James Langton --> I read your message under my last posting. 30 hours hey? How are you doing now? I found the first week really hard. Does your partner smoke pot? It is really hard if they do... My husband smokes and he doesn't realize he has a problem. I am hoping that he will realize it on his own, but it looks like I may have to force him to quit (like our friend Victoria had to). http://www.healthboards.com/ubb/eek.gif I don't really want to do that though. I have to face my addiction first. I don't really know when it was that I started to quit, but basically I found it pretty easy to get where I am now. About a month ago I decided that I was a pot-head. I told myself I was only going to smoke once or twice a week, then every two weeks. I had a smoke on Tuesday night (2 days ago), but it was over 2 weeks before that. It is really hard to just quit cold turkey, especially since we have at least 1/2 always around the house. I am not going to let myself have another smoke until December. It is just over 2 weeks. I may not even have one. I think I might be ready to just quit. http://www.healthboards.com/ubb/tongue.gif Do it occasionally with friends, but not with my husband. I'm just babbling. I am glad that you have joined our support group James, we can use all the support out there. Good luck and keep us updated.

Jes

Hi Jester Thanks for your reply sorry it's taken me a good few days to get back to you again. I must have been a little woozy when I wrote last time it had in fact been 72 hours not thirty who cares because now it's nearly nine days. and everything is pretty much O.K. I don't have a partner which is really my main reason for quitting although my long term ex used to like to smoke with me. I spoke to her a few weeks ago and she's not smoking now either. I still have hash in a drawer at home that way every time I have a craving it's no big deal I just need to make a positive choice. It sounds like you're doing really well not bothered if you smoke in December or not. that's the right attitude I think take it or leave it. I do have a few points. One I'm really realizing how lucky I am that pot was my drug of choice and not alcohol or cocaine or heroin I don't think I'd be here now if I'd abused those things as much as I've smoked pot 2 I'm feeling very sad http://www.healthboards.com/ubb/frown.gif about all the time I "WASTED" being stoned how much more could I have lived if I hadn't been hiding out. 3 What about my dreams! I've spent the last 25 years drugged out no dreams now there here every night and sooo real Good luck with everything Jes It's nice to talk with other people in the same boat

all my best

James

It is perfectly normal to grieve for what we have lost. You have lost part of your life and you have every right to be angry. So get angry and get it over with don't waste anymore of your life worrying about how much of your life you have wasted.

I don't know who I am giving advice although I've struggled through a lot of battles and marijuana is the last of my battle.

Where I am right now is where I need to be, when I learn what it is I need to learn I will move on.

Ok, I know I'm going to sound like some ignorant punk to you guys in particular, but I can't help but ask,: How on Earth does ANYONE become addicted, or considders(sp?) themself an addict to Mother Natures little herb---pot? Marijuanna is all natural and medically shown not to have the same classification and chemistry as EVERY other drug out there. It's completely in a class of it's own. I'm currious, do anyone of you KNOW just exactly what 'addiction' is? Do you know what it means to be an 'addict'? I just find it so hard to believe that anyone would have to smoke pot continuously throughout the day/night just to 'make it'. Have you had to go to drastic extremes, "sell your soul" even, just to get so much as a 'roach'? Have you spent the last of your money just to re-up again? And when you're out, do you experience true 'withdrawl'? That means, the shakes, innability to wake up, get out of bed, not being able to eat, the irritability and easy set off to rage? Have you chosen pot over your family, like you would rather divorce your spouse and children over it? Have you spent endless hours digging up change from the couch cushions, pawned something of personal value, rolled a 'million' pennies just to get a buzz? Are you even, still, able to get high? Addicts lose the ability to get 'high', they only get buzzed, and for the most part, even though that great 'buzz' to most no longer exists, they still do it b/c they're body will shut down. Does your body shut down, unable to physically function just b/c you didn't smoke pot for 12 hrs? If any of you truly experience the actuall effects of withdrawl just from smoking pot, man, than that's a new one on me. This is a first for me to ever hear of pot addiction, and I am sorry if I sound ignorant to ya'll, I mean no ill-will to anyone, it's just that I'm shocked if people really go through the motions of being an 'addict'. I mean, it has been scientifically/medically prooven that the human body cannot, or should I say, should not become dependent of marijuanna. Again. I mean no malice to ya'll, I'm just currious. I really for for you guys deeply. It's ashame that something so mild & natural could actually put you through such a nightmare. I hope you succeed in your battles w/ addiction. Good luck to you!

