IZZY'SMOM
01-22-2008, 12:26 AM
I think I tried to cover this in another thread about HIPPA ect, and really what I needed to ask is this...
My doc wrote for my b/t meds 10/325 norco 1 to 2, 2 to 3 times daily, which allows me the max of 6 per day, because its #60.
So it is a 10 day supply....
Ive had some trouble getting my patches refilled because of them not having enough sandoz, so Ive had to go over on my b/t meds.
I have had 1 reg script with 3 refills...the first 3 fills have been on time, and this last one I will need early. When i asked the pharm manager, he says the doc HAS to call to okay it...EVEN a day or 2 early. Ive had probs with him before, and I overheard another lady trying to get a pain med filled early the other day to go out of town, and the one pharmacists said..."*****, the manager is REALLY clamping down on ANY early refills....I cant do anything."
So my question again is..Why in the hell is this guy able to do this to everyone. Ive noticed since Ive been with them for agaes, he does it to everyone. Not just me. Even ONE day early, and I talked to him today, and he says the doc has to call. I dont give a rats *** about insurance, nor did the lady I heard talking...
Do the doctors tell the pharmacists to do this? I recall once that my doc said the pharmacist and docs all cover each other's asses. And I told him Ive never tried to fill early, but he says in this small town, they all do.
I only have one other pharmacy to go to, and the other one is just as bed...Ive heard them talk to other ppl too.
I can see a person who wants a script early for 100 tabs the second day, but WTF?????
Im sure my doc will override this jacka**, but what is their REAL boundry I want to know. Its a Kroger based firm. And the other is Walmart. Ive actually had better luck with the Walmart ppl.
P.S, Ive been with this doc for over 2 yrs, and I have NEVER been under contract...
xoxoxox,
IZZY'SMOM
My doc wrote for my b/t meds 10/325 norco 1 to 2, 2 to 3 times daily, which allows me the max of 6 per day, because its #60.
So it is a 10 day supply....
Ive had some trouble getting my patches refilled because of them not having enough sandoz, so Ive had to go over on my b/t meds.
I have had 1 reg script with 3 refills...the first 3 fills have been on time, and this last one I will need early. When i asked the pharm manager, he says the doc HAS to call to okay it...EVEN a day or 2 early. Ive had probs with him before, and I overheard another lady trying to get a pain med filled early the other day to go out of town, and the one pharmacists said..."*****, the manager is REALLY clamping down on ANY early refills....I cant do anything."
So my question again is..Why in the hell is this guy able to do this to everyone. Ive noticed since Ive been with them for agaes, he does it to everyone. Not just me. Even ONE day early, and I talked to him today, and he says the doc has to call. I dont give a rats *** about insurance, nor did the lady I heard talking...
Do the doctors tell the pharmacists to do this? I recall once that my doc said the pharmacist and docs all cover each other's asses. And I told him Ive never tried to fill early, but he says in this small town, they all do.
I only have one other pharmacy to go to, and the other one is just as bed...Ive heard them talk to other ppl too.
I can see a person who wants a script early for 100 tabs the second day, but WTF?????
Im sure my doc will override this jacka**, but what is their REAL boundry I want to know. Its a Kroger based firm. And the other is Walmart. Ive actually had better luck with the Walmart ppl.
P.S, Ive been with this doc for over 2 yrs, and I have NEVER been under contract...
xoxoxox,
IZZY'SMOM
Sponsor
Shoreline
01-22-2008, 02:34 AM
Hey Izzy, A doc can't over ride the pharmacist decision and make a pharanmmcist put his licence on the line for allowing early refills. If anything the pharmacist is in a position of reporting him for allowing early refills. The pharamcist is the last line in prevention of abuse and diversion. This guy either takes the responsabilty very seriously, is an opiate phobe or is on a power trip. He knows, Nobody can make him fill a script he isn't comfortable filling, especially if he has legitimate cause, Like it's early. He wasn't asking you to wait untill day 11 when you are out. He was telling you he would fill it on day 10 which really means you should have have some of day 10 left when your filling it unless doing it late at night.
Pharamcist do have the right to question or refuse any script and no doc wants to get into a peeing contest with a pharmacist. It's not the pharmacists fault you used extra BT meds. If you need more or an adjustment that should be resolved with your doc, not by a pharamacist allowing early fills even if it's OK with your doc and insurance. It's not their call once the script is in the pharamcists hands.
