Sannah
02-12-2007, 01:03 PM
Okay you guys, it's my turn to put an issue on the table for dissection. I get really shaky when I am confronting someone. I also get this way if I have intense feelings which are being aroused. My guess is that this has something to do with having needs. I think that I am still uncomfortable at a certain level with expressing my needs/feelings. For a review of my history - only my mother's needs were met in our family. I believe I received all sorts of negative messages to keep my needs to myself.
I have a memory that is specific to this. Remember the "why, why, why" stage when you are around three or so? Well, with my very first expression of this stage, my mother got all irritated and yelled at me with my 3rd "why" in response to her answer. I still remember this clearly. I was taken aback. Guess what, I never asked my mom a question again! Isn't that sad! Many parents get irritated with their children but you see my mother ignored me so I wasn't going to risk getting negative attention from her! I already questioned if she loved me. If she was going to yell at me this would have sealed the deal! (This just brought tears to my eyes - I guess I hit a nerve!)
Going back to my issue - even when I am on the boards here and I am reading or responding to something and it brings up intense feelings I shake. There are a few people on other boards who attack. I don't run, I respond, but boy do I shake! I went a few weeks ago for an interview for volunteering. I am volunteering now at a half-way house for women released from prison. During the interview I was all nervous that she was going to say something that was going to bring out intense feelings for me and then I would get all shaky.
I guess I just need to ACCEPT that I CAN have intense feelings and that it is OKAY! Any feedback/advice welcome!
I have a memory that is specific to this. Remember the "why, why, why" stage when you are around three or so? Well, with my very first expression of this stage, my mother got all irritated and yelled at me with my 3rd "why" in response to her answer. I still remember this clearly. I was taken aback. Guess what, I never asked my mom a question again! Isn't that sad! Many parents get irritated with their children but you see my mother ignored me so I wasn't going to risk getting negative attention from her! I already questioned if she loved me. If she was going to yell at me this would have sealed the deal! (This just brought tears to my eyes - I guess I hit a nerve!)
Going back to my issue - even when I am on the boards here and I am reading or responding to something and it brings up intense feelings I shake. There are a few people on other boards who attack. I don't run, I respond, but boy do I shake! I went a few weeks ago for an interview for volunteering. I am volunteering now at a half-way house for women released from prison. During the interview I was all nervous that she was going to say something that was going to bring out intense feelings for me and then I would get all shaky.
I guess I just need to ACCEPT that I CAN have intense feelings and that it is OKAY! Any feedback/advice welcome!
Sponsor
dustoffkid
02-12-2007, 01:10 PM
Sannah-
I guess you could place this in the "feedback" column rather than the "advice" one; I have the same problem that you have! I am strong and have opinions but when I confront someone I get the shakes, too- sometimes coupled with burning ears (like a blush, but I think it's more of a flush than a blush)... the fight or flight response kicking in at times when there is no detectable physical threat. I'd liken it to a panic attack but I never have pain with it and it as always controllable to a certain degree. That is, even though I am having the reaction I can still respond with the words/actions that are appropriate. Make sense?
I don't know what to do about it... and I am willing to take advice if anyone is willing to offer it. But I certainly can relate.
Dustoff
I guess you could place this in the "feedback" column rather than the "advice" one; I have the same problem that you have! I am strong and have opinions but when I confront someone I get the shakes, too- sometimes coupled with burning ears (like a blush, but I think it's more of a flush than a blush)... the fight or flight response kicking in at times when there is no detectable physical threat. I'd liken it to a panic attack but I never have pain with it and it as always controllable to a certain degree. That is, even though I am having the reaction I can still respond with the words/actions that are appropriate. Make sense?
I don't know what to do about it... and I am willing to take advice if anyone is willing to offer it. But I certainly can relate.
Dustoff
ICC
02-12-2007, 01:13 PM
Hi sannah----sorry you are going through this. When i speak of anxiety you have described EXACTLY how I feel. I know I can handle my own in a confrontation and very rarely will unless I know I am 100% right but I feel my BP go up, the shaking starts, the heart palpitations. I agree with you that this comes from having your feelings shot down as a small child. I did and it continued with may people in my adult life where I was stifled and never allowed to "speak my peace" , called hyper, too sensitive. you name it I was called it. so though I have no answers and am still working on this myself I can definitely relate to your feelings. they are valid and I suffer also. Hopefully someone will come along with some insight.
Hugs,
Grasshopper
Hugs,
Grasshopper
galinaqt
02-12-2007, 01:23 PM
I am trying to avoid confrontations and feel lousy if I had to fight. Some people are this way, another enjoying it. May be you should just try to avoid confronations if you can.
I can understand about your mother. About my mother everybody says "Everything should be only how it is convenient to her". And also she is very good to diminish everybody else effort and fingerpointing. In your case, you lucky to leave in this country where you can be independent from her. In my case mine very basic needs depends from this kind of person and there is no future or escape.
I had to stay with her for 2 nights 'cause my father needs to get out of town and she can't be left alone with her health conditions and we ended up fighting and that is every time I stayed with her.
My husband really unhappy about the way I am after I spent night at her place.
I can understand about your mother. About my mother everybody says "Everything should be only how it is convenient to her". And also she is very good to diminish everybody else effort and fingerpointing. In your case, you lucky to leave in this country where you can be independent from her. In my case mine very basic needs depends from this kind of person and there is no future or escape.
I had to stay with her for 2 nights 'cause my father needs to get out of town and she can't be left alone with her health conditions and we ended up fighting and that is every time I stayed with her.
My husband really unhappy about the way I am after I spent night at her place.
Sannah
02-12-2007, 02:18 PM
I agree with you that this comes from having your feelings shot down as a small child.
Hey Dustoff, Grasshopper, and Galinaqt, thanks for responding!
Grasshopper ( I have to get used to calling you this!) what you said above is exactly it. Maybe we can all figure this out together! I guess I am afraid of having my feelings shot down. Just writing this out in my thread really helped me to see it better. When I wrote about my mom loving me I really started crying so I am sure that it is related to that. I really just want to be able to have any feelings come out and feel comfortable with them. We are human. I will always have intense feelings come out, I just need to not feel insecure when it happens. Is this the feeling Dustoff and Grasshopper? Is what we are really feeling, is it insecurity? Like we are going to lose control or something if we have these intense feelings?
Galinaqt, for me to avoid confrontations - this would NEVER be the answer! If I can't figure it out and get myself to stop shaking I'll just confront along shaking!
Hey you guys, I just got a thought. Do you think that we are afraid that our feeling will be shot down and then we will just basically be "told" that we are, therefore, worthless. What we are insecure and shaky about then is that someone is basically going to "tell" us that we are worthless? If we take the chance to let our needs and thoughts be known we are risking this?
Hey Dustoff, Grasshopper, and Galinaqt, thanks for responding!
Grasshopper ( I have to get used to calling you this!) what you said above is exactly it. Maybe we can all figure this out together! I guess I am afraid of having my feelings shot down. Just writing this out in my thread really helped me to see it better. When I wrote about my mom loving me I really started crying so I am sure that it is related to that. I really just want to be able to have any feelings come out and feel comfortable with them. We are human. I will always have intense feelings come out, I just need to not feel insecure when it happens. Is this the feeling Dustoff and Grasshopper? Is what we are really feeling, is it insecurity? Like we are going to lose control or something if we have these intense feelings?
Galinaqt, for me to avoid confrontations - this would NEVER be the answer! If I can't figure it out and get myself to stop shaking I'll just confront along shaking!
Hey you guys, I just got a thought. Do you think that we are afraid that our feeling will be shot down and then we will just basically be "told" that we are, therefore, worthless. What we are insecure and shaky about then is that someone is basically going to "tell" us that we are worthless? If we take the chance to let our needs and thoughts be known we are risking this?
galinaqt
02-12-2007, 02:35 PM
I thought you worked with therapist who helped you. I've head a program with therapist who said that our experiecnes programmed us, so when we have similiar experience we remembering things and reacting same way as before.
Sannah
02-12-2007, 02:42 PM
Yes, Galinaqt, I had a therapist who helped me immensely. Now, I am just working out the last few kinks. I am able, however, when issues come up to resolve them by myself. I already feel a lot better about this issue from just discussing it here. I can't wait for a "test" to see if I still shake!
I edited my last reply while you were posting your last one here. You might want to go back and read what I wrote?
I was thinking about you and your mother again. You are free from her really but in your mind you still think that you are not? If she goes into one of her whatever you want to call it, can you just get to a point where you look at her and accept her for who she is and realize that she really doesn't have any power over you anymore? Just say to her "okay mother, whatever you say" and then look the other way and roll your eyes.
Galinqt, I just got what you were saying about the programming. Yeh, I agree we get programmed but once we understand we don't go into that automatic programming anymore.
I edited my last reply while you were posting your last one here. You might want to go back and read what I wrote?
I was thinking about you and your mother again. You are free from her really but in your mind you still think that you are not? If she goes into one of her whatever you want to call it, can you just get to a point where you look at her and accept her for who she is and realize that she really doesn't have any power over you anymore? Just say to her "okay mother, whatever you say" and then look the other way and roll your eyes.
Galinqt, I just got what you were saying about the programming. Yeh, I agree we get programmed but once we understand we don't go into that automatic programming anymore.
ICC
02-12-2007, 03:14 PM
sannah---good point about feeling insecure and worthless. makes alot of sense to me. Whenever I have really stood up for myself it has taken a fight. I have lost my temper because the person wasn't listening, didn't care, or was so into themselves that the buttons they pushed really pushed me into an anger mode. that being very frustrating to me as I am the opposite. I have had to argue my feelings most of my life. at times they have been laughed at, I have been called insecure, stupid and just wanting to be difficult. The insecure thing bothers me as I am a pillar of strength and confidence. I have been also called overly sensitive. maybe I am but I am who I am. I am very sensitive to others needs much more so than many so why wouldn't I be sensitive to my own needs? I'm not talking about those that demand. I don't do anything for anyone anymore who demands or expects something from me. I'm talking about virtual strangers who are in need. I come to their defense in the blink of an eye. why wouldn't I do that for myself? Times that I have tried I have had people tell me they know how I am but love me anyway. WHAT?????? when asked "just how am I" they back off. no answer. I think the world is full of insensitive, uncaring, selfish, jealous people who are dysfunctional to say the least but truly believe it is everyone else's issue. never theirs. From childhood I have been drawn to people like this and they are drawn to me. I believe it started with my mother's lack of interest , love and concern for my well being and now has excalated full blown in adulthood. I still have a really hard time when confronted just saying it like it is and moving on. No i say it like it is, have the shaking, HBP, palpitations, My voice goes up (not intentionally) and therefore it is thought that I am yelling which I am not. afterwards I will be an anxiety attack sometimes for days and have to go over it in my mind or verbally to others for days sometimes weeks before I can let it go. we're going to understand this and work on it until we figure it out. It is my last obstacle. You know the deal with triggers but this is a trigger of mine. the last one that I still don't know how to deal with. Even in the face of confrontation I might appear to be calm and very upfront but it's what's going on inside that I want and need to stop.
Hugs,
Grasshopper
p.s. FTM's name for me has grown on me very comfortably. it will you also but feel free to call me whatever you would like. I think we go back further than anyone.
Hugs,
Grasshopper
p.s. FTM's name for me has grown on me very comfortably. it will you also but feel free to call me whatever you would like. I think we go back further than anyone.
galinaqt
02-12-2007, 03:41 PM
Some people are very good in argueing and they are looking forward to provoke you than they are on their territory and it will be hard for outsiders to see who is right and who is wrong.
While they are feeling better and getting what they want, we got sick from it.
In another case like with my mother - you tell her a word and she will tell you 100 back. She would be always right and all the guilt will be put on the most convenient person and you will be ungrateful rat.
Most of my resentment is because of all hardships and losses I had 'cause of her and if things will go her way I'd likely die on the street.
Also my brother got everything she deprived me and it 'cause enormous jealosy on my part.
While they are feeling better and getting what they want, we got sick from it.
In another case like with my mother - you tell her a word and she will tell you 100 back. She would be always right and all the guilt will be put on the most convenient person and you will be ungrateful rat.
Most of my resentment is because of all hardships and losses I had 'cause of her and if things will go her way I'd likely die on the street.
Also my brother got everything she deprived me and it 'cause enormous jealosy on my part.
