wildflowers
03-26-2007, 06:52 AM
Hi there! Just recently I started to drink soy milk, I heard that it was good for osteoporosis plus many other health benefits. To my amazement I really got alot of negative feedback from friends telling me how bad soy is for you. They mentioned that it contains phytic acid that causes mineral deficiencies, mainly calcium and magnesium etc. They said soy milk and soy products would take calcium away from my bones that it wouldn't benefit me. I did a little research but I am a novice to sort all this stuff out, it actually seems to be divided right down through the middle. If there are some soy milk drinkers out there, would you be so kind to inform this newbie soy milk drinker, I am trying very hard to select foods that would benefit me in anyway, not only for my osteoporosis, but for a healthier life, period!!!
Happy Springtime! Blessings! Wildflowers
Happy Springtime! Blessings! Wildflowers
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taape
03-26-2007, 08:42 PM
Soy Milk has calcium added just like other foods that have calcium added. The only thing that I can wrong with it is the taste. I wish I liked soy products but just can't eat them.
wildflowers
03-26-2007, 11:16 PM
:wave: thank you for your comeback!!! the taste initially was a problem for me, then I saw Bob Green on Oprah's show talking about 8th continent soy milk, I tried it and I like it very much, the taste is not a problem anymore. Apparently it is a good drink and I should not be concerned, I will trust that the benefits of drinking it outweighs any other effects. Blessings! Wildflowers
tomatojuice
03-27-2007, 12:25 AM
hi wildflowers When I was first diagnosed-about a year ago I started drinking soy milk for added calcium. But then-from the boards and also friends who were lifelong vegetarians started to inform me that soy was not really good. I did some research-and found a lot of controversy over it (the Phytic acid thing) so I decided for myself to give it up - why take the chance that it is robbing your bones of calcium. There are other drinks fortified with calcium. I eat yogurt and llots more leafy greens, and take my calcium supplements religiously. I don't miss soy at all-because for me also it was kind of gassy. Well on this final note, nice to meet you.
wildflowers
03-27-2007, 09:08 AM
:wave: thank you tomato juice, mostly for taking the time to share your experience. All of these concerns are genuine, soy milk and soy products may be low on the radar screen considering many more other urgent concerns, however, I have found over the years, it's the little things I may have overlooked that had made the greatest impact and difference, it's many things combined for a better outcome. The phytic acid is a real concern, I am very aware of what I swallow and consume dietary wise, eating healthy foods and taking the extra time to do research, gives my body the "WOW" factor it needs to beat up:blob_fire the germs, bacteria, illnesses my body has to deal with. I will go with my initial gut reaction, plus your sharing of your own experience tomato juice, that is to discontinue soy and soy products. My mom use to say many many years ago, " when in doubt" DON'T.
It also helps to live one day at a time, spring has sprung in Ohio here, my flowers are really enjoying the warmer weather and so am I. It's amazing how therapeutic and healing a little sunshine and warmth can be to this ole' body. Blessings to you! Wildflowers
It also helps to live one day at a time, spring has sprung in Ohio here, my flowers are really enjoying the warmer weather and so am I. It's amazing how therapeutic and healing a little sunshine and warmth can be to this ole' body. Blessings to you! Wildflowers
DesertBloom
03-27-2007, 02:37 PM
Hi Wildflowers: I've been running into the same issues on soy myself, after I just started eating edamame's, soy nuts and taking isoflavones. In my case what I've been reading is about the increase in breast cysts from the isoflavones, and like you mentioned you can find just about as many pro articles as con on soy so who knows:eek: The only thing I can think of if I continue with what I'm eating and taking is to try and decide which of the theories (pro or con) make more sense to me.
For now I don't have an answer, but I think you could figure it out with common sense and a good evaluation of what you read. My Dr wants me to increase my soy intake because of my low estrogen level, so I've been including the above in my diet for one week so far, so we'll see what I come up with on this issue. My Dr seems to feel that phytoestrogens are good for a low estrogen level and osteo, so I hope he is correct. Since I haven't really committed myself to this yet one way or the other, I'll have to see what I'm going to do. Aren't you glad spring is here:blob_fire My bulbs are all in bloom so it's real nice having flowers all over the house.