It's not that I agree, I just know the pharm biz from my wife being in it for 6 years. The pharamcist are the tail that wags the dog. Without the PIC "pharamcist in charge," licence on the wall, that pharamcy can't be open for biz, so in the pharamcy, he is GOD and only his decsion matters. Your doc could cancel the refill and call another script into a different pharamcy, but is it really worth involving your doc at that level when you could simply wait 24 hours and then explain you have had attitude from this guy several times and you are going to change pharmacies and work out the dosing problem with your doc. The pharamcist doesn't even have to give you your script back if he says he needs to talk to your doc first.
There are rules, certain people have power and it's just how it is. There are no laws to make a doc prescribe a drug he doesn't want to or laws to make a pharamcist fill a script he isn't comfortable with. It's up to a doc to prescribe and up to a pharamcist to fill it if they feel it's appropriate. Just like there are opiate phobe docs, there are opiate phobe pharamcists. In his mind, all he's asking you to do is fill the script on the day it's due. If he had no reason to prevent you from filling it, I would argue it and involve my doc, but honestly, he's right and doesn't have to fill it. If he starts making exeptions where do you draw the line, What if the next person wants it 3 days early and says their going on a trip or someone needs it a week early because their claim to be going to europe for a month. At least he's an equal opportunity jerk and applies the same rules to everyone as far as you know.
Just an example,there was a local doc in our area that was known as a soft touch after previous trouble with the DEA and the medical board. He was an ortho surgeon that had already been sanctioned, suspended and lost his hospital provlidges so he had no where to operate once he got his licence back. He could still practice medecine So he took on cash PM customers only and did nothing but sell drugs for the price of a jacked up office visit. He didn't take or file insurance, had no malpractice insurance and no privlidges, but had a valid licence to write scripts after he took the first slap on the wrist. Many pharamcist flat out refused to fill any of his scripts and that is their right and professional duty.
If the doc felt this behavior was uncalled for and the pharamcists were actually slandering his "good name" by treating all his scripts as inappropriate, the doc could have brought about a civil case. Hoewever, the doc was arrested again and is now serving time for his prescribing practices, so they were right to treat his scripts as bogus. If not for pharamcist like that, they too would be part of this docs scheme to flood the streets with narcotics as long as a patient had cash. The point is, Pharamcist do have the power to make you wait untill day 10. They are the last line in preventing diversion and prescription abuse. The only thing you can do is take your buisness elsewhere if you don't want to use this pharamcist any longer. Sure there are pharamicist that will make an exception, but he's obviously not one.
Good luck, Dave
Pharamcist do have the right to question or refuse any script and no doc wants to get into a peeing contest with a pharmacist. It's not the pharmacists fault you used extra BT meds. If you need more or an adjustment that should be resolved with your doc, not by a pharamacist allowing early fills even if it's OK with your doc and insurance. It's not their call once the script is in the pharamcists hands.
It's not that I agree, I just know the pharm biz from my wife being in it for 6 years. The pharamcist are the tail that wags the dog. Without the PIC "pharamcist in charge," licence on the wall, that pharamcy can't be open for biz, so in the pharamcy, he is GOD and only his decsion matters. Your doc could cancel the refill and call another script into a different pharamcy, but is it really worth involving your doc at that level when you could simply wait 24 hours and then explain you have had attitude from this guy several times and you are going to change pharmacies and work out the dosing problem with your doc. The pharamcist doesn't even have to give you your script back if he says he needs to talk to your doc first.
There are rules, certain people have power and it's just how it is. There are no laws to make a doc prescribe a drug he doesn't want to or laws to make a pharamcist fill a script he isn't comfortable with. It's up to a doc to prescribe and up to a pharamcist to fill it if they feel it's appropriate. Just like there are opiate phobe docs, there are opiate phobe pharamcists. In his mind, all he's asking you to do is fill the script on the day it's due. If he had no reason to prevent you from filling it, I would argue it and involve my doc, but honestly, he's right and doesn't have to fill it. If he starts making exeptions where do you draw the line, What if the next person wants it 3 days early and says their going on a trip or someone needs it a week early because their claim to be going to europe for a month. At least he's an equal opportunity jerk and applies the same rules to everyone as far as you know.
