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Old 10-30-2007, 12:47 AM   #1
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Angular Stomatitis (Cheilitis)/Candida albicans (yeast infection) vs Herpes

[url]http://www.healthboards.com/boards/showthread.php?p=3261648#post3261648[/url]

I posted this a while ago. Mostly concerning about tests I took. They concerned my status before the event which made me suspicious I had something.

It's been about 2 months from that sexual event. About an hour after sex I got a bump on my lip. I'm told this can't happen due to herpes or any sexual disease, unless it's a prior case. Lets rule that out, because bloodwork indicates I didn't have type I or II.

Now, a month and half later I'm getting inflamation under my lips, along the lining of my inner lip. There are no clusters, but the moment I lightly squeezed my inner lip, the area above my lip got inflamed and turned light white. I was concerned that was a fever blister, so I decided it was best to leave it alone and wait. Five days later the whitish bump is slowly shrinking and turning to a normal color. There was no clusters or visible dots to indicate an obvious cold sores. I'm not sure whether or not I have herpes or I just irritated something else in my mouth.

Upon my internet investigation, and the feeling my primary doctor doesn't know much about STD's, I found 'angular stomatitis', which perfectly descripes my lip condition. Especially the inner lining of my lip.

Quote:
Angular stomatitis refers to inflammation, cracking, or irritation at the corners of the mouth. In contrast, herpes infections usually appear on the upper or lower lip margins, not in the corners. Angular stomatitis may be an initial sign of anemia or vitamin deficiency. It can also occur in people who wear dentures, whose saliva can accumulate and lead to the overgrowth of yeast.
I've always had dry cracked lips, especially after taking accutane (acne medicine)...which is said to spur it on. I'm wondering if my genital and oral complications are part of former sensitive skin issues (e.g dermatits) and a possible yeast infection the girl may have given me. Angular stomatitis or chellitis is said to come from many things: including yeast build-up, dermatitis, b12 defiency, anemia, etc...

As far as my penis goes, it was for the last 20 days very blotchy...no lesions, no clusters....just look like a mild rash. The less I probe at it, the more it looks like it's getting normal. My doctor didn't think anything of it. He just told me to use a sensitive lotion.

He prescribed lotion for my dermatitis...which is above my eyes and on my upper back. This dermatitis just came right after the sex...which he says is unrelated.

I'm sort of weighing the odds on my infection of herpes vs it being something else. We're all told symptoms can be mild or not present at all....

I'm just wondering if my symptom are unrelated. Given I've been out in the sun quite a bit,...and clusters or obvious herpes hasn't formed this close to my possible infection...do you think the above indicates little chance of herpes infection?

I wish blood work was faster to indicate this stuff....

 
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Old 10-30-2007, 07:56 AM   #2
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Re: Angular Stomatitis (Cheilitis)/Candida albicans (yeast infection) vs Herpes

Sounds like ya got a hodgepodge of skin related issues. A new dermatologist might be in order. Less worry about what it is might also help. My vote is its not herpes. Although maybe if you try hard enough you could talk yourself into it. (yes, this is impossible so lets get real here)

Did you ever have your mouth sores swabbed and cultured?

If you only drew blood after a short period of time after your sexual experience and IF you were exposed and contracted herpes it would not show up in a blood test.

Heres to you finding some relief.

 
Old 10-30-2007, 12:24 PM   #3
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Re: Angular Stomatitis (Cheilitis)/Candida albicans (yeast infection) vs Herpes

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Originally Posted by Ca.Girl2 View Post
[FONT="Comic Sans MS"][SIZE="3"]Sounds like ya got a hodgepodge of skin related issues. A new dermatologist might be in order.
He's just my primary doctor. It's an HMO, so unfortunately in this case I have to go through him. In most cases I feel he's a rather competent doctor, but since the level of his information seems inadequate or wrong at time (about STD's),...I feel a bit uneasy.

