janewhite1
05-30-2009, 11:17 PM
We've got some GREAT threads going right now. So I thought I'd add one about sleep.
I've had trouble falling asleep since early childhood. (Since birth, according to my mother.) It almost always takes me the better part of an hour to fall asleep. When I'm actually suffering from stress-related insomnia... Let's not go there.
I remember once when I was about four years old I fell asleep as soon as I lay down and slept all night, and woke up utterly bewildered as to where the night had gone. Even at that age it was normal for me to take half an hour to an hour to fall asleep, and then to wake up too early.
In fact, I learned as a teenager that many people actually can fall asleep in less than 10 minutes under the right circumstances. This was a total surprise to me.
In fact, the number one reason I take my Adderall only in emergencies is that if I take it at 9am, I'll be up until 4am.
I know I'm not alone in this. Does anyone have solutions?
I've had trouble falling asleep since early childhood. (Since birth, according to my mother.) It almost always takes me the better part of an hour to fall asleep. When I'm actually suffering from stress-related insomnia... Let's not go there.
I remember once when I was about four years old I fell asleep as soon as I lay down and slept all night, and woke up utterly bewildered as to where the night had gone. Even at that age it was normal for me to take half an hour to an hour to fall asleep, and then to wake up too early.
In fact, I learned as a teenager that many people actually can fall asleep in less than 10 minutes under the right circumstances. This was a total surprise to me.
In fact, the number one reason I take my Adderall only in emergencies is that if I take it at 9am, I'll be up until 4am.
I know I'm not alone in this. Does anyone have solutions?
Sponsor
Thunor
05-31-2009, 02:06 AM
I wish I could help; falling asleep has never been my problem. There are times that I take an hour or so to fall asleep, but they are far from the norm. As a rule, I can turn it off in minutes, and that's when I'm sleeping in bed . . . put me in the passenger seat of a car or a truck and it's like flipping a switch, an unfortunate side effect of years on the road without enough sleep, you slept when it wasn't your turn to drive.
Now staying asleep, that's another matter. Not a night goes by that I don't wake up at least two to three times, and have done so as long as I can remember. I remember kids making fun of me at summer camp because I woke the whole cabin every night when I woke up and stumbled to the bathroom in the pitch dark.
Alas, I've yet to find a solution. I do sleep better with regular exercise, but it doesn't eliminate my nightly waking entirely. OTC sleep aids do little other than make me groggy in the morning, same with Melatonin. Therefore, I'll be watching this thread with interest, because I'd love to learn how people manage to sleep through the night.
Now staying asleep, that's another matter. Not a night goes by that I don't wake up at least two to three times, and have done so as long as I can remember. I remember kids making fun of me at summer camp because I woke the whole cabin every night when I woke up and stumbled to the bathroom in the pitch dark.
Alas, I've yet to find a solution. I do sleep better with regular exercise, but it doesn't eliminate my nightly waking entirely. OTC sleep aids do little other than make me groggy in the morning, same with Melatonin. Therefore, I'll be watching this thread with interest, because I'd love to learn how people manage to sleep through the night.
addprogrammer
05-31-2009, 06:29 AM
Sleep, wa dat?
Visa-versa on the Adderall, though. It can help me sleep but not consistently. So far, no cigar, on nailing the variables. Perhaps half the time my brain keeps doing whatever it was doing during the day especially if it was doing it all day. I am in some level of sleep because the time I percieve I was asleep is much less than elapsed time. Sucky sleep is just as sucky as no sleep.
Sedation WAS (six days on the wagon now) partially behind my super chocolate ice cream addiction. Essentially it's a stimulant mixed in with a few thousand grams of fat and sugar. Sugar alone gives me ebbe-gebbies.
I don't know what the heck I'm talking about other than I don't sleep well most of the time and it reeks havoc with my ADHD.
What's the solution?
Bob
Visa-versa on the Adderall, though. It can help me sleep but not consistently. So far, no cigar, on nailing the variables. Perhaps half the time my brain keeps doing whatever it was doing during the day especially if it was doing it all day. I am in some level of sleep because the time I percieve I was asleep is much less than elapsed time. Sucky sleep is just as sucky as no sleep.
Sedation WAS (six days on the wagon now) partially behind my super chocolate ice cream addiction. Essentially it's a stimulant mixed in with a few thousand grams of fat and sugar. Sugar alone gives me ebbe-gebbies.
I don't know what the heck I'm talking about other than I don't sleep well most of the time and it reeks havoc with my ADHD.
