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Old 07-01-2005, 09:33 PM   #1
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21 years old, high blood pressure

Hi all,

About three years ago I developed high blood pressure out of no where. I was 18. Now I'm 21, and I'm on 300 mg of Avapro. My blood pressure seems stable, at 140/80, etc. (I used to go into the hospitral with 180/120, etc. etc.

They've done tons of tests and recently came back with my sodium levels VERY HIGH. I want to know if high sodium levels can cause high pulse (100+) and always high blood pressure. My doctor just added a low dose of toporal, and the pharmacist was shocked when she saw my prescription, which makes me nervous. A google search showed all these side effects for toporal. I already had sexual side effects on the Avalide, which is why I got off the diuretic. I don't like medicine very much and it just upsets me when I think I have to take more.

I have the toporal sitting here but haven't started it yet. The doctor wants to do tests on my thyroid. I am taking the avapro which seems to keep my blood pressure down to 140/80 ... my systolic is always very high though, 150/80 sometimes.

Any suggestions? I'm running out of ideas.

I am a little heavy ........ 250 pounds, 5' 11" ..... I am biking every day, could this naturally lower my pulse by working out intensely for 4 days/week? I'm just trying to not go on the toporal if I don't have to ......

Regards,

Matt

 
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Old 07-02-2005, 07:12 AM   #2
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Re: 21 years old, high blood pressure

Have you ever been tested for Diabetes?

 
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Old 07-02-2005, 07:26 AM   #3
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Re: 21 years old, high blood pressure

Matt,
I think the very best thing you could do would be to drop 50 pounds. It's often remarkable how quickly BP will drop with weight. I know, easier said than done.
Sorry to say that 250# for almost all 5'11 inch guys qualifies as obese, rather than a little heavy. Actually the new, tight standard for obesity, via BMI, begins at 215#. Sorry to be the bearer of bad news, but forewarned is forearmed!

High sodium levels are almost guaranteed to raise BP (also a sign of dehydration...bikeing in the hot sun perhaps?) Usually the body won't even allow the high sodium for minutes becasue there's an immediate dilution>>>extra plasma volume>>>hypertension.
I think you are a natural for the addition of a thiazide diuretic which will lower both your BP and your sodium.

If you start the Toprol, you can kiss the bike-rides goodbye and you'll probably gain more weight. Avoid the drug like the plague, you won't like it.

But your long term answer is to work on the weight.

Last edited by Lenin; 07-02-2005 at 07:32 AM.

 
Old 07-02-2005, 08:15 AM   #4
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Re: 21 years old, high blood pressure

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lenin
Matt,
I think the very best thing you could do would be to drop 50 pounds. It's often remarkable how quickly BP will drop with weight. I know, easier said than done.
Sorry to say that 250# for almost all 5'11 inch guys qualifies as obese, rather than a little heavy. Actually the new, tight standard for obesity, via BMI, begins at 215#. Sorry to be the bearer of bad news, but forewarned is forearmed!

...

But your long term answer is to work on the weight.
Good advice, Lenin.

Also, the kidneys are supposed to regulate the blood's sodium level. Often with diabetes, or with insulin resistance, there is an increased problem with high blood pressure and with the kidneys regulating blood sodium levels.

The solution then, would include dietary control.

Last edited by Machaon; 07-02-2005 at 08:16 AM.

 
Old 07-02-2005, 12:34 PM   #5
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Re: 21 years old, high blood pressure

So are you guys saying then, that maybe I should consider joining a gym and trying to lose weight, and if it just doesn't happen, then maybe try the beta blocker?

 
Old 07-02-2005, 12:39 PM   #6
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Re: 21 years old, high blood pressure

Quote:
Originally Posted by beerzoids
Have you ever been tested for Diabetes?
Yes, my sugar level was fine.

 
Old 07-02-2005, 01:28 PM   #7
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Re: 21 years old, high blood pressure

Quote:
Originally Posted by mjuszczak
So are you guys saying then, that maybe I should consider joining a gym and trying to lose weight, and if it just doesn't happen, then maybe try the beta blocker?
I am not suggesting any medicine at all. I was just wondering if you had been tested for diabetes, or if you have become insulin resistant, both of which can cause high blood pressure and cause the heart to misfire.