Just an example,there was a local doc in our area that was known as a soft touch after previous trouble with the DEA and the medical board. He was an ortho surgeon that had already been sanctioned, suspended and lost his hospital provlidges so he had no where to operate once he got his licence back. He could still practice medecine So he took on cash PM customers only and did nothing but sell drugs for the price of a jacked up office visit. He didn't take or file insurance, had no malpractice insurance and no privlidges, but had a valid licence to write scripts after he took the first slap on the wrist. Many pharamcist flat out refused to fill any of his scripts and that is their right and professional duty.
If the doc felt this behavior was uncalled for and the pharamcists were actually slandering his "good name" by treating all his scripts as inappropriate, the doc could have brought about a civil case. Hoewever, the doc was arrested again and is now serving time for his prescribing practices, so they were right to treat his scripts as bogus. If not for pharamcist like that, they too would be part of this docs scheme to flood the streets with narcotics as long as a patient had cash. The point is, Pharamcist do have the power to make you wait untill day 10. They are the last line in preventing diversion and prescription abuse. The only thing you can do is take your buisness elsewhere if you don't want to use this pharamcist any longer. Sure there are pharamicist that will make an exception, but he's obviously not one.
Good luck, Dave
HappyFlower
01-22-2008, 03:34 AM
Shore,
Very interesting.
I have a question....is day 10 counting the day you had the original Rx filled or do you start counting on the next day?
EX...If I take my paper Rx and have it filled on Jan 1, 2008...is the 10th day Jan 10 or Jan 11?? Also, can any pharmacist be the PIC or are the qualifications different?
Izzys,
I have a friend who has problems every month getting the Sandoz brand. She finally had the idea to call the pharmacy the week before her script is due and remind them (nicely) to check the stock. They are always very nice and She has not had a problem since then. Of course, she uses a Mom and Pop pharmacy-but maybe it would work at Kroger.
Very interesting.
I have a question....is day 10 counting the day you had the original Rx filled or do you start counting on the next day?
EX...If I take my paper Rx and have it filled on Jan 1, 2008...is the 10th day Jan 10 or Jan 11?? Also, can any pharmacist be the PIC or are the qualifications different?
Izzys,
I have a friend who has problems every month getting the Sandoz brand. She finally had the idea to call the pharmacy the week before her script is due and remind them (nicely) to check the stock. They are always very nice and She has not had a problem since then. Of course, she uses a Mom and Pop pharmacy-but maybe it would work at Kroger.
Luvmypugs
01-22-2008, 09:41 AM
Hello everyone, hope you all are doing okay today :).
Shoreline I'm sorry but I have to disagree with you on the early refills. We have several pharmacies in our small town but the biggest chain here is(Walgreens). I have had one or two prescriptions filled a day early before when I had knee surgery and when the Pharmacist said "no" he called the doctor and the doctor told him to do it and he did. So I don't believe the tail always wags the dog, sometimes I think the dog wins out ha ha :).
Now I know that this is not always the case and some pharmacists are just pure jerks (I encountered one before but Walgreens fired him realy quick :eek:). And just like doctors, pharmacists have to deal with druggies and I'm sure they can't tell the difference half the time either but if they call the doctor and the doctor says sure go ahead they have a legitimate reason, they should fill it.
Just my opinion, take care all :wave:!!!
Freezing in Tennessee
Shoreline I'm sorry but I have to disagree with you on the early refills. We have several pharmacies in our small town but the biggest chain here is(Walgreens). I have had one or two prescriptions filled a day early before when I had knee surgery and when the Pharmacist said "no" he called the doctor and the doctor told him to do it and he did. So I don't believe the tail always wags the dog, sometimes I think the dog wins out ha ha :).
Now I know that this is not always the case and some pharmacists are just pure jerks (I encountered one before but Walgreens fired him realy quick :eek:). And just like doctors, pharmacists have to deal with druggies and I'm sure they can't tell the difference half the time either but if they call the doctor and the doctor says sure go ahead they have a legitimate reason, they should fill it.
Just my opinion, take care all :wave:!!!
