Hi gang,

I know all of you are aware of the terrible tragedy that happened at Virginia Tech this week. If you have been following the news - it's difficult not to - you also know that there has been lots of talk about what the school, doctors and others could have done to predict this killer's behavior. There has been lots of talk about depression and the "signs" of mental illness. There has also been talk about changing the laws that protect our privacy - by people who are insensitive to others with mental illness, people who do not consider the rights of millions of people, like us, who suffer from mental illness who have never, and would never conceive of doing any harm to anyone.

Am I the only one who feels the fear of impending doom, the fear of a "witch hunt" mentality developing in this country against those of us who suffer from any form of mental illness? After all, it only takes a strong majority to change the laws that protect all of us. I am very disturbed by the direction the political ideologues are spinning the discussion.

I do, of course, believe that if anyone exhibits signs of hurting anyone else or themselves, observers have a responsibility to act. However, I am saddened that people believe that the answer is to take away the rights of all of us, who already have to deal with the stigma and ridicule that goes along with mental illness. It's a slippery slope, and we need to remain vigilant to ensure that our rights are not taken away from us during this sad and scary time. I mean, it wasn't long ago that students in high schools all over the South were banned from wearing black clothes, or accused of worshipping the devil for being different. Is it so far a leap that it couldn't happen to us?

Curiously, with all the news coverage about "warning signs" and what could have been done, not one person has said anything about our culture, how people should learn to be nicer and more compassionate and understanding to the people who are different than they are, to embrace them rather than shun them. They interviewed the teachers and professors who said they tried to intervene when the killer exhibited violence in his writings. One said she reached out to other professors, trying to alert others about his strange behavior. What's interesting is that never in any of her interviews did she say she tried to confront him, to take him aside and talk to him, to ask him if he needed help or to talk to someone about what he was feeling; never did she say that she talked to him at all, not as a mentor or to lend him a helping hand in what was apparently a very dark time in his life. No talk of interraction at all on her part. What she did, her instinct, was to turn him in and ask someone else to intervene. No one did. One act of kindness can often go a long way. But no one has talked about kindness; everyone talks around it as if being kind to people who are different or lonely or unpopular is so far beyond our imagination that we must look to other mechanisms to solve social problems, to prevent them. It's very curious indeed.

I am not, in any way, trying to excuse what this maniac did or to minimize the impact and sadness of his actions and the poor families' heartache and fears. I am just worried that, in all of the grieving and finger pointing, that we, the people on this board and others like us, could lose our rights to privacy. That would be another tragedy in and of itself, and I don't want that to happen. :(

Hi Gav,

I am hoping it will have the opposite effect. So many specialists were on the air saying the current state of affairs in this country pertaining to mental illness is so horrendous, emphasizing how many cannot get any help....how even when parents know their adult child has severe problems, they are not able to get any help, etc. But I know what you mean. I was screaming at the TV when Chris matthews was going on, criticizing the college for not having notified the suitemates that they were living with someone who had been declared mentally ill. I even wrote an email to him, I was so annoyed. At least the MSM didn't immediately start describing the kid as being bipolar. I was waiting for that to happen.

You make some very good points.

:wave: Tsohl

Hi tsohl,

I'm relieved to hear that I wasn't the only one - I kept waiting, biting nails, for them to say he was bipolar, too! I did see Dr. Phil on Larry King tonight emphasizing the dangers of stigmatizing people with mental illnesses because of this, saying that most are lawabiding, productive and compassionate adults and kids. I felt better after hearing that. I haven't seen much positive spin on the side of the mentally ill; I wish I had. I've been over here so angry at the insensitivity of some of these people, the ignorance veiled as compassion for the victims. They do not consider that there are some people out there who need their understanding. After all, the lack of compassion and understanding just may prevent future incidents.

I think you'll be waiting a long time to see much positive spin on the side of the mentally ill. Most people do not understand what it is all about, or what it is like for someone who is diagnosed with a mental illness or disorder. I have to admit that even after our son was diagnosed it took me quite awhile to come to some understanding. I really can't imagine a time when there will not be a stigma associated with it. Most people are just so ignorant. Most people also lack compassion for anything other than what they already know.

