justaguydi
10-07-2002, 02:40 AM
I am totally happily married. My wife is a dream come true, We are totally in sync. We are on the same wavelength about everything, not just sexual. We have sex at least once a day. She happily goes along with all my fantasy ideas. She also has her own ideas. We are completeley, truly in love. We make porno movies together, it's such a blast. She satisfies me totally, and I never want to be with anyone else.
I do, however, like to download porn. And take voyueristic pics of women. This upsets her; she says it makes her feel insecure..... Am i wrong?
I do, however, like to download porn. And take voyueristic pics of women. This upsets her; she says it makes her feel insecure..... Am i wrong?
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star508
10-07-2002, 09:42 AM
When you say you like taking voyeristic pics of women...what do you mean?
Greenberry
10-07-2002, 09:53 AM
Seeking a sexual outlet outside of your marriage is always WRONG. I don't mean an occasional "fantasy" (i.e., in your mind) about someone else, I mean downloading dirty pictures and even worse, spying on other women and taking pictures of them (which is a CRIME). And if your wife doesn't like it, it is double wrong, because it hurts her personally in addition to violating your marriage vows. Of course your wife is hurt by it. Your activities make her feel as though she is not enough for you. You are always looking for more, despite everything she does to try to please you. You should consider her feelings and make her feel as though she is the only woman in the world for you, and one way to do that is by staying away from porn and not taking pictures of other women.
nicola76
10-07-2002, 11:00 AM
Greenberry is right on. Continuing to do things that you know upset and hurt your spouse is always wrong. You need to show some consideration for her feelings.
By the way, when you say you take "voyeuristic pictures" of women, do you mean that you're spying on them and photographing them? If so, then that's a crime like Greenberry has said.
By the way, when you say you take "voyeuristic pictures" of women, do you mean that you're spying on them and photographing them? If so, then that's a crime like Greenberry has said.
*hannahstruecolors*
10-07-2002, 12:27 PM
Well... on my opinion and i dont know what he means by the whole taking pictures and he didnt really modify that, but i dont think that downloading porn is wrong. everyone has something different that stimulates their sexual self and if yours happens to be porn sometimes then i dont really see whats wrong with that. Your sex life may be great and really that is fantastic but do either of you still masturbate after or before the daily intercourse session? If she did would you be upset about that?
Greenberry
10-07-2002, 01:11 PM
While waiting to find out exactly what was meant by taking voyeuristic pictures of women, in the meantime I'd like to add that if that consists of what I suspect it might, it is also a good way to get the crap beat of you by someone's angry husband/boyfriend/father/brother/friend. In addition to getting yourself arrested, prosecuted, penalized and permanantly "marked" as a sex offender...
[This message has been edited by Greenberry (edited 10-07-2002).]
[This message has been edited by Greenberry (edited 10-07-2002).]
Blastoff9600
10-07-2002, 02:22 PM
Whoa telling him he is wrong to look at porn other than what he and his wife make!?!?!? And then saying his wife should be the only one who sexually stimulates him!!??? Geez come on open your eyes to the real world.
Granted his wife isnt happy that he does it but that can be worked on and I willa ddress it in a bit.
Now hubby and I also have a great marriage. But we both look at porn. I will have mental images of others(normally movie stars and such) when making love with my hubby. I even go as far as buy porn mags for my hubby. I even encourage him to go to strip clubs. Why do I do these things. Simple I have seen what happens to marriages in which the women try to control their spouse by telling they cant do things like that. Those marriages normally end or they stay together and neither are happy.
Greenberry, would you say masturbation is wrong because it is a sexual outlet that is outside the marriage??? Say a guy is masturbating in the shower thinking of a movie star or such....he is seeking sexual release outside of the marriage..
Men are visually stimulated far more than women are(there are exceptions). Downloading porn isnt as harmful as some make it out. It is no worse than going to the store and buying Playboy. The harmful part is when it becomes an obession and you cant function without it. And I dont see anything in your post suggesting that.
Now for the wife being hurt by the downloading of porn. The feeling of insecurity can be overcome. The women in most pron pics are airbrushed and so on. The actualy picture is so doctored that the real thing barely compares to it. YOur best bet is to just reassure your wife that it has nothing to do with her. It may take some work and you will have to compromise but that is what marriage is about. See if she will help you pic out pictures and such to download. Or if she will help you in taking voyueristic pictures of her. That can be fun if you set things up right....
Just make sure you and your wife talk it out and work out something that works for the both of you.
Granted his wife isnt happy that he does it but that can be worked on and I willa ddress it in a bit.
Now hubby and I also have a great marriage. But we both look at porn. I will have mental images of others(normally movie stars and such) when making love with my hubby. I even go as far as buy porn mags for my hubby. I even encourage him to go to strip clubs. Why do I do these things. Simple I have seen what happens to marriages in which the women try to control their spouse by telling they cant do things like that. Those marriages normally end or they stay together and neither are happy.
Greenberry, would you say masturbation is wrong because it is a sexual outlet that is outside the marriage??? Say a guy is masturbating in the shower thinking of a movie star or such....he is seeking sexual release outside of the marriage..
Men are visually stimulated far more than women are(there are exceptions). Downloading porn isnt as harmful as some make it out. It is no worse than going to the store and buying Playboy. The harmful part is when it becomes an obession and you cant function without it. And I dont see anything in your post suggesting that.
Now for the wife being hurt by the downloading of porn. The feeling of insecurity can be overcome. The women in most pron pics are airbrushed and so on. The actualy picture is so doctored that the real thing barely compares to it. YOur best bet is to just reassure your wife that it has nothing to do with her. It may take some work and you will have to compromise but that is what marriage is about. See if she will help you pic out pictures and such to download. Or if she will help you in taking voyueristic pictures of her. That can be fun if you set things up right....
Just make sure you and your wife talk it out and work out something that works for the both of you.
someguyinhis20s
10-07-2002, 02:58 PM
Originally posted by Blastoff9600:
Greenberry, would you say masturbation is wrong because it is a sexual outlet that is outside the marriage?
Yes, it's cheating. If you're married, then you've promised that each of you will try to fulfill each other's sexual needs. If you're having sex and your spouse isn't involved, that's cheating. It's makes no difference that you're alone.
[This message has been edited by someguyinhis20s (edited 10-07-2002).]
Greenberry, would you say masturbation is wrong because it is a sexual outlet that is outside the marriage?
Yes, it's cheating. If you're married, then you've promised that each of you will try to fulfill each other's sexual needs. If you're having sex and your spouse isn't involved, that's cheating. It's makes no difference that you're alone.
[This message has been edited by someguyinhis20s (edited 10-07-2002).]
kama2080
10-07-2002, 03:51 PM
Originally posted by someguyinhis20s:
Yes, it's cheating. If you're married, then you've promised that each of you will try to fulfill each other's sexual needs. If you're having sex and your spouse isn't involved, that's cheating. It's makes no difference that you're alone.
[This message has been edited by someguyinhis20s (edited 10-07-2002).]
That's a very unrealistic point of view..If I'm not in the mood for sex, I would rather my man masturbate then try to pressure me into sex or worse, go and find it elsewhere. At some point, there is going to be a time when you or your partner wants to have sex and the other does not. What then?
Yes, it's cheating. If you're married, then you've promised that each of you will try to fulfill each other's sexual needs. If you're having sex and your spouse isn't involved, that's cheating. It's makes no difference that you're alone.
[This message has been edited by someguyinhis20s (edited 10-07-2002).]
That's a very unrealistic point of view..If I'm not in the mood for sex, I would rather my man masturbate then try to pressure me into sex or worse, go and find it elsewhere. At some point, there is going to be a time when you or your partner wants to have sex and the other does not. What then?
ana_24
10-07-2002, 03:56 PM
If you're so deliriously happy with your wife and she fulfills your every need, then why are you jeopardizing a wonderful relationship by looking at porn? Some couples make it part of their sex life, others choose not to. The important thing is to respect your wife's wishes. If she feels strongly about this, then what is more important to you, her happiness or looking at porn? Really, you have to get your priorities straight!
Greenberry
10-07-2002, 03:58 PM
Hey, thanks, someguyinhis20's! While I wouldn't personally consider masturbating to be "cheating," it's not exactly a healthy thing to do because it is seeking sexual fulfillment without the involvement of your committed life partner.
Not everyone is as cool as you Blastoff! My eyes ARE open to the "real world", and I for one am sick of the "real world" where everything goes, as long as it feels good and "nobody gets hurt"! You have every right to run your life however you see fit, but I just have to ask, how does looking at pornography improve your marriage? How does sending your husband off to strip clubs help YOUR sex life? Do you feel that it is necessary to tolerate and accept material that degrades women and cheapens the sexual act in order to keep your husband?
Women who are married to real MEN don't have to worry about controlling their spouse, because of the very fact that they are married to real MEN who have learned to control themselves. Don't put all of this back on the wife for being "insecure." Most women would feel insecure being compared to the airbrushed fantasies that are posted on-line or are found in porn magazines.
Not everyone is as cool as you Blastoff! My eyes ARE open to the "real world", and I for one am sick of the "real world" where everything goes, as long as it feels good and "nobody gets hurt"! You have every right to run your life however you see fit, but I just have to ask, how does looking at pornography improve your marriage? How does sending your husband off to strip clubs help YOUR sex life? Do you feel that it is necessary to tolerate and accept material that degrades women and cheapens the sexual act in order to keep your husband?