What's the solution?
Bob
addprogrammer
05-31-2009, 07:06 AM
Maybe I should apply my auto repairs skills.
I have a inprocess job that I must hand off to an expert tomorrow. I've been using the diagnostic process called "throwing parts at it." One of them there parts has got to be the problem. Sooner or later, said car will be fixed. Off to an expert tomorrow. My arm hurts from part throwing.
I missed a free near-by sleep study last year. You know, they wire you up, expect you to sleep wired (no pun intended), and measure brain waves. Then tell you the part to replace. You need a new hypothalamus. Check at NAPA for a remanufactured. Just be sure to take the your old one with you so you don't get nailed with a core charge.
Anyone ever do a sleep disorder thing?
Bob
I have a inprocess job that I must hand off to an expert tomorrow. I've been using the diagnostic process called "throwing parts at it." One of them there parts has got to be the problem. Sooner or later, said car will be fixed. Off to an expert tomorrow. My arm hurts from part throwing.
I missed a free near-by sleep study last year. You know, they wire you up, expect you to sleep wired (no pun intended), and measure brain waves. Then tell you the part to replace. You need a new hypothalamus. Check at NAPA for a remanufactured. Just be sure to take the your old one with you so you don't get nailed with a core charge.
Anyone ever do a sleep disorder thing?
Bob
addprogrammer
06-01-2009, 10:28 AM
Jane,
If this thread goes dead, it's because no one has a clue how to manage this perhaps most pervasive ADHD side-kick. I, for one, have not found a practical solution. I used lumber jacking for a while. The calorie requirements for a full time lumber jack, not using mechanization other than a chain saw, is about 8,000 calories per day. I slept better than a rock. It is not practical or even possible for me to exercise like that more than once a month. Nets me one good night's sleep per month.
I've tried eating myself to sleep; some efficacy with life threatening weight gain. No good.
Boozing myself to sleep. Produces two or three hours of poor quality sleep than wide awake with a headache and the worse case of ADD (less the H) imaginable. Positively no good.
Over-the-counter and presciption sleep aids: Either made the insomnia worse or had same effect as booze less the headache.
Melatonin: Insufficient efficacy. Produces serotonin overload if mixed with Celexa. I experience the overload as a wicked case of RLS. Needless to say, not conducive to sleep. My brain wants to sleep but leg anguish overrides.
Celexa has helped some but not enough. Exceptional effective as an AD for me. I had shrink appt. last week. Talked about kicking Celex. Shrink told me I'm too much of a problem without it. Hmn, who's he worried about? :D
I have some variables plugged but will have to wait to post details. Here's the outline.
The four types of ADHD I experience and how insufficient sleep affects them:
Switching channel ADHD
Brain dead ADHD
Overfocused ADHD
Stimulant crash ADHD
If this thread goes dead, it's because no one has a clue how to manage this perhaps most pervasive ADHD side-kick. I, for one, have not found a practical solution. I used lumber jacking for a while. The calorie requirements for a full time lumber jack, not using mechanization other than a chain saw, is about 8,000 calories per day. I slept better than a rock. It is not practical or even possible for me to exercise like that more than once a month. Nets me one good night's sleep per month.
I've tried eating myself to sleep; some efficacy with life threatening weight gain. No good.
Boozing myself to sleep. Produces two or three hours of poor quality sleep than wide awake with a headache and the worse case of ADD (less the H) imaginable. Positively no good.
Over-the-counter and presciption sleep aids: Either made the insomnia worse or had same effect as booze less the headache.
Melatonin: Insufficient efficacy. Produces serotonin overload if mixed with Celexa. I experience the overload as a wicked case of RLS. Needless to say, not conducive to sleep. My brain wants to sleep but leg anguish overrides.
Celexa has helped some but not enough. Exceptional effective as an AD for me. I had shrink appt. last week. Talked about kicking Celex. Shrink told me I'm too much of a problem without it. Hmn, who's he worried about? :D
I have some variables plugged but will have to wait to post details. Here's the outline.
The four types of ADHD I experience and how insufficient sleep affects them:
Switching channel ADHD
Brain dead ADHD
Overfocused ADHD
Stimulant crash ADHD
addprogrammer
06-01-2009, 12:45 PM
Jane,
I spent about 2 hours ferretting through the maze to catch the meat.
