neveragain444
05-31-2009, 07:44 AM
I had a really bad day yesterday, pain in my cheeks/neck, headache all day. Then it got worse so I took 15mg ambien and went to bed, layed down & it got even worse, so I took another 15mg of ambien. I'm only supposed to take 10mg. Well then I get to the point that I am screeming bloody murder (in pain), I rub on the temples on my forehead and start gagging. Immediately take another 20mg of ambien and then started vomitting something terribly. And about 15 min later, am finally able to doze off. Still having all that pain this morning + some jaw pain.
I can't figure out if I puked because of a migrane or because of the pills. It isn't the first time though, I used too many sleeping pills for pain relief and it never made me sick like that. But I have had migranes before that made me vomit.
Could this be two separate problems that happen to be occuring at the same time or will TMJ cause migranes? Or will migranes cause facial pain similar to TMJ?
This has me a little confused with what medications I should ask for tomorrow when I go to my doctor. It's the headaches of the pain I can't handle and end up doing something stupid like last night. When it hits severe mode, it always comes with a severe headache & occurs 3-5 times a month. It's not every day I suffer that bad, though the pain is pretty much there all the time.
I can't figure out if I puked because of a migrane or because of the pills. It isn't the first time though, I used too many sleeping pills for pain relief and it never made me sick like that. But I have had migranes before that made me vomit.
Could this be two separate problems that happen to be occuring at the same time or will TMJ cause migranes? Or will migranes cause facial pain similar to TMJ?
This has me a little confused with what medications I should ask for tomorrow when I go to my doctor. It's the headaches of the pain I can't handle and end up doing something stupid like last night. When it hits severe mode, it always comes with a severe headache & occurs 3-5 times a month. It's not every day I suffer that bad, though the pain is pretty much there all the time.
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Thelma-Louise
05-31-2009, 10:53 AM
Migraines are a very common symptom of tmj, a changing or shifting bite or mispositioned jaw but can also be due to other causes such as hormonal imbalances or fluctuations, dietary issues, stress, etc which result in vascular constriction of blood flow. It may not be an easy task to determine what is triggering your migraine so you may have to take a scienctific approach to figuring out what is causing yours by trying diff things and seeing what helps and what does not.
I had migraines for 3-5 years after my braces were removed - nothing would help except taking 6 Anacin (it contains caffiene) and sleeping under covers for 10 hrs - I think inhaling my own carbon helped for some reason - like when they tell you to inhale and exhale in a paper bag to help with fainting and adrenaline rushes - the carbon that builds up in the paper bag and is inhaled and exhaled over and over heps opens the "blood" and changes your oxgen level. I would vomit with pain too but usually only if the Anacin didn't have an affect within a couple hours. When my tmj started (20 yrs after the braces) the pain was just as intense and the vomitting returned but now this pain was 24/7 so I basically was vomitting every other day or so and ended up losing a lot of weight. I don't recall my migraines causing or starting with facial pain - they would start at the base of my head or neck and then expand around my forehead and feel like someone beating me with a sledge hammer - but at full throttle my whole head, face, eyes, ears and under my chin would hurt, I couldn't open my eyes and all noise sounded like it was amplified 10 fold.
Taking something to sleep is really not the answer unless you feel you need to sleep to help the migraines ease up. They do have meds that supposedly help with migraines (ususally low dose heart meds) that help keep the blood pumping at a normal rate by opening up the vascular pathways - and newer drugs have come out that address the issue differently.
I'm sorry I can not recall your previous posts at this moment but are you getting other tmj symptoms even when the migraines are not present? Are you going to your medical dr or dentist for the meds?
I had migraines for 3-5 years after my braces were removed - nothing would help except taking 6 Anacin (it contains caffiene) and sleeping under covers for 10 hrs - I think inhaling my own carbon helped for some reason - like when they tell you to inhale and exhale in a paper bag to help with fainting and adrenaline rushes - the carbon that builds up in the paper bag and is inhaled and exhaled over and over heps opens the "blood" and changes your oxgen level. I would vomit with pain too but usually only if the Anacin didn't have an affect within a couple hours. When my tmj started (20 yrs after the braces) the pain was just as intense and the vomitting returned but now this pain was 24/7 so I basically was vomitting every other day or so and ended up losing a lot of weight. I don't recall my migraines causing or starting with facial pain - they would start at the base of my head or neck and then expand around my forehead and feel like someone beating me with a sledge hammer - but at full throttle my whole head, face, eyes, ears and under my chin would hurt, I couldn't open my eyes and all noise sounded like it was amplified 10 fold.
