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Old 11-09-2006, 12:48 PM   #1
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Niacin versus Inositol Hexaniacinate

I have high lp(a) and my numbers have not come down much on 250mg twice daily of the non-flush niacin(Inositol Hexaniacinate). My doctor has suggested taking the regular flush niacin to reduce these levels. Can anyone comment on the differences and why the regular would be better than the non-flush.

When I researched the non-flush I found on medscape:

"Inositol hexaniacinate, otherwise known as inositol nicotinate or no-flush niacin, consists of 6 nicotinic acid molecules crossed-linked together with an inositol molecule"

If I am right the regular flush niacin is also know as nicotinic acid, so I am getting regular niacin in the non-flush bound form, just released at a slower rate. Since I do not tollerate flush well, I am thinking it might be more beneficial to increase the dose of the non-flush and see if that brings the numbers down rather than go to the same dose of the regular flush niacin.

Can anyone comment of the difference between flush and non-flush and why I might be asked to go from one to the other when they seem to be basically the same thing. Has anyone seen success in doing so?

Thanks

 
Old 11-09-2006, 04:36 PM   #2
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Re: Niacin versus Inositol Hexaniacinate

Quote:
Originally Posted by master44
I have high lp(a) and my numbers have not come down much on 250mg twice daily of the non-flush niacin(Inositol Hexaniacinate). My doctor has suggested taking the regular flush niacin to reduce these levels. Can anyone comment on the differences and why the regular would be better than the non-flush.

When I researched the non-flush I found on medscape:

"Inositol hexaniacinate, otherwise known as inositol nicotinate or no-flush niacin, consists of 6 nicotinic acid molecules crossed-linked together with an inositol molecule"

If I am right the regular flush niacin is also know as nicotinic acid, so I am getting regular niacin in the non-flush bound form, just released at a slower rate. Since I do not tollerate flush well, I am thinking it might be more beneficial to increase the dose of the non-flush and see if that brings the numbers down rather than go to the same dose of the regular flush niacin.

Can anyone comment of the difference between flush and non-flush and why I might be asked to go from one to the other when they seem to be basically the same thing. Has anyone seen success in doing so?

Thanks

Master44, I don't know why your doctor put you on such a low dose, I will tell you that my doctor has used the same type of niacin, inositol hexaniacinate, for many years and told me he is prescribing it more all the time. I can not take a statin and have been taking that niacin and on my last test my total had dropped 40 points. I have been taking 1000mg's each evening with my meal. My doctor said he recommends 1500 mg's a day and now I am taking that amount and will see if it lowers my cholesterol even more. A well known Dr. Whitacker wrote in his book that he also recommended 1500 mg's a day but he said to take 500 mg with each meal, I probably should do that but I forget it or am not home etc. so I just take it at night. I also take 3000mg of fish oil and some Vit's. My HDL is 50, niacin does raise your good cholesterol. And just for the record, I tried the other niacin and couldn't take the flushes.

 
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Old 11-10-2006, 05:28 AM   #3
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Re: Niacin versus Inositol Hexaniacinate

master,

I concur, your doseage of the HN is just too low for much of an effect.
What kind of a dose of "regular" niacin did your doctor recommend?

 
Old 11-10-2006, 05:30 AM   #4
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Re: Niacin versus Inositol Hexaniacinate

master,

I concur, your doseage of the HN is just too low for much of an effect.
What kind of a dose of "regular" niacin did your doctor recommend?

If you up your dose of HN, try taking it ONCE a day. It is safer to do niacin that way, because the less time you expose your liver to it the better.

 
Old 11-10-2006, 07:39 AM   #5
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Re: Niacin versus Inositol Hexaniacinate

Thanks for all the responses... My cholesterol has been reduced nicely with Vytorin, but the Niacin is strictly to get my lp(a) levels down. With my past 2 tests my levels have been at 22, where normal is less than 10. Even after taking 250mg slow-release niacin 2X daily for a year, my lp(a) levels have stayed the same, so my doctor recommended getting up to 500mg 2X daily of the regular flush niacin.

I told my doc I did not handle flush well and asked if staying on the slow-release IH variety would do any good and he said no, I needed to use the flush kind. But when I researched the differences between flush and non-flush I don't see where the flush kind is really any different other than getting a quick dose and possible lighter effects on the liver and my liver tests are normal.

I asked for a referral to a cardiologist, but he said until I was on 500mg 2X daily of the flush niacin he would not grant it. So I am trying to figure out if I went to 500mg 2X daily of the non-flush, would I be getting the same thing as the regular Niacin. I tollerate the non-flush well, with only the occasional light flush and would prefer not to have to change it up to something I know will bother me. I cannot find any good reference to tell me the differences in effectivity between the flush and non-flush niacin and its impacts on lp(a) levels. Thanks!

 
Old 11-10-2006, 02:31 PM   #6
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Re: Niacin versus Inositol Hexaniacinate

Lenin,

I meant to ask you to post your analysis (please on Niacin v. No-Flush v. Slo-Niacin here instead of the Niacin Flush thread. Sorry .

I try to deal in common sense and common sense tells me that if No-Flush worked just as well or better than Niacin or extended release Niacin we wouldn't need them at all.

