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Old 12-04-2004, 01:28 AM   #1
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Am I just totally buggared??

Everyone always says in order to be loved, you must first love yourself. Here's my question/problem regarding that:
Ever since I was five years old, if I showed any sort of confidence or moxy, I was labeled annoying, spastic or arrogant or thinking I was "princess", when nothing could have been further from the truth. If someone was trying to walk over me, I'd speak up and say "hey, you can't do that" and I would be told to be quiet, quite whining, etc. If I held my tongue and deferred to someone else, I was labeled indecisive, frustratingly weak and timid. I soon learned to disengage and not even relate to people on any sort of real intimate level, even though it's what I wanted most in the world, I just didn't know how to do it very well, anyway. Then I met a man who I thought genuinely cared for me and who loved me, or at the very least was my friend. It turned out he had lied to me about pretty much everything. He was just using me and told me all the things he told me to get what he wanted, then dumped me quite unceremoniously when he was done. This seems to have been the last straw. This happened quite a few years ago and I still can't stop crying. I was talking to a mutual friend yesterday about this situation and other things, life, love, God, and other things. I asked him about that Jim Carrey movie, Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind, where a man is left by his girlfriend and he's in so much pain about it, he decides to have his memory of the relationship erased. This "friend" and I were playing a sort of truth or dare and I asked him if this procedure were real, would there be any relationship he would want erased? I guess I implied that I would erase the memory of my relationship with my ex (his friend). He got very angry and said I hadn't learned anything and that I was stupid for asking such a stupid question. I thought I was simply expressing the fact that this guy hurt me so badly, and damaged me so irreperably that I would be better off if I could just get rid of my memories of this relationship. Anyway, his reaction not only confused me, but it hurt, insulted and angered me. Though I just sort of took it. I dont' understand why people talk to me this way when they wouldn't dream of talking to anyone else this same way. And please don't tell me "because you let them." Every time I have attempted to stand my ground and defend myself, I either got beaten, punished, fired, or otherwise made to pay for not taking it. Which is why somewhere along the line, I learned to not defend myself anymore. To the point where I think I've totally forgotten how.
What this all boils down to is this: Before this guy (my ex) I had issues with defense mechanisms, assertiveness, and self esteem, but after him, I can't seem to get up off the ground. I look in the mirror and where I used to see a pretty, intelligent, talented, if misunderstood and often ill-used, young lady, I now see nothing but a pile of garbage that doesn't deserve to loved by anybody, obviously since no one ever has. My question - how do you get out of this hole by yourself, when it feels like what you need to climb out is a hand to help pull you out? How can you love yourself when no one else does? I don't think I can do this. I'm supposed to pick myself up and get healthy before I can even think of being loved by someone, yet I feel that the one thing I need to be healthy IS to be loved by someone? I can't even get myself to believe God loves me anymore, which is huge for me. No matter how bad things got, I always believed God would take care of things for me and it would turn out ok and that He loved me and wanted good things for me. I can't feel that way anymore. I felt so blessed when I was with my ex, and I believed God loved me. I know that just because things get bad, it doesn't mean God doesn't love you. But I just can't feel Him anymore. I know that a relationship doesn't solve all your problems, but I can't help but feel that the one thing that I could use the most is just a pair of arms around me. Is there anyone out there who had no friends at all, no one at all to talk to, no family to speak of, no one to care about you, and picked yourself and built a life for yourself totally by yourself and went on to find love and fulfillment sharing your life with someone else? Is it possible? Or am I just buggared? Does anyone have first hand, personal experience that proves this is possible? Or am I wasting my time, and should I just accept that I'm just not supposed to be happy?

Last edited by Ninispjc; 12-04-2004 at 01:42 AM.

 
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Old 12-04-2004, 02:51 AM   #2
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Re: Am I just totally buggared??

