Hi,
I'm so glad I ran across this message board. I'm scheduled with Dr. Timothy Marten on Feb. 1st for a face/neck lift with fat injections, and rhinoplasty. Even though I have had a forehead lift done in the past by another doctor, I'm still really nervous. Your information was very helpful in what to expect, thank you. I wanted to share with you that when I had my forehead lift done I had no movement at all and little feeling for like 2 months before it returned... which as an actress, I'm very grateful for-lol:-) How are you doing now? Everything back to normal for you? If so, how long was it before your lip movement came back? I look forward to hearing from you:-)

Jeanne

How's your lip doing? Mine is slooooowly beginning to resolve itself. I think my right eyebrow is starting to have some movement too, but it's so miniscule that I'm not sure if it's really there or if I'm imagining things. In any case, I'm starting to feel better about my lip and eyebrow. I'm also really happy with the way my facelift/necklift turned out. I know that I still have some swelling so some of the "youthfull-ness" will dissolve as my swelling goes down. Dr. Marten often does fat injections with his facelifts but I didn't get them because I couldn't afford the extra downtime for healing. Have you heard of the new method for injecting fat into the face? Apparently it's a much improved procedure and almost all of the fat is permanent (used to be upwards of 80% could dissolve). Because of the permanency you'd better make sure your Plastic Surgeon knows what he/she is doing. One thing I found interesting about the fat injections is that the harvested fat (harvested from your body) contain adult stem cells which seem to have an anti-aging effect on the facial tissues. Interesting, huh?

Everything has resolved itself and I'm very happy with my results. My lip movement came back fairly quickly, I would say in less then a month. I didn't get fat injections with my facelift because I didn't have the 'downtime' needed for recovery. My understanding of fat injections is that there is considerable swelling for a long time, for at least 2-3 months it would be obvious that something had changed in regards to your face. I was too self-conscious about going back to work looking as if I'd obviously done something to my face. I do plan to go back to Dr. Marten eventually and get the fat injections as my face is very thin naturally and the more I age the more "gaunt" I look. I would really appreciate it if you would let me know how you feel about the fat injections afterwards.

Besides being a great surgeon Dr. Marten is a very nice man who is always responsive to any concerns, etc. His staff is wonderful as well. You've made a great choice in regards to picking a surgeon.

How are your scars healing? Are they in front and behind the ears?

My scars are healing ok, not great..or maybe I should say not perfect. I say this because where my earlobes connect to my face there is a wrinkle or line...hard to explain but it's like as my scars healed the area where my ear meets my ear loosened so my ear lobe moved forward a bit making a tiny fold where the earlobe meets my face. It's not noticable by anyone but me I'm sure, but it is something I've noticed. The scars behind my ears are well hidden and they seemed to be healing ok as well. What I regret is using a scar fade gel like Mederma. I think that this would have helped but I was too lazy to use it.

I definitely will keep you posted. I'm more nervous about my nose because I've heard it can take up to a year for your nose to look normal again and for the swelling to go down. Have you heard anything on rhinoplasty? Thanks:-)

Everything has resolved itself and I'm very happy with my results. My lip movement came back fairly quickly, I would say in less then a month. I didn't get fat injections with my facelift because I didn't have the 'downtime' needed for recovery. My understanding of fat injections is that there is considerable swelling for a long time, for at least 2-3 months it would be obvious that something had changed in regards to your face. I was too self-conscious about going back to work looking as if I'd obviously done something to my face. I do plan to go back to Dr. Marten eventually and get the fat injections as my face is very thin naturally and the more I age the more "gaunt" I look. I would really appreciate it if you would let me know how you feel about the fat injections afterwards.

Besides being a great surgeon Dr. Marten is a very nice man who is always responsive to any concerns, etc. His staff is wonderful as well. You've made a great choice in regards to picking a surgeon.

I had a rhinoplasty almost 25 years ago. Things were done a lot differently then and I've heard that the procedure has much improved, much less downtime. All that being said I only had obvious swelling and brusing for about 2 weeks, it wasn't bad at all. I think you'll be fine.

Well that's a relief to hear. Two more days and counting... ah ya ya-lol I'll be in touch when it's all over.

