rollo
06-11-2007, 02:07 PM
I'm a 44 year old male marathon runner. In shape and thin with a very good diet. My readings have been running bout 140/80 for many years. Other tests show everthing else is normal with my health (kidney, liver, heart, etc.)
My Dr. doesn't believe in "white coat syndrome" and is recommending I start on medication which I have resisted. At home my readings have been slightly lower (135/75) with occaisional readings @ 120/70 and 145/80.
My Dr. doesn't believe in "white coat syndrome" and is recommending I start on medication which I have resisted. At home my readings have been slightly lower (135/75) with occaisional readings @ 120/70 and 145/80.
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Guy1_USA
06-11-2007, 03:44 PM
Gosh... I'm about your age and my Doctor and staff does believe in white coat syndrom. He's happy if my BP is 135 or low, and 80 or lower. Of course he would be happier if I was 120 / 75.
I've been reading on these boards all the BP meds around that seem to have serious side effects... and I haven't read much about people taking ACE inhibitors, like Fosinopril. I've been taking this med for 15 or 16 years without a single side effect. Ask your Doctor about taking the lowest dosage of fonoipril (I believe 10 mg). Try it for a month... and if you don't like it, just stop taking it. I always stop taking meds if I don't like the side effects. I just tell my Doctor I don't like it. He's just happy that I'm will to give new meds a go before saying no.
The beta blockers and calcium channel blocker meds seem to have a whole bunch of nasty side effects reported. I'd take a pass on those. I took the calcium channel blocker for 10 weeks recently and hated the side effects... water gain in legs and feet, weight gain, and always tired. All stuff that would work against a marathon runner. I'm only taking Fosinopril and HCTZ at the moment.
Try the lowest dose of finosipril and see how it goes.
Good luck.
I've been reading on these boards all the BP meds around that seem to have serious side effects... and I haven't read much about people taking ACE inhibitors, like Fosinopril. I've been taking this med for 15 or 16 years without a single side effect. Ask your Doctor about taking the lowest dosage of fonoipril (I believe 10 mg). Try it for a month... and if you don't like it, just stop taking it. I always stop taking meds if I don't like the side effects. I just tell my Doctor I don't like it. He's just happy that I'm will to give new meds a go before saying no.
The beta blockers and calcium channel blocker meds seem to have a whole bunch of nasty side effects reported. I'd take a pass on those. I took the calcium channel blocker for 10 weeks recently and hated the side effects... water gain in legs and feet, weight gain, and always tired. All stuff that would work against a marathon runner. I'm only taking Fosinopril and HCTZ at the moment.
Try the lowest dose of finosipril and see how it goes.
Good luck.
Lenin
06-11-2007, 06:23 PM
rollo,
I would not medicate numbers like that. ESPECIALLY not if you are a marathon runner.
When your doctor gives you his next bill why not tell him "You don't BELIEVE in doctor's bills." (You might also ask him what his best marathon time is. :D)
Your doctor is a fool and should be fired. White Coat hypertension is a reality whether or not some doctor "believes it" or not. Medicine is not a faith-based system.
In fact, white coat doesn't even enter into the equation if you get 140/80 in the office...even the newest tightest guidlines will call that "prehypertension" (give or take a point. :D)
If you can run/walk/crawl 26.2 miles at age 44, you have no reason to worry about the condition of your heart. You have just [assed the ULTIMATE stress test with flying colors.
(Any antihypertensive will also crucify your best times!)
I would not medicate numbers like that. ESPECIALLY not if you are a marathon runner.
When your doctor gives you his next bill why not tell him "You don't BELIEVE in doctor's bills." (You might also ask him what his best marathon time is. :D)
Your doctor is a fool and should be fired. White Coat hypertension is a reality whether or not some doctor "believes it" or not. Medicine is not a faith-based system.
In fact, white coat doesn't even enter into the equation if you get 140/80 in the office...even the newest tightest guidlines will call that "prehypertension" (give or take a point. :D)
If you can run/walk/crawl 26.2 miles at age 44, you have no reason to worry about the condition of your heart. You have just [assed the ULTIMATE stress test with flying colors.
(Any antihypertensive will also crucify your best times!)
rollo
06-11-2007, 07:52 PM
Lenin - Thx for your response. Youv'e made me feel a whole lot better. I'm against medications except when absolutely necessary.
dvdmon
06-19-2007, 10:23 AM
Rollo, I would get yourself a new doctor. I'm with you about medications. Only for accute problems. It's a much better idea to try to find the root of the problem if there is one and attack that. Obviously for you it's not a weight issue. Perhaps it is an imbalance of electrolytes? Do you get lots of sodium but very little potassium? Hydration is also important, but I assume you are getting that if you are a runner!