If you figure it out yourself let us know.:wave:
For now I don't have an answer, but I think you could figure it out with common sense and a good evaluation of what you read. My Dr wants me to increase my soy intake because of my low estrogen level, so I've been including the above in my diet for one week so far, so we'll see what I come up with on this issue. My Dr seems to feel that phytoestrogens are good for a low estrogen level and osteo, so I hope he is correct. Since I haven't really committed myself to this yet one way or the other, I'll have to see what I'm going to do. Aren't you glad spring is here:blob_fire My bulbs are all in bloom so it's real nice having flowers all over the house.
If you figure it out yourself let us know.:wave:
wildflowers
03-27-2007, 07:53 PM
Hi Desert Bloom, I am truly excited about spring, I even have a spring to my step. Spring fever feels like the gold rush fever of long ago, I must be outside, not panning for gold, but scanning for new buddings on the trees, little sprouts in the garden, simply wonderful.
I really have been doing alot of reading, and like you mentioned Desert Bloom, everything is split right down the middle. I could be drinking a glass of soy milk one minute, thinking I was doing something healthy for myself, next I would be gagging on it having read very negative reports. I have scared myself to death from reading about breast cancer, thyroid cancer etc etc etc. not to mention the phytic acid thingamagig. Well, anyways Desert Bloom, there is three of us at least, you, tomato juice and myself that feel there really is no concrete answer to this soy question. I have been going round and round on this for awhile. The soy companies of course make you feel you could walk on water by downing one cup of this nectar from the Gods. Jeepers I would love to find a one size fits all food, that would take away all my medical concerns. Until that time happens I will continue to keep reading and perchance somewhere down the line there will be good news regarding soy. One has to take into serious consideration the pros and cons of anything new we try. One of these days I am just going to risk it, go get a giant hamburger, fresh fries and a large milkshake and not worry about my high cholesterol, and then again maybe I won't. Many blessings and good health to you and your family. Wildflowers
I really have been doing alot of reading, and like you mentioned Desert Bloom, everything is split right down the middle. I could be drinking a glass of soy milk one minute, thinking I was doing something healthy for myself, next I would be gagging on it having read very negative reports. I have scared myself to death from reading about breast cancer, thyroid cancer etc etc etc. not to mention the phytic acid thingamagig. Well, anyways Desert Bloom, there is three of us at least, you, tomato juice and myself that feel there really is no concrete answer to this soy question. I have been going round and round on this for awhile. The soy companies of course make you feel you could walk on water by downing one cup of this nectar from the Gods. Jeepers I would love to find a one size fits all food, that would take away all my medical concerns. Until that time happens I will continue to keep reading and perchance somewhere down the line there will be good news regarding soy. One has to take into serious consideration the pros and cons of anything new we try. One of these days I am just going to risk it, go get a giant hamburger, fresh fries and a large milkshake and not worry about my high cholesterol, and then again maybe I won't. Many blessings and good health to you and your family. Wildflowers
phylwill1152
03-28-2007, 08:21 AM
Hello everyone :wave: ...I've been reading your soy dicussion with interest. I've never gotten into soy, other than the toasted snack beans, even though over the years it has been touted as one of the perfect foods. It seems that things come and go so quickly in the "whats right to do" department that you need a scorecard and phd to keep up with all the pros and cons you read. I think that like everything else MODERATION is the way to go, unless your told different. I don't think too much of anything is good.
Spring has sprung here in Illinois too. The grass is green from all the rain we've had, the periennals for starting to grow and the birds are singing. All those things that rejuvenate the spirit after a long winter. i have a few brick borders i need to repair. I like things in order before i start hitting the greenhouses and filling the bare spots. have a good week...take care...phyllis
Spring has sprung here in Illinois too. The grass is green from all the rain we've had, the periennals for starting to grow and the birds are singing. All those things that rejuvenate the spirit after a long winter. i have a few brick borders i need to repair. I like things in order before i start hitting the greenhouses and filling the bare spots. have a good week...take care...phyllis
wildflowers
03-28-2007, 09:14 AM
:wave: Good Morning Phyllis, "hitting the greenhouses" my favorite thing to do. During the winter I would at least one time a week, stroll through the greenhouses and soak up all the fragrance and beauty of the seasonal flowers. Now, I can go in with their doors wide open and have a feast for my eyes.