Not sure if I should bother trying to help, since I'm pretty much the opposite of you, in that I've never been in a serious relationship and don't ever talk to my friends about anything important to me, but I'll try anyways. Number one things is: ALL memories and experiences are able to be learned from. Regardless how painful they are, even if they seem unbearable. I've learned this about myself, that oftentimes the worst memories are the ones that have shaped the good things about me. The important thing is to discern what results it had on you, and to try to lessen the damage it's done while reinforcing the good things. Being used by a guy would hurt you and make you withdraw, but it would also teach you what things to look for in other men, and you could keep an eye on your friends and give them the head's up if their boyfriends seem suspicious to you. That's probably 99% wrong in your case, but you see what I'm getting at. Find the good things and focus on them. I promise there are some.

The second thing is: no one's worthless. Regardless how many things might be wrong with you, they're finite and can be overcome, and you have your own unique variety of strengths to offer, also. I can't tell you what they are, you'll have to find them on your own, but I have NEVER met ANYone who I thought was worthless.

As for living your entire life alone and stuff, I do. It sucks. Totally just sucks. The worst part about it is that no one notices, I live with my parents, I have friends I see regularly, I have a job and go to school, and none of it means a **** thing. I finally gave up on communicating with people in 7th grade and haven't told anyone anything remotely important to me ever since. The pros are that I don't have to put up with all the crap I used to, but I'm still not happy and sometimes I feel like I'm going to explode if I don't vent. Thank God for the internet.

Anyways, since you have friends you can really talk to, enjoy it. As for God, that's not an area in which I can really help right now. I'm having similar problems there as well. I just can't picture a future for myself at all, let alone one with God in it, and it's troubling.

I guess this probably told you a lot of nothing, but it's my 2 cents. Don't spend it all in one place.

 
Old 12-04-2004, 06:17 AM   #3
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Re: Am I just totally buggared??

Quote:
Originally Posted by 18AndDumb
... but it's my 2 cents. Don't spend it all in one place.
Great line, 18! I think I'm gonna have to borrow it!

ninispjc, I would strongly recommend counseling for you. You CAN learn to stand up for yourself despite your background and you CAN learn to like yourself better. A great place to start is with a counselor.

 
Old 12-04-2004, 02:21 PM   #4
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Re: Am I just totally buggared??

All of the Hitlers, Stalins, and Mussolinis can not compare to the ruthlessness of the petty tyrants of this world that we face every day.

The individuals that like to tear down our self preserving instincts are more ill than we are and running from their own truths.

"We are more than merely passive receptacles of other people's views of us" -Nathaniel Branden

I think you can judge for yourself how selfish, arrogant, etc you may or may not be on your own. Just do not take anything personally. It has more to do with them and not you.

I do not think anyone or anything can abandon you before you abandon yourself. Just a thought.

Hope something here makes sense and you start feeling a little better.
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Old 12-05-2004, 02:22 AM   #5
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Re: Am I just totally buggared??

I guess I must be the freakish exception to the rule. I think the "no one can abandon you unless you abandon yourself first" is pretty much just victim blaming. The truth is, you can feel wonderful about yourself and there will still be people who will try to sabatoge you and who will lie to you and try to wreck your life.

I actually tried therapy on and off for four years. I tried prozac, but had a bad allergic reaction. But nothing seems to help. I guess I am just totally buggared. Everyone says no one will love you until you love yourself, only you can fix you, ext. But I loved myself when I was a kid, and no one else loved me. I fell in love with a man once, and thought I deserved better treatment than he gave me, and instead of treating me better, he left, and now he's happily married and I'm still alone. I don't know why I don't deserve love or to be happy, but I guess I just don't.

 
Old 12-05-2004, 06:08 AM   #6
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Re: Am I just totally buggared??

"No one can abandon themself until everyone else already has" how's that one? Anyways, as far as I'm concerned that stuff's just a case of kicking someone when they're down. You're totally screwed up, and therefore incapable of fixing it. We went out of our way to put you there. But it's still your fault. You selfish B****rd.