Quote:
Less worry about what it is might also help. My vote is its not herpes. Although maybe if you try hard enough you could talk yourself into it. (yes, this is impossible so lets get real here)
I'm fairly convinced I have stomatitis...and apparently the net says you can get that from a herpes infection. It's said to be likely from a type I infection....if it's from that. That strikes me as odd, though. I would think if I can get all this inflamation,...I would likely have some lesions on my outer lip...but I don't.

I have swelled inner lips..unnoticeable till I open my mouth. I have canker sores on the four corners of my mouth. And when I squeeze my mouth together I get that puffy mouth sensation. Some areas are going down in swelling, and others are just forming. The one area that turned whitish on the outside appears to be back to normal...although I've let my facial hair grow...and there MIGHT be a little rash there. Not quite sure. It itches a bit, but it doesn't hurt.
Quote:
Did you ever have your mouth sores swabbed and cultured?
No, my doctor says I need lesion that look like herpes to do that. Nothing looks like the text book version of herpes to him or me.
Quote:
If you only drew blood after a short period of time after your sexual experience and IF you were exposed and contracted herpes it would not show up in a blood test.
Yes, I have to wait a few months. 3-4. My guess is either I have a body rash due to weather changes, a yeast infection from her, b12 deficiency, or type I herpes. I'm not quite sure I have type II, but I wouldn't rule it out.

My lips tend to get warm when I put my lip protectant on. Odd feeling.

I was told on my second Herpes Select test (from the agency that gave me the results), that type I herpes isn't something to overly worry about. That I could inform any new partner of it, but generally it's not something to be too concerned about. That it's not likely going efffect my genital regions on a permanent basis...that if anything, it will come back a few times there. That it's more prevalent in the oral region than the genital.

Is that information correct?

 
Old 10-30-2007, 02:04 PM   #4
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Re: Angular Stomatitis (Cheilitis)/Candida albicans (yeast infection) vs Herpes

Herpes 1 is more prevalent in the oral region than the genital region.
Can live either or though. Not to fussy when push comes to shove if ya know what I mean.

And remember, you cant believe everything you read off the internet.

good luck

 
Old 10-30-2007, 04:41 PM   #5
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Re: Angular Stomatitis (Cheilitis)/Candida albicans (yeast infection) vs Herpes

I'm not sure I'd agree with your doctor that HSV 1 isn't something to worry about. You can't let it run your life, but at the same time you need to be aware of what the effects are... Guess it depends on your point of view...

 
Old 10-30-2007, 11:08 PM   #6
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Re: Angular Stomatitis (Cheilitis)/Candida albicans (yeast infection) vs Herpes

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ca.Girl2 View Post
Herpes 1 is more prevalent in the oral region than the genital region.

And remember, you cant believe everything you read off the internet.
ha...Yeah, the internet isn't always reliable, but nevertheless...it's full of info.

So...IF this is a viral stomatitis, I could safely assume it's type 1, and not likely type 2. Although that doesn't dismiss it could be. Nor does it mean I don't have type 2 down below or not...or type 1 for that matter.

Last edited by moderator2; 10-31-2007 at 06:02 AM. Reason: disallowed website

 
Old 10-31-2007, 12:22 AM   #7
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Re: Angular Stomatitis (Cheilitis)/Candida albicans (yeast infection) vs Herpes

It is true what the Herpes Select agency told you regarding genital HSV-1. Type 1 does not thrive in the genital area, and outbreaks tend to be one/year and then even less or none again after that. But then again, herpes affects everyone differently.

For instance, many people acquire oral herpes type one as a child, have OBs then, but then as an adult never suffer from OBs again. While others suffer from chronic oral herpes outbreaks. The same holds true for genital HSV-2. That is partly why this virus continues to be spread so rampantly. About 40% of the population doesn't suffer from frequent or noticeable OBs, while the rest of us have very severe, chronic OBs that rule our lives. So that 40% doesn't think anything of informing their partners and spreading it, because they either don't know they have it, or don't really care because it barely affects them. The other side is that most doctors don't even bother to test for herpes, or as you've found out personally, they are not aware there are good and bad tests, and don't know much about the virus. I feel more women than men tend to have more severe OBs...I've read it, too. Since many more women seem to write on here about their severe genital symptoms, I think that statement holds up. It just goes to show you how little, and far behind the medical community is on health issues that affect women and how conditions affect the sexes differently.

