PVC's, Ablation, and Fear & Loathing in Cardiac Land - Heart Disorders Message Board

dreambetter · 02-15-2006, 05:03 AM

I had RF Ablation for AV Nodal Reentry Tachycardia when the procedure was in the experimental phases. I had one of the pioneering cardiologist do the procedure. Just in case your you're new to cardiac problems, I put it in plain english... I had rapid heart beats, or arrhythmia's, that ran up into 250 beats per minute. The electrical fibers in my heart, in the atrial-ventricular node, caused a "looping" and thus I would go from a normal rate, 60 to 100, into 150 plus. As a result I suffered a mild stroke in my twenties, flat-lined too many times, had a load of other complications yet survived it all. You can survive tachycardia and arrhythmia's! I had PAC's, premature atrial contractions, PVC's, premature ventricular contractions, and all the so forth. When they ablate, radio frequency burning-like a laser, they usually take the slow track. My problem started in my teens and I continued to have it until I had surgery at 35. You can survive your cardiac problem and find help that is not based on meds! No one today would know that I had a stroke, so you can heal. For the most part, I do not take any medications other than aspirin. Yet, I have to keep tabs on my cardiac health, constantly, and I try to focus ahead on the complications that come with it to avoid most problems. Whenever I get colds, influenza, or anything related to respiratory infection that get extreme, I tend to get slow and rapid pulse, PVC's, chest pains, dizziness, and the "fear." Oral infections, related to the teeth and gums, can cause the same problems(this is a very important issue to watch!). Sometimes infections are too tough to overcome with time, currently I'm taking antibiotics for a respiratory infection, and likely I'll end-up with IV antibiotic therapy because it's a bad one. Watch any infection, especially oral problems, and if it takes too long to resolve, get the antibiotics and take them. With ablation, you have to protect yourself when it comes to infection because you're slightly prone to some mild to extreme cardiac consequences, or "irritation." A bad infection can "express" itself in and around the heart or lungs; thus, the cardiac problems such as rapid heart rate and premature beats come about. Just as a side note, a couple of things...I had to prep for a sigmoidostophy(a normal check for colon cancer and whatnots...a 12 inch tube and camera) requiring fasting and a dose of an over-the-counter laxative, magnesium-citrate. This gave me a heartblock, or BBB(it is an actual side-effect from the product which I found-out afterwards), where the heart skips a beat altogether-but eventually beats-on. BBB is bundle branch block. Magnesium, potassium, calcium, and sodium are critical to the hearts chemistry, known as the pump. Thus, as I found-out, be extremely careful with high doses of those minerals. -And-carefully research any prescribe or over-the-counter drugs to avoid such ordeals. Also, I'm posting this because I read most of this board and there are lots of fears and wonderment. I'm not an expert(however I eventually studied and certified in cardiovascular med), but should you wonder if you can "handle" it, know that you can. The most important element is "information." Learn about your problem

. Ask you cardiologist every question, bring a written list, and never feel too dumb to ask anything. It is a known psychological component to cardiac problems, the desire to learn. Knowledge helps overcome fear. Fear will always happen with cardiac problems, it biochemical, but the knowledge will help you get through it. And finally, if you have a deep-seated fear that is ominous, doom-like, don't hesitate...go to the emergency room or call 911. That is why I am alive today. I never abused the ER, but I always trusted my instincts...listen to your heart....This site is a great resource to discover that you are not alone!

Graciella · 02-15-2006, 01:42 PM

Hi,

My name is Graciella and I'm 25 years old. A couple of year back, I started having rare incidences of palpitations, Rapid heart beats. It was bothersome but since it would occur so seldom, I didn't think much of it. Over the past year it has become more frequent and it wouldn't just happen when exercising. I am a healthy individual, none of the risk factors apply to me (no coffee, no alcohol, no obesity).
So, I had myself checked recently and found out I suffer from P. A. T. or supraventricular atrial Tachycardia.
The treatment involves a procedure called ablation, the removal of tissue by heat or cold with a catheter.
I am not sure where to go from here. I haven't experienced any fainting yet, so, I don't really want to do it, since I am not at a very serious stage. I'm not sure how serious this is, but from what you're describing it's pretty darn serious.

