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Old 10-10-2002, 11:06 AM   #1
Blue4U2
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Angry Doctors are not pshyologists!!!!!

I have been reading a lot of postings and responding to some for months now. THere seems to be a special concentrstion these days, of medical doctors who like to blame everything on anxiety.

This is beginning to pi** me off.

While there ARE some wonderful doctors out there, I have not met any of them, and it does not sound like many of you have either.

You know, there were the days not so many years ago
when doctors thought you could bleed pain out of the skull by impaling it.

THere were the days when doctors believed that bad spirits could be the cause of a disease because they did not know what to do. The patients who trusted them died as a result.

The people in their time believed in them.... they thought they were gods among them.

Now we look back at some of the practices doctors had and realize they were idiots.

Who says it is any different today?

With growing technology, there is great advancement in the medical field.
But THEY DO NOT KNOW EVERY THING!!!!
Just as chickenpox was incurable in its youth, people then thought it was this horrible disease, and then, it was.
But today we have a vaccination for it.

What is to say that it isn't the same with today's
"incurable diseases?"

As population grows, environmental hazards increase,
insurance capitolism inflates, immigration continues
new diseases are borne evry day.

Have you ever heard a doctor say "I JUST DON'T KNOW!"?

No. They blame you and put you on prozac for that clogged atery that could not be detected by an ekg.

They give you albuterol for a stomach virus.

They give you Xanax for that intermittent epiliepsy problem.

There are REAL ANXIETY problems, TOO.

JEEZ, LOOK at our society.... the world. OF COURSE we are having PANIC disorders.

But I am starting to think a lot of people are getting diagnosed at the cost of their lives.

I lost a year of mine and nearly was institutionalized
because I had a stomach infection, but was diagnosed with anxiety disorder.

I spent months on my face from the drugs, and more vomiting, and thousands of dollars later, and 2130 hours lost from working....and an anxiety disorder caused by the physical problems.....

And I saw a commercial on t.v. about lawsuit abuse....
Our POOR doctors.....they get sued so much they have to move to new states...
Well.... as far as I am concerned, do it right or DO SOME THING ELSE.

There is no room for mistakes when you have someone elses life in your hands. If you think there is, you should not be practicing.

And Bedside manner? The doctrs who are in it for the money? The doctors who make you feel worse than you did before you saw them? GRRRRR.

All of us are afraid.
Even those of us whose doctors who are among the few decent ones left.

I am sorry that so many of you are going through so much pain. I do not think ANY of it is in ANY of your MINDS!!!!!

The medical practice has just become a huge money industry. Every commercial is about a drug, every billboard about hospitals, vd's and insurance....
It is being shoved down our throats. If everything was cured, millions of people would be unemployed, and our economy would crash because the pharmecuetical companies would not be in business.

Jee, I wonder why there so many horrible diseases without cures.

Blue

 
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Old 10-10-2002, 02:01 PM   #2
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I empathize with you, and feel bad for your lost year. What I don't get is when you walk into a doc's office and they ask YOU to tell them what's wrong. Why can't we bypass the damn middle man ('doctor') and just go straight to the damn pharmacy and ask for the cure-all fix-it pill they will give us anyways. Gees, ya know, I didn't go to school all those years like those so called doctor's, why the hell am I telling them what the problem is. It's like they expect us to figure out what is wrong and how to cure it before we even step foot in their office. UGH!

 
Old 10-10-2002, 03:36 PM   #3
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yes...... either that, or, what you tell them doesn't matter. Rather than making the cure fit the symptoms, they already have an idea in their head and make your symtoms fit that idea.

I have made a point to educate myself on health and that could be good and bad.

A person has got to do SOMETHING when out of work for so long. Plus I am OCD so I took to studying physiology and anatomy.

I studied every physiology book I could get my hands on and learned about everything I could.

Then, when I had no more books to read, I borrowed my friend's psychology books from college.

One book is behavioral adjustment, another is psych 2
and the third is psych 3.

Interesting. I recommend to everyone reading a physiology book.

There is a reason doctors hate educated patients.

They cant jerk them around.