ICC
02-12-2007, 03:53 PM
galinaqt----right on!!!! I have been on the other side of "those people" many times. I have been provoked more times than i can possibly remember. When i think back it irritates me that I stayed in the situation as long as I did. Now that i'm out of it I am more outspoken and don't care what the other person thinks but I was stuck in a hell hole for many years with intolerable people who seemed to create drama, many problems for others and yet came out "smelling like a rose" while I on the other hand was called "too sensitive" trust me when i tell you I can hold my own so I don't back down easily and have never had a confrontation because my feelings were hurt though that's sometimes what people thought. I started to be even more honest and tell them " My feelings aren't hurt. I am angry with you for what you said/did" believe me most of the time they still thought what they wanted. I find alot of people have a real hard time with honesty and wouldn't recognize it if it slapped them in the face. So my honesty was always taken as something else. I remember one day I was having a smoke outside of my building. My supervisor came out and said "what's up? what are you doing/" I answered with " I 'm having a smoke, screwing off" He then said " No really, what are you doing"? I have always bee completely honest and believe most people couldn't believe anyone is that honest and most people have the phony conversations that are meaningless so they couldn't understand my honesty. I have told people for years that I am Black and White. what you see and hear is what it is. No hidden agenda. very few people believe me.
Hugs girlfriends,
Grasshopper
Hugs girlfriends,
Grasshopper
Sannah
02-12-2007, 04:06 PM
Galinaqt, I see you as trying to get your power back from your mother. You do not have to do this. You have your power UNLESS YOU GIVE IT TO YOUR MOTHER. I wouldn't give your mother that first word. You will never win with her so why try. The issue is really about power here.
Everyone, you know this issue for me is a good example of how issues come up and how they get dealt with. I rarely have to confront anyone. I am a stay-at-home mom in the pleasant state of Kentucky. Sure, I would shake in front of the computer in the comfort of my safe home. So what! It never came to my conscious mind that I needed to work on this issue UNTIL I went to volunteer at the half-way house. NOW it's an issue. I can't have one of the women bring up a subject which brings out feelings in me and there I am shaking! This is how issues have always come up for me.
ICC, is the issue any clearer for you now? It is for me.
Everyone, you know this issue for me is a good example of how issues come up and how they get dealt with. I rarely have to confront anyone. I am a stay-at-home mom in the pleasant state of Kentucky. Sure, I would shake in front of the computer in the comfort of my safe home. So what! It never came to my conscious mind that I needed to work on this issue UNTIL I went to volunteer at the half-way house. NOW it's an issue. I can't have one of the women bring up a subject which brings out feelings in me and there I am shaking! This is how issues have always come up for me.
ICC, is the issue any clearer for you now? It is for me.
ICC
02-12-2007, 05:16 PM
Absolutely Sannah!!! i'm not glad youhad the experience but glad that we have acknowledged it. Triggers!!!! I still believe that's what it comes down to> As you said if someone brings up an issue you can't start shaking. It is one of your triggers they are bringing up. So here we are knowing as we have for along time that certain triggers set us into an unclofrtable mode of being and thought but we still have no idea how to stop it. I have said for many years that I just want to be one of these people who very little bothers. I have so many triggers and even though in my rational mind when I think I have things under control I never know when someone will push one of those nasty buttons and set me off. I am trying to be more aware and if nothing else I don't stew about anything anymore but bring it right out and deal with it. I don't like that uncomfortable feeling of panicking, shaking, or just sensing danger. What did you get out of all of this? do you feel any better?
Galinaqt-----sannah is right. That;s why I have nno contact with my mother. It never ended nicely. I was hurt EVERY time I was in her co . and if my kids were there one of them if not all would be hurt by her words. I know you have said you have no choice but to be in contact BUT I wouldn't let her get a word in. Walk away and tell her if she continues on this path you refuse to listen. start singing! or whistling out loud. but refuse to listen to the abuse.
Hugs girls!
Grasshopper
Hugs,
Grasshopper
Galinaqt-----sannah is right. That;s why I have nno contact with my mother. It never ended nicely. I was hurt EVERY time I was in her co . and if my kids were there one of them if not all would be hurt by her words. I know you have said you have no choice but to be in contact BUT I wouldn't let her get a word in. Walk away and tell her if she continues on this path you refuse to listen. start singing! or whistling out loud. but refuse to listen to the abuse.
Hugs girls!
Grasshopper
Hugs,
Grasshopper
Sannah
02-12-2007, 06:05 PM
ICC, I don't think that when a strong emotion is elicited from me that it is a trigger. I am just uncomfortable having any strong emotions. I think that it is okay to have these strong emotions on an intellectual level, I am not comfortable, however on the emotional level. I think that I have discovered today with these conversations that I am uncomfortable having these strong feelings because then I am vulnerable to someone "shooting down" my feelings. If I don't have these feelings then no one can shoot them down. If I have them and they are strong, then someone can shoot them down. If someone shoots down my feelings (which really isn't going to happen in the situations that I am speaking about but that childhood fear is talking here) this says that I am not valuable and therefore worthless. This is what I am really afraid of. I will get the test soon here. I'll see if I get shaky if strong feelings are elicited here. I actually think that I can work through it now because I understand it. I think that it is normal to have strong emotions I just need to feel comfortable with it. I don't think that it is a trigger because I never suffered from confrontations as a child. My family did not speak! But if you think that I am not seeing something here please keep explaining!
hergy
02-12-2007, 07:10 PM
Sannah, oh my word, did we have the same mom?
I get those very shakes. It embarasses me because I can't control it. When I'm in an emotionally charged conversation or argument, I shake as if I'm shivering from cold. I don't ever feel cold, but I've even gotten a blanket to see if I can get my body to stop shaking.
When my freak of a 'friend' used to come on to me or force herself on me, I also would shake (I may have been shaking out of fear with this one, but shaking nonetheless).
I'll have to give this more thought, but my experience with my mom seems to be similar to yours. That could be at the root of the problem.
You said only my mother's needs were met in our family. I believe I received all sorts of negative messages to keep my needs to myself.
ME, TOO! I was made to believe I was selfish for expressing needs. I didn't even ask for toys because my mom sent the message that it was bad to want things.
You also said I wasn't going to risk getting negative attention from her! I already questioned if she loved me. If she was going to yell at me this would have sealed the deal!
My mom yelled, and still yells. I have always hated it. I was so happy to be on my own and out of earshot of her yelling. My mom has always told me she loves me, but she's stone-faced and rarely shows emotion. So grasping the reality of her feelings is impossible. When I prod for emotional expression, I'm scolded, STILL!
I never really analyzed the shaking problem until you posted about it. It seems to be sort of like a volcano. Most of the time, a volcano is firm and unshakable. But when something starts to bubble and burn, it begins to shake. It shakes until it explodes.
For me, I know now that I'm full of bubbling and burning emotions. Maybe that's where the shaking comes from - fear of releasing a lifetime of stifled emotion.
I'd like to give this more thought. I was only lurking because I'm in a lot of pain today. I'll post later.
Thanks for bringing this up. This is a very interesting topic.
Love you!
Nikki
I get those very shakes. It embarasses me because I can't control it. When I'm in an emotionally charged conversation or argument, I shake as if I'm shivering from cold. I don't ever feel cold, but I've even gotten a blanket to see if I can get my body to stop shaking.
When my freak of a 'friend' used to come on to me or force herself on me, I also would shake (I may have been shaking out of fear with this one, but shaking nonetheless).
I'll have to give this more thought, but my experience with my mom seems to be similar to yours. That could be at the root of the problem.
You said only my mother's needs were met in our family. I believe I received all sorts of negative messages to keep my needs to myself.
ME, TOO! I was made to believe I was selfish for expressing needs. I didn't even ask for toys because my mom sent the message that it was bad to want things.
You also said I wasn't going to risk getting negative attention from her! I already questioned if she loved me. If she was going to yell at me this would have sealed the deal!
My mom yelled, and still yells. I have always hated it. I was so happy to be on my own and out of earshot of her yelling. My mom has always told me she loves me, but she's stone-faced and rarely shows emotion. So grasping the reality of her feelings is impossible. When I prod for emotional expression, I'm scolded, STILL!
I never really analyzed the shaking problem until you posted about it. It seems to be sort of like a volcano. Most of the time, a volcano is firm and unshakable. But when something starts to bubble and burn, it begins to shake. It shakes until it explodes.
For me, I know now that I'm full of bubbling and burning emotions. Maybe that's where the shaking comes from - fear of releasing a lifetime of stifled emotion.
I'd like to give this more thought. I was only lurking because I'm in a lot of pain today. I'll post later.
Thanks for bringing this up. This is a very interesting topic.
Love you!
Nikki
Sannah
02-12-2007, 09:41 PM
Nikki, it is amazing how no one mentioned this earlier and many of us suffered from it! Yes, our mothers do sound alike, I can't wait to hear what you have to say once you have thought about it. Nikki, why are you in pain? Love you too!
galinaqt
02-12-2007, 10:18 PM
My mother is one of the people who would be happier to be married to her career, she was always A+ and had a phd, which was big deal to have back in our country with all discriminations.
Since that time in my country, getting married and had kids was something everybody had to do, she did it.
Whatever she did for a family is like a favor, which has to be repayed not something she has to do. Whatever they everybody else did for her is taking for granted. Everything about her is bittersweet.
Since that time in my country, getting married and had kids was something everybody had to do, she did it.
Whatever she did for a family is like a favor, which has to be repayed not something she has to do. Whatever they everybody else did for her is taking for granted. Everything about her is bittersweet.
zencat
02-12-2007, 11:35 PM
Hi. Sannah
“I can't have one of the women bring up a subject which brings out feelings in me and there I am shaking!” ~ Sannah
This statement struck me.
Now I may not be reading this right, but here go’s. You use the phrase “intense feelings”. Can you name those feelings. Are you feeling; apprehension, concern, dread, fright, dejection,, disrespected, shamed……Try putting a name on those intense feelings.
When you describe being shakey, I think of fear. And when I think of fear as being a child, I think of; rejection, abandonment and dread. Maybe you are still that little girl seeking your mothers approval, having a real apprehension that if you annoy her she will get angry. If you confront your mother she might abandon you because you irritated or annoyed her. She may become hostel and resent you.
How about if somebody got annoyed at you for confronting them, would they get angry, hostel, fly into a fury of outrage. ( abandonment )
What would happen if some one sees you shaking, if they think you are afraid? What would you fear if someone rejects your concern? Or better yet. they don’t pay attention to something that is a concern to you and needs immediate attention. Do you fear that you wont be heard? That you concern will be discarded, rejected or abandon.
To confront some is to run the risk of not being heard, having your concern rejected, your feelings set aside. And you feeling dejected and depressed. Its almost better to not risk or close off your feelings than to fear that they will be unbearable to endure. or to intense to even name.
Well that’s my take on the subject. Let me know what you think. At any rate this has given me something to think about regarding my own fears when dealing with others.
Take care
Zencat
“I can't have one of the women bring up a subject which brings out feelings in me and there I am shaking!” ~ Sannah
This statement struck me.
Now I may not be reading this right, but here go’s. You use the phrase “intense feelings”. Can you name those feelings. Are you feeling; apprehension, concern, dread, fright, dejection,, disrespected, shamed……Try putting a name on those intense feelings.
When you describe being shakey, I think of fear. And when I think of fear as being a child, I think of; rejection, abandonment and dread. Maybe you are still that little girl seeking your mothers approval, having a real apprehension that if you annoy her she will get angry. If you confront your mother she might abandon you because you irritated or annoyed her. She may become hostel and resent you.
How about if somebody got annoyed at you for confronting them, would they get angry, hostel, fly into a fury of outrage. ( abandonment )
What would happen if some one sees you shaking, if they think you are afraid? What would you fear if someone rejects your concern? Or better yet. they don’t pay attention to something that is a concern to you and needs immediate attention. Do you fear that you wont be heard? That you concern will be discarded, rejected or abandon.
To confront some is to run the risk of not being heard, having your concern rejected, your feelings set aside. And you feeling dejected and depressed. Its almost better to not risk or close off your feelings than to fear that they will be unbearable to endure. or to intense to even name.
Well that’s my take on the subject. Let me know what you think. At any rate this has given me something to think about regarding my own fears when dealing with others.
Take care
Zencat
hergy
02-13-2007, 03:31 AM
Shaking with fear is not uncommon. So I can only assume that it's fear and nerves that stiffen my body and make me shake.
I was emotionally frightened when my former 'best friend' was invading my space and my comfort zone. Not saying anything kept me bubbling inside, alone with unnerving feelings that I had no way out. I was embarassed and confused about the shaking. She didn't seem to care. That made me know for sure that I was alone.
I hated displeasing my mom. It meant there'd be yelling, dissappointment and disapproval. For goodness' sake, I already thought I was bad and dirty. So I sucked up my emotions. Cold and numb, emotional expression was dead.
