jkhh
09-18-2006, 07:07 PM
I just received my most recent labs and would like some input (test date 9/15/06); Chol 255 mg/dl (ref range 100-199), Trig 169 (ref range 20-200), HDL 39 (ref range 0-45), LDL 182 (ref range 0-159). I use fish oil 3 grams per day, occasional glass of red wine, multi-vitamin, Vitamin C & E, wheat germ, flax seed (powder), oatmeal daily. My prior results with 5 mg Crestor; Chol 155, Trig 162, HDL 36, LDL 87. Obviously, the Crestor is potent (even at 5 mg) and works, however, I would like opinions on whether I need to worry about it at all. I am age 39, male 6' 195 lbs with not a high amount of heart disease in my family, but not uncommon. I have a doctor's appt. this week and am certain he will consider me going back on the Crestor. If so, I will definitely use COQ-10!
Thanks for any input!
Thanks for any input!
Sponsor
20withacne
09-19-2006, 12:18 AM
What other risk factors do you have? Smoker? Diabetes? Your HDL is a little low, TG slightly elevated, and LDL on the high side. Your DR should rec diet and exercise first. If that does not work you need a statin. What about Lipitor? Crestor has high side effects and not good outcomes data.
Lenin
09-19-2006, 07:23 AM
Judge,
Your cholesterol/HDL ratio is a fairlly dismal 6.5 which is a high risk situation.
For those with little or no risk factors LDL should not be above 160 and yours is 182 WHILE doing all you can to lower your numbers with diet. Your low HDL is a risk factor all on its own. You can view 40 as a bare minimum.
If you had any first degree relatives (parents or grandparents) have an MI or heart disease before 65 or you've recently smoked I'd definitely medicate, otherwise. At 6' and 195 I doubt that you will get much help from weight loss.
You can TRY to cut most of the fat from your diet (<20% fat.) You can consider 5 or 10 mg. of a weaker statin like simvastatin.
But ultimately as you approach 45 (another risk factor) you will be wise to intervene with drugs if you can't get an LDL below 160...and 130 is far better.
Of course, you cannot remove from your judgement scales whether or not that first trial of Crestor caused you any probelms or not...that's a fairly weighty consideration.
Your cholesterol/HDL ratio is a fairlly dismal 6.5 which is a high risk situation.
For those with little or no risk factors LDL should not be above 160 and yours is 182 WHILE doing all you can to lower your numbers with diet. Your low HDL is a risk factor all on its own. You can view 40 as a bare minimum.
If you had any first degree relatives (parents or grandparents) have an MI or heart disease before 65 or you've recently smoked I'd definitely medicate, otherwise. At 6' and 195 I doubt that you will get much help from weight loss.
You can TRY to cut most of the fat from your diet (<20% fat.) You can consider 5 or 10 mg. of a weaker statin like simvastatin.
But ultimately as you approach 45 (another risk factor) you will be wise to intervene with drugs if you can't get an LDL below 160...and 130 is far better.
Of course, you cannot remove from your judgement scales whether or not that first trial of Crestor caused you any probelms or not...that's a fairly weighty consideration.
jkhh
09-19-2006, 08:16 AM
Lenin and 20,
Thank you both. I don't smoke or have any other real risk factors. I do exercise but have slacked off this summer with doing yardwork, etc. Does Lipitor have the same side effect concerns as Crestor? I did try Lescol XL for 3 months and it didn't bring my total below 200 so my doctor switched me back to Crestor. It's hard to argue with Crestor's number reduction, however, I do worry about the side effects. I ordered some more COQ10 y'day in the event I go back on the Crestor or maybe will take it anyway!
Have a nice day:)
Thank you both. I don't smoke or have any other real risk factors. I do exercise but have slacked off this summer with doing yardwork, etc. Does Lipitor have the same side effect concerns as Crestor? I did try Lescol XL for 3 months and it didn't bring my total below 200 so my doctor switched me back to Crestor. It's hard to argue with Crestor's number reduction, however, I do worry about the side effects. I ordered some more COQ10 y'day in the event I go back on the Crestor or maybe will take it anyway!
Have a nice day:)
Lenin
09-20-2006, 10:01 AM
If I had to rate them, I'd say Crestor> Lipitor(atorvastatin)> Zocor (simvastatin) in strength and all are stronger than the Lescol (fluvastatin.) Yes, all four being statins, they will share the same KINDS of side-effect concerns but not everyone suffers any of them. I have been on Lipitor for 8 years with no trouble at all...other than a pinched pocket. My partner has taken 20 mg. simavastatin at least 5 years now without problems.
I would think the Lipitor at 10 mg. will work at least as well as the 5 mg. Crestor but maybe 5 mg. Lipitor will still get you what you want. Trial and error will tell the tale.
Remember, all size pills cost the same, so a 20 mg. spit in half cuts your costs in half and in quarters down to 25%
I would think the Lipitor at 10 mg. will work at least as well as the 5 mg. Crestor but maybe 5 mg. Lipitor will still get you what you want. Trial and error will tell the tale.