Good luck! ARe you staying in the nearby hotel the next day? That was the only sort of weird thing about the whole experience. I stayed in a hotel next door for about 4 days after the surgery. Staying in the hotel wasn't so bad but being wrapped up in a sheet and being wheeled over there in a wheel chair from Dr. Marten's office was. I had this big sheet surrounding me and pulled up over my head covering my whole body and face...it had to have been obvious to anyone that I must have had some sort of plastic surgery...why else be hidden under a sheet? I wish I'd had a burka or something instead, that way it wouldn't have looked to strange to have my body and face covered.

Oh, I wanted to make a correction from one of my postings. I wrote about the scars and that I regretted using a scar fade gel like Mederma....I meant to say that I regretted NOT using Mederma.

Good luck! ARe you staying in the nearby hotel the next day? That was the only sort of weird thing about the whole experience. I stayed in a hotel next door for about 4 days after the surgery. Staying in the hotel wasn't so bad but being wrapped up in a sheet and being wheeled over there in a wheel chair from Dr. Marten's office was. I had this big sheet surrounding me and pulled up over my head covering my whole body and face...it had to have been obvious to anyone that I must have had some sort of plastic surgery...why else be hidden under a sheet? I wish I'd had a burka or something instead, that way it wouldn't have looked to strange to have my body and face covered.

Oh, I wanted to make a correction from one of my postings. I wrote about the scars and that I regretted using a scar fade gel like Mederma....I meant to say that I regretted NOT using Mederma.
Hi, it's been two weeks and it's been an interesting experience so far. I don't have much memory of the first four days. I was under anesthesia for 9 1/2 hours and spent that night in Dr. Martens facilities right there in a bedroom beside the surgery room, and then was picked by family members the next morning and went home. My sister and lover took care of me. I was told they wheeled me to the car covered in a sheet too. I have no memory of this at all. My neck is so tight, but, it suppose to soften up over the next 1-3 months and feel normal again. I'm going to start Lymphatic massages to help with the healing process. The swelling has already gone down quite a bit, but still has a ways to go... especially my lips-OMG-ducky is all I can say, but, was told don't worry they too will look normal again. I love my nose. I'm pretty happy over all. The only thing I'm a little worried about is my smile. I have always liked my big smile, but because I don't have the full muscle movement back yet, I can't smile normal. So between the lack of muscle movement and the ducky lips, my smile looks weird, fake. I kind of wish he didn't put the fat around the outer part of my lips and that he just put it in the lip part... I think that's why it looks ducky. I know I just need to be patient, it's only been two weeks and I feel it is normal for people who go through such extensive surgery to question or be worried to some extent. Can you tell me how long it took for you to get the movement back in your smile? I look forward to hearing from you and if your interested, I could send you pics my sister took.

I'd like to hear about how you progress. I'm thinking about getting a lower face/neck lift. I'm worried about the scarring, so, I'll be interested to see how your scars heal and how your neck heals. The only lip injections that I've had have been Restylane and Juvaderm. I had that duck lip look and it does subside. Did you get fat grafting in your cheek area? I hope you are feeling better. I had foot surgery a few weeks ago, so, I know about anesthesia, swelling and post-op pain. All the best.

Hi, I am feeling much better, thank you:-) I get a little out of breath easier than usual, but, anesthesia does affect you lungs briefly after surgery. I look forward to getting back into working out. As far as the scarring, it is already healing very well. I don't think I will be able to see them at all once healed. At our initial meeting he showed me some up close pictures of scars on previous patients and I couldn't see them. I mean, you would have to get a magnifying glass and you still would barely see them. He does really good work. Like I had stated before, I am over all pretty happy with the results. I just need to have a little more patience with the healing process. My neck and face look pretty good considering it's only been two weeks. Oh and yes, I had fat injections in my face as well. I highly recommend Dr. Marten. I will certainly keep you posted as I heal.

In regards to having a lop sided smile, I had this as well for probably up to 3 weeks. I also had one eyebrow that was completely paralyzed for about 2 (?) months. All have completely resolved themselves.

I wasn't able to get fat injections along with my facelift because I didn't have the downtime. I didn't want to go back to work with my face look overly puffy, too self-conscious I guess. I've been thinking of going back for fat injections as my face is long and thin, getting almost gaunt the older I get (this is, unfortunately, inherited).