Blue

 
Old 10-10-2002, 04:44 PM   #4
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I now exactly where you are coming from..In 97 I had excruciating back pain,went to the doctor at least 4-5 times.Each doctor I went to ran no tests to determine the cause of my pain(at that time I was not working and had no insurance)so they blamed my Panic Disorder as the reason I was hurting.I was prescribed Muscle Relaxers,pain pills of all sorts and Steroids with no relief.Finally I went to a State close to me to get PROPER care and was diagnosed with Vertebral Osteomylitis Septic Discitis.To narrow that down,it was a Staph infection that could of Paralyzed me,caused extensive Heart and Heart Valve probs OR I could of died.While in hosp,I had a Subclavian Groshong Cath placed so I could take Antibiotics at home after a 3 week hosp stay.On top of everything I went through the Groshong became infected..They told me this could happen..Anyway when it became infected I ran a high fever of 105-106 and chilled so severly I convulsed.I went to the doctor(foreign)and he consulted with the Infectious Disease doctor,of all silly things after calling the doctor he gave me samples of Claritin!!Can you believe this??That is for Allergies!!I went to the Surgeon that placed the Cath and within a few days he removed it,prescribed me Cipro and I was on the road to recovery..

 
Old 10-10-2002, 09:13 PM   #5
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I E Ė mailed the FDA stating

"I think it's utterly ridiculous that Red Yeast Rice is outlawed. The highly expensive statins (that you're making large amounts of money from) are life threatening and they're not nearly as affective as Red Yeast Rice. Bayer's drug Baycol caused over 100 deaths. Red Yeast Rice has been proven to be the safest, cheapest, and most affective way to lower cholesterol. What's wrong with having a safe, cheap, and affective way to lower cholesterol? Oh yeah, that's right, it causes you to loose a lot of money. In other countries people who use it live longer, healthier lives. Red Yeast Rice was sold in the U.S for over six years (and was proven by the people to be the most affective way to lower cholesterol, otherwise no one would have bought it) and not a single person reported any harm or injury from it. If you really want to outlaw something that's harmful to people (that has been proven to be harmful to people), why don't you outlaw cigarettes, cigars, alcohol, and other harmful substances. Oh yeah, that's right, because the government makes a fortune from these harmful substances. Yet marijuana is outlawed because the government can't regulate it (therefore the government doesn't make any money from it). I'm not saying that marijuana is a good thing for people to take, but I know for a fact that if the government can regulate it (and make money from it) they would legalize it in a split second. This proves that your number one concern isn't the well being of the people, but it's the well being of your money. I thought America is supposed to be for the people, by the people. Well I guess I was wrong."

Their response

"Thanks for writing. I understand you frustration, but please know the govt.
is not making money by prohibiting this product from the market."

My response

"Explain yourself.

Red Yeast Rice has been used in China for centuries for lowering cholesterol. It's probably the safest, most affective, and cheapest method of doing so. People who eat Red Yeast Rice generally live longer, healthier lives than people who don't. The UCLA School of Medicine conducted a study involving 83 people with high cholesterol levels. Within twelve weeks those who received Red Yeast Rice experienced a significant decrease in total cholesterol, LDL (bad) cholesterol, and triglycerides compared to those who received placebo. HDL (good) cholesterol wasn't affected in either group during the study. In 1999 two studies involving Red Yeast Rice were presented at the American Heart Association's 39th Annual conference. In the first study, 187 people with mild to moderate elevations in total cholesterol and LDL cholesterol revealed that treatment with red yeast rice reduced total cholesterol by more than 16%, LDL cholesterol by 21%, and triglycerides by 24%. HDL (good) cholesterol increased by 14%. In the second study, elderly people who received red yeast rice experienced significant reductions in total cholesterol and LDL cholesterol compared to those who were given placebo. Both studies were done over an eight-week period. In another 8-week trial with 446 people with high cholesterol levels, those who received red yeast rice experienced a significant drop in cholesterol levels compared to those who received placebo. Total cholesterol dropped by 22.7%, LDL by 31%, and triglycerides by 34%. HDL cholesterol increased by 20%. Red Yeast Rice has been sold in the U.S for over six years and there have been no reports of any harm or injury (from anyone). The very expensive statins now used in America are much more dangerous and less affective than Red Yeast Rice. Bayer's drug Baycol was removed from the market in August, 2001 because it caused over 100 deaths.

Give me one good reason why Red yeast Rice is outlawed."

Their response

"Below is the reason that you cannot market red yeast rice legally.