Remember, all size pills cost the same, so a 20 mg. spit in half cuts your costs in half and in quarters down to 25%
edkal
09-22-2006, 12:27 AM
:wave: You have to remember that the reason Lipitor is highly toted is because if the strength. One 5 mg of Lip. is equivalent of 10 mg of Mevacor or Zokor and so on.
This info came from an article I read some time ago, but memory loss cannot put it into print.
No womder it is the leading brand of Satin on the market.
BY the way, my memory loss , I think, is due to one of the many side effects I had from satins.
This info came from an article I read some time ago, but memory loss cannot put it into print.
No womder it is the leading brand of Satin on the market.
BY the way, my memory loss , I think, is due to one of the many side effects I had from satins.
Lavinia2
09-22-2006, 01:19 PM
There is a book called, The China Study. I highly recommend it. It is based on numerous studies over a 20+ year period. Actually it continues to this day. The premise is this; People in China have virtually no heart disease, VERY little high blood pressure and VERY little high cholesterol. Their acceptable levels are entirely different than ours. What is considered low cholesterol in the US is actually considered high in China. Most people think it is because they eat more vegies and brown rice. THat is a part of it but not the biggest reason for the difference. It is an amazing book and I am NOT a crazy nutritional lunatic (though I'm afraid I'm becoming one). I've been on a self-imposed Health-Quest for almost a year. I have found that these things are a process. Anyway- if you want to really learn about nutrition, The China Study will help to get you on your way.
Lavinia
Lavinia
jkhh
09-22-2006, 04:20 PM
Thanks Lavinia. I'll give a read this winter. Plus, I love Chinese Food and eat at the buffet every Saturday night :) .
Lenin
09-23-2006, 10:04 AM
A fascinating study was released by HARVARD of CENSUS data last month. It documents the most long-lived and short-lived counties in the United States. For my locale, the New York City area, the longest lives were achieved in BERGEN COUNTY, NJ (just across the Hudson River from NYC.) Lifespan was as much as a two or three years longer (around 79) than average BUT what was so startling:
And Asian-American women in Bergen County have the longest average lifespan, 91 years, of any racial group in the nation, said the authors — from the Harvard School of Public Health
This is creating quite a stir, needless to say. The indication to me is that Chinese, Japanese, and Koreans have a genetic advantage as well as a dietary one since many of the New Jersey orientals have been here for decades and decades.
The authors point to other differences:
Dr. Christopher J. L. Murray, the chief author: Much of the difference among counties, he said, appears to stem from differences in things like tobacco and alcohol use, obesity, high blood pressure and cholesterol levels.
Another conclusion seems too be that the differences even out among groups "ONCE PEOPLE HAVE MADE IT TO 65."
An interesting study.
And Asian-American women in Bergen County have the longest average lifespan, 91 years, of any racial group in the nation, said the authors — from the Harvard School of Public Health
This is creating quite a stir, needless to say. The indication to me is that Chinese, Japanese, and Koreans have a genetic advantage as well as a dietary one since many of the New Jersey orientals have been here for decades and decades.
The authors point to other differences:
Dr. Christopher J. L. Murray, the chief author: Much of the difference among counties, he said, appears to stem from differences in things like tobacco and alcohol use, obesity, high blood pressure and cholesterol levels.
Another conclusion seems too be that the differences even out among groups "ONCE PEOPLE HAVE MADE IT TO 65."
An interesting study.
jkhh
09-23-2006, 01:20 PM
Lenin,
Just went out and bought slo-niacin 500 mg. Guess I will try this along with the COQ10 and maybe add Policosanol then test my labs again in December. Then, if I don't get my ratio down I'll try the Niacin/Zetia combo. I've always ready about Niacin causing gout attacks. Have you had any problems or do you think the Allopurinol 300 mg takes care of it? Also, I would be interested to know when you take the Allopurinol in relation to when you take the Niacin.
Thanks.
Just went out and bought slo-niacin 500 mg. Guess I will try this along with the COQ10 and maybe add Policosanol then test my labs again in December. Then, if I don't get my ratio down I'll try the Niacin/Zetia combo. I've always ready about Niacin causing gout attacks. Have you had any problems or do you think the Allopurinol 300 mg takes care of it? Also, I would be interested to know when you take the Allopurinol in relation to when you take the Niacin.
Thanks.
Lenin
09-24-2006, 12:34 PM
The allopurinol and the COZAAR (a uricosuric antihypertensive) take care of it and I monitor carefully to keep my serum uric acid below 5.0. I think the niacin effect is fairly small.
Even a worse offender with uric acid buildup is a thiazide diuretic which really can CAUSE gout in some people...for me daily thiazides during the 1980's CAUSED my gout to surface.
