pstuart
04-25-2008, 09:40 PM
I would really appreciate any feedback. I've been suffering for a year now and will go to a chiro in a few weeks. These are my symtoms:
Jaw and cheek pain; sometimes ear pain
When I put my fingers in my ear, I hear a crunch - crepitus
jaw pops out on right side when I yawn
Jaw deviates to "healthy" side on opening and closing
Loud, hard crepitus in right ear
The pain moves arouns - some days not bad, some are really painful
pain goes from back of ear down under jaw
Anterior neck muscle pain
When i move my jaw laterally it cracks
It feels like a big muscular component
ODDLY, no pain when I sleep..... is there anything besides tmj that this can be? Thanks so much....
Jaw and cheek pain; sometimes ear pain
When I put my fingers in my ear, I hear a crunch - crepitus
jaw pops out on right side when I yawn
Jaw deviates to "healthy" side on opening and closing
Loud, hard crepitus in right ear
The pain moves arouns - some days not bad, some are really painful
pain goes from back of ear down under jaw
Anterior neck muscle pain
When i move my jaw laterally it cracks
It feels like a big muscular component
ODDLY, no pain when I sleep..... is there anything besides tmj that this can be? Thanks so much....
Sponsor
Thelma-Louise
04-26-2008, 12:47 AM
It could be cervical related since the jaw and neck share the same muscles and depend on each other for alignment so seeing a chiro is a good idea. But the fact that your jaw is popping would seem to indicate a displacement of your disc so seeing a tmj dentist for evaluation would be a good idea as well.
Rawspice
04-26-2008, 05:00 AM
But the fact that your jaw is popping would seem to indicate a displacement of your disc .
Really?? I also hear a really loud crack everytime I move my jaw to the left or push my lower jaw slightly forward. Sometimes it just cracks without hardly moving it at all. Also when opening and closing I hear a little popping or different type sounds. Yet everytime I've had an X-ray they told me that my discs were in place...they said my tmj was a muscle problem. I've never had an MRI.
Also I did think that maybe my tmj could be secondary to a cervical problem...but they dismissed it. I don't know why they dismiss it because I constantly have neck and shoulder pain.:rolleyes: I've not had any tests on my neck, they didn't look at my neck or shoulders. I have a slight bulge from the middle of my neck going up to behind my ear, I notice it when I compare it to the good side of my neck. Also one of my shoulder blades is clearly more prominent than the other, and one shoulder looks higher than the other. Maybe I should see a chiro...I've never seen one before. Could my shoulder be causing neck pain? Or maybe it's just tmj causing my neck and shoulder pain.
Really?? I also hear a really loud crack everytime I move my jaw to the left or push my lower jaw slightly forward. Sometimes it just cracks without hardly moving it at all. Also when opening and closing I hear a little popping or different type sounds. Yet everytime I've had an X-ray they told me that my discs were in place...they said my tmj was a muscle problem. I've never had an MRI.
Also I did think that maybe my tmj could be secondary to a cervical problem...but they dismissed it. I don't know why they dismiss it because I constantly have neck and shoulder pain.:rolleyes: I've not had any tests on my neck, they didn't look at my neck or shoulders. I have a slight bulge from the middle of my neck going up to behind my ear, I notice it when I compare it to the good side of my neck. Also one of my shoulder blades is clearly more prominent than the other, and one shoulder looks higher than the other. Maybe I should see a chiro...I've never seen one before. Could my shoulder be causing neck pain? Or maybe it's just tmj causing my neck and shoulder pain.
Thelma-Louise
04-26-2008, 03:17 PM
Your discs are probably in place at rest but when you open and close they displace and then recapture which accounts for the noise only when moving your jaw. A good or knoweldgeable tmj dr would use a stethesis scope in examining a patient to confirm audible noises when opening and closing and not just rely on films.