BTW, you may have gotten candida from your last sex partner, but usually men can only get it if they have an underlying poor immune system that allows its manifestation. Try typing in the search box for "candida" and see if any useful info comes up. It is definitely a serious concern. I agree with another person on here that you should seek seeing an actual dermatologist who knows more than your GP. A urologist might be in order after that, as they specialize in male reproductive areas and would probably know more about herpes and STDs. Try taking a daily probiotic supplement for several weeks and see if that does any good. Health food stores sell all kinds of candida cleansing products these days, too. Check them out. If you've taken lots of antibiotics in your life, a candida condition can be caused by that.

 
Old 10-31-2007, 08:22 PM   #8
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Re: Angular Stomatitis (Cheilitis)/Candida albicans (yeast infection) vs Herpes

Quote:
Originally Posted by Oceanus View Post
It is true what the Herpes Select agency told you regarding genital HSV-1. Type 1 does not thrive in the genital area, and outbreaks tend to be one/year and then even less or none again after that. But then again, herpes affects everyone differently.
I was told HSV-1 has to make it's home up near the back of the neck, and since the genitals are so far away...it doesn't come back that often or at all. Something like that...don't quote me.

Quote:
For instance, many people acquire oral herpes type one as a child, have OBs then, but then as an adult never suffer from OBs again. While others suffer from chronic oral herpes outbreaks. The same holds true for genital HSV-2. That is partly why this virus continues to be spread so rampantly. About 40% of the population doesn't suffer from frequent or noticeable OBs, while the rest of us have very severe, chronic OBs that rule our lives. So that 40% doesn't think anything of informing their partners and spreading it, because they either don't know they have it, or don't really care because it barely affects them.
I want to know, and I want to be honest with any new partner...but I don't want it to disable a relationship if it's not at all reasonable. That meaning, I don't want to give fear to someone uninfected when perhaps that fear is unwarranted.

Then again, I don't know if I am infected. And even if I test positive for type I, I won't really know if it's down there...unless I have a lesion.


Quote:
BTW, you may have gotten candida from your last sex partner, but usually men can only get it if they have an underlying poor immune system that allows its manifestation.
Sometimes I think I do have a poor immune system. A year and a half ago I was coughing for four months. My doctor (at that point in time) could not give me a reason. I was tested for STD's, but I had none. Cancer, anemia etc...nothing. Years later I was told by my doctor to avoid dogs and he gave me a nasal spray. While my coughing wasn't as bad with the new doctor, my new doctor (which is my current doctor)...actually effectively ended my coughing all together. My runny nose was no-longer running.

I felt revitalized. I'm not sure if it's the dogs not being around or the nose spray...or something else.

Quote:
Try typing in the search box for "candida" and see if any useful info comes up. It is definitely a serious concern. I agree with another person on here that you should seek seeing an actual dermatologist who knows more than your GP. A urologist might be in order after that, as they specialize in male reproductive areas and would probably know more about herpes and STDs.
I'm on a HMO...my primary doctor would have to refer me. I feel uneasy saying I don't trust your opinion, can you refer me to another doctor....but at the same time I think this issue needs to be resolved. I just want to know what I have.

BTW, the symptom candida seem to be relating to me...quite a bit. Body rash, atheletes foot (which I think I had), 'fogged-in' feeling, etc...I feel like I'm getting a whole bunch of non-related things. Perhaps candida may be it...perhaps.


Quote:
Try taking a daily probiotic supplement for several weeks and see if that does any good. Health food stores sell all kinds of candida cleansing products these days, too. Check them out. If you've taken lots of antibiotics in your life, a candida condition can be caused by that.
For five months I took an antibiotic for acne ...a few years later I would have the coughing symptom for months...and now this. As bad as it sounds, I hope that's all related...and none of this does anything to bad.

