It appears you have not yet registered with our community. To register please click here...


 Home Message Boards Videos Join for Free User Blogs Board Index
Search
 
Forgot your username or password?


Heart Disorders Message Board
Post New Thread   Closed Thread
Share
 
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 04-16-2006, 07:16 PM   #1
Member
(male)
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 67
Hugs: 0
Hugged 0 Times in 0 Posts
Thanks: 0
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Brad53 HB User
Take Your Plavix!

I received 2 Taxus stents in August of 2005, and 2 Cypher stents 7 weeks ago. As far as I know, these are the only 2 brands of stents approved by the FDA, for use in the US. Both manufacturers, Boston Scientific (Taxus) and Johnson & Johnson (Cypher) recommend taking Plavix and aspirin for 1 full year, after receiving a stent. My doctor and other cardiologists, that I have seen in 2 different hospitals, have prescribed this for my follow up medicinal regime. This is a standard within the US, and probably around the world, and is more than likely due to the findings of the CURE trial and the CAPRIE trial.

I cannot tolerate aspirin or any NSAID, because I abused the drugs for many years. They produced ulcers in my small intestine, and erosions in my stomach and esophagus. They are cured, but 1 aspirin can cause me lots of pain 2-3 days. My cardiologist says not to take aspirin, due to possible intestinal bleeding, in people like myself. I have taken Plavix since a stroke and heart attack 3 years ago. I haven't noticed any side effects.

So people like myself have to have protection. Plavix is better than it's competitor, so I lovingly take it without fail for stroke and post stent thrombosis prevention.

Here are some excerpts taken from the respective trials and published by the National Institutes of Health (NIH) :

CAPRIE
A randomised, blinded, trial of clopidogrel versus aspirin in patients at risk of ischaemic events.

BACKGROUND: Many clinical trials have evaluated the benefit of long-term use of antiplatelet drugs in reducing the risk of clinical thrombotic events. Aspirin and ticlopidine have been shown to be effective, but both have potentially serious adverse effects. Clopidogrel (Plavix), a new thienopyridine derivative similar to ticlopidine, is an inhibitor of platelet aggregation induced by adenosine diphosphate.

METHODS: CAPRIE was a randomised, blinded, international trial designed to assess the relative efficacy of clopidogrel (75 mg once daily) and aspirin (325 mg once daily) in reducing the risk of a composite outcome cluster of ischaemic stroke, myocardial infarction, or vascular death; their relative safety was also assessed. The population studied comprised subgroups of patients with atherosclerotic vascular disease manifested as either recent ischaemic stroke, recent myocardial infarction, or symptomatic peripheral arterial disease. Patients were followed for 1 to 3 years. FINDINGS: 19,185 patients, with more than 6300 in each of the clinical subgroups, were recruited over 3 years, with a mean follow-up of 1.91 years. There were 1960 first events included in the outcome cluster on which an intention-to-treat analysis showed that patients treated with clopidogrel had an annual 5.32% risk of ischaemic stroke, myocardial infarction, or vascular death compared with 5.83% with aspirin. These rates reflect a statistically significant (p = 0.043) relative-risk reduction of 8.7% in favour of clopidogrel (95% Cl 0.3-16.5). Corresponding on-treatment analysis yielded a relative-risk reduction of 9.4%. There were no major differences in terms of safety. Reported adverse experiences in the clopidogrel and aspirin groups judged to be severe included rash (0.26% vs 0.10%), diarrhoea (0.23% vs 0.11%), upper gastrointestinal discomfort (0.97% vs 1.22%), intracranial haemorrhage (0.33% vs 0.47%), and gastrointestinal haemorrhage (0.52% vs 0.72%), respectively. There were ten (0.10%) patients in the clopidogrel group with significant reductions in neutrophils (< 1.2 x 10(9)/L) and 16 (0.17%) in the aspirin group.

INTERPRETATION: Long-term administration of clopidogrel to patients with atherosclerotic vascular disease is more effective than aspirin in reducing the combined risk of ischaemic stroke, myocardial infarction, or vascular death. The overall safety profile of clopidogrel is at least as good as that of medium-dose aspirin.

*Note that aspirin caused intracranial haemorrhage in .47% vs Plavix .33% of patients, and gastrointestinal haemorrhage .72% vs Plavix.52%
*Neutrophils squeeze through the capillary walls and into infected tissue where they kill the invaders (e.g., bacteria). Aspirin decreased these white blood cell components in .17%, compared to .10% of the patients who took Plavix.

CURE Trial
Effects of pretreatment with clopidogrel and aspirin followed by long-term therapy in patients undergoing percutaneous coronary intervention: the PCI-CURE study.