Even a worse offender with uric acid buildup is a thiazide diuretic which really can CAUSE gout in some people...for me daily thiazides during the 1980's CAUSED my gout to surface.
jkhh
09-24-2006, 02:53 PM
Lenin,
At 300 mg, I can stay at about 4.6 consistently, however, when I went to 100 mg, my uric acid rose to 5.6 which is the top range of high at my lab. My engines just seem to work better on the 300 mg. What are the significance of ALT levels? I realize it has to do with the liver, but I've never really understood what the significance of mine being high (although <3times normal). You mentioned Niacin, but are you aware of other meds that elevate ALT levels. I've taken Allegra D for several years (just switched to Allegra), the Allopurinol, Fish Oil and then the Crestor 5 mg.
At 300 mg, I can stay at about 4.6 consistently, however, when I went to 100 mg, my uric acid rose to 5.6 which is the top range of high at my lab. My engines just seem to work better on the 300 mg. What are the significance of ALT levels? I realize it has to do with the liver, but I've never really understood what the significance of mine being high (although <3times normal). You mentioned Niacin, but are you aware of other meds that elevate ALT levels. I've taken Allegra D for several years (just switched to Allegra), the Allopurinol, Fish Oil and then the Crestor 5 mg.
Lenin
09-25-2006, 09:32 AM
Kevin,
ANYTHING that effects the liver can raise ALT including hepatitis or a fatty liver and any drug that is metabolized by the liver, including of course statins and fibrates.
HEart disease or angina can raise ALT as can even an injection given intramuscularly.
One alcoholic drink a few hours before the test can raise it dramatically.
Probably a high fat diet can do it too.
NOW, ahem, I hate to type this but they are finding that allopurinol is not quite so innocuouus as once thought. There can be really awful immune-affectig side effects from decades on this stuff. Suspect any persistent red rashes. As to the liver specifically:
Periodic liver enzymes, renal function tests and complete blood counts should be performed in all patients on allopurinol. Alterations in liver enzymes, including transient elevations of serum alkaline phosphatase, AST and ALT, have occurred in some patients.
I wouldn't know WHAT to do if I had to give up the allopurinol...die of kidney disease presumably.:dizzy: Alas I DO have a troublesome periodic facial rash that...but then, today I'll worry ONLY about the dentist this afternoon, the worst scourge of my life. <HELP ME GOD!>
ANYTHING that effects the liver can raise ALT including hepatitis or a fatty liver and any drug that is metabolized by the liver, including of course statins and fibrates.
HEart disease or angina can raise ALT as can even an injection given intramuscularly.
One alcoholic drink a few hours before the test can raise it dramatically.
Probably a high fat diet can do it too.
NOW, ahem, I hate to type this but they are finding that allopurinol is not quite so innocuouus as once thought. There can be really awful immune-affectig side effects from decades on this stuff. Suspect any persistent red rashes. As to the liver specifically:
Periodic liver enzymes, renal function tests and complete blood counts should be performed in all patients on allopurinol. Alterations in liver enzymes, including transient elevations of serum alkaline phosphatase, AST and ALT, have occurred in some patients.
I wouldn't know WHAT to do if I had to give up the allopurinol...die of kidney disease presumably.:dizzy: Alas I DO have a troublesome periodic facial rash that...but then, today I'll worry ONLY about the dentist this afternoon, the worst scourge of my life. <HELP ME GOD!>
jkhh
09-25-2006, 07:56 PM
Lenin,
Actually there is a very new medicine to treat high uric acid but I would imagine it is very expensive (nor do I know the name of it). I would agree with you that life would be unbearable without it. I allowed myself to suffer with gout attacks for approximately 8 years and wish I would have started on Allopurinol when they started. One doctor even stuck Cortisone shots in my foot :mad: . Are there any levels that you specifically have done concerning the use of Allopurinol? When my doctor orders my lab, it is typically for Lipid Panelsand I think many of the liver panels.
Actually there is a very new medicine to treat high uric acid but I would imagine it is very expensive (nor do I know the name of it). I would agree with you that life would be unbearable without it. I allowed myself to suffer with gout attacks for approximately 8 years and wish I would have started on Allopurinol when they started. One doctor even stuck Cortisone shots in my foot :mad: . Are there any levels that you specifically have done concerning the use of Allopurinol? When my doctor orders my lab, it is typically for Lipid Panelsand I think many of the liver panels.
Lenin
09-25-2006, 08:32 PM
No, only blood lipids, liver functions, and uric acid.
I am currently trying 200 mg. allopurinol and will get tested next month especially for uric acid.
THe lower the better as long as the allopurinol is still an effective dose.
I have toyed with trying one of the several uricosuric drugs (pee out uric acid) like sufinpyrazole but they really are fraught with side effects.
I am currently trying 200 mg. allopurinol and will get tested next month especially for uric acid.
THe lower the better as long as the allopurinol is still an effective dose.
I have toyed with trying one of the several uricosuric drugs (pee out uric acid) like sufinpyrazole but they really are fraught with side effects.
NHone
09-26-2006, 02:22 AM
If you want to treat high uric acid you can use Vitamin B5. It is know to lower high uric acid levels.