Women who are married to real MEN don't have to worry about controlling their spouse, because of the very fact that they are married to real MEN who have learned to control themselves. Don't put all of this back on the wife for being "insecure." Most women would feel insecure being compared to the airbrushed fantasies that are posted on-line or are found in porn magazines.
someguyinhis20s
10-07-2002, 04:28 PM
Originally posted by kama2080:
That's a very unrealistic point of view..If I'm not in the mood for sex, I would rather my man masturbate then try to pressure me into sex or worse, go and find it elsewhere. At some point, there is going to be a time when you or your partner wants to have sex and the other does not. What then?
What do you do if you want to go out to eat and your spouse doesn't? One of you wins. It's the same thing with sex. If my wife's not in the mood and I am, then I wait until she is. Commitment takes discipline. The people who cheat are the ones who can't exercise self-control.
That's a very unrealistic point of view..If I'm not in the mood for sex, I would rather my man masturbate then try to pressure me into sex or worse, go and find it elsewhere. At some point, there is going to be a time when you or your partner wants to have sex and the other does not. What then?
What do you do if you want to go out to eat and your spouse doesn't? One of you wins. It's the same thing with sex. If my wife's not in the mood and I am, then I wait until she is. Commitment takes discipline. The people who cheat are the ones who can't exercise self-control.
Blastoff9600
10-07-2002, 05:14 PM
I never said it improved my marriage but it sure hasnt hurt it. Actually now that I think of it porn has had some benefits. By watching it together we can see how some positons are done instead of looking at a picture and hoping to get it right. So there it has added spice by giving new ideas.
As for the strip club thing,it adds a bit of spice,he comes home reved up and I get the benefits of that. Though he doesnt go that often he says it doesnt interest him as much as I interest him. Kind of an ego boost there. LOL
I dont see porn as degrading nor do I see it as cheapening the act of sex. I dont have to do these things to keep my hubby. It is something I brought up after we got married. I surprised him with subscription to Playboy for x-mas. So porn being in our house was my choice. I was raised that it wasnt a bad thing. Heck I remember as a kid finding porn mags in my grandparents bathroom. Years later I asked my grandma about it and she said they both enjoyed looking and reading them.
I cant beleive someone beleives masturbating is cheating....man oh man you must never be away from you partner. A person shouldnt be expected to hold everything in because their partner is unavailable. That is just plain silly and can cause undue stress on the body. My hubby is in the Air Force so he is gone quite a bit. Well we both masturbate when away from each other. Matter of fact it is good for men to masturbate because it keeps the sperm fresh. I know funny thing to bring up but for those that have ever had to go through infertility you learn a bit. Guys that masturbate tend to have better control for sex and better sperm quality. This is going to sound cold but Someguyinhis20's I hope you never have to give a semen sample because low and behold you have to masturbate for that. And with your strict beliefs it will be an interesting experience for you.
Anyway masturbating is in no way cheating. I am very committed to my hubby and have been throughout our marriage. Masturbating just helps get through the times he isnt here or he is too tired. Also great stress reliever.
Also I never said everything goes just a realist when it comes to how men and women differ in so many things in our world.
As for the strip club thing,it adds a bit of spice,he comes home reved up and I get the benefits of that. Though he doesnt go that often he says it doesnt interest him as much as I interest him. Kind of an ego boost there. LOL
I dont see porn as degrading nor do I see it as cheapening the act of sex. I dont have to do these things to keep my hubby. It is something I brought up after we got married. I surprised him with subscription to Playboy for x-mas. So porn being in our house was my choice. I was raised that it wasnt a bad thing. Heck I remember as a kid finding porn mags in my grandparents bathroom. Years later I asked my grandma about it and she said they both enjoyed looking and reading them.
I cant beleive someone beleives masturbating is cheating....man oh man you must never be away from you partner. A person shouldnt be expected to hold everything in because their partner is unavailable. That is just plain silly and can cause undue stress on the body. My hubby is in the Air Force so he is gone quite a bit. Well we both masturbate when away from each other. Matter of fact it is good for men to masturbate because it keeps the sperm fresh. I know funny thing to bring up but for those that have ever had to go through infertility you learn a bit. Guys that masturbate tend to have better control for sex and better sperm quality. This is going to sound cold but Someguyinhis20's I hope you never have to give a semen sample because low and behold you have to masturbate for that. And with your strict beliefs it will be an interesting experience for you.
Anyway masturbating is in no way cheating. I am very committed to my hubby and have been throughout our marriage. Masturbating just helps get through the times he isnt here or he is too tired. Also great stress reliever.
Also I never said everything goes just a realist when it comes to how men and women differ in so many things in our world.
someguyinhis20s
10-07-2002, 06:21 PM
First of all, the stress reliever argument is a weak one since you can use it to justify anything. Second, whether a person is cheating is more about intent than what they actually do. If I go to a fertility clinic and have to give a semen sample, then the main purpose of me masturbating isn't to get sexual pleasure. It's just a bonus. But if I'm married and I decide that even though my wife's available, I'd rather have sex with myself, than I am cheating. Now in a special case where my wife is away on a business trip, then I suppose I could masturbate. Whether I'm cheating depends on what I'm thinking of. If I'm imagining being with her, that's fine. But if my wife is away and I start thinking of someone else, then that is a form of cheating cause you're basically wanting to have sex with someone other than your spouse.
Phaycops
10-07-2002, 11:22 PM
Woah. Greenberry, and whoever else thinks you should never think of anyone besides your spouse:
If you really think that your partner should never be excited by anyone but you and should never ever seek sexual release "outside" of the relationship, then you're just not being realistic. What, is your partner expected to be isolated from all outside ideas and images? Do you and your romantic partner live under rocks that you don't see images of other people and get turned on by them? Do you really, truly, honestly think that even if they say they are, that your parnter isn't thinking about someone else? Or masturbating? Gahd, you sound just like you're out of "1984" or something. Trying to control your partners thoughts is entirely, truly, without qualification, grounds for ending the relationship. And that's what you're advocating by saying they should never be excited or turned on by anything but you. Next thing you'll be telling them how to dress and what friends they can have and how often they can see their own mothers. It's also selfish. I'm sure you have fantasies and masturbate, but I just bet you somehow justify that.
Oh, and for the record, that "anything goes" mentality Greenberry mentioned? That's called, oh what is the word? Oh, yeah, freedom, I knew it was something like that. Guess what? Nobody but me gets to say what I do, and if "nobody's getting hurt" then who the heck cares?
And you know what else? I think Greenberry in particular is being hypocritical. It really bugs me when people say things like "I think it's wrong that people are gay/experiment with bondage/look at porn" and then say something completely inane like "But you can live your life however you see fit." It's like saying "No offense," and then following it with something incredibly rude. Nope, doens't count.
If you really think that your partner should never be excited by anyone but you and should never ever seek sexual release "outside" of the relationship, then you're just not being realistic. What, is your partner expected to be isolated from all outside ideas and images? Do you and your romantic partner live under rocks that you don't see images of other people and get turned on by them? Do you really, truly, honestly think that even if they say they are, that your parnter isn't thinking about someone else? Or masturbating? Gahd, you sound just like you're out of "1984" or something. Trying to control your partners thoughts is entirely, truly, without qualification, grounds for ending the relationship. And that's what you're advocating by saying they should never be excited or turned on by anything but you. Next thing you'll be telling them how to dress and what friends they can have and how often they can see their own mothers. It's also selfish. I'm sure you have fantasies and masturbate, but I just bet you somehow justify that.
Oh, and for the record, that "anything goes" mentality Greenberry mentioned? That's called, oh what is the word? Oh, yeah, freedom, I knew it was something like that. Guess what? Nobody but me gets to say what I do, and if "nobody's getting hurt" then who the heck cares?
And you know what else? I think Greenberry in particular is being hypocritical. It really bugs me when people say things like "I think it's wrong that people are gay/experiment with bondage/look at porn" and then say something completely inane like "But you can live your life however you see fit." It's like saying "No offense," and then following it with something incredibly rude. Nope, doens't count.
wattagirl
10-07-2002, 11:28 PM
someguy-you said commitment takes discipline-so if your wife is away on a business trip then you should discipline yourself to wait until she gets back-say your wife has a child and can't have sex for 6wks-should you hold off for that long or what-just wondering-
Greenberry
10-07-2002, 11:48 PM
Phaycops, please re-read my post! Of course, occasional thoughts cross people's minds. I am not talking about that. I am talking about people who make an effort to get on the computer, find pornography and look at it, even when their wife, who they proclaim to love passionately, objects to such activities.
This IS America, and people are free to do whatever they want to do as long as it is legal. That concept leads to the fact that I am free to think that some things some people do are WRONG. What is so hypocritical about thinking someone is engaging is an activity that is wrong, even while acknowledging that they are free to continue doing that activity?
[This message has been edited by Greenberry (edited 10-07-2002).]
This IS America, and people are free to do whatever they want to do as long as it is legal. That concept leads to the fact that I am free to think that some things some people do are WRONG. What is so hypocritical about thinking someone is engaging is an activity that is wrong, even while acknowledging that they are free to continue doing that activity?
