After watching the 20/20 special, I became concerned.

I take aleve everyday for fibromyalgia pain. Some days I only take one or two, but on bad days, I take up to four. My doctors know about this and approve. They've each said that aleve is effective as a pain reliever for me and that it has fewer side effects than prescription pain relievers, which I have taken before. The problem with this is that I often have headaches as well, almost every day.

My question is whether the aleve that I'm taking for fibromyalgia pain could be turning off my brain's headache pain receptors. In other words, can rebound headaches occur when pain relievers are taken for for conditions other than headaches (while headaches are also present)? How do the pain receptors in my brain know that the Aleve is for the fibromyalgia pain and not for the headaches? Could the daily Aleve be causing my daily headaches?

Also, I have a number of doctors, as someone with a medical condition often does. Who should I ask these questions of? Should I ask my family doctor, my rheumatologist, my physiatrist, my psychiatrist, my allergist... Which would be most knowledgable? I must admit that I am very, very worried. Thank you all in advance.

[This message has been edited by Anonymity (edited 01-14-2003).]

Hi Anon,

First off I would stop worrying. If, and it is a big if, you are getting rebound headaches, I would think that would be a GOOD thing. You will have diagnosed your headaches and found an answer to a condition that haunts many people for decades!!

The 20/20 special, as most news programs are apt to do, took the rebound issue to an extreme. It is just NOT TRUE that over 90% of people who suffer from chronic headaches are getting rebound headaches. Some Dr.'s use the 'rebound headache' diagnosis because it's the easiest thing for them to say. Some, because they don't want to prescribe pain killing meds. to patients, and most, because they don't have the answer as to why people have these awful headaches.

A very respected headache specialist - Dr. Robbins pegs the figure at 10-20% of CDH patients. If you talk to a group of people suffering from CDH and a group of headache specialists, the vast majority will say that the 90% figure is bunk!

It is very simple to check for yourself, you just have to stop taking all analgesic medications for a period of 10-12 weeks. If your headaches get worse for a couple of weeks and then start to get better, chances are you are/were getting rebound headaches. If you are in the same or more pain at the end, you are not suffering from rebound headaches.

From what I've read from people that actually DO get rebound headaches, YES, you can get them if you are taking a medication for something else and are sus. to headaches. If you are not a headache person then you most likely won't develop rebound headaches if you are taking a medication for a bad back.

I've read some that say a rebound h/a is just like a regular migraine, but I've read from more people that say a rebound h/a is more like an 'all-over' the head headache.

Good luck!!//Woody

[This message has been edited by moderator2 (edited 01-21-2003).]

I would seek a Neurologist. I see a Neurologist myself for daily dull headaches and migraines.

Hi,

I have a question about this. I am 23 and suffer from TMJD and are have chronic pain 24/7. I have daily headaches (that are like migranes and tenion HA's ) that are so bad I just want to die! pain beind my eyes, jaw pain, etc. I dont have health insurance so I cant see a doctor to help me with my pain yet! I spent my saving money on trying to find out what was causing my headaches to begin with.

I have been taking so many OTC drugs forever I should be dead! I never watched this 20/20 but wish I did! I probably have been doing this for over a year or two. I think I have been taking close to 15-25 or more Advil, Tylenol, anything I could get my hands on for a longtime! I came across rebound headaches and was wondering if I could be making my HA's worse. My pain has been so bad, and it has taken me so long to relieze what I have been doing to myself. How does someone go about something like this? Can you be addicted to OTC med's?

Any input would be appreciated http://www.healthboards.com/ubb/smile.gif

Thanks,

Starr

[This message has been edited by thisstarr (edited 01-19-2003).]

Unfortunately, you can get addicted to most meds if you take them for long enough.

