Hello, I haven't posted in a while but I am 50yrs young female with high cholesterol and high blood pressure. Oh yea, and I've just completed surgery and chemotherapy for breast cancer. Although I'm sick and tired of doctors, I had to go see my primary for a routine check and he found my (sorry I don't have all the numbers) cholesterol was 250, down from 271 six months ago.

I've been on lipitor 20mg daily but today he increased the dose to 80mg and I'm wondering is that "ok"? The doctor said "we have to get that number down" and that's the best way. I told him I've been really changing my diet by eating alot of fresh fruits and veggies, little red meat, no sodas or sweets. Also, as soon as this fatigue goes away from the chemo, I have a treadmill waiting on me.

This cancer scare was a big one---life changing--and I am determined to take care of myself from now on. I am about 50 pounds overweight and I'm hoping with these changes I can get rid of the BP med (benicar that works great) as well as the lipitor...is that a reasonable goal?

I'm really concerned about going from 20 to 80mg all at once. He wants to see me again in 1 month.
Thanks, Pat

I wouldn't do it... it's bad enough you are taking 20. While 250 isn't good... it doesn't warrent a dramtic increase in Meds.

Lenin takes Lipitor and niacin... and seems to be good with that. I reduced my total cholesterol over the last year from 328 to 195 with Niaspan... something even the statins couldn't do for me.

If you take statins, keep as low a dose as you can stand. Try Lenin's cocktail... seems to work for him... or try Niaspan (just niacin... which is Vitamin B-3).

Good luck.

PS... don't jump to 80... that's crazy talk.

Hi,

Venture man is right. You should be given a chance to lose weight, make adjustments to your diet, get plenty of exercise (if you are feeling up to it now.) Your body has been through a LOT of assaults already. Unless you are at an immediate and very high risk of a cardiovascular event, I don't see what your doctor's reasoning is. You need a break from the drugs, your system needs to be purged of them. You can get your cholesterol reduced on your existing dose of Lipitor, exercise, plus lifestyle changes.

Good luck! :)
Flowergirl

..... I've just completed surgery and chemotherapy for breast cancer. .....
The other thing to consider is that both cholesterol and ubiquinone are powerful antioxidants. Amongst other things, they enable your body to fight against cancer. So,bearing in mind your medical history, do you really want to use Lipitor to inhibit you liver's production of these substances? Total cholesterol of 250 really isn't that high. And, according to the nursing study, the use of statins by women provides no overall mortality benefit anyway.

Mark

High cholesterol in older young women, and for that matter men, has shown little or no correlation to cardiac events or increased life span based on the Framingham study. Your doctor needs to do some reading. Taking statins after recent cancer treatment and chemo is assinine and your doctor borders on criminal. Get another doctor and opinion.

High cholesterol in older young women, and for that matter men, has shown little or no correlation to cardiac events or increased life span based on the Framingham study. Your doctor needs to do some reading. Taking statins after recent cancer treatment and chemo is assinine and your doctor borders on criminal. Get another doctor and opinion.

do you have anything to back this up? my dad is on chemo and his doc said to keep taking lipitor, and we questioned it, but don't have any proof that it's a bad idea, just gut feelings... thanks!

over20,

I wouldn't do it either...if you DO develop serious side effects and then CANNOT take a statin where will that leave you?
Go to 40 mg. (but continue to BUY the 80's and split them...it's cheapest that way.;) )

I'm surprised you got such a small response with 20 mg. Lipitor...most people cut their cholesterol in half.:confused: Perhaps the chemotherapy is interfering with the Lipitor...not unlikely!

I think the only persons who should try 80 mg. Lipitor are those with considerable plaque deposits and heart disease who want to get their LDL's below 70 in order to reduce the plaques.

I think the 50 pound weight loss is likely to let you flush away the Benicar...good luck.

Can you break down your cholesterol numbers further: HDL, LDL, triglycerides?

Is it possible that BOTH the numbers you reported were while taking 20 mg. Lipitor?

Yes Lenin, both number were while on the 20mg.

Last night I just did not want to take the 80mg so I took 40 and today I'm calling my dr. to tell him. I'm glad you suggested 40mg as well. I have had (knock on wood) no cardiac events, only my grandmother had cardiomegaly and then later a massive heart attack that killed her. Neither of my parents, siblings, aunts or uncles on either side have any heart problems.

So I have to go with my gut on this. I should have spoken up yesterday when he told me to go to 80. I'm going to see if they'll fax me the lipid panel from last time. Let you all know.

I'm just echoing Lenin's advice to go with 40 for awhile and see what happens...it makes no sense to me that the doc would make such a precipitous increase without trying 40 for at least 3 months first.

I've had excellent control with 40 mg. Lipitor (and Niaspan to increase my HDL). But I have heart disease (diagnosed shortly after my 54th birthday) so I am comfortable with a higher dose. It also matters what your other readings are, e.g. LDL, HDL, triglycerides: if your HDL is high, that is good as it is protective, but it can also increase your total.

