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Old 06-25-2005, 08:10 PM   #16
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Re: conflicting info - soy products in diet good or bad?

I'm with racehorse on this. Just simply do a web search on this subject, and I guarantee you will find a lot more bad than good things about soy.

It's a cheap product (and a huge cash cow for the producers) in way too many food items on the grocery store shelves, as well as in cosmetics. All in the name of being a "health" food and product.

One of the most worst places it's in, is, unfortunately.........baby formula. Scary

 
Old 06-26-2005, 06:24 AM   #17
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Re: conflicting info - soy products in diet good or bad?

Don't give soy to babies...BUT
Quote:
Coronary Heart Disease
The cholesterol lowering effects of soy protein were first demonstrated in humans in 1967. In 1999, the U.S. Food and Drug Administration (FDA) approved a health claim for soy protein for cholesterol reduction and in the following year the American Heart Association endorsed the use of soyfoods for people with elevated cholesterol. In 2002, the United Kingdom approved its version of a health claim for soy protein under the Joint Health Claims Initiative (JHCI).
Soy protein may also be hypotensive as a recent review found that two-thirds of the better designed trials reported decreases in blood pressure. Lowering systolic blood pressure from just 2 V 5 mmHg has been estimated to reduce stroke and CHD risk by 6-14% and 4-9%, respectively. Furthermore, isoflavones may have independent coronary benefits. For example, isoflavones have been shown to increase the flexibility of the large arteries, and isoflavone-rich soy protein may enhance arterial reactivity and inhibit LDL-cholesterol oxidation.

Breast Cancer
Early life factors are thought to play in the etiology of breast cancer. For example, breast feeding, parity, and early pregnancy, are thought to reduce risk of breast cancer. There is an exciting and intriguing hypothesis that has both animal and epidemiologic support is that early soy intake is also one of these early life protective influences.
Consistent with the animal studies in the United States are the results from two case control studies, one conducted in Shanghai and the other in the United States that involved women of Asian ethnicity. In the former study, soy consumption (11 g soy protein/day) during the teenage years reduced risk of developing breast cancer by 50%. Soy consumption during adulthood had no bearing on these findings. In the latter study, soy consumption throughout life reduced risk by 35% whereas soy consumption only during adulthood was not protective.

Osteoporosis The skeletal effects of both soy protein and the soybean isoflavones are being investigated. Numerous short-term clinical trials dating back to the 1980s have shown that soy protein decreases urinary calcium excretion when replacing animal protein. This advantage of soy protein is quite attractive considering most women do not meet dietary calcium requirements. Various studies have also suggested that isoflavones may inhibit bone loss in much the same way that estrogen does.
Initial interest in the role that soy might have in reducing breast cancer risk was based on three early observations: (1) low breast cancer rates in Asia; (2) animal research showing adding soybeans to the diets of rats inhibited mammary cancer; and (3) data showing that weak estrogen-like compounds such as isoflavones can exert antiestrogenic effects under some experimental conditions. It is also widely recognized that isoflavones have potentially important non-hormonal effects relevant to cancer prevention and treatment.

Menopausal symptoms
Messina and Hughes recently reviewed 19 trials involving over 1700 women that examined the effects of soyfoods and isoflavone supplements on menopausal symptoms. Six trials were excluded from their analysis, two involving breast cancer patients, two which reported data on severity but not hot flush frequency, one that was not blinded, and one that did not include a control group. They found among the remaining 13 trials that there was a statistically significant relationship between initial hot flush frequency and treatment efficacy. More specifically, the correlation indicates that hot flush frequency will decrease about 5% (above placebo or control effects) for every additional initial hot flush/day in women whose initial hot flush frequency is 5/day.
Thus, soy and isoflavones have modest beneficial effects but only in women with frequent hot flushes. In practical terms this means that in theory a women with eight hot flushes per day who experienced a typical placebo response of 25% would experience a 40% improvement by consuming soy or isoflavones; thus, hot flushes would decrease from eight per day to 4-5 per day.

Cognitive Function Dementia rates in East Asia where soyfoods are consumed, are lower than those in Europe and rates of dementia and AD are reportedly higher among Japanese men living in Hawaii compared to native Japanese in Japan. Additionally, maintaining a more Japanese lifestyle is associated with better cognitive function among Japanese women living in the West.
Three clinical trials have found isoflavones enhance some aspects of cognition and memory.

Prostate Cancer Worldwide, cancer of the prostate is the fourth most common cancer and sixth most common cause of cancer death in men. There are striking differences in prostate cancer rates among regions in the world, however. Compared to Western rates, prostate cancer incidence and mortality in China and Japan is extremely low; in fact, they are as low as the breast cancer rates in those countries. The low rates in soyfood consuming countries provided initial motivation for investigating the impact of soy intake on prostate cancer risk.
In vitro, the main soybean isoflavone genistein inhibits the growth of testosterone-dependent and independent prostate cancer cells. It also reduces the ability of prostate cancer cells to metastasize independent of cell growth inhibition. In addition, in a dose-dependent manner genistein decreases the growth of human-patient benign prostatic hypertrophy tissue and prostate tumors in histoculture. Although the epidemiologic literature is limited, studies in Hawaii, California, and China, have recently found soy intake to be associated with a reduced risk of prostate cancer.
It seems like a pretty good food for adults...FAR superior to most meats for many reasons (no cholesterol for one.)