As far as diet, I am on an insulin resistant diet which has greatly improved my health. It involves frequent small meals, 5-6 per day, consisting of basically whole grain, some protein and some type of vegetable.

Avapro messes around with the blood sodium, so that might explain the high level of sodium in the blood.

Do you get any other symptoms? Any shortness of breath? Excess sweating? Lightheadedness?

Noone on Healthboards is a medical professional. Most of us are just victims of some type of medical problem, just like you.

 
Old 07-02-2005, 01:29 PM   #8
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Re: 21 years old, high blood pressure

Quote:
Originally Posted by mjuszczak
Yes, my sugar level was fine.
Sugar level being fine might rule out diabetes, but it doesn't rule out insulin resistance.

 
Old 07-03-2005, 07:55 AM   #9
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Re: 21 years old, high blood pressure

Quote:
Originally Posted by mjuszczak
They've done tons of tests and recently came back with my sodium levels VERY HIGH. I want to know if high sodium levels can cause high pulse (100+) and always high blood pressure.
I am not a health professional, but the very high sodium level means that your kidneys are not properly balancing the sodium content of your blood. This is probably not related directly to your diet at all. This is related more to how your kidneys are functioning.

The heart has several channels that help to control the heartbeat. There is the potassium channel, the calcium channel and the sodium channel, among others I think. If the body's sodium is out of whack, it would seem to me that it could have a big impact on how well the heart beats.

Quote:
My doctor just added a low dose of toporal, and the pharmacist was shocked when she saw my prescription, which makes me nervous. A google search showed all these side effects for toporal. I already had sexual side effects on the Avalide, which is why I got off the diuretic. I don't like medicine very much and it just upsets me when I think I have to take more.
The toporal's purpose is to attempt to regulate your heartbeat and lower your blood pressure, by blocking some of the hormones in your system. To me, the most important "clue" of your problem is the very high sodium. What did your doctor say might be causing that? Did you get ALL of your blood test results? Any other high or low readings?

My reasons for suggesting insulin resistance is because it can cause problems such as high blood pressure, heart rhythm problems, and extra weight is a symptom. The medical community estimates that about 25% of the population has insulin resistance in one form or another. Insulin resistance can wreck havoc with the body. But...... it might not be your problem. Your doctor wants to test your thyroid. He probably thinks that your problem could be glandular. If your thyroid checks out he will probably want to check out another gland.

Last edited by Machaon; 07-04-2005 at 08:39 AM.

 
Old 07-03-2005, 05:05 PM   #10
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Re: 21 years old, high blood pressure

My sodium levels were 380. He said that was in range but very high. He'd like me to get them down to 80, so I've been checking out sodium in everything I eat.

He also told me my creatinine levels were very high. They are supposed to be below 250 and mine were 275. But he didn't seem to sweat that at all, which I was suprised about .... he said the high creatinine levels were because of the high sodium, and its the ratio that counts, or something like that.

He gave me a test with a diagnosis code of "Renal Failure", but I'm not freaking out because he didn't tell me anything. He wants to check my thyroid and wants to do the standard nine test check (cholestoral, CBC, etc.).

I know a kidney function test was done a year ago or so for me and that came back fine.....I think....

I'm on 300 mg of Avapro, the highest dose.

Also, someone mentioned something about other symptoms. I have a rapid heart beat and I sweat, A LOT. Sometimes I have to change my clothes 10 times a day, and my hands are always drenched in sweat.

That's about it. My mom was freaking me out earlier by saying her brothers nephew's cousin's former roommate or something had kidney failure after he had high creatinine levels ..... so now I'm all freaked out, if anyone could say anything to comfort me as to why my doctor didn't seem paranoid at ALL (he basically said lower your sodium and you should be OK) that would be great....

-Matt

 
Old 07-03-2005, 06:01 PM   #11
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Re: 21 years old, high blood pressure

Quote:
Originally Posted by mjuszczak
My sodium levels were 380. He said that was in range but very high. He'd like me to get them down to 80, so I've been checking out sodium in everything I eat.
Cutting down on sodium probably is a very good idea, but I don't think that will significantly help you with your very high blood sodium level problem. Your blood sodium level is balanced by your kidneys. A high blood sodium level indicates that the kidneys are not doing their job.

