janeslk
09-14-2006, 11:54 AM
My husband is calling his doctor to schedule a cholesterol test next week. Should he request the VAP test instead of the standard cholesterol panel? He is also having a CPK test. His doctor in the past has refused to do any testing for high genetic LDL, saying he can't do anything about it so why do it.
Any input on what tests he should request would be appreciated. My eyes start to glaze over when I start reading about all the tests. In May his TC was 269, HDL was 53, LDL was 195 and TRI were 104. His liver enzymes were higher than usual and although not out of range he stopped his non-flush niacin. His CPK also had increased. We think his TC has dropped another 30 points since the doctor's test, based upon two home tests, but I am not sure of the value of a simple cholesterol panel test.
We pay everything out-of-pocket so I want the most bang for the buck.
Jane
Any input on what tests he should request would be appreciated. My eyes start to glaze over when I start reading about all the tests. In May his TC was 269, HDL was 53, LDL was 195 and TRI were 104. His liver enzymes were higher than usual and although not out of range he stopped his non-flush niacin. His CPK also had increased. We think his TC has dropped another 30 points since the doctor's test, based upon two home tests, but I am not sure of the value of a simple cholesterol panel test.
We pay everything out-of-pocket so I want the most bang for the buck.
Jane
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NHone
09-15-2006, 12:28 AM
I understand the out of pocket..... You might want to have a CRP test and an Lp(a) test done. THis should give you some degree of information of inflammation. You might check out the tests Spectracell in Houston offers. THey have a much more specific test for particle size on both HDL and LDL.
janeslk
09-15-2006, 11:09 AM
I understand the out of pocket..... You might want to have a CRP test and an Lp(a) test done. THis should give you some degree of information of inflammation. You might check out the tests Spectracell in Houston offers. THey have a much more specific test for particle size on both HDL and LDL.
I think the Lp(a) test is the one that his doctor refused to do. I think he will probably have the CRP, CPK and VAP tests. I will check into the Spectrcell tests as well. Thank you.
Jane
I think the Lp(a) test is the one that his doctor refused to do. I think he will probably have the CRP, CPK and VAP tests. I will check into the Spectrcell tests as well. Thank you.
Jane
NHone
09-15-2006, 07:58 PM
If you talk to spectracell tell them that it is out of pocket....they will work with you. If you have questions of spectracell...they will let you talk to one of the chemists. Good luck.
Lenin
09-15-2006, 08:00 PM
Jane,
The VAP is apt to be HIDEOUSLY expensive...but it's a superb battery of tests. MAke sure you find out BEFORE you are handed a thousand dollar bill.
A fair price for Lipid profile (HDL, LDL, TC and triglycerides), CrP and Homocysteine should be about $100.
I found ONE reference to VAP cost , at a lab called YHL, and it was Retail: $747 and discount: $249
The VAP is apt to be HIDEOUSLY expensive...but it's a superb battery of tests. MAke sure you find out BEFORE you are handed a thousand dollar bill.
A fair price for Lipid profile (HDL, LDL, TC and triglycerides), CrP and Homocysteine should be about $100.
I found ONE reference to VAP cost , at a lab called YHL, and it was Retail: $747 and discount: $249
NHone
09-16-2006, 12:45 AM
Lenin, just what does a VAP test do?
Lenin
09-16-2006, 09:14 AM
nhone,
The VAP directly measures LDL and divides it into 4 different density classes (small dense LDL is far more dangerous than larger "fluffy" particles), VLDL into several, several HDL sub groups (only one of which offers much protection), even Lp(a) fractions and classifies the overall picture into a Pattern A or Pattern B profile. I believe there is even separate measuring of the protein substructures, the apolipoproteins.
BTW, pravastain actually lowers LDL particle size where atorvastatin increases it and rosuvastatin increases it a lot.
Next blood test I will have the whole workup...I've only done it piecemeal like ordering HDL-2, HDL-3, apolipoprotein A and apo B and of course Lp(a.) IF my insurance company gives me a firm okay though...no way I'll do it out of pocket.
Of course it helps to have an EXPERIENCED cardiologist interpret them, or better yet, work hard at understanding the nuances oneself. Having a GP look at them and say, "Uh Huh, looks okay," might be a waste of coin!
The VAP directly measures LDL and divides it into 4 different density classes (small dense LDL is far more dangerous than larger "fluffy" particles), VLDL into several, several HDL sub groups (only one of which offers much protection), even Lp(a) fractions and classifies the overall picture into a Pattern A or Pattern B profile. I believe there is even separate measuring of the protein substructures, the apolipoproteins.
BTW, pravastain actually lowers LDL particle size where atorvastatin increases it and rosuvastatin increases it a lot.
Next blood test I will have the whole workup...I've only done it piecemeal like ordering HDL-2, HDL-3, apolipoprotein A and apo B and of course Lp(a.) IF my insurance company gives me a firm okay though...no way I'll do it out of pocket.
Of course it helps to have an EXPERIENCED cardiologist interpret them, or better yet, work hard at understanding the nuances oneself. Having a GP look at them and say, "Uh Huh, looks okay," might be a waste of coin!
janeslk
09-16-2006, 10:35 AM
Jane,
The VAP is apt to be HIDEOUSLY expensive...but it's a superb battery of tests. MAke sure you find out BEFORE you are handed a thousand dollar bill.
A fair price for Lipid profile (HDL, LDL, TC and triglycerides), CrP and Homocysteine should be about $100.
