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Old 08-30-2008, 07:33 PM   #1
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Unhappy gallbladder problems without gallstones??.

ive had lots of digestive problems, (understatement), had nissan surgery for reflux. taking about every drug for motility or acid, carafate, cytotec, reglan, aciphex, ect ect ect.
Nothing has really worked for me, I basically live on white rice, green beans, some boiled potatoes, a little shredded wheat cereal with rice milk. ive had trouble eating ever since taking two back to back rounds of doxyclycline, and then taking tetraclycline for H Pylor about five years ago.
Now ive got fatigue, Hypoglycemic, I have to eat every few hours, No fat at all, and even still i get the acrid taste in my mouth and stomach swells a bit.
A new doctor i just went to, ran a lot of the same tests ive had throut the years, Hydascan, xray's, poo samples, blood work ect. the only thing wev veen able to pinpoint as unusual is the fact that my gallbladder, although it has no stones, its ejection fraction is 97 to 99 % every time. The doctor said he had never seen one do that.
Im scheduled to have it taken out next week, with the hopes that it will aleviate some of my symptomes. Ive taken lots of medications that usually will help at least some people, only it really didnt change things for me. Nothing has worke, even the nissan surgery for reflux, a computer chip in my throat said I had no acid, yet i still get sore throat, and acrid taste.
the swelling and such was going on prior to the surgery. only thing is my bathroom frequence has went up since having it. in fact the nissan surgery has really done nothing but make me feel farty allllll the time. kinda makes it hard to be social, i told one of my friends, that "everytime you look at me i m holding in a fart LOL", sad fact is, its true.
I didnt have digestive problems prior to taking the antibiotics, but a few days afterwards, I ended up getting a stiff neck, a tingling sensation between my shoulder blades, and an awful horrible gastritis stomach that just will not resolve itself no matter what i do.
if anyone has heard of removing a hyperactive gallbladder, please give me some advice on this, i just cant imagine how it would be if things got worse for me. and the surgery kind of scares me.
appreciate any advice, this is my first post.

 
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Old 08-31-2008, 01:40 PM   #2
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Re: gallbladder problems without gallstones??.

I have the opposite gallbladder problem, so I'm no expert. I have some thoughts, but that's all they are.

I would have thought 99% was good for a HIDAscan, but I don't know what a normal rate would be. My doctor said anything below 35-40% is bad. Mine is 32%, with no gallstones, and I may need to get it removed. If I were you, I'd want to get a second opinion before surgery, preferably from someone who has successfully treated patients with such a high ejection rate.

Either way, I'd want to resolve some of those other issues before getting surgery. Your system may need to recover from the antibiotics and other medications you took. Antibiotics always mess up my whole gastro system. Probiotics help - you know, the active stuff in yogurt. I used to get a supplement from the pharmacy. Can you eat yogurt?

Have you tried to add some good fats back into your diet? Our bodies need fat for many many purposes. I've heard people say that your gall bladder needs some fat to stay in shape. If yours is hyperactive, maybe it needs more fat than the rest of us. I felt weak and tired for years when I tried to stay on a lowfat diet.

If the chip says you don't have a lot of acid, then consider that the sore throats and bad taste might be due to something else, such as nasal or chest congestion, or dental issues. I found that post-nasal drip from allergies often gives me sore throats, and tastes a lot like an acidic stomach. Phlegm from a chest cold makes me nauseous. Also, bleeding gums can taste a lot like acid.

If you don't really have a lot of acid in your stomach, acid-fighting meds might be causing more problems than they help.

And lastly, have they tried giving you mild anti-anxiety meds or anti-depressants? I think they helped me a lot, especially with IBS type symptoms.

Good luck!

 
Old 08-31-2008, 10:03 PM   #3
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Re: gallbladder problems without gallstones??.

My HIDAscan was at 32 also. I, too, have no stones. Just wondering if you ever get really sharp pains around your gallbladder.

