list you make gets you ALL the food you need to stick to your meal plan, okay? second, make some strict rules. some obvious ones i would think of for you would be 1) i only buy regular cheese, 2) i only buy real eggs, 3) i will buy a loaf of bread every time i shop, etc. and then, DO NOT break those rules. just walk into the egg section, pick up the eggs, and MOVE. don't dwell on "well, maybe i should get egg beaters because blah blah blah." since you've A) made your list and B) made those rules, you've just gotta do what you KNOW is right. and then just keep shopping. cuz if you let yourself (or rather Ed) start comtemplating the food choices, you risk falling back, you know?

it's hard when you and Ed start "talking" in the grocery store, i know. it still gets me sometimes too. like Ed will say "just get light sour cream, it tastes the same and it's lower calories," but i know i should get the regular. and i stand there for like 2 minutes like a MORON staring at the sour creams and trying to decide between light and regular. and i have to FORCE myself to pick up that stupid regular and keep shopping. cuz i know if i get the light this time, Ed will remind me of that next time and then next thing i know, Ed and me will be buying the "fat-free" and that's NOT the direction i want to head in, you know? and honestly, when i get that "regular" sour cream home in my fridge, i'm like "why was i debating about this?!?! it's not even a big deal!" and then i happily eat it and don't stress.

i don't know if you'd be willing to do this, but another suggestion is to enlist the help and support of your roomates. i know it sounds embarrassing, but think about it, if you were in their shoes, wouldn't you want to help your friend get better as quickly as possible? what i mean is to tell them your "shopping rules." that way they KNOW that LF cheese is not allowed. i think that will help deter you from "breaking" the rules, plus, then even if you slip, you can talk it over with friends who really care about you and i think it'll help you do better next grocery shop, you know? for me, i still slip and pick up the "light" sometimes. but Eric knows that i'm not "supposed" to (according to my own rules.) so he'll pull it out and be like, "Jo! what is this?!? you know i'm not supposed to eat light sour cream!" and then we laugh about it and then next time, i don't buy it cuz i KNOW it's not the healthy choice for me.

the final grocery store tip i've got for you is to buy one (just one!) scary food each time. i'd suggest a dessert this time. like what's your FAVORITE packaged cookie? oreos, chips ahoy, nutter butters, those striped ones with a hole in the middle? i really think you should buy just one kind of cookies (your fav!). it doesn't have to be something terrifying like a cheesecake from the bakery, but just something "out of the norm" that you LOVE the taste of. just get the package in your cupboard. you might keep them there for 2 weeks before you actually work up the nerve to open them and have a couple, but at least they're there, you know? i really think this is key. cuz the more you see that "forbidden" food that you love, the more you're gonna want it and then finally, you'll get brave and eat it! and then you realize you don't die from it and eat it again the next day. and so on until X kind of cookies is no longer scary, you know? so then you buy something else and keep doing this same process. yes, it's tedious and somewhat anxiety-ridden, but the benefits FAR outweigh the negatives.

finally (i really gotta go!), try (and yes, this IS hard to do) to not pay attention to what others eat. ED loves to do that, we know that already, right? but what Ed always seems to "not notice" is when others eat MORE than us. he ONLY notices when he THINKS we're eating more. trust me, this is tough, but you HAVE to do it to an extent. i live with a 27 year old guy who eats A LOT, and Ed and me battle this out ALL the time. like i "don't notice" when Eric sits down and polishes off 1/2 a bag of chips with a side of mountain dew before dinner. but i blow my top off and feel like a fat cow when he skips breakfast. the truth is that our perception of when/what others eat is TOTALLY morphed, so we HAVE to stick to our plan and just try to keep moving forward and try as best as we can to ignore our ideas of what others eat. cuz frankly, as much as we can "prove" we're eating SO much more, we wrong. we don't KNOW what/when others eat, so we have to work on letting it go, you know? and your friends not eating dinner before going out? that's not normal. so just tell yourself that over and over and over if you have to. if it makes you feel any better, ALL of my friends eat dinner before going out and always have, k?

well i gotta go, but i hope this helps! oh yeah, and i'm doing good! no acting, looking for a new job still (frustrating!) and going to Madison, WI (where i went to college) to visit friends this weekend, yay! have a good weekend and GO SHOPPING! :)