I just got off the phone with drs. office. Of course I couldn't talk with him but I asked the nurse to fax me any lipid panels they have in my record AND I told her to tell the dr. I will not be taking the 80mg as he advised. I am taking instead 40mg.

Ok, here are the numbers and they are dated 4/11/07 which is during the time I was undergoing chemo:
Cholesterol: 251
Triglyceri : 294
HDL : 41
"calculated" LDL chol: 151
Risk ratio LDL/HDL : 3.69

What I find odd is that the dr. never called me to discuss these results back in April so I thought they were ok. Not until yesterday's visit and me ASKING how they came out did he then say I had to go up to 80 on the lipitor. They drew more labs yesterday with another lipid panel so we'll see how that comes out.

....and I was on 20 of lipitor already.

Just a little about me: I don't smoke, drink maybe one beer every 6 months, I don't care for sweets at all. My downfall is colas, rice, potatoes, chips and salty stuff. I prefer chicken over beef and love seafood although I don't cook it myself. We use margarine thinking it's "better" than butter and I like 2% milk and drink water like crazy especially in the summer.

In the past week I have stopped adding salt to my food, stopped all colas but find the hardest to give up or avoid is the rice and potatoes...but I'm going to do it.

by the way, is butter better??

mcr285, [removed] Chemo and statins are both clearanced by your liver. The chemo is typically very toxic so you don't want to overload your system. Additionally both drugs can produce nueropathy. Check with your oncologist, NOT your primary physician (pill pusher) about this.

As to the lack of correlation between cholesterol, heart disease and mortality after about ~ 50 and especially for women [removed]

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wayover,

Firstly, I wouldn't fully trust any blood lipiud readings while on hcemotherapy...after all, these drugs are made to kill body cells and god knows what THAT causes to be dumped into the bloodstream.

You problem seems to be Metabolic Syndrome, high triglycerides low HDL. Remember, a calculated LDL adds a factor of 1/5 of triglycerides...so 50 of your 150 LDL is caused by tryglycerides. There are drugs that specifically target tri's.

My downfall is colas, rice, potatoes, chips
I recommend you keep the rice and potatoes but replace the colas with DIET colas (sugar is a sure way to raise triglycerides.)
and potato chips are just salt and grease...plain old BAD food.
Are you overweight, if so, trim down.

I agree, call your oncologist and ask him if the chemo drugs are skewing/screwing :D your lipid profile. I would be very much surprised if they are not. Also remember to tell your oncologist BEFORE anymore chemo treatments that you are on 40 mg. Lipitor...it might influence the dose of the chemo agent.

We use margarine thinking it's "better" than butter and I like 2% milk and drink water like crazy especially in the summer.
...by the way, is butter better??

Butter MAY be better than margarine depending upon how much you use. Margarine is a killer, especially if it is the typical filled with hydrogenated or partially hydrogenated fats. There are some on the market now that purport to lower cholesterol that do not contain hydrogenated fats (or that do contain small amounts of hydrogenated fats but have added plant sterols). I'm personally not convinced they are healthy, so I try to use very tiny amounts only occasionally. Actually, I'm trying to eliminate them completely from my diet, and go with only olive oil, canola oil, etc.

As for 2% milk, I think the milk producers have managed to pull one over on the American public with that one. Regular, whole milk is slightly over 3% butter fat, so you aren't getting much of a calorie or fat reduction. Try to gradually transition to 1% and ultimately nonfat milk, or try one of the soy milks.

My advice is strictly from a heart disease/cholesterol/normal healthy diet perspective. I don't know what effect cancer and chemo might have on nutrition, so it is possible you would need a higher fat content diet at this point, although I suspect monosaturated rather than saturated fats is still the way to go.

Thank you all for your input! I am only taking the 40mg and first thing Monday I'm going to get with my oncologist about this as now I have lost pretty much all faith in my primary doctor. 20 to 80 in one fell swoop.....NO WAY!

mcr285, [removed] Chemo and statins are both clearanced by your liver. The chemo is typically very toxic so you don't want to overload your system. Additionally both drugs can produce nueropathy. Check with your oncologist, NOT your primary physician (pill pusher) about this.

As to the lack of correlation between cholesterol, heart disease and mortality after about ~ 50 and especially for women [removed]

thanks - that makes sense. i'm so brainfried right now with all the research i'm doing for my dad, it's hard sometimes to keep it all straight! reading your response i was kind of like "duh!" i should have known that! so anyway, thanks, now i know more what to look for in my research and what to tell the doctors.