I'm watching the rerun of Larry King right now.

Take care,
:wave: Tsohl

Hi tsohl,

I'm relieved to hear that I wasn't the only one - I kept waiting, biting nails, for them to say he was bipolar, too! I did see Dr. Phil on Larry King tonight emphasizing the dangers of stigmatizing people with mental illnesses because of this, saying that most are lawabiding, productive and compassionate adults and kids. I felt better after hearing that. I haven't seen much positive spin on the side of the mentally ill; I wish I had. I've been over here so angry at the insensitivity of some of these people, the ignorance veiled as compassion for the victims. They do not consider that there are some people out there who need their understanding. After all, the lack of compassion and understanding just may prevent future incidents.

gav...I can surely understanf where you are coming from. Your thoughts are very valid. As mine,they come from our own personal view points and the fact that we live with BP Disorder. I hear your conserns loud and clear......
However, I am looking to NAMI to provide a "blanket statement" about the lack of concern for ALL people with a Dx. of mental illness. I have not seen it yet...but I'm hoping it will apear in the media very soon. I'm a supporter of NAMI's "stigmabuster" sagement. bpMagazine is also an excellent source for education and knowledge about controling stigma with BP Disorder. The bpMagazines's mission is "Hope and Harmony For People with Bopolar". Look into it. On a personal basis, I live in a retired community. In the last 4 years here,I have shared with so many of my friends that I am Bipolar. I have held short sessions around the "pool" providing education and knowledge to these folks. It is just amazing how these folks had such poor and missinformed knowledge about BP Disorder. A large number have asked for my opinion this week,on what happened,as it relates to mental illness. I have nerver received a feeling of "stigma" from these folks....In fact, they all respect me,(I was in the medical professional), as a person who they see as normal friend;who has acheived stability in Life.

Just a comment on all the anger that the media has shown toward so many people,classmates,techers,police,and mental health professionals. Yes...gav...
your right...if only there was more compassion given to this person...than possibabily he could of not "cracked". But it seems that no one tried ...compassion.

Amy...another poster on this Board has recommend a Book by the Dilai Lama-"Healing Anger-The Power of Patience".
I have just finished it. It's point...as far as I can understand (it is very indepth),
may be quite simple....If we all can develope Patience and Tolerance toward a person's behavior,than our Anger could be controled. After we have done this and show Compassion toward the person,we will find that, yes, Compassion with over ride Anger.

I'm not naive...I'm 65 and I have been Dxed with BP Disorder for almost 40 years...and Stable of the last 23 years.

Carry On

what about mentally ill profiling? will that become rampant?

the key solution to most of the problems in the world is to develop more compassion and empathy.

this includes such organizations as PETA. they are known to take drastic measures to get their point across. that, in turn, alienates people. the solution is not thrown it in your face, it is teaching the basics of compassion and empathy. if people learned to care at a basic level, then you wouldn't have to take such measures.

hope this makes sense.

same goes for poverty, fostering, mental illness, etc.

have a great day!

kathryn

I think this a very interesting question, Gav, and I think that the problem stems from the fact that it is people like the Virginia Tech killer that get the media attention for mental illness. It is not people like you, Gav, who have learned not only to manage, but to prosper, with a BP diagnosis.

I can give you another example of how this works. I was watching one of the predator shows that Dateline is running. I have a teenage son so, of course, I feel a personal outrage about adults who solict young girls and boys. In one of the interviews of the predators, he said he was bipolar. I was interested in my own reaction because I should be very sensitized to the plight of those with mental illnesses. Yet, I have to say that I probably thought the same thing as most of America when they watched that because it struck me as a convenient excuse to prey on 12 year old girls.

I felt almost guilty about my reaction, but I also realized that for people who have no interaction with anyone with BP, and only see and hear stories like this on the news, how can they not stigmatize the greater group? The success stories cannot be relegated to the cable news shows or the daytime talk circuit. As Eyes said, this would be a great time for NAMI to make a statement and get some primetime coverage to counteract the perspective that mental illness is equated with deviant behavior.

It's a long road, unfortunately, but it is really is people like you, Gav, that can change perspectives. We need to get you and Eyes on primetime (and so many others who are living successful and happy lives with a diagnosed mental illness!)