I'd be very interested in how you feel about the fat injections once your swelling has gone down. I'm a bit worried about the fat injections because I've seen some actresses who's faces look sort of puffy and plastic and I think they've all had fat injections. Pricilla Presley is one, what in the heck did she do to her face? I also saw some recent photos of Madonna where her face looked unnaturally smooth, and I mean smooth in a mildly inflated ballon sort of way. I'm sure that the results of fat injections are due to the person who's doing them, like any other plastic surgery. As Dr. Marten specializes in fat injections I would expect his results to be much more natural looking.

Please keep in touch and let me know how you feel about your face in general once a few months have gone by.

FYI, I had some issues with being out of breath as well. I've been a long distance runner since for almost 25 years so it was really strange to become winded after simply walking up a flight of stairs. No one told me that anesthesia could do this so I was wondering what the heck was gong on. After about 3 weeks I was almost back to normal, it wasn't until about a month and 1/2 before I felt truly myself.

Hi Ali,
I sure hope my smile goes back to normal as quickly as yours did. That's my biggest concern. I just don't have the full muscle movement back yet, and I'm sure the numbness doesn't help either. Second concern is the tightness in my neck (especially being a singer). It's really tight. They said it would correct itself over 1-3 months, but, I just read today on another forum about a woman with the same tightness and it's been a year and it's still just as tight. That was not encouraging. I'm starting the lymphatic massages tomorrow. It's suppose help with all of these issues. Here I go freaking myself out again. I just need to be patient... I do have the time. It's only been 17 days. I'm not doing anything (as far as work is concerned) for another month 1/2. Wish me luck:-)

My neck felt VERY tight as well but that resolved itself within about 3 months, gradually getting better every week. I almost wish it was tighter now! It's so scary to see that certain parts of your face don't work like they used to, I was totally freaked out when my right eyebrow wouldn't move at all! I was convinced that it was never going to get better but it did..completely. Don't hesitate to email or call Dr. Marten's office even if you just need reassurance. I know that I called him at least twice within a month about my eyebrow and he always got back to me right away and was very reassuring. I'm sure that you'll be fine, 17 days is not very long and none of what you're talking about seems anything out of the norm.

Thank you again for the encouragement:-) I really enjoyed my first lymphatic massage today. It was quite relaxing and I swear my neck already feels a bit more relaxed too. she was very thorough in explaining things to me and she too ensured me that everything I am experiencing is quite normal. My next appointment is on Thursday. She said the amount of visits will be played by ear according to my healing. She also showed me some exercises to do at home which will change as we go. Whatever it takes. I had an interesting shock in my neck later when I got home... must be the nerves starting to heal. Oh yea, I saw Sean Penn while trying to park and I waved at him, and I told my Mom on the phone at that time that he's going to think I'm following him because I had to circle around the block to find parking again. So, I parked the car, walked to the address, and I'll be damned if he wasn't standing right there at the entrance to the building. I just held up my hand and said "I swear I'm not following you, I really do have an appointment here". He just laughed. What are the odds?-LOL- Anyway, I'll be back soon.:) Take care all:-)

What kind of anesthesia are they using now? I'm game for local or sedation but have a phobia of general.

I went under general, but, I can't imagine doing such extensive surgery as what I did any other way. This is my second time going under and no complications in either case. Anesthesia does have some common side affects such as low energy, getting out of breath easier than normal, dizzeness, memory loss(in the beginning)... all of which are temporary and pass as you heal. The longer you are under the better chance of these side effects. I was under for 9 1/2 hours which is a long time. I'm doing fine and look forward to getting back into my regular workout in couple more weeks (6 weeks). I am taking regular walks on the beach and regaining my strength. Hope this helps... don't worry, you will be fine:-)

Willowbreeze, you are brave... I'm considering a neck lift, within the next few months, and I have the choice of local sedation or general sedation. I wonder if local is too traumatizing... Primarily, I'm interested in knowing how your scars around and behind your ears heal, as the next weeks pass. At this point, I'm worried about the scarring the most. It's helpful seeing how others are doing. Thanks for sharing your story.