[This message has been edited by Greenberry (edited 10-07-2002).]
justaguydi
10-08-2002, 01:51 AM
Ok,
Let me get a few facts straight.
My wife doesn't object to porn we watch together, she doesn't understand why I would watch it on my own.
I'm not downloading pictures. I'm downloading videos. I have a pretty nice porn collection.
I like taking pictures of women's asses. I like doing "stealth" work.
I have a HUGE collection of pictures I've taken of my wife, and a lot that she's taken of me. We have hours of video footage.
We are into public exhibitionism.
We both masturbate when we're apart from each other, and also in front of each other when we're together. We both encourage it and get turned on by it.
We are so in tune with each other. We relate on a zillion different levels.
I am totally in love with her.
But I like doing this other stuff, and I don't think it's such a big deal. She's upset by it. She says that if that's the way I am, go ahead and do it, she doesn't want to change me, I'll only resent her for trying to eventually. We could stay married and be reasonably happy, but it wouldn't be the same as it once was, when we felt like we were soulmates. I want SOOOOO much for it to be the same as it once was. But I don't know how.
Let me get a few facts straight.
My wife doesn't object to porn we watch together, she doesn't understand why I would watch it on my own.
I'm not downloading pictures. I'm downloading videos. I have a pretty nice porn collection.
I like taking pictures of women's asses. I like doing "stealth" work.
I have a HUGE collection of pictures I've taken of my wife, and a lot that she's taken of me. We have hours of video footage.
We are into public exhibitionism.
We both masturbate when we're apart from each other, and also in front of each other when we're together. We both encourage it and get turned on by it.
We are so in tune with each other. We relate on a zillion different levels.
I am totally in love with her.
But I like doing this other stuff, and I don't think it's such a big deal. She's upset by it. She says that if that's the way I am, go ahead and do it, she doesn't want to change me, I'll only resent her for trying to eventually. We could stay married and be reasonably happy, but it wouldn't be the same as it once was, when we felt like we were soulmates. I want SOOOOO much for it to be the same as it once was. But I don't know how.
someguyinhis20s
10-08-2002, 12:14 PM
Phaycops,
Did you even bother reading what I wrote cause it sounds like you totally missed the point of what I was saying? You're talking about whether a person gets turned on by someone other than their spouse. I'm talking about whether they're doing so deliberately. Those are two very distinct ideas. It's perfectly normal for a person to get aroused by people other than their spouse. A person can't suddenly condition themselves to only be sexually aroused by their partner. That goes against human nature. But there's a big difference between that and me deciding to go to a strip club. In the former, I wasn't looking to get aroused, it just happened as a result of the situation I was in. But in the latter, I decided to get turned on by someone else. Do you see the difference?
As for dictating to my wife what she should think, I don't know where you got that from. I would never presume to tell my wife what she should think. I'd leave that up to her. But what does it say about our commitment to one another if she decides to masturbate while imagining she's having sex with another man? It wouldn't bother you if your spouse was pretending to have sex with someone else? It would bother me and I'd expect it to bother her if I did the same thing. Sex is in the mind, not just the bed.
As for the issue of freedom, that comes down to what your understanding of a relationship is. Whatever restrictions a person has in a relationship have to be self-imposed. In other words, I won't go to strip clubs, not because my wife told me not to, but because I on my own decided not to. Now maybe some people out there have spouses who won't mind in which case no harm is done. But personally, I wouldn't go even if my wife were OK with it. It's disrespectful to her and even if she didn't feel insulted, I would feel like I was being unfaithful. If my fantasized about other men, I would prefer not to know about it.
If my wife were away on business, yes I would wait. Getting married means you make certain concessions. It sounds like you want it both ways. You want to commit to someone sexually but leave the door open to think about someone else. Sorry, but I think commitment should be reflected in not only what you do but what you don't do. It may be old-fashioned, it may be unrealistic, but I think once you open the door where you say it's OK to fantasize about others, then it's very easy to take the next step and say, "well she's not here so I'll go to a strip club". Pretty soon you take it the next level and sleep with someone else excusing yourself because you're wife is out of town and you need some satisfaction.
There's nothing hypocritical about what Greenberry said. You just didn't understand. What she is saying is that it's wrong but at the same time, the person doing it should decide for themselves to not do it. They shouldn't stop because someone else made them. For example, I think it would be wrong for me to watch strippers if I'm married, but I wouldn't want my wife telling me not to do it. No one wants their spouse to set rules for them to live by. Instead I would expect my wife to simply tell me that my going to strippers insults her and then leave it to me to decide whether to keep going. Likewise, if my wife did the same thing, I wouldn't demand that she not go. But I would make my feelings clear and hope that she's things from my view and stops going.
Did you even bother reading what I wrote cause it sounds like you totally missed the point of what I was saying? You're talking about whether a person gets turned on by someone other than their spouse. I'm talking about whether they're doing so deliberately. Those are two very distinct ideas. It's perfectly normal for a person to get aroused by people other than their spouse. A person can't suddenly condition themselves to only be sexually aroused by their partner. That goes against human nature. But there's a big difference between that and me deciding to go to a strip club. In the former, I wasn't looking to get aroused, it just happened as a result of the situation I was in. But in the latter, I decided to get turned on by someone else. Do you see the difference?
As for dictating to my wife what she should think, I don't know where you got that from. I would never presume to tell my wife what she should think. I'd leave that up to her. But what does it say about our commitment to one another if she decides to masturbate while imagining she's having sex with another man? It wouldn't bother you if your spouse was pretending to have sex with someone else? It would bother me and I'd expect it to bother her if I did the same thing. Sex is in the mind, not just the bed.
As for the issue of freedom, that comes down to what your understanding of a relationship is. Whatever restrictions a person has in a relationship have to be self-imposed. In other words, I won't go to strip clubs, not because my wife told me not to, but because I on my own decided not to. Now maybe some people out there have spouses who won't mind in which case no harm is done. But personally, I wouldn't go even if my wife were OK with it. It's disrespectful to her and even if she didn't feel insulted, I would feel like I was being unfaithful. If my fantasized about other men, I would prefer not to know about it.
If my wife were away on business, yes I would wait. Getting married means you make certain concessions. It sounds like you want it both ways. You want to commit to someone sexually but leave the door open to think about someone else. Sorry, but I think commitment should be reflected in not only what you do but what you don't do. It may be old-fashioned, it may be unrealistic, but I think once you open the door where you say it's OK to fantasize about others, then it's very easy to take the next step and say, "well she's not here so I'll go to a strip club". Pretty soon you take it the next level and sleep with someone else excusing yourself because you're wife is out of town and you need some satisfaction.
There's nothing hypocritical about what Greenberry said. You just didn't understand. What she is saying is that it's wrong but at the same time, the person doing it should decide for themselves to not do it. They shouldn't stop because someone else made them. For example, I think it would be wrong for me to watch strippers if I'm married, but I wouldn't want my wife telling me not to do it. No one wants their spouse to set rules for them to live by. Instead I would expect my wife to simply tell me that my going to strippers insults her and then leave it to me to decide whether to keep going. Likewise, if my wife did the same thing, I wouldn't demand that she not go. But I would make my feelings clear and hope that she's things from my view and stops going.
MelNor
10-08-2002, 12:31 PM
OH SOMEGUY!!!
Where were you 5 years ago! LOL
Do you think maybe you could send some...even just a little of your beliefs and morals out there for some other men to get a piece of?? :)
Where were you 5 years ago! LOL
Do you think maybe you could send some...even just a little of your beliefs and morals out there for some other men to get a piece of?? :)
MelNor
10-08-2002, 01:07 PM
OK justaguydi-
I really have to ask you what does it matter what ANYONE else think about if your right or wrong?? We are not the people you have to worry about, it is your wife you have to please.
I think you are incredibly lucky to find a lady who will fulfill and enjoy all the things you mentioned that you do TOGETHER. That is something you should be proud of cause it seems like you really love each other.
I guess what I want to ask is if your need to view porn and take pics of other women is greater than your need for your wife?? I suspect, it really is not, and I would guess that it might be a touchy topic in the future if you don't stop, which "could" potentially ruin your marriage. Within herself she is probably thinking OMG, I give and share with him all these things and activities and I am STILL not enough. I have to say I totally can understand what she is saying.
You say
""We could stay married and be reasonably happy, but it wouldn't be the same as it once was, when we felt like we were soulmates. I want SOOOOO much for it to be the same as it once was. But I don't know how.""
What do you mean when you say that you want it to be the same as it once was??? At one time did she not mind if you done these things???
I think the only answer here is to make compromises. She don't like you taking pics of women's asses and watching porn alone and you want her to like it. Ok, maybe if you agree not to take the pics she will agree to lighten up on the porn alone issue.
What ya gotta realize is that she says she isn't about to MAKE you do anything that will make you resent her later but yet your expecting her to accept something she is not comfortable with, and it is no different...do u think she will not resent you later if you continue regardless of how it bothers her??
You might not be totally happy with that compromising idea...but really...When you find someone you are that compatable with, isn't it worth a bit of compromise and self control to make that person feel good and secure in the marriage??
I wish you the best of luck!!