I dunno, I just don't see why anyone beleives that. Granted you have control over yourself first, but everyone loves themselves, at least to an extent. How can you know if you have good reason to do so unless other people do, too? You have a vested interest in loving yourself, they do not. So shouldn't you go by the objective opinion rather than the biased one? I dunno, I just don't see why people do some of the things they do. You can't blame everyone for your problems, but for the same people who refuse to help you fix it to blame you for it is just sadistic and moronic as far as I'm concerned.

PS- Be careful of HOW you stick up for yourself. I've seen people who were perfectly in the right manage to, rather than point out that they were right, simply insult and anger people while trying to stick up for themselves. Just tread lightly and try to stick to the facts, best advise I can give.

Last edited by 18AndDumb; 12-05-2004 at 06:09 AM.

 
Old 12-05-2004, 06:23 AM   #7
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Re: Am I just totally buggared??

Quote:
Originally Posted by 18AndDumb
"No one can abandon themself until everyone else already has" how's that one? Anyways, as far as I'm concerned that stuff's just a case of kicking someone when they're down. You're totally screwed up, and therefore incapable of fixing it. We went out of our way to put you there. But it's still your fault. You selfish B****rd.

I dunno, I just don't see why anyone beleives that. Granted you have control over yourself first, but everyone loves themselves, at least to an extent. How can you know if you have good reason to do so unless other people do, too? You have a vested interest in loving yourself, they do not. So shouldn't you go by the objective opinion rather than the biased one? I dunno, I just don't see why people do some of the things they do. You can't blame everyone for your problems, but for the same people who refuse to help you fix it to blame you for it is just sadistic and moronic as far as I'm concerned.

PS- Be careful of HOW you stick up for yourself. I've seen people who were perfectly in the right manage to, rather than point out that they were right, simply insult and anger people while trying to stick up for themselves. Just tread lightly and try to stick to the facts, best advise I can give.
Thanks for your post 18, and I won't call you andumb because I think you're anything but! No, I'm not the type to yell or get angry or whatever. Actually, I did get a wee bit stepped on at work the other day. I felt my boss was telling me one thing, and the controller was telling me something different, and sent me a scolding email telling me what I did wrong, so I just sent one back copying it to my boss what he told me, where it contradicted what she was telling me, and until otherwise directed I'll do this that and the other, and please let me know if I can do anything else to give you a better result, and I got support and cooperation back. And that's the first time I've ever really experienced that before, which was really nice. Usually, I would get "well, you do what I tell you, anything else you work out with the other person"' then the other person would say the same, big mess me in the middle, or some other mess. I think it has something to do with the quality of the people I'm working with now as much as it has anything to do with anything I'm doing.

I don't know. I've been struggling with this most of my life, and especially for the last 7 years, and I"m just so tired of it. I don't know what else to do but give it to God and trust that no matter what happens, whether I end up happy and in love with someone, or alone and miserable for the rest of my life, it's what God wants for me. I don't know why God would want anyone to be miserable, but it seems that's His plan for some people.

 
Old 12-05-2004, 06:31 AM   #8
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Re: Am I just totally buggared??

It just sounds to me like you don't know yourself anymore. Everybody since you were a kid has taken a part of you away. Start by learning about yourself. The best helpful ways that I have found to help me figure out a problem is making list and writing it out. Write down the things you know you like, get yourself invovled in them, expand on them, and figure out who you are.

And if you feel that nobody cares about you and you don't really matter, then maybe you should think about doing some volenteer work in your community. You would be suprised how good doing things for others will make you feel. And if you really don't have much time for that there is a website (though I can't post) that is meant for people to send care packages over to soldiers in iraq, kuwait, afghanistan that are really appreicated and some of the soldiers over there don't get a lot of mail and love to have any correspondence. Just a small thing like writing a letter to them boost their morals and it would probably do the same for you.

 
Old 12-05-2004, 07:06 AM   #9
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Re: Am I just totally buggared??

Quote:
Originally Posted by Calamity04
It just sounds to me like you don't know yourself anymore. Everybody since you were a kid has taken a part of you away. Start by learning about yourself. The best helpful ways that I have found to help me figure out a problem is making list and writing it out. Write down the things you know you like, get yourself invovled in them, expand on them, and figure out who you are.