GC Litigation Summaries:
"Pharmanex v. Shalala (D. Utah) On March 30, 2001, the United States
District Court for the District of Utah (Judge Dale A. Kimball) denied
Pharmanex Inc.'s motion to Set Aside Administrative Decision, and granted
FDA's motion to Affirm Administrative Decision, in the Cholestin matter.
This matter involves a purported dietary supplement product that contains
lovastatin, the active ingredient present in the prescription drug Mevacor,
intended to reduce serum cholesterol levels. Last fall, the Tenth Circuit
Court of Appeals had ruled in favor of FDA on legal issues, but remanded the
matter back to the district court for resolution of certain factual issues.
In the latest ruling, the district court has affirmed the factual bases
supporting FDA's Administrative Decision that Pharmanex, in marketing
Cholestin, was marketing lovastatin, an article approved as a new drug that
was not before such approval, marketed as a food or dietary supplement. This
means that, under DSHEA, red yeast rice containing lovastatin is regulated
as a drug and not a dietary supplement.."

That means if the company Pharmanex could prove that their product
containing red yeast rice was marketed prior to the drug Lovostatin, then
they could continue to market.

mk11"

My response

"Why don't you just outlaw Cholestin? Why did you outlaw Red Yeast Rice. Red Yeast Rice has been around much longer than Mevacor. So basically what you're trying to tell me is that the medical system has the right to find an ingredient in any herb (or plant), create a drug that contains that ingredient (even though the herb / plant has been around much longer than the drug), outlaw the herb / plant, and sell the drug for as much money as they please? This isn't a democracy.

Here is the flaw in your reasoning for outlawing Red Yeast Rice.

The FDA says red yeast rice has not been approved through Stage 3 drug testing, therefore doctors cannot write prescriptions for it. If the ingredient in Red Yeast Rice is identical to lovastatin then it has already been approved through Stage 3. If it has not been approved, then that can only mean it is not identical, and thus the grounds for its ban are invalid."

------------------
Life is in the Blood

 
Old 10-11-2002, 07:06 AM   #6
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I for one have heard doctors say "i don't know" and I for one appreciate it when they do say that. At least they are being honest. I am sorry you haven't found a good doctor lately but fortunately for me and my family we have had good doctors now and the one we had before relocating here.

 
Old 10-11-2002, 08:59 AM   #7
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Hi Blue,

I have to agree with you - its real sad, but a lot of the time its a reality.

What kind of stomach infection did you have? I am interested, as I had problems with a stomach infection earlier on this year and was really sick from it. I have since also discovered that I have food intolerances that were adding to my problems.

The best thing I did however was switching from going to see an MD to seeing an ND. He is really great and it is the best thing I ever did. More natural cures and a much better bed side manner. He has time for patients too.

 
Old 10-11-2002, 01:19 PM   #8
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I do agree with you that it is very difficult to find a good doctor, but I do not think that all doctors are as you described. (although a good deal of them are!) I personally have been extremely extremely fortunate to have found a wonderful doctor who has cared so much for me and about me that he has become a friend. I think that as patients we need to develop good working relationships with our doctors. I mean, anything that a patient can do to help out with their own treatment is always beneficial. If I am diagnosed with something, the first thing I do is go online and start reading as many web-sites as I possibly can about the condition. Sometimes the doctor is not always informed of the latest medical treatments, and the patient can enlighten them. My doctor for example, loves it when I come in with new information for him. In fact, he has occasionally asked me to go online for him and find out about a new medication if he can't get any info on it himself. I certainly do not think that patients should have to cure themselves, but it is always helpful if you go into a drs office with a list of complaints and what you want the dr to help you with. I have also had more than one doctor tell me "I don't know what is wrong, why don't you go and get a second opinion?"

I am sorry that you haven't found a good doctor. It's really a shame that when you (everyone) go to a dr for help, you wind up getting more and more stressed out because the dr doesn't listen to you. I also totally agree that diseases are not all in peoples heads. (I've been told that on more than one occasion, and I got up and walked out every time) If a disease is in my head, then howcome I can see the physical symptoms?

Trust me, there are some really great doctors out there who will take the time to listen to you and work with you to address all of your concerns. It's just that they are really hard to find!

 
Old 10-11-2002, 02:23 PM   #9
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Helicobactor pylori is the infection.

It caused me everything ranging from fatigue to intermittant fevers, an enlarged spleen (since it was not found, it caused more problems).....stomach pain you'd go to the emegency room for, and headaches.

I was put on steroids, which made me psychotic, mixed with Claritin, Klonipin, Paxil, Benadryl, Pepsid, Ativan, Flovent, and Albuterol.

If I ever made it out of my house, it was to be escorted to the doctors or in an ambulance to the emergency room for drug interactions and allergies to particular drugs. Please understand, I was put on these drugs all at once.