I, too, mean no offense, but like "Dammned" I also had trouble with understanding how pt can ruin your life - when you are a coke fiend like me- that "jones" makes you do unthinkable things - I am not into heroin but that is even worse, I hear, due to the physical addiction.

HOWEVER, pot certainly kills motivation and turns some folks into a complete waste of life, so I suspect that is part of it. I have heard that some of the grouchiest people in rehab are potheads - so maybe because it is "n o big deal" and can really relax you- kicking it is very aggravating. - I know many recreational users so it must be a frequency thing...good luck to all in your quest for freedom from ANY substance

Hey D.
Your right...your not stupid or ignorant...pot does not become physically addictive...I don't think anyone said it did or does.
But it is addictive...How you say? well its addictive just like other drugs its a psychological or psychosomatic addiction. Which by the way is way worse than a physical addiction. I appriciate your
doubtful attitude, but it is in error and trying to explain addiction to someone who is not addicted is like trying t explain how bad child birth or kidney stones hurts.
Besides pot is as bad as tobacco on your lungs. I grew up in a pot culture in the sixtys and seventys, when I was in Nam we smoked it anytime we were out of the bush, it helped us keep our sanity. But yea,,,most of my buddys went on to become total potheads and nothing could get their attention much except to make enought money to get somemore weed. Several of them graduated to coke and crack and one to heroin. A couple like myself used whatever they could get their hands on untill we either died, went to prison, or like me traded all those other addictions for two that are not illegal. But neither help my depression.
Peace..


[This message has been edited by TrickyDick (edited 12-15-2000).]

Hello all. This is my first post.

As of today, I have gone 20 days without any drugs/alcohol and it has been 28 days since i smoked dope. i have never tried the harder stuff except lsd once or twice ten yrs ago. weed i have had three eight week stints with in my whole life. i drank almost every day for nine years from 91 to the present.

Weed is addictive no matter what anyone might say. My third and final encounter/obsession with this substance occurred this past autumn starting on 9-15-2000 and finally ending on 11-18-2000. This is what happened.

I was living in Washington DC where I had gone to start law school. Two weeks into the semester, I was barred from one of the subjects final exams due to absences. I had skipped all but one of the six classes of the first two weeks in this one class with a really anal prof on attendance and so i was informed that i would be barred from that class. I therefore had pretty much no choice but to drop out. I had skipped those classes because I figured it was the beginning of the semester and it was no big deal. in fact for the other three classes and profs it was exactly that: no big deal.

So, anyway, I am sitting there in my apt in mid sept printing out resumes and looking for jobs in the paper, on the net and stuff and faxing out resumes and cover letters. It is sept 15, 2000 and friday afternoon. i call a friend of my sister who i had met a few months earlier who had whipped out a blunt on the roof of my sister's apt complex. following this, i had asked to buy weed from him but he had asked me not to call him as he was not a drug dealer and my sister had asked him not to sell to me.

well on sept 15, i called him and he said he would hook me up with his dealer. boy did he ever. i went back again and again and again to his dealer for the next two months, on a daily basis. the very few days i didn't go were days of hell and herculean struggle. i spent every last dollar i had on the stuff. i sold all my furniture and spent it on weed. i did nothing for 2 months except sit in my apt in a daze. my parents came over for four days during columbus day weekend. i had to stop smoking for that time and i promised myself after they left i would not resume smoking pot. they came and i was extremely irritable and angry. i had no appetite whatsoever, even for my mom's fantastic indian cooking. the minute they left, i went to my dealer. he told me to come back at 10 pm but he wasn't there (drug dealers are unreliable, imagine that).

