my mother is 74 and just had a stent put in 1 month ago she has had internal bleeding and had recieved 22 units of blood.. We have decided to stop the plavix and asprin. What are the chances of a heart attack?
Your mother is on the wrong side of risk/benefit ratio. Plavix and aspirn are a risk of internal bleeding, and the risk without are blood clots can cause a stroke or MI.
Since the risk of internal bleeding (now 100%) out weighs the risk of clots, the medication should be discontinued as it is not tolerated. Alternative treatment for blood clots should be considered.
She may STILL be able to take a daily dose of baby aspirin. It won't cause the devastating bleeding that Plavix frequently does.
Where was her bleed? If it was ANYWHERE but her stomach, I'd say continue the aspirin.
My mother suffered from heart disease and GERD for 20 years while taking daily aspirin. They stopped the aspirin in the hospital to ease her stomach discomfort...they eased her right into a coffin the next week with a fatal heart attack.
I think that everyone with heart disease needs daily aspirin forever, and NOBODY needs Plavix after 60 days following a stent placement. Plavix is a killer and it kills with fatal bleeds (defined as any resulting in DEATH or requiring replacement of 4 units of blood.)
A tiny portion of the population is devastatingly allergic to aspirin but this is usually apparent very early on in life and the person is aware of the allergy. It doesn't sound like your mom is in this group.
my mother has had bleeds in her bowel, small intestine, stomach, throat, nasal vortex and nose bleeds. She has been off of the plavix for 1 week now and is still bleeding. She is on her 24th unit of blood if you can believe that! She has given up and wants to die. She now has a staff infection in her leg and I can't do anything to help her. I just want her to come home and be comfortable.
I read a nurse's report dealing with bleeds. One nurse discussed how easily bleeds caused by coumadin or heparin could be staunched but NO intervention was effective for bleeds caused by Plavix.
I pray the bleeding stops for her. Does it seem to be slowing?
Your mother is on the wrong side of risk/benefit ratio. Plavix and aspirn are a risk of internal bleeding, and the risk without are blood clots can cause a stroke or MI.
Since the risk of internal bleeding (now 100%) out weighs the risk of clots, the medication should be discontinued as it is not tolerated. Alternative treatment for blood clots should be considered.
ABSOLUTELY no anticoagulates. The risk is overwhelming. If one is bleeding in one area (even nose bleeds) there is an indication the system cannot tolerate, and the bleeding can occur anywhere there is vulnerability. If one has diabetes, the risk is compounded as the healing process is compromised.
It takes about a week to clear the circulatory system (5 days prior to any operation) of any anticoagulate. Provided there were no anticoagulates, a week should be sufficient for healing unless there is diabetes, etc.
My Doctor put me on Plavix years ago because I had blood clots and to this day I still take Plavix. Now if I scratch my self or something like that, I do bleed and it's hard to get it stopped but the shape that I am in I would be scared to go off of the Plavix because I have 3 stents and just found out I have blockage in both legs and will be going thru surgery soon. I do not take the aspirin though and I was told to take it. I would so afraid if they took me off of my Plavix because it would stay on my mind that I would end up with more blood clots. Thats just my opinion though.
My Doctor put me on Plavix years ago because I had blood clots and to this day I still take Plavix. I am in I would be scared to go off of the Plavix because I have 3 stents and just found out I have blockage in both legs
see? thats my point. we are supposed to take plavix indefinetly to prevent clots but yet the plavix eventually causes internal bleeding plus the fact of you still getting blockages show that the plavix is apparently not doing its job. I have had the same problem. I was placed on plavix May 2005 in addition to 325 mg of aspirin daily and I still have had to have 2 more stents placed on seperate occasions since then. So apparently we are taking this drug thats killing us for no reason.
