flowergirl2day
04-21-2009, 10:53 PM
I was switched from Lipitor to Crestor about three weeks ago. I have just obtained my latest lab results, which show that my cholesterol is now 3.4 mmol/L, almost a whole point below the lowest end of the normal range (4.20-5.20), and the LDL cholesterol is also flagged as being too low.
The main reason for switching from one cholesterol drug to another was not the cholesterol control, which was pretty good with Lipitor :), but reducing arterial inflammation. Crestor has been shown to have such anti-inflammatory effects.
I wonder if Crestor could have caused this significant drop in my cholesterol levels in so short a time -three weeks-, or if some other factors or health issues may have played a role in this decrease. My cholesterol levels were well within the normal range at the end of January.
What are the consequences, if any, of lower than normal cholesterol levels? Should I be concerned? I know that lowering the statin dose would seem the next logical step. I don't know if that's an option. It will be a few weeks before I see my doctor; longer still before I see the prescribing doctor.
Any input would be much appreciated.
The main reason for switching from one cholesterol drug to another was not the cholesterol control, which was pretty good with Lipitor :), but reducing arterial inflammation. Crestor has been shown to have such anti-inflammatory effects.
I wonder if Crestor could have caused this significant drop in my cholesterol levels in so short a time -three weeks-, or if some other factors or health issues may have played a role in this decrease. My cholesterol levels were well within the normal range at the end of January.
What are the consequences, if any, of lower than normal cholesterol levels? Should I be concerned? I know that lowering the statin dose would seem the next logical step. I don't know if that's an option. It will be a few weeks before I see my doctor; longer still before I see the prescribing doctor.
Any input would be much appreciated.
Sponsor
yackedar
04-25-2009, 03:41 PM
Hi Flowergirl,
It would appear that I am in exactly the same situation as yourself.
Having had a TC of 4.4-4.6 mmol/L (@175mg/dl), LDL of 2.8-3.4 mmol/L (108-130) and HDL of 1.3-1.4 mmol/L (@50-54) with no medication for the past six years or so, this was soon to change.
At the beginning of January this year, apparently a plaque ruptured somewhere in them miles of arteries and until recently have had an angina attack every morning within an hour of rising.
At the end of February I saw a Cardiologist who immediately doubled my intake of beta-blockers from 25-50mg daily and placed me on 40mg Simvastatin (Zocor), which by the way has superior positive study results in respect of Cardiac problems than Crestor, and at a lower dose. My cardiologist wants my LDL level below 1.6 mmol/L (61.9 mg/dl), where several studies have proven that this low level has shown to halt the growth of arterial plaque, and after thirteen weeks starts to reduce it's size.
However, after six weeks on Simvastatin my levels went from normal to these, and I am far from happy with these low levels for reasons I'll mention below.
TC: 3.2 mmol/L (123.7 mg/dl)
LDL 1.6 (61.9)
HDL 1.2 (46.4) Lowest ever HDL reading.
Trig's: 0.9 (79.7)
Now, what to do?
Well, I shall continue taking 40mg Simvastatin for two months, retest to see if the levels have decreased even more and then go to 20mg for two months and retest. Depending on the results I shall decide whether to stop taking Simvastatin, and start taking hawthorn berry tincture in addition to the 200mg COq10, 1.2g aged garlic and 8ozs pomegranate juice currently being taken daily.
Since adding the aged garlic and pomegranate juice to my daily intake two weeks ago, my weekly angina attacks have decreased from 7-10 per week to 4. This I have proven is not down to the action of Simvastatin.......not yet, anyway.
Looks like you have been reading the same science papers as I have.
The latest thinking by the world's most respected cardiologists is that saturated fats etc. are not the cause of high cholesterol levels, but yes, as you said, by inflammation within the arteries.
Inflammation caused by toxins within the blood stream damage our arteries, which apparently starts to happen once we are weaned off baby milk. ( Wow! cholesterol plaque found in little kids from the age of two.) To prevent damaged arteries from rupturing, LDL cholesterol adheres itself to the inflamed arterial section to seal it, along with whatever metal particles and toxins are around at that time. The first effects of plaque being present is the onset of Hypertension (High blood pressure). Overtime, plaque gets damaged by continuing inflammation and the process continues over and over.
Depending on the chemical makeup of the plaque, it is either soft or hard crusted (calcified) can lead to unstable or stable angina (respectively), heart attack or even death if the plaque has totally blocked an artery, or a blood clot blocks an artery after rupturing.
So, in the light of this way of thinking by the 'boffins', is LDL bad cholesterol?
No-one knows, but I know for sure that low levels of LDL, HDL and TC have proven to lead to several high risk medical conditions, including kidney failure, various forms of cancer and higher than average risk of a stroke.......and I for one will not continue to have cholesterol levels lower than those proven to be needed by the body to function as it should......Angina or not, so I will attack the root of the problem, inflammation, but not by conventional means, as in my eyes, swings and roundabouts is not good enough for my body.
It would appear that I am in exactly the same situation as yourself.