Switching topics from soy to Ezorb calcium, it is another treatment that seems to be recommended, however, my doctor didn't seem to know much about it. It makes claims for a significant difference in bone spurs, heel spurs, loss of bone mass, fibromyalgia, rheumatoid and osteoarthritis, back and muscle pain. According to them they have set a world record on calcium absorption. Of course I was reading there testimonials on ezorbonline.com Yes, I think tomato juice is right, its best to get your calcium through food and not worry about looking for other alternatives that have not been totally proven either way. Soy? or Ezorb? I will hold out with waiting to hear from one of you that it has made a difference in your life, someway, somehow. It certainly would be a miracle to swallow something that could change all the above mentioned medical problems.
Just a little side note. Does anybody ever get tired of the reaction from folks when you mention you have osteoporosis? I don't go around telling everyone I have osteoporosis, however, during medical visits etc. the look I get sometimes is sympathy, not empathy, they seem to be afraid they will be witnessing me breaking my back in front of them. Could it be true that there is that much fear out there?
I am reading a wonderful book right now from the MAYO CLINIC ON OSTEOPOROSIS it is the best I have read so far in relation to explaining everything and I do mean everything. I keep alot of books on hand to remind me of little things I have a tendency to forget over time. again happy springtime to all of you. blessings wildflowers
Switching topics from soy to Ezorb calcium, it is another treatment that seems to be recommended, however, my doctor didn't seem to know much about it. It makes claims for a significant difference in bone spurs, heel spurs, loss of bone mass, fibromyalgia, rheumatoid and osteoarthritis, back and muscle pain. According to them they have set a world record on calcium absorption. Of course I was reading there testimonials on ezorbonline.com Yes, I think tomato juice is right, its best to get your calcium through food and not worry about looking for other alternatives that have not been totally proven either way. Soy? or Ezorb? I will hold out with waiting to hear from one of you that it has made a difference in your life, someway, somehow. It certainly would be a miracle to swallow something that could change all the above mentioned medical problems.
Just a little side note. Does anybody ever get tired of the reaction from folks when you mention you have osteoporosis? I don't go around telling everyone I have osteoporosis, however, during medical visits etc. the look I get sometimes is sympathy, not empathy, they seem to be afraid they will be witnessing me breaking my back in front of them. Could it be true that there is that much fear out there?
I am reading a wonderful book right now from the MAYO CLINIC ON OSTEOPOROSIS it is the best I have read so far in relation to explaining everything and I do mean everything. I keep alot of books on hand to remind me of little things I have a tendency to forget over time. again happy springtime to all of you. blessings wildflowers
phylwill1152
03-28-2007, 12:16 PM
Hi Betty Lou....I know what you mean bout the reactions to osteo. i've notced a few like you've mentioned. I don't want to open a can of worms about something that can cause so many problems but....i beleive all the adds on tv for osteo drugs have created an awareness that thats wasn't around before they went on the market. Funny, it wasn't till all us baby boomers were getting to the right age that it all started appearing in mass. We all heard and knew about our bones getting weaker as we age and that fractures happen, but all the media attention and drug companies have created a fear factor that wasn't prevelant in the past. To be honest i'd like to see all drug commercials off the air and let the dr. do their own research into the drugs they want to give their patients. Didn't mean to ramble... ***Please keep in mind that this is my opinion and is probably different from many of the posters.
I'm not familiar with Ezborb, i have read the claims it makes and also know its on the expensive side. I take a once a day 1000mg/D calcium supplement called EzCal and try to eat foods that are good calcium sources. I've read the Mayo book and does have lots of good info in it, altho my favorite is still the Myth of Osteoporsis.enjoy the nice weather..take care..phyllis
I'm not familiar with Ezborb, i have read the claims it makes and also know its on the expensive side. I take a once a day 1000mg/D calcium supplement called EzCal and try to eat foods that are good calcium sources. I've read the Mayo book and does have lots of good info in it, altho my favorite is still the Myth of Osteoporsis.enjoy the nice weather..take care..phyllis
petal*pusher
03-28-2007, 06:01 PM
Hmmm...interesting thread! As a vegetarian (for 18 years) I have no problem with any of the soy products. I try to be careful in what I eat....(except for that ice cream!) Someone here mentioned the back 'n forth info we're given in how good it is for us...I think that's the case in many different things.