I really have to ask you what does it matter what ANYONE else think about if your right or wrong?? We are not the people you have to worry about, it is your wife you have to please.
I think you are incredibly lucky to find a lady who will fulfill and enjoy all the things you mentioned that you do TOGETHER. That is something you should be proud of cause it seems like you really love each other.
I guess what I want to ask is if your need to view porn and take pics of other women is greater than your need for your wife?? I suspect, it really is not, and I would guess that it might be a touchy topic in the future if you don't stop, which "could" potentially ruin your marriage. Within herself she is probably thinking OMG, I give and share with him all these things and activities and I am STILL not enough. I have to say I totally can understand what she is saying.
You say
""We could stay married and be reasonably happy, but it wouldn't be the same as it once was, when we felt like we were soulmates. I want SOOOOO much for it to be the same as it once was. But I don't know how.""
What do you mean when you say that you want it to be the same as it once was??? At one time did she not mind if you done these things???
I think the only answer here is to make compromises. She don't like you taking pics of women's asses and watching porn alone and you want her to like it. Ok, maybe if you agree not to take the pics she will agree to lighten up on the porn alone issue.
What ya gotta realize is that she says she isn't about to MAKE you do anything that will make you resent her later but yet your expecting her to accept something she is not comfortable with, and it is no different...do u think she will not resent you later if you continue regardless of how it bothers her??
You might not be totally happy with that compromising idea...but really...When you find someone you are that compatable with, isn't it worth a bit of compromise and self control to make that person feel good and secure in the marriage??
I wish you the best of luck!!
Greenberry
10-08-2002, 01:54 PM
To justaguydi, I am still wondering exactly how you carry out your voyeuristic activities. That has not been totally clarified, and is by far the most disturbing aspect of your original post. Since you mentioned stealth, I can only assume that you are the kind of guy who hides outside of people's windows, or in locker rooms, etc, and takes pictures of women's butts. Hey, it's just for fun...nobody is getting hurt, right? Well, let me tell you something. If that is the kind of activity that you are engaged in, you are totally in the wrong I don't care what your wife or anyone else says. How dare you victimize women for your own sexual gratification? At a gym I went to for a while, it was discovered that some guys had put in some peepholes over the showers. All of the women that used the showers (not me, I only changed clothes and went home and took a shower) were horrified and embarassed and indeed felt victimized. You have no right to violate someone's privacy for your own perverse enjoyment. I hope I am wrongly accusing you, and if so please tell me. But if not, I hope you get caught with a camera outside of a woman's window by her armed, martial arts-expert husband and get shown a thing or two about what happens to people who violate other people's privacy.
SouthernCaliforniaGirl
10-08-2002, 02:21 PM
someguysinhis20s:
I'm not going to copy and paste your posts here, but you mention more than once "my wife" meaning your wife. I thought from all your other posts you weren't married? And if you are married, why are you posting questions about whether you made a mistake with someone a long time ago and how you supposedly haven't found anyone yet?
Just a little confused by your inconsistency.
I'm not going to copy and paste your posts here, but you mention more than once "my wife" meaning your wife. I thought from all your other posts you weren't married? And if you are married, why are you posting questions about whether you made a mistake with someone a long time ago and how you supposedly haven't found anyone yet?
Just a little confused by your inconsistency.
someguyinhis20s
10-08-2002, 03:21 PM
MelNor,
5 years ago I was at a bar watching strippers.
Kidding.
SouthernCaliforniaGirl,
I'm not married. I was speaking hypothetically. That's easier than starting off each sentence with "if I were married".
5 years ago I was at a bar watching strippers.
Kidding.
SouthernCaliforniaGirl,
I'm not married. I was speaking hypothetically. That's easier than starting off each sentence with "if I were married".
SouthernCaliforniaGirl
10-08-2002, 03:32 PM
Then you should relay this to your audience so they know you are NOT speaking from experience. Being ambigous won't help their cause.
someguyinhis20s
10-08-2002, 04:17 PM
First of all, you're the only one who was confused. And even if people thought I was married, so what? It may be easier for me to comment, but that doesn't change the meaning of what I'm saying. If I were married and a single person gave me advice, I wouldn't dismiss it just because the person was single. This discussion is all about values and the different definitions of fidelity. I don't think one has to be married to talk about those.
PAISLEY
10-08-2002, 04:42 PM
someguyinhis20's-YOU ROCK!!
ana_24
10-08-2002, 05:00 PM
Someguy, I think your credibility changes drastically seeing as how you are NOT married. A lot of things are easier said than done...
SouthernCaliforniaGirl
10-08-2002, 05:04 PM
You are wrong. I was not confused. I was the only one who noticed it because I've read your other replies. You can not speak from experience when you don't have it. Like Ana_24 said, you lose credibility. If you are married, then you can also speak as a single person, because you were single at one time. You just have to make sure you are telling your audience that IF I were married.
Kadree
10-08-2002, 05:26 PM
justaguy,
I have read over this whole post and I feel that I must get my two cents in.
First of all, I don't agree with what you are doing, taking the pics, downloading videos etc. but that is your choice and what you chose to do is your business.
As for your wife, I can totally relate to how she is feeling, and the insecurities that she might have. How would you feel if she was doing this? Wanting to look at naked pics of other men all the time. I am pretty sure that you would start questioning whether or not you were the one she was thinking about.
In a marriage, things change a lot. The views that you go into marriage with are not necessarily the same views that you will have in 5 or 10 years.
If your sex life is so great, and you are so in love with your wife, then why are you questioning what you should do? If it is something that she is not comfortable with, and making her feel insecure then don't do it.
Kadree
I have read over this whole post and I feel that I must get my two cents in.
First of all, I don't agree with what you are doing, taking the pics, downloading videos etc. but that is your choice and what you chose to do is your business.
As for your wife, I can totally relate to how she is feeling, and the insecurities that she might have. How would you feel if she was doing this? Wanting to look at naked pics of other men all the time. I am pretty sure that you would start questioning whether or not you were the one she was thinking about.
In a marriage, things change a lot. The views that you go into marriage with are not necessarily the same views that you will have in 5 or 10 years.
If your sex life is so great, and you are so in love with your wife, then why are you questioning what you should do? If it is something that she is not comfortable with, and making her feel insecure then don't do it.
Kadree
someguyinhis20s
10-08-2002, 06:40 PM
[QUOTE]Originally posted by SouthernCaliforniaGirl:
You cannot speak from experience when you don't have it. Like Ana_24 said, you lose credibility. If you are married, then you can also speak as a single person, because you were single at one time./QUOTE]
Suppose I were married. My wife and I get into an argument. I lose my temper and I start beating her. Later on, a friend of mine confronts me and tells me that I shouldn't hit my wife. The catch is he's single and he's never been married. By your logic, he has less credibility than someone who's married or has been married. Give me a break! You don't have to be married or have been married to comment about values, fidelity, respect, and honesty which is what this thread comes down to. These are not things exclusive to marriage and married people act like you have to be part of the club before you can criticize. I think that's the most flawed reasoning I've ever heard of. I wonder if a wife beater ever used that when he got arrested. "Oh officer, you're single so you can't comment. If you were married then I'd attach more credibility to what you're telling me." Please.
"You don't know it feels to be me." It's a good song, but a lame excuse to hide behind.
[This message has been edited by someguyinhis20s (edited 10-08-2002).]
You cannot speak from experience when you don't have it. Like Ana_24 said, you lose credibility. If you are married, then you can also speak as a single person, because you were single at one time./QUOTE]
Suppose I were married. My wife and I get into an argument. I lose my temper and I start beating her. Later on, a friend of mine confronts me and tells me that I shouldn't hit my wife. The catch is he's single and he's never been married. By your logic, he has less credibility than someone who's married or has been married. Give me a break! You don't have to be married or have been married to comment about values, fidelity, respect, and honesty which is what this thread comes down to. These are not things exclusive to marriage and married people act like you have to be part of the club before you can criticize. I think that's the most flawed reasoning I've ever heard of. I wonder if a wife beater ever used that when he got arrested. "Oh officer, you're single so you can't comment. If you were married then I'd attach more credibility to what you're telling me." Please.
"You don't know it feels to be me." It's a good song, but a lame excuse to hide behind.
[This message has been edited by someguyinhis20s (edited 10-08-2002).]
SouthernCaliforniaGirl
10-08-2002, 08:19 PM
Spare me the self pity. You are breaking my heart.
Greenberry
10-08-2002, 08:32 PM
Hey, you don't have to be married in order to know the proper way to act while married. Someguyinhis20's, you are GREAT! You are going to be a great husband someday!
MrHoops
10-09-2002, 09:30 AM
You should have inserted the word "If" in the first sentence. Even you admitted that. Don't get all bent out of shape just because someone noticed a disparity between a few of your posts. No need to write back with this huge explanation like you are being accused of murder. Just face facts you made a slight error in ommission. It won't take a single or married person to be man enough they made a mistake. The police officer argument is weak. His only judgement of you is whether or not you are breaking the law.
nicola76
10-09-2002, 09:41 AM
Someguy hasn't lost any credibility at all. He gives some of the best advice on these boards! Its absurd to say that he has to be married in order to know how to act in a marriage as well as give advice on the subject.