Girly-
That's a really good idea. I like the fact that that would alllow me to have something structured, yet vary it a little bit, too. This morning I switched up my breakfast b/c I was REALLY craving carbs (namely cereal). I had a big banana cut up with a yogurt and a huge amount of cereal and some raisins. I feel really full and disgusting right now b/c that is just how creal ALWAYS makes me feel for some reason.
Also, I just ate that "snack" at 1am or something last night and I woke up and ate breakfast at 8 - I wasn't even hungry!! I feel like that is a sign that I am obsessed with food (getting up before I'm even rested to make breakfast b/c I'm so excited) and that I'm going to spiral out of control and eat everything!
Honestly though, how do you justify the comparing thing that I do. Yeah, I know I'm at a different place than my friends and maybe I need to GAIN weight, but they need to eat SOMETHING!! How is it fair that they can run off to work and not eat anything, and not only do I have to, I have to make a big two-egg platter with juice and toast! I can't help but get angry when that happens.
Ugh - I feel SO full right now. Looks like I've come full-circle and am relating back to the original title of my post.
I feel like I do that a lot with cereal - eat wayyyy too much. Sometimes I'll pour a bowl and then just keep eating out of the box as if that cereal doesn't "count."
Since I ate such a large breakfast, would it be ok to eat a smaller lunch if I promise to get back on track with dinner? I KNOW that I won't be hungry by lunchtime. I can promise you that.

No LS, I dont think its a good idea to skimp on lunch because of breakfast. I remember when I was recovering there were many many times I had to force myself to eat. You seem to be constantly forgetting that you ARENT recovered nor is your eating going to be normal. You ARENT going to be eating because you are hungry- you don't know what hungry is! Furthermore, I HIGHLY doubt that any amount you eat would be "overeating"..your mind physically, no matter what you say, would jsut not let it happen. Realistically, your "so full" feeling likely is just plain old "full"..and you know what? Since you seem to be wanting to imitate others, as far as I know, most people sit back and say "ahh Im so full.." and enjoy it, reminiscing about how good their meal was. They aren't hungry anymore, they are satisfied, and thus can carry on with their day. And then when lunchtime comes along, they wont even question how much they eat, they'll jsut eat til theyre full again.

You are not "normal" nor will your eating patterns be "normal." You CANNOT and should not compare yourself to others and their eating patterns because you are not like them. They do not obsess over calories and fat and food choices...they eat what they want in any amounts and do not second guess it. You do, you would, and that is why you can't emulate their eating right now. When you get to the point where you CAN, you will be at a healthy weight and healthy mindset. Realistically, you can't even eating LOW FAT, LOW CAL frozen yogurt without feeling guilty!

Eat lunch normally. Eat a big snack. Eat dinner. Eat dessert. Do not change your eating because of your feelings right now. That's your ed talking and you can't pay attention to it, no matter how "logical" it may be. You are taking baby steps and you are sticking to your meal plan for a START..once you can do that basic step, you'll know you've got some progress going..

hi everyone:wave: sorry i havent been here for a while. this past week has been really bad and extra weird with my ed. Yesterday morning i had one of those "yea i guess i am too skinny" images in the mirror and then just 3 hours later, i looked like a cow in the mirror. and i just tell myself that its just illusions but it doesnt work. yes, i know its ed making me look bigger and its not real, but for some reason, its REALLY getting to me latley. all my friends say i look 100% better but i still need 4 more pounds. i dont get it?!? why cant i just be done?!?! seriously i hate this. i look healthy i feel healthy, but i still need to gain? what is up with that. i dont knowwwww. ughhh.
ls- listen to everything everyone is saying to you. dont compare..theres no point. everyone is 100% differnt. sure i have friends who skip breakfast which is an immediate trigger, but then when i see them eat twice as much as me at lunch, i dont feel so bad afterwords. are your friends loosing weight? if they're not, then they're eating!! you just might not see when though.

i gotts go but i hope evryone is doing great :D

ls, how's this week going so far? i hope you're doing well and getting better at sticking to the meal plan. i also REALLY hope you didn't restrict on the day that Ed told you you ate too much for breakfast. (cuz seriously hon, i'm 99% sure you didn't eat "too much"). keep trying to stick to the plan (or rather, just stick to it; it really isn't that hard) and you'll get better at this. you won't feel "so full" after a breakfast like that IF you can stick to your plan for like a week straight, you know? but if you keep jumping around and sticking to it now and again, then it's gonna keep being this hard, you know?