Always,

Hope

WOW! So many really great responses. I'm glad I wasn't the only one who pondered the implications of this situation. And what nice things you had to say - thank you. :)

I was going to post a reply earlier but had a previous engagement that ended up showing up earlier then expected. I know with the 9/11 attacks and though they are on a different level they do relate. That there were attacks or things that happened to people not of Middle Eastern ancestry. That though some understand as it being an emotional reaction to the situation though it doesn't excuse it. I cringe to hear someone being described as mentally illness after such events as those that took place at Virginia Tech for much the same reasons. There will be lawmakers and citizens who will once again bring up barbaric things such as putting the mentally ill in sort of a prison to keep the supposed "normals" safe. The problem is that the research that has been done shows that many mentally ill patients aren't violent and do lead very productive lives without committing a violent act. I don't think movies or Tv help when they promote things that are not exactly on target for what Bipolar people, schizophrenics, and others go through and often make it more bizarre or scarier then what it might be in reality. Yes, it unnerves me at the moment that somehow a label might be cast upon me because of it.

I read the "supposed" plays the young man wrote and though they expressed a lot of anger, and rough or crude language but they were not the bloody gore things I had heard about. I know some of the stories I wrote in school were very much worse then what he had done and no one ever said yeap there's a future anything. They tended to like my work and I got good grades. It made me wonder what the difference between his work and mine really was? I do think there were some who did try to reach out to him in the ways that they could. Sadly, I think (I don't know if I am wrong or right either) that by then he perhaps was afraid that it was only a joke, so angry at previous events, had a hard time socializing with others because of limited exposure, or if they made it up entirely. In the end, compassion isn't just a one way street and sometimes though smiles are more valuable then a dozen roses it can be torture for someone who reads too much into it.

Sorry this is so long but I wanted to say my peace while the question was fresh rather then wait till I forgot about it altogether.

Eme:angel:

I'm so happy to have all of you. I really get so much out of hearing your take on things. I don't know if you watch Bill Maher's talk show on HBO, but they had some conservative lady talking about Virginia Tech, and when Bill Maher and the others started talking about gun control issues, she piped in and said "Gun control? What about "NUT" control?" I can't tell you how angry I got! I know I must've surely had steam coming out of my ears! :mad:

Double post - sorry

This is a great thread.....I too wonder what the aftermath will be for those who have a mental illness after what has occurred at VT. I think that Emerald brought up a great point in regard to how Muslims were looked at after 9/11 and some innocent people were actually arrested and interogated based upon their ethnicity.

To me in hits close to home....my oldest daughter just started seeking help through her college for ADD/BP symptoms for further evaluation. She went to a counselor and missed her followup appointment after coming down with Mono....perhaps it was a blessing in disguise. I may call that off and have her evaluated once she comes home because of my fears of what may happen and how she may be treated differently while at college.

I also will be concerned for Erin when the time comes for her to go to college. I don't want her to be ashamed of having BP but feel now that her divulging such information may be held against her.

I would imagine, Gav, that this will have some impact upon your recent recognition at your college....perhaps it will be your opportunity to turn things around.;) Knowing you, the future of students struggling with BP and/or mental illness in the college you attend will have the support of their professors and college personel.

Anyway.....on another note, I am also concerned about all the publicity this VT massacre is getting. It almost glorifies what he did and the media should put it quickly to rest so that our children do not see that people are given such high attention when something so horrific happens.

That's my 2 cents worth. :)

~ Goody:angel: :wave:

But, Goody, once again it forces those who have BP or depression into "hiding." They know if they talk about their diagnosis they will face stigma, or worse. When will we ever be able to talk about having BP like we'd talk about having fibromyalgia or diabetes or .....????

At my son's first career job after graduating college, once word was out (only the HR guy knew initially) that he had BP, people treated him differently. Everything he did was looked upon as being a sign of him being "crazy." The example I remember best occurred at Easter time. The receptionist had a big bowl of jelly beans sitting on her desk. Son was talking with her and made the observation that there were many more black jelly beans than were normally found in that quantity of jelly beans. To him, this was simply an observation, but by noon he discovered that this comment had made the rounds of the whole office, through the grapevine. This continued to build to the point where he felt every little thing he did was being scrutinized and examined to see if it was a sign of his mental illness.