Many people fear the unknown. For me, the unknown is verbalizing emotion. I guess when I start to get to the point I did as a child of expressing myself, I experience fear, an inner fear of approaching a place I've never been. It hurts to admit it, but I think I just get plain scared.
I'll be thinking about this one for a while. It happens so often that I'd like to find a solution or at least an answer.
Love,
Nikki
To answer your question, I often have back pain. A lot of the problems come from an untreated rotator cuff injury that has sent pain gradually to different areas of my back, neck and shoulders. Today and yesterday have been particularly bad.
I was emotionally frightened when my former 'best friend' was invading my space and my comfort zone. Not saying anything kept me bubbling inside, alone with unnerving feelings that I had no way out. I was embarassed and confused about the shaking. She didn't seem to care. That made me know for sure that I was alone.
I hated displeasing my mom. It meant there'd be yelling, dissappointment and disapproval. For goodness' sake, I already thought I was bad and dirty. So I sucked up my emotions. Cold and numb, emotional expression was dead.
Many people fear the unknown. For me, the unknown is verbalizing emotion. I guess when I start to get to the point I did as a child of expressing myself, I experience fear, an inner fear of approaching a place I've never been. It hurts to admit it, but I think I just get plain scared.
I'll be thinking about this one for a while. It happens so often that I'd like to find a solution or at least an answer.
Love,
Nikki
To answer your question, I often have back pain. A lot of the problems come from an untreated rotator cuff injury that has sent pain gradually to different areas of my back, neck and shoulders. Today and yesterday have been particularly bad.
ICC
02-13-2007, 08:20 AM
Nikki---I kno whow you feel on all turns. I never know if it's my neck or shoudler causing the pain as both have injuries. I'm thinking of you and praying for a pain free day!
galinaqt------You describe your mother as many professionals have been described. the career and children. one always suffers and I have yet to see it be the career. sad but true.
zencat-----When did you enter my mind? You have described the feelings perfectly and I do agree that it is fear. fear of what? all that you mentioned. at least in my case it is. abandonment is a biggie. I have found that people who have read me wrong, formed a bad opinion of me since they didn't understand what i was saying, and just basically being ignored, not validated, being made to feel my feelings were unfounded, a nuisance, stupid, etc. has brought that fear out in me all my life.
sannah----you are right on target. I understand your seperation of the intellect and the emotional mind but to me they are one and the same. I am a strong, capable, intelligent woman and yet in certain situations I have not been able to keep my emotions in check though intellectually I know I can/should. easier said then done. As Nikki said we already felt bad, worthless. I still believe it is a trigger of something from the past. Also this topic has been hit on but not like you did. I think we have all talked about it but used different descriptions not being sure what it is or what's going on within us. I have always said I just want to be comfortable. I hate the shaky feeling. to me it's anxiety. anxiety comes out in me when i feel threatened,unsure, unsafe, stupid, or just that I am a burden. we need to keep this going as all are suffering and I think with all of our heads together we will get it straight and have some good ideas of how to deal with this.
Love you all,
Grasshopper
galinaqt------You describe your mother as many professionals have been described. the career and children. one always suffers and I have yet to see it be the career. sad but true.
zencat-----When did you enter my mind? You have described the feelings perfectly and I do agree that it is fear. fear of what? all that you mentioned. at least in my case it is. abandonment is a biggie. I have found that people who have read me wrong, formed a bad opinion of me since they didn't understand what i was saying, and just basically being ignored, not validated, being made to feel my feelings were unfounded, a nuisance, stupid, etc. has brought that fear out in me all my life.
sannah----you are right on target. I understand your seperation of the intellect and the emotional mind but to me they are one and the same. I am a strong, capable, intelligent woman and yet in certain situations I have not been able to keep my emotions in check though intellectually I know I can/should. easier said then done. As Nikki said we already felt bad, worthless. I still believe it is a trigger of something from the past. Also this topic has been hit on but not like you did. I think we have all talked about it but used different descriptions not being sure what it is or what's going on within us. I have always said I just want to be comfortable. I hate the shaky feeling. to me it's anxiety. anxiety comes out in me when i feel threatened,unsure, unsafe, stupid, or just that I am a burden. we need to keep this going as all are suffering and I think with all of our heads together we will get it straight and have some good ideas of how to deal with this.
Love you all,
Grasshopper
ICC
02-13-2007, 08:44 AM
Sannah---i had to add something. When I took my job 20 years ago I was in a horrible frame of mind. still living with the abusive alcoholic. I had a wonderful boss who had an exhuberant amount of confidence in me from day one. I was promoted 3 times in less than 2 years. Never thought or even imagined that I was capable of doing the final job I was promoted to. Well he was right. from what I have been told I am one in a million when it comes to my accuracy. the place falls apart in my area when i'm out. Great HUH? 9-10 years later he retires and in walks the new boss who hates me from day one. the feeling today is very mutual. the man is a liar, unfair, and very into women who are seen and not heard. THAT HAS NEVER BEEN ME! we have butted heads more times than I can count. I haven't seen a promotion or raise since he's been there. The last and final promotion , as I could go no further, was given to someone who was there for 3 years. He then told me he expected me to train her and do her job if i had to until she learned. He also explained that even though I was more qualified than her this was his decision because he had overpaid her 2 years before and had to take the money back so he owed her. one year later he told me what a mistake it was and that he doesn't always see things my way at first but in the end always does and that I was his was diplomatic and flexible employee. WHAT:confused: Point i'm getting at is that every time i'm near him I have a major anxiety attack. something about him reminds me of my mother. always a fight to be excepted, to be noticed, to be understood. Always set aside for someone else. never first. accomplishments always ignored. He has lied to my face and about me behind my back just as my mother has. He has thrown my deceased daughter in my face. I am now facing having to sit through his deposition in my WC case knowing how he despises me. The day I was told I immediately went blank and had a major panic attack. Sannah i know he has nothing to say as he wasn't even in the bldg. and I know he isn't my mother. BUT the fact still remains that I have been 100% better since I haven't been at work. now i have to face him again with knots in my stomach. my BP flying and will be a ball of anxiety. Hence my belief that these feelings are brought on by triggers. He draws out the same exact feeling sI have around my mother. He has to trigger something in me that she did to me and reminds me of her. I have had this happen to me with a few others in my life and just in the past couple fo year shave been able to say "OMG this reminds me of my mother though I know in my intellectual mind that it makes no sense" Just my turn on things.
Hugs,
Grasshopper
Hugs,
Grasshopper
Sannah
02-13-2007, 09:37 AM
ICC, I get the trigger thing now with your mother! I think that it makes total sense if others remind you of how you felt with your mother! What has always helped me in these situations (when I did realize that a current situation was reminding me of my past) was to remind myself in the moment that this is now and that was then.
I also liked what you said when you said the feeling is being unsafe and threatened. This is it. Sounds like boundaries to me, like we feel that we are very vulnerable and that we cannot protect ourselves at that moment.
Nikki, you said it is fear. It probably is. Fear that we are unsafe and threatened.
Zencat, the one thing that you said that struck me is abandonment.
So here we are - fear, unsafe, threatened, boundaries/protection and abandonment. Let's all get to work and keep thinking!
I also liked what you said when you said the feeling is being unsafe and threatened. This is it. Sounds like boundaries to me, like we feel that we are very vulnerable and that we cannot protect ourselves at that moment.
Nikki, you said it is fear. It probably is. Fear that we are unsafe and threatened.
Zencat, the one thing that you said that struck me is abandonment.
So here we are - fear, unsafe, threatened, boundaries/protection and abandonment. Let's all get to work and keep thinking!
ICC
02-13-2007, 10:06 AM
OK all ---- between all of us we're getting somewhere.:blob_fire Sannah I have tried to talk to myself saying "this is not the past, you are safe, no one is hurting you, they are only words" BUT I still come out with the feeling that words CAN AND DO hurt. I believe wrods are what got me here in the first place from 53 years ago. So I can still be hurt by certain situations and people. keeping myself in the here and now I try desperately to do but I still have a few people I have to close the door on and haven't been able to for legal reasons.
OBSTACLE:eek:
FEAR OF: being UNSAFE, THREATENED, ABANDONDED, INSECURITY, FEELING WORTHLESS
REMEDY: BOUNDARIES, SELF PROTECTION
?????????? Bring it on all. I think this will take all of us since we all suffer.
Love you all,
Grasshopper
OBSTACLE:eek:
FEAR OF: being UNSAFE, THREATENED, ABANDONDED, INSECURITY, FEELING WORTHLESS
REMEDY: BOUNDARIES, SELF PROTECTION
?????????? Bring it on all. I think this will take all of us since we all suffer.
Love you all,
Grasshopper
Sannah
02-13-2007, 10:16 AM
ICC, what insight does your therapist have about this? When is your next appt? Are you going to discuss this with her? She will probably just say it's a trigger, but we need more than that. We need to know why we feel that we cannot protect ourselves? I have been working on boundaries for almost 20 years!
Sannah
02-13-2007, 10:42 AM
Okay, something just came to me while I was eating my yummy homemade whole wheat, walnut pancake with maple syrup! I said earlier why do we feel that we cannot protect ourselves? Well, I just realized that when I am in one of these states that I am not afraid of whoever I am with! Frequently, I am by myself! I am afraid of my own feelings? Or I am really just sent back and reliving when I was a child?
A few years ago I became aware that whenever I was physical with my husband (even just cuddling) that I would tense a bit like I was going into this protection mode because another person was near. I wasn't really even consciously aware of it until that day. I thought about it and realized that it was just habit. I had nothing to fear from my husband, it had become a REFLEX. I was able to stop doing it just by being conscious of it.
Is this just a very stubborn, ingrained reflex for us?
A few years ago I became aware that whenever I was physical with my husband (even just cuddling) that I would tense a bit like I was going into this protection mode because another person was near. I wasn't really even consciously aware of it until that day. I thought about it and realized that it was just habit. I had nothing to fear from my husband, it had become a REFLEX. I was able to stop doing it just by being conscious of it.
Is this just a very stubborn, ingrained reflex for us?
galinaqt
02-13-2007, 11:42 AM
ICC
I myself professional and have to admit that I don't give my dd as much time and attention as I should of. Career in my field is more like give it all or nothing, not in between.
As a reward my dd has descent things and opportunities (touch wood).
In my ex country my mother's career mostly ment image and nice working hours for her. In terms of finance, she may get a little more than others which she rub in our faces, but it absolutely doesn't mean any remotely descent place to leave, clothes, food on the table or any kind of career opportunites for others and we could expect things to be worse not better.
Any opportunity of immigrate she was turning down again 'cause of her job.
Shannah
I had hard time getting pregnant and it wasn't 'cause of phisical issues, but I didn't let my husband in or almost didn't. My obgyn said that people who got abused in their life, not necessary sexually have a reflex when they "close the door" and she recommended me to see psychologist. The one she recommended didn't take our insurance and we randomly go to one which was a flop.
I got pregnant 'cause since I was too old, we used doctor's help, I don't want to go into details.
You may have something similiar.
I myself professional and have to admit that I don't give my dd as much time and attention as I should of. Career in my field is more like give it all or nothing, not in between.
As a reward my dd has descent things and opportunities (touch wood).
In my ex country my mother's career mostly ment image and nice working hours for her. In terms of finance, she may get a little more than others which she rub in our faces, but it absolutely doesn't mean any remotely descent place to leave, clothes, food on the table or any kind of career opportunites for others and we could expect things to be worse not better.
Any opportunity of immigrate she was turning down again 'cause of her job.
Shannah
I had hard time getting pregnant and it wasn't 'cause of phisical issues, but I didn't let my husband in or almost didn't. My obgyn said that people who got abused in their life, not necessary sexually have a reflex when they "close the door" and she recommended me to see psychologist. The one she recommended didn't take our insurance and we randomly go to one which was a flop.
I got pregnant 'cause since I was too old, we used doctor's help, I don't want to go into details.
You may have something similiar.
Sannah
02-13-2007, 12:07 PM
Hi Galinaqt, well, I was able to stop that reflex with my husband. Now I am fine. I just have this shaking issue with intense feelings? Actually, whenever I discuss any issue with my husband and it gets intense I am fine. I never shake with him, never had. I can cry easily if I get too upset, though.
Sannah
02-13-2007, 01:54 PM
Okay guys, here's the thing for me. I could totally avoid ever having to really have this reaction in my everyday life. I have this reaction because I choose to go where people are digging into deep issues where I get triggered. I come here where people are digging and then I go to a half-way house where women have a lot of deep issues. This type of interest that I have is not your everyday interest of most people - to place yourself in a position where you come into contact with these issues many times every day.