I have been reading this thread and getting scared and encouraged both at the same time. I have just seen Dr. Marten for a consult for SMAS facelift, necklift, chin implant, and temple eyelift and am considering the surgery for late May or June. I had liposuction with Dr. Marten back in 1997 or so and it turned out beautifully. I want to ensure that I am still selecting the best PS for the face. Have any of you heard or consulted with Dr. Carolyn Chang in SF? She is also supposed to be excellent.

The consult with Dr. Marten was wonderful. He is just as nice and refreshing as he was in 1997.

AliAyson/willowbreeze? - how are you with the results now?

I'm worried about the chin implant; I hadn't even thought of it myself but Dr. Marten suggested it for me. It sounds like it does work with no complications if put in by an expert.

I have several points to make for you to think about in general and specifically about my experience with Dr. Marten.

My experience: Yes. Dr. Marten is charming, engaging and intelligent. However, as with you, he also suggested and encouraged me to have procedures done that I had not thought about before I came into his office. And, I did them. And, I DEEPLY REGRET. More than deeply...it has been completely truned my life upside down. I am so saddened. I feel that he took away my beauty. I feel the proportions on my face are significantly less attractive than what I began with. Thinking back, I am so disappointed in myself and appalled that I was in such a vulnerable state to let that happen.

Secondly, and in general...if you are scared, I believe that tells you something about your comfort level with the procedures (clearly then, you are not comfortable) or perhaps you are not comfortable with this plastic surgeon. I strongly encourage you to seek another expert facial surgeon before proceeding.

Thirdly...I had a facelift performed by Dr. Marten . I feel it was truly a traumatic experience (It would be with any doctor, I suppose) So, my advice it that for ANY procedures, you better be sure you want them, before you do it. I feel I was too young...and didn't have anything to "lift." I feel it was a restructuring and am appalled that he recommended it for me.

Finally, in general...some plastic surgeons care more about making money. It is up to you to determine whether this applies to Dr. Marten. Some post-care nurses gave me the "real" scoop on the plastic surgery business. Too bad it was too late for me.

For anyone else who is interested, I had a horrendous experience with Dr. Marten. The surgery has ended my old life as I knew it. I wish I had never been referred to him and met him.

Thank you for the information. I am very saddened to hear of your experience. Can you say if you had a SMAS facelift and other procedures and are unhappy with all? Do you think he performed them poorly and/or did not share your same vision for what the outcome should have been? Do you feel as if he talked you into procedures that you were too young for?

I am 51 and do need this but did not even consider a chin implant until he suggested it. I have since talked to a cosmetic surgery nurse who said that many chin implant patients have nerve damage issues, so I will probably forego that procedure.

I have another consultation with a top PS tomorrow. I do feel comfortable with Dr. Marten but any kind of surgery this major on my face is fairly terrifying. I worked in medicine for a long time and know there are a number of outcomes that are less than perfect even under the best conditions.

I'm trying to gather as much information as I can and I truly appreciate your post. Are there any corrections possible for what you do not like?

If you are 51...you've been living with your face for 51 years. You know it better than anyone. If you didn't have a problem with your chin before, I ask you, why would you want to change it? Face work is not like a haircut. Its permanent. You can't change it back if you don't like it. Think about the emotional consequences of such a change, if you don't like it. Are you willing to have someone else re-design one of your facial features...when you didn't have a problem with it in the first place?

Thanks for your empathy. Wish I could answer more of your questions, but I am limiting the amount I say on-line, for personal reasons. I'll look back again...and see what else I might answer.

Hello, again. Just another observation in case you could use some grounding.

You say you are 51 and NEED this. We need water. We need sleep. We need friends/family/a sense of belonging. No one NEEDS plastic surgery....unless and except you are in the TV or movie business perhaps...and are not getting hired or re-hired because you are aging...aka your income is dependent upon this (or you have sufferred a deformity...burn/violence victim).

So...keep in mind, though I don't know your particular situation, you may WANT plastic surgery. And, if that is the case...that is OK. You may want it to appear younger, or feel you have a better shot at finding a mate (And, even then, most often, people are attracted to who you are inside and not how old your skin looks), or whatever the reason. Just something to think about. It is elective. And,it has to be worth it to you...to go through the physical and emotional pain of watching your face be completely distorted and changing for a period of months-year.