Oops! my above post was in response to Coyote. Her quote is the top paragraph and apparently i havent figured out how to put other's quotes in that little seperate box yet lol . forgive me.
see? thats my point. we are supposed to take plavix indefinetly to prevent clots but yet the plavix eventually causes internal bleeding plus the fact of you still getting blockages show that the plavix is apparently not doing its job. I have had the same problem. I was placed on plavix May 2005 in addition to 325 mg of aspirin daily and I still have had to have 2 more stents placed on seperate occasions since then. So apparently we are taking this drug thats killing us for no reason.
There are two kinds of blockages...the kind caused by atherosclerosis (i.e. plaque that builds up in your arteries from cholesterol, etc.), and a blockage caused by a blood clot. Plavix (and aspirin) will help prevent the second kind of blockage, i.e. that caused by a blood clot. It will have no effect on atherosclerosis, which is why we got the stents in the first place. Those of us who are taking it are taking it to prevent a blood clot.
Ohhhhh thats lovely, I was unaware of that. So if it doesnt stop the blockages that I've been getting..is it even worth it to continue such a dangerous medicine? And as well...how do I prevent these reoccuring blockages????
No, after 60 days following stent placement, Plavix is NOT worth continuing...unless wants to suffer the risk of devastating bleeds. It adds nothing to an aspirin's anti-clotting capability.
To prevent atherosclerotic blockages, the kind that stents are used to open, the best drugs are the statins or else a diet that is extremely low in saturated fats and trans fats...the lower the better.
Lenin and I agree on most things, but we have a difference of opinion on Plavix, so let me give you a different perspective.
There is research to suggest that, with people with medicated stents like the Cypher stent, there is an increased risk of having a blood clot (as compared to a bare metal stent). It seems to occur more frequently in people who discontinue "dual antiplatelet therapy," meaning both aspirin and Plavix. Blood clots can, of course, cause heart attacks and death. The FDA recently recommended that people with these stents remain on both aspirin and Plavix for at least one year after the stent is placed, and many prominent cardiologists are recommending people stay on it indefinitely if they can tolerate the medication. Not sure how "prominent" my cardiologist is, but he does work at Mayo Clinic, and he's had me on it for more than 2 years. I've had no problems with it except I bruise more easily and if I cut my finger, it takes a little longer to stop bleeding.
Plavix is a relatively safe medication (all medications have potentially dangerous side effects) in most people.
I hope I don't have to be on it for too much longer, but until the science is clearer as to whether there really is increased blot clot problems with medicated stents and what to do about it, I'm not going to go against the advice of my doctor unless I start having more side effects, or I see better science showing Plavix really is dangerous.
I appreciate that comfort Connie. I too have been told that I have to be on plavix maybe for the rest of my life, tho now I'm not so sure why, because once the stents have been in for a while and cells grow over and cover the stents, why continue with the medication if the danger of the stent itself causing clots should be over? I haven't had any problems with the plavix/aspirin combo as of yet and its been almost 2 years for me as well. I was also taking vytorin for just as long but now I am told my liver enzymes are elevating so now I have to get off of that. But now what do I do for cholesterol? My Cardiologist says its ok to get off the vytorin and he didnt offer to replace it with anything else..so what? Was I on the med for no reason? I am learning more and more scarey things daily..and not sure what to believe anymore.
Duelling Cardiologists:
MY cardiologist, who was (he became Head of Medicine at a prominant University elsewhere) probably the most noted percutaneous (arterial catheter work) specialist in New York City said Plavix for 90 days, aspirin forever. When I said I was bleeding, he said 60 days will be okay with him: I stopped after 45 days, having taken 1/2 dosage the last 14.
I predict you will start hearing stories that go something like:
1. "Study shows commonly prescribed heart drug may be more risky than previously thought."
2. "Doctors questioning the recommendation of long term Plavix use."
3. "Plavix risk is far higher than previously thought; deaths reported"
4. "Sanofi-Aventis and Bristol Myer Squibb testify they didn't KNOW the risk of bleeding is so severe with Plavix."
5. "Whistle blower says that CEO was TOLD the risk off bleeds was intolerable long before FDA approval."