Yeh, I know, this issue has been on my mind a lot today while a go about my day!
Yeh, I know, this issue has been on my mind a lot today while a go about my day!
ICC
02-13-2007, 02:34 PM
galinaqt----i understand. I believe when injured/hurt/traumatized/abandoned/neglected,etc. as a child we bring this fear into our adult lives. You must have been so afraid to let anyone in that you shut down with your husband. from some of your past posts it sounds like the two of you have a good relationship now. Am I correct? He seems to be very supportive and sees the obvious that your mother still hurts you and it appears that he doesn't like it. Very protective. a good thing.
Sannah----I see my counselor tomorrow and will approach the subject but guaranteed I am told it is some trigger from the past. I had my first anxiety attack at 21 in the supermarket with my oldest daughter who was around 18 months old at the time. had to leave my cart and get home quickly. to this day I have no idea what brought it on and probably never will. sometimes I think our sub-concious minds wander and we don't even realize what's there, what's trying to come to the surface. hence anxiety. the feeling of not being safe, something is wrong,. fight or flight. When in a situation that is obvious it's one thing but I have alot of times not had a clue. Now i realize that in the back of my mind there is a TV always on. Replaying old movies. I don't know if you read my post on the concept of computer windows and the mind but I know that's how my mind works. I talk to myself, ask questions and tell myself I am safe but still the anxiety arises. It sounds like you live on the edge which is what my counselor tells me I do. When I am well enough I intend to volunteer for a domestic violence agency in my area. I have talked this over with my counselor and she said she couldn't think of anyone better for the job BUT told me to be very careful as some of their issues were mine and it could trigger a reaction. I have a strong inner need to help others in whatever way I can and feel I have wasted most of my life helping those that didn't want help. Now it's time to go where it's needed and wanted. I was thinking about this phone conference I have with my attorney today. I am very comfortable with him but am still anxious due to certain issues that have come up with my boss. so you see it's all very confusing in that the person I have to speak to I am not the least bit intimidated by BUT the person we will be talking about I am not intimidated by but dislike very much as he brings out those feelings my mother did. so even without him being in front of me just the thought of him makes me anxious. I am very confused and will bring this up to my counselor and see if we can spend the whole session on it and maybe I can get some insight for all of us. I feel this is a very important issue as it makes us really uncomfortable.
Love,
Grasshopper
Sannah----I see my counselor tomorrow and will approach the subject but guaranteed I am told it is some trigger from the past. I had my first anxiety attack at 21 in the supermarket with my oldest daughter who was around 18 months old at the time. had to leave my cart and get home quickly. to this day I have no idea what brought it on and probably never will. sometimes I think our sub-concious minds wander and we don't even realize what's there, what's trying to come to the surface. hence anxiety. the feeling of not being safe, something is wrong,. fight or flight. When in a situation that is obvious it's one thing but I have alot of times not had a clue. Now i realize that in the back of my mind there is a TV always on. Replaying old movies. I don't know if you read my post on the concept of computer windows and the mind but I know that's how my mind works. I talk to myself, ask questions and tell myself I am safe but still the anxiety arises. It sounds like you live on the edge which is what my counselor tells me I do. When I am well enough I intend to volunteer for a domestic violence agency in my area. I have talked this over with my counselor and she said she couldn't think of anyone better for the job BUT told me to be very careful as some of their issues were mine and it could trigger a reaction. I have a strong inner need to help others in whatever way I can and feel I have wasted most of my life helping those that didn't want help. Now it's time to go where it's needed and wanted. I was thinking about this phone conference I have with my attorney today. I am very comfortable with him but am still anxious due to certain issues that have come up with my boss. so you see it's all very confusing in that the person I have to speak to I am not the least bit intimidated by BUT the person we will be talking about I am not intimidated by but dislike very much as he brings out those feelings my mother did. so even without him being in front of me just the thought of him makes me anxious. I am very confused and will bring this up to my counselor and see if we can spend the whole session on it and maybe I can get some insight for all of us. I feel this is a very important issue as it makes us really uncomfortable.
Love,
Grasshopper
Sannah
02-13-2007, 03:01 PM
Hello again everyone! Gee, another thought just popped into my head. I do believe that I have multiple explanations for what is going on with myself with these - all that I have discussed so far. A new one came to me, however. Since I am fine in my everyday life with a few incidents which can be attributed to fearing being shot down, I believe that when I am listening to other's issues maybe all I need to do is put up that boundary so that their issues do not become my own. This is a problem for those of us with boundary issues - we can easily soak up other's emotions.
One of my clues for myself is that I have never shook with my husband. He was the person who helped me overcome my fear of intimacy problems so I trust him totally. He will not shoot down my feelings like my mom did. He is really the only person that I really trust totally.
One of my clues for myself is that I have never shook with my husband. He was the person who helped me overcome my fear of intimacy problems so I trust him totally. He will not shoot down my feelings like my mom did. He is really the only person that I really trust totally.
Sannah
02-13-2007, 03:22 PM
ICC, how do you know that you are living on the edge? What does that mean?
Galinaqt, just curious, what is your mother's PhD in?
Galinaqt, just curious, what is your mother's PhD in?
ICC
02-13-2007, 04:45 PM
Hi Sannah----- Living on the edge is putting yourself in situations that could trigger unwanted emotions. I have always been told by my therapist to keep myself safe physically, mentally and emotionally which I obviously have not done, hence living on the edge. It's a feeling that or should I say lack of feeling that you have been through so much and have conquered so much that you can't be hurt anymore. I don't do this physically anymore and have stopped setting myself up emotionally since coming to these boards. I also only feel totally safe with my husband and daughters. My daughters are 28 and 34 so they are like friends. I have some trust in others but not alot. I believe that's what my therapist meant when I told her my plan for the future in volunteering with domestic violence. that theri problems would become mine or remind me too much of my past abuse. I think we're getting somewhere. That pancake gave you lots of thoughts today:D I have to tell you being a diabetic I can't eat them every often but love a buckwheat pancake with warm apples, walnuts and a little sugar free syrup. Lousy weather here. snow, rain, ice back to rain, back to ice. dreary and damp. nice day to sit and talk with friends. I have enjoyed and been enlightened immensly. thank you for starting this post though I don't think we are through with it yet. think somemore. I'll be back.
Hugs,
Grasshopper;)
Hugs,
Grasshopper;)
dustoffkid
02-13-2007, 04:47 PM
I've been lurking a bit again...
The thing is, sometimes I jump into these things and then I don't know how to respond later. I've been reading all of your messages and responses here, and have to say that I am very impressed with the openness with which you discuss these issues.
I don't really have the same type of relationship with my mother that y'all had with yours (although she definitely had one with hers), though many of my feelings of abandonment must come from her. She left when I was nine. She is so guilt-ridden by that (she never did handle it well) that somehow now she has become exceptionally needy in her relationships with her children. I resent it sometimes, and have no problem telling her that. I have always been scrupulously (brutally?) honest with her about everything. She knows better than to ask questions she doesn't really want an answer to. No shakes with that kind of confrontation.
But people I don't know well... whoof. Shakes, red ears, fast heart, the whole bit. Why on earth? Where's the threat? I admit that I have always had a fear of failure (which has occasionally manifested as a self-destruction of success), and I am sure it's all related. I also don't remember having (or if I had) this reaction before the events that triggered my PTSD. Maybe I did and can't recall it, but I think I didn't.
I know this has been a ramble. Maybe someone can make heads or tails of it.
Hugs to all,
Dustoff
The thing is, sometimes I jump into these things and then I don't know how to respond later. I've been reading all of your messages and responses here, and have to say that I am very impressed with the openness with which you discuss these issues.
I don't really have the same type of relationship with my mother that y'all had with yours (although she definitely had one with hers), though many of my feelings of abandonment must come from her. She left when I was nine. She is so guilt-ridden by that (she never did handle it well) that somehow now she has become exceptionally needy in her relationships with her children. I resent it sometimes, and have no problem telling her that. I have always been scrupulously (brutally?) honest with her about everything. She knows better than to ask questions she doesn't really want an answer to. No shakes with that kind of confrontation.
But people I don't know well... whoof. Shakes, red ears, fast heart, the whole bit. Why on earth? Where's the threat? I admit that I have always had a fear of failure (which has occasionally manifested as a self-destruction of success), and I am sure it's all related. I also don't remember having (or if I had) this reaction before the events that triggered my PTSD. Maybe I did and can't recall it, but I think I didn't.
I know this has been a ramble. Maybe someone can make heads or tails of it.
Hugs to all,
Dustoff
galinaqt
02-13-2007, 04:48 PM
My mother is a linguist, English is her primary language and German secondary and Russian is our native. She wrote a dissertation related to history of English language or grammer.
When we wanted immigrate her reasoning was - "I am a guru in what I am doing and what will I do there, change my profession?" Another reason - "I love English but talking on it all the time whould bore me."
Right now she is putting guilt on my father who is not perfect as the reason of her unwillingless to leave, but truthfully it was no consideration for anybody else.
When we came here, each time when she has to use her language skills to do something for grandfather or other relatives (in Russia most of the people only learn it as a subject if they are lucky) who were very greateful and did lot of stuff back, it was a tragedy and I was a guilty party.
My husband even offered me to stay with her instead of me since she irritated each time. I have to decline it, since it won't look right. He doesn't always understand everything, but he is trying to be supportive.
When we wanted immigrate her reasoning was - "I am a guru in what I am doing and what will I do there, change my profession?" Another reason - "I love English but talking on it all the time whould bore me."
Right now she is putting guilt on my father who is not perfect as the reason of her unwillingless to leave, but truthfully it was no consideration for anybody else.
When we came here, each time when she has to use her language skills to do something for grandfather or other relatives (in Russia most of the people only learn it as a subject if they are lucky) who were very greateful and did lot of stuff back, it was a tragedy and I was a guilty party.
My husband even offered me to stay with her instead of me since she irritated each time. I have to decline it, since it won't look right. He doesn't always understand everything, but he is trying to be supportive.
stick2013
02-13-2007, 06:13 PM
HI All,
My, my, my what a post......Ok, well we are all related!!!!!!! If I get into a confrontation, I get shaking so bad that my teeth(false ones) start to chatter, and I can hardly talk. I am shaking so bad that it's like I have been in a freezer for 24 hrs.......LOL BUT!!!!!!! Get me even more upset, and if the tears start.... YOU JUST MIGHT BE DEAD DOG MEAT IN SECONDS!!!!!!!! After the tears I loose it........The rage will set in, and world war 3 has just arrived....
My opinion.......It's every emotion all wrapped up in one little bundle. It's all of the crap that we have endured, and I think it just simmers under the edge, and when confronted we start to shake. After it's over then the scenario playing starts.......FOR DAYS ON END!!!!!!!!
WELCOME TO THE WORLD OF PTSD, The flight is NON stop, there will be NO refreshments(wonderful life) served. Round and round we go, never knowing when the BEAST will rear it's ugly head. Should turbulence be a problem, please use your seat belts, and ground your self to the nearest object. Should there be a sudden dip(depression)try and look to the sky for guidance. Should you become over joyed with life, don't worry it won't last long. Always be prepared, and plan accordingly as life is one big circus. We should start to level off soon, so enjoy the rest of your flight!!!!!!
I hope that everyone enjoyed my little story on PTSD. I find it rather accurate, sad as it might be......
Other than that, I am sick of winter, and I am NOT looking forward to 2 feet or more of snow. So I am rather crabby.....LOL!!!!!!!!! I just hate winter.....
Love and hugs to everyone...
Sid
My, my, my what a post......Ok, well we are all related!!!!!!! If I get into a confrontation, I get shaking so bad that my teeth(false ones) start to chatter, and I can hardly talk. I am shaking so bad that it's like I have been in a freezer for 24 hrs.......LOL BUT!!!!!!! Get me even more upset, and if the tears start.... YOU JUST MIGHT BE DEAD DOG MEAT IN SECONDS!!!!!!!! After the tears I loose it........The rage will set in, and world war 3 has just arrived....
My opinion.......It's every emotion all wrapped up in one little bundle. It's all of the crap that we have endured, and I think it just simmers under the edge, and when confronted we start to shake. After it's over then the scenario playing starts.......FOR DAYS ON END!!!!!!!!