Quote:
He also told me my creatinine levels were very high. They are supposed to be below 250 and mine were 275. But he didn't seem to sweat that at all, which I was suprised about .... he said the high creatinine levels were because of the high sodium, and its the ratio that counts, or something like that.
From what I have read, a high creatine level could also indicate problems with the kidneys. They have to determine someone's normal creatine level based on their body mass. The larger the body mass, the higher the range.

Quote:
He gave me a test with a diagnosis code of "Renal Failure", but I'm not freaking out because he didn't tell me anything. He wants to check my thyroid and wants to do the standard nine test check (cholestoral, CBC, etc.).
I would take his diagnosis code very seriously. You might be able to get some information on a board like Healthboards, but there are no health professionals here.

Quote:
I know a kidney function test was done a year ago or so for me and that came back fine.....I think....
Do you remember why they gave you a kidney function test?

Quote:
I'm on 300 mg of Avapro, the highest dose.
I just did a search on "avapro kidney". A lot of articles popped up that speak about doctors giving avapro to diabetics. Many of them say that, In people with type 2 diabetes and high blood pressure, Avapro is also prescribed to stave off damage to the kidneys, often delaying the need for dialysis and a kidney transplant.

Quote:
Also, someone mentioned something about other symptoms. I have a rapid heart beat and I sweat, A LOT. Sometimes I have to change my clothes 10 times a day, and my hands are always drenched in sweat.

That's about it. My mom was freaking me out earlier by saying her brothers nephew's cousin's former roommate or something had kidney failure after he had high creatinine levels ..... so now I'm all freaked out, if anyone could say anything to comfort me as to why my doctor didn't seem paranoid at ALL (he basically said lower your sodium and you should be OK) that would be great....

-Matt
To a novice like me, your symptoms all scream out either Diabetes or Insulin Resistance, along with the kidney problems. If it were me, I would check with the doctor to get approval to get on a diet that could reverse Insulin Resistance.

With an insulin resistance diet, like I am on, one has to eat five or six small meals a day, consisting of 1/2 cup of 100% whole grain, 1/2 cup of a low sugar vegetable, and a little bit of protein. In between most meals, I have a 1/4th cup of almonds. These amounts would probably have to be bumped up somewhat to take into consideration your weight.

But...... keep in mind that I am not a health professional, and I am only guessing. Everything you do should be coordinated with your doctor. If I was having the symptoms and the blood test results that you are having, I would be in the doctor's office, or the hospital, right now having additional tests run.

 
Old 07-03-2005, 06:28 PM   #12
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Re: 21 years old, high blood pressure

Quote:
Originally Posted by beerzoids
Cutting down on sodium probably is a very good idea, but I don't think that will significantly help you with your very high blood sodium level problem. Your blood sodium level is balanced by your kidneys. A high blood sodium level indicates that the kidneys are not doing their job.
I dont know how he can tell the blood sodium level .... he got the high sodium and high creatinine from a 24 hour urine test.

Quote:
Originally Posted by beerzoids
From what I have read, a high creatine level could also indicate problems with the kidneys. They have to determine someone's normal creatine level based on their body mass. The larger the body mass, the higher the range.
Agreed.... he said mine were only slightly high, but then he said to completely ignore the number. He said they were high because of my relative "something", or some kind of "ratio". he didn't seem to have any problem with the level, he just said I have to lower my sodium, and then focused strictly on my fast heart beat for the rest of the visit.

Quote:
I would take his diagnosis code very seriously. You might be able to get some information on a board like Healthboards, but there are no health professionals here.
Again, he didn't even mention anything about my kidneys being wrong. Is he lieing to me until he knows more info?


Quote:
Do you remember why they gave you a kidney function test?
I had out of nowhere high blood pressure starting a few years back, so they tested for everything. When one doctor told me everything was fine and I just needed to lose weight and take pills, I went for a second opinion at a prominent medical hospital in Phila******a, which is where I am going now.