Starr- I'm 22, and I also have TMJD, chronic pain, and headaches along with fibromyalgia and some other conditions. I'm just as confused as you are, but I'd say that you're probably taking way too many pills. Even if they aren't causing rebound headaches, they are probably causing trouble for your stomach, liver, and kidneys. You need to tell your family doctor, etc. how much you're honestly taking. I think they will be concerned. Don't be scared, though; just realize that it's time to do something about this problem. I think you already realize that from the tone of your post. Besides, even if you're not addicted, and you're not having rebound headaches, and your liver is fine, you still shouldn't have so much pain that you need that many pills. Good luck, and let us all know how you decide to proceed! http://www.healthboards.com/ubb/smile.gif

P.S. You asked whether a person can be addicted to OTC medicines. I was totally addicted to OTC nasal sprays and drops. You know, the kind you're only supposed to use twice a day for less than four days when you have a horrible cold with nasal congestion? I got to where I felt like I couldn't breathe without them, and they started causing more nasal congestion. They're labeled with rebound warnings, but I ignored them. I'm finally off of them, but I was definitely addicted. I just thought I'd share an example of an OTC addiction.

[This message has been edited by Anonymity (edited 01-21-2003).]

Starr:

As you can tell from my other post, this did happen to me. I would just cut down, slowly. I went to a headache clinic and they took me off ALL AT ONCE and this did NOT make me feel better. For many, I guess it does after the awful withdrawal, anyway. I'd just eliminate a few at a time and try to eliminate them, while at the same time, ask your doctor for PREVENTATIVE or abortive meds. For example, I take Tenormin, a beta blocker, that is originally for heart problems, but works very well for my migraine prevention. I also take Depakote and it's been GREAT at eliminating TONS of my migraines. Tension ones are the hardest for me to get rid of!!!

Anyway, in my humble opinion, and long experience, recommend tapering off the OTC meds, while looking for preventative daily meds which are prescription.

Hi,
Thanks for you post http://www.healthboards.com/ubb/smile.gif

Anonymity: Thanks so much for your response and shareing your story.
I dont have a doctor I see at all, I was just going to doctor to doctor to fine out my problem with tmj. I do need GP I can see whenever. I dont have any health insurance at the moment but I am hoping I can get it soon. I started to cut down and count and I am paying for it big time! It seems my headaches and the pain is 10x worse. I hope I didnt mess up my stomach, I do get stomach pain all the time, and get nasusa often but I thought it was all part of tmj. I once had a doctor tell me he thought I had fibromyalgia, I think I do I suffer with these pain attacks often that shoot down my back and into my hips and all the way down my legs, doctors have told me it is muscle pain but I dont think it is, it is way to painful to the point I cant walk.
Thanks..

AMOSQUITO: It must of been hard for you,glad you made it though. I didnt relieze how addicting OTC med's really are. Did you have bad withdrawels? I started to reduce how many pills I have been taking and I feel so much worse! Thanks so much for answering me

Take care,
Starr

How you all have good days ahead http://www.healthboards.com/ubb/smile.gif


[This message has been edited by thisstarr (edited 01-22-2003).]

I'm guessing that it's going to be worse before it gets better. That said, I'm so proud of you!! You are so strong to try this! Just go very slowly, and don't hurry yourself. Think of how long it took you to get to this point and this number of pills, and how long you've been taking the pills, even in small doses. It's probably been quite some time, so there's no reason to expect yourself to quit overnight or to taper off within a week. Take as much time as you need. If you can only elimate one pill and then have to wait two weeks before you elimate another, that is still a victory! You might check out the addiction and recovery board on this site. I'm not suggesting that your addiction is necessarily similar to anyone else's; I'm only suggesting that persons on that board may have some general tapering tips that would apply to people taking all kinds of medicines, etc. Good luck, and let us know how you do!

Take Care! http://www.healthboards.com/ubb/dance.gif

P.S. Even without insurance, there may be some sort of clinic or prompt care place that could treat you inexpensively if you run into any problems that you need help with. You might try calling around now, so that you'll have that information if you should need it. I doubt you will, but it might make you feel more secure if you know of a place you can go if you need help.

Hi,
Thank you so much for being supportive I appreciate it alot, It is nice to have some support! A few people I know doesnt think it is a big deal because it is not a "real" drug I am stuck on. Most people think OTC med's are safe, but they are in the dark as I was. It seems like people think OTC cant be addicting, I didnt know tell you told me! I am still shocked!
It is hard but I know I can do it, I have to!
I will let you know, thanks again for being here...

I am on my way......... http://www.healthboards.com/ubb/dance.gif hope I make it!