BACKGROUND: Despite the use of aspirin, there is still a risk of ischaemic events after percutaneous coronary intervention (PCI). We aimed to find out whether, in addition to aspirin, pretreatment with clopidogrel followed by long-term therapy after PCI is superior to a strategy of no pretreatment and short-term therapy for only 4 weeks after PCI.

Long-term administration of clopidogrel after PCI was associated with a lower rate of cardiovascular death, myocardial infarction, or any revascularisation, and of cardiovascular death or myocardial infarction.

At follow-up, there was no significant difference in major bleeding between the groups.

INTERPRETATION: In patients with acute coronary syndrome receiving aspirin, a strategy of clopidogrel pretreatment followed by long-term therapy is beneficial in reducing major cardiovascular events, compared with placebo.

*Acute coronary syndrome is an umbrella term used to cover any group of clinical symptoms compatible with acute myocardial ischemia.

 
Sponsors Lightbulb
   
Old 04-18-2006, 11:13 PM   #2
Member
(male)
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 67
Hugs: 0
Hugged 0 Times in 0 Posts
Thanks: 0
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Brad53 HB User
Re: Take Your Plavix!

Any comment?

 
Old 04-19-2006, 05:24 AM   #3
Member
(male)
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Posts: 86
Hugs: 0
Hugged 0 Times in 0 Posts
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
redbaron HB User
Re: Take Your Plavix!

From the New England Journal of Medicine-
Quote "The cumulative incidence of recurrent bleeding during the 12-month period was 8.6 percent (95 percent confidence interval, 4.1 to 13.1 percent) among patients who received clopidogrel and 0.7 percent (95 percent confidence interval, 0 to 2.0 percent) among those who received aspirin plus esomeprazole (difference, 7.9 percentage points; 95 percent confidence interval for the difference, 3.4 to 12.4; P=0.001).

Conclusions Among patients with a history of aspirin-induced ulcer bleeding whose ulcers had healed before they received the study treatment, aspirin plus esomeprazole was superior to clopidogrel in the prevention of recurrent ulcer bleeding. Our finding does not support the current recommendation that patients with major gastrointestinal intolerance of aspirin be given clopidogrel." Unquote.

I had a bleeding Ulcer caused by Aspirin, and I found that Clopidogrel caused diarrhoea, but by combining Aspirin with Losec everything is fine again.

I'm not saying that Clopidogrel is a bad drug, I just thought that this may be of interest to anyone experiencing side-effects from taking Clopidogrel.

 
Old 04-20-2006, 06:30 AM   #4
Senior Veteran
(male)
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 8,546
Hugs: 0
Hugged 2 Times in 2 Posts
Thanks: 0
Thanked 15 Times in 15 Posts
Lenin HB UserLenin HB UserLenin HB UserLenin HB UserLenin HB User
Re: Take Your Plavix!

I question most of the conclusions (presumably in red)...but none more than:
Quote:
Long-term administration of clopidogrel after PCI was associated with a lower rate of cardiovascular death, myocardial infarction, or any revascularisation, and of cardiovascular death or myocardial infarction.
An inspection of the CURE data commonly given as a graph fairly clearly shows that not one additional death FROM CLOT is achieved after the 60 th day.
The studies both give short shrift (or deliberate lies) to the severe unstaunchable bleeding that others have found. I guess only SANOFI/SQUIBB have these answers.

PLAVIX is not long for this world...wait for it. The background noise is already being heard in this or that article.


As for a claim that CAPRIE shows clopidogrel to be better than aspirin: within any reasonable meaning of the word, the clot protection shown by CAPRIE is the same for both.

My sample of one (ME) discontinued PLAVIX early because of daily nose bleeds for 45 days. A nose bleed is something I haven't suffered since I was a kid in spite of taking 650 mg. aspirin or more per day. If my nose is bleeding from a drug, odds are very good that something else inside is bleeding also.

However, IF one cannnot take aspirin, one is left with no choice for a stent placement. However IF one cannot take aspirin, I would think there is a VERY good chance of not being able to take clopigorel for exactly the same reason.

But for me, if I ever need another percutaneous procedure, my clot prevention will be aspirin alone...or if truly desperate, anticoagulant therapy with warfarin or heparin.

There was an interesting page on nursing that discussed methodology for pharmaceutically staunching bleeds caused by anticoagulants but how difficult it was to staunch bleeds caused by anti-platelet therapy.

Last edited by Lenin; 04-20-2006 at 06:57 AM.

 
Old 04-20-2006, 10:57 AM   #5
Veteran
(male)
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 301
Hugs: 0
Hugged 0 Times in 0 Posts
Thanks: 0
Thanked 4 Times in 4 Posts
Beefsteak HB UserBeefsteak HB User
Re: Take Your Plavix!