Now here are the results from 7/12/07:
Choles: 250
Trig : 280
HDL : 35
LDL : 159
Risk ratio: 4.54

(Previous #'s from 4/11/07):
Cholesterol: 251
Triglyceri : 294
HDL : 41
LDL chol: 151
Risk ratio LDL/HDL : 3.69

Drs. nurse called me this morning to say dr. wants me to come in next week to "discuss results" even though I'm now taking 40 of lipitor. She said these results were high for someone already taking lipitor even at 20mg and maybe it "wasn't working at all".
I'm somewhere between concerned and annoyed and need clarity please. Are these results THAT different that we can't just wait and see if the now 40mg lipitor is going to be effective before we panic? I am really aware of what I'm eating now and have had nothing fried, no sodas at all, much smaller portions, if any, of starches. Also after being off work for past 6 months for chemo, I'm back full force and on my feet 8 hours a day (I'm a nurse in a busy surgery unit).

wayover,

Firstly, I wouldn't fully trust any blood lipiud readings while on hcemotherapy...after all, these drugs are made to kill body cells and god knows what THAT causes to be dumped into the bloodstream.

You problem seems to be Metabolic Syndrome, high triglycerides low HDL. Remember, a calculated LDL adds a factor of 1/5 of triglycerides...so 50 of your 150 LDL is caused by tryglycerides. There are drugs that specifically target tri's.


I recommend you keep the rice and potatoes but replace the colas with DIET colas (sugar is a sure way to raise triglycerides.)
and potato chips are just salt and grease...plain old BAD food.
Are you overweight, if so, trim down.


Lenin, I also asked my oncologist if the chemo could skew choles. levels and she said Very unlikely. So I guess I can't blame it on that.
Any other sugggestions to lowering my trigs?? Also, I added 100mg/day of CO Q10 on my own, is that enough? I appreciate everyone's input as it is much more valued that what I get from my physician. Do you know he never even suggested any dietary changes, never even brought the subject up. UGH.

In addition, the results of the chemistry panel with SGOT and SGPT was all normal, even fasting glucose (which has always been normal).

You blame the tiredness on chemo... It is probably the Lipitor, it slowly steals your strength and energy until you are hardly able to do anything....

I can not believe that doctor upped you to 80mg for no more than your cholesterol was.. Thank God you didn't take it! It is not even suppose to be used in such high doses and I would be looking for me another doctor! He obviousley does not know what he is doing. I wouldn't even take 40mg... that is when I started having MAJOR problems and it started stealing my memory, drained my energy completely and about put me on disability.

Try natural methods, diet and lifestyle changes and get those chemicals out of your body before they do any more damage.

wayover,

Your cholesterol is high because your triglycerides are over the top. That high triglyceride low HDL combo is called Metabolic Syndrome.

If 20 mg. Lipitor AND 40 mg. Lipitor work poorly, I think the proper conclusion is that Lipitor is not going to work for you...thus 80 mg. is not wise.

I dispute the nurse's assertion that chemotherapy won't mangle your blood lipid numbers...do you know what agents they are using. Is there any chance you have some old numbers before they uncovered the cancer?

Lulu,
You blame the tiredness on chemo... It is probably the Lipitor

Have you ever known anyone undergoing chemotherapy for cancer? I think EXTREME fatigue is more the rule than the exception.

...
I dispute the nurse's assertion that chemotherapy won't mangle your blood lipid numbers...do you know what agents they are using. Is there any chance you have some old numbers before they uncovered the cancer?

Lulu,


Have you ever known anyone undergoing chemotherapy for cancer? I think EXTREME fatigue is more the rule than the exception.
Lenin...these are from 6/6/2006:
Chol: 272
Trig: 215
HDL: 42
LDL: 187
And from 12/18/06:
Chol: 277
Trig: 157
Hdl: 46
Ldl: 200

Breast Cancer was diagnosed on 12/29/06. I was on vytorin (diarrhea) until 12/18/06 changed to lipitor 20mg.

I finally got to see him today and told him I stopped all lipitor due to muscle aches. So now he wants me to try Crestor 10mg once a day.

Also, my last chemo dose was 7/19/07 and first regimen was Adriamycin and Cytoxan every 3 weeks for 4 doses then Taxol every week for 12 doses. And thanks for saying so.....chemo is TOXIC, causes extreme fatigue not to mention a host of other awful side effects.

So if I were to lose weight via low carb diet, would that give me decent trigs and Ldl numbers? Since 7/13/07 I have stopped eating all white stuff including bread and sweets (which was easy since I don't even buy them), rice and potatoes, and haven't had a soft drink in months. I don't do alcohol so no problem there.

wayover,
I am loathe to ever recommend a low carb diet becasue it ALWAYS means a hiigh fat diet. But there is nothing that will lower test triglycerides faster than a low carb diet...the effect can be STARTLING, I've seen the effect over and over again.

But remember, triglycerides are measured after an artificial fast. People eating fat-fat-fat all day have a neverendinding stream of triglycerides being pumped around...until they fast for a blood test. So how representative is the test...who knows? Perhaps measuring postrandial triglycerides would be of value...but the don't.

So I'm not sure what to say on the subject.

Alas, it looks like your cholesterol numbers were equally bad before the chemotherapy...so the chemo is off the hook.

Good luck in beating the BIG C and I hope you are near the end of the chemotherapy treatments.