Here tis:
Every day I experience an afternoon crash at about 2PM. "Brain dead ADHD" is how I define my afternoon crash. My shrink told me just last week that my afternoon crash cannot be avoided. The crash is caused by a combination of an apparently normal afternoon low most everyone experiences and by the stimulate I take in AM wearing off. If I am excessively fatigued, the afternoon crash is the end of my productive day.
The afternoon crash can be lessened by getting a good night's sleep and by reducing the AM stimulant dose. I can't reduce the AM stimulate dose unless I get a good night's sleep.
Ok, the varibles are nailed. The problem remains.
Help.
Hmn, I think I'll peruse the sleep disorder board. I'm fairly sure ADHD is the culprit but perhaps we can discover some cross-over technology.
I spent about 2 hours ferretting through the maze to catch the meat.
Here tis:
Every day I experience an afternoon crash at about 2PM. "Brain dead ADHD" is how I define my afternoon crash. My shrink told me just last week that my afternoon crash cannot be avoided. The crash is caused by a combination of an apparently normal afternoon low most everyone experiences and by the stimulate I take in AM wearing off. If I am excessively fatigued, the afternoon crash is the end of my productive day.
The afternoon crash can be lessened by getting a good night's sleep and by reducing the AM stimulant dose. I can't reduce the AM stimulate dose unless I get a good night's sleep.
Ok, the varibles are nailed. The problem remains.
Help.
Hmn, I think I'll peruse the sleep disorder board. I'm fairly sure ADHD is the culprit but perhaps we can discover some cross-over technology.
janewhite1
06-01-2009, 01:56 PM
Haven't checked this thread in a couple days, got sidetracked by some animal-related excitement. (Seriously, ... but that's another story. No one was hurt, including the critter.)
I also have had little luck with drugs. However, I do take a small dose of the tricyclic antidepressant to control my fibromyalgia. I find it gives me the ability to roll over and go back to sleep when I wake up too early in the morning, which is really convenient. (Makes it a little harder to get up when it's actually time to get up, but life is full of these little struggles.:angel:)
It's good to know I am not alone in this. My husband says, "You just need to develop a better bedtime routine. I had insomnia in high school, but it went away when I started taking a shower right before bed, and concentrated on lying still once I lay down."
To which I say, "I see. How did you sleep in nursery school?"
Of course, there is one way in which husbands are good for sleep, but we won't get into that here.
Physical activity to the point of total exhaustion does help. So does reading a novel before bed, because then the 500,000 really interesting thoughts in my head are mostly about the novel, rather than anything super-stressful. Particularly if I was working right before bed, that novel time is critical.
I'm considering using only very dim lighting for a couple hours before bed, but I'm not sure how practical that is.
I also have had little luck with drugs. However, I do take a small dose of the tricyclic antidepressant to control my fibromyalgia. I find it gives me the ability to roll over and go back to sleep when I wake up too early in the morning, which is really convenient. (Makes it a little harder to get up when it's actually time to get up, but life is full of these little struggles.:angel:)
It's good to know I am not alone in this. My husband says, "You just need to develop a better bedtime routine. I had insomnia in high school, but it went away when I started taking a shower right before bed, and concentrated on lying still once I lay down."
To which I say, "I see. How did you sleep in nursery school?"
Of course, there is one way in which husbands are good for sleep, but we won't get into that here.
Physical activity to the point of total exhaustion does help. So does reading a novel before bed, because then the 500,000 really interesting thoughts in my head are mostly about the novel, rather than anything super-stressful. Particularly if I was working right before bed, that novel time is critical.
I'm considering using only very dim lighting for a couple hours before bed, but I'm not sure how practical that is.
addprogrammer
06-01-2009, 02:42 PM
Of course, there is one way in which husbands are good for sleep, but we won't get into that here.
There is one way in which wives are good for sleep, but we won't get into that here.
:D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D
Hey, it may be THE solution. At my age, though, every night just might kill me. Then again, ain't nothing like going out in a blaze of glory.
You made me think bad thoughts, you did. Thank you.
Dang, got busted for too many similies. Imagine a few thou here.
Bob
There is one way in which wives are good for sleep, but we won't get into that here.
:D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D
Hey, it may be THE solution. At my age, though, every night just might kill me. Then again, ain't nothing like going out in a blaze of glory.
You made me think bad thoughts, you did. Thank you.
Dang, got busted for too many similies. Imagine a few thou here.
Bob
janewhite1
06-01-2009, 11:42 PM
I just live to make trouble, Bob.