Having had a TC of 4.4-4.6 mmol/L (@175mg/dl), LDL of 2.8-3.4 mmol/L (108-130) and HDL of 1.3-1.4 mmol/L (@50-54) with no medication for the past six years or so, this was soon to change.
At the beginning of January this year, apparently a plaque ruptured somewhere in them miles of arteries and until recently have had an angina attack every morning within an hour of rising.
At the end of February I saw a Cardiologist who immediately doubled my intake of beta-blockers from 25-50mg daily and placed me on 40mg Simvastatin (Zocor), which by the way has superior positive study results in respect of Cardiac problems than Crestor, and at a lower dose. My cardiologist wants my LDL level below 1.6 mmol/L (61.9 mg/dl), where several studies have proven that this low level has shown to halt the growth of arterial plaque, and after thirteen weeks starts to reduce it's size.
However, after six weeks on Simvastatin my levels went from normal to these, and I am far from happy with these low levels for reasons I'll mention below.
TC: 3.2 mmol/L (123.7 mg/dl)
LDL 1.6 (61.9)
HDL 1.2 (46.4) Lowest ever HDL reading.
Trig's: 0.9 (79.7)
Now, what to do?
Well, I shall continue taking 40mg Simvastatin for two months, retest to see if the levels have decreased even more and then go to 20mg for two months and retest. Depending on the results I shall decide whether to stop taking Simvastatin, and start taking hawthorn berry tincture in addition to the 200mg COq10, 1.2g aged garlic and 8ozs pomegranate juice currently being taken daily.
Since adding the aged garlic and pomegranate juice to my daily intake two weeks ago, my weekly angina attacks have decreased from 7-10 per week to 4. This I have proven is not down to the action of Simvastatin.......not yet, anyway.
Looks like you have been reading the same science papers as I have.
The latest thinking by the world's most respected cardiologists is that saturated fats etc. are not the cause of high cholesterol levels, but yes, as you said, by inflammation within the arteries.
Inflammation caused by toxins within the blood stream damage our arteries, which apparently starts to happen once we are weaned off baby milk. ( Wow! cholesterol plaque found in little kids from the age of two.) To prevent damaged arteries from rupturing, LDL cholesterol adheres itself to the inflamed arterial section to seal it, along with whatever metal particles and toxins are around at that time. The first effects of plaque being present is the onset of Hypertension (High blood pressure). Overtime, plaque gets damaged by continuing inflammation and the process continues over and over.
Depending on the chemical makeup of the plaque, it is either soft or hard crusted (calcified) can lead to unstable or stable angina (respectively), heart attack or even death if the plaque has totally blocked an artery, or a blood clot blocks an artery after rupturing.
So, in the light of this way of thinking by the 'boffins', is LDL bad cholesterol?
No-one knows, but I know for sure that low levels of LDL, HDL and TC have proven to lead to several high risk medical conditions, including kidney failure, various forms of cancer and higher than average risk of a stroke.......and I for one will not continue to have cholesterol levels lower than those proven to be needed by the body to function as it should......Angina or not, so I will attack the root of the problem, inflammation, but not by conventional means, as in my eyes, swings and roundabouts is not good enough for my body.
flowergirl2day
04-26-2009, 03:15 AM
Hi yakedar,
thank you very much for responding to my post. For some reason, we tend to think that our problems are unique when, in fact, that is seldom the case. It is so good to know that other individuals are dealing with the same issues.
I've just finished typing a lengthy reply and promptly lost it in cyberspace.
Because of the late hour, I'll retype it tomorrow night.
FG
thank you very much for responding to my post. For some reason, we tend to think that our problems are unique when, in fact, that is seldom the case. It is so good to know that other individuals are dealing with the same issues.
I've just finished typing a lengthy reply and promptly lost it in cyberspace.
Because of the late hour, I'll retype it tomorrow night.
FG
flowergirl2day
04-26-2009, 11:52 PM
Hi, :)
At the end of February I saw a Cardiologist who immediately doubled my intake of beta-blockers from 25-50mg daily and placed me on 40mg Simvastatin (Zocor), which by the way has superior positive study results in respect of Cardiac problems than Crestor, and at a lower dose. My cardiologist wants my LDL level below 1.6 mmol/L (61.9 mg/dl), where several studies have proven that this low level has shown to halt the growth of arterial plaque, and after thirteen weeks starts to reduce it's size.
Thanks for that information. I have not been told what level to aim for. What complicates my situation is a chronic kidney disease. It perpetuates the inflammatory processes and also effects the cardiac function. I still have a lot of reading to do. It seems to me that, rather than just one or two drugs from this class, the whole statin family of drugs has antiinflammatory properties, not unlike some mega-strength aspirin. What makes a difference to some people is that a couple of statins have actually been proven effective in reducing inflammation in clinical trials. (evidence-based info) :)
However, after six weeks on Simvastatin my levels went from normal to these, and I am far from happy with these low levels for reasons I'll mention below.
TC: 3.2 mmol/L (123.7 mg/dl)
LDL 1.6 (61.9)
HDL 1.2 (46.4) Lowest ever HDL reading.
Trig's: 0.9 (79.7)
Now, what to do?
Well, here are my numbers as of three weeks ago:
(Looks familiar?)