the next day, since i was sick of being ripped off because i was paying this guy twenty bucks for a dime packet of dope i decided to go back to my sister's friend and ask for a different and cheaper hookup. he took me back to the same guy, had me pay for it, and then wanted me to buy him and his three friends beers and philly blunts and use my weed for blunts for the five of us to share, and get this, in a SCHOOLYARD basketball court. why not just smoke it at the police station i thought.

anyway, i said no to all of that. i told him he was welcome to come to my apt and smoke it with me, but there wasn't enough to share with three other strangers and especially not on school property of all places. he became enraged at this and demanded some of the weed, starting insulting me and threatening me. he said he wasn't going to leave my side until i gave him some. said he was going to tell nearby cops that i had it in my pocket. i went into a bar to try and wait it out. and he sat right by the exit so i couldn't leave. i went to the back room to the dart board and put the dime packet in the shrubbery of a plant. then i went outside where there was a cop car sitting at a red light and i told him this guy was threatening me. that got rid of the creep. finally got back to my apt and was shaking , but you know what? still went back to that bar after an hour to get that weed. despite the danger involved, i still went back. that is addiction.

this was mid oct. i continued to go back over and over until i had absolutely no money left whatever. during this time i also lost two thousand dollars on e trade in the stock market.

marijuana is addictive. the only people who don't think so are the ones who are addicted and have been stuck in the same rut since they started using. of course, there are people who can take it or leave it, i have seen this with my own eyes. but if you have an addictive personality as i do , it is best to stay away from the stuff and also anything that is stronger than water.

It is addictive and it will make your dreams go up in smoke. i am living in my parents house now, totally broke and it is prob only because of that that i haven't drank in three weeks or smoked in 4 wks.

good luck to all. i know this account was disjointed but then so is my thinking.

I understand that my addiction to pot is nothing compared to cocaine or heroin, but is is a problem I have and it isn't that fair to say that it is impossible to be addicted to it (Christine and Damned32). I don't know if it is necessarily the chemicals in the marijuana, or if it is strictly the habit, but I was addicted. It is something that I could see others not being able to handle. It is a great feeling to be stoned, and I was doing it at least once every night. I told myself I couldn't sleep without it.

I am also addicted to biting my nails, and cracking my knuckles, are you going to tell me that I am not really addicted to that as well. Marijuana is not just a good natural drug - I believe that cocaine is just as natural as pot! http://www.healthboards.com/ubb/eek.gif Regardless I don't think it makes any of us any better by you telling us that we are not really addicted. I am glad you are able to give us your input, but it makes it a little harder to face our addictions when we are already trying to find excuses to continue our use. http://www.healthboards.com/ubb/frown.gif

[This message has been edited by Jester (edited 12-18-2000).]

[This message has been edited by Jester (edited 12-19-2000).]

Hey Jester,
I suggest you go back and read my post again.
Also, No one ever needs an excuse to use.

Mega-dittos to Tricky-Dick - Jester, we are all here to help each other - not to offend one another - please don't take take what is posted so personally!!

I believe that the person who posted asking how you can become addicted did it quite dplomatlically - I think he (and I know that I) genuinely would love to shed some light on our own addictions and are simply wondering where your heads are at. Pot is NOT physically addictive like heroin, a fact is a fact, therefore there must be a physiological factor that I, for one, would be interested in knowing more about. Addiction is addiction.
Best of luck with our mutual battle.

ok ,anyone that thinks that any behavior can't become addictive doesn't know addiction. you name it you can become a addicted to it. And depending on what that addiction is meeting in terms of your psycholgical needs, will determine how strong that addiction will be.