More reasons not to sleep: I found a baby raccoon in the basement last night, and a mouse in the kitchen today. I know Mom always said my room was so messy it was like living in the zoo, but I never expected to live out her words so literally.
More reasons not to sleep: I found a baby raccoon in the basement last night, and a mouse in the kitchen today. I know Mom always said my room was so messy it was like living in the zoo, but I never expected to live out her words so literally.
rheanna
06-05-2009, 04:03 AM
I found some baby possums in the washing machine out in the garage a few years ago. The adorable little creatures hissed at me, then collapsed in fake-dead-mode. I almost died myself from laughter. I left for a while to allow them to come to and realize that this wasn't the best place to snooze. They left on their own. I still laugh to this day thinking about how cuuuuute they were. And how they tried to divert me by playing dead. Aaaaawwww.
Ahem. I can't go to sleep that quickly. I keep reading material handy by the bed. Or crossword puzzles. And I sleep with the light on, because I keep waking up all night long, and the reading material is the only way to put aside "the 500,000 really interesting thoughts in my head". My husband, a night owl (where are all these animal metaphors coming from???), comes to bed a few hours after I do, and falls asleep in 5 minutes. I usually wake up when he comes in, and I watch him conk out. And he sleeps solidly through the night. Sigh.
Yes, being really really tired helps me to fall asleep faster. Doesn't happen very often.
A glass of liquor sipped in bed helps to mellow me out and allow me to fall asleep. Then it wears off early in the morning. And I'm wide awake again.
It's really hard to switch off those thoughts. Especially if I have something scheduled the next day, or if there's something I have to take care of, or if I'm worried about the health of the cat (long going saga) (there goes the animal business again!), or whatever -- the brain doesn't want to shut off.
I'm going through a phase in the last couple of weeks that makes me think I'm becoming sensitive to caffeine. My precious special expensive tea. Two large mugs of which I enjoy every single day. Sob. I may have to wean myself off of it. Sniff.
No solutions. Just sympathy.
--Rheanna
Ahem. I can't go to sleep that quickly. I keep reading material handy by the bed. Or crossword puzzles. And I sleep with the light on, because I keep waking up all night long, and the reading material is the only way to put aside "the 500,000 really interesting thoughts in my head". My husband, a night owl (where are all these animal metaphors coming from???), comes to bed a few hours after I do, and falls asleep in 5 minutes. I usually wake up when he comes in, and I watch him conk out. And he sleeps solidly through the night. Sigh.
Yes, being really really tired helps me to fall asleep faster. Doesn't happen very often.
A glass of liquor sipped in bed helps to mellow me out and allow me to fall asleep. Then it wears off early in the morning. And I'm wide awake again.
It's really hard to switch off those thoughts. Especially if I have something scheduled the next day, or if there's something I have to take care of, or if I'm worried about the health of the cat (long going saga) (there goes the animal business again!), or whatever -- the brain doesn't want to shut off.
I'm going through a phase in the last couple of weeks that makes me think I'm becoming sensitive to caffeine. My precious special expensive tea. Two large mugs of which I enjoy every single day. Sob. I may have to wean myself off of it. Sniff.
No solutions. Just sympathy.
--Rheanna
addprogrammer
06-05-2009, 08:10 AM
I found some baby possums in the washing machine out in the garage a few years ago. The adorable little creatures hissed at me, then collapsed in fake-dead-mode. I almost died myself from laughter. I left for a while to allow them to come to and realize that this wasn't the best place to snooze. They left on their own. I still laugh to this day thinking about how cuuuuute they were. And how they tried to divert me by playing dead. Aaaaawwww.
--Rheanna
Rheanna,
You are sick in the head. Possums cute? They look cute as road kill. With them rat tales they deserve to get run over. Least they make good frisbees after sun-drying a few days.
Sick, I said, sick, you are. No wonder you can't sleep.
Bob
--Rheanna
Rheanna,
You are sick in the head. Possums cute? They look cute as road kill. With them rat tales they deserve to get run over. Least they make good frisbees after sun-drying a few days.
Sick, I said, sick, you are. No wonder you can't sleep.
Bob
rheanna
06-05-2009, 09:15 AM
Bob,
I'M sick???? This from the man who prefers Moose Droppings to the delicate Rabbit Droppings that I recommended in another thread???
Man, this really IS turning into an animalistic thread!:D
--Rheanna
I'M sick???? This from the man who prefers Moose Droppings to the delicate Rabbit Droppings that I recommended in another thread???