And if you feel that nobody cares about you and you don't really matter, then maybe you should think about doing some volenteer work in your community. You would be suprised how good doing things for others will make you feel. And if you really don't have much time for that there is a website (though I can't post) that is meant for people to send care packages over to soldiers in iraq, kuwait, afghanistan that are really appreicated and some of the soldiers over there don't get a lot of mail and love to have any correspondence. Just a small thing like writing a letter to them boost their morals and it would probably do the same for you.

Thanks for your reply Calamity. I'm not sure my problem is not knowing myself as much as it is not being able to find anyone else who cares who I am. You can only feel good about yourself for so long when everyone else in the world thinks you have nothing at all to offer.

I do volunteer, and it gives me a little warm fuzzy for about a minute, but it doesn't make me feel any less miserable, lonely or worthless or unloveable. I go home alone, I go to bed alone, and I wake up alone, and I have to go to work and listen all day to songs that tell me how life is meaningless unless someone loves you, unless you have a family, spouse and kids. I don't believe life is meaningless without those things, my life is just meaningless to ME without those things. I won't be happy unless I find someone to love and have a family, and that's just all there is to it. I need it to survive. I don't think anyone can really help me with that, and i'm not even sure what I'm asking anymore. The only man I've ever loved, the only man I probably will ever get the chance to love, lied ot me, used me, threw me away like a piece of garbage and ran off and married the exact kind of woman he swore to me he would never, ever want and he's happy in a nice house with the comfort, companionship and regular sex of someone he loves, beautiful kids, etc. and i'm still alone,, and every day that goes by is one day closer to being alone and childless forever. There just doens't seem to be any way to be ok with that.

 
Old 12-05-2004, 07:20 AM   #10
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Re: Am I just totally buggared??

I understand what you mean it seems to be the most simple desire to find a partner and have child but can be the hardest to find. I could go and say you should get over that guy and that he wasn't good enough and blah blah blah...but helps nothing. Is it that you haven't gotten over him or you haven't gotten over what he did to you?

 
Old 12-05-2004, 07:38 AM   #11
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Re: Am I just totally buggared??

Quote:
Originally Posted by Calamity04
I understand what you mean it seems to be the most simple desire to find a partner and have child but can be the hardest to find. I could go and say you should get over that guy and that he wasn't good enough and blah blah blah...but helps nothing. Is it that you haven't gotten over him or you haven't gotten over what he did to you?
I think probably both. For whatever reason, it's just always been very hard for me to connect with people, and find people I'm comfortable with who like and are comfortable with me, that I have any sort of emotional intimacy with. Probably 3 or 4 my whole life. Everyone else I've come into contact with have been distant acquaintances. But when I met him, after only knowing him a few weeks I felt I'd known him my whole life. More than that, I felt like there had been a hole in me, and I finally found what I had been missing my whole life. He said I was his best friend. At the very least I always thought he was my friend, someone who cared about me. Only to find out I meant nothing at all to him. Oh, blah blah, I've told this story on another board on these forums, but I just can't seem to, I think I'm looking for something that no one can really give me. A reason to hang on till tomorrow, a guarantee of some kind that I will not end up alone, that if I can just muddle through today, I'll get to be happy tomorrow. But I know at the same time, it's not possible for anyone to give me any such guarantee. Looking back at my life, the time I spent with this guy was really the happiest time in my life by a long shot. I never even knew how little life I was getting before I met him, now I do, which makes it even harder to be without him. I just wish I'd never met him. As good as the good days were, they weren't worth feeling like this the rest of my life. I told this to our mutual friend the other day and he said that was an incredibly stupid thing to say, and I havent' learned any of the things he's been trying to teach me. He's recently found religion and fancies himself a minister of sorts now, which actually ticks me off because he's really smug about it. I've been going to bible school and church and studying and worshiping my whole life while he's been drinking, doping and sleeping around, and now he thinks he's got a better handle on Jesus and God than I do. I got back in contact with him at first I think because i was looking for answers, why did I deserve this, why did my ex do this to me? But I haven't gotten any that satisfy me in any way. Now, I think I'm at a point where having this guy back in my life is doing more harm than good.