Justaguydi,
I, along with a few other people I imagine, are still waiting for an explanation on your "stealth" pictures of women's butts. If you're hanging around outside women's homes and taking voyeuristic pics of them you're defiantely in the wrong and I don't blame your wife for being upset. Please correct me if I'm in the wrong.
Maybe there's a sort of agreement you and your wife can come to but if you're engaging in activity that you know hurts and upsets her, then why continue it?
Take care everybody.
Nic
Justaguydi,
I, along with a few other people I imagine, are still waiting for an explanation on your "stealth" pictures of women's butts. If you're hanging around outside women's homes and taking voyeuristic pics of them you're defiantely in the wrong and I don't blame your wife for being upset. Please correct me if I'm in the wrong.
Maybe there's a sort of agreement you and your wife can come to but if you're engaging in activity that you know hurts and upsets her, then why continue it?
Take care everybody.
Nic
justaguydi
10-09-2002, 06:33 PM
Stealth... I like to surreptiously take pics of women without their knowledge, particularly butt shots.
There's a new twist...
I used to talk to this girl on ICQ before I met my wife. She helped me get through a depressed period of my life. We were cybersex buddies. We never met. When I fell in love with my wife a year ago, I told ICQ girl about it, and she was pissed. She said a lot of nasty things about her, and I decided not to talk to her again. I told my wife (g/f at the time) about it, and I told her I wasn't talking to her anymore. But I would still talk to ICQ girl once in a while.
A few months after we got married, somehow ICQ girl got my wife's ICQ # and started messaging her. Saying rotten things to her. At first my wife tried to be nice to her, cause I told her that ICQ girl had a lot of problems and was psycho. ICQ girl apologized to her. I told my wife I put ICQ girl on ignore.
Then she kept on harassing my wife, calling her names, saying she was ugly, telling her that I still wanted ICQ girl, that I was going to cheat, that I loved ICQ girl's body. My wife was upset. We got into a big fight about it. My wife couldn't understand why I would have ever talked to this girl again after she dissed her to me.
Then ICQ girl told her I was still asking her to send me pics. My wife asked me if this was true, and I said, yes, a while back the girl messaged me and told me she got new jeans and I asked her for a pic. My wife was really pissed, cause this girl dissed her to me and to her, and bragged to my wife about how I always forgave her no matter what she said or did. So I emailed ICQ girl in front of my wife and told her, "No more, leave us alone." I told my wife I'd never talk to her again.
A while after that, my wife asked me if I had heard from her lately. I told her, yes, I messaged her to ask her a question about a UFO phenomenon that was happening in her country. My wife hit the roof. She said she couldn't believe I'd still talk to her after all the trouble she'd caused, and after the horrible things she'd said to and about my wife. I said I just asked her an innocent question about UFO's. She almost wanted a divorce. I told her I'd never talk to ICQ girl again.
Well, a couple of days ago, ICQ girl messaged me, and told me she got raped. So I talked to her. She then messaged my wife and started gloating about how I'm still talking to her. I told my wife that ICQ girl got raped, but she didn't want to hear about it. She says she can't believe I would still talk to her after we almost got a divorce over the whole thing. My wife says she doesn't trust me, and wants a divorce.
There's a new twist...
I used to talk to this girl on ICQ before I met my wife. She helped me get through a depressed period of my life. We were cybersex buddies. We never met. When I fell in love with my wife a year ago, I told ICQ girl about it, and she was pissed. She said a lot of nasty things about her, and I decided not to talk to her again. I told my wife (g/f at the time) about it, and I told her I wasn't talking to her anymore. But I would still talk to ICQ girl once in a while.
A few months after we got married, somehow ICQ girl got my wife's ICQ # and started messaging her. Saying rotten things to her. At first my wife tried to be nice to her, cause I told her that ICQ girl had a lot of problems and was psycho. ICQ girl apologized to her. I told my wife I put ICQ girl on ignore.
Then she kept on harassing my wife, calling her names, saying she was ugly, telling her that I still wanted ICQ girl, that I was going to cheat, that I loved ICQ girl's body. My wife was upset. We got into a big fight about it. My wife couldn't understand why I would have ever talked to this girl again after she dissed her to me.
Then ICQ girl told her I was still asking her to send me pics. My wife asked me if this was true, and I said, yes, a while back the girl messaged me and told me she got new jeans and I asked her for a pic. My wife was really pissed, cause this girl dissed her to me and to her, and bragged to my wife about how I always forgave her no matter what she said or did. So I emailed ICQ girl in front of my wife and told her, "No more, leave us alone." I told my wife I'd never talk to her again.
A while after that, my wife asked me if I had heard from her lately. I told her, yes, I messaged her to ask her a question about a UFO phenomenon that was happening in her country. My wife hit the roof. She said she couldn't believe I'd still talk to her after all the trouble she'd caused, and after the horrible things she'd said to and about my wife. I said I just asked her an innocent question about UFO's. She almost wanted a divorce. I told her I'd never talk to ICQ girl again.
Well, a couple of days ago, ICQ girl messaged me, and told me she got raped. So I talked to her. She then messaged my wife and started gloating about how I'm still talking to her. I told my wife that ICQ girl got raped, but she didn't want to hear about it. She says she can't believe I would still talk to her after we almost got a divorce over the whole thing. My wife says she doesn't trust me, and wants a divorce.
MelNor
10-09-2002, 06:50 PM
OMG!! Your too much! LOL
What the heck did u expect?? C'mon!!
What the heck did u expect?? C'mon!!
Greenberry
10-09-2002, 08:23 PM
You sound like you have some real problems, pal, not the least of which is being a SEX OFFENDER. But no, your big worry seems to be that a girl with whom you should not even be corresponding is having problems or seeing UFOs or whatever. I think your wife is making the best decision of her life! I wish her lots of luck!
[This message has been edited by Greenberry (edited 10-09-2002).]
[This message has been edited by Greenberry (edited 10-09-2002).]
justaguydi
10-09-2002, 09:38 PM
I would never EVER cheat on my wife. I don't want anyone else but her. I've told her that. How can I make her believe that? I told her I was not going to download any more porn. No more voyeur pics. I only want her. I changed my ICQ so that I can only receive messages from people on my list.
Greenberry
10-09-2002, 11:56 PM
Are you on drugs or something???? Ask yourself, why should your wife believe you this time? In the above story, you told your wife THREE TIMES that you would never talk to this girl again, and then you did. At least one of those times, YOU initiated the contact with the other girl, with that LAME story about UFO sightings. Why should she believe you the third time? You should have found out a long time ago (i.e., the first time this topic came up between you and your wife) that contact with this girl is bad for your marriage. Why haven't you learned that before now, say, when your wife was ready to walk out on you last time? I don't blame your wife one bit and I personally think that you have had enough chances. You've lied to and deceived your wife so many times that you shouldn't be surprised if she doesn't believe a word you say.
You have learned the hard way that when you get married, previous sex partners (even cybersex partners) should take last priority over anything. If one is smart, before they get married, they will permanently sever all ties with any previous sex partners that are lurking about, especially ones that they know are "troubled." You certainly shouldn't be e-mailing them asking to see pictures of their new jeans. What were you thinking!?!
[This message has been edited by Greenberry (edited 10-09-2002).]
You have learned the hard way that when you get married, previous sex partners (even cybersex partners) should take last priority over anything. If one is smart, before they get married, they will permanently sever all ties with any previous sex partners that are lurking about, especially ones that they know are "troubled." You certainly shouldn't be e-mailing them asking to see pictures of their new jeans. What were you thinking!?!
[This message has been edited by Greenberry (edited 10-09-2002).]
justaguydi
10-10-2002, 01:10 AM
I really want this marriage to work out. My wife is more important to me than anything. Could I ever regain her trust?
De Lou
10-10-2002, 03:02 AM
OK I could really care less right now if someone is married or not. Here is my opinion on the orginal post and a few after. Everyone is getting carried away here.
A few months ago I saw that my hubby was on the playboy site. Granted that is not the same as porn BUT here is how I felt. I have had 4 children I am not happy with the way I look. My problem there right. But I felt that in his mind I was not good enough to look at as he was on this site in the morning before I woke up. I was hurt. Of course I will never look like I belong any where in playboy. But I am not over weight. As he explained it to me( but it still hurt) at least he is not out on the street cheating. Ok I took this as his easy way out. But whatever the main thing is I was hurt to find he did this behind my back. So I am over it. ok maybe not 100% but you know when he is out maybe at the grocery store he sees someone and he thinks "wow wonder what she would be like in bed" I am best off not thinking about this. Have I ever seen my hubby masterbate no. Have I asked him about it no. Do I care maybe a bit. But we are happy (maybe I am speaking for me) and we are good together. Hurt goes away and maybe that is what she was feeling. Talk about it. And for masterbateing to who ever said it was cheating it is not. In DR. spocks baby book he says kids do this. I bought a book for my 12 YR.old son about boys growing into men. It says to do it. And never tell someone it is wrong becuase it is not healthy for them mentally.
OOOOPPPPPSSSSS did I open a new can of worms? Did I make sense.