:wave: Tsohl

This thread really puts everything in a new light for me and forces me to face the fear of the diagnosis of mental illness. My son was thinking of writing one of his college essays on his whole experience of dealing with BP and I thought that was a great idea, but no more.

Tsohl is right - it forces us to hide mental illness.

UGH!

Hope

Hi gang,

I think we need to take a step back and truly look at how these people are making us feel and make a decision to stand up rather than back down. After all, it's ignorance that undermines our efforts, ignorance that's coming through over the airwaves. Therefore, we should use this as an opportunity to speak up, to educate, to show those who would rather see us lose our rights that most of us are functioning adults, most of us are extremely intelligent and creative and kind people, not "nuts" who need to be controlled and exposed to more criticism and ridicule!

I really want to stress that I think it would be a mistake for your son not to write his essay on bipolar disorder; in fact, maybe he should tackle this subject specifically - the devastating impact that the legal system and media can have on sufferers of mental illness. You really don't hear any discussion about mental illness, specifically bipolar disorder, unless someone has committed a crime or is being prosecuted for committing a crime and bipolar disorder is their defense of choice. The legal system has encouraged society's misconceptions and negatively colored people's opinions of mental illness thereby solidifying the prevailing ignorance in our society about us and others like us - that most of us are criminals and/or can't be trusted. And the media exemplifies it by reporting those beliefs.

I think this is a great opportunity for your son to write about this disorder, ESPECIALLY since he's in college - it's completely relevant and important for him to take a stand and speak out, not cower in the face of ignorance. That's what college is all about - teaching and learning! :D If I had more classes and the subject matter was appropriate for my major, I would certainly use it and write about it.

About your son at his job - there is a major legal issue there that MUST be dealt with! A person's disability is not a free-for-all in the workplace. I would encourage him to approach upper-management about holding a workshop about mental illness specifically geared toward educating staff about mental illness in general, their rights to privacy and understanding, the stigma that comes with it, and the hurt that it causes us. If that's not possible, he could always tackle that issue himself, talking to co-workers about the disorder, etc. I might even compile a list of celebrities and scholars who also suffer from this disorder, people they WISH they knew and were like. It's so sad to me that he's having to go through that at work. It's completely inappropriate and makes me angry that people are so ignorant and cold that they would whisper behind his back about something so silly and foolish - get a LIFE already! GEEZ! :mad:

But we can all play a part together to change minds by educating others, even if only the few around us. It's easier said than done, I know. Writing about bipolar disorder in my application for the award was VERY scary for me. But I made the decision to confront it in public and I am happy I did. And what I find is that more people respect us for our bravery than ridicule and judge us. Just think of those you know how allow themselves to be vulnerable to stand up to their beliefs - even if you don't agree with them - in the face of adversity. Who put themselves out there prepared to pay a price and be honest knowing that they could face severe consequences for doing so. I've never met a person who didn't respect them for it. Doing what's right is NEVER easy, it's always the most difficult path to take. But for those of us who choose it, it is almost always worth it! DON'T BACK DOWN! :D

You are 100% right, Gav. I guess my concern for my son (although I do like your positioning very much) is that his essays would be for acceptance to the colleges. We have two years - he is only a sophomore - and my hope is that the world will be in a better place by then.

I watched some of the news shows yesterday and several of the commentators did mention that as a country, we have done a terrible job educating people about mental illness or offering sufficient treatment, but my fear is that the discussion will end pretty quickly and the after-effects will be all negative.

Thanks for starting this important thread.

Love,

Hope

I have to run to school, but wanted to comment really quick about your son's essay. Since it's a school acceptance letter, he might just mention that he is determined to help and educate others about the disorder, especially in such trying times (V Tech) It is very relevant and educators would see the significance and importance of his voice and would very likely admire him for his position and motivation to help others - like the award I just received. It was an application process, too. I wouldn't focus my entire essay on that, but I would most definitely mention it. Not only is it a noble cause, it will very likely distinguish him from the other applicants. What is he planning to major in, by the way? That might make a difference in the content of his application.