More than ever, I now appreciate the natural contours of faces...no matter how old and/or weathered.

Hi,
I have an appointment with Dr. Marten, and I'm now wondering if I should cancel it. I had abdominal liposuction and a breast lift (with slight reduction on one side) by Dr. Chang in San Francisco. Like one of the members, I now question why several surgeons would recommend aggressive procedures (eg, the breast surgery left me with significant scars) when my original situation wasn't that bad. But what bothers me most is that I now gain weight in other parts of my body (arms, face) to a greater degree, and I also feel that it's harder to maintain my previous weight, even though I'm eating the same. (The December 2004 Journal of Plastic Surgeon - or some name like that - published a study that showed that most people's weight increased by 5 to 10 lbs one year after lipo, despite no change in diet.) So the combo of a greater propensity to gain weight plus the redistribution factor has made me feel that my face looks significantly worse. It has devastated me, and I'm trying to live with it, but I feel pretty determined that I want to fix my face. It scares me, beyond belief, that I could end up looking even worse. One has to just look at some of the celebrities (who have enough money to go to the best) to know that the result can be dreadful.
Now that I'm done ranting, my question is How does one find a great plastic surgeon? I know that Dr. Marten is highly regarded, but I also know that people's aesthetic sense varies. Some people think Madonna's latest work looks great - I think she's looking like a paper mache (sp?) doll.
To the person who's looking for a facial plastic surgeon, can you let me know if you find a good one? (And I will do the same.) A journalist (she did a piece on an LA plastic surgeon) recommended Dr. Marten, Dr. Issa Eshima, and Dr. John Owsley (who is over 80). I'm looking to have a small amount of work done for a extremely subtle, natural look.
Thanks for reading!
Rose

Hi,
I have been looking for a highly regarded plastic surgeon to do work on my face. It sounds like you're on the same journey and are seeking a natural look. I have had a difficult time finding recommendations, despite my Internet search of several months. Would you mind letting me know the names of physicians you're considering? I would be very grateful! Thanks.

Hi Rosemary,

Yes, I am doing the same. I have sought out a lot of information. Based on what you said in your first email on wanting a small amount of work for an extremely subtle natural look, I would have suggested Dr. Chang, but if I am reading between the lines, it sounds like you might not be considering her based on your other surgery. I had a consult with her (I had a friend go to her for a VERY small amount of eye work and she was happy) and Dr. Chang is very big on subtle work and if you look at her face photos, I think they reinforce that. She is a young surgeon and hasn't done a ton of faces yet, however, although she is working on it.
I was also referred to Dr. Issa Eshima. I think he is generally held in high regard for his face work. I talked to three sources about his work and 2 out of 3 said his results were good (although one of those people said he was a bit difficult to work with), yet the third source said she did not like his results. All of these sources were quite reliable. I did not go to a consult with him.
I was also referred to a Dr. Kristoffer Ng Chang (no relation to the other Dr. Chang) by my dermatologist but felt that he didn't really specialize in faces or at least not yet (but I am not an expert about him so don't really know his story).
I was referred to a Dr. Brian Toth whom I had not heard of before and I did not go to a consult.
All of the above are in the bay area.
This takes us back to Dr. Marten whom I was referred to by many people and I had actually been to him myself a long time ago. He is considered an excellent facial plastic surgeon and generally a "top 10" in country. I would not say that he is recommending aggressive procedures for me that I did not request. He took the time to listen to all my requests about my face and told me what he would do. The only procedure that he recommended that I did not request was a chin implant and that procedure, along with any others (such as the facial fat injections - which I did request) that I don't want to do, will not be done. It is up to me. He has suggested that I might just want to do my eyes for now and do the rest in a couple of years. It is totally up to me.
My suggestion would be to at least go to your consult with him. In addition to being comfortable with the surgeon and being in agreement with what you want, what one nurse told me was to make sure you look at the photos - lots of them. You want to see what work they do.
I know of approximately 11 people over the past 8 years or so who are very happy Dr. Marten patients. But, you bring up a good point about Madonna. Everyone is raving about her but you don't particularly like her new looks. (I don't know what she looks like now - I tried to look her up on line briefly but can't see much of her but her sunglasses.) At any rate, you and the surgeon have to see eye to eye on what you want.
I can refer you to some top surgeons in NYC and one in LA if you are interested in leaving the area.
Your information on lipsuction was very interesting. I had this in the mid-90s and did not have the propensity to gain weight (any more than usual) or the redistribution factor - I guess I was lucky.
I hope this helps. Please let me know if you have any other top facial surgeons who you're considering.