WELCOME TO THE WORLD OF PTSD, The flight is NON stop, there will be NO refreshments(wonderful life) served. Round and round we go, never knowing when the BEAST will rear it's ugly head. Should turbulence be a problem, please use your seat belts, and ground your self to the nearest object. Should there be a sudden dip(depression)try and look to the sky for guidance. Should you become over joyed with life, don't worry it won't last long. Always be prepared, and plan accordingly as life is one big circus. We should start to level off soon, so enjoy the rest of your flight!!!!!!
I hope that everyone enjoyed my little story on PTSD. I find it rather accurate, sad as it might be......
Other than that, I am sick of winter, and I am NOT looking forward to 2 feet or more of snow. So I am rather crabby.....LOL!!!!!!!!! I just hate winter.....
Love and hugs to everyone...
Sid
ICC
02-13-2007, 06:57 PM
My Dear Sid---- and I have been told I'm blunt and to the point. these people haven't met you;) You are right on all you said. sad but it's here. we have it. Never know when it will strike again but it will i'm sure. Thank you for being so optimisitc:rolleyes: We can contol it but i really feel with me it is there all the time. maybe I am just still on guard or should I say finally on guard. I am aware of my issues and triggers now so try to avoid them at all costs. doesn't always work. the only thing we differ in is that when I am done with the confrontation, shakes, palps and anxiety , then i sit and cry. I think part of it is sheer frustration and the rest is anger at whomever got me there. Glad you're home safely. We have a mess here too and supposed to continue into tomorrow night. I don't like the heat but I hate this crap.
Hugs girlfriend,
Grasshopper
p.s. we did good today didn't we?:D
Hugs girlfriend,
Grasshopper
p.s. we did good today didn't we?:D
Sannah
02-13-2007, 09:40 PM
Hello all, yes, what a productive day. I feel like I have dug all the way to the bottom of this barrel. Let's see how I react next time. I am not sure if you all know this about me or not, but I take this as a challenge that I WILL overcome. I have gotten to know my mind and my emotions so well over the last 20 years that I know that this can be beaten AND I WILL DO IT. I have come to understand so many of my issues and problems that I do not see this as some mysterious thing that cannot be understood. It will be tested soon. I might have to work on it for a bit maybe but it will not win. (Remember, I was the one who found a doctor to cure my daughters leaky gut and food allergies - nothing is impossible). Now Sid, I know that we are on opposite ends of the optimism/pessimism scale.
Dustoff, first off, how much snow did you get in your area? You are taking care of your back now aren't you? Don't be careless and injure yourself for life (careless in not thinking first and making sure that you are not doing something in a way that will hurt your back! Take the extra time to take care of yourself!).
What were the circumstances with your mother leaving? This is interesting that you do not shake with her.
Dustoff, first off, how much snow did you get in your area? You are taking care of your back now aren't you? Don't be careless and injure yourself for life (careless in not thinking first and making sure that you are not doing something in a way that will hurt your back! Take the extra time to take care of yourself!).
What were the circumstances with your mother leaving? This is interesting that you do not shake with her.
hergy
02-14-2007, 12:57 AM
A lot of times when someone asks me why I'm reacting a certain way that seems inappropriate to a situation, I have no idea what to say.
So I'm very interested in the subject matter of this thread. I researched medical findings on the nervous system responses in people diagnosed with PTSD.
Since we're not supposed to go on about such matters on the boards, I'll just say I read that, with PTSD, a certain portion of the nervous system can continue to be chronically aroused even though a threat has passed and has been survived.
Therefore, with PTSD, for example, the increase in heartbeat experienced during exercise can perhaps remind the body of the reflex response to a trauma experienced years before.
During a traumatic experience, a person's reflexes are narrowed down to three responses: fight, flight or freeze.
For myself, I'm thinking that maybe there's not one solid reason for my own shaking response. During my trauma, I froze. I can't remember being upset, fighting or trying to run. But my life afterward proves that somewhere in my head I was totally freaking out. So, maybe, my shaking responses are part of the reflexes that start working when my emotions run high, kind of like overkill.
I'm sure there's really no clearcut answer to the shakiness question, but I was pretty fascinated by the amazing facts about the brain I read. If it wasn't for the complexities of our minds, I feel confident that our traumas would have had much worse effects on all our lives.
So I'm very interested in the subject matter of this thread. I researched medical findings on the nervous system responses in people diagnosed with PTSD.
Since we're not supposed to go on about such matters on the boards, I'll just say I read that, with PTSD, a certain portion of the nervous system can continue to be chronically aroused even though a threat has passed and has been survived.
Therefore, with PTSD, for example, the increase in heartbeat experienced during exercise can perhaps remind the body of the reflex response to a trauma experienced years before.
During a traumatic experience, a person's reflexes are narrowed down to three responses: fight, flight or freeze.
For myself, I'm thinking that maybe there's not one solid reason for my own shaking response. During my trauma, I froze. I can't remember being upset, fighting or trying to run. But my life afterward proves that somewhere in my head I was totally freaking out. So, maybe, my shaking responses are part of the reflexes that start working when my emotions run high, kind of like overkill.
I'm sure there's really no clearcut answer to the shakiness question, but I was pretty fascinated by the amazing facts about the brain I read. If it wasn't for the complexities of our minds, I feel confident that our traumas would have had much worse effects on all our lives.
ICC
02-14-2007, 07:23 AM
good morning ladies*******:) Sannah i have no doubt that you will see this through and conquer it. It's who you are and that's what makes you so calming, enlightening, caring and optimistic. that's why we love you. I don't thingk any of us will let this go now, I know I am on a mission to conquer it. My therapist has always told me that some issues, triggers, hurts need to be worked on longer and more frequently than others. we will keep at it.
Dustoff---I'm with sannah. NO SHOVELING~ amazing how we all suffer the same but for different reasons and with different people. I have no problem with strangers or even people I know but don't have a realationship with. My problem with my mother and my boss is that they don't listen and read something into every word I say that just isn't there. I have told these people what I say is what I mean. please don't look for hidden agenda's. there are known. Be safe.
Nikki^^^^^^^I have also read what i could on PTSD and praise you for your reasearch. there are alot of physical responses involved one being a heightened awareness and another being our startle reaction is higher than most. That's why I believe this anxiety we suffer is being triggered by something in the past. I usuallly know when I am in the fight, flight, freeze mode. Sometimes it's so obvious that the person or situation is just pissing me off and sometimes I think I'm sad, hurt, ect. after sleeping on it and find that I was just plain old offended and angry at the person. Though I still feel like this pretty regularly I am starting to know what emotion I am feeling very quickly. that's a true accomplishment for me because for years I couldn't distinguish, fear, hurt, anger, frustration. being misunderstood is a biggie with me. I remember my last eval at work my boss telling me that I had an attitude. believe me I don't. When he said "well if we have 5-6 people out and then something breaks down you have this look on your face" I asked him if he ever thought it could just plain old frustration of trying to do my job and 5 others with broken equipment. He looked at me and "yeh I can go for that, never thought of it" so you see I have been misundertood many times in my life because alot of people believe whatever it is they think is Gospel, really don't give a hott what I am feeling, and are just shocked when they're wrong. this hasn't been easy for me since I know it, have known it for years and the feeling of not being understood and a wrong opinion of me having been formed just makes me want to "fight/flee the situation. I have had many people in my life who wouldn't know honesty if it slapped them. so most times I say it like it is in a few words but others think something's missing because it was too simple. Many times I have had to go to a person and tell them "look, what you said really offended me or Don't ever speak to me like again or Please don't try to live my life for me" all have been responded to with a blank face. no response.
Hugs,
Grasshopper
Dustoff---I'm with sannah. NO SHOVELING~ amazing how we all suffer the same but for different reasons and with different people. I have no problem with strangers or even people I know but don't have a realationship with. My problem with my mother and my boss is that they don't listen and read something into every word I say that just isn't there. I have told these people what I say is what I mean. please don't look for hidden agenda's. there are known. Be safe.
Nikki^^^^^^^I have also read what i could on PTSD and praise you for your reasearch. there are alot of physical responses involved one being a heightened awareness and another being our startle reaction is higher than most. That's why I believe this anxiety we suffer is being triggered by something in the past. I usuallly know when I am in the fight, flight, freeze mode. Sometimes it's so obvious that the person or situation is just pissing me off and sometimes I think I'm sad, hurt, ect. after sleeping on it and find that I was just plain old offended and angry at the person. Though I still feel like this pretty regularly I am starting to know what emotion I am feeling very quickly. that's a true accomplishment for me because for years I couldn't distinguish, fear, hurt, anger, frustration. being misunderstood is a biggie with me. I remember my last eval at work my boss telling me that I had an attitude. believe me I don't. When he said "well if we have 5-6 people out and then something breaks down you have this look on your face" I asked him if he ever thought it could just plain old frustration of trying to do my job and 5 others with broken equipment. He looked at me and "yeh I can go for that, never thought of it" so you see I have been misundertood many times in my life because alot of people believe whatever it is they think is Gospel, really don't give a hott what I am feeling, and are just shocked when they're wrong. this hasn't been easy for me since I know it, have known it for years and the feeling of not being understood and a wrong opinion of me having been formed just makes me want to "fight/flee the situation. I have had many people in my life who wouldn't know honesty if it slapped them. so most times I say it like it is in a few words but others think something's missing because it was too simple. Many times I have had to go to a person and tell them "look, what you said really offended me or Don't ever speak to me like again or Please don't try to live my life for me" all have been responded to with a blank face. no response.
Hugs,
Grasshopper
Sannah
02-14-2007, 09:22 AM
Hi guys, thanks for your kind words, ICC! I was just on another board and opened up a thread where a person posted who can attack easily. My shaking was much less! He didn't attack too bad but he did have that attitude. I tried to work with myself at the time to stay calm. Then I went to another board and answered a thread where I poured out my heart. I started to shake just a bit, and now I feel just a bit shaky. What this tells me is that it has a lot to do with boundaries. I am sharing a deep part of myself and it is making me feel unsafe - I have opened up the boundaries, therefore, I am vulnerable! So, therefore, I will keep working on this by telling myself that I can protect myself. If I can freely open my boundary and let my heart out I can just as quickly close my boundary and protect myself all the while telling myself to remain calm. This isn't a black hole mystery guys! EVERYTHING can be understood. If it is understood, it CAN be dealt with and YOU CAN CHANGE your reactions to your environment! It might take time because we have been programmed by our environment but if we can be programmed in one direction we can reprogram in another direction. It just takes understanding. ICC, we are both Capricorns and I feel like my mind is a computer also. Capricorns are VERY structured and this is all this is, putting things in their places and organizing them where they need to be.
ICC
02-14-2007, 09:47 AM
good morning sannah--what great insight. you are right. I always say i live in the most organized mind and I think that makes it bother me more that my mind kind of "runs a muck" in certain situations. you are right though it is just a matter of opening up the boundaries, walls, doors to our mind and knowing when and how to close them quickly if necessary. Were you on these boards? I would love to read them. That's who I want to be. A person who can protect themself, knows when and how to. doesn't always feel afraid that they are in danger. VULNERABILITY!!!! that's a biggie. I feel as children when we opened our souls we were made to feel wrong, bad, worthless and now have a fear of being vulnerable as we know we can be hurt. again it's a matter of control. I agree that we can conquer this also and I'm sure will get an education while doing it. the feeling of being out of control also scares me. I think I frighten myself at times. Make sense?
Hugs,
Grasshopper;)
Hugs,
Grasshopper;)
Sannah
02-14-2007, 09:48 AM
I am starting to know what emotion I am feeling very quickly. that's a true accomplishment for me because for years I couldn't distinguish, fear, hurt, anger, frustration. being misunderstood is a biggie with me.
ICC, this is a true accomplishment! I think that you got here because instead of running you are staying and focusing on what is going on with you now. I have always noticed something about your posts. I have always noticed that you bury the main issue in A LOT of words. When you are nervous are you one of those people who start talking a lot? This is how I see your posts frequently. You hit on an issue, get stimulated and your brain just takes off with ideas. This post that I pulled your above quote from was focused on the issues without extra words.
ICC, this is a true accomplishment! I think that you got here because instead of running you are staying and focusing on what is going on with you now. I have always noticed something about your posts. I have always noticed that you bury the main issue in A LOT of words. When you are nervous are you one of those people who start talking a lot? This is how I see your posts frequently. You hit on an issue, get stimulated and your brain just takes off with ideas. This post that I pulled your above quote from was focused on the issues without extra words.
Sannah
02-14-2007, 09:54 AM
it is just a matter of opening up the boundaries, walls, doors to our mind and knowing when and how to close them quickly if necessary.
ICC, I feel it is more of opening my boundaries to my emotions that is unsettling. Yes, I was on these boards. I was on the Anger board answering to Strongernow and I was on the depression board answering to Tigersuit.