Anyone talking MONEY influencing the pushing of certain foods, and internet propoganda esposuing the same should know that the meat and dairy industry FAR outstip the soy industry which is tiny in comparison. Notice the absence of a billion dollar ad campain called GOT SOY?
We've had milk and meat advertising and lobbying jammed down our throats for half a century...and the net result of meat and dairy at 3 meals every day for 50 years is probably the least healthy population in the civilized world. The soy eaters of the East have fared MUCH better!

Last edited by Lenin; 06-26-2005 at 06:36 AM.

 
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Old 06-26-2005, 07:34 AM   #18
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Re: conflicting info - soy products in diet good or bad?

Very good points made Lenin. When the average person hears the word SOY, the first thing that comes to mind is sauce, not milk.

 
Old 06-26-2005, 07:56 AM   #19
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Re: conflicting info - soy products in diet good or bad?

I've never heard anything bad about soy products. In fact, most everything I've heard has been positive. I remember that there was a big tofu craze back in the late 1970s. I've had it a few times, but not recently. It wasn't bad, but I wouldn't say it was delicious either. It's funny how all the foods that are supposed to be the healthiest are also the least appetizing! I mean, how can anyone even compare tofu to a nice juicy California burger?
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Old 06-26-2005, 09:16 AM   #20
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Re: conflicting info - soy products in diet good or bad?

I have no idea!! But I've heard that soy has phytoestrogens (plant estrogens) that can cause female problems. I have uterine fibroids, which can be caused by estrogen dominance. One source said I should eat soy, which would replace the "bad" estrogen with "good" estrogen. Another source said I should avoid it and use progesterone cream to level out the estrogen. I don't know what to do!!

A lot of people use soy milk to replace cows' milk. It can actually cause just as much mucus build-up as cows' milk and savvy pediatricians will not recommend it for children. It's also heavily processed, just like cows' milk.

Everything I read & hear is SO confusing that my mind is going in circles. I've come to two conclusions: 1. Everything in moderation, and 2. everything organic. There is no silver health bullet.

 
Old 06-26-2005, 10:20 AM   #21
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Re: conflicting info - soy products in diet good or bad?

I won't quote the Lenin post from above ... for several reasons. 1. length 2. it is just cut and paste Soy propaganda. I didn't see any information about aluminum contamination (1000's of times higher than breast milk) excitotoxins that are known to destroy brain tissue especially the hippocampus, the adverse effects of isoflavones and its estrogenic effects, or how about the haemaggluttins, or high phytates or maybe the protease inhibitors. One thing is sure, the soy that is eaten today was an industrial invention that is quite recent and bears no relation to the fermented products consumed in traditional asian diets. What about the study that found a relationship with soy use and early onset dementia? There is a reason for the Japanese folk wisdom that says to feed a wayward husband tofu (yeah, cuts down his libido). Think about this, the very isoflavones that soy proponents say can help with menopausal symptoms (estrogen effects) are also supposed to be good for males, children and infants of both sexes. This is rubbish. Soy, its oil, and the waste that becomes the various soy components of just about every packaged food is not fit for human consumption. Indeed it is not fit for animal consumption, Parrot owners found soy feed produced beak deformities, early coloration (maturation) and infertility, the same infertility has been documented in cheetahs on soy feed. There are recent accounts of infertility in humans because of soy use. The dangers to your thyroid are clear, as little as 1 cup of soy milk a day can cause measurable changes in blood Thyroid Stimulating Hormone. The association with continued soy use and thyroid disorder is well documented. The association with pancreatic disorders is also well established. Add to this that about 85% of the soy produced in the US today is Genetically Modified and you have a clear call to avoid this stuff as a potent health risk. The soy industry would have you believe in the balance beam of scientific credibility, where who has the largest number of studies prevails. The Soy Industry has done much with its checkbook studies to make every negative about soy into a positive but don't be fooled. There is good science and crap. It is clear that soy is crap as is the so called science that promotes it.

 
Old 06-26-2005, 10:29 AM   #22
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Re: conflicting info - soy products in diet good or bad?

Hmmm, it seems like there's both good and bad to everything. I think I'll go have that California burger.
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Old 06-26-2005, 10:32 AM   #23
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Re: conflicting info - soy products in diet good or bad?

Quote:
Originally Posted by kerry1
I have no idea!! But I've heard that soy has phytoestrogens (plant estrogens) that can cause female problems. I have uterine fibroids, which can be caused by estrogen dominance. One source said I should eat soy, which would replace the "bad" estrogen with "good" estrogen. Another source said I should avoid it and use progesterone cream to level out the estrogen. I don't know what to do!!

A lot of people use soy milk to replace cows' milk. It can actually cause just as much mucus build-up as cows' milk and savvy pediatricians will not recommend it for children. It's also heavily processed, just like cows' milk.

Everything I read & hear is SO confusing that my mind is going in circles. I've come to two conclusions: 1. Everything in moderation, and 2. everything organic. There is no silver health bullet.
LOL, Yeah I agree. IT is SO confusing and YESSSs, everyting in moderation. Don't LIVE off of soy AND or cows milk!!!LOL Still eat lots of fruits and veggies, moderate proteins, good whole grains(I think whole wheat, not a lot, is good for the young ones including teens), and drink your MILK!!!lol

 
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