<WOW!> What a mess. Hmmm... When I first saw this particullar topic, here, I was shocked. Mainly because I had never really heard of such a thing. I did state that I was currious AND that I meant no ill-will to anyone. Apparently, it seem's like most of ya'll responded rather defensively, taking what I had written, perhaps, as an uneducated attack[?]. Either way, I think, maybe, some of ya'll should probobly read it again, and a little slower even. Like I said, my interest of this topic caught the attention of my curriosity. BUT, since I am here, again, I feel a need to clarify some thing's here... a little lesson 101 or somethin'. [Then maybe when , if you do, re-read what I had written, ya'll might have a different reaction] Ok, first on the list goes to: Jester- You wrote..."I don't know if it is necessarily the chemicals in the marijuana, or if it is strictly the
habit, but I was addicted.
I believe that cocaine is just as natural as pot!

I am also addicted to biting my nails, and cracking my knuckles, are you going to tell me
that I am not really addicted to that as well. --- Habit & addiction:2 words most commonly mistaken to mean the same thing. Unfortuneately, for some of ya'll, they are 2 completely different things. The only thing these words have in common is that 'addiction' IS used as slang for the word 'habit'. HABIT- an action or behavior pattern that is regular, repetitive, and often unconscious /
somebody's attitude or general disposition. ADDICTION- a state of physiological or psychological dependence on a drug liable to have a damaging effect. [It also mean's 'devotion to...'. And, yes, I'm afraid that biting your nails & knuckle cracking is not an addiction, that is, of course, unless you are DEVOTED to doing those things constantly..out of devotion.] It is nothing more than a habit. Take note, my friend's... addiction fact's- psychologically dependent /the person using drugs feels they cannot cope or face the
world unless they are under the influence of drugs. This form of dependency has more
to do with the people using the drug rather than about the particular drug they are taking.
.... Physical dependency results from the repeated, heavy use of drugs
Heavy and continual use of these drugs can change the body chemistry so that if someone
does not get a repeat dose they suffer physical withdrawal symptoms - the shakes, flu like
effects. They have to keep taking the drug just to stop themselves from feeling ill.
Continual use of drugs like cannabis, ecstasy and LSD does not result in physical
dependency, even though people may become psychologically dependent. And since we are on the addiction topic, I would like to comment on the response from: dreamer- You had said:..."anyone that thinks that any behavior can't become addictive doesn't know addiction." Well, I'm just gonna be open with ya'll, OH~ I do KNOW addiction, all to well, not only from illegal drugs, but prescription drugs. I think what may be you were tryin to say was that people get "addicted" to whatever & can't control it? That would resemble a behavioral problem, similar to that of O.C.D., which is nothing more than a really freaky habit, a routine. I am not addicted to getting dressed in the mornings, but it is a habit of mine to do so. Ok, now on to Tricky... You had stated that pot is "addictive just like other drugs its a psychological or psychosomatic addiction...
Which by the way is way worse than a physical addiction. I appriciate your
doubtful attitude, but it is in error and trying to explain addiction." Take note: psychological- relating to the mind or mental processes**psychosomatic- mentally induced/
used to describe a physical illness that is caused by mental factors such as stress, or the effects related to such illnesses. Involving both the mind and body. Ever hear the saying, "Mind over matter"? , it's gonna be physically related to ya. All 3 are of equal measure. So, in trying to correct this "error;of explaining addiction", I thouht I'd be more specific. You had also mentioned..." Besides pot is as bad as tobacco on your lungs." Yet, another "error". Actually, media put's that in ya'll's head's, but in all actuallity, the ONLY thing that has been proven time & time again, is that if you smoke extremely LARGE quantities of it, in an enclosed area,ie; room, garage,car..., the only thing that's gonna get ya & hurt you is the carbon monoxide gasses, usually just causing minor bronchitus or infection. It doe's nothing to ya, other than the monoxide, so it doesn't fall under the same class of lung probs/disease as cig's do. Ok, and grand finally here, just to educate ya'll on a few things that were mentioned by some of you,... Cocaine is NOT a natural drug, even though it does come from a plant, but it is chemically enhanced...not natural. : cocaine-
an addictive narcotic drug
chemical make-up: C17 H21 NO4.....** POT- pot
the dried flowers and leaves of the Indian hemp plant, smoked or eaten as a drug
cannabis
a drug produced in various forms from the dried leaves and flowers of the hemp plant,
smoked or chewed. Its recreational use is illegal in most countries.
There is no physical dependence associated with cannabis use. Regular users who stop
smoking do not suffer withdrawal symptoms in the same way as with drugs like heroin.
Even so regular users can become psychologically dependent
Someone who uses cannabis excessively may appear apathetic, lack energy and motivation
and perform poorly at their work or education. This state may carry on for weeks after
stopping use of the drug. However, such a condition seems rare and is similar to what would
be expected from someone who drinks too much or regularly uses tranquillisers. ** Narcotic's & Chemical's-
narcotic
a drug, especially one derived from opium, that has effects ranging from mild dulling of
the senses, pain relief, and sleep, to stupor, coma, and convulsions. Most narcotics are addictive.
...able to induce drowsiness, sleep, or stupor, or alter mental states through its chemical properties