ICC, I feel it is more of opening my boundaries to my emotions that is unsettling. Yes, I was on these boards. I was on the Anger board answering to Strongernow and I was on the depression board answering to Tigersuit.
Sannah
02-14-2007, 01:21 PM
ICC, my whole point in mentioning to you about focusing on the issue is that I wondered if it is the same thing that you are talking about - that you can identify your feelings more now. Before you didn't know exactly what you were feeling and I sort of correlated that with focusing on an issue in a post. I also wondered if this is why people don't get what you are trying to say sometimes, like with your boss and how he misunderstood you. Like your posts, you added a lot of words instead of focusing. Hope I didn't hurt your feelings!
galinaqt
02-14-2007, 01:50 PM
In my experience when boss wants to understand me he/she does. If her/his aim is to prove that I am last person on earth impossible to deal, then it is a different story. I don't believe that I myself miraculasly change, although I don't say that I was perfect and that I didn't do mistakes and in my former country was no room for mistakes.
I've heard the worse boss I've ever had telling people that I would curse her all life, since she knew that she is not fair to me and it is likely that I would have it better any other place.
I've heard the worse boss I've ever had telling people that I would curse her all life, since she knew that she is not fair to me and it is likely that I would have it better any other place.
dustoffkid
02-14-2007, 02:17 PM
Thanks all-
And yes, I have been protecting my back; the only thing I shoveled was the porch, so the dog and I could go out without having to wade through 3 feet of snow, haha. The driveway can stay snowy.
For once I thought of myself before others and didn't go in to work today. I just didn't relish driving in a whiteout in the dark for twenty miles on unplowed country highways. I thought about just going in late, but the post is closing early today and all of the local schools are closed so I just stayed here.
You asked about the circumstances of my mother leaving; she left when I was nine to go to Florence and study art (she is a painter, and where better to be than Florence for a painter?). She was never really prepared or equipped to be a parent, and leaving may have been the best thing for all of us in the end. Doesn't make much difference why, though, to a bunch of kids. My brothers were older and were more outwardly effected by it, they still harbor a lot of anger and resentment. I try to let these things go, for the most part; I don't like to hang on to a lot of negativity (but I do believe that this was the genesis of my brutal honesty to this day). I only resent her when she turns to me for psychoanalysis, and I tell her that when she does it. I learned this when I was ten or eleven, whenever she came back to Chicago (not to live with us, though, she took an apartment not too far away).
I could go on, and I will, but I feel the need to putter about the house. Always things to do! I'll check back in in a bit though.
Hugs to all.
Dustoff
And yes, I have been protecting my back; the only thing I shoveled was the porch, so the dog and I could go out without having to wade through 3 feet of snow, haha. The driveway can stay snowy.
For once I thought of myself before others and didn't go in to work today. I just didn't relish driving in a whiteout in the dark for twenty miles on unplowed country highways. I thought about just going in late, but the post is closing early today and all of the local schools are closed so I just stayed here.
You asked about the circumstances of my mother leaving; she left when I was nine to go to Florence and study art (she is a painter, and where better to be than Florence for a painter?). She was never really prepared or equipped to be a parent, and leaving may have been the best thing for all of us in the end. Doesn't make much difference why, though, to a bunch of kids. My brothers were older and were more outwardly effected by it, they still harbor a lot of anger and resentment. I try to let these things go, for the most part; I don't like to hang on to a lot of negativity (but I do believe that this was the genesis of my brutal honesty to this day). I only resent her when she turns to me for psychoanalysis, and I tell her that when she does it. I learned this when I was ten or eleven, whenever she came back to Chicago (not to live with us, though, she took an apartment not too far away).
I could go on, and I will, but I feel the need to putter about the house. Always things to do! I'll check back in in a bit though.
Hugs to all.
Dustoff
ICC
02-14-2007, 03:07 PM
Sannah--- all I can say is YES! YES! YES! to all of the above. I have always been capable of saying like it is BUT when I feel threatened, or just not sure of myself I will waltz around an issue until I get to the point. I don't know when this began. I believe with my mother's negligence as I got older and started to word it to others they would look at me like I was nuts. No one's mother treats their child like that. so I would have to explain every aspect to make sure they got it. As far as my boss goes I have never gone into too much detail with him because he was always on the run so it was either a sporadic comment or I thought it out before approaching him. He's a creep no matter how i look at it. and him thinking I am just a b---- because my daughter died put me in a position that I have never wanted to talk to him unless necessary. All of the women I worked with thought he was hot and made it known to him. except me. part of his dislike of me. You didn't offend me sannah as I have said it many times. you all know that i get really long winded when stuck on an issue and can't move forward. you are very perceptive.
Love you,
Grasshopper
Love you,
Grasshopper
stick2013
02-14-2007, 04:11 PM
Dustoff,
Quick question????...... I do not mean to be rude, or hurt you in any way I am just trying to get a grip on your mother leaving her kids at such a young age. It puzzles me........Is your mother today still emotionally unavailable?????
Sid
Quick question????...... I do not mean to be rude, or hurt you in any way I am just trying to get a grip on your mother leaving her kids at such a young age. It puzzles me........Is your mother today still emotionally unavailable?????
Sid
ICC
02-14-2007, 04:58 PM
dustoff----sorry i missed your post. I think we were posting at the same time. I am glad you are looking out for you and putting yourself first. I am also curious with your mother's negligence how you are so able and seems to have always been able to tell her like it is. My mother's negligence began a life of pain and suffering for me. You seem to be angry at her at times but tell her. does she get it?
Grasshopper
Grasshopper
dustoffkid
02-14-2007, 06:20 PM
Sid and Grasshopper- Not to me, she isn't. I'd guess that's because of our unique "tell it like it is" relationship. I simply tell her when I am not up to deep discussion, and if she is unwilling or unable to have any other kind at that moment we end the call. Her relationship with my brothers is quite a different story. They spent so many years being angry and resentful that I don't know how they'll get back to a place of comfort (or even just tolerance) with her. She told me over the weekend that she and one of my brothers are starting to approach some of his deeper hurts (in relation to her, which I theorize most of his deeper hurts come from), and that it hurts her but she has strong shoulders and can work through it. I tell ya, I have never heard her speak with that kind of emotional self-confidence, and I was impressed. We didn't talk too much about that though, because as I told her that is his story and he can tell me when or if he wants to.
As for whether she "gets" it when I tell her my resentments , I think that she does, yes. For years I might have questioned this. I finally some years back told her that when she was ready to have an honest relationship she should call me. I didn't call her at all. I still sent birthday and Christmas cards, but the relationship ball was in her court and I made her know it. We get along fairly well now.
As for whether she "gets" it when I tell her my resentments , I think that she does, yes. For years I might have questioned this. I finally some years back told her that when she was ready to have an honest relationship she should call me. I didn't call her at all. I still sent birthday and Christmas cards, but the relationship ball was in her court and I made her know it. We get along fairly well now.
stick2013
02-14-2007, 06:47 PM
Dustoff,
I am glad that at least you can express to your mother how you feel. It should at least give you some satisfaction. Although having to grow up without your mother must have been tough. Was it just to further her career, or was it because she couldn't be a mother????
How are you holding out? Have you heard from hubby lately???
Hugs,
Sid
I am glad that at least you can express to your mother how you feel. It should at least give you some satisfaction. Although having to grow up without your mother must have been tough. Was it just to further her career, or was it because she couldn't be a mother????
How are you holding out? Have you heard from hubby lately???
Hugs,
Sid
dustoffkid
02-14-2007, 06:58 PM
It was both, I think, but I think it was more the total unpreparedness to be a mother. She did what she probably should have done back in 1960- which would have solved a lot of problems for her but also would have resulted in no us. She says she doesn't regret us one bit. And of course now she has all of these grandbabies...
And I am okay... just staring at the snow, hoping it stops overnight so that I won't have to drive in new snow to work tomorrow. I hear frm hubby pretty often, as a matter of fact we are supposed to chat online in an hour!
And I am okay... just staring at the snow, hoping it stops overnight so that I won't have to drive in new snow to work tomorrow. I hear frm hubby pretty often, as a matter of fact we are supposed to chat online in an hour!
ICC
02-15-2007, 08:18 AM
distoff---I am so glad you ahve contact with hubby. it's good for both of you. You must miss each other tremendously. If i'm understanding your relationship with your mother it has always been open and honest. You have held your ground through it all. She was willing at some point to work with you and respect your wishes. that in itself makes a huge difference. When I would go to mine she would immediately start screaming that there was nothing wrong with her and it was all me. I believed her for many years and each and everytime I had a problem with someone I believed it was me and let the abuse continue. I am glad you are well. I have PT today and feel the same way. I just don't want to scrape my car, drive and just go out in the sub-zero weather. thinking of you always.
Love and Hugs,
Grashopper
Love and Hugs,
Grashopper
stick2013
02-15-2007, 09:12 AM
Morning all,
Dustoff,
I too get the feeling that you have a semi ok relationship with your mom. Not the warm fuzzy type, but at least an understanding of where you both are coming from. Good for you for setting your boundaries and letting her know. If only your brothers could let their anger go, they too could have a better relationship with her. After years of anger(that I really didn't know I had) I went to my mother when she was dying in the hospital, and asked for her forgiveness. And told her that I also forgave her for the things that had happened. She declined, and refused to talk about it. I tried, and when she died I had no guilt, and just wanted her to have peace in death.
It's colder than a freezer here, about 2 feet of snow, and I am NOT GOING ANYWHERE!!!!!!!!!!!!! :D :D :D Tomorrow is another day!!!!!
Hugs,
Sid
Dustoff,
I too get the feeling that you have a semi ok relationship with your mom. Not the warm fuzzy type, but at least an understanding of where you both are coming from. Good for you for setting your boundaries and letting her know. If only your brothers could let their anger go, they too could have a better relationship with her. After years of anger(that I really didn't know I had) I went to my mother when she was dying in the hospital, and asked for her forgiveness. And told her that I also forgave her for the things that had happened. She declined, and refused to talk about it. I tried, and when she died I had no guilt, and just wanted her to have peace in death.
It's colder than a freezer here, about 2 feet of snow, and I am NOT GOING ANYWHERE!!!!!!!!!!!!! :D :D :D Tomorrow is another day!!!!!
Hugs,
Sid
Phoenix
02-16-2007, 06:27 PM
Okay you guys, it's my turn to put an issue on the table for dissection. I get really shaky when I am confronting someone. I also get this way if I have intense feelings which are being aroused. My guess is that this has something to do with having needs. I think that I am still uncomfortable at a certain level with expressing my needs/feelings. For a review of my history - only my mother's needs were met in our family. I believe I received all sorts of negative messages to keep my needs to myself.
I have a memory that is specific to this. Remember the "why, why, why" stage when you are around three or so? Well, with my very first expression of this stage, my mother got all irritated and yelled at me with my 3rd "why" in response to her answer. I still remember this clearly. I was taken aback. Guess what, I never asked my mom a question again! Isn't that sad! Many parents get irritated with their children but you see my mother ignored me so I wasn't going to risk getting negative attention from her! I already questioned if she loved me. If she was going to yell at me this would have sealed the deal! (This just brought tears to my eyes - I guess I hit a nerve!)
Going back to my issue - even when I am on the boards here and I am reading or responding to something and it brings up intense feelings I shake. There are a few people on other boards who attack. I don't run, I respond, but boy do I shake! I went a few weeks ago for an interview for volunteering. I am volunteering now at a half-way house for women released from prison. During the interview I was all nervous that she was going to say something that was going to bring out intense feelings for me and then I would get all shaky.
I guess I just need to ACCEPT that I CAN have intense feelings and that it is OKAY! Any feedback/advice welcome!
Dear Sannah,
I have learned that when I didn't receive the attention from my parents, I looked elsewhere; what else could be expected of a child? All we wanted was a little nurturing and answers to life's questions.
Some parents tend to forget that they too, were right where we were and those that did not get the attention knew how that felt (as I) and I would never, ever put my daughter what I went through.
We weren't taught "socitiety's" way of conversing so we are still learning.
That, accompanied with all the "baggage" is more than enough to deal with.
We all need to get a "t-shirt" saying "I'm a survivor" because only God know's the true extent of our trauma.