DE
A few months ago I saw that my hubby was on the playboy site. Granted that is not the same as porn BUT here is how I felt. I have had 4 children I am not happy with the way I look. My problem there right. But I felt that in his mind I was not good enough to look at as he was on this site in the morning before I woke up. I was hurt. Of course I will never look like I belong any where in playboy. But I am not over weight. As he explained it to me( but it still hurt) at least he is not out on the street cheating. Ok I took this as his easy way out. But whatever the main thing is I was hurt to find he did this behind my back. So I am over it. ok maybe not 100% but you know when he is out maybe at the grocery store he sees someone and he thinks "wow wonder what she would be like in bed" I am best off not thinking about this. Have I ever seen my hubby masterbate no. Have I asked him about it no. Do I care maybe a bit. But we are happy (maybe I am speaking for me) and we are good together. Hurt goes away and maybe that is what she was feeling. Talk about it. And for masterbateing to who ever said it was cheating it is not. In DR. spocks baby book he says kids do this. I bought a book for my 12 YR.old son about boys growing into men. It says to do it. And never tell someone it is wrong becuase it is not healthy for them mentally.
OOOOPPPPPSSSSS did I open a new can of worms? Did I make sense.
DE
nicola76
10-10-2002, 07:15 AM
You should have thought about how important your wife was to you before being in contact with this girl THREE times after you PROMISED your wife you wouldn't speak to her. And why would you ask this ICQ girl for a pic of her in her new jeans??? What's wrong with you? I don't blame your wife one bit for getting ready to walk out on you. You've thrown her trust in you back in her face 3 times now. I don't know what to tell you really. It looks like you've blown it.
Good luck.
Good luck.
Kadree
10-10-2002, 01:00 PM
This is getting WAY to wierd for me. You kept on talking to this girl, even after she bad mouthed your wife, and all of the rest of the stunts she pulled.
And the whole thing about the UFO's - what is that? That is the lamest excuse I have ever heard!!
I think the best advice I can give would be to your wife GET OUT NOW.
And the whole thing about the UFO's - what is that? That is the lamest excuse I have ever heard!!
I think the best advice I can give would be to your wife GET OUT NOW.
De Lou
10-10-2002, 03:47 PM
Ok after reading the last post I realized I missed the UFO thing. If I werre your wife I would be pissed too. There were other ways to find out about the UFO thing from the other country. After you knew how your wife felt about this you should of never contacted that girl again. How would you feel if she all of a sudden caught up some how with a man she knew from the past? You ahould be changeing your screen names email addresses and such where there is no way for this girl to get in touch with you. You put your wife thru something that could have been avoided. The porn is one thing(Not good if you are doing it alone) But to contact someone from the past you had cyber sex with(Which to me is wierd but to each his own)is just not right and if your wife feels as if she is being cheated on I do not blame her. Maybe we should hear your wifes point of view. Have her read all of your replies to the post you started. It would really be interesting to see what she has to say. You need to think of her feelings on this. I for awahil had a friend of my moms sending me some down right dirty emails my hubby found out. It was not pretty. It turned out the dude lived across the street from where I was taking my kids to the sitter. I did not know this untill the end. But my hubby thought I knew him as he could describe me to a detail in the emails as he said what he would like to do to me. Well the dope said where he was palying baseball one night. Needless to say my hubby ended it all by visiting his games. I changed all my info for the internet and never heard from him again. Did my hubby feel he was being cheated on YES. That was 4 years ago and to this day he does not like me being on the internet. And if I were you wife I would throw the computer out the window. Becuase it sounds as if you may do it again as you had already told her you would not contact this person and the you do about UFO'S. That was the best you could come up with? maybe true but think about it! http://www.healthboards.com/ubb/hammer.gif
DE
DE
MelNor
10-10-2002, 03:52 PM
YEAH!! Great idea De Lou!
Why not let her read these posts and let her voice her opinion on the topic.
------------------
Never be afraid to try something new.
Remember that a lone amateur built the Ark.
A large group of professionals built the Titanic.
Why not let her read these posts and let her voice her opinion on the topic.
------------------
Never be afraid to try something new.
Remember that a lone amateur built the Ark.
A large group of professionals built the Titanic.
justaguydi
10-10-2002, 10:09 PM
That might be a good idea. I'll think about it.
De Lou
10-10-2002, 10:45 PM
Think real hard because I know alot of us are waiting to hear from her!
thewife
10-13-2002, 01:14 AM
The wife here.
So, my husband had a chat buddy before we got married. No big deal. I had a few myself. But I put them into perspective at the proper time.
He told ICQ girl he was in love with me, and she was pissed. She called me a whore. He told me about this, and I asked him why he would bother talking to her anymore. He said he wasn't.
Shortly after we got married, she started sending me "mysterious" ICQ messages, trying to get my goat. I ignored them for a while, told my husband about it, he said she was had a lot of problems. I felt sort of sorry for her, after all, she was in love with him, and now she was hurt. I responded to her after a while, and tried to explain to her that he's married now, she was young and should be out meeting real guys and not getting hung up on a cyber relationship, such is the nature of these things, meet a real flesh-and-blood man. She intermittently insulted me or apologized to me. I kept trying to be nice to her, knowing that she was messed up. Finally, this converstion occurred:
HER 6/10/200 4:16 PM enjoy your husband before he cheats on
you.....
ME 6/10/200 5:57 PM i see you're up to your troublemaking again
HER 6/10/200 6:01 PM yeah but he doesn't have the guts to tell me
off
ME 6/10/200 6:04 PM well, i do, i've had enough of your
S***...i've tried to be nice to you....why
don't you just leave him alone? do you want to
push him into being hurtful to you?
HER 6/10/200 6:05 PM he's isn't hurtful to me at
all.......hahahahha
ME 6/10/200 6:07 PM look, you were online buddies for a while, now
he's married....give it up already, have a
little pride....don't throw yourself at
someone who doesn't want you
HER 6/10/200 6:08 PM he still asks me for pictures....
HER 6/10/200 6:09 PM he dreams about havinga 3some
ME 6/10/200 6:10 PM who doesn't? why are you being such a
troublemaker?
HER 6/10/200 6:10 PM he wants me to be in that 3some
ME 6/10/200 6:11 PM get a life, flor
HER 6/10/200 6:11 PM he wants to f*** me
HER 6/10/200 6:12 PM I have a video of him without his cockring
ME 6/10/200 6:12 PM so?
ME 6/10/200 6:13 PM big f***ing deal, i have his cock, ring and
all
HER 6/10/200 6:13 PM he did it for me when u didn't even existed
for him
HER 6/10/200 6:14 PM he was going to send me something just when u
were going to get married
HER 6/10/200 6:14 PM I don't mean a picture.....
ME 6/10/200 6:15 PM so he had a life before me, duh, we all have
lives....with the exception of you, apparently
HER 6/10/200 6:15 PM I do have a life
HER 6/10/200 6:15 PM and it honorable compared to yours
ME 6/10/200 6:16 PM then live it instead of living in your
pathetic cyberworld
HER 6/10/200 6:16 PM being 21 I have more class than u'll ever have
HER 6/10/200 6:17 PM he's the only one in the cyberworld.......I
have my family and tons of people who loves
me.....and my friends......
ME 6/10/200 6:18 PM look, he doesn't want you, he's married and
has a nice life....why are you so obsessed?
HER 6/10/200 6:19 PM my problem why I am like this
ME 6/10/200 6:19 PM look, i don't even care, the question was
rhetorical
HER 6/10/200 6:20 PM my obsessions r mine
ME 6/10/200 6:21 PM who cares? leave him alone, have a little
self-respect, you're throwing yourself at a
man who doesn't want you, comprende?
HER 6/10/200 6:22 PM u don't have to be nice to me because I can't
be nice to u
HER 6/10/200 6:22 PM don't u dare to speak spanish it doesn't suit
u
HER 6/10/200 6:23 PM I really want to stumble on him by accident
and see if that's true
ME 6/10/200 6:23 PM vete a la mierda, not much chance of
that happening
HER 6/10/200 6:24 PM non breasted woman
ME 6/10/200 6:26 PM yes, exactly the way my HUSBAND and i like it
HER 6/10/200 6:26 PM well he also like mine
ME 6/10/200 6:27 PM you really appear pathetic, you know, you'll
hate yourself one day for acting so foolishly
ME 6/10/200 6:27 PM so WHAT? he had a life before me, for god's
sake
HER 6/10/200 6:28 PM I'll laugh......I don't know how I'm going to
think ten years later and I'm not worried
about it
ME 6/10/200 6:28 PM that makes you all the more pathetic
HER 6/10/200 6:28 PM he's really ok.....maybe someday I'll thank
about this
ME 6/10/200 6:29 PM for god's sske, woman, show a little pride
HER 6/10/200 6:29 PM u want me to be pathetic ..ok......
ME 6/10/200 6:34 PM ***** is really going to hate you when i tell
him about this...is that what you want?
HER 6/10/200 6:36 PM I don't care......I'm used to things to work
up like **** for me it doesn't matter........