dreambetter · 02-15-2006, 07:10 PM

Graciella,

First off, I'm merely giving you my opinion and hope that you will seek the advice of a physician in order to make any decisions, absolutely validate this information with your cardiologist. PAT, or paroxysmal atrial tachycardia, is a sudden-periodic attack, an abrupt onset, of atrial tachycardia. A single "irritable" focus in the atria takes over control of the heart to produce rates of 150-250 bpm. Some of these rapid signals to beat faster are usually blocked by the AV node to keep the ventricular rate in a normal range so that the entire heart can handle it, a type of limiter. Note though, at some point the ventricles can speedup as well. The AV, atrial-ventricular, node is within the AV junction, and is a part of the conduction system that slows conduction of impulses through the AV junction. So the overall system to keep your heart at a normal range has an electrical anomaly. As we age so do our muscles and that is why many cardiac symptoms become more prominent in the twenties. Take a rubber band, for example, a new one can stretch, rebound, and stretch again without much change to its body. Whereas, an older one may not have that flexibility, show wear & tear, and rebound larger. It doesn't mean that your heart is weakening or that this condition will "stretch" your heart too far, it's just that you're likely to experience your condition more often as you get older. Thus, whether you can cope and manage 150-250 beats per minute is something that you need to determine? How will this work in your life, lifestyle, and psyche? Will you always be in the best health to overcome it? I am not stating these things to cause you undo fear, but to be realistic. In terms of Atrial Tachycardia, when the atria beats so rapidly the ventricle doesn't always have enough time to fill with blood, then the blood volume might not meet the needs of your body. Beats that go towards 175+ will likely have more felt symptoms and you don't seem to express that. With less proper volume of blood you can feel anxiety, chest pains, shortness of breath, and lightheaded just to name a few issues. Have you had these symptoms? Again, as you age you may get more events and thus have more symptoms. It that likely? That is something that you must gauge. It is not that, no matter what, it will get worse, the question is do you feel that it is getting worse and can you handle it? Do you have meds, has the doctor taught you Vagotonic maneuvers or Vagal, to push your abdominal muscles down or out, as to strain hard-like you were passing difficult bowel matter? Do you have depression and fear that grows with each event and it remains at that level? Impending fear can make a future episode seem far worse. Can your family handle it all? Look, I'm being blunt and I don't mean to frighten you. Know this, ablation is way too easy and relatively safe. The benefits typically outweigh the risks of the condition. It is noninvasive and it may correct your problem close to entirely. All surgeries have risks; however, when your condition becomes too much, then you'll need to consider what will improve the quality of your life. If that choice is ablation, you can handle it as long as you go into it knowing all the benefits and risks. Who ever does the procedure-check-out, seek the best and diligently check their credentials. See your cardiologist, and nothing but & not just a regular Doctor, on a regular basis. Have a plan if the beats get too, too rapid, such as meds and getting to an ER? The Key word to describe your condition is "irritable," and you have good physical protocol, but are there irritants such as stress, lack of sleep, not eating regular meals at regular times? Be brave and know that you will get through it because so many have. Overcome fear with knowledge and the ability to cope as calmly as possible (and this means overriding biochemical, physiological reactions). There is a lot of verbiage here, I hope that I have not made it worse...just don't be afraid to face your issue, don't be afraid to improve you life and health if the benefits outweigh the risks...And smile...your burden is one of many...

yugokid · 02-15-2006, 10:28 PM

i have frequent pvc's 10-12k a day for the past 4 years, that two docs and two cardios said it was fine after some tests. I had unhealthy teeth, i do have gingavitis with plaq build up that im getting removed. I went years without having seen a dentist and let it build up, now over the last 3 months i have been taking care of my teeth like theres no tomorrow, brushing and rinsing and all the good stuff. I had two infected teeth, one eventually went away and the other resulted in a extraction of a wisdom tooth, (both infections came way after i started noticing the pvc's) after so long of taking care of my teeth, My gums look healthy besides the plauqe i have to have removed. im tring to eat healthy and get into a diet and get under 200lbs (currently 210 5'11) But i doubt my pvc's came about from my gums, my cardio said they can just "pop" up in anyone, even a 24yrold with a otherwise healthy heart. I do have the occasional "chest pain" but its releaved with a change in position or a nice burp. and if its prolonged, its a pinpointable muscle i can recreate the pain with. Btw no rapid Heart Rate, just pvc's

I wanna have the ablation done but im scared stiff to do it.