chemical
produced by or involved in the processes of chemistry
composed of or involving the use of chemicals
A chemical has a defined atomic or molecular structure that results from, or takes part in,
reactions involving changes in its structure, composition, and properties. Ok, if you've made it this far, than you actually gave a *@!$# to learn something truthfull, or to just refresh your memory. I will never & have never said or written anything meant to be taken as fact simply based from oppinion. I am an educated 'fool' with hand's on knowledge, friend's & family in the medical and Science carreer, I do my research, so if you still disagree, than please, correct me. [With fact taken from actual M.D.'s, University research/doctors/professors....] I still hope that those of you that do suffer from "pot addiction-like habit" overcome & succeed. Peace & festive jolly-day's to ya'll.

Holy moly Damned32 - did you smoke a big doobie before you got into writing that HUGE message?

No, he is just pissed because some people did'nt like his attitude and is trying to makeup for it. Hey, thats ok, He has some good facts but not the right attitude. Nothing we can do about that except to:
"WISH HIM A HAPPY NEW YEAR"!!!!!

I am laughing my *** off reading this!! This is great!

Thank God for this board and that we are all here to help each other - thank God we all don't think the same way or we would never be able to get help!!!

You are all wonderful people - it is so great to see how passionate we all get over what? Getting better!!!

Happy New Year to all and good luck to us in our mutual battle!!!

I agree... Interesting read. Thanks for the chuckle... http://www.healthboards.com/ubb/tongue.gif

Ok, I give up. I tried. This HAS gotten all too funny. I had NO idea I had such a BAD attitude, must be a "bad habit" of mine. Still, I at least, in my mind, meant no bad attitude to anyone, just trying to clarify...argghhh LOL Anyway's, it was funny to see this particullar site "grow" w/ so much enthusiasm. Oh, and since I love to clarify soooo much, I'm a SHE, not a he. http://www.healthboards.com/ubb/redface.gif) Too much fun, guys, too MUCH fun.

Damned32 has the right idea, not to mention great information to back it up, AND I think he/she handled this entire thing with a lot of tact considering some of the responses posted.

One CANNOT get addicted to marijuana. Are you all so stoned that you can't see this fact? Try putting the doobage down and opening a window in your head to let some of the smoke out.

I really have a problem with people who say that pot is not addictive. That is just not true. Anyone can become addicted to any mind-altering chemical (that can go so far as to include food, sex, adrenaline producing activities, etc.).

To say that pot is non-addictive to someone who struggles with an addiction to it is misleading and extremely discouraging, to say the least. To make light of someone's struggle with their addiction based on their drug of choice (pot) is just plain nasty. Damned32, before you go on to tell me that you didn’t make light of Jester’s addiction or pot addiction in general, go on and re-read your posts .