Quote:
I just did a search on "avapro kidney". A lot of articles popped up that speak about doctors giving avapro to diabetics. Many of them say that, In people with type 2 diabetes and high blood pressure, Avapro is also prescribed to stave off damage to the kidneys, often delaying the need for dialysis and a kidney transplant.
I know they told me I didn't have diabetes, it was tested as recently as a few weeks back.


Quote:
To a novice like me, your symptoms all scream out either Diabetes or Insulin Resistance, along with the kidney problems. If it were me, I would check with the doctor to get approval to get on a diet that could reverse Insulin Resistance.
My mom has diabetes (type 2), but I'm only 21. I know 21 year olds can get it, but I know they tested it because I asked about it and they said no chance as of now.

Quote:
With an insulin resistance diet, like I am on, one has to eat five or six small meals a day, consisting of 1/2 cup of 100% whole grain, 1/2 cup of a low sugar vegetable, and a little bit of protein. In between most meals, I have a 1/4th cup of almonds. These amounts would probably have to be bumped up somewhat to take into consideration your weight.

But...... keep in mind that I am not a health professional, and I am only guessing. Everything you do should be coordinated with your doctor. If I was having the symptoms and the blood test results that you are having, I would be in the doctor's office, or the hospital, right now having additional tests run.

Makes me wonder if I should take the tests he wants me to get done and go get them done now.

 
Old 07-03-2005, 07:33 PM   #13
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Re: 21 years old, high blood pressure

This is making me happy. Maybe someone can further help my happyness.

The creatinine and sodium levels that were checked were in my urine, not my blood.

From *****:

High creatinine clearance. High creatinine clearance values can be caused by strenuous exercise, muscle injury (especially crushing injuries), burns, carbon monoxide poisoning, hypothyroidism, and pregnancy.

This would explain why he didn't make a big deal about it and is testing my thyroid. I was out of the range of 80 - 250 (I was 275), but I was HIGH, not LOW. High meaning that my body sent out a high amount of creatinine. The above symptoms say hypothyroidism, which is maybe why he is testing it....

Am I making sense? Does this mean I'm probably OK for now?

 
Old 07-03-2005, 07:54 PM   #14
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Re: 21 years old, high blood pressure

Quote:
Originally Posted by mjuszczak
Am I making sense? Does this mean I'm probably OK for now?
Your symptoms of high blood pressure, heart rhythm irregularities, and excess sweating, are telling you that something is not right.

Exercise and proper diet are the two best medicines. You are already getting a lot of exercise. I don't know about your diet.

I have no idea about the seriousness of your condition.

I suspect Insulin Resistance, which can also result in kidney problems, high blood pressure, excess sweating and heart rhythm problems, among others.

Insulin resistance is pre-Diabetes type 2. Most people with diabetes type 2 first got insulin resistant.

During the time when one's body is becoming Insulin Resistant blood sugar test levels can be normal. Although insulin resistance is mainly caused by hereditary genetic factors, it can also be caused by eating meals with excessive calories.

Here is what happens. When you continue to eat meals that have too many calories, such as in high carbohydrate meals, the body slowly becomes resistant to the excess insulin produced by the pancreas. As time goes by, without diet change, the body becomes more resistant to insulin, and the pancreas keeps putting out more and more insulin. The body, in turn, becomes more and more resistant to the excess insulin. Then, finally, the pancreas can't keep up any more, starts to fail, and the result is Diabetes Type 2.

Insulin is extremely important to body functions, so when someone becomes insulin resistant, the result is all kinds of misery, including sleep apnea, fatigue, brain fogginess, feeling agitated, etc. Another test for Insulin Resistance is high triglyceride readings. Have you ever had your triglyceride level tested?

I could also be totally wrong about you being Insulin Resistant. I am just throwing out some thoughts, for you, or anyone else reading this thread.

I wish you the best of luck and health. Have a fun Fourth of July!

 
Old 07-03-2005, 08:10 PM   #15
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Re: 21 years old, high blood pressure

beerzoids,

I appreciate your response I will definitely get it checked out and mention it to my doctor.

I was just hoping that my high creatinine wasn't something to be alarming, and it appears that if its high in the urine, its not life threatening (as it would be if it was majorly high in the blood test).

I'll take your advice though thanks.

-Matt

 
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