Starr

Starr- Still coming along?? How are you feeling?? Remember to go slow and that it's okay to stay at the same dose for awhile until you get used to it. Let me know what's up!! http://www.healthboards.com/ubb/bouncing.gif

Hi,

Thanks for checking on me, I was doing pretty good. I started getting bad pain in my back last week so I went to the ER and I have a bad kideny infection. They gave me med's for it and some pain pills I have been taking the pain pills like every six hours without ANY OTC stuff so I am happy. I am just scared once I am done with the pills I will be back to popping all those pills again.

Thanks for worring and checking up on me your the best! http://www.healthboards.com/ubb/angel.gif

take care,
Starr

[This message has been edited by thisstarr (edited 01-28-2003).]

Oooh, I've never had a kidney infection, but I can imagine! You poor thing! I've had bladder infections, and I've heard that kidney infections are even worse. I'm so glad you went to get it checked out!! Have you stopped the OTC altogether since starting the Rx pain pills? You know, when your Rx runs out, you may still have to take some OTC pills and continue your tapering. Going from Rx pain pills to nothing could potentially be more difficult than tapering the OTC pills. Just something to keep in mind. Well, take care, and take it easy! Get those kidneys back in gear!
http://www.healthboards.com/ubb/wave.gif

Hi,

The doctor said you can have a bladder infection or a UTI and if you were unaware you had it it can go to your kidenys and give you a bad kideny infection. You probably new this but thought I would let you know anyway.

Thanks for caring, I know once I am out of RX I will have to go back to taking the OTC, I will just take it one day at a time! It is just so hard when you have chronic pain 24-7 not to take anything!I am hoping I will have health insurance by the end of Feb, so hopefully I can get some help with my pain from a doctor...
Thanks for being supportive, it helps alot! http://www.healthboards.com/ubb/smile.gif


Thanks again http://www.healthboards.com/ubb/angel.gif

Starr

[This message has been edited by thisstarr (edited 01-29-2003).]

Hi Starr,

I was just reading this thread and you got some good advice from Anonymity!

A couple things to consider,,,,,

Regarding the OTC meds.. Your body can't handle taking 20 or more regular strength (or worse extra-strength) Tylenol per day. If you are taking the regular strength ones you are getting over 6500mgs. of acet. per day. If you are taking 20 extra strength ones it is more than 10,000mgs. per day. Your liver can't handle that and please, take this seriously. People die from taking too much of that stuff.

If I remember right the max. amount per day if you are NOT taking it daily is 4000mgs. and I believe if you are taking it every day they recc. no more than 2000mgs. per day. Also, a max. of 1000mgs. at a time. You really should talk to your Dr. about it and get him to run some liver tests for you. It really is a serious thing that many people are not aware of. Pain Managment Dr.'s will not prescribe daily acet. for their chronic pain patients (for the most part). They will prescribe pure opioids and usually the long acting variety (MS Contin, Oxycontin, Duragesic patches) because they are much easier on the body.

Also, you didn't mention what pain meds. you have been Rx by your Dr., but, if you are taking them every 6 hours, when you run out (of course depending on what it is, how high the dose is, and how long you will have been taking it) your withdrawal from them will be much, much worse than stopping the OTC meds..

The best thing to do to avoid that is to start lengthening your time between doses until you can go 24 hours without feeling any withdrawal symptoms.

I would really suggest that you see your Dr. and tell him/her what you have been taking for your pain on a daily basis. Your Dr. can look at your situation and decide on the course of treatment.

Wish you all the best!!//Woody

Starr- How're you feeling? How's the health insurance hunt coming along? Has your pain medicine prescription run out yet?

I hope things are going well and that you're feeling much better! Let me know!!!!
http://www.healthboards.com/ubb/jester.gif

Hi everyone.