(ps, i asked my cardio and he said that the only way that gums can have a neg effect on your heart causing HD and irregularitys if the problem presists over a long long period of years, we both know people who have never been to the dentist and so much picked up a toothbrush, lost several teeth, yet no probs)

dreambetter · 02-16-2006, 02:12 AM

Yugokid,

It's been a slow process for medical doc's to consider the connection between oral and physical health, but it's coming-on and getting stronger. Weekly, -statistics gradually increase in odds favoring the profound impact of oral health upon the heart. What is known now is that folks with oral/dental issues are twice as likely to have heart problems, an increased risk of cardiac arrhythmia, vascular issues, inflammatory diseases of the heart, heart valve infections, stroke risk, 2.7 times more likely to suffer heart attack, 7-8 times more likely to give birth prematurely, can raise blood sugar contributing to diabetes, and can contribute or increase the severity of respiratory diseases. There is an established link between some dental procedures and a rare infection of the heart lining called bacterial endocarditis when bacteria from the mouth enters the bloodstream. Periodontal disease is a chronic bacterial infection of the gums. The beginning stage of the disease is known as gingivitis, which is a curable condition marked by inflammation and bleeding of the gums. The later, irreversible stage is known as periodontitis. Periodontitis involves loosening of the teeth and deterioration of the jaw bone beneath them. Advanced periodontal disease can lead to chewing problems, pain, and tooth loss. Currently, there are two leading theories that link periodontal disease with heart disease. The first holds that the periodontal bacteria (from dental plaque) can enter the bloodstream through inflamed gums, during the simple act of chewing, or through small cuts and tears made by dental procedures. Once in the bloodstream, some of these bacteria can produce an enzyme that causes blood platelets to become sticky and form small blood clots that may contribute to the development of hardening of the arteries, or atherosclerosis. The second theory is that the presence of gum inflammation enhances overall inflammation throughout the body, which may cause further buildup of existing arterial plaque. Studies have shown that inflammation in the gums, such as found with periodontal disease, is connected to an increase in white blood cells, C-reactive protein and other markers for inflammation. Until a connection is either proven or disproven, the American Heart Association recommends that people with heart disease take extra precautions regarding their dental health and this includes taking antibiotics before and sometimes after any dental procedure. In any case, you need to let your dentist know if you have any cardiac issues so that you both can determine if any precautions should be taken prior to your dental work. You're 24 and said that the infection to the gums and extraction occurred after the PVC's, but you had gone for years without seeing a dentist and had plaque built-up. Having merely PVC's doesn't mean you have a cardiac condition. PVC's are normal in anyone. In fact, a number of people have PVC's and aren't even aware of them. However, in some cases as the heart act-up a person can become acidotic (related to gastrointestinal issues-such as brups), hypovolemic (diminished blood volume, diminished water content-thirst), dig-toxic (withhold digitalis-watch mineral intake), and hypoxic (deficiency of oxygen, poor blood gas-needing air). You stated that you get "chest pains" and burp which relates to being acidotic; however, this may solely be an existing gastric issue and not a cardiac reaction. It can also come about due to stress and fear as a result of the PVC's. If your cardiologist won't connect oral health to cardiac health, so be it, but there are an abundant number of medical professionals who believe there is a direct correlation. I can think of an example to pose a question to you, why do you have car insurance? Hopefully it's a fail-safe even though you hope you do not have an accident. Much like that, keep your oral health up just in case. 10 to 12K PVC's does go beyond the norm and since you do-actually have some oral issues, keep-up on them...have insurance with regular and timely dental care-prior to problems. As far as ablation, the thought of having it is far more frightening than the procedure. I think that those of us who have had it, did so because the quality of our lives suffered. The heart condition became the focus of our lives and we lived-in discontent, fear, and suffering. Trust me, if a cardiologist strongly suggest this procedure and you have the feelings that I've described, you will look forward to the relief and can handle the fear knowing that your life will greatly improve. At 24 you have the option to reverse a great many things to your body. Now that you have a few markers, strive for a healthy life and see if you can avoid remedies that might cause you distress. At your age you have less stress to your body verses a 34 year old, and so on. Thus, it is easier to prevent something than it is to recover...