The tomato juice surprised me! My daughter was diagnosed with rheumatiod arthritis when she was 7 (29 now) and one of the things suggested NOT to eat too much of was anything in the "Nightshade" family....(tomatoes, peppers, eggplant). My vegetarian diet is not because of disdain for killing animals...my digestive system simply has trouble digesting certain foods... red meat being the main culprit. My daughter and I read all we could about the RA, and decided to change our eating...(to help her out, I ate like her)...to my surprise, my system benefitted, so I never looked back....and do not miss the meat! She is a Vegan, but I am not...I know I need the calcium offered thru animal products such as milk, cheese, eggs......and ICE CREAM!
Wildflowers...I agree that attitudes on this disease are a'changing. Perhaps it IS because our generation seems to be effected much too early....or it could be those dastardly commercials too (I agree Phyllis..I bet those Doctors really like people going in and telling THEM what they should be taking!)
GREENHOUSES?!? Funny how many here love gardening! I've been a florist for over 40 years; after 25 years in the industry, I changed jobs to teach Floral Design at a vocational school (day classes and Ad. Ed.)...been there 19 years! In our Horticulture class, we teach Landscape Design, Floral Design, and Greenhouse Production. The kids have been filling the 3 greenhouses daily with flats of annuals, perennials, and hanging baskets that will be ready to sell by Mother's Day here in Mi. Such a wonderful challenge it is to teach "the wonderment of growing things" to youngins' that have never been in a garden. I love it!......Pam;)
The tomato juice surprised me! My daughter was diagnosed with rheumatiod arthritis when she was 7 (29 now) and one of the things suggested NOT to eat too much of was anything in the "Nightshade" family....(tomatoes, peppers, eggplant). My vegetarian diet is not because of disdain for killing animals...my digestive system simply has trouble digesting certain foods... red meat being the main culprit. My daughter and I read all we could about the RA, and decided to change our eating...(to help her out, I ate like her)...to my surprise, my system benefitted, so I never looked back....and do not miss the meat! She is a Vegan, but I am not...I know I need the calcium offered thru animal products such as milk, cheese, eggs......and ICE CREAM!
Wildflowers...I agree that attitudes on this disease are a'changing. Perhaps it IS because our generation seems to be effected much too early....or it could be those dastardly commercials too (I agree Phyllis..I bet those Doctors really like people going in and telling THEM what they should be taking!)
GREENHOUSES?!? Funny how many here love gardening! I've been a florist for over 40 years; after 25 years in the industry, I changed jobs to teach Floral Design at a vocational school (day classes and Ad. Ed.)...been there 19 years! In our Horticulture class, we teach Landscape Design, Floral Design, and Greenhouse Production. The kids have been filling the 3 greenhouses daily with flats of annuals, perennials, and hanging baskets that will be ready to sell by Mother's Day here in Mi. Such a wonderful challenge it is to teach "the wonderment of growing things" to youngins' that have never been in a garden. I love it!......Pam;)
phylwill1152
03-28-2007, 07:29 PM
petal*pusher...i worked in a florist /greenhouse for 13 years and loved every minute of it. No formal training, all on the job. I got to be a pretty good basic designer, i left the fancy designer pieces to the best in the shop. Just yesterday i started seeds in vermiculite. I know its easier to buy bedding plants, but i like the whole process. I've also taken a few cutting form my houseplants and am waiting anxiously till its time for me to take them outside for the summer.
I don't really think things have changed that much or that we are effected more..we are just the first generation to use the new technologies that are availabe to detect and the drugs to treat it. Before lots of people had osteo they just didn't know it unless they fractured something and were checked. I just hope by the time our daughters and grandkids are our age that there a better options for treatment than available now. take care...phyllis
I don't really think things have changed that much or that we are effected more..we are just the first generation to use the new technologies that are availabe to detect and the drugs to treat it. Before lots of people had osteo they just didn't know it unless they fractured something and were checked. I just hope by the time our daughters and grandkids are our age that there a better options for treatment than available now. take care...phyllis
wildflowers
03-28-2007, 11:08 PM
Hi Petal Pusher, when I mentioned tomato juice i was referring to one of our friends here on healthboards that posted regarding our topic, sorry for the confusion in my communication.