Freezing in Tennessee
Shoreline
01-22-2008, 10:32 AM
Hey pugs, It's not a matter of you being right or me being right, The call is up to the individual pharmacists, Some will make exceptions, some won't. If you have never had a problem with a pharmicist, you haven't been involved in pain management long. Eventually you will run into someone that says no to you and your doc and there is absolutely nothing you can do other than get a new script and go to a different pharamcist. However, if the pharmy is really a jerk, all he has to do is pick up the phone, call the medical board and your doc will spend the afternoon explaining why he doesn't demand compliance from his patients.
Even if the doc says OK fill it a day early, what if the pharamcist says no to the doc, You don't think there are pharmacists out there that aren't afraid to say no to a doc?
The question is, does the pharamcist have the right, and the answer is yes. Does it mean every pharamcist is going to be that strict, of course not. That's nice you have never been refused or had to wait until a due date, but more than likely the day will come and you will be on this forum asking can they do this.
Obviously they can because it just happened. Do you think they are going to fire their pharamacist when the pharm DM asks why he wouldn't fill a partuicluar script once he gets a complaint from a customer. The first thing out of the pharmies mouth will be that patient has a drug problem or tried to fill a class 11 or 111 early and his job is safe.
My wife worked with a Pharamcist that had killed a person on a missfill and recieved nothing more than a slap on the wrist which meant 3 months to work on his boat before having to go back to work. In my state an employer can't even ask a phramcist if he's ever been sanctioned. She's been in Pharmacies where the pharamcist was dragged out of the stoor by the police and been in stores where customers are dragged out. You see it all when your in the biz. Just because it's never happened to you, doesn't mean there aren't hundreds of similar posts on this forum where it happened to others.
Use the search feature and type in, Pharamcist refused to fill my script. See how many other people have been through the exact same thing. Are they all lying? Is Izzy lying about her experience? I don't think your lying, you just haven;'t been involved in PM long enough or ran into the wrong pharamcists yet. Most people stick with a good pharamcist once they find one, but even your favorite guy has limits as far as how early he's going to let a script go through. You really don't want to test those limits because every script after that will be scrutinized once your flagged in their system which carries to every store in the chain.
Exactly how do you think you can make a pharmcist fill a script they don't want to. It happens every day all across the country, to legit patients and patients abusing the system and there isn't a thing you can do other than change pharamcies or be complaint and never ask for an execption to be made.
Congrats on your luck with pharmies, but luck doesn't mean you have recourse once a pharmcist says no. You can complain, but if the pharamist is right, do you really think someone will loose their job for refusing to fill a script early.
To Happy, Day one is the day you fill the script.
Good luck, Dave
Even if the doc says OK fill it a day early, what if the pharamcist says no to the doc, You don't think there are pharmacists out there that aren't afraid to say no to a doc?
The question is, does the pharamcist have the right, and the answer is yes. Does it mean every pharamcist is going to be that strict, of course not. That's nice you have never been refused or had to wait until a due date, but more than likely the day will come and you will be on this forum asking can they do this.
Obviously they can because it just happened. Do you think they are going to fire their pharamacist when the pharm DM asks why he wouldn't fill a partuicluar script once he gets a complaint from a customer. The first thing out of the pharmies mouth will be that patient has a drug problem or tried to fill a class 11 or 111 early and his job is safe.
My wife worked with a Pharamcist that had killed a person on a missfill and recieved nothing more than a slap on the wrist which meant 3 months to work on his boat before having to go back to work. In my state an employer can't even ask a phramcist if he's ever been sanctioned. She's been in Pharmacies where the pharamcist was dragged out of the stoor by the police and been in stores where customers are dragged out. You see it all when your in the biz. Just because it's never happened to you, doesn't mean there aren't hundreds of similar posts on this forum where it happened to others.
Use the search feature and type in, Pharamcist refused to fill my script. See how many other people have been through the exact same thing. Are they all lying? Is Izzy lying about her experience? I don't think your lying, you just haven;'t been involved in PM long enough or ran into the wrong pharamcists yet. Most people stick with a good pharamcist once they find one, but even your favorite guy has limits as far as how early he's going to let a script go through. You really don't want to test those limits because every script after that will be scrutinized once your flagged in their system which carries to every store in the chain.