Man, this really IS turning into an animalistic thread!:D
--Rheanna
marisuela
06-05-2009, 11:44 PM
You guys are seriously cracking me up!!! :D
Okay, sleep is one thing I rarely have a problem with. I have found that if I don't take my afternoon adderall, then my brain won't shut up at night and even if I do fall asleep, I think myself awake every 15-20 minutes, all night long! So I make it a point to take that afternoon dose!
I also make sure to get in 30 minutes of exercise at least 3 times a week. Nothing hard, usually I walk on the treadmill and watch tv, or listen to a book on cd..... I don't really enjoy exercise, but if I can do it and watch my favorite shows, it's tolerable! :)
I also almost completely cut out all artificial colors and flavorings, processed foods, and caffeine. I say almost because I do still indulge on occasion, but not that often (frozen almond snickers are my current favorite!).
Give yourself 15-45 minutes each day to de-stress and unwind. I find that beating the crap out of a punching bag can do wonders for lowering your stress levels (it's a good healthy way to exercise too!). I also love going out for a night time swim when I'm somewhere with a pool (also a good way to exercise). Another good tool for de-stressing is keeping a journal. I have a couple of different journals. One is strictly for venting (I usually go back and rip out the pages and throw them in the shredder.... it's quite theraputic, actually....), one is for my children, and the last one is my feelings about losing my Dad to cancer almost two years ago.
Watching tv relaxes me too. I have my favorite shows on certain nights of the week, and after I get my kids in bed, and deal with the last minute housework (dinner dishes and such), I watch my shows.
Last thing.... learn to let go of things. One thing I learned a long time ago was that obsessing over things that I can't control, won't change anything, and it will just make me miserable. Things that happened in the past are especially high on the list of things to let go of. If it's in your power to fix it, then by all means, fix it.... but if it can't be fixed, then learn from it and let it go.
Oh, one more last thing.... a bath or a shower before bed is actually said to be proven to help your body relax enough to fall asleep. I just watched or read something about it a few days ago. Something about your body's internal temperature being cooler helps your body fall asleep faster.
Oh crap.... another last thing I just thought of.... on days when I really can't sleep, I go to my church website (I am LDS) and pull up a "General Conference" talk, which is a talk given by one of the church leaders, and I listen to it.... I'm usually out in no time! I know it's awful, but for some reason, those talks just make me so relaxed and sleepy! Listening to the scriptures on cd knocks me out too! (*in my defense, if I read it myself, I stay awake easily....)
Okay, this ended up a bit longer than I had intended.... but it's because it's all the advice I give my mom when she can't sleep (which is all the time!!!). Hopefully something here can help! :)
Oh! Bob, I get that afternoon crash too! Not daily, but a couple of times a week.... that's my huge neon sign that I've forgotten to take my afternoon dose!!! :D
Okay, sleep is one thing I rarely have a problem with. I have found that if I don't take my afternoon adderall, then my brain won't shut up at night and even if I do fall asleep, I think myself awake every 15-20 minutes, all night long! So I make it a point to take that afternoon dose!
I also make sure to get in 30 minutes of exercise at least 3 times a week. Nothing hard, usually I walk on the treadmill and watch tv, or listen to a book on cd..... I don't really enjoy exercise, but if I can do it and watch my favorite shows, it's tolerable! :)
I also almost completely cut out all artificial colors and flavorings, processed foods, and caffeine. I say almost because I do still indulge on occasion, but not that often (frozen almond snickers are my current favorite!).
Give yourself 15-45 minutes each day to de-stress and unwind. I find that beating the crap out of a punching bag can do wonders for lowering your stress levels (it's a good healthy way to exercise too!). I also love going out for a night time swim when I'm somewhere with a pool (also a good way to exercise). Another good tool for de-stressing is keeping a journal. I have a couple of different journals. One is strictly for venting (I usually go back and rip out the pages and throw them in the shredder.... it's quite theraputic, actually....), one is for my children, and the last one is my feelings about losing my Dad to cancer almost two years ago.
Watching tv relaxes me too. I have my favorite shows on certain nights of the week, and after I get my kids in bed, and deal with the last minute housework (dinner dishes and such), I watch my shows.
Last thing.... learn to let go of things. One thing I learned a long time ago was that obsessing over things that I can't control, won't change anything, and it will just make me miserable. Things that happened in the past are especially high on the list of things to let go of. If it's in your power to fix it, then by all means, fix it.... but if it can't be fixed, then learn from it and let it go.