The other thing you might want to do is test yourself. Get an automated cuff (CVS has a good one that I've been using for a while and it's fairly inexpensive), and take your BP right after you wake up - even before you get out of bed if possible. This will give you a true RESTING BP. After taking your BP, if your doc is concerned that it is too high, what he should be doing is having you lie down for 10 or 15 minutes at least, then coming back and taking it again. BP is normally taken right after one walks into the doctor's office, and the nurse or whoever is taking it often is talking to you while they take it. Talking increases BP, as does any physical activity. What you really want to get is a resting BP reading.
I've had BP that was slightly elevated for as long as I can remember (at least 10 years). Initially that was 130/80, but more recently it had climbed a bit higher to 140/90 or so. I'm managing it wonderfully without drugs. I'm basically trying to stay hydrated (something that's always been a challenge for me), I'm not adding any sodium to the food I make (although I can't control this when I go out to eat), but rather am adding a salt substitute that includes potassium. Cinnamon has been shown to lower BP a little, and so I try to add this to my coffee (only decaf now!). There is also a study which showed that using a hand grip (you know, the one that you squeeze to strengthen your grip), also had the effect of lowering BP, so I've been doing that on and off. Possibly most significantly I've been using the Resperate biofeedback device a few times a week. This has an immediate effect on BP (I take it before and after), but I'm hoping it is also responsible for what I've seen as a more constant lowering affect. Basically for the last few months I've not seen a rating over 125/85 and often it is under 120/80. I think my lowest reading so far (after doing a session with it) is 108/68. Sure you have to spend 15 minutes a few times a week, but isn't that worth all the potential side effects with a medication?
The other thing you might want to do is test yourself. Get an automated cuff (CVS has a good one that I've been using for a while and it's fairly inexpensive), and take your BP right after you wake up - even before you get out of bed if possible. This will give you a true RESTING BP. After taking your BP, if your doc is concerned that it is too high, what he should be doing is having you lie down for 10 or 15 minutes at least, then coming back and taking it again. BP is normally taken right after one walks into the doctor's office, and the nurse or whoever is taking it often is talking to you while they take it. Talking increases BP, as does any physical activity. What you really want to get is a resting BP reading.
I've had BP that was slightly elevated for as long as I can remember (at least 10 years). Initially that was 130/80, but more recently it had climbed a bit higher to 140/90 or so. I'm managing it wonderfully without drugs. I'm basically trying to stay hydrated (something that's always been a challenge for me), I'm not adding any sodium to the food I make (although I can't control this when I go out to eat), but rather am adding a salt substitute that includes potassium. Cinnamon has been shown to lower BP a little, and so I try to add this to my coffee (only decaf now!). There is also a study which showed that using a hand grip (you know, the one that you squeeze to strengthen your grip), also had the effect of lowering BP, so I've been doing that on and off. Possibly most significantly I've been using the Resperate biofeedback device a few times a week. This has an immediate effect on BP (I take it before and after), but I'm hoping it is also responsible for what I've seen as a more constant lowering affect. Basically for the last few months I've not seen a rating over 125/85 and often it is under 120/80. I think my lowest reading so far (after doing a session with it) is 108/68. Sure you have to spend 15 minutes a few times a week, but isn't that worth all the potential side effects with a medication?
cartner
06-19-2007, 10:32 AM
Those are my readings while I'm on Med, I think that's fine and you don't need any Med.
Good luck,
Mick
Good luck,
Mick
rollo
06-19-2007, 12:12 PM
I'd be very interested if you could elaborate a bit more about the Resperate biofeedback device. How does it work? Is it expensive? etc.
thx
thx
dvdmon
06-19-2007, 01:56 PM
I'd be very interested if you could elaborate a bit more about the Resperate biofeedback device. How does it work? Is it expensive? etc.
thx
Rollo, I would post about it but am unsure whether that's allowed here, as I'm a new member and don't want to get banned as soon as I start posting! Can someone clarify what I can describe in relation to this admittedly commercial product?
Thanks.
thx
Rollo, I would post about it but am unsure whether that's allowed here, as I'm a new member and don't want to get banned as soon as I start posting! Can someone clarify what I can describe in relation to this admittedly commercial product?
Thanks.
bethsheba
06-19-2007, 04:49 PM
Given the side effects, the risks, the costs, and the alternative therapies, I would not recommend medication given your lifestyle or your numbers. That is not to say that there aren't things you can do to lower your pressures...continue aerobic activity, fine tune your eating (perhaps consult with a dietician), do some self checks to see if you're at risk for sleep apnea which can elevate pressures at night and during the daytime hours, drink alcohol moderately (if at all), and learn to breath correctly.