Taking something to sleep is really not the answer unless you feel you need to sleep to help the migraines ease up. They do have meds that supposedly help with migraines (ususally low dose heart meds) that help keep the blood pumping at a normal rate by opening up the vascular pathways - and newer drugs have come out that address the issue differently.
I'm sorry I can not recall your previous posts at this moment but are you getting other tmj symptoms even when the migraines are not present? Are you going to your medical dr or dentist for the meds?
rondapearl
05-31-2009, 11:17 AM
Have you ever had an MRI? I had "migranes" + jaw and ear problems and I had an MRI for facial numbness when I would wake up in the morning. The MRI showed that I have Arnold Chiari Malformation so I had suboccipital decompression surgery at University of Michigan Hospital and the headaches are now gone, but I still have jaw and ear problems.
neveragain444
05-31-2009, 11:52 AM
I am sensitive to light now and definetly noise when my head hurts. It hurts in my temples and across my forehead and down into my eyes, even my nasal bone starts hurting.
My dentist told me if I needed a muscle relaxant anymore, to go to my PCP. Well he's had me on Darvocet & Ibuprofen the past 3 months and it hasn't helped. I also have bruxism and in no doubt have the mouth problems. I don't think the headaches could be the cause of my facial pain, really. It's starts as facial pain before the headaches occur. I sometimes can't open my mouth without extreme pain, my teeth hurt when I chew on food. My jaws click. But I had no idea TMJ could cause migrane headaches. So, at least I know why they are occuring.
I don't know what's setting off the TMJ, except one of my dentists pulled out about all of my teeth on the left side of my mouth and I only have one side I can chew on. Plus I have PDL enlargements on the side I chew on now. Too much pressure, maybe? My teeth were recently grinded down to improve my bite & I'm getting partials to make up for the lost teeth. This dentist recommended another splint but I don't have the $$ right now. I have knocked my chin really hard with something before and it seems a little off center when I smile, I don't know if that caused a problem. For some reason, it feels like the muscles where the dentist poked me with needles flare in sharp shooting pain. I don't know if that procedure can be hurtful, cause a problem, or not? Of course, my jaws hurt but when the pain is extreme, it's in my muscles.
I am going to the doctor tomorrow. Maybe I will ask for TMJ meds & migrane medications both. I need the migrane medication the most, but if you don't treat the cause, it'll just keep recurring, right?
No I don't take the sleeping pills for pain relief, except in the fact that I know they will make me pass out and go to sleep because I cannot take the pain. Bad way of dealing with it, I know. It was either/or go to the ER and I was too sick to get cleaned up.
My dentist told me if I needed a muscle relaxant anymore, to go to my PCP. Well he's had me on Darvocet & Ibuprofen the past 3 months and it hasn't helped. I also have bruxism and in no doubt have the mouth problems. I don't think the headaches could be the cause of my facial pain, really. It's starts as facial pain before the headaches occur. I sometimes can't open my mouth without extreme pain, my teeth hurt when I chew on food. My jaws click. But I had no idea TMJ could cause migrane headaches. So, at least I know why they are occuring.
I don't know what's setting off the TMJ, except one of my dentists pulled out about all of my teeth on the left side of my mouth and I only have one side I can chew on. Plus I have PDL enlargements on the side I chew on now. Too much pressure, maybe? My teeth were recently grinded down to improve my bite & I'm getting partials to make up for the lost teeth. This dentist recommended another splint but I don't have the $$ right now. I have knocked my chin really hard with something before and it seems a little off center when I smile, I don't know if that caused a problem. For some reason, it feels like the muscles where the dentist poked me with needles flare in sharp shooting pain. I don't know if that procedure can be hurtful, cause a problem, or not? Of course, my jaws hurt but when the pain is extreme, it's in my muscles.
I am going to the doctor tomorrow. Maybe I will ask for TMJ meds & migrane medications both. I need the migrane medication the most, but if you don't treat the cause, it'll just keep recurring, right?
