Hello. I am new to the boards and seeking advice. My mother has manic depression, and has been on tons of medications for years. (about 30years now). I think she's also been diagnosed wih schizoaffective disorder and she also has anxiety. My father is a saint, in a way, and has stood by her side. My sister and I, however, are so frustrated with her that at the moment we are not speaking to her. The problem is that my mother seems to lie all the time. For example, she returns things that are used and lies to the stores, she sells antiques and fabricates stories about where she got the items, she recently claimed that someone stole things out of the house (we can't prove it a lie) but the amount she was claiming on homeowners was outrageous, she secretly had a credit card bill of 10K(this is the first time this has ever happened), the frustrations go on and on. She also doesn't work outside the home..she can shop during the day, but when my dad comes home from a 40hour work week he cooks, cleans, vaccuums, cuts the grass, grocery shops, etc. She does jack. She does have a back problem but it's always something. If her back doesn't hurt, she'll come up with some other reason people have to wait on her. She doesn't act appropriately in public. She'll be out shopping and be impatient and almost butt in line, she'll cause a scene, she'll sit on the floor in the middle of the store to rest if I am shopping with her. She's just embarasing. What I am asking is if this is all related to her illness and my sister and I shold cut her some slack. But we feel that ill or not you still are responsible for your actions and we've finally hit our lids where we can't stand her anymore. I've told her how I feel about her behaviors. She has an excuse for everything. We can never prove her to be wrong. She will talk you in circles about why she is right. it's so frustrating. I just want to be confirmed that even if you are sick with a mental illness you should be able to control the lieing, cheating the system, etc. behaviors. She just seems like such a dishonorable person..but at the same time is my mother. My dad has the same suspicions but since he can't prove it and he has to live with her, he won't confront her becuase she'll win anyway and he can't take the stress. He just walks around blindly. any advice would be greatly appreciated! Thanks!

Rae

A lot of the stuff you've described sounds like it could very well be due to the schizoaffective disorder. Does your mother still visit a psychiatrist? The things you've just talked about are common in people with schizophrenia- delusions, which are false beliefs or ideas, aka the house being robbed. I don't know enough to make any diagnosis, but what I do know is that severe mental illnesses definately have a big impact on how the person acts, and sometimes it is out of their control. Sorry I couldn't help. Good luck with your mom.
ps- my mom sits on the floor when we go shopping too...

Well I don't think my mom is seeing things or imagining that the house was robbed. I think what is happening is she has a huge credit card debit and thought this is a perfect way to claim some money on the home insurance to pay it off. I think she just came up with it as a lie. But of course can't prove it. She does still see a psychiatrist..but not as often as she used to. Basically on a medication maintanence. Of course I believe she goes in there and says she's fine and doesn't tell her of all her lies and behaviors etc. I've thought about calling this pyschiatrist and telling her of all the concerns our family has, but she's not the type to keep it quiet. She'll go straight to my mom and say I called and I don't want to deal with the wrath that would come from that. It's just so frustrating on how to help her. Ughh! Thanks for helping though!

Rachel

Rae,
I am sorry your frustration has affected you and your sister's relationships with your mother to the point neither of you are currently speaking to her.

Lying is a common problem for manic depressives, so much is happening in their minds that it is difficult to pick out the appropriate thing to say, so often, they just say the first thing, making it up as they go. Then they have to go back and cover for these impulsive lies.

Because of the impulsivity and lack of judgement common in bipolar, massive credit card debt from ill advised shopping trips are also a well-known symptom. For the moment, while shopping, things seem happy and better, instead of depressed or out of control, but bipolars experience an inability to curb this short term pleasure in the interest of mitigating long term consequences. Like debt and its resulting troubles.

Often because of depression or unreliability manic depressive persons do poorly in work situations, have reduced capacity to do work, or are not very employable. Many, even with adequate treatment and support, do not have jobs for long, or may be on disability.

At times your mother may be incompacitated to the point that others take over and wait on her, but if this is a constant deal, then she may indeed be taking advantage. Or since she has so many present symptoms, I would say that her medication and therapy may not be adequate. But if your mother is happy with them, you may have a difficult time persuading her regarding this.

You can ask her therapist about family therapy if you suspect your mother is not adequately describing her symptoms to the therapist, or simply tell the therapist why you are concerned for your mother without mentioning that you think she is not reporting these things. Your mother may be touched by the expression of concern, but may be angry if she feels you are interfering.

The inappropriate actions in public do seem partly related to bipolar, the impatience and demanding attitude. Or the need to rest more frequently. But it may also be that she is engaging in a protest of sorts, maybe she has an issue with you that she is relunctant to discuss. Thus the antics when the two of you shop together.

Yes, most of these could very well be related to her illness. In general, bipolars feel that unless you are psychotic, then you are responsible for your actions. Yet this is difficult when your actions while ill may be quite different from the behavior you engage in when you are stable. Most have to come to grips with this issue in their own way. Mental illness is baffling in this respect: how do you seperate the symptoms from the individual? Most persons would not blame a cancer patient's symptoms on the patient, but on the illness. But people commonly blame the individual instead of the illness when manic depressives act out symptomatically.

I can see how frustrating it must be to never have proof of her being in the wrong. Yet it is also common for family and friends who have not experienced bipolar, schizoaffective symptoms, or anxiety to not fully understand the impact of these on a person and their life. I believe that every thing you have stated indicates that your mother is wrong in one respect at least, her illness is a very present reality and is not receiving adequate treatment.

While ill, your mother may not be able to control these actions lying, cheating, impulsivity, depression, etc., these symptoms do not constitute your mother. Her character doesnt change because she is ill and not in control of her actions. If you suspect that the things you have listed are character issues, then that is another issue, one in which I can offer no advice. If your mother receives adequate treatment however, unless these actions are truly a part of her character, then she will be able to be in control of her life and actions while maintaining stability. However, periods of instability will be a constant possibility at later dates. Something to be watched for, I would urge you to talk to her therapist and/or her doctor immediately. It is important to well manage bipolar disorder, undertreatment results in a worsening condition.

I hope that you will soon reconcile with your mother, bipolars need all the support they can get from family and friends. Difficulty in relationships is always stressful on both parties. I know this may not be the reply you were hoping for, but I hope it will be helpful to you in sorting out your mom's behaviors and differentiating them from the person you know.

Compassionately, zion

I am new to this board, but have been diagnosed with bipolar, schizoaffective disorder, and generalized anxiety disorder for more than 15 years.

Thanks Zion for the detailed reply to my post. I think the key to things is whether this behavior is a character flaw or her illness. My sister and I get so tired of making her illness an excuse. I guess the problems could be partly both. It's just so frustrating. I am speaking to her again, but am distancing myself for my own sanity. I can't take the stress myself. Your post helped me to understand that yes my mother is ill and that her behaviors are partly due to her illness...but at the same time I think she has the ability to control some of the things she does and is just selfish and used to getting her way. She is very manipulative..another common trait in mental illness I would think. Well thanks again!

Rae

psychiatry is not an exact science, too often it is based only on the information provided by the patient...3rd party information can be a very valuable tool for the psychiatrist to use in a proper assessment of how the medication is actually working with your mom...perhaps you can send the psychiatrist a letter listing your mom's behaviors so that it can be discussed at the next visit....best wishes to you...