5. "Sanofi-Aventis and Bristol Myer Squibb seek Chapter 13 bankruptcy protection to avoid onslaught of lawsuits."
6. "FDA chief says 'If ONLY we had known the truth we'd have acted more quickly to get this off the pharmacy shelves.'"
7. "Congress to hold hearings into responsibility for 'killer drug'."
Remember where you first heard this scenario. My only question is the time frame. <I wonder how many of those headlines I got exactly right! :>
I must say that my hat is off to these drug companies who managed to convice most doctors that "asprinandplavix" was one word...as in "take your aspirinandplavix daily." and "never stop taking aspirinandplavix." They really are two different drugs with vastly different side effects.
I do believe I will be asking my dr about getting off the plavix since it obviously doesnt stop the blockages I get anyway. I dont think I would like the risk of continuing on it. How do you ween off of it? I read that stopping a drug like that could be dangerous. What about another blood thinner like Warifin or something like that? Is there a safe prescription that one can take without having to worry about bleeding to death?
my mother is 74 and just had a stent put in 1 month ago she has had internal bleeding and had recieved 22 units of blood.. We have decided to stop the plavix and asprin. What are the chances of a heart attack?
There is a risk for any medication. The risk of serious side effects or any side effect almost always is learned in a very short time. And decisions should be made accordingly...stopping may be the correct decision.
But for many other patients the risk for a blood clot over a longer period of time with drug coated stents are greater than the risk of serious bleeding. If one's medical condition contraindicates (due to history of bleeding) taking plavix or anticoagulant, then one should have a metal stent.
What it comes to, it is a medical decision based on knowledge your doctor has on the patient's constitution and whether or not the risk of blood clot is greater than the speculation to some bleeding. A blood clot can cause a stroke or a fatal heart attack!!
The consensus of the medical community with studies and anecdontal evidence is there is a higher risk of clots for a longer period of time with coated stents, therefore, plavix's medication time should be extended to a year. The evidence clearly show there are fewer occurences of restenosis of the stented vessel. To have restenosis may be a better alternative to the possibility of serious internal bleeding!!
oops! Sorry for repeating myself...anyway I'm consistent and it may help someone not to make a mistake with their medication.
now I am even more confused! should I or shouldnt I take this drug???
Any anticoagulant provides risk for excessive bleeding due to an injury and that includes aspirin as well. It is a reasonably safe call to continue on a medication if there are no side effects within about a month and that includes plavix.
It doesn't make much sense to take a med for a month without experiencing any side effects and then discontinue after a month due to a fear of side effects.
The risk of a clot is slight, probably less than 1%, but it is life threatening with a heart attack or a disabling stroke. Weigh that against the probability of serious bleeding. If one doesn't have a blood disorder, diabetes, etc., the probability is slight for a serious bleeding episode and the numbers seem to favor going with Plavix.
Three years ago I had a stent implant (coated) and was prescribed Plavix and aspirin (coated) for a year and no problems. If one excessively worries about bleeding, it may be wise for one's mental health to avoid said medication as the probability of a serious event is very low. However, many doctors and major hospitals take one death in a hundred that could have been prevented with medication to be significant.
There shouldn't be any confusion. There is a slight risk of a blood clots without Plavix, and depending on one's general health the risk of bleeding is slight. I would rather have a risk of some bleeding that a stroke or a heart attack. The orginal poster describes a bleeding condition within a short period of time with the medications, and everyone would agree the anticoagulants should be stopped.
Ok...well so far I havent had any problems thank God. I have been checked by a gasetronolgst (sic) and all stomach problems other than gerd are negative. My last stent was Oct 06, there is a chance I may have to have another angio..so I believe staying on the plavix is probably in my best interest. right? I do not have diabetes or any other blood disorder and the aspirin I take is the coated ecotrin. So based on all that... stay on plavix?
Re: Questions about stopping plavix after 1 month 