TC 3.4mmol/L (4.20-5.20)
LDL 1.93mmol/L (2.20-3.40)
HDL 1.13 (.90-2.40)
Triglycerides .93 (.60-2.30)
compared to the following levels two months ago:
TC 4.58
LDL 2.89
HDL 1.24
Triglycerides .98
Well, I shall continue taking 40mg Simvastatin for two months, retest to see if the levels have decreased even more and then go to 20mg for two months and retest. Depending on the results I shall decide whether to stop taking Simvastatin, and start taking hawthorn berry tincture in addition to the 200mg COq10, 1.2g aged garlic and 8ozs pomegranate juice currently being taken daily.
I plan to do the exact same thing. The bottom line when deciding whether to continue with this therapy as prescribed are the often irreversible or fatal consequences of atherosclerosis and unstable plaque. Thanks for describing the effects of low cholesterol on the body. They sound almost as bas as those of blocked arteries. :( I feel that monitoring our progress (or the lack thereof) in fighting inflammation is our doctors' responsibility, as are any necessary dose adjustments.
I've been taking the same supplements as you for over two years now, with the exception of the hawthorn berry. My daily supplements include CoQ10, garlic, vitamins E and C and fish oil. I hope they've done some good. If you know of any other supplements thought to reduce inflammation, please share.
Looks like you have been reading the same science papers as I have.
The latest thinking by the world's most respected cardiologists is that saturated fats etc. are not the cause of high cholesterol levels, but yes, as you said, by inflammation within the arteries.
I've done a lot of reading about inflammation, atherosclerosis and related issues. It is fascinating stuff. You are correct, inflammatory processes cause the initial endothelial dysfunction, which then leads to atherosclerosis, plaque deposition and resulting problems. For this reason, inflammation is what must be targeted in order to reduce one's risk of an adverse event.
Thank you so much for your input! It is so good to know I am not alone in this. Any recommendations?
flowergirl
At the end of February I saw a Cardiologist who immediately doubled my intake of beta-blockers from 25-50mg daily and placed me on 40mg Simvastatin (Zocor), which by the way has superior positive study results in respect of Cardiac problems than Crestor, and at a lower dose. My cardiologist wants my LDL level below 1.6 mmol/L (61.9 mg/dl), where several studies have proven that this low level has shown to halt the growth of arterial plaque, and after thirteen weeks starts to reduce it's size.
Thanks for that information. I have not been told what level to aim for. What complicates my situation is a chronic kidney disease. It perpetuates the inflammatory processes and also effects the cardiac function. I still have a lot of reading to do. It seems to me that, rather than just one or two drugs from this class, the whole statin family of drugs has antiinflammatory properties, not unlike some mega-strength aspirin. What makes a difference to some people is that a couple of statins have actually been proven effective in reducing inflammation in clinical trials. (evidence-based info) :)
However, after six weeks on Simvastatin my levels went from normal to these, and I am far from happy with these low levels for reasons I'll mention below.
TC: 3.2 mmol/L (123.7 mg/dl)
LDL 1.6 (61.9)
HDL 1.2 (46.4) Lowest ever HDL reading.
Trig's: 0.9 (79.7)
Now, what to do?
Well, here are my numbers as of three weeks ago:
(Looks familiar?)
TC 3.4mmol/L (4.20-5.20)
LDL 1.93mmol/L (2.20-3.40)
HDL 1.13 (.90-2.40)
Triglycerides .93 (.60-2.30)
compared to the following levels two months ago:
TC 4.58
LDL 2.89
HDL 1.24
Triglycerides .98
Well, I shall continue taking 40mg Simvastatin for two months, retest to see if the levels have decreased even more and then go to 20mg for two months and retest. Depending on the results I shall decide whether to stop taking Simvastatin, and start taking hawthorn berry tincture in addition to the 200mg COq10, 1.2g aged garlic and 8ozs pomegranate juice currently being taken daily.
I plan to do the exact same thing. The bottom line when deciding whether to continue with this therapy as prescribed are the often irreversible or fatal consequences of atherosclerosis and unstable plaque. Thanks for describing the effects of low cholesterol on the body. They sound almost as bas as those of blocked arteries. :( I feel that monitoring our progress (or the lack thereof) in fighting inflammation is our doctors' responsibility, as are any necessary dose adjustments.
I've been taking the same supplements as you for over two years now, with the exception of the hawthorn berry. My daily supplements include CoQ10, garlic, vitamins E and C and fish oil. I hope they've done some good. If you know of any other supplements thought to reduce inflammation, please share.
Looks like you have been reading the same science papers as I have.
The latest thinking by the world's most respected cardiologists is that saturated fats etc. are not the cause of high cholesterol levels, but yes, as you said, by inflammation within the arteries.
I've done a lot of reading about inflammation, atherosclerosis and related issues. It is fascinating stuff. You are correct, inflammatory processes cause the initial endothelial dysfunction, which then leads to atherosclerosis, plaque deposition and resulting problems. For this reason, inflammation is what must be targeted in order to reduce one's risk of an adverse event.
Thank you so much for your input! It is so good to know I am not alone in this. Any recommendations?
flowergirl