I found ONE reference to VAP cost , at a lab called YHL, and it was Retail: $747 and discount: $249
I found a VAP test at one of those on-line medical testing sites for $95. You pay for it on-line and they direct you to the nearest lab for the blood draw. The nearest lab to us is 20 minutes away. Are there different variations of the VAP test? This one says it shows all the components of the LDL and HDL, etc. You don't have to go through a doctor to get the test.
Jane
The VAP is apt to be HIDEOUSLY expensive...but it's a superb battery of tests. MAke sure you find out BEFORE you are handed a thousand dollar bill.
A fair price for Lipid profile (HDL, LDL, TC and triglycerides), CrP and Homocysteine should be about $100.
I found ONE reference to VAP cost , at a lab called YHL, and it was Retail: $747 and discount: $249
I found a VAP test at one of those on-line medical testing sites for $95. You pay for it on-line and they direct you to the nearest lab for the blood draw. The nearest lab to us is 20 minutes away. Are there different variations of the VAP test? This one says it shows all the components of the LDL and HDL, etc. You don't have to go through a doctor to get the test.
Jane
Lenin
09-16-2006, 11:51 AM
WOW, Jane,
That is appealing...I assume the lab won't charge TOO much for a blood draw. Of course it must be coordinated: whether centrifuged, refrigerated, cells blood removed from plasma, etc. etc. etc. Mailing blood seeems a bit problematical.
Why not call Atherotek and ask them for the cheapest method and if they see any problem with the discounters?
I found one discounter with three choices:
VAP Cholesterol
Retail: 115.00 Our Price: 94.00
VAP Pkg
VAP, Homocysteine, CRP-hs
Retail: 367.00 Our Price: 179.00
VAP Pkg with CWP
VAP, Homocysteine, CRP, and CWP
Retail: 747.00 Our Price: 249.00
That CWP is a complete wellness package with liver, kidney, thyroid, diabetes, diabetes screening.
I'd be wary but geez, with what a doctor charges these days for a complete workup OUT OF POCKET, maybe dipping a toe for just the VAP might be worth the risk? But be certain that the blood is handled correctly: even my doctor screws up the blood half the time and the lab says "cannot test." Everybody is happy and well except the patient, ME!
If you get the results direct, we can all work them out together.
That is appealing...I assume the lab won't charge TOO much for a blood draw. Of course it must be coordinated: whether centrifuged, refrigerated, cells blood removed from plasma, etc. etc. etc. Mailing blood seeems a bit problematical.
Why not call Atherotek and ask them for the cheapest method and if they see any problem with the discounters?
I found one discounter with three choices:
VAP Cholesterol
Retail: 115.00 Our Price: 94.00
VAP Pkg
VAP, Homocysteine, CRP-hs
Retail: 367.00 Our Price: 179.00
VAP Pkg with CWP
VAP, Homocysteine, CRP, and CWP
Retail: 747.00 Our Price: 249.00
That CWP is a complete wellness package with liver, kidney, thyroid, diabetes, diabetes screening.
I'd be wary but geez, with what a doctor charges these days for a complete workup OUT OF POCKET, maybe dipping a toe for just the VAP might be worth the risk? But be certain that the blood is handled correctly: even my doctor screws up the blood half the time and the lab says "cannot test." Everybody is happy and well except the patient, ME!
If you get the results direct, we can all work them out together.
janeslk
09-16-2006, 04:43 PM
I think I will get the Male Heart Disease profile package through the on-line service in addition to the VAP profile. The total comes to $220. I don't think there is a charge from the lab for drawing the blood. It is included in the price. We spend $60 when we see the doctor for the blood draw so that cost would be eliminated.
Yes, I would definitely need your help in figuring out the results, Lenin. Thanks.
One last thing--hasn't the homocysteine relationship to inflammation been debunked by a recent study? I thought I read somewhere that lowering the level did not seem to affect one's risk of having a heart attack.
Jane
Yes, I would definitely need your help in figuring out the results, Lenin. Thanks.
One last thing--hasn't the homocysteine relationship to inflammation been debunked by a recent study? I thought I read somewhere that lowering the level did not seem to affect one's risk of having a heart attack.
Jane
Lenin
09-17-2006, 03:57 PM
I read the same thing Jane and my doctor was quick to tell me that the
"hideously high" amounts (like 1200 mcg. :D:D) of folic acid were no longer necessary...poor guy gets so few chances to gloat!
I still take 800 mcg. just in case they reverse themselves...I have a 3 year supply in my closet because those Puritam Sales like "buy 3 bottles get 5 free" always attract me.
The downside is that when I die, my executor will have to figure out what the 600 bottles of pills are for! :D:D
"hideously high" amounts (like 1200 mcg. :D:D) of folic acid were no longer necessary...poor guy gets so few chances to gloat!
I still take 800 mcg. just in case they reverse themselves...I have a 3 year supply in my closet because those Puritam Sales like "buy 3 bottles get 5 free" always attract me.
The downside is that when I die, my executor will have to figure out what the 600 bottles of pills are for! :D:D
janeslk
09-17-2006, 06:00 PM
Keep taking that folic acid, Lenin. Another study in Norway? Sweden? or somewhere showed 800mcg per day helps keep dementia away. It was one of those studies that covered several years, tested several hundred men and was not done by the manufacturers of folic acid, if I remember correctly.