Put it on, wear it proud and say it loud "I'M A SURVIVOR!:blob_fire
((((((((((((((((((CYBER SHIRTS TO EACH ONE THAT READS THIS))))))))))))))))
Dear Sannah,
I am not strong enough to go through each post, so there may be some repetetive thoughts but I hope that you get the "jist" of it.;)
Take care
God Bless
FTM
I have a memory that is specific to this. Remember the "why, why, why" stage when you are around three or so? Well, with my very first expression of this stage, my mother got all irritated and yelled at me with my 3rd "why" in response to her answer. I still remember this clearly. I was taken aback. Guess what, I never asked my mom a question again! Isn't that sad! Many parents get irritated with their children but you see my mother ignored me so I wasn't going to risk getting negative attention from her! I already questioned if she loved me. If she was going to yell at me this would have sealed the deal! (This just brought tears to my eyes - I guess I hit a nerve!)
Going back to my issue - even when I am on the boards here and I am reading or responding to something and it brings up intense feelings I shake. There are a few people on other boards who attack. I don't run, I respond, but boy do I shake! I went a few weeks ago for an interview for volunteering. I am volunteering now at a half-way house for women released from prison. During the interview I was all nervous that she was going to say something that was going to bring out intense feelings for me and then I would get all shaky.
I guess I just need to ACCEPT that I CAN have intense feelings and that it is OKAY! Any feedback/advice welcome!
Dear Sannah,
I have learned that when I didn't receive the attention from my parents, I looked elsewhere; what else could be expected of a child? All we wanted was a little nurturing and answers to life's questions.
Some parents tend to forget that they too, were right where we were and those that did not get the attention knew how that felt (as I) and I would never, ever put my daughter what I went through.
We weren't taught "socitiety's" way of conversing so we are still learning.
That, accompanied with all the "baggage" is more than enough to deal with.
We all need to get a "t-shirt" saying "I'm a survivor" because only God know's the true extent of our trauma.
Put it on, wear it proud and say it loud "I'M A SURVIVOR!:blob_fire
((((((((((((((((((CYBER SHIRTS TO EACH ONE THAT READS THIS))))))))))))))))
Dear Sannah,
I am not strong enough to go through each post, so there may be some repetetive thoughts but I hope that you get the "jist" of it.;)
Take care
God Bless
FTM
ICC
02-17-2007, 08:43 AM
FTM----thanks for the T-shirt. I have it on. You are so right about how we were raised. There are so many of us that had parents who didn't care, didn't know how to care, had no clue how toraise kids as they weren't raised with knowledge of how to be an adult. That being said it has also made me raise my children totally different. me being the parent, I have opted to continue counseling to break this cycle. My daughters are fully aware of all of my traumas and have had their share of "baggage" because of what they saw as children and of course the fact that I am just now learning how to be a healthy adult. We share constantly. I help them when needed and they have so much insight that they have alot to offer me. This has become a learning process with 3 grown women who love each other dearly. I can already see where my oldest ( she is the one with kids) has broken the cycle with hers and I couldn't be more pleased or proud. She is the kind of parent I wish I could've been but for lack of knowledge all i really had to offer was love and protection. from what they tell me that's all they needed. they remember.
God bless and keep you safe,
Grasshopper:D
God bless and keep you safe,
Grasshopper:D
Phoenix
02-17-2007, 08:56 AM
My dear Grasshopper,
The "if I knew then what I know now" saying is pertinent in so many respects.
Life is a learning experience and no one person learns life lesson's at the same pace.
The moment we stop learning life, life has done the same.
You are strong and carry with you much insight.
Stay focused, my friend.
Take care
God Bless
FTM
The "if I knew then what I know now" saying is pertinent in so many respects.
Life is a learning experience and no one person learns life lesson's at the same pace.
The moment we stop learning life, life has done the same.
You are strong and carry with you much insight.
Stay focused, my friend.
Take care
God Bless
FTM
Sannah
02-21-2007, 12:22 PM
Just an update for everyone. I am getting less shaky every day! Since my last post here I have just been very conscious when it happens and I focus on it with some self talk. The response is getting smaller every day. The way that I look at it is I had to retrain my emotions. Previously, I was just in automatic response and I never consciously thought it out that I needed to change this behavior.
zencat
02-21-2007, 12:41 PM
Fantastic Sannah, :) I use self-talk all the time. Great tool.
Sometimes I get caught up in the causation and I forget to apply some curative measures...:O
Sometimes I get caught up in the causation and I forget to apply some curative measures...:O
ICC
02-21-2007, 12:43 PM
Hi all *** sannah you are so right. I have noticed the same since the day or 2 that we spent on the issue. I had to confront a group of people at a table at my husband's b-day party sat and was shocked that I was able to say it, no discomfort and walk away. I didn't see my therapist last week because of the bad weather but do see her today and will still bring it up. Zen*** good to see you as always.
Love,
Grasshopper
Love,
Grasshopper
stick2013
02-21-2007, 09:05 PM
Sannah,
I am glad that you are finally figuring it out, and have calmed it down some. My problem with the SELF TALK......I NEVER LISTEN to my own answers,:eek: although I talk to myself all the time.......:D
Hugs,
Sid
I am glad that you are finally figuring it out, and have calmed it down some. My problem with the SELF TALK......I NEVER LISTEN to my own answers,:eek: although I talk to myself all the time.......:D
Hugs,
Sid
hergy
02-21-2007, 11:59 PM
My problem with the SELF TALK......I NEVER LISTEN to my own answers
It's good, though, that you're friends with yourself.
When voices start giving you answers, let your counselor know. And when the sheep dog, the cats and the lady with a perm show up, well, do the same.:)
I don't listen to my answers, either, but the talking can help you work things out.
I do listen to your answers and I love every one. Thanks, friend.:wave:
Love,
Nikki
It's good, though, that you're friends with yourself.
When voices start giving you answers, let your counselor know. And when the sheep dog, the cats and the lady with a perm show up, well, do the same.:)
I don't listen to my answers, either, but the talking can help you work things out.
I do listen to your answers and I love every one. Thanks, friend.:wave:
Love,
Nikki
stick2013
02-22-2007, 07:00 AM
Nikki,
How are you???? Feeling any better after a few days of rest???? Take all the time that you need....
I am taking care of 2 dogs for the next week. I have use of their computer. The dogs help with being alone. One of them is my sweetie, and the other well I really think that he needs to be put down, but they won't do it. He's blind, deaf, has had a few strokes, has arthritis real bad, is becoming incontinent, and sometimes poops in the house too. She just says that as long as he can wag his tail, she will keep him alive. He's 18......I think it's sad. but well...............
I am glad that I have helped you even if only a little. Any help that we can get is important. I am going to be nosy......How are you doing with the SI or should I say lack of????? I hope that you have managed not too, but if you haven't.....It's ok, just start over agin. I know it must be hard.... Let me know ok.
Love you too hon....And I hope that you are better.
Hugs,
Sid:) :)
How are you???? Feeling any better after a few days of rest???? Take all the time that you need....
I am taking care of 2 dogs for the next week. I have use of their computer. The dogs help with being alone. One of them is my sweetie, and the other well I really think that he needs to be put down, but they won't do it. He's blind, deaf, has had a few strokes, has arthritis real bad, is becoming incontinent, and sometimes poops in the house too. She just says that as long as he can wag his tail, she will keep him alive. He's 18......I think it's sad. but well...............
I am glad that I have helped you even if only a little. Any help that we can get is important. I am going to be nosy......How are you doing with the SI or should I say lack of????? I hope that you have managed not too, but if you haven't.....It's ok, just start over agin. I know it must be hard.... Let me know ok.
Love you too hon....And I hope that you are better.
Hugs,
Sid:) :)
ICC
02-22-2007, 08:58 AM
good morning all *** i also do alot of self talk. Sid you and I must look like a couple of crazy ladies talking to ourselves in the supermarket:cool: I also don't listen to myself very often but am starting to. I have realized that I know me better than anyone so when that voice in the back of my head named "Grasshopper" starts to tell me something i try to slow down and pay attention. 99% of the time she is right. I trust me more than anyone right now. Had an incident yesterday with the counselor which I willl start another thread for.
Love you guys,
Grasshopper
p.s. Nikki think back to a couple of days ago. what an accomplishment. Are you proud of yourself?
Love you guys,
Grasshopper
p.s. Nikki think back to a couple of days ago. what an accomplishment. Are you proud of yourself?
hergy
02-22-2007, 09:38 AM
I am going to be nosy......How are you doing with the SI
Hi, Sid!:wave:
About the SI, still haven't given in.:D
I didn't expect to be so numb and weird this week, but I'm not ignoring the reason. I hate feeling so vacant, though. I'm ready to get the feeling back that I'm progressing. Right now, I feel like I'm standing in a bucket of glue.
Thanks for thinking about me. I've been posting a bit, but I haven't been comfortable with posting about myself. I so hate being blank.
Sorry that you'll be there with a dog whose life makes you sad. I'd be sad, too. He shouldn't go on that way.
Take care over there.
Love you!
Nikki
Hi, Sid!:wave:
About the SI, still haven't given in.:D
I didn't expect to be so numb and weird this week, but I'm not ignoring the reason. I hate feeling so vacant, though. I'm ready to get the feeling back that I'm progressing. Right now, I feel like I'm standing in a bucket of glue.
Thanks for thinking about me. I've been posting a bit, but I haven't been comfortable with posting about myself. I so hate being blank.
Sorry that you'll be there with a dog whose life makes you sad. I'd be sad, too. He shouldn't go on that way.
Take care over there.
Love you!
Nikki
ICC
02-22-2007, 10:23 AM
Nikki---- i know it's an uncomforatble feeling but being blank is not always a bad thing. It gives your mind time to rest and I believe it happens periodically after conquering an issue. I had an old male friend who used to say there are "s--- moments in life" what he meant was the anticipation, anxiety, worrying and waiting whether for a good or bad event once it's over your mind sometimes says "that's it?' it's somewhat like a let down, ( i know that sounds crazy ) but I have found it to be trued many times in my life. Anticipating something and then before you know it, it's over. Be good to yourself.
Love you,
Grasshopper
Love you,
Grasshopper
stick2013
02-22-2007, 03:10 PM
Dearest Nikki........:D :D
OMG I am so proud of you.......WAY TO GO GIRLFRIEND...... Oh Nikki, I really am so proud of you... This is such a big thing for you!!!!!! Your post made me smile.:D I gave you a thumbs up, and if you were here I would hug the S*** right out of you.... Well maybe NOT that hard.....
I think that you, feeling like you are in glue is normal for right now.......When we live in the world of full blown PTSD our lives are like a rollercoaster caught in a tornado. It never stops, and the crap just keeps coming, the dramma feeds the fire, and we just go round and round..... Once we Get the hell off the ride........Well there is NOTHING.... The emotions just stop. We feel dead, nothing, slow motion, no drama, no dysfunction, no upset.....It's OK.... You will adjust to this soon, and then when something does happen to upset you, you will NOT like it. You will want the peace back.....and will do everything you can to achieve it again.....That's call being healthy....
You are on your way hon....My god I am so proud of you.....You are an :angel: ... You deserve 1,000,000,000 badges of courage from Zencat, and everyone else too. Here's mine.:)
Love you, love you, love you.........
Sid
OMG I am so proud of you.......WAY TO GO GIRLFRIEND...... Oh Nikki, I really am so proud of you... This is such a big thing for you!!!!!! Your post made me smile.:D I gave you a thumbs up, and if you were here I would hug the S*** right out of you.... Well maybe NOT that hard.....
I think that you, feeling like you are in glue is normal for right now.......When we live in the world of full blown PTSD our lives are like a rollercoaster caught in a tornado. It never stops, and the crap just keeps coming, the dramma feeds the fire, and we just go round and round..... Once we Get the hell off the ride........Well there is NOTHING.... The emotions just stop. We feel dead, nothing, slow motion, no drama, no dysfunction, no upset.....It's OK.... You will adjust to this soon, and then when something does happen to upset you, you will NOT like it. You will want the peace back.....and will do everything you can to achieve it again.....That's call being healthy....
You are on your way hon....My god I am so proud of you.....You are an :angel: ... You deserve 1,000,000,000 badges of courage from Zencat, and everyone else too. Here's mine.:)
Love you, love you, love you.........
Sid
hergy
02-23-2007, 12:36 AM
Oh Nikki, I really am so proud of you....I think that you, feeling like you are in glue is normal for right now....It's OK...You will adjust to this soon....You are on your way hon....My god I am so proud of you.....You are an :angel: ... You deserve 1,000,000,000 badges of courage from Zencat, and everyone else too. Here's mine.:)
The above phrases mean so much to me. That's not just a thanks for your post.
You told me that you're proud of me, that what I'm feeling is normal, that it's ok and I'll adjust soon. I rarely get reassurance from someone who knows whether or not things will be ok. That's why your words mean a lot to me. Your post reflects the excitement of a friend and the reassurance of a mom.