The current NEJM has a paper on this.
Don't know if this is the article Redbaron is referring to as I can't access the full article.
Volume 354:1706-1717 April 20, 2006 Number 16
Anyway the Conclusions in this trial were:
There was a suggestion of benefit with clopidogrel treatment in patients with symptomatic atherothrombosis and a suggestion of harm in patients with multiple risk factors.
Overall, clopidogrel plus aspirin was not significantly more effective than aspirin alone in reducing the rate of myocardial infarction, stroke, or death from cardiovascular causes.

 
Closed Thread

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Board Replies Last Post
Plavix and Stents Beefsteak Heart Disorders 2 07-07-2010 02:41 AM
Tapering Off Plavix donsabi Heart Disorders 3 02-22-2009 04:56 PM
Plavix After DES donsabi Heart Disorders 6 02-06-2009 08:41 AM
Questions about stopping plavix after 1 month s-larette Heart Disorders 47 09-10-2008 02:13 PM
my doctor wants me to stop taking plavix,after taking it four yrs? ralean01 Heart Disorders 6 08-29-2008 02:34 AM
Consumer Reports: PLAVIX Lenin Heart Disorders 27 02-08-2007 12:41 PM
plavix & aspirin is killing my stomach enie Heart Disorders 22 01-04-2007 12:02 PM
Plavix discontinued GranpaMcCoy Heart Disorders 8 04-15-2006 01:05 PM
side effects of plavix greeneyes109 Heart Disorders 4 09-21-2005 07:38 AM




Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off











Message Boards
  • Open to All Other Health Topics
  • It's Life - Off Topic Discussions
  • Natural Disaster Sympathies and Support
  • Health News
  • HealthBoards Testimonials
  • Suggestions for New Boards
  • Registration/Membership/Site Problems
  • Health Issues
  • General Health
  • Abuse Support
  • Acid Reflux / GERD
  • Acne
  • Share Your Acne Story
  • Acne Tips
  • Acute Respiratory Distress Syndrome (ARDS)
  • ADD / ADHD
  • Addiction & Recovery
  • Addison's Disease
  • Aging Issues
  • Allergies
  • Alternative Medicine
  • Alzheimer's Disease & Dementia
  • Amputation / Prosthetic
  • Amyotrophic Lateral Sclerosis (ALS)
  • Anemia
  • Aneurysm
  • Anger Management
  • Angina
  • Anxiety
  • Share Your Anxiety Story
  • Anxiety Tips
  • Arthritis
  • Asperger's Syndrome
  • Asthma
  • Autism Spectrum
  • Autoimmune Disorders
  • Back Problems
  • Beauty & Cosmetics
  • Bell's Palsy
  • Bipolar Disorder
  • Birth Control
  • Blood and Blood Vessel
  • Bone Disorders
  • Bowel Disorders
  • Brain & Head Injury
  • Brain & Nervous System Disorders
  • Brain Tumors
  • Breastfeeding
  • Burns & Injuries
  • Cancer
  • Cancer: Bladder
  • Cancer: Bone
  • Cancer: Brain
  • Cancer: Breast
  • Cancer: Cervical & Ovarian
  • Cancer: Colon
  • Cancer: Esophageal
  • Cancer: Kidney
  • Cancer: Lung
  • Cancer: Oral
  • Cancer: Pancreatic & Liver
  • Cancer: Prostate
  • Cancer: Rectal & Anal
  • Cancer: Skin
  • Cancer: Stomach
  • Cancer: Testicular
  • Cancer: Throat
  • Cancer: Thyroid
  • Cancer: Uterine
  • Candida
  • Caregivers
  • Carpal Tunnel Syndrome
  • Celiac Disease
  • Cerebral Palsy
  • Chemotherapy
  • Children - Special Needs
  • Children's Health
  • Chronic Fatigue
  • Codependency
  • Colds & Flu
  • Swine Flu (H1N1)
  • Cosmetic / Plastic Surgery
  • Costochondritis
  • Crohn's Disease / Ulcerative Colitis
  • Cystic Fibrosis
  • Death & Dying
  • Degenerative Diseases
  • Dental Health
  • Depression
  • Share Your Depression Story
  • Depression Tips
  • Diabetes
  • Hypoglycemia
  • Diet & Nutrition
  • Digestive Disorders
  • Disabilities
  • Divorce & Separation
  • Dizziness / Vertigo
  • Down Syndrome
  • Drug Interactions
  • Dyslexia
  • Dysphagia
  • Ear, Nose & Throat
  • Eating Disorder Recovery
  • Endocrine Disorders
  • Endometriosis
  • Environmental Disorders
  • Epilepsy
  • Epstein Barr Virus (EBV)
  • Exercise & Fitness
  • Eye & Vision
  • Family & Friends of Cancer Patients
  • Family & Friends of the Mentally Ill
  • Family Planning / Adoption
  • Fibromyalgia
  • Foot Problems
  • Gallbladder
  • Genetic Disorders
  • Grief & Loss
  • Hair Loss / Alopecia
  • Hair Problems
  • Headaches & Migraines
  • Health Insurance Issues
  • Healthcare Professionals
  • Healthy Lifestyle
  • Hearing Disorders
  • Heart Disorders
  • Hepatitis
  • Hernia
  • Herpes
  • High & Low Blood Pressure
  • High Cholesterol
  • HIV Prevention
  • HIV/AIDS Living With
  • Hormone Problems
  • Hospice
  • Human Papillomavirus (HPV)
  • Hypochondria
  • Hysterectomy
  • Immune Disorders
  • Incontinence
  • Infant Care (up to 18 months old)
  • Infectious Diseases
  • Infertility
  • Share Your Infertility Story
  • Inner Ear Disorders
  • Interstitial Cystitis (IC)
  • Irritable Bowel Syndrome (IBS)
  • Kidney Disorders
  • Knee & Hip Problems
  • Lasik Eye Surgery
  • Learning Disorders
  • Leukemia
  • Liver & Pancreas Disorders
  • Lung & Respiratory Disorders / COPD
  • Lupus
  • Lyme Disease
  • Share Your Lyme Disease Story
  • Lymphedema
  • Lymphomas
  • Men's Health
  • Menopause
  • Mental Health
  • Mesothelioma
  • Military Health Issues
  • Miscarriage & Still Birth
  • Mononucleosis
  • Multiple Sclerosis
  • Muscular Dystrophy
  • Myositis
  • Nail Problems
  • Neurofibromatosis
  • Neurology
  • Neuromuscular Diseases
  • Neuropathy
  • Nutritional Disorders
  • Obesity
  • Obsessive Compulsive Disorder (OCD)
  • Occupational Health & Safety
  • Orthopedic
  • Osteoporosis
  • Pain Management
  • Chronic Pain
  • Share Your Pain Management Story
  • Panic Disorders
  • Paralysis
  • Parenting Issues
  • Parkinson's Disease
  • Personality Disorder
  • Phobias
  • Pituitary Disease
  • Polio
  • Polycystic Ovary Syndrome (PCOS)
  • Post-Traumatic Stress Disorder (PTSD)
  • Postpartum Depression (PPD)
  • Pregnancy
  • Share Your Pregnancy Story
  • Pregnancy Tips
  • 2010 Mommies
  • 2011 Mommies
  • Pregnancy-Teen
  • Prostatitis
  • Psoriasis
  • Rape / Sexual Abuse
  • Rare Disorders
  • Raynaud's Syndrome
  • Reflex Sympathetic Dystrophy
  • Relationship Health
  • Restless Leg Syndrome
  • Rosacea
  • Sarcoidosis
  • Schizophrenia
  • Scoliosis
  • Self-injury Recovery
  • Senior Health
  • Sexual Dysfunction Treatment
  • Sexual Health - General
  • Sexual Health - Men
  • Sexual Health - Teens
  • Sexual Health - Women
  • Sexually Transmitted Diseases
  • Shingles
  • Shoulder / Rotator Cuff Problems
  • Shyness
  • Sickle Cell Anemia
  • Sinus Problems
  • Sjögren's Syndrome
  • Skin Problems
  • Sleep Disorders
  • Smoking Cessation
  • Speech & Language Disorders
  • Spinal Cord Disorders
  • Stress
  • Stroke
  • Sudden Infant Death Syndrome (SIDS)
  • Teen Health
  • Thyroid Disorders
  • TMJ Disorder -TemporoMandibular Joint
  • Tourette Syndrome
  • Transplants
  • Trigeminal Neuralgia
  • Trying to Conceive (TTC)
  • Urology
  • Vaccination & Immunization
  • Vitamins & Supplements
  • Weight Loss
  • Weight Loss / Surgical
  • West Nile Virus
  • Women's Health



  • TOP THANKED CONTRIBUTORS

    Heart Disorders

    Machaon (29), JJ (22), Vyking (17), started04 (14), cvcman (8), sjb (8), Jimmysyd (5), jrueda (4), Fizzickle (4), sickandtired99 (4)

    Site Wide Totals

    thanbey (581), janewhite1 (526), BlueSkies14 (511), SpineAZ (483), DGabriel10 (463), mscat40 (419), tetonteri66 (418), jennybyc (399), sammy64 (388), jgrangran (357)

    All times are GMT -7. The time now is 12:10 AM.



    Site owned and operated by HealthBoards.com™
    Copyright and Terms of Use © 1998-2012 HealthBoards.com™ All rights reserved.
    Do not copy or redistribute in any form!


    SEO by vBSEO ©2011, Crawlability, Inc.