Exactly how do you think you can make a pharmcist fill a script they don't want to. It happens every day all across the country, to legit patients and patients abusing the system and there isn't a thing you can do other than change pharamcies or be complaint and never ask for an execption to be made.
Congrats on your luck with pharmies, but luck doesn't mean you have recourse once a pharmcist says no. You can complain, but if the pharamist is right, do you really think someone will loose their job for refusing to fill a script early.
To Happy, Day one is the day you fill the script.
Good luck, Dave
HappyFlower
01-22-2008, 10:49 AM
Thanks...I thought that is how it was, but not sure.
Pugs, I, like you are lucky enough to have a great pharmacist. However, Dave is right...a pharmacist can refuse to fill any script for any reason. Do you remember a few years ago when all the hype over the birth control pill went on? I don't remember the name of the drug, but many pharmacists flat out refused to fill any script for that medication. They felt it violated their morals....that it was murder. I guess I remember it becasue I live in the middle of the bible belt, so it was a HUGE deal here. There is no authority that can make an individual pharmacist fill a prescription which they feel is wrong.
I am not sure if there are limits, such as they MUST fill heart meds, etc, but I do know for sure if they don't want to fill my Lortab a day early or at all they don't have to-and there is nothing I can do. The doc can always call them and say he/she approves the refill, but if the pharmacist doesn't want to, that's the end of it.
Pugs, I, like you are lucky enough to have a great pharmacist. However, Dave is right...a pharmacist can refuse to fill any script for any reason. Do you remember a few years ago when all the hype over the birth control pill went on? I don't remember the name of the drug, but many pharmacists flat out refused to fill any script for that medication. They felt it violated their morals....that it was murder. I guess I remember it becasue I live in the middle of the bible belt, so it was a HUGE deal here. There is no authority that can make an individual pharmacist fill a prescription which they feel is wrong.
I am not sure if there are limits, such as they MUST fill heart meds, etc, but I do know for sure if they don't want to fill my Lortab a day early or at all they don't have to-and there is nothing I can do. The doc can always call them and say he/she approves the refill, but if the pharmacist doesn't want to, that's the end of it.
Luvmypugs
01-22-2008, 12:37 PM
Okay DAVE, I did not say you were wrong or I was right. I said I would have to disagree with you...opinion only. NO, I am not in Pain Management and thank goodness I don't have to deal with all you all do, bless your hearts :angel:. But, I didn't need a lecture on "being wrong".
I know you are a valued person on this board for your knowledge. I was just giving my experience as everyone does and my opinion which everyone does.
Gosh maybe from now on I'll just read and not respond, I don't need the headache :(!!!
I know you are a valued person on this board for your knowledge. I was just giving my experience as everyone does and my opinion which everyone does.
Gosh maybe from now on I'll just read and not respond, I don't need the headache :(!!!
slipperyslope
01-22-2008, 01:46 PM
oh vey!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I have never had a pharmacist refuse my scrips even 1-3 days early and I have been in PM for 6 plus years but I don't do this often and I don't make a habbit of it, I only refill a few days early just so I have it. it all depends on the pharmacist I suppose. You shoudn't be running out if your Dr is giving you enough B/T meds, maybe you need an increase Izzy? i have no other comments for you other than your pharmacist is just not going to fill your scrips even 1 day early so you need to just save a few pills or deal with it. and you don't want to cause a scene as he could than call your Dr and say he feels you are a drug seeker and than you could loose your Dr that you have had for 2 years with never an issue or a PM contract. Also you don't want a red flag next to your name at the pharmacy as being pushy or getting angry. the deal is you get a RX every 10 days and it can't and won't be filled early. this is how your pharmiacist operates and I don't think there is a thing you can do about it unelss you get an increase on your meds or take a new RX to another pharmacy. I understand how angry you are over this as your post has some agressive language in it, I didn't know that was permitted here. Izzys mom Its not healthy to get this angry over your RX not being filled 1 day early, its bad for your pain and your health in general and will only aggrivate things for your neck condition, I hope you are able to get this worked out before some heads fly.... I think some relaxation techniques may be in order today, If you that desperate for your RX to be filled today, than I would call your Dr and see if he has any samples to tie you over or ask him for a new RX and drive to another town or state if you must get them today......good luck
HappyFlower
01-22-2008, 04:28 PM
Geez....everyone is a bit grumpy this Tuesday!! Let's all huddle by the campfire and sing Kum Ba Ya....or however you spell it!!