Never was anything else done about my stomach until I finally switched doctors. A very cloudy year went by
before I finally was off everything (at my own disgretion) and only then was I clearminded enough to realize I needed to seek out a new doctor.

(HMO's make things difficult too)

But the physicians I was seeing was through a university hospital.... renowned once for its brilliant doctors..... but losing its reputation quickly.

This doctors office never scheduled me with the same doctors, and What was put into the computer on my first visit was what they went according to.... NOT what I told them.

When I went in the first time, I had a doctor whose impression was that I had an anxiety problem.
(Mind you I WAS anxious that I hadn't gooten a deep breath in three months and was scared.) But my life was happy.
I was clear about that.

He did not check my breathing or feel my stomach.
Instead, he gave me a piece of paper and told me to write down ten things from my past that made me feel depressed.

This shocked me.
Luckily, my sister was with me and she told him I was there to get my body checked..... not to be telling this man personal emotions of mine from the past. (This was the furthest thing from my mind)

It did not matter. Whatever he wrote in the computer
haunted me the next year.

They checked everything except for my stomach.
I would ask, but they were so convinced I was anxious that they would not test my GI
I began to believe them. So I went to a psych.
Two psychs felt that I was above average in coping abilities, and thought I needed better doctors.

Not only was it that these medical doctors
didn't give me quality of care, they also prescribed addictive psych meds I did not need which cost me thousands not including what the insurance covered.
Then, they wouldn't even refill them in time. I would be in the ER with withdrawl, (once it was tremors, another time it was seizures)

Horrible.

YES there ARE good doctors out there.
But none of them work at that university office.Istead
I went to a Ghetto clinic in a dangerous part of the city.... and found a doctor who knew what to do, and did it, no b.s. He also agreed with me regarding the psych meds.

I didn't need them.

I have developed a death phobia as a result of some of the things that happened in this last year, mostly for
coming so close to it as a result of incompetence.
I have also developed a serious hatred toward money.
It seems to be more important than people.

I am glad some of you have great doctors. I sure wish you all did.

Blue


 
Old 10-12-2002, 02:30 AM   #10
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Blue4U2:

What you went through was hellish! Thank goodness you finally got a doctor that helped you!

To all:
It is not just all about money. Many doctors are just not well enough informed, with each specialized field of study being so compartmentalized! Who would have time to be there for people, have a life, and stay on top of each field?

Many times something I had going on went undiagnosed, then also, many times, something was dianosed quickly due to a doctor having recently dealt with the same issue.

Doctors are just human and no one knows everything, and we need to be our own healthcare advocate, and do our own research. I research each suggested drug and treatment, and decide for myself what I will and will not take.

Listen to your own gut feeling, and do not accept any doctor that does not listen to you or who is arrogant.
A listening docotr can help you find out what is wrong.

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Old 10-12-2002, 10:56 AM   #11
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Thank you.

But I am not a victim of the system anymore.

My main problem, bottom line is these primary care physicians REFUSAL to refer me for tests or to specialists.

They were so convinced it was anxiety right off the bat that I never stood a chance of getting help.

While I agree that doctors cannot stay on top of everything, these doctors decided to take psychology into thier own hands.

Maybe I should also mention that I searched myself, over and over, to figure out what I did or how I behaved to give them such an impression.

My sister told me it was because I am tatooed and pierced. I also shave my head.

I guess a person would have to have issues, then, huh?
I choose to be taken for who I am, in my face, in my eyes..... not by wearing a certain hairstyle or certain mainstream clothes. It does not work for me. It is lovely for some... but not me.
But this idea of living not in a state of vanity backfired. People attached their own meanings to it, and thus,I am alone in my comfort with myself in society....with the exception of those who know me.

In the last year, I was asked more than two dozen times if I was a drug user. I had doctors tell me I HAD to be..... I had a coup[le ask me if I was sure.
I later found out that some addicts shave their heads so that a strand test cannot be conducted.

I had no idea.

But the irony in it all is that I do not even like to take tylenol......and, they HAD MY BLOOD. How could they NOT know I am not a user.

And then, they put me on a whole slew of a different kind of addictive drugs.


I digress.

God Bless the doctors who are not so conformed to the politics of the medical industry, that there is still some integrity and interest left, and a little spark of
intrigue enough to INVESTIGATE an illness.

Perhaps it is not doctors who bother me. Maybe it is the system that governs some of them.

