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Old 02-12-2011, 10:11 AM   #1
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What else should I try :(

I have tried BBs, ACEs, ARBs and CCBs also I have tried duiretics. What else should I be trying
The side effects are just too much to handle, my life is literally on hold!!!

 
Old 02-12-2011, 07:14 PM   #2
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Re: What else should I try :(

Ive been where youre at (actually Im sort of still there), and Im sort of an antihypertensives nerd these days.....

In regards to CCBs, did you try all the subclasses? Verapamil, amlodipine, diltiazem each represent different variants of CCBs. Give me more info, and I can provide further suggestions (I have researched and tried 12+ meds over the years).

In regards to beta blockers, its a similar situation. They really arent all identical. Carvedilol, Bystolic and labetalol are vasodilating and thus behave differently than the beta1 selectives (metoprolol, atenolol, bisoprolol, etc). Carvedilol is a nonselective beta blocker so it is more prone to side effects related to beta 2 and 3 blockade - but worth a try unless youre an asthmatic. Bystolic is a newer drug (brand name only), labetalol is perhaps not often used - but like the other vasoldilating beta blockers is good to preserve exercise capacity.

Aliskiren ??

Also, please indicate why you couldnt tolerate the others. This may help narrow down drugs to try next/combos at lower doses that may be tolerable to you.

Last edited by atengnr; 02-12-2011 at 07:16 PM.

 
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Old 02-12-2011, 09:12 PM   #3
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Re: What else should I try :(

atengnr,

Thank you so much for help, you have no idea how bad my life is. I have injuried shoulders and knees and can barely move. I have tried ARBs and ACEs, they caused the same nasty side effects : breathless, heavy legs, dizziness, sweating all the time, complete impotence and fatigue. I think if I try one of ARBs then all of them cause the same side effects right? I tried Cozaar and Atacand anyway.

I'm weaning off diltiazem because of the severe dry eyes and blurry vision it's causing. I have tried Norvasc 5mg, but my heart rate was up so I stopped it.

I found that in Egypt we have Carvedilol 25mg, should I be trying it? I hope it's better than Bisoprolol 5mg.
Thanks for help man
Mike

 
Old 02-12-2011, 10:47 PM   #4
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Re: What else should I try :(

Quote:
Originally Posted by cartner View Post
atengnr,

Thank you so much for help, you have no idea how bad my life is. I have injuried shoulders and knees and can barely move. I have tried ARBs and ACEs, they caused the same nasty side effects : breathless, heavy legs, dizziness, sweating all the time, complete impotence and fatigue. I think if I try one of ARBs then all of them cause the same side effects right? I tried Cozaar and Atacand anyway.

I'm weaning off diltiazem because of the severe dry eyes and blurry vision it's causing. I have tried Norvasc 5mg, but my heart rate was up so I stopped it.

I found that in Egypt we have Carvedilol 25mg, should I be trying it? I hope it's better than Bisoprolol 5mg.
Thanks for help man
Mike
Agreed, OK so ACEIs ARBS are out.

In regards to diltiazem, if dry eyes was the only issue, then give verapamil a try. These drugs are similar, but absolutely not idenitical.

Did you get dry eyes with norvasc? Another thought, if heart rate was your complaint with norvasc, then you could ask your doc to add a bit of beta blocker to the norvasc to blunt the reflex tachycardia youre seeing.

Carvedilol is perhaps a better drug, but I think this depends on what you dislike about bisoprolol. If your complaint is fatigue, I suspect carvedilol wont be any better. But, it is worth a try, as is bystolic (nebivolol).

Aliskiren is another option as well (perhaps you might save it for last).

So, thoughts I have are:

- Try Verapamil (CCB)

- ask about adding a bit of beta blocker (bisoprolol would be good I think) to norvasc to blunt the heart rate increase (Im assuming you had no issues with norvasc other than that)

- If fatigue is getting to you with beta blockers, you might try coreg, nebivolol, but you are likely to have fatigue issues with all of them IMO

- Try Aliskiren

BTW, what was your issue with diuretics??

 
Old 02-13-2011, 12:13 AM   #5
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Re: What else should I try :(

I don't know man I'm so confused right now
The first time I took Norvasc I almost fainted, but when I had coffee I came back to normal. I started to feel that my eyes are better now, no blurry vision at least and it's less dry. I took 5mg of Bisoprolol yesterday, but in few hours I felt that I was hit by a truck.

diuretics caused dizziness and heavy legs too , Verapamil would cause the same side effects as Diltiazem too.
Right now life is very difficult for me

 
Old 02-13-2011, 03:25 AM   #6
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Re: What else should I try :(

Couple of thoughts...

Do they know what is causing your high blood pressure? How high is it? You mention that your knees, etc. cause you considerable pain. Pain triggers a sympathetic nervous system response and may be to blame for at least part of your high blood pressure. If that is the case, then you might want to consider focusing on ways to treat the pain you suffer from. There are cases of hypertension where no root cause can be found, but there a many when hypertension is actually a symptom of some underlying problem.

Have you made the suggested lifestyle changes for lowering blood pressure? For instance, the DASH diet, maintaining a healthy weight, healthy sodium/potassium ratios, not drinking a lot of alcohol, not smoking, avoiding caffeine, making sure you get adequate sleep, nominal fructose intake, etc. There are a number of people for which these lifestyle changes make a big difference.