if it makes you feel any better, cereal always makes me feel a little "off/loopy" when i have it for breakfast too. it has NOTHING to do with you "overeating" or "eating carbs, which are bad." i think it's just the way cereal makes some people feel! it doesn't matter if i have two big bowls or one teensy one, i always get that weird-o stomach feeling, so i really think it has nothing to do with the quantity either. (regardless of the McNasty feeling i get after eating it, i still eat it all the time, lol! it's just SO good!!!) anyway, just wanted to throw that out there so you know that it's not just you that cereal does funky things to. :)

what did you think of my last post? i really feel like you're "delaying" your recovery (not intentionally, i just think you're stuck in this safe place and not moving forward much, you know?) and i think some of the things i posted (like "rules" when grocery shopping, mandatory "challenge foods" in the house, etc.) would really help. anyway, let me know what you thought.

pinstriped, hope you're feeling better and JUST HANG IN THERE! you've been doing SO great and you're so so SO close now. i know Ed says "ugh, 4 more HUGE fatso pounds," but really, what's four pounds??? it's hardly anything at all, you know?!?! sometimes, i've gotta remind myself of that too. it's REALLY not much at all! 20 pounds, fine, that's major. but 4??? that's A) not a "noticable" amount to anyone but our good old friend Ed and B) not even a big deal on the number you see on the scale. you're doing so great and i KNOW you're gonna get those four pounds and look even more fabulously hot!

it seems like you're having a lot of trouble with the body stuff lately, and i wish i had more good advice to help you. i can tell you for one that hips and thighs and a little stomach curve are SEXY. seriously. even i think they're sexy and i'm a girl! Ls said to me once (and she's SO right) that guys OBSESS over stars with awesome curves -- J. Lo, etc. (my bf LOVES Kate Winslet, for example). who do they not dream about??? supermodels. cuz frankly, the whole bony thing is UNATTRACTIVE. hips??? those are one of our assets as women, hon!! you're just getting to the age where you get to learn to USE those hips -- get that walk down, and just try to FEEL how sexy you are with your fabulous hips. i'm totally serious here. you've gotta believe how GOOD hips look (and boobs, if you're lucky enough to have them. i'm not, lol). they are what MAKE the female body (along with the boob part), you know? guys have the bony, straight and BORING bodies. we? we have curves that men (and women) have been painting for thousands of years because they're so beautiful. our flesh and curves and yes, fat, is what makes us the more attractive of the sexes, so learn to use it! i already know you got fabulous curly hair (right?), so i bet your developing body is just making you all the prettier.

i know i can't really convince you of all these things, you have to find it and learn it yourself, but i hope you can think along those lines a little. just keep sticking it out and it'll get better, you know? and the mirror? stay away from it as much as possible. i LOVE to use my "fat days" as an excuse to look in the mirror 14 million times, even though i KNOW it just reinforces my bad feelings and actually makes me feel worse. when i'm smart enough to stay away from it (getting better at that), i find that the "fat feeling" often goes away (at least to a degree) on its own. so stand far clear of the mirror!

have a good day ya'll and i hope to get some updates soon! and on that note, sorry i have nothing to say about me! here's a little, relatively boring stuff: i'm learning to play guitar and it's AWESOME! i still kinda suck, but i REALLY like it. also, went to madison to visit old college friends this weekend and did REALLY good with the whole food part and was able to relax and have lots of fun! been sweating my way through this heat wave (are you all getting this too?), but i secretly LOVE hot weather (even though i swear i sweat MUCH more than the average woman, lol!), so i'm loving it despite the ungodly temperatures and humidity. REALLY want a new job (cuz this one SUCKS), but am having trouble finding one. there's tons out there, but i apply and often don't hear anything. guess it's just a "numbers game," you know? anyway, that's really it for me. still stuck at the same STUPID weight and not understanding that whole phenomenom, but not trying to either. just relaxing, having fun and playing (or trying to play) my guitar! have a good one and stay cool!