Oh, one more last thing.... a bath or a shower before bed is actually said to be proven to help your body relax enough to fall asleep. I just watched or read something about it a few days ago. Something about your body's internal temperature being cooler helps your body fall asleep faster.
Oh crap.... another last thing I just thought of.... on days when I really can't sleep, I go to my church website (I am LDS) and pull up a "General Conference" talk, which is a talk given by one of the church leaders, and I listen to it.... I'm usually out in no time! I know it's awful, but for some reason, those talks just make me so relaxed and sleepy! Listening to the scriptures on cd knocks me out too! (*in my defense, if I read it myself, I stay awake easily....)
Okay, this ended up a bit longer than I had intended.... but it's because it's all the advice I give my mom when she can't sleep (which is all the time!!!). Hopefully something here can help! :)
Oh! Bob, I get that afternoon crash too! Not daily, but a couple of times a week.... that's my huge neon sign that I've forgotten to take my afternoon dose!!! :D
janewhite1
06-07-2009, 02:58 AM
Oh crap.... another last thing I just thought of.... on days when I really can't sleep, I go to my church website (I am LDS) and pull up a "General Conference" talk, which is a talk given by one of the church leaders, and I listen to it.... I'm usually out in no time! I know it's awful, but for some reason, those talks just make me so relaxed and sleepy! Listening to the scriptures on cd knocks me out too! (*in my defense, if I read it myself, I stay awake easily....)
Now, that gives me an idea. All of my father's older relatives are Russian, and I find a certain type of Russian accent to be seriously hypnotic. Like being rocked to sleep, safe in my grandmother's arms. This was somewhat inconvenient in certain college classes, but now I think I could take advantage.
I need to find some recordings of older people with Russian accents. I don't care what they're talking about, but I seriously think this could work.
Now, that gives me an idea. All of my father's older relatives are Russian, and I find a certain type of Russian accent to be seriously hypnotic. Like being rocked to sleep, safe in my grandmother's arms. This was somewhat inconvenient in certain college classes, but now I think I could take advantage.
I need to find some recordings of older people with Russian accents. I don't care what they're talking about, but I seriously think this could work.
index.html
06-07-2009, 01:46 PM
Great thread! I had no idea that so many of you have trouble sleeping, too. I thought I was alone in this. Like Jane, sleep has been a major issue all of my life. As far back as I can remember - age 6 or 7 - I'd lay awake for hours.
I will be going for a sleep study soon so I'll let you know how it goes, Bob. I've avoided it for years but I've gotta do it. Now, in addition to not being able to go to sleep, when I do sleep I snore terribly. I don't think there's much doubt that I have sleep apnea. So, I'm gonna 'bite the bullet' and do it.
I will be going for a sleep study soon so I'll let you know how it goes, Bob. I've avoided it for years but I've gotta do it. Now, in addition to not being able to go to sleep, when I do sleep I snore terribly. I don't think there's much doubt that I have sleep apnea. So, I'm gonna 'bite the bullet' and do it.
addprogrammer
06-07-2009, 02:39 PM
Marisuela,
I had my first popcorn with deer droppings. Yummy.
Rheanna,
I added "delicate" rabbit droppings - chocolate jimmies. Even more yummy.
Jane, why? Couldn't Granny show up at class?
Index,
Thanks for removing the "in" from the "sane" this post. Tell us how goes with the sleep thing. In meantime I have a fix: "Laughter is the best medicine." This thread has been one gut splitter after another. Works.
Bob
PS Warning: Edy's Slow Churn is Schedule II. Not be used without adequate supervision. Prescribe sparingly. Dang near lost it one evening. Saved by the boss-lady.
I had my first popcorn with deer droppings. Yummy.
Rheanna,
I added "delicate" rabbit droppings - chocolate jimmies. Even more yummy.
Jane, why? Couldn't Granny show up at class?
Index,
Thanks for removing the "in" from the "sane" this post. Tell us how goes with the sleep thing. In meantime I have a fix: "Laughter is the best medicine." This thread has been one gut splitter after another. Works.
Bob
PS Warning: Edy's Slow Churn is Schedule II. Not be used without adequate supervision. Prescribe sparingly. Dang near lost it one evening. Saved by the boss-lady.
janewhite1
06-07-2009, 07:46 PM
Bob: My reaction to certain accents was unfortunate in college when I had professors with those particular accents. Bad enough trying to follow a complicated lecture with the normal butterflies in my head, when the professor's voice is simultaneously putting me to sleep, it's near impossible.