 
Old 11-10-2006, 02:32 PM   #7
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Re: Niacin versus Inositol Hexaniacinate

Lenin,

I meant to ask you to post your analysis (please on Niacin v. No-Flush v. Slo-Niacin here instead of the Niacin Flush thread. Sorry .

I try to deal in common sense and common sense tells me that if No-Flush worked just as well or better than Niacin or extended release Niacin we wouldn't need them at all (with their side effects).

 
Old 11-11-2006, 04:55 AM   #8
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Re: Niacin versus Inositol Hexaniacinate

master,

Next time you see your doctor, take 1000 mg. plain old niacin on an empty stomach about 30 minutes before you get to his waiting room.
Let HIM see what misery such a dose can cause. Make sure you mention any differences in your breathing, swollen lips, eyelids etc.

But don't look for niacin to cure a high Lp(a)...it won't. Only booze works a bit.


Judge,

I'm not sure exactly what you are asking.
But I think basically that anyone who CAN take a gram or two of REAL niacin should. It works best and has the least effect on the liver. Others have to content themselves with slow release although it is harder on the liver. In truth though, LOTS of people are on niacin and we don't hear much about liver damage...I think it was overhyped.
I dont know if the inosital-niacin molecule is fully metabolized...maybe yes, maybe no.

I can NOT use any amount of flushy niacin so I buy non-flush for price.

Last edited by Lenin; 11-11-2006 at 05:01 AM.

 
Old 11-11-2006, 08:30 AM   #9
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Re: Niacin versus Inositol Hexaniacinate

I meant to say Lenin and/or anyone else who can offer a meaningful comparison!!!

Lenin, you answered mostly but I didn't think you took Inositol (no-flush) . I thought you took slow release (Slo-Niacin). If i understand correctly no-flush is a different type than Niacin or slow release niacin . Also, if I understand correctly, Niacin and extended release are the same type of niacin with extended release having something to delay the release (such as polygel in slo-niacin).

 
Old 11-11-2006, 09:29 AM   #10
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Re: Niacin versus Inositol Hexaniacinate

Correct on all counts Judge.
I have never taken the inositol hexanicotinoate, just plain niacin, polygel formulation and time release capsules.
The inositol formulation is the only one that is chemically different.

 
Old 12-11-2006, 10:24 AM   #11
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Re: Niacin versus Inositol Hexaniacinate

I just started taking 500mg of inositol hexanicotinoate but I thought it helped your memory?? You could not pay me to take the flushing kind. I tried it once 35 years ago and I still remember how I was affected. Never Again.
My ex mother in law always took the flushing kind and she's 95 now and living at home; she uses a cane. I don't know if there's any connection She has recovered from several heart attacks and a broken hip. Her husband is 5 yrs younger and does the cooking and makes cranberry wine
If we try, we can find out the differences between the two formulas. If some drs say to take the flushing kind, and others say the non is the same, then I have to deduce that they DON'T KNOW. And why not? Because we're not talking about pharmaceuticals
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Old 12-11-2006, 06:33 PM   #12
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Re: Niacin versus Inositol Hexaniacinate

I copied this from a web site, sorry but don't know which one,,,,
According to the National Cholesterol Education Program (NCEP), Niacin or vitamin B3 is the treatment of choice for normalizing the blood lipid levels. Several double-blind placebo-controlled studies have found that niacin increased HDL (good cholesterol) by 30% or more while reducing total cholesterol by 10-25% and triglycerides by as much as 50%.[1],[2],[3],[4],[5] A common side effect of niacin is flushing which is the result of blood vessels opening wide. However, another form of Niacin called Inositol Hexanicotinate (IH) or “No-Flush Niacin” is proven as an effective and safer alternative to niacin.[6] In one study, Welsh and Eade reported that inositol hexanicotinate was more effective than niacin in regulating cholesterol levels.

I plan on giveing the Insoitol Hex a try soon.
Hope this is of some help. I do know that it has been used in Europe for years by a lot of doctors.

 
Old 12-12-2006, 05:46 AM   #13
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Re: Niacin versus Inositol Hexaniacinate

Don't ignore the time release formulations either. They are exacly nicotinic acid mixed with products (gels, soluble fibers) that slow down their absorprion.
They are cheaper than the inositaol complex but pricier than the plain "flushy" stuff.
I find they work very well and rarely cause any flushing.

Manke,
I mistrust buzz-statement like:

Quote:
Several double-blind placebo-controlled studies have found that niacin increased HDL (good cholesterol) by 30% or more
It indicates that I am reading something unscientific. What is says, in fact, is that there was not a SINGLE person studied who did not get at least 30% increase in HDL. NCEP would never use shoddy reporting like that so it was quoted improperly by someone...maybe someone selling niacin hexanicotinoate?
A real study would wsay something like the AVERAGE HDL was raised 18.4% using a dose of 1 gram/day...or something like that.


I perused the NCEP and they (an arm of the NHBLI, U.S. Government) don't see overly wild about niacin as "the treatment of choice." Maybe i didn't look deeply enough...they have pamphlets within pamphlets with pamphlets...enough .PDF's to choke a horse.

Last edited by Lenin; 12-12-2006 at 05:47 AM.

 
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