 
Old 12-07-2004, 01:49 PM   #12
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Lightbulb Re: Am I just totally buggared??

Look, less of the self pity. Its pathetic.
Ive been at rock bottom in the past near suicide, speaking like the world was a conspiracy to do me wrong, like their all in on a joke but Im not.
Im now on anti depressants. It helps me. I need them. I get lonely, bored, dissillusioned, hurt, dismayed. But everyone gets a sh1tter sometime.
. Your not a victim. There's no masterplan doing you out of it.
Maybe its chemical, my problem probably is, a mental problem . Iknow when depressed your self obsessed and boring which make it hard for people to hang out with you. Theyve got their problems too!
Hope im not too unsympathetic.ive been there and will probably go back, but less of the "im destined for misery" cra-p . cheer up! have an ice cream and watch the simpsons!

 
Old 12-07-2004, 05:41 PM   #13
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Re: Am I just totally buggared??

No offense, but I watch The Simpsons every day and have chocolate ice cream in my freezer - doesn't help when you're feeling like that.

I read your other thread, Nini (may I call you that?) - the whole thing. I can't tell you what to do, otherwise I would be able to do it myself. Seriously, we are so very much alike. All I can tell you is that you are not alone in feeling this way. How do you keep going when you feel you are missing the one thing that you prize the most and which would make your life worth living - love?

 
Old 12-08-2004, 11:44 AM   #14
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Re: Am I just totally buggared??

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kid Acne
Look, less of the self pity. Its pathetic.
Ive been at rock bottom in the past near suicide, speaking like the world was a conspiracy to do me wrong, like their all in on a joke but Im not.
Im now on anti depressants. It helps me. I need them. I get lonely, bored, dissillusioned, hurt, dismayed. But everyone gets a sh1tter sometime.
. Your not a victim. There's no masterplan doing you out of it.
Maybe its chemical, my problem probably is, a mental problem . Iknow when depressed your self obsessed and boring which make it hard for people to hang out with you. Theyve got their problems too!
Hope im not too unsympathetic.ive been there and will probably go back, but less of the "im destined for misery" cra-p . cheer up! have an ice cream and watch the simpsons!
Well, in a sense, no one is a victim. You can very easily say to someone who was raped "what were you doing in that dark alley?" Or to someone whose child was killed in a drunk driving accident "Why didn't you teach your kid to be more careful?" You can always find a way to "blame the victim" and thereby make it out like there are no victims.

I know nothing about your situation and if meds help you, great. They didn't help me at all. My heart aches because I'm alone. I do not have a husband and children, and because of my religion and upbringing, in a nutshell, life simply isn't worth living if you don't have someone to share it with and children to pass it on to. I don't see how ice cream and the Simpsons is going to help. I'm not sure your post has harsh, it just wasn't useful. Sorry.

 
Old 12-08-2004, 11:49 AM   #15
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Re: Am I just totally buggared??

Quote:
Originally Posted by CrimsonClover
No offense, but I watch The Simpsons every day and have chocolate ice cream in my freezer - doesn't help when you're feeling like that.

I read your other thread, Nini (may I call you that?) - the whole thing. I can't tell you what to do, otherwise I would be able to do it myself. Seriously, we are so very much alike. All I can tell you is that you are not alone in feeling this way. How do you keep going when you feel you are missing the one thing that you prize the most and which would make your life worth living - love?
I never knew just how many people are going through the same thing until I joined this board. It is amazing how many lonely people there are out there, it's sad. Thanks for your post. I know there really isn't any advice that can be given to me at this point. I suppose I am pathetic. I have no friends, no one to talk to, I work my stupid little job and go home to my stupid little apartment and eat my stupid little tv dinner and watch my stupid little tv until I fall asleep. It's all so pathetic and worthless. I guess I was looking for a bit of hope, maybe someone out there who had been there and found someone. But I guess not.

 
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