HER 6/10/200 6:38 PM he knows I talked to u ...i told him myself
ME 6/10/200 6:39 PM you have gone too far this time....he is going
to be very pissed
HER 6/10/200 6:40 PM I've given him 100 reasons to be furious at me
and he forgave me in all of them
HER 6/10/200 6:41 PM u know what.....u'r acting more childish than
I am...it feels like a 5 yr old who wants to
tell his daddy the other girl took her doll
ME 6/10/200 6:41 PM i have completely lost my patience with your
bull****...i thought you were some mixed-up
kid, now i see what you really are....nothing
but a troublemaker....you know nothing about
chris, he is all about the vibe, and you don't
have it....your heart is ugly
HER 6/10/200 6:42 PM and u'r and old wasted woman who wants to get
laid
ME 6/10/200 6:42 PM you don't know my husband at all
FLOR 6/10/200 6:42 PM whatever
ME 6/10/200 6:43 PM i could say hurtful things if i wanted to but
i don't.....grow up
ME 6/10/200 6:44 PM have a little pride
HER 6/10/200 6:47 PM I know something the only person he really
loved is dead
ME 6/10/200 6:50 PM you know nothing about my husband
HER 6/10/200 6:50 PM and I think after that girl he was just
looking not to be alone
HER 6/10/200 6:55 PM he had a depression and I was the one who told
him that going to a doctor would be the
best....and he was too sad for this girl and
he still is......because it was the first
thing he said when I told him about my
grandfather's death
ME 6/10/200 6:56 PM get a REALITY CHECK....he's married, give it
UP already....
ME 6/10/200 6:56 PM that's over and past, move on
HER 6/10/200 6:58 PM I'm talking about what he tells me about his
feelings.......
ME 6/10/200 7:00 PM well, that's over now too
HER 6/10/200 7:00 PM we were taking antidepressants at the same
time and it was nice to have someone to talk
to
HER 6/10/200 7:02 PM u know nothing about me and 100% of what u
said isn't true
ME 6/10/200 7:04 PM i can only form my opinions about you based on
the conversations i've had with you.... and i
don't like what i see
ME 6/10/200 7:04 PM and ***** will not like what he sees when i
relay this dialogue to him
HER 6/10/200 7:05 PM do it...don't care.......u'r cruel
ME 6/10/200 7:05 PM his tolerance for this type of bulls*** is
small
ME 6/10/200 7:05 PM i'll let ***** be the judge of that
HER 6/10/200 7:06 PM I don't care......an almost 40 yr messing up
with a 21 yr.....u must be really dumb
ME 6/10/200 7:07 PM get a life, you can't push my buttons
HER 6/10/200 7:08 PM it doesn't matter how it sounds to u....it is
waht it is.......all the 40 yr I know r a
little bit smarter than u r
ME 6/10/200 7:08 PM if i was interested in messing with you, you
wouldn't stand a chance, i tried to be nice,
now i'm being blunt....don't you get it?
HER 6/10/200 7:09 PM most of those women wouldn't be talking to
me...
ME 6/10/200 7:10 PM duh....i tried to be nice to someone who
happened to have a crush on my
husband....***** was be the same way to the
guys who had crushes on me...
HER 6/10/200 7:11 PM crush on you?......
ME 6/10/200 7:11 PM that's the way we are.... but you are just
obsessed...
HER 6/10/200 7:12 PM I don't have to bleach my hair to be beautiful
ME 6/10/200 7:13 PM niceness didn't work, bluntness doesn't seem
to be doing the trick either.... i'll let
***** handle it
ME 6/10/200 7:14 PM goodbye
HER 6/10/200 7:14 PM and I definately have a body to die for
So, my husband had a chat buddy before we got married. No big deal. I had a few myself. But I put them into perspective at the proper time.
He told ICQ girl he was in love with me, and she was pissed. She called me a whore. He told me about this, and I asked him why he would bother talking to her anymore. He said he wasn't.
Shortly after we got married, she started sending me "mysterious" ICQ messages, trying to get my goat. I ignored them for a while, told my husband about it, he said she was had a lot of problems. I felt sort of sorry for her, after all, she was in love with him, and now she was hurt. I responded to her after a while, and tried to explain to her that he's married now, she was young and should be out meeting real guys and not getting hung up on a cyber relationship, such is the nature of these things, meet a real flesh-and-blood man. She intermittently insulted me or apologized to me. I kept trying to be nice to her, knowing that she was messed up. Finally, this converstion occurred:
HER 6/10/200 4:16 PM enjoy your husband before he cheats on
you.....
ME 6/10/200 5:57 PM i see you're up to your troublemaking again
HER 6/10/200 6:01 PM yeah but he doesn't have the guts to tell me
off
ME 6/10/200 6:04 PM well, i do, i've had enough of your
S***...i've tried to be nice to you....why
don't you just leave him alone? do you want to
push him into being hurtful to you?
HER 6/10/200 6:05 PM he's isn't hurtful to me at
all.......hahahahha
ME 6/10/200 6:07 PM look, you were online buddies for a while, now
he's married....give it up already, have a
little pride....don't throw yourself at
someone who doesn't want you
HER 6/10/200 6:08 PM he still asks me for pictures....
HER 6/10/200 6:09 PM he dreams about havinga 3some
ME 6/10/200 6:10 PM who doesn't? why are you being such a
troublemaker?
HER 6/10/200 6:10 PM he wants me to be in that 3some
ME 6/10/200 6:11 PM get a life, flor
HER 6/10/200 6:11 PM he wants to f*** me
HER 6/10/200 6:12 PM I have a video of him without his cockring
ME 6/10/200 6:12 PM so?
ME 6/10/200 6:13 PM big f***ing deal, i have his cock, ring and
all
HER 6/10/200 6:13 PM he did it for me when u didn't even existed
for him
HER 6/10/200 6:14 PM he was going to send me something just when u
were going to get married
HER 6/10/200 6:14 PM I don't mean a picture.....
ME 6/10/200 6:15 PM so he had a life before me, duh, we all have
lives....with the exception of you, apparently
HER 6/10/200 6:15 PM I do have a life
HER 6/10/200 6:15 PM and it honorable compared to yours
ME 6/10/200 6:16 PM then live it instead of living in your
pathetic cyberworld
HER 6/10/200 6:16 PM being 21 I have more class than u'll ever have
HER 6/10/200 6:17 PM he's the only one in the cyberworld.......I
have my family and tons of people who loves
me.....and my friends......
ME 6/10/200 6:18 PM look, he doesn't want you, he's married and
has a nice life....why are you so obsessed?
HER 6/10/200 6:19 PM my problem why I am like this
ME 6/10/200 6:19 PM look, i don't even care, the question was
rhetorical
HER 6/10/200 6:20 PM my obsessions r mine
ME 6/10/200 6:21 PM who cares? leave him alone, have a little
self-respect, you're throwing yourself at a
man who doesn't want you, comprende?
HER 6/10/200 6:22 PM u don't have to be nice to me because I can't
be nice to u
HER 6/10/200 6:22 PM don't u dare to speak spanish it doesn't suit
u
HER 6/10/200 6:23 PM I really want to stumble on him by accident
and see if that's true
ME 6/10/200 6:23 PM vete a la mierda, not much chance of
that happening
HER 6/10/200 6:24 PM non breasted woman
ME 6/10/200 6:26 PM yes, exactly the way my HUSBAND and i like it
HER 6/10/200 6:26 PM well he also like mine
ME 6/10/200 6:27 PM you really appear pathetic, you know, you'll
hate yourself one day for acting so foolishly
ME 6/10/200 6:27 PM so WHAT? he had a life before me, for god's
sake
HER 6/10/200 6:28 PM I'll laugh......I don't know how I'm going to
think ten years later and I'm not worried
about it
ME 6/10/200 6:28 PM that makes you all the more pathetic
HER 6/10/200 6:28 PM he's really ok.....maybe someday I'll thank
about this
ME 6/10/200 6:29 PM for god's sske, woman, show a little pride
HER 6/10/200 6:29 PM u want me to be pathetic ..ok......
ME 6/10/200 6:34 PM ***** is really going to hate you when i tell
him about this...is that what you want?
HER 6/10/200 6:36 PM I don't care......I'm used to things to work
up like **** for me it doesn't matter........
HER 6/10/200 6:38 PM he knows I talked to u ...i told him myself
ME 6/10/200 6:39 PM you have gone too far this time....he is going
to be very pissed
HER 6/10/200 6:40 PM I've given him 100 reasons to be furious at me
and he forgave me in all of them
HER 6/10/200 6:41 PM u know what.....u'r acting more childish than
I am...it feels like a 5 yr old who wants to
tell his daddy the other girl took her doll
ME 6/10/200 6:41 PM i have completely lost my patience with your
bull****...i thought you were some mixed-up
kid, now i see what you really are....nothing
but a troublemaker....you know nothing about
chris, he is all about the vibe, and you don't
have it....your heart is ugly
HER 6/10/200 6:42 PM and u'r and old wasted woman who wants to get
laid
ME 6/10/200 6:42 PM you don't know my husband at all
FLOR 6/10/200 6:42 PM whatever
ME 6/10/200 6:43 PM i could say hurtful things if i wanted to but
i don't.....grow up
ME 6/10/200 6:44 PM have a little pride
HER 6/10/200 6:47 PM I know something the only person he really
loved is dead
ME 6/10/200 6:50 PM you know nothing about my husband
HER 6/10/200 6:50 PM and I think after that girl he was just
looking not to be alone
HER 6/10/200 6:55 PM he had a depression and I was the one who told
him that going to a doctor would be the
best....and he was too sad for this girl and
he still is......because it was the first
thing he said when I told him about my
grandfather's death
ME 6/10/200 6:56 PM get a REALITY CHECK....he's married, give it
UP already....