FYI, I experienced almost every side effect in the book on minimal doses of bp meds (I only took 1 med at a time), and gained 20+ pounds, elevated my cholesterol by 100+ points, and was miserable for 3 years (you might want to check out my thread of BP Side Effects)...when the 5th med started interfering with my sleep, I went off medication without medical supervision----not recommened and my sleep returned to normal within 48 hours. But the biggee is that my systolic and my diastolic pressure have both DROPPED more than 20 points since I've been off of medication! I am monitoring it daily as I am aware that the effects of the medication last for a period of time after disco'ing the med. But my pressures are the lowest they've been in three years!!!
Medication is absolutely necessary for some people, but if you have a choice, lifestyle changes are the way to go!
Bsheba
FYI, I experienced almost every side effect in the book on minimal doses of bp meds (I only took 1 med at a time), and gained 20+ pounds, elevated my cholesterol by 100+ points, and was miserable for 3 years (you might want to check out my thread of BP Side Effects)...when the 5th med started interfering with my sleep, I went off medication without medical supervision----not recommened and my sleep returned to normal within 48 hours. But the biggee is that my systolic and my diastolic pressure have both DROPPED more than 20 points since I've been off of medication! I am monitoring it daily as I am aware that the effects of the medication last for a period of time after disco'ing the med. But my pressures are the lowest they've been in three years!!!
Medication is absolutely necessary for some people, but if you have a choice, lifestyle changes are the way to go!
Bsheba
mod-anon
06-20-2007, 03:37 AM
Rollo, I would post about it but am unsure whether that's allowed here, as I'm a new member and don't want to get banned as soon as I start posting! Can someone clarify what I can describe in relation to this admittedly commercial product?
Thanks.
You may describe a product, discuss its pros and cons, discuss your experience with it. You may discuss information about the product in your own words. You may NOT quote from any other source. You may NOT discuss purchasing it from another website.
See the sticky at the top of this Board: "Copying and Pasting is not allowed".
http://www.healthboards.com/boards/faq.php?faq=faq_hb
"Posting any kind of information for any reason on how to find websites, products, services, businesses, commercial sites, message boards, or chats is cause to be banned."
mod-anon
Thanks.
You may describe a product, discuss its pros and cons, discuss your experience with it. You may discuss information about the product in your own words. You may NOT quote from any other source. You may NOT discuss purchasing it from another website.
See the sticky at the top of this Board: "Copying and Pasting is not allowed".
http://www.healthboards.com/boards/faq.php?faq=faq_hb
"Posting any kind of information for any reason on how to find websites, products, services, businesses, commercial sites, message boards, or chats is cause to be banned."
mod-anon
Lenin
06-20-2007, 09:45 AM
rollo,
RESPERATE DOES work by retraining our breathing practices.
But, in my estimation it is WAY overpriced and the same results can be gotten with some cheaper yoga breathing practice, or just practiced deep slow breathing.
But, like many methodologies, it is too easy to fall back into our sloppy ways all too soon. I know, I've been trying to breathe slowly and deeply for YEARS and YEARS, and the operative word is "trying." It works only when I THINK about it...I CANNOT seem to make it a habit.
RESPERATE DOES work by retraining our breathing practices.
But, in my estimation it is WAY overpriced and the same results can be gotten with some cheaper yoga breathing practice, or just practiced deep slow breathing.
But, like many methodologies, it is too easy to fall back into our sloppy ways all too soon. I know, I've been trying to breathe slowly and deeply for YEARS and YEARS, and the operative word is "trying." It works only when I THINK about it...I CANNOT seem to make it a habit.
dvdmon
06-20-2007, 11:27 AM
Thanks for the clarification mod-anon. Here's the message I had typed up waiting for this:
It is not cheap. It's around $300. Basically what you do is you put headphones on and listen to tones that initially you are instructed to breath in and out in accordance with. You put a sensor 'belt' around your waste so that the device can monitor how fast you are breathing and it gradually makes the tones slower so that, following the tones, your breathing slows. Once you get below 10 breaths/minute, you are said to be in the "therapeutic zone." Apparently the company has funded some studies that showed it decreased BP over an extended period. The way I've heard it described is kind of an automated way of doing meditation, although it doesn't instruct you about what to think, just how to breath. The one thing I thought it might do is to also slow your heart rate, but I don't experience that - at least not every time.