The slight bulge in your neck could indicate that the atlas and axis are slightly off center or a disc in your spine may be slightly herniated - I had bulging on C5, 6, and 7. An MRI of the spine/c-spine could confirm if this may be part of the problem. I am pretty sure my disc bulging started shortly after my tmj since I never really had any back or neck problems before then - but its hard to prove or disprove what started first. Seeing a chiro is a good idea - the higher shoulder and increased prominence of one shoulder would probably also indicate a cervical problem - but try and find one that specializes in c-spine, or tmj problems. My current chiro is a kinesiologist and specializes in cranial disorders. Many drs do feel if you correct the tmj all other resulting symptoms and conditions will resolve themselves over time but correcting the actual tmj problem can take quite some time for some - so I have found that while undergoing tmj treatment seeing a chiro can help ease the other symptoms in the meantime and may actually help with the tmj treatment by providing correct spinal alignment during that period as well. Many tmj dsr work with chiros during treatment and often refer their patients to one should they see that splint therapy alone is not working.
Also - a lot of people have disc displacing or occasional popping and cracking which does not cause other problems (other than been annoying) and therefore they do not seek treatment for it - which is OK - its when it does start to casue other problems or intereferes in daily life that one may need to have it treated.
The slight bulge in your neck could indicate that the atlas and axis are slightly off center or a disc in your spine may be slightly herniated - I had bulging on C5, 6, and 7. An MRI of the spine/c-spine could confirm if this may be part of the problem. I am pretty sure my disc bulging started shortly after my tmj since I never really had any back or neck problems before then - but its hard to prove or disprove what started first. Seeing a chiro is a good idea - the higher shoulder and increased prominence of one shoulder would probably also indicate a cervical problem - but try and find one that specializes in c-spine, or tmj problems. My current chiro is a kinesiologist and specializes in cranial disorders. Many drs do feel if you correct the tmj all other resulting symptoms and conditions will resolve themselves over time but correcting the actual tmj problem can take quite some time for some - so I have found that while undergoing tmj treatment seeing a chiro can help ease the other symptoms in the meantime and may actually help with the tmj treatment by providing correct spinal alignment during that period as well. Many tmj dsr work with chiros during treatment and often refer their patients to one should they see that splint therapy alone is not working.
Also - a lot of people have disc displacing or occasional popping and cracking which does not cause other problems (other than been annoying) and therefore they do not seek treatment for it - which is OK - its when it does start to casue other problems or intereferes in daily life that one may need to have it treated.
Rawspice
04-29-2008, 11:40 PM
Your discs are probably in place at rest but when you open and close they displace and then recapture which accounts for the noise only when moving your jaw.
I am pretty sure my disc bulging started shortly after my tmj since I never really had any back or neck problems before then - but its hard to prove or disprove what started first. Seeing a chiro is a good idea - the higher shoulder and increased prominence of one shoulder would probably also indicate a cervical problem - but try and find one that specializes in c-spine, or tmj problems. My current chiro is a kinesiologist and specializes in cranial disorders. Many drs do feel if you correct the tmj all other resulting symptoms and conditions will resolve themselves over time but correcting the actual tmj problem can take quite some time for some
Also - a lot of people have disc displacing or occasional popping and cracking which does not cause other problems (other than been annoying) and therefore they do not seek treatment for it - which is OK - its when it does start to casue other problems or intereferes in daily life that one may need to have it treated.
Good point. Thanks Thelma, you have always been really helpful on here. More helpful than any doctor or specalist I've seen that's for sure!
Same here, I never had any neck and shoudler problems until I got tmj. I also have a bulge near my left shoulder blade and it always aches. I always feel cold as well. Can the c-spine cause tmj symptoms or is it just the other way round...that tmj can cause c-spine problems? Yeah I read that tmj can cause feature imbalance. I get some low back pain now and I never used to. Also I have an constant ache on my upper left leg, it kinds feels like I've got one leg shorter than the other. All my symptoms are down one side of my body really.
The tmj specalist told me not to worry about the cracking sounds because I only get them when I move my jaw to the side, or slighlty forward. He said you only have to worry about your jaw when you get sounds with opening and closing, he thinks the sounds I get with opening and closing are not bad. But I think the loud cracking sounds are why I have jaw pain, even if it's not with opening and closing...is that possible? You can hear the loud cracking sounds from the other side of the room. The sounds I get with opening and closing are nowhere near as loud, just slight popping and I can hear sort of grinding sounds in my head.
I am pretty sure my disc bulging started shortly after my tmj since I never really had any back or neck problems before then - but its hard to prove or disprove what started first. Seeing a chiro is a good idea - the higher shoulder and increased prominence of one shoulder would probably also indicate a cervical problem - but try and find one that specializes in c-spine, or tmj problems. My current chiro is a kinesiologist and specializes in cranial disorders. Many drs do feel if you correct the tmj all other resulting symptoms and conditions will resolve themselves over time but correcting the actual tmj problem can take quite some time for some
Also - a lot of people have disc displacing or occasional popping and cracking which does not cause other problems (other than been annoying) and therefore they do not seek treatment for it - which is OK - its when it does start to casue other problems or intereferes in daily life that one may need to have it treated.
Good point. Thanks Thelma, you have always been really helpful on here. More helpful than any doctor or specalist I've seen that's for sure!
Same here, I never had any neck and shoudler problems until I got tmj. I also have a bulge near my left shoulder blade and it always aches. I always feel cold as well. Can the c-spine cause tmj symptoms or is it just the other way round...that tmj can cause c-spine problems? Yeah I read that tmj can cause feature imbalance. I get some low back pain now and I never used to. Also I have an constant ache on my upper left leg, it kinds feels like I've got one leg shorter than the other. All my symptoms are down one side of my body really.
The tmj specalist told me not to worry about the cracking sounds because I only get them when I move my jaw to the side, or slighlty forward. He said you only have to worry about your jaw when you get sounds with opening and closing, he thinks the sounds I get with opening and closing are not bad. But I think the loud cracking sounds are why I have jaw pain, even if it's not with opening and closing...is that possible? You can hear the loud cracking sounds from the other side of the room. The sounds I get with opening and closing are nowhere near as loud, just slight popping and I can hear sort of grinding sounds in my head.
Thelma-Louise
04-30-2008, 02:46 PM
I was going to mention that a higher shoulder would then suggest one leg is longer and your hips and pelvis are unbalanced - some chiros use leg length or shoulder height (if both are equal) to determine what needs to be adjusted. My current chiro feels that the jaw, atlas and axis (c-spine), the sphenoid bone located under the nose and pelvis all need to be equally balanced and centered - when one goes off center they tend to all follow so the entire skeletal structure gets skewed or torqued. In my case I feel this may be true as I could see the changes that occurred shortly after the tmj started not just in overall body pain, but I started walking differently, one leg felt strained, my hips hurt when I laid down, my collar bones shifted off center and at one point I could barely see them any more, one shoulder was hgher and my head and neck leaned more to one side and forward plus my calf and arm muscles were twitching when at rest and my hands and feet felt tingly and sore all the time. My neck would crack with even the smallest movement.
I still am not sure if the tmj casues spine problems or vice versa - a tmj dentist may say the tmj comes first and a chiro may say the spine may come first. My feeling is it may different for each person depending on their their medical/dental history - with me I have an extensive dental history which includes braces, chin augmentation surgery, dental implants and several facial traumas (falling face first on pavement when younger) so it may be hard to pin pnpoint what casued what - but I do know my problems started shortly after changing dentists and progressed over the 3 year period I went to him - up to that point which was after all the other stuff had occurred I was fine and normal. So my feeling is it had to do with the dental work my last dentist did so for me the tmj came first.
The grinding is not good tends to indicate bone on bone contact but again it could be cranial/cervical derangement if you are feeling or hearing it more in the head.
I would go see a chiro if possible - my current one (my 3rd so far) is a kinesiologist and a member of ICAK.
I still am not sure if the tmj casues spine problems or vice versa - a tmj dentist may say the tmj comes first and a chiro may say the spine may come first. My feeling is it may different for each person depending on their their medical/dental history - with me I have an extensive dental history which includes braces, chin augmentation surgery, dental implants and several facial traumas (falling face first on pavement when younger) so it may be hard to pin pnpoint what casued what - but I do know my problems started shortly after changing dentists and progressed over the 3 year period I went to him - up to that point which was after all the other stuff had occurred I was fine and normal. So my feeling is it had to do with the dental work my last dentist did so for me the tmj came first.
The grinding is not good tends to indicate bone on bone contact but again it could be cranial/cervical derangement if you are feeling or hearing it more in the head.
I would go see a chiro if possible - my current one (my 3rd so far) is a kinesiologist and a member of ICAK.
Rawspice
05-05-2008, 08:02 AM
Oh right, thanks! I can't say I've noticed that I'm walking any different, but when standing I always feel like I'm leaning on one leg more. Maybe though because it aches I just think I'm leaning on it more.
I haven't had an extensive dental history like you. When I was a kid the dentist said by bite wasn't right, but it was never mentioned again so I presume my bite just corrected itself. I have definitely had a few facial traumas though! Well I seemed to get headaches and fatigue etc first, then jaw problems, then I got shoulder, neck and back problems last. I was reading about some of the tests for neck problems, they sound painful like injecting your spine.
I just looked up kinesiology, I think that is just what I need because I have a lot of symptoms of fibromyalgia. I said to my doctor once that I think I might have fibromyalgia but he said there are no tests for it.
I haven't had an extensive dental history like you. When I was a kid the dentist said by bite wasn't right, but it was never mentioned again so I presume my bite just corrected itself. I have definitely had a few facial traumas though! Well I seemed to get headaches and fatigue etc first, then jaw problems, then I got shoulder, neck and back problems last. I was reading about some of the tests for neck problems, they sound painful like injecting your spine.
I just looked up kinesiology, I think that is just what I need because I have a lot of symptoms of fibromyalgia. I said to my doctor once that I think I might have fibromyalgia but he said there are no tests for it.
Thelma-Louise
05-05-2008, 11:26 PM
I used to stand more on one leg myself - many years before this ever started - never really gave it much thought though - until now.
Your dr may be right - my dr feels the same way and thinks fibro is a symptom of something else being wrong (another condition) and not really a condition per se - like you said there are no real tests for it although some may argue that a high or elevated inflamation rate can be seen in certain blood tests that may indicate it. My dr also suggested I see a rheumetologist though since they treat conditions like arthritis and such which have similar symptoms of body pain, stiffness, muscle twitching , etc and are therefore more familiar with drugs used to treat such things. I would much rather find a more holistic or natural approach though since I don't trust the drugs they make these days - most have more side affects and do more harm than what they were made to treat in the first place.
If you do go to a kinesiologist - let me know how you make out.
Your dr may be right - my dr feels the same way and thinks fibro is a symptom of something else being wrong (another condition) and not really a condition per se - like you said there are no real tests for it although some may argue that a high or elevated inflamation rate can be seen in certain blood tests that may indicate it. My dr also suggested I see a rheumetologist though since they treat conditions like arthritis and such which have similar symptoms of body pain, stiffness, muscle twitching , etc and are therefore more familiar with drugs used to treat such things. I would much rather find a more holistic or natural approach though since I don't trust the drugs they make these days - most have more side affects and do more harm than what they were made to treat in the first place.
If you do go to a kinesiologist - let me know how you make out.
Rawspice
05-16-2008, 11:19 AM
Well they say one test for Fibro is to check over your body for tender points, my doctor didn't seem to know what I was on about. However when I said to a tmj specialist that my doctor said there were no tests for it, he said there are tests and that doctors don't know everything. Exactly, I don't trust them either, I hate taking drugs! It's so off putting when you look at the 'million' side effects, you just think if I take this I will feel even worse than I do now.
Will do!
Will do!