No I don't take the sleeping pills for pain relief, except in the fact that I know they will make me pass out and go to sleep because I cannot take the pain. Bad way of dealing with it, I know. It was either/or go to the ER and I was too sick to get cleaned up.
neveragain444
05-31-2009, 11:57 AM
Have you ever had an MRI? I had "migranes" + jaw and ear problems and I had an MRI for facial numbness when I would wake up in the morning. The MRI showed that I have Arnold Chiari Malformation so I had suboccipital decompression surgery at University of Michigan Hospital and the headaches are now gone, but I still have jaw and ear problems.
I've had an MRI on my brain before (normal, believe it or not), :dizzy: would it be helpful to have one on my jaw muscles?
I've had an MRI on my brain before (normal, believe it or not), :dizzy: would it be helpful to have one on my jaw muscles?
rondapearl
05-31-2009, 12:47 PM
How long ago was the MRI? and if not too long ago have someone else read it. And have them specifically check for Arnold Chiari Malformation. It is very easily missed by older MRI machines and easily missed readings by radiologist. Tell your doctor you want another reading on your MRI and have them check for the Arnold Chiari Malformation. If they only did your brain they may not have seen it. The Arnold Chiari Malformation is found at your C-Spine.
check out this post... has some good info on it.
http://www.healthboards.com/boards/showthread.php?p=3999564#post3999564
check out this post... has some good info on it.
http://www.healthboards.com/boards/showthread.php?p=3999564#post3999564
neveragain444
05-31-2009, 01:39 PM
Hard to say, maybe 6 years ago or longer. It's been awhile. I also had a full MRI on my spine, back when my organs were prolapsed and didn't know that was causing my back pain. And that's been probably 5 yrs or so. The tests were normal except for some degeneration in my lower spine.
Even though it was a MRI on my brain, I'm sure it would have shown my cervical spine.. The test was ordered by a neurologist.
This is genetic from what I read. The things that run in my family are cerebral brain atrophy, aneurisms, and brain cancer.
But I think my little pee brain is perfectly fine. I'm not concerned about being genetically cursed with something, nor want to get that way. I'd probably just worry myself sick over nothing.
OMG I have a squirrel running loose in my house thanks to my stupid cat. It just went by my feet. EWWWWWWWWWWWWWWW. She's going to need the MRI by the time I get done with her!
Even though it was a MRI on my brain, I'm sure it would have shown my cervical spine.. The test was ordered by a neurologist.
This is genetic from what I read. The things that run in my family are cerebral brain atrophy, aneurisms, and brain cancer.
But I think my little pee brain is perfectly fine. I'm not concerned about being genetically cursed with something, nor want to get that way. I'd probably just worry myself sick over nothing.
OMG I have a squirrel running loose in my house thanks to my stupid cat. It just went by my feet. EWWWWWWWWWWWWWWW. She's going to need the MRI by the time I get done with her!
Thelma-Louise
05-31-2009, 11:12 PM
LOL My sister refers to her house as Wild Kingdom - she comes home to rabbits and chipmunks running around the house and birds flying around her A-frame ceiling beams thanks to 2 very active cats.
MRIs of the brain, c-spine, spine and jaws (mandible and maxilla) are all diff tests. I had the brain, c-spine and jaws done. They did the brain and c-spine during one appt and the jaws on another appt. But I got written test results and films for all 3 tests.
If you are going to your PCP, the most common scripts or meds for tmj are flexeril, neurontin and baclofen, amitryptiline - they are muscle relaxants. Certain antidepressants may have the same affect like triavil or elavil - but some anti-depressants can casue or induce further clenching or grinding so sometimes they are not always helpful.
It could be a lot of your problem is due to the missing teeth on the one side and this will ease up once you replace thsoe teeth. The other issue could be that grinding down your remaining teeth to even out the bite lowered your vertical dimension which is pushing pressure on the joints. Have you tried using an OTC nightguard - the kind you soak in water and mold to your teeth/jaw - it may help even out and raise your bite when you are laying down and that may help alleviate the migraines.
MRIs of the brain, c-spine, spine and jaws (mandible and maxilla) are all diff tests. I had the brain, c-spine and jaws done. They did the brain and c-spine during one appt and the jaws on another appt. But I got written test results and films for all 3 tests.
If you are going to your PCP, the most common scripts or meds for tmj are flexeril, neurontin and baclofen, amitryptiline - they are muscle relaxants. Certain antidepressants may have the same affect like triavil or elavil - but some anti-depressants can casue or induce further clenching or grinding so sometimes they are not always helpful.