Lenin is right in that you can do the same thing on your own, the only question is "will you?" For me, the answer was almost assuredly not. My life is way too busy with a new job, a 21-month-old, and supporting my wife with her photography business. It's a wonder I even remember to breath at all! ;) Anyway, what resperate provides is a way for you to just sit down for 15 minutes and let it do all the thinking for you. In addition, it tracks your usage of it over time, and it has many options to play with, including voice, no voice, different kinds of tones, changing the amount of time per session, etc. I would definitely recommend it for those who a) have the money to spare, and b) are not self-disciplined enough or simply don't have the time to design a meditation program on their own...
It is not cheap. It's around $300. Basically what you do is you put headphones on and listen to tones that initially you are instructed to breath in and out in accordance with. You put a sensor 'belt' around your waste so that the device can monitor how fast you are breathing and it gradually makes the tones slower so that, following the tones, your breathing slows. Once you get below 10 breaths/minute, you are said to be in the "therapeutic zone." Apparently the company has funded some studies that showed it decreased BP over an extended period. The way I've heard it described is kind of an automated way of doing meditation, although it doesn't instruct you about what to think, just how to breath. The one thing I thought it might do is to also slow your heart rate, but I don't experience that - at least not every time.
Lenin is right in that you can do the same thing on your own, the only question is "will you?" For me, the answer was almost assuredly not. My life is way too busy with a new job, a 21-month-old, and supporting my wife with her photography business. It's a wonder I even remember to breath at all! ;) Anyway, what resperate provides is a way for you to just sit down for 15 minutes and let it do all the thinking for you. In addition, it tracks your usage of it over time, and it has many options to play with, including voice, no voice, different kinds of tones, changing the amount of time per session, etc. I would definitely recommend it for those who a) have the money to spare, and b) are not self-disciplined enough or simply don't have the time to design a meditation program on their own...
famnd
06-21-2007, 12:25 AM
Tried Resparate. All I got was palpitations & a higher b/p but I still think it has potential for others. I hated the music that came with it-depressing. My breathing got in sync right away & I was very motivated to stop taking meds & seeing DR's but it just did not work for me. My money was refunded except for postage. The rep for the company admitted that my experience does occur with certain patients. Fam
joe86
06-21-2007, 01:37 PM
I'm new here (see "New Joe on the block") and so I'm just jumping in the middle of this. But I'm interested in the comments on the Resperate machine.
(Moderator: I'm also a bit worried about what I can say here about products but I've read the explanation and I hope I'm well within bounds.)
I also tried the machine and I just couldn't tolerate it. It's way overpriced and it gets irritating real fast, for me anyway.
But I do believe in breathing to lower blood pressure and it's my most important defense against hypertension. You don't need a machine to learn it but I agree with those of you who ask "will you do it on your own?" The answer is usually NO! I found a great alternative to Resperate called Breatheasy. I like it a lot better because it uses real music, it's easy to use and it's cheap. I've done the breathing so long now I can do it on my own any time but it's still a lot easier to put on a CD and get a little "help".
I also use take all the usual lifestly and diet advice but I don't waste any money on expensive formulas or "miracle cures". I never found any that were worth a damn.
(Moderator: I'm also a bit worried about what I can say here about products but I've read the explanation and I hope I'm well within bounds.)
I also tried the machine and I just couldn't tolerate it. It's way overpriced and it gets irritating real fast, for me anyway.
But I do believe in breathing to lower blood pressure and it's my most important defense against hypertension. You don't need a machine to learn it but I agree with those of you who ask "will you do it on your own?" The answer is usually NO! I found a great alternative to Resperate called Breatheasy. I like it a lot better because it uses real music, it's easy to use and it's cheap. I've done the breathing so long now I can do it on my own any time but it's still a lot easier to put on a CD and get a little "help".
I also use take all the usual lifestly and diet advice but I don't waste any money on expensive formulas or "miracle cures". I never found any that were worth a damn.
linda714
07-05-2007, 08:30 PM
I'm so glad that someone in this thread mentioned Breatheasy. My blood pressure for the past 3 years that I know of has been high but I didn't want to go on medication. Lately it has been around 155 over 85 but it still has been as high as 190 over 90 so I decided that I needed to do something about it. I had ordered some natural meds but I haven't started taking them yet. I have tried the Breatheasy for the past 4 days and I can't believe the change. Now I am seeing my pressure down to 125 over 75 quite a bit of the time. Sometimes lower. Right now it is 131/81 but that's sure not bad. I am very surprised that it has worked so well for me this quickly. I don't think that is always the case.
lmejianyc
07-06-2007, 12:26 AM
Breatheasy I found the tracks are fast I bought it Track 1 was to fast got very light headed I had to go to track 4 or 5 to fell ok...