Jester has decided to discontinue his use of pot and try to live life clean, without mind-altering chemicals. Jester has determined that he is addicted to pot, that it has affected his life in negative ways, and he wants to change it. I don’t think that Jester or addicts generally need to “hit their bottom” before they can clean up. But, sadly, I know that most of us did.

I know three people personally that are addicted to pot. My partner, clean for over six years, is addicted to pot. Without getting into all of the gory details, he: left pilot training in the army for it; left a woman he loved for it; stole money from jobs he worked at for it; and ended up on the skids on Welfare for it. An ex-roommate of mine, who continues to use, has all but dropped out of society, and spends any money he has on pot first; food, rent, etc. second.

Withdrawal symptoms associated with pot addiction include inability to sleep, loss of appetite, agitatation and irritability.

Addiction is a lot more than physical dependence to a substance.

“Addiction is a biopsychosocial disease.

It is psychological. As addiction progresses there are personality changes. Psychological problems relating to thinking and feeling develop. The brain and central nervous system are affected by addiction (neurological impairments). Neurological impairments include impairments in the ability to do abstract thinking, to concentrate, to remember, overreaction to stress and lowered ability to tolerate stress. As a result of these impairments addicts begin to see themselves differently than they did before. Self-image changes.

It is behavioral. As addiction progresses it affects not only the body, mind and feelings, but also behavior. It affects your actions, your performance, the way you function. In the early stages, addicts use to improve behavior, but eventually they use just in an effort to function normally. As life becomes more and more substance centered, addicts have less and less control over behavior. They lose interest in activities that were once important. Getting ready to use, using, and recovering from using become their life activities. Anything that interferes with those activities gets pushed aside. Life is consumed by the need to use. When using becomes more important than anything else, addicts begin to violate their own value systems.

It is social. The effects of addiction are far reaching. They aren’t limited to the physical, psychological, and behavioral deterioration of the addict. The lives of the people the addict lives with, works with, and associates with are affected. As life becomes more substance centered, addicts isolate themselves from other people. They give up social activities that were important to them because the activities interfere with their using. Friends and acquaintances separate themselves from the addict because his/her behavior becomes embarrassing or offensive. The family withdraws from social contacts out of fear of what the addict may do. Children stop bringing their friends around; the spouse doesn’t invite people to the house. Communication skills are lost as the addict withdraws to use alone. “

The foregoing is quoted from writings by Terence T. Gorski, M.A., former Director of treatment centres, consultant to national and international alcoholism programs, lecturer and author.

Damned32, I appreciate that you got your information from medical professionals and professors, but in all fairness, unless a doctor, psychiatrist, therapist or counselor is specifically trained in addictions, they do not have the knowledge at hand to make declarations regarding addiction.

I want to add that just because pot is addictive, people who smoke are not necessarily addicted to it, just like everyone that drinks is not an alcoholic. This post is in no way meant to judge or presume that someone is an addict if they use pot (or whatever), recreationally or otherwise. Addiction is a very personal thing - and only each person can determine if they have a substance abuse problem or not.

I want to apologize to everyone for how long this post is. I, obviously, feel very strongly about this issue.

Be well.


[This message has been edited by Casper (edited 01-25-2001).]

Hey Casper,
Good post, long or not. But I think that this is getting out of hand. Arguing about it is only hurting peoples feelings. So I suggest we stop. Any more posts by either "side" should not be responded to.

Casper - thanks for the kind words to support me - just one thing I am not a he!!! I am a 23 year old woman, regardless I do appreciate your words.

Damned32 and indamnified - I don't think you should be posting your messages here. I think that by telling me and others that we are not addicted to pot just because you think it is not addictive is plain out WRONG!! I understand that you don't think that you could be addicted to pot, but if you look at a lot of the people out there who are addicted to cocaine or heroin it usually started with pot or alcohol. Personally I don't think that alcohol is addictive, but that is only because I have never been addicted to it. I can drink and not drink it doesn't matter, but with pot I have a harder time controlling myself.