ME 6/10/200 6:56 PM that's over and past, move on
HER 6/10/200 6:58 PM I'm talking about what he tells me about his
feelings.......
ME 6/10/200 7:00 PM well, that's over now too
HER 6/10/200 7:00 PM we were taking antidepressants at the same
time and it was nice to have someone to talk
to
HER 6/10/200 7:02 PM u know nothing about me and 100% of what u
said isn't true
ME 6/10/200 7:04 PM i can only form my opinions about you based on
the conversations i've had with you.... and i
don't like what i see
ME 6/10/200 7:04 PM and ***** will not like what he sees when i
relay this dialogue to him
HER 6/10/200 7:05 PM do it...don't care.......u'r cruel
ME 6/10/200 7:05 PM his tolerance for this type of bulls*** is
small
ME 6/10/200 7:05 PM i'll let ***** be the judge of that
HER 6/10/200 7:06 PM I don't care......an almost 40 yr messing up
with a 21 yr.....u must be really dumb
ME 6/10/200 7:07 PM get a life, you can't push my buttons
HER 6/10/200 7:08 PM it doesn't matter how it sounds to u....it is
waht it is.......all the 40 yr I know r a
little bit smarter than u r
ME 6/10/200 7:08 PM if i was interested in messing with you, you
wouldn't stand a chance, i tried to be nice,
now i'm being blunt....don't you get it?
HER 6/10/200 7:09 PM most of those women wouldn't be talking to
me...
ME 6/10/200 7:10 PM duh....i tried to be nice to someone who
happened to have a crush on my
husband....***** was be the same way to the
guys who had crushes on me...
HER 6/10/200 7:11 PM crush on you?......
ME 6/10/200 7:11 PM that's the way we are.... but you are just
obsessed...
HER 6/10/200 7:12 PM I don't have to bleach my hair to be beautiful
ME 6/10/200 7:13 PM niceness didn't work, bluntness doesn't seem
to be doing the trick either.... i'll let
***** handle it
ME 6/10/200 7:14 PM goodbye
HER 6/10/200 7:14 PM and I definately have a body to die for
thewife
10-13-2002, 01:57 AM
I was very upset after this conversation. I showed it to my husband. I asked him if he had asked her for pics. He said a while back, she told him she got new jeans, and he asked her to send a pic of her in them. I asked him why, he said he wanted to see them to see if I would look good in them. I hit the ceiling. I told him it would lead her on to have ANY kind of contact with her. I almost wanted a divorce. We had a HUGE fight. Finally, he emailed her and told her, No mas. Leave us alone. I'm married. He told me he wouldn't talk to her anymore. The next day he told me she emailed back and apologized.
Some time after that, I asked him if he had heard from her lately. He said he messaged her to ask her if she'd seen any UFO's. Apparently, there was some UFO thing going on in South America. I FLIPPED OUT. I couldn't beleive he would ever INITIATE a conversation with her after what had gone down already. I was EXTREMELY upset. There is no doubt in my mind that my husband knew that I was inches away from a divorce. It was a more ultimatum-ly version of the fight we had before. Though I did not issue an ultimatum, the implication was there.
[Another thing that bothers me is, this girl really thought that he loved her. He knew she was unglued. He knew she was in love with him. Why did he lead HER on? He considered her to be a "psycho hose beast". Why continue talking to her, knowing it's only gonna mess her up more?]
Anyway, by this point I had had it with ICQ girl, and my husband knew it.
Things got good again. Then I felt insecure again. The porn and the voyeur stuff started to bother me. I was just about to get past it when wham!!!!----------- ICQ girl started her stuff again, gloating that my husband was still talking to her.
I told him she contacted me, gloating that he was talking to her.... asked him if he had indeed spoken to her, he said yes, I hit the roof, he said she messaged him cause she got raped, and I was like, who cares?
Am I wrong to feel like I should never trust him?
Some time after that, I asked him if he had heard from her lately. He said he messaged her to ask her if she'd seen any UFO's. Apparently, there was some UFO thing going on in South America. I FLIPPED OUT. I couldn't beleive he would ever INITIATE a conversation with her after what had gone down already. I was EXTREMELY upset. There is no doubt in my mind that my husband knew that I was inches away from a divorce. It was a more ultimatum-ly version of the fight we had before. Though I did not issue an ultimatum, the implication was there.
[Another thing that bothers me is, this girl really thought that he loved her. He knew she was unglued. He knew she was in love with him. Why did he lead HER on? He considered her to be a "psycho hose beast". Why continue talking to her, knowing it's only gonna mess her up more?]
Anyway, by this point I had had it with ICQ girl, and my husband knew it.
Things got good again. Then I felt insecure again. The porn and the voyeur stuff started to bother me. I was just about to get past it when wham!!!!----------- ICQ girl started her stuff again, gloating that my husband was still talking to her.
I told him she contacted me, gloating that he was talking to her.... asked him if he had indeed spoken to her, he said yes, I hit the roof, he said she messaged him cause she got raped, and I was like, who cares?
Am I wrong to feel like I should never trust him?
newdawn
10-13-2002, 01:59 AM
I just had to reply to this post omg I understand where a lot of woman on here are coming from first of all I was married to a very abusive man no he didn't hit me he mentally and emotionally abused me all he wanted was to watch porn, go to strip clubs, not have sex with me but with everyone else, and he also ran up a thousand dollar phone bill on another marines bill I got married to this idiot when I was a very stupid 24 year old and he was a kid 19 well anyway I felt so ugly I wasn't I thought what is wrong with me?? why doesn't he want me at all.. it makes you doubt yourself as a woman now you say you don't want anyone else and that you would never cheat but cybersex to me you are talking about intimate things so in a way that can be considered a type of cheating.. I know I have been abused so much that when I get in a relationship and I have had many!!!) that I have talked to men in the chat rooms.. and why in the world would you talk to a girl who puts your wife down, and that you had cybersex with it will take a lot for your wife to trust you again you have to stop talking to that girl completely, and stop taking those pics of other women crazy and weird.. I wish you good luck but ask yourself this if my marriage means that much to me why would you have to talk to other women anyway??? thats what I asked my ex husband everyday just a thought..
good luck,Renee' :eek:
good luck,Renee' :eek:
newdawn
10-13-2002, 08:38 AM
ok,
now this is for you sweetie the wife I don't think its wrong for you to feel that you can't trust him again he talked to her on three different occassions what is wrong with that everything I just don't understand men sometimes I swear..let me tell you I know what it is like to be obsessive I have OCD and I will write someone when I feel ignored I am doing much better thank goodness but I never said cruel things before she is one sick girl.... she sounds like she needs some serious help bad!!!!! read my posts if you don't mind about my ex husband now I will say that we should have never been married we didn't know each other long enough he was a marine and he was abusive but sorry I am rambling no zoloft yet lol.. the point is he should have just stopped all together you sound like a sweet lady and you gave him so many chances to do the right thing if you do stay with him it will take a lot for him to regain your trust I mean I hate to see people get divorced it breaks my heart but in this situation I think that the trust is broken I will pray for you both and good luck..
god bless you both,Renee' http://www.healthboards.com/ubb/gabby.gif
now this is for you sweetie the wife I don't think its wrong for you to feel that you can't trust him again he talked to her on three different occassions what is wrong with that everything I just don't understand men sometimes I swear..let me tell you I know what it is like to be obsessive I have OCD and I will write someone when I feel ignored I am doing much better thank goodness but I never said cruel things before she is one sick girl.... she sounds like she needs some serious help bad!!!!! read my posts if you don't mind about my ex husband now I will say that we should have never been married we didn't know each other long enough he was a marine and he was abusive but sorry I am rambling no zoloft yet lol.. the point is he should have just stopped all together you sound like a sweet lady and you gave him so many chances to do the right thing if you do stay with him it will take a lot for him to regain your trust I mean I hate to see people get divorced it breaks my heart but in this situation I think that the trust is broken I will pray for you both and good luck..
god bless you both,Renee' http://www.healthboards.com/ubb/gabby.gif
Greenberry
10-13-2002, 11:23 AM
Ok wife, if that's really you, RUN as fast as you can away from this guy! Hopefully you have no children yet with him and can make a clean break! GET OUT NOW! Otherwise you may find yourself in the middle of him getting arrested/convicted for his fun, voyeuristic activities. Why would you even want to stick around someone who has lied to you multiple times about a really important issue? This is not like "No dear, those pants don't make you look fat..., this is SERIOUS!! And if you had a daughter, would you want some guy spying on her and taking pictures that he can use to jerk off with later? He doesn't think it's a big deal to do that kind of thing!! That reminds me, whatever you do (even if you don't leave), DO NOT HAVE CHILDREN WITH HIM EVER!!
P.S., If I were you, I would also try to destroy all of the "hours of video footage" that you have made with him to keep it from reappearing later, but it is probably too late because when he reads this he will hide as much as he can. Good luck to you!
P.S., If I were you, I would also try to destroy all of the "hours of video footage" that you have made with him to keep it from reappearing later, but it is probably too late because when he reads this he will hide as much as he can. Good luck to you!