Hey there!!
Joni - I haven't gone to the grocery store since you posted that "rule" list, but I'm definitely going to use that advice next time I go. I think I had gone grocery shopping earlier on the day that you posted that and I was laughing to myself because I was TOTALLY standing there debating over stupid things like lowfat yogurt or nonfat yogurt, small tortillas or big tortillas, and lowfat cheese or regular cheese. Of course, I ended up getting the lowfat cheese, the fat free yogurt and the smaller tortillas, but at least I didn't get the fat free cheese, etc.
I've been doing a good job of sticking to my meal plan, but I'm a little concerned that I've somewhat condensed it and I just THINK I'm eating the whole thing. But I really am eating a lot! Like, for breakfast, for example, I am supposed to have 2 grains, 1 dairy, 1 fat, 2 protein and 1 fruit. That would be 2 pieces of toast, 2 eggs, cheese, and maybe some OJ. What I really eat every single morning is a lower-carb tortilla with scrambled egg beaters and cheese and some blueberries or maybe some juice. Sometimes I'll have a latte, too. My snack midmorning is 2 grains and 1 dairy and I usually just have a granola bar. Then for lunch I do a good job - I almost always have a big turkey sandwich with bread, lettuce, tomato, avocado, turkey, and mustard and some sort of fruit on the side. The afternoon snack is always really hard for me to force in, but I try. Right now it's about 3pm and I am SO full. I ate that same breakfast, a granola bar, and that same lunch with an apple and I just can't believe how full I am. I can also tell that I am gaining weight, which is obviously a good thing, but it has me worried for several reasons.
First of all, if I'm not even really following the MP 100% (although I might be) then how could I be gaining all this weight? And second of all, how will I ever stop!?
I feel like my hunger has quadrupled since I've started eating more. I wake up every morning hungry (which never used to happen before) and I actually feel like I NEED to eat when it's meal time. I love that feeling, but it also scares me because I'm still so nervous to trust my body's signals.
Last night I went out to thai food and ate sooo much. We ordered a bunch of different dishes and shared them and they all came with rice and they were so good. That was at about 7. Later on that night I felt like I could eat again! I wanted a snack or something, but honestly, I could not even believe I was thinking about it b/c I had eaten so much at dinner! That is what I mean when I can't trust my body. I don't know what I'm supposed to be feeling and if what I'm feeling is legitimate.
I'm exercising some, but not overdoing it. How about you, Joni? Can you exercise yet? I still absolutely LOVE yoga. I have been doing it as often as I can and I can just feel myself getting stronger and more flexible (and I'm sure the better nutrition is helping with that!!) It's given me such a sense of peace and happiness and I would recommend it to any and everyone. The other day I was in there and I just felt SO strong and connected to my core and I realized that I loved the way my body is feeling stronger and more alive. I didn't care that my hip bones weren't as visible or my arms weren't as frail - in fact, I loved that they weren't!

I do wish this recovery process didn't have to take so long, but I have been learning so much about myself in the process that maybe I should try and see the positive side of it. There are a lot of things I still need to work on and change, but then again, there are a lot of things that have already changed that I am so proud of. I just can't wait to be free from him and his ridiculous thoughts!!!! He's even commenting on my bulging stomach right now as I write this. I'm trying to tell him it's because I'm full and just ate, but he's telling me it's because I didn't exercise today and won't be able to do it tomorrow, either. How does he know I'll be fat if I don't exercise tomorrow if it's not even tomorrow yet!?!? See!! He even has faulty logic! Oh, so now he can tell the future??? Wow - I give him wayyyy too much credit. What a moron. Haha.

Anyway, that was interesting. Sorry for that break from reality. Haha. I hope everyone is having a beautiful day and I'll talk to you all soon!
HANG IN THERE, Pinstriped!! If I can do it, I know you can, too. You're doing awesome and seriously listen to what Joni said about women and curves. She's not even talking about "fat" curves - just natural, voluptuous curves that EVERY woman should be entitled to. Flaunt it!!

Hi, I mostly am a reader

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feel I can relate so much with you LS, and Joni, as well. As I was perusing some other boards, I saw one on exercise and fitness that you posted, Joni, and just wanted to say that I am glad you have been able to run 4 days a week for a while now. I am proud of your progress!!

Hey dudes (or should i say "dudettes" ... man i'm a geek!)