Rheanna: When baby animals hiss at you, it's adorable. When they hiss at you from concealment 6 inches away from your ear (as in you had no idea it was there) it's a wee bit startling.
I find that screen time (computer or TV) before bed is usually a bad idea. Please note the time stamps on some of my posts to see how religiously I fail to follow that rule!
Showering is good, partly because it relaxes me and partly because it eases my backaches, which tend to be barely noticeable during the day but leap to the forefront once I stop doing things.
Rheanna: When baby animals hiss at you, it's adorable. When they hiss at you from concealment 6 inches away from your ear (as in you had no idea it was there) it's a wee bit startling.
I find that screen time (computer or TV) before bed is usually a bad idea. Please note the time stamps on some of my posts to see how religiously I fail to follow that rule!
Showering is good, partly because it relaxes me and partly because it eases my backaches, which tend to be barely noticeable during the day but leap to the forefront once I stop doing things.
greencandy
09-13-2009, 08:37 PM
Hello Jane and all of you, I wanted to say thank you for your advice last year. Jane, Thunor, Bob, index.html, and himmylover, your input was valuable at a time when I really needed it.
On sleep:
My background - I was always a night owl, pretty much from birth. I was staying up all night by age 9 because I would get interested in something and not realize the time passing because I wouldn't get sleepy. For the first 36 years of my life, I thought that going to sleep was the same thing as passing out from exhaustion, which was why I frequently stayed up all night, I'd just catch up the next night. I resisted sleep like a preschooler refusing a nap because I had this unrealized belief that I couldn’t go to sleep until I had used up every bit of whatever energy I had, on whatever thing needed to be done that I could still do before calling it a day. I also had a problem of waking up in the night and not being able to go back to sleep. Some thought would occur and then my brain would activate and then even if I was really tired I still couldn’t go back to sleep. I would usually just get up and figured I could catch up the next night.
However, when I decided to go back to college the insomnia became an issue. Anxiety about tests etc. just added to it and staying up to study more had diminishing returns once sheer exhaustion started interfering with test results. I tried all sorts of things to go to sleep at night so I could have productive days, including meditation, exercise, foods, herbs, sleeping pills, hot baths, antidepressants, booze, bedtime rituals. What I didn’t know and what prevented any of that from working, was how to turn myself off and go to sleep when I wasn’t actually tired or sleepy enough to really want to.
Then I learned how to overcome my bad habit of insomnia. Now I can go to sleep almost whenever I want to, whether at night or for a nap in daytime. I signed up for a workshop run by a professor at SMU in Dallas. He ran a Cognitive Behavioral Therapy program and offered several workshops on different issues. The overcoming habits workshop was very simple and I had really doubted it would work on me.
Each night I would write down every single thing that was keeping me awake at the time. Over time I learned to recognize, remember, and avoid things I knew would keep me awake, like TV or chocolate or specific worries. I put an extra lock on the door so anxiety about burglars would stop being an issue. I made the room dim and quiet at bedtime, and used a fan for white noise to mask sounds. Every thought that would pop into my head and give me that feeling of alertness, I would write in a notebook by the bed and make an appointment with myself to revisit the thought when I got up in the morning. Tasks I had forgotten and other compelling reasons to get up, I would write in the notebook and reset the alarm for a few minutes earlier to do it in the morning. Problems I could not solve that night, I would deliberately decide to wait to worry about until the morning. The biggest change was making my bed ONLY for sleeping, instead of for reading, chatting on phone, etc. Then I also learned to pay attention to the immediate moment and physical being, like after writing down the stimulating thought I would deliberately focus on how the pillow felt, how my body felt, and pay attention to my breathing in and out. Each time my mind would jump to something I would take a deep breath and refocus on the breathing deeper and slower all the time. I would notice how my muscles felt as they were relaxing. Getting as comfortable as possible became my single-minded goal while I was trying to fall asleep.
I know it sounds too simple to work but it is like a miracle that I can make myself go to sleep at all. From taking two hours or more to go to sleep, I can now fall asleep in less than ten minutes. I think the reason such a simple procedure actually works is that instead of a quick fix, you are actually the one in charge of the process, and the only one who can really identify all the subtle and unique reasons the environment and your own brain won’t let you fall asleep. The notebook allows you to give yourself permission to deal with intrusive thoughts tomorrow, eliminating the guilt that can drive sleep resistance. I think it creates actual permanent change in how you approach sleep, mentally. It was a lot of work and didn’t happen overnight but was definitely worth the trouble. Maybe for insomnia caused by a medical problem this wouldn’t be enough, but I really hope that this method helps you guys overcome insomnia too.