Thank you so much for your thoughtul reply. You're correct that I don't want to go to Dr. Chang again. I would have had some of my issues had I gone to any physician, but I still would like to try someone new. Regarding Dr. Marten, I have now seen two negative comments about him on this message board. One woman said that he botched her nose. I'm not getting a nose job, but it still wasn't encouraging to hear. I'm beginning to think that I'll need to travel to have the work done. Given that I might be living with the results for the next 40+ years, I feel it's more important to choose the right surgeon rather than a convenient one. I would love to get your LA and NY recommendations. In Allure magazine, I read about a doctor Raj Kanodia (LA) who is described as "meticulous" and a "craftsman". I'd like to go to someone like him, but I probably won't go to him because it doesn't appear that face lifts are his specialty. In researching Dr. Marten, I came upon articles about Dr. Bruce Connell in Santa Ana who is regarded as a pioneer in facelift surgery. He says that a bad facelift is often the result of a rush job. (And this happens even among some of the best-known surgeons.)
This time around I'm going to really do my homework. I may spend at least a year just doing the research. I'm willing to travel both to LA and New York for the right surgeon.
Thank you for any information/advice you can provide! Rosemary

Ah...re parimaribo's last response: Interesting that that Marten is by suggesting you do your eyes now and more later. Perhaps now you have been firm with him. IWith any plastic surgeon, know yourself very well, think for a long time about what YOU want, stay grounded and don't let the plastic surgeon's persuasive nature get you off track of what YOU want.

In NY, I was referred to Dr. Alan Matarasso (his brother, Seth, is an excellent dermatologist in SF). Other top facial PS' in NY are Dr. Dan Baker, Dr. Sherrell Aston, and Dr. David Hidalgo. I'm sure there are others.

In LA, I was referred to Dr. Malcom Paul. Referral said he does "beautiful eye and face work". He is in Newport Beach.

The rush job comment is interesting. I agree that it is very important for the doc to TAKE HIS TIME. In fact, I think this in most areas of work when you want excellent outcome which you certainly do with plastic surgery. I was actually told that in NY the surgery goes much faster (in general) than with CA surgeons. I don't know if this is true, but it turned me off NY surgeons a bit. Although I am sure there are a number of outstanding NY results.

Someone in LA might be good option. I was not specifically looking for facelift at time I gathered all these names, so I don't know if any of them are specifically facelift specialists. Dr. Bruce Connell I have not heard of.

Sosad08's advice to stay grounded is good. Rushing into surgery can also result in a problem. It is good you are doing a lot of research. I'll let you know if I find anything else out.

Thank you so much for the recommendations! And I'll also let you know if I obtain any more recommendations.

Interesting that you found someone that said Marten did a botched nose job. He told me that he refers his nose jobs to others. That seems to indicate that he choses which patients will tolerate as many sales as they are willing to 'bite" on. His behavior with me, together with the woman who said he recommended a chin implant for her at age 51, together with this nose experience, indicates to me that he might be about sales and does not give advice consistent with someone's best interest - their OWN.

Good luck wit your research!

Hi Rosemary, I had a Lower F/L and Browlift that did not turn out well at age 34. I am 38 now with the same problems and want to meet with a surgeon that has an excellent reputation, not just any doctor like the one who did the original surgery. Do you think Dr. Ristow would be good doctor to consult? I was considering meeting with Dr. Owsley just to get his opinion. I know he is considerably older. The fact that Dr. Marten has patients sign forms by Medical Justice made me a little nervous, although he has a very good rep for facework. Would Dr. Chang be a good doc to consult with? I live in the Bay Area. Any recommendations would be great.
thanks,
Dave