WOODSTOCK: Thank you so much for replying to me I appreciate you explaining how much you should and shouldnt take! I know I take alot, It took me a while to relieze it, I know I need to take care of this before something bad happens. It has been really hard for me I am only 23 and I dont have any health insurance so I cant see a doctor and get treatment for my chronic pain I have. I suffer from Chronic headaches, TMJD, and Fibo. I really need help with my pain,and I am hoping I will have insurance soon. When I do get insurance I will have him run test on my liver, do they just take you blood? I get a lot of stomach pain too, I am scared I have ulcers, someone told me you can get them from taking to much OTC stuff. I am trying to limit my intake it is just hard, I am just trying to wait as long as I can and as soon as the pain gets worse I take some, thanks for your input http://www.healthboards.com/ubb/smile.gif

AONEYMITY: I am feeling a little better from my kideny infection, thanks! I am still having really bad back pain thats shooting down my legs, hopefully it will go away...I am all out of the pain pains, I still have some Motrin left he gave me so I have been taking it with some of the Extra.S.Tylenol. I am trying to cut my pill count down on the Tylenol and it is working http://www.healthboards.com/ubb/smile.gif for now!
I still havent got health insurance, but I have been talking with parter and we are thinking of getting married earlier then we had planned, so I can get on his health insurance so I can start seeing a doctor, I cant take this pain much longer, I feel like I am going to have a break down because I cant handle the pain. so I will let you know..thanks so much for caring
take care,
Starr

Goodness, I totally know what you mean. Periods of time without health insurance can be really scary. My fiance is currently on a good plan through his parents (since he's finishing up school). Once we get married in May, though, he'll have to be on my insurance (because he will finish school), and my insurance is just okay, not good. It's a little scary, since he's had a lot of health problems lately.

Keep your chin up, and congratulations on your progress with the OTC medicines! If your back pain keeps up, you may want to call a nurse at a hospital triage (which normally doesn't cost anything), and ask her if the continued pain is normal. You don't want to find out later that your infection isn't totally gone!

Good luck, and let us know how things go! http://www.healthboards.com/ubb/smile.gif

Starr:

I agree with all the great advice given by others re taking as LITTLE as possible. Esp. after stopping the Rx. You will not get relief from the OTC, even after being off them for a while now. Your body needs a lot more time off them before taking an occasional dose will help.

I think, that you should go to your local ER and tell them about this back pain shooting down the leg. You don't have insurance and my hospital here has a sign right in the check in area saying "this hospital cannot refuse treatment to anyone without insurance." You are in need, you are not sucking off the system

I'd rather see you do this, rather than pushing up your wedding date in order to get insurancee. That isn't a good enough reason to change your date, and it could potentially cause a rift later on.

That said, I really encourage you while at the hospital to get them to give you some of the preventative meds. Things like beta blockers or channel blockers, antidepressants to help raise the pain threshold and interrupt the pain signals to the brain. These are fine meds. and you will prevent a lot of the daily, chronic headaches. I KNOW. This is what I've done over the years and fine tuned it all. I KNOW chronic pain!!! I know how the OTC's don't work after a while and I know the true withdrawal I went through.

Be well!

How's life, Starr? You doing okay? Let me know what's going on!

Take Care!! http://www.healthboards.com/ubb/cool.gif

Hi Anonymity & everyone else! http://www.healthboards.com/ubb/wave.gif

I have been doing bad this week, the weather is cold here and it seems to make my headaches and jaw pain 10x worse. I have cut down on the OTC stuff, I am still taking a lot but not as much as I was. I am hoping I can get to a doctor soon... hope your doing well...

Thanks for caring http://www.healthboards.com/ubb/angel.gif your the best!

Take care,
Starr

Starr~

How are things going? Has the weather let up any to give you some relief? I hope things are going well... Have you figured out some way to get to the doctor? Don't push yourself too hard-- I'm sure you're doing very well. Just remind yourself that going slow is okay!! I'm doing okay... weather is nasty here, too!

Take care!! http://www.healthboards.com/ubb/wink.gif

Anony,

Hi The weather has been pretty bad and making my pain worse, thanks for asking.... the good thing is I got insurance http://www.healthboards.com/ubb/smile.gif the bad thing is it is an HMO Kaiser, have you heard of them? It though my husbands works so I am going to make an appt on Monday. Medical doctors dont seem to want to help me so I am a sad I am going to get my hopes up for nothing....I am so tired of doctor searching....I just want to be out of pain....

take care,

starr http://www.healthboards.com/ubb/angel.gif

[This message has been edited by thisstarr (edited 02-28-2003).]