Pugs...don't do that!! There are times when a person comes across as harsh and maybe doesn't mean to...and even if the post was meant harshly.....don't let it get to you!! Life is too short to worry about what somebody says. You are more than entitled to your opinion...and don't be afraid to put it out there. We all aren't always going to agree...which is good because then we all learn how to better manage our pain issues. So, pet the puppies for me and keep on posting!! :)
Izzys....hope things work out. Sorry the pharmacist is being such a snot.
Pugs...don't do that!! There are times when a person comes across as harsh and maybe doesn't mean to...and even if the post was meant harshly.....don't let it get to you!! Life is too short to worry about what somebody says. You are more than entitled to your opinion...and don't be afraid to put it out there. We all aren't always going to agree...which is good because then we all learn how to better manage our pain issues. So, pet the puppies for me and keep on posting!! :)
Izzys....hope things work out. Sorry the pharmacist is being such a snot.
Luvmypugs
01-22-2008, 04:54 PM
Thanks Happy Flower. I understand your point, thanks :).
What's the saying, Opinions are like ***holes, everyone has one ;) ha ha.
Take care all!!
What's the saying, Opinions are like ***holes, everyone has one ;) ha ha.
Take care all!!
HappyFlower
01-22-2008, 05:27 PM
lol....yes....and some are real stinkers.
SpinalMalady
01-23-2008, 09:13 AM
Izzy:
Now that the Watson brand is out for the patches have you tried them?? I'm going to ask about trying them or at least seeing if my pharmacy is willing to order them for the next month. My PM started me back on 12.5mcg over the holidays due to increased pain along with a NEW TENS unit! YAY. The TENS unit seems to be helping, and how I know that is that I've been waiting for the company to ship my new electrode pads for over a week, and my pain has gone back up, up, up!! So I can't wait for them to arrive.
My pharmacy originally told me they were "losing" too much money on the Sandoz generic brand between what "they" have to "pay" and what folks insurance are willing to "pay". :confused:
My other question, more of a curiousity I guess is why a 10 day script. Why would the doc not Rx a 30 day script...even if he "allows" for the prescibing up to 6 per day.... don't you only see him once a month...?? What happens when/if the refills are gone?? what do you do then?? Seems to me that he would Rx #180, and I'm just curious if his prescribing practice perhaps has the pharmacy on guard, not anything perhaps you have done...just wondering.
Are you still using the compounding pharm?? Is it possible if not to go back to them?? If I remember right, I think you had to drive to get there, and now that winter is in full force in Colo. it might not be realistic!
Either way, I wish you much luck. I hate to hear of anyone suffering. I woke up today hurting like heck. Stupid cold blast down here in the deep south! GRRRR!!! :mad: My rods just aren't used to it! :(
Now that the Watson brand is out for the patches have you tried them?? I'm going to ask about trying them or at least seeing if my pharmacy is willing to order them for the next month. My PM started me back on 12.5mcg over the holidays due to increased pain along with a NEW TENS unit! YAY. The TENS unit seems to be helping, and how I know that is that I've been waiting for the company to ship my new electrode pads for over a week, and my pain has gone back up, up, up!! So I can't wait for them to arrive.
My pharmacy originally told me they were "losing" too much money on the Sandoz generic brand between what "they" have to "pay" and what folks insurance are willing to "pay". :confused:
My other question, more of a curiousity I guess is why a 10 day script. Why would the doc not Rx a 30 day script...even if he "allows" for the prescibing up to 6 per day.... don't you only see him once a month...?? What happens when/if the refills are gone?? what do you do then?? Seems to me that he would Rx #180, and I'm just curious if his prescribing practice perhaps has the pharmacy on guard, not anything perhaps you have done...just wondering.
Are you still using the compounding pharm?? Is it possible if not to go back to them?? If I remember right, I think you had to drive to get there, and now that winter is in full force in Colo. it might not be realistic!
Either way, I wish you much luck. I hate to hear of anyone suffering. I woke up today hurting like heck. Stupid cold blast down here in the deep south! GRRRR!!! :mad: My rods just aren't used to it! :(