Ls, i'm glad you're doing well with all that stuff. The MP stuff seems to be going MUCH better, so that's awesome. now maybe just try the "baby steps" approach to take it from where you are (very close to the actual MP) to where you're supposed to be (the MP), you know? first of all, congratulate yourself on being able to regularly get it as close as you are. now, tackle one little piece at a time. for example, maybe you tackle "mid-morning snack" first. so instead of just the granola bar (does that count as one or two grains?), you start regularly eating the granola bar (if it's two grains, otherwise something else) and a piece of string cheese. leave breakfast as is for now, just work on that one little part you know? then when you've got that one down and feeling comfortable, tackle a little part of breakfast and on from there. you're doing REALLY great, so i don't think these final steps will take much outta you. i think it'll probably be relatively painless and easy to form those additional little habits, you know? plus, getting the proper food in the house (real cheese, real eggs, regular-size tortillas (no way is one of those small ones 2 grains!)) will help a lot too.

i totally know what you mean about feeling MUCH hungrier overall once you start eating what your body actually needs. i remember i was eating about 1200 calories a day when i started therapy and that was it. now? i eat more than that BEFORE dinner! and i can't even IMAGINE surviving the entire day on that amount of food, you know? maybe that's something that could help us cope with ED flaring up when other people skip breakfast, etc. Ed likes to tell me what a PIG i am cuz i need breakfast and so-and-so just skipped it, but in reality, i'm not a pig! i'm a healthy, hungry girl! and truly, i NEED that meal. i'm not eating "just to eat," i'm eating cuz i'm hungry. cuz my body hasn't eaten since the night before and it needs it's fuel to start off the day. anyway, i totally can relate to you on that one. people in my office eat like a packet of oatmeal for breakfast and that's it till lunch and i'm like "gigga what?!? i'd pass out if that's all i ate!" i really view it as a good thing, i guess. if we're getting so hungry, it just means we're so HEALTHY, you know?

last, but most definitely not least, don't just assume that you're gaining weight and definitely don't let that affect ANYTHING you do or eat, k? i only want to throw that out there, cuz (at least for me) Ed ALWAYS says we're gaining weight. seriously, even when i was at my sickest, Ed and I could tell that i was gaining weight, you know? and now, i feel like i've "definitely" gained weight like everyday. yet when i weigh in, the number remains the same. anyway, i'm just saying this to give you a little something to fall back on if that thought is getting you down. you may think you're gaining, you may feel like you've gained, but there is only one person who can really assess that, and that's your doctor with his/her scale, you know? oh yeah, and don't worry (lol!), you won't gain indefinitely until you weigh 200 pounds. i promise! :) your body will fall into it's natural, healthy weight range and you'll happily settle in there, you know?

anyway, have a good one and you stay cool too! it's our final day of "sweltering," i think (and hope!) we're supposed to get thunderstorms tonight and tomorrow to break this heat wave. even though i LOVE hot weather, i'm glad ... i need a little break where i don't get drenched in sweat every time i lift a finger, lol! and my "exercise" has definitely gotten much better. i was always allowed to keep my running, which was cut to 3 miles, 4 days a week (which frankly, i LIKE now ... more is too much, lol!). the "restricted exercise" was just ALL other forms of movement (and yes, that included walking around the block even), so basically i ran, sat at work and then went home to sit around. it's still VERY restricted, but due to me having a minor hissy fit in june (the "it's not fair" type, lol), i'm now allowed up to 1 mile of walking a day. nothing else though, which does suck. for example (major bummer), i haven't sat on my bike all summer. :( i haven't even pumped the tires, cuz i know it'll just frustrate me that i can't ride AT ALL. and nothing else fun like tennis or frisbee or anything like that, you know? so it majorly sucks overall, but at least with my measely little 1 mile (remember i live downtown, so that's necessary just to LIVE) at least i can get out of the house, you know? so that's my business (man, now i want to ride my bike!), have a good one!

hi everyone-thanks for your replies, they made me feel SO SO SO much better.

However, i went to the beach today with a bunch of my friends. My best friend told me that i looked so much better. She told me that I filled out where my collar bone and chest bones used to stick out. i told her how i still hafta gain 4 more pounds and she said nothing. then asked if i looked 100% better and she told me 99% better. ok- WHAT THE F* DOES THAT MEAN?!?!?:confused: Did she say that so that i dont feel bad about gaining 4 pounds over a healthy looking body? or do i really not look 100% better and she told me 99% so that i wouldnt get upset (not knowing that it actually works the opposite way for me)? or did she say 99% so that i would keep going whereas i would want to completley just end it if she said 100%. omg i dont know:confused: whyyyy do i hafta keep going??