Thank you all for helping me think through this.


Blue

 
Old 10-13-2002, 07:42 AM   #12
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One of the problems is that the FDA outlaws so many natural forms of medication (just to make money, as Iíve proven above), that itís very difficult to treat certain illnesses (because sometimes those outlawed medications are necessary). Why do you think the cancer rate in Japan is one / fourth the cancer rate in America, and their life expectancy is over one hundred years. China isnít that far behind. Itís up to the people to prevent such injustices from occurring. One thing we can do is to be careful whom we vote for.

------------------
Life is in the Blood

 
Old 10-13-2002, 05:14 PM   #13
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I agree.

I also think that some of the spiritual beliefs and relaxation techniques native to China and Japan help them too.

I sort of feel kind of hopeless.
I feel like whenever I have found the answer, something else comes up in my body.
I feel like no one is ever going to figure it out.

While my H pylori was treated, there still seems to be an underlying problem.

The sensation of falling, and it generally starts like an electric impulse in my shoulders.... and I get a tickling itchy feeling in the middle of my shoulder
blades that drives me nuts. An itch on the inside, where you cannot scratch it.
And then theres the sensation that someone is impaling my spine with a big fat needle.

WHo knows.

Maybe I am going to the wrong kind of doctors.
Perhaps I need to see a medical intuit or shaman.

Bluer than usual.


 
Old 10-13-2002, 08:24 PM   #14
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Eat raw (uncooked, unprocessed, unheated) garlic every night before going to bed. Eat small pieces at a time and drink it down with cold water (or milk). Then take some kind of probiotic supplement (make sure it contains Acidophilus and Bifidus). If youíre not lactose intolerant you could take yogurt (but make sure the yogurt you take states that it contains Acidophilus and Bifidus). Even though you got rid of the bacterial infection there is a good chance that you still have other infections (because your immune system was so weak for such a long period of time that it couldnít really fight off organisms very well). Eat a large variety of fruits, vegetables, herbs, etc... If you can, take multivitamins (preferably Centrum. Make sure you get enough vitamins A, C, and E for your immune system). Make sure you get enough calcium (Coral Calcium is the best source of calcium). It will take a long time before your body completely recovers from the damage done by this infection (and all the harmful medications those doctors put you on to purposely keep you sick and take your money). With proper diet, sleep, and exercise (donít worry too much about exercise yet) your body can recover (and as long as you continue to live a healthy lifestyle chances are you wonít have very many problems in the future once you recover. Itís important to make sure your immune system is functioning at all times). Stay away from junk food (chocolate, processed hamburgers from McDonalds, candy, etc...). Be sure to pray (GOD and Jesus do answer prayers), and thank GOD and Jesus when your prayers are answered.

----------------
Donít let others tell you what to think. Think for yourself.

 
Old 10-14-2002, 05:49 AM   #15
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The first thing I do when I awaken is Thank God.
I do not ask him for anything, but thank Him for what is.

Thank you for the advice.
Yes,it is quite important to keep the immune system strong...... I agree. I do not think I really ever recovered from a few years a go when I was pancytopenic with no known cause. I was in the hospital for weeks, and then my spleen began to bleed.

But they never figured out what it was, and there was no real follow-up thereafter until this all started.

But interestingly enough, the air hunger I experienced
is very similar to what I felt when my spleen was enlarged and bleeding.

My CBCs are normal, but my spleen IS enlarged again.

They did not know what was wrong with me three years ago, but it nearly took my life.... with a white blood count of 1.

Doctors and visitors had to wear masks when they came in my room, because the smallest germ could have killed me.

They pumped me with some "kill all" antibiotics and iv
fluids, and I had to get a blood transfusion from
losing so much blood from my spleen.

Incidentally, I still have my spleen because I think God put it in there for a reason.

I am real funny about altering my insides....
just because doctors do not know what something does doesn't mean it can be removed.

BTW, my point regarding the medical profession, is similar to the theory I have about the world.
You will accomplish very little in the future using only what has been the past. The present is occurring, and should not be ignored. Todays present is tomorrows yesterday.

History repeats itself because we obsess on it so much.

With new things borne each day, new diseases, new phantom illnesses..... and biological and chemical warfare.... you would think that they would be more
apt to investigate new things more.

I actually think I may have gotten the west Nile three years ago, but it had not quite been identified until about a month after I was released from the hospital.


Thank you again for your wonderful advice!



Blue

 
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