 
Old 09-03-2008, 11:23 AM   #4
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Re: gallbladder problems without gallstones??.

I had my gallbladder removed in June of 2005, 3 years ago and was in the hospital right after that for what my surgeon thought was an intestinal infection that i got from the hospital, he gave me flagyl. I was back in the hospital again in January of 2006, because i was unable to eat many things without getting sick after the gallbladder surgery. The gastro doc ran tests did an endoscopy and told me that i wasnt producing enough enxymes from my pancreas to digest the foods. I went on librax, an antispasmodic for the stomach and pancrease mt20, to be taken with meals, it got me through the next couple of years, still had to watch what i ate though and this past year started with diarrhea more than usual and within six months, i had to go on a toast and rice diet. I felt that the meds werent working like they should anymore, lots of nausea, throwing up, diarrhea and pain in upper abdomen and left flank, with low grade fever. Now they are checking me for pancreatic cancer. I am so stressed because one my sisters had a cyst on her pancreas a couple of years ago that spread to her spleen and stomach and it ruptured and she was bleeding internally, had surgery removed total spleen, 3/4 pancreas and stomach. One of my other sisters just passed away 3 months ago from pancreatic cancer which is very hard to detect in early stages. What im trying to say in a long way, sorry, is that you should ask your docs to have your pancreas checked out and also liver and spleen to see if there is anything going on there that is causing these symptoms. Hope this helps. Peace, Nancy

 
Old 09-04-2008, 09:00 PM   #5
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Re: gallbladder problems without gallstones??.

I have tried lots and lots of probitoics thruout the years, tried the good fat, but even good fat causes my body stress. stomach rumbling, gas, fatigue ect.
I have been trying to find something on taking out a gallbladder that has a supernormal ejection fraction and i fianlly found this article the other night.
I havent been tested for Celiac diease yet, but i wonder....
anyway herer is the article that I found.

Gallbladder disease is a common condition typically affecting young and otherwise healthy individuals. Risk factors include obesity, diabetes, female gender, pregnancy, family history, rapid weight loss, liquid protein diets, and race or ethnic background. When typical symptoms of right sided upper abdominal pain, nausea, vomiting, and bloating occur within 15-90 minutes of eating, especially a fatty meal, gallstones are usually suspected. Ultrasound of the gallbladder is the first test ordered and will confirm the presence or absence of gallstones. If gallstones are confirmed then surgical removal of the gallbladder is recommended.

However, if the ultrasound is negative or normal and gallbladder disease is still suspected a nuclear test called biliary scintography or more commonly called HIDA scan is ordered. The basis of this test is the fact that a radiolabeled chemical is administered intravenously that is concentrated in the liver where bile is made before being stored in the gallbladder between meals. If the gallbladder is diseased it may fail to be seen on the scan due to blockage or fail to empty as expected when a hormone called cholecystokinin (CCK) is given intravenously. CCK is present in the body and released with meals to stimulate gallbladder emptying of bile into the intestine for digestion. Typically, the gallbladder will empty a third or more of its volume when CCK is given during a HIDA scan but usually not more than 70-80%. The fraction of volume the gallbladder empties is referred to as the ejection fraction. A low ejection fraction is typical of a diseased gallbladder. Reproduction of the typical pain of gallbladder disease and a low ejection fraction are considered diagnostic of gallbladder disease in the absence of gallstones and results in a recommendation that the gallbladder be removed surgically.

An unusual phenomenon has been observed in some Celiac patients. Gallbladder type abdominal pain without gallstones and a "supranormal" gallbladder ejection fraction. Surgery relieves the gallbladder type pain and a diseased gallbladder is found. Radiology studies have been reported in the literature that shed light on this phenomenon though it's significance has been largely missed by the medical community.