It could be a lot of your problem is due to the missing teeth on the one side and this will ease up once you replace thsoe teeth. The other issue could be that grinding down your remaining teeth to even out the bite lowered your vertical dimension which is pushing pressure on the joints. Have you tried using an OTC nightguard - the kind you soak in water and mold to your teeth/jaw - it may help even out and raise your bite when you are laying down and that may help alleviate the migraines.
rondapearl
05-31-2009, 11:29 PM
my bite guard causes me more problems. what i dont understand is why my insurance won't cover my "tmjd" they say it is "cosmetic" ??? excuse me? it hurts and i can barely eat! ugh... i am so so sososososo SSSSOOOO tired of going to the doctors.
good luck with the squirrel!!!
good luck with the squirrel!!!
Thelma-Louise
06-01-2009, 02:39 AM
Which insurance - dental or medical? Many dental insurances do not cover tmj/tmd (although some limit it to one time orthodontia only) but medical isnurances may cover the splints and therapies such as chiro, PT acupuncture, etc - and some med ins may even cover dental treatments. If they don't cover tmj/tmd per se then it might be covered under myofacial pain syndrome, cranial pain syndrome, etc - as these are similar conditions which often present similar symptoms and are treated using similar methods. It all depends on knowing what your dental and medical insurance do and do not cover - and under medical insurance, the diagonis and procedure codes they will accept under your plan. All my splints were covered under my medical insurance. And even when a claim has been denied you can always re-submit it or file an appeal within a specified period of time - usually 180 days of a denial or submission of the claim. Again - it depends on your plan.
neveragain444
06-01-2009, 06:20 PM
LOL. That's not funny but then again.... I still have the squirrel so yea I know how she feels. I'm thinking rat trap but that's so mean...
I have medicaid insurance, it will not cover treatment for TMJ or bruxism, it will only cover medications. It will not pay for a splint, the only thing it covers through dental is going to certain dentists, xrays, and having teeth pulled. I'm not sure if it would cover me going to an oral facial surgeon but I think I may try finding out if these new medications don't work. Yea I may get by with treatment for myofacial pain syndrome. Good idea. But it's not going to buy my splint.
Well I got an OTC sports mouth guard, very uncomfortable and unable to use.
So I didn't get exactly what I wanted, except migrane medication (Cephadyn). And I don't think he really wanted to give it to me, cause he said it probably wouldn't work considering it's probably not actually a migraine, though it is actually a migraine, it's just not being caused by my brain. So why wouldn't it help? The way I see it, if I am vomitting and screeming from head pain, it's a headache, no matter why it's occuring.
And he gave me Savella for my fibromyalgia to see if it would help my jaw pain. OMG this is unreal. No, I'm not too happy. I will try it but I will probably live to regret considering it's an antidepressant. They cause muscle tension really bad for me.
I want a doctor who knows how to treat this stuff. I mean, I took 5 ambien saturday night & was vomitting and screeming in pain. How much more do I have to screem to get the help I need.
I have medicaid insurance, it will not cover treatment for TMJ or bruxism, it will only cover medications. It will not pay for a splint, the only thing it covers through dental is going to certain dentists, xrays, and having teeth pulled. I'm not sure if it would cover me going to an oral facial surgeon but I think I may try finding out if these new medications don't work. Yea I may get by with treatment for myofacial pain syndrome. Good idea. But it's not going to buy my splint.
Well I got an OTC sports mouth guard, very uncomfortable and unable to use.
So I didn't get exactly what I wanted, except migrane medication (Cephadyn). And I don't think he really wanted to give it to me, cause he said it probably wouldn't work considering it's probably not actually a migraine, though it is actually a migraine, it's just not being caused by my brain. So why wouldn't it help? The way I see it, if I am vomitting and screeming from head pain, it's a headache, no matter why it's occuring.
And he gave me Savella for my fibromyalgia to see if it would help my jaw pain. OMG this is unreal. No, I'm not too happy. I will try it but I will probably live to regret considering it's an antidepressant. They cause muscle tension really bad for me.
I want a doctor who knows how to treat this stuff. I mean, I took 5 ambien saturday night & was vomitting and screeming in pain. How much more do I have to screem to get the help I need.