Another way to lower blood pressure is with herbs and therapies. Some of the most successfully tested herbs include CoQ10, garlic, and hawthorn. Dandelion is also an amazing natural diuretic. As far as therapies go, your only real choices are rhythmic breathing (Stress Eraser, Resperate) and isometric handgrip therapy (Zona Plus). Both seem to help calm the sympathetic nervous system and isometric handgrip therapy has also been shown to help improve artery function. My grandfather had great success with the Zona, so I will admit I am a bit biased but I have heard of people using both successfully.

I really hope you are able to find some answers soon and can get back to living life to its fullest!!!

 
Old 02-13-2011, 07:27 AM   #7
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Re: What else should I try :(

Cartner did you get shortness of breath and a fast pulse when you were on some of these meds? I found that to be true with Benicar and lisinopril. Benicar it was way worse but then I was on a higher dose.

 
Old 02-13-2011, 07:44 AM   #8
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Re: What else should I try :(

Flutterbye77,
I have the same side effects you had on both ACEs and ARBs , actually more.

 
Old 02-13-2011, 07:48 AM   #9
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Re: What else should I try :(

runnnergirl,

Thanks for your support and help. I have hypertension way before my joints problems. My parents and my sisters have high bp, so it's in our Genes. I have tried all drug classes with failure, I just took a duiretic one hour ago and I started to feel dizzy and my mouth is very dry, also I think it affects my eyes too
I don't know what else to do, it seems there is no hope. I use Hawthorn but I can't depend on it alone, I can't exercise because of my joint problems. I can barely walk!

 
Old 02-13-2011, 08:04 AM   #10
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Re: What else should I try :(

Quote:
Originally Posted by cartner View Post
I don't know man I'm so confused right now
The first time I took Norvasc I almost fainted, but when I had coffee I came back to normal. I started to feel that my eyes are better now, no blurry vision at least and it's less dry. I took 5mg of Bisoprolol yesterday, but in few hours I felt that I was hit by a truck.

diuretics caused dizziness and heavy legs too , Verapamil would cause the same side effects as Diltiazem too.
Right now life is very difficult for me
Did you try less than 5 mg norvasc? Did 5 mg lower your bp too much, causing the faintness? Did you try a lower dose?

Verapamil is not exactly the same as diltiazem, so you wouldnt know if youll have the eye effect unless you try it. Sure they both impact mostly calcium channels on cardiac tissue, but their action is not quite the same.

With diuretics, again, did you try a very low dose at first??

How high is your bp, when untreated?

 
Old 02-13-2011, 08:13 AM   #11
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Re: What else should I try :(

Quote:
Originally Posted by cartner View Post
Flutterbye77,
I have the same side effects you had on both ACEs and ARBs , actually more.
I totally understand but my doctors didn't. I also never knew anyone with the same side effect. For me it seemed the lower my pressure would go, the shortness of breath and pulse would race. I hated it!! I don't know what you can do ither than live with the side effects. I know it sounds terrible but it's better than having the side effect of high blood pressure.

I hope you find something that works for you.

 
Old 02-13-2011, 08:24 AM   #12
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Re: What else should I try :(

Thanks for your support, I'm doing what I can to stay healthy! I will keep researching and trying different doses.
I will keep you posted
Mike

 
Old 02-13-2011, 08:59 AM   #13
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Re: What else should I try :(

what is your blood pressure without meds? because i have noticed one thing you and I share and that we both tend to have a high diastolic, which most people battle with the systolic. I am wondering if there is some connection.

Last edited by Flutterbye77; 02-13-2011 at 09:04 AM.

 
Old 02-13-2011, 09:15 AM   #14
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Re: What else should I try :(

Yes I have a high diastolic too, my bp without meds can be 140/110 sometimes or 150/100 - 140-100. Actually, at times it can be 130-100

My problem is not only with the readings but with the symptoms, even if my reading is 130/90. I feel breathless and I get dizzy when I stand up instantly. This is without medications, when I take diltiazem for example those symptoms disappear and I feel good (regarding those symptoms only). It's really wierd!!!

 
Old 02-13-2011, 10:23 AM   #15
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Re: What else should I try :(

Cartner,

I am starting to get the feeling that you are trying everything on your own, without a proper diagnose or follow up. Is this correct?

The symptoms that you describe, "breathless and I get dizzy when I stand up instantly" are not normally related with BP, but with other diseases, and you also indicates that you have them even with normal BP (130/90). Have you ever been evaluated by a cardiologist??

In the other hand, what is exactly the problem that you have with your joints?? There are many things that can be linked...and what medications do you take for them?? In particular any NSAID like Ibuprofen or alike, will increase your BP.

You say it is genetics ... my view on that is that UNLESS you know what is the gen, and you have been tested for it, and you know what is the process that that particular gen controls, there is a good chance that all the genetics issues translate in deficiencies to process or produce some key nutrients ... then adding those solve the problem easily.. and that brings me to another question... Have you ever been tested for Vitamin D deficiency?

Low Vit. D may increase BP, and produce deficiencies in autoimmune system that can translate in terrible joint pains...

Jesus

Last edited by jeda; 02-13-2011 at 10:25 AM.

 
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