 
Old 11-01-2007, 04:51 AM   #9
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Re: Angular Stomatitis (Cheilitis)/Candida albicans (yeast infection) vs Herpes

HSV1 makes it's home in the nerve endings in the base of your neck if you have it orally. This wouldn't affect your genitals at all. If, however, you get or have the virus genitally then it's home is the base of your spine.

So your doctor saying it won't affect your genitals is correct, providing the virus isn't diagnosed there as well.

Same goes for HSV2 in reverse.

 
Old 11-01-2007, 10:49 AM   #10
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Re: Angular Stomatitis (Cheilitis)/Candida albicans (yeast infection) vs Herpes

Quote:
Originally Posted by catharine101 View Post
HSV1 makes it's home in the nerve endings in the base of your neck if you have it orally. This wouldn't affect your genitals at all. If, however, you get or have the virus genitally then it's home is the base of your spine.

So your doctor saying it won't affect your genitals is correct, providing the virus isn't diagnosed there as well.

Same goes for HSV2 in reverse.
I hear that HSV2 on the lip is only 6% of most oral herpes...ie it's kind of rare. And given I had angular stromatitis (as the swelling in the inner lining of my lip is going down), it's even more unlikely a type 2 there...atleast from what I read, and if I have it.

From what I'm reading, but without quoting it or listing the site address...it says that each type lose it's punch if it's not in it's favorite areas. 30% of new herpes infections on the genitals are said to be type one, and they often don't ever reaccur or appear at all. 2-5% reaccur..while University of Washington says type II on the genitals is 10 times more likely to reaccur.

Apparently they've done studies where 110 women had an average of 0 reaccurances in a year from type I....while others indicate 1 OB at the most. Which makes me ponder...if it's not reaccuring, how often will it be shedding? Does that increasingly reduce shedding or are these processes wholly independent of each other?

Note: I can't find the rule on sharing info..if this is the wrong way, correct me and give me a link, please.

 
Old 11-01-2007, 03:57 PM   #11
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Re: Angular Stomatitis (Cheilitis)/Candida albicans (yeast infection) vs Herpes

All those stats sound about right. Keeping in mind that they vary a bit wherever you go.

Of course, you have to remember that there are always exceptions - for some reason the exceptions seem to crop up more than you'd expect from the stats!!

As for the recurrence of shedding - I've heard it both ways. That the longer you are OB free the less shedding there is. And also that you continue to shed the same amount. Take your pick.

So now, this thread has gone on so long - refresh my memory. Have you yet been diagnosed with herpes, or are you still waiting??

 
Old 11-01-2007, 11:24 PM   #12
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Re: Angular Stomatitis (Cheilitis)/Candida albicans (yeast infection) vs Herpes

Quote:
Originally Posted by catharine101 View Post
So now, this thread has gone on so long - refresh my memory. Have you yet been diagnosed with herpes, or are you still waiting??
Waiting. Took one test which said I had it, but found out the combination test wasn't reliable...took another 15 days later which was HerpesSelect (type specific), which said I had neither. So prior cases of anything aren't likely, imo.

Of coarse I need to wait another month atleast, to let the anti-bodies form or not (as I had my sexual experience in early sept). I'm crossing my fingers, and hoping that it's all just some odd symptom of something that's mild in comparison e.g allergies, mild candida, etc....

 
Old 11-02-2007, 04:49 AM   #13
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Re: Angular Stomatitis (Cheilitis)/Candida albicans (yeast infection) vs Herpes

That's right, I remember now. I do agree with others - you need to see a more knowledgeable doctor. A dermatologist to start with. Don't feel bad about asking your doctor for a referral - they get asked for second opinions all the time. And really, what's more important?? His feelings or your health??

And here's a laugh for all you Americans this morning - what the heck does HMO stand for anyway?? I know from context it's got to be like a regular health care doctor/provider etc. But it's not an acronym we use here and it's been driving me nuts!

 
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