Phyllis bravo and a standing ovation:angel: I totally agree with you.
Desert Bloom you have caremark for your insurance for your forteo, I have caremark also and my request for forteo is still pending, would you be so kind to reply how long it took before you heard regarding approval. It would be deeply appreciated.
To my flower friends, this year I am going to be planting more flowers in larger containers, it will be easier for me, do you have any suggestions. I plant cosmos in the garden, would they do well in larger containers. I would love to have something that can tolerate the heat, last year here in ohio it was in the 90's alot. Thanks a bunch!!! Wildflowers
Phyllis bravo and a standing ovation:angel: I totally agree with you.
Desert Bloom you have caremark for your insurance for your forteo, I have caremark also and my request for forteo is still pending, would you be so kind to reply how long it took before you heard regarding approval. It would be deeply appreciated.
To my flower friends, this year I am going to be planting more flowers in larger containers, it will be easier for me, do you have any suggestions. I plant cosmos in the garden, would they do well in larger containers. I would love to have something that can tolerate the heat, last year here in ohio it was in the 90's alot. Thanks a bunch!!! Wildflowers
phylwill1152
03-29-2007, 08:58 AM
Hi Betty Lou...we like cosmos too, but for some reason we just can't get them going. If you could find a short variety i think they'd do well in a container. Anymore we stick with wildflowers since they aren't quite so picky about conditons. I've had great luck with vinca flowers..not the vine vinca, but the small flowers with glossy green foliage. They seem to thrive in our sandy soil and don't require as much watering.
thanks for the bravo...its good to know that others feel the same way.
have fun gardening...taike care...phyllis
thanks for the bravo...its good to know that others feel the same way.
have fun gardening...taike care...phyllis
DesertBloom
03-30-2007, 12:11 PM
Desert Bloom you have caremark for your insurance for your forteo, I have caremark also and my request for forteo is still pending, would you be so kind to reply how long it took before you heard regarding approval. It would be deeply appreciated.
Wildflowers: Haven't you been waiting a long time for this? It seems to me that you've fallen between the cracks, because it shouldn't take more than 72hrs to approve or disaprove a rx.
No I don't have Caremark as my insurance, they are only a distributor that Humana (my insurance) uses to fill, and ship the rx.
What does your Dr say about the delay? In my case my insurance covered it after the Dr sent in the necessary paper work (48 hours), but in the mean time Eli Lily gave the patients a free pen for the first month when we went to the instruction class on how to use the pen. If you have to wait longer than 72 hours for approval, you're entitled to file a grievance with your insurance.
When I set up my first delivery from Caremark it did take about 2 weeks to finally get it, but they keep telling me they didn't get the rx from my Dr, but they also knew that I had a free pen on hand, and the delay had nothing to do with it being covered or not, which it was. If I were you I would stay on the phone with Caremark and the Dr until that rx arrives. Making you wait this long is medically detrimental--start yelling!!!:mad: :mad: :mad:
Good Luck:wave:
Wildflowers: Haven't you been waiting a long time for this? It seems to me that you've fallen between the cracks, because it shouldn't take more than 72hrs to approve or disaprove a rx.
No I don't have Caremark as my insurance, they are only a distributor that Humana (my insurance) uses to fill, and ship the rx.
What does your Dr say about the delay? In my case my insurance covered it after the Dr sent in the necessary paper work (48 hours), but in the mean time Eli Lily gave the patients a free pen for the first month when we went to the instruction class on how to use the pen. If you have to wait longer than 72 hours for approval, you're entitled to file a grievance with your insurance.
When I set up my first delivery from Caremark it did take about 2 weeks to finally get it, but they keep telling me they didn't get the rx from my Dr, but they also knew that I had a free pen on hand, and the delay had nothing to do with it being covered or not, which it was. If I were you I would stay on the phone with Caremark and the Dr until that rx arrives. Making you wait this long is medically detrimental--start yelling!!!:mad: :mad: :mad:
Good Luck:wave: