HI everyone,

I've been trying to get my cholesterol down. At least get the bad cholesterol down and the good up and make my ratio's healthier. I'm trying to avoid going on medication. Since I had a hysterectomy, it appears that my cholesterol is going up. I used to be fine. Age might be a factor too. Both my older sister and mother are on meds. Other sisters seem to be doing fine. I've lost over 25 pounds and I'm trying to watch what I eat (no foods with hydronated and partially hydronated oils, etc) Anyway, here are my numbers. I know they are really bad. I had bloodwork done on 11/2002, 4/29/2003, and 5/5/2003. I will list numbers in that order.

Cholesterol 232, 242, 248
HDL 43, 47, 43
LDL 119, 174, 176
Triglycerides 346, 104, 146
GGT 149, 132, 91

I know from the lab reports that some of these are high. I have not been checked since May. Any suggestions on how to lower these more. My doctor seemed very concerned and wanted to start me on prevachol until I got it down?? I'm trying to avoid meds, but, maybe I have no choice. Any suggestions?







[This message has been edited by mommaof5 (edited 10-19-2003).]

Hello again mommaof5!

I know I've already given you some advice on the vitamin board, but I'd just like to add one other thing. Although your doctor appears to be in a hurry(you've only been given 3 months to show improvement) to prescribe Pravachol, I can also understand your reluctance to take it. But if worse comes to worse, why not ask if you can try Niaspan(prescription niacin)instead? I think that it would be a much better alternative, and it carries far fewer potentially serious side effects than the statin drugs. In addition, it has a far more favorable impact on HDL, increases LDL particle size(rendering it less harmful), and helps to lower Lp(a), another damaging lipid component.

Read "Niaspan makes me smile" on page two. Some good information is contained in that post.

Thank you Arizona!

My chiropractor sold me something called Lipotain. It is a non-flush Niacin and standardized guggul extract. I haven't tried it yet. Is this something similar to what you are talking about? Also, i responded to you on the Vitamins board ..with those numbers you were asking about. Let me know what you think please. Thank-you very much.

[This message has been edited by mommaof5 (edited 10-19-2003).]

mommaof5,

Niaspan is simply plain old niacin(nicotinic acid), but in an extended release form. It is only available by prescription. Why only via prescription, I have no idea.

The flush-free niacin you have is probably inositol hexanicotinate. It is niacin bound to inositol. It is generally regarded as being equal to or better than ordinary niacin, but much safer in terms of side effects.

Gugulipid is also in your supplement. Although I have never personally taken it, it is also supposed to be effective for lowering cholesterol. In combination with the niacin, it may work better. Of the two, inositol hexanicotinate is probably the most effective.

I don't know what the dosages are, but in the case of inositol hexanicotinate, you generally need to take anywhere from 1,500-3,000mg/day in order to experience any beneficial results. This is usually taken in divided doses with each meal.

In addition, you may also want to include fish oil, lecithin, and a garlic supplement which is standardized to contain at least 4,000mcg allicin. With the garlic, one tablet a day should be fine. As far as lecithin is concerned, 2-3 tablespoons/day should be sufficient. With fish oil, 4-6 capsules each day.

As I have said, 3 months is a relatively short period of time. You may need more time before you see improvements. Is your doctor cooperating with you in any way, or are you pretty much on your own? If I know doctors, he's probably just ignoring your efforts, and waiting for you to return so that he can write out a prescription.

I have seen your numbers, and I agree that they need to be improved. But, as I've said before, if worse comes to worse, ask your doctor about trying the Niaspan. If he agrees, then at least he'll be willing to work with you.

Thank-you Arizona,

I have written down your suggestions and will try them. Those numbers are from May, but, I'm giving it some time before I go back to the doctor. I didn't think 3 months was enough time either. Hopefully my numbers are getting better with the weight loss and dietary changes.

You hit it right on the head, my doctor is waiting for me to come back so they can put me on the meds.

I want to get my numbers down naturally. There is a walk in lab in town that I might go to for a cholesterol test before going back to my doctor http://www.healthboards.com/ubb/smile.gif

By the way, in your opinion, just how bad are my numbers? My doctor acted like I was doomed unless I immediately went on the meds.

Anyway, I just bought a bunch of vitamins and supplements that are supposed to help with cholesteral too. I'll let you know how it works out.

Thank-you for all your help!
take care Arizona!

Arizona,

I think that the problem (in part) with Niaspan and the requirement for prescription is the need to have consistent hepatic panels to ensure that the high dosage of niacin is not affecting the liver. As I understand it, high levels of niacin can at any time produce adverse effects in the liver and the propensity of this is just as likely after week 2 as it might be 20 years later. It took me about 3 months before I ended up with elevated ALT and bilirubin levels.

mammaof5,

You are not necessarily doomed by any means. I don't like it when doctors try to scare patients with such tactics. We still don't understand all there is to know to explain why some people develop heart disease, while others escape it. There are even plenty of people with cholesterol levels above 300 who live into their 80's or 90's and never develop any problems. On the other hand, there are others with much lower cholesterol levels who were considered to be "at lower risk", and still succumbed to heart disease at relatively young ages. So you see, there is still much we need to learn, and even many doctors and people in the scientific and medical field have differing opinions. There is even a theory, called the Pauling-Rath Theory, which points the finger at Lp(a) as being the most damaging culprit in the development of atherosclerosis. What is their solution? High doses of vitamin C(2-6 grams), along with the amino acids Lysine and Proline. Pauling reasoned that Lp(a) is produced in the body to repair damaged blood vessels(like forming a scab on a wound)which results from a chronic deficiency of vitamin C. There may, in fact, be some credibility to this. The Proline and Lysine are supposed to serve as Lp(a) binders, meaning that they latch onto the circulating Lp(a) and prevent it from depositing as plaque inside the walls of arteries. To date, I don't know of any large scale studies which have been done to confirm or dismiss this theory. But from what I have read so far regarding small case studies, it appears that there may in fact be some validity to this theory. We'll just have to wait and see.

But back to your original question. Yes, I would agree that your blood lipid profile needs improvement. Your ratios are all outside of what is considered an optimal range. To give you an idea of where you stand, the TC/HDL ratio should be less than 4.0. Yours is currently 5.77. The LDL/HDL ratio should be less than 2.5. Yours is 4.09. Your Trig/HDL ratio should be under 2.0, and preferably closer to 1. Yours is 3.4. As you can see, everything is measured against HDL. That is why HDL is so desirable. You need to bring this number up, and bring your triglycerides down.

I don't know what your diet was like. But I hope you are not on a low fat diet. Although a low fat diet can potentially lower total cholesterol, the ratios of TC/HDL and Trig/HDL often worsen. This is because HDL often declines on such a diet, while triglycerides increase due to the increased intake of carbohydrates that people generally end up consuming.

All you can do right now is to try to keep your carbohydrate intake in check. Especially try to avoid junk foods and foods containing hydrogenated fats. Hopefully, the supplements will also result in an overall improvement. But give it some time. They are not drugs, so it will most likely not happen overnight.

Thank-you Arizona!

I've learned more from you in the past 2 days, then my doctor even bothered to tell me after my yearly exam. All they did was have the nurse call me, tell me the results of the blood work, and then ask what pharmacy I used so that they could call in a prescription for prevachol ..whoa! I said. http://www.healthboards.com/ubb/smile.gif

Now I'm trying to do this on my own and learn as I go.
You would have thought the doctor would have discussed dietary changes first.

Thank-you for your kindness again Arizona. You are a very nice person.

mammaof5,

Thank you for your kind words. I really hope that things work out fine for you. Check back here often. There are a lot of knowledgeable people here who share similar concerns, and can offer many additional tips and advice. I wish you well.

"Physicians just do what the medical authorities say to do. Of all the professions, the medical profession is the one in which the individual practitioners do the smallest amount of thinking for themselves."---Linus Pauling

Don't want to scare you, but your numbers do alarm me. Mine were not as bad as yours when I had a cardiac event. I was only 41 female non-smoker and had a family history. I've been on Zocor for over a year without a problem. If you are not drastically changing your lifestyle you may not be lowering those numbers enough to reduce your risk.