I think I am actually out of the "bad spot" where I have to avoid pot. I am not craving it anymore, when I get upset or depressed I still reach for it, but I am getting better at self-restraint. My husband thinks just like Damned32 and indamnified. He smokes pot about once a day, sometimes he takes a day off, sometimes he smokes a couple of times. But he thinks that it is just "casual". Unfortunately he doesn't seem to have fun when he is stoned anymore, also he CANNOT have fun sober. It is a catch 22. Anyway, I am glad that there are a lot of people who care so much about this topic. http://www.healthboards.com/ubb/tongue.gif

(heavy sigh).... I agree that we should no longer argue the point of PHYSICAL addiction VS. PSYCHOLOGICAL DEPENDENCY. As a guy in my group says everyday - "I have a thinking disease whether I use or not". Amen.

I do not advised any one to smoke pot, but I have been smoking pot for seven years. I don't smoke everyday, maybe three sometimes four times a week. I work 30 hours a week, and I am a full-time college student. I have no problems with my grades, and never had any problems in school. I am very smart and I don't feel like i'm 13 years old. (the age I started.) I don't smoke weed during the day and let it get in the way of my school work. But a night, after a hard long day, there is nothing like lighting up a joint and relaxing. I do not believe in any other drugs, and have never even tried any other substances, and don't ever in my life plan on it!

I do not advised any one to smoke pot, but I have been smoking pot for seven years. I don't smoke everyday, maybe three sometimes four times a week. I work 30 hours a week, and I am a full-time college student. I have no problems with my grades, and never had any problems in school. I am very smart and I don't feel like i'm 13 years old. (the age I started.) I don't smoke weed during the day and let it get in the way of my school work. But a night, after a hard long day, there is nothing like lighting up a joint and relaxing. I do not believe in any other drugs, and have never even tried any other substances, and don't ever in my life plan on it!

I have stumbled upon this big pot debate and I have to say this all seems like alot of drama over physical v.s. mental addiction.
Although stories of physical withdrawl and addiction strong enough to steal to support what is probably the cheapest drug habit around seems a little far fecthed, I cannot judge. The sad tales of destructive behavior are no matter what real to those who say they have experienced them. It seems to me however when talking about drug addiction people tend to use drugs as a crutch to blame their self destructive behavior on.If one looks at the drug culture and the self abuse that goes on it is very obvious that beyond the particular drug of choice and its individual chemicaly addictive properties there are many other forces at play. We have all been told pot is a gateway drug that leads to other drugs.However, to be more honest pot leads people to other people who smoke it and very well may be into various other drugs. The socialization between these various drug users leads to experimentations that may go past pot and on to other substance abuse(self abuse). There is a common thread here. Those people who go past recreational usage to the point of endangering themselves and others around them all have very similar self destructive emotional, or psychological problems "addictive personalities." Most often rather than deal with their problems this personality type tries to cure or avoid dealing with problems by way of habitual behaviors.Low self esteem, trauma from past sexual or mental abuse,unresolved guilt,and lack of healthy socialization with others are just a few of the common underlying causes of "addictive" self destructive behavior. Trying to fill those voids with sex, drugs, alcohol,self mutilation, etc. to excess is the real dead end road. In some ways the codependant ties between "addicts" who are heading in the same downward spiral justifying each others actions and helping to pull each other down are more dangerous than the addictions. This is evident when you see people go through counseling programs such as 12 step programs kicking the habbit successfully only to fall back into the addiction when the same old friends come back around. The drug culture can be like a reverse 12 step program.Nobody wants to destroy their lives alone and they usually seem to try to drag their rehabilitated freinds back down. They support each other in self destruction. That being said,I can see how some people can take any habbit and destroy thier lives with a little help from their "freinds." To blame it all on the drugs is really missing the point. You may ask what about physical addiction? What about when your body can't handle it and goes through withdrawl? Those are nice excuses, however you don't get to that point without those pesky underlying personality problems. Those problems helped lead you to doing things that are known to be dangerous or that even if you had not heard all the negative facts you know you knew better but did it anyway. Ex. Heroin junkies are very visibly not exciting role models. Speaking of a hard and physically addictive drug like heroin, did you know that Rolling Stones guitarist Keith Richards explained in a magazine article that the reason he has been able to do heroin all this time and not destroy himself is because he controls himself with a strick regimine of controlled dosages as well as taking time off from the drug so that he is in control instead of the heroin. That is plain old recreational use of one of the most addictive drugs known. I can see why damned32 and others found that addiction to pot physically seemed odd considering our own U.S. government funded studies have shown pot to have no physically addictive qualities. Its quite likely that those who have a so called "pot addiction' may find the answer to freedom by taking a deep introspective look at the people they use with and the problems they are avoiding dealing with. Solving the underlying problems by getting good, supportive ,like minded friends to help each other succeed and grow in positive emotional and mental directions is the only long time cure for addiction.Deal with problems openly and honestly with yourself. Look within for the answer not an escape. You abuse yourself with the addiction the addiction does not abuse you. GOOD LUCK TO ALL OF YOU LOOKING FOR A LIFELINE OF HOPE AND LOVE.LEARN TO LOVE YOURSELVES THERE ARE ALOT OF GOOD THINGS TO ENJOY IN LIFE THAT DON'T DESTROY YOU,BUT UPLIFT YOUR SPIRIT.