Various ultrasound findings have been reported in Celiac disease, primarily in the European literature. Colli et. al in Italy noted increased fasting volumes of the gallbladder by ultrasound in untreated Celiac patients and Mariciani et. al. in the U.K. found increased gallbladder volumes and elevated gallbladder ejection fractions using MRI. Low CCK levels have been reported in Celiac patients (Deprez et.al. 2002, Rehfeld 2004). This physician has had several Celiac disease patients who have had high gallbladder ejection fractions (typically >90%) associated with classic gallbladder symptoms that resolved after gallbladder surgery. Chronic gallbladder disease was confirmed pathologically.

Gallbladder disease should be considered in Celiac disease patients despite normal ultrasound and HIDA tests, especially if a "supranormal" ejection fraction is noted and pain reproduced with CCK. Patients with abnormal high gallbladder ejection fractions should be considered as possible undiagnosed Celiacs and should undergo blood tests for Celiac disease and consideration of upper endoscopy with small bowel biopsy.


I think I will re- post this in another forum just in case someone is a Ceilac patient and might find this article interesting.
Ill keep everyone posted on my progress. I sort of feel that im going thru with the surgery, Ive always felt that my digestion was in hyper drive and when they said a super ejection fraction, it kind of made sense to me. Its how ive been feeling for a long long time.
wishe me luck.

 
Old 09-04-2008, 09:10 PM   #6
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Re: gallbladder problems without gallstones??.

thanks nancy, I dont pray, but you will be in my thoughts, please let us know how things turn out. I do hope you dont have this awful cancer. I have heard that people who have their gallbladders removed can have the bile continually drip into their intestines and sometimes this can cause problems, have you thought that maby you might have some bile getting up into your tummy, hence causeing your tummy achs and problems? its just a thought, I believe that bile does get into my stomach at times since there is so much of it. I can always taste that familiar bile taste after eating and then lougeing too much sometimes.
hope you feel better soon.
take care

 
Old 09-04-2008, 09:17 PM   #7
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Re: gallbladder problems without gallstones??.

thanks for the advice, I did try probiotics for years, actually probabbly took too much of them at times. I cannot do yogurt anymore as ive become dairy intollerant. They have done liver enzyme tests which came out good and my stool and blood samples taken indicated that the pancrease was putting out good as well. The only thing they have found thus far was the super ejection fraction. I do hope it turnst out to be this, the doctor also said my nissan surgery for reflux has slipped a bit and was moving about, that he could fix it at the same time. He was up in the air himself about wheather or not removing the gallbladder would help me, I jsut really dont know but if everything else works then maby too much bile is what keeps my guts hurting all the time.

 
Old 09-06-2008, 10:54 AM   #8
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Trish1001 HB User
Re: gallbladder problems without gallstones??.

Quote:
Originally Posted by soahcalm View Post
thanks nancy, I dont pray, but you will be in my thoughts, please let us know how things turn out. I do hope you dont have this awful cancer. I have heard that people who have their gallbladders removed can have the bile continually drip into their intestines and sometimes this can cause problems, have you thought that maby you might have some bile getting up into your tummy, hence causeing your tummy achs and problems? its just a thought, I believe that bile does get into my stomach at times since there is so much of it. I can always taste that familiar bile taste after eating and then lougeing too much sometimes.
hope you feel better soon.
take care
How do you know for sure if bile is dripping into your intestine?

 
Old 08-14-2011, 12:28 AM   #9
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Re: gallbladder problems without gallstones??.

Hi soahcalm . If youíre still on this list, please provide an update if you underwent GBS and if your problems went away. If symptoms still present, your story has to be told as another warning to false and misleading diagnosis conducted by surgeons advising GB removal as been the cure to problems. From reading thousands of posts on line, GS surgery could be the worst thing to address problems identified. Thanks for your feed back in advance. j

 
Old 08-14-2011, 05:44 AM   #10
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Re: gallbladder problems without gallstones??.

Just an FYI, anything below 35% OR above 75% is considered non functioning for a HIDA result.

 
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