On sleep:
My background - I was always a night owl, pretty much from birth. I was staying up all night by age 9 because I would get interested in something and not realize the time passing because I wouldn't get sleepy. For the first 36 years of my life, I thought that going to sleep was the same thing as passing out from exhaustion, which was why I frequently stayed up all night, I'd just catch up the next night. I resisted sleep like a preschooler refusing a nap because I had this unrealized belief that I couldn’t go to sleep until I had used up every bit of whatever energy I had, on whatever thing needed to be done that I could still do before calling it a day. I also had a problem of waking up in the night and not being able to go back to sleep. Some thought would occur and then my brain would activate and then even if I was really tired I still couldn’t go back to sleep. I would usually just get up and figured I could catch up the next night.
However, when I decided to go back to college the insomnia became an issue. Anxiety about tests etc. just added to it and staying up to study more had diminishing returns once sheer exhaustion started interfering with test results. I tried all sorts of things to go to sleep at night so I could have productive days, including meditation, exercise, foods, herbs, sleeping pills, hot baths, antidepressants, booze, bedtime rituals. What I didn’t know and what prevented any of that from working, was how to turn myself off and go to sleep when I wasn’t actually tired or sleepy enough to really want to.
Then I learned how to overcome my bad habit of insomnia. Now I can go to sleep almost whenever I want to, whether at night or for a nap in daytime. I signed up for a workshop run by a professor at SMU in Dallas. He ran a Cognitive Behavioral Therapy program and offered several workshops on different issues. The overcoming habits workshop was very simple and I had really doubted it would work on me.
Each night I would write down every single thing that was keeping me awake at the time. Over time I learned to recognize, remember, and avoid things I knew would keep me awake, like TV or chocolate or specific worries. I put an extra lock on the door so anxiety about burglars would stop being an issue. I made the room dim and quiet at bedtime, and used a fan for white noise to mask sounds. Every thought that would pop into my head and give me that feeling of alertness, I would write in a notebook by the bed and make an appointment with myself to revisit the thought when I got up in the morning. Tasks I had forgotten and other compelling reasons to get up, I would write in the notebook and reset the alarm for a few minutes earlier to do it in the morning. Problems I could not solve that night, I would deliberately decide to wait to worry about until the morning. The biggest change was making my bed ONLY for sleeping, instead of for reading, chatting on phone, etc. Then I also learned to pay attention to the immediate moment and physical being, like after writing down the stimulating thought I would deliberately focus on how the pillow felt, how my body felt, and pay attention to my breathing in and out. Each time my mind would jump to something I would take a deep breath and refocus on the breathing deeper and slower all the time. I would notice how my muscles felt as they were relaxing. Getting as comfortable as possible became my single-minded goal while I was trying to fall asleep.
I know it sounds too simple to work but it is like a miracle that I can make myself go to sleep at all. From taking two hours or more to go to sleep, I can now fall asleep in less than ten minutes. I think the reason such a simple procedure actually works is that instead of a quick fix, you are actually the one in charge of the process, and the only one who can really identify all the subtle and unique reasons the environment and your own brain won’t let you fall asleep. The notebook allows you to give yourself permission to deal with intrusive thoughts tomorrow, eliminating the guilt that can drive sleep resistance. I think it creates actual permanent change in how you approach sleep, mentally. It was a lot of work and didn’t happen overnight but was definitely worth the trouble. Maybe for insomnia caused by a medical problem this wouldn’t be enough, but I really hope that this method helps you guys overcome insomnia too.
addprogrammer
09-14-2009, 11:44 AM
greencandy,
Thank you. I'll begin this PM.
My bedtime thoughts are like little drops of moisture uneventful until they begin coalescing into that relentless torrent of sleepless agitation. Total exhaustation, my only recourse, has become totally exhausting. Your plan has all the earmarks of a workable solution ... including the "lot of work and didn't happen overnight" facet.
Tonight: Session 1 of ?
Bob
Thank you. I'll begin this PM.
My bedtime thoughts are like little drops of moisture uneventful until they begin coalescing into that relentless torrent of sleepless agitation. Total exhaustation, my only recourse, has become totally exhausting. Your plan has all the earmarks of a workable solution ... including the "lot of work and didn't happen overnight" facet.
Tonight: Session 1 of ?
Bob