9

Wow, what a debate. If we spent as much time working on our problems as with this, we'd be in good shape. Everyone else said their peace, so here is mine
We are all different and respond differently to chemicals. What is essential to one person, another could take or leave. Recovering is up to the individual, and never easy. And finally, these boards are a domain of free speech and everyone should be able to say what they want. But if it doesn't help, maybe it doesn't need to be said. Peace to all.

Let me enter in here...
the boards are not a domain of free speech, as the website is privately owned, and this is not an open forum. There are clear guidelines for use of the boards.

Therefore, it is best to get back on topic, which is support in dealing with addictions.
We don't need to judge others addictions or addictiveness. If they say they are, please just accept it. If you can't, leave it to someone else.

Thanks...enjoy the boards!

Hey there, I'm a bit new ta all this so bear with me! I have been addicted to pot for a couple of years now and would like firstly to agree in principle with the opinions expressed by damned32. tho I cannot speak from experience, the hell of being a slave to hard drugs is plain to see to those who care to notice and I would be a fool to compare the withdrawal symptoms of pot to what other addicts endure. Yet, it seems to me that pot presents a different set of challenges to its victims. We all started for whatever reason but wind up shaping our addiction to our lifestyle, to tha point where it becomes hard to justify just why we should, in fact, give up. I know that I can get smashed b4 work, get thru the day with ease (maybe even enjoy myself @ work!) Then come home and get smashed again, do what I have to do as I am active in the sporting community, get wasted again, go ta bed then get up and do it all again.........so whats my problem? My problem is that there was a time when I could do all this without pot and now I have trouble convincing my brain to admit to this. I can identify with a lot of the posts here, the idea of giving up your "best mate" seems unbearable! why? he helps me belive that my shortcomings are bearable and that it's ok to live in my sheltered little world where I very rarely *** up! Sounds good eh? nahah! Wanna know why I never *** up? Because I don't give myself the chance to!!!!!!! Pot takes away ur drive, your will to make a difference in the world. Nah, pot don't compare to the hard drugs when it comes to quitting. Nevertheless it is a serious problem to all the people who have taken the time to seek wisdom in the postings of others who are experiencing similar problems, and should not be trivialised by those with a narrow point of view.