I love you, too! And you have the right to hug anything out of me. You're awesome!:cool:
Nikki
The above phrases mean so much to me. That's not just a thanks for your post.
You told me that you're proud of me, that what I'm feeling is normal, that it's ok and I'll adjust soon. I rarely get reassurance from someone who knows whether or not things will be ok. That's why your words mean a lot to me. Your post reflects the excitement of a friend and the reassurance of a mom.
I love you, too! And you have the right to hug anything out of me. You're awesome!:cool:
Nikki
stick2013
02-23-2007, 07:46 AM
Nikki,
I AM PROUD of you... I KNOW how hard you are trying, and how far you have come in such a short time. I also KNOW what you are feeling, and NOT feeling. Things will smooth out soon, and you will come to understand so much about the way you want and NEED your life to proceed. You will start to make healthy choices about every aspect of your life. Including family, friends, social settings, jobs, ect.... You will learn healthy boundaries, grounding yourself in cases when you need too. You will learn how to keep yourself safe at all times. You are on your way sweetie, and I KNOW also you will make it........
Love and squishy hugs,
Sid
I AM PROUD of you... I KNOW how hard you are trying, and how far you have come in such a short time. I also KNOW what you are feeling, and NOT feeling. Things will smooth out soon, and you will come to understand so much about the way you want and NEED your life to proceed. You will start to make healthy choices about every aspect of your life. Including family, friends, social settings, jobs, ect.... You will learn healthy boundaries, grounding yourself in cases when you need too. You will learn how to keep yourself safe at all times. You are on your way sweetie, and I KNOW also you will make it........
Love and squishy hugs,
Sid
hergy
02-23-2007, 05:36 PM
Things will smooth out soon....You will start to make healthy choices about every aspect of your life
How do you crawl inside my head like this?:wave:
I'm starting a new thread about being on the verge of one of those 'healthy choices.'
I'm still numb, but reassurance from you guys and my therapist today makes me know I'm not sliding backward.
My therapist said things would 'smooth out soon,' too. She also said the fact that I teared up and got nervous during my appointment was good because I was connecting emotion with the event instead of freezing up. Yay!:bouncing:
Thanks for your encouragement and support, Sid.
Love you!
Nikki
How do you crawl inside my head like this?:wave:
I'm starting a new thread about being on the verge of one of those 'healthy choices.'
I'm still numb, but reassurance from you guys and my therapist today makes me know I'm not sliding backward.
My therapist said things would 'smooth out soon,' too. She also said the fact that I teared up and got nervous during my appointment was good because I was connecting emotion with the event instead of freezing up. Yay!:bouncing:
Thanks for your encouragement and support, Sid.
Love you!
Nikki
stick2013
02-23-2007, 05:46 PM
Nikki,
You make me laugh......:D How do I crawl into your head????? REMEMBER......MY HEAD WAS ONCE WHERE YOURS IS NOW!!!!!! Silly girl.....I KNOW how you are feeling every step of the way......
I am so glad that your therapist SEES how much and how far that you have come too........It must be a BIG bonus hearing that from a PERSON and not just some TYPED words.......YOU DESERVE the BEST kiddo, and you will achieve this.........You can have the world.........
Love you too more that you will ever know....Remember you are my :angel:
Hugs,
Sid
You make me laugh......:D How do I crawl into your head????? REMEMBER......MY HEAD WAS ONCE WHERE YOURS IS NOW!!!!!! Silly girl.....I KNOW how you are feeling every step of the way......
I am so glad that your therapist SEES how much and how far that you have come too........It must be a BIG bonus hearing that from a PERSON and not just some TYPED words.......YOU DESERVE the BEST kiddo, and you will achieve this.........You can have the world.........
Love you too more that you will ever know....Remember you are my :angel:
Hugs,
Sid
hergy
02-23-2007, 06:13 PM
MY HEAD WAS ONCE WHERE YOURS IS NOW!!!!!! Silly girl.....I KNOW how you are feeling every step of the way
I do believe that. Definitely!
You help me so much. YOU ARE SO AWESOME!
I'm depressed, disoriented and numb, but I'm pleased with my progress recently. I stopped SI, got a pelvic exam and got completely disturbed by one of my favorite DVDs.:bouncing:
You're right, it is a bonus to hear my therapist confirm the good stuff, but I don't underestimate the power of your mind-to-keyboard action. You have typed some of the best advice I've ever gotten.:)
Love you! (By the way, being that :angel: always puts a smile in my heart.)
Nikki
I do believe that. Definitely!
You help me so much. YOU ARE SO AWESOME!
I'm depressed, disoriented and numb, but I'm pleased with my progress recently. I stopped SI, got a pelvic exam and got completely disturbed by one of my favorite DVDs.:bouncing:
You're right, it is a bonus to hear my therapist confirm the good stuff, but I don't underestimate the power of your mind-to-keyboard action. You have typed some of the best advice I've ever gotten.:)
Love you! (By the way, being that :angel: always puts a smile in my heart.)
Nikki
stick2013
02-23-2007, 07:36 PM
Nikki,
Just for you then.....:angel: :angel: :angel: :angel: :angel:
You are my :angel: :angel: :angel:
Love you,
Sid:wave:
Just for you then.....:angel: :angel: :angel: :angel: :angel:
You are my :angel: :angel: :angel:
Love you,
Sid:wave:
hergy
02-24-2007, 01:01 AM
Just for you then... ..:angel: :angel: :angel: :angel: :angel:
You are my :angel: :angel: :angel:
Thanks, Sid. I'm smiling with my teeth showing, and I'm in here by myself.:D
I love you!
You are my :angel: :angel: :angel:
Thanks, Sid. I'm smiling with my teeth showing, and I'm in here by myself.:D
I love you!
stick2013
02-24-2007, 11:01 AM
Nikki,
Now that I put my teeth in this morning.....LOL!!!!! I too can smile and my teeth will show. Before that it was just GUMS!!!!!!!! Hope I made you smile, and maybe laugh too. We with PTSD.....Laughter is a good thing that dosen't happen to often, so when ever I get the chance to laugh, or make someone else laugh.... I DO.....Toothless grin and all.....
Love you sweetie,
Sid
Now that I put my teeth in this morning.....LOL!!!!! I too can smile and my teeth will show. Before that it was just GUMS!!!!!!!! Hope I made you smile, and maybe laugh too. We with PTSD.....Laughter is a good thing that dosen't happen to often, so when ever I get the chance to laugh, or make someone else laugh.... I DO.....Toothless grin and all.....
Love you sweetie,
Sid
hergy
02-24-2007, 09:53 PM
Nikki,
Now that I put my teeth in this morning.....LOL!!!!! I too can smile and my teeth will show. Before that it was just GUMS!!!!!!!! Hope I made you smile, and maybe laugh too. We with PTSD.....Laughter is a good thing that dosen't happen to often, so when ever I get the chance to laugh, or make someone else laugh.... I DO.....Toothless grin and all.....
Love you sweetie,
Sid
Sid,
YOU SO ROCK! (We should have a smiley for that) Yes, I'm laughing my head off, again, in a once quiet room while by myself.:D
We are very much alike. I like to keep people laughing, too. It boosts my own spirit. I'm kind of 'down to business' on the board, but I'm rarely that way in person.
You have so many issues that anchor your happiness from flying as high as it should, but you unselfishly extend yourself to show your support. You're upbuilding, encouraging, insightful, loving, down-to-earth and funny.
Thanks. You're a special friend and a super cyber-mom.
I LOVE YOU!
Nikki
Now that I put my teeth in this morning.....LOL!!!!! I too can smile and my teeth will show. Before that it was just GUMS!!!!!!!! Hope I made you smile, and maybe laugh too. We with PTSD.....Laughter is a good thing that dosen't happen to often, so when ever I get the chance to laugh, or make someone else laugh.... I DO.....Toothless grin and all.....
Love you sweetie,
Sid
Sid,
YOU SO ROCK! (We should have a smiley for that) Yes, I'm laughing my head off, again, in a once quiet room while by myself.:D
We are very much alike. I like to keep people laughing, too. It boosts my own spirit. I'm kind of 'down to business' on the board, but I'm rarely that way in person.
You have so many issues that anchor your happiness from flying as high as it should, but you unselfishly extend yourself to show your support. You're upbuilding, encouraging, insightful, loving, down-to-earth and funny.
Thanks. You're a special friend and a super cyber-mom.
I LOVE YOU!
Nikki
stick2013
02-25-2007, 07:41 AM
Dearest Nikki,
Thank you for the kind words......We all need to hear them once in awhile. I am happy in my own way, I have the peace that I struggled to find. THAT in it's self makes me feel that EVERYTHING, and EVERYONE I have given up, turned away from, and said NO to was well worth the journey.....You may not understand that statement right now, but sometime in the future you will.......
Acheive your goals Nikki, you deserve them MORE than you will ever know....... Seek the things that you have ALWAYS wanted, but have been out of reach.....Most of all........TREAT yourself with the respect that you never had from others.... When YOU treat yourself with respect, others will do the same towards you....
That is one of the reasons that this board works so well.....WE HAVE RESPECT FOR OTHERS, and OURSELVES!!!!!
Sid
Thank you for the kind words......We all need to hear them once in awhile. I am happy in my own way, I have the peace that I struggled to find. THAT in it's self makes me feel that EVERYTHING, and EVERYONE I have given up, turned away from, and said NO to was well worth the journey.....You may not understand that statement right now, but sometime in the future you will.......
Acheive your goals Nikki, you deserve them MORE than you will ever know....... Seek the things that you have ALWAYS wanted, but have been out of reach.....Most of all........TREAT yourself with the respect that you never had from others.... When YOU treat yourself with respect, others will do the same towards you....
That is one of the reasons that this board works so well.....WE HAVE RESPECT FOR OTHERS, and OURSELVES!!!!!
Sid
ICC
02-25-2007, 09:03 AM
ABSOLUTELY SID !!!!:blob_fire that's also what i believe keeps us here. the respect and compassion for each other. so many of us have missed that in our lives and it is very necessary to be validated, cared about unconditionally. We all understand each other with is a miracle in itself. Nikki i am with Sid on this one. I have also closed doors on many that I loved. When it came to the point where they were more harmful than helpful, and I saw it, I had to say goodbye. It almost became them or me. I hate drama, chaous,dishonesty,betrayal, confrontations that are unncessary, etc. I don't want to be around people like that anymore. I am still holding my own but not there yet. I have my moments of depression and anxiety but they are much more short lived. I believe we have to always be aware of our surroundings and those around us. Sometimes just a word or two can set me back months. as our Sid says STOP---LISTEN---LEARN!!!! Be aware. think before you act/react. This was a tuffy for me as I am a typical type A and quick. Have learned that sometimes there's no point in even answering some people. If people "got it" they wouldn't inflict pain on others. and then you have the sickos of the word.
God bless my girls,
Love you,
Grasshopper
God bless my girls,
Love you,
Grasshopper
Sannah
03-15-2007, 12:48 PM
Just wanted to update everyone again. I haven't had this reaction in weeks now. As I was working on my reaction it gradually got less and less until it was gone. I might get into a situation where it might return but I will continue to work on it if it does. There is hope and everything (if the environment caused it) can be overcome if you want to face it head on and work on it.
Phoenix
03-15-2007, 05:35 PM
Dear Sannah,
I am glad that you are doing better.
Check the warning signs.
Before the onset, something has to be triggered in order to set this off.
Take care
God Bless
FTM
I am glad that you are doing better.
Check the warning signs.
Before the onset, something has to be triggered in order to set this off.
Take care
God Bless
FTM
Sannah
03-16-2007, 02:11 PM
.
Check the warning signs.
Before the onset, something has to be triggered in order to set this off.
Hi FTM, this is how I worked through it, understanding what was going on in the situations and then trying to understand how I was reacting to it and then telling myself what was REALLY going on in the present instead of just reacting to my memories of the past.
Hope you are feeling better these days.
Check the warning signs.
Before the onset, something has to be triggered in order to set this off.
Hi FTM, this is how I worked through it, understanding what was going on in the situations and then trying to understand how I was reacting to it and then telling myself what was REALLY going on in the present instead of just reacting to my memories of the past.
Hope you are feeling better these days.
ICC
03-17-2007, 07:05 AM
Hi sannah I am so glad you have worked through this. I have not. Being in a nasty legal situation the other day set me off totally. I knew where i was going, why and the possible turnout. Thought I was prepared. Was calm in anticipation of this but when the lying started so did my anxiety. 3 days later I am still uncomfortable. Still obviously need alot work in this area.
Grasshopper
Grasshopper