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Old 05-24-2003, 08:58 AM   #1
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OppOnn HB User
Post Anyone reversed bone loss w/out drugs?

Has anyone reversed bone loss without using drugs?
If so, what did you do? Exactly. Perhaps this could help me - and others wanting to get off drugs.

1. By exercise? What kind? How often? When?
2. With calcium (w magnesium, D minerals)...?
3. How much per day?
4. Taken when during the day?
5. How many at a time?
6. What other supplements?
7. Phospherous? Vit K? SAme? DHEA?
8. Multi-vitamin - with which vits dominating?
9. What do you eat that helps reverse bone loss?
10. What do you drink that helps reverse bone loss?
(how much, how often for each)

What exactly did you take? And do? Any information may be useful.

I controlled my Crohn's without drugs (been in remission for 3 years) - everyone one said I couldn't - and I am going make a good atempt to reverse my bone loss. This is war...
O



 
Old 05-26-2003, 08:22 AM   #2
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I see I am getting no replies, so does that mean no one can say they reversed their bone loss, or stayed the same, when they took no drugs?

Very discouraging if that is the case.

Maybe the questions seem daunting, but one could answer just a few and help others.

Some are very basic, but maybe important. Like I don't think one should take one's calcium the same time as one's multi-vitamin.

I did this because on my Crohn's board someone has done similar, got tons of answers and we are all thrilled with the basic knowledge we all learned.
O

 
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Old 05-27-2003, 10:05 AM   #3
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I would love to know the answer to this one as well. I don't do well with medications and would prefer to fight the battle naturally. You are not alone in your quest. Hang in there, maybe someone will be by sometime in the next century to give us both an answer to this....

 
Old 05-27-2003, 02:18 PM   #4
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Hello OsteoMom:
I hope we can get some answers before "the end of the century!"

I'd be happy to hear someone has managed to maintain their bone loss without losing more by alternative means. There must be someone.

I am investigating myself. Doing major research into alternative options. Onto Vitamin K at the moment. Think I'm going to take 10 mg/day of that to start. And eat more lettuce, since I can't tolerate
too many dark green veggies because of my stomach probs.

Read the protocol from ******* on Osteoporosis. I don't think it is up to date because they mention hormone therapy, but there is some interesting info there.
Good luck to you.
I don't think we are alone in not wanting to take these meds with their short and probably long term side fx.
O


 
Old 05-29-2003, 09:07 PM   #5
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I tried for a year and my bone density got much worst! I'm still feeling the need to help myself through this without the drugs. Right now my hips are -3.7 and it is scary thinking hip fractures. If you find a way let us know as most of us would like to fight this war naturally!!!

 
Old 05-30-2003, 05:37 AM   #6
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even with evista i am still losing bone..just not as much as without it...i hate taking meds but i believe that diet and exercise are most often just not enough.

 
Old 05-30-2003, 07:14 AM   #7
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I'm going to fight taking drugs all the way.

For starters, I don't think calcium is enough on its own, even with magnesium and D, etc.. One must absorb enough of whatever calcium one is taking.
And there are calciums and calciums. I am taking a very sophisticated one, but don't think it was enough, or I am not personally absorbing it.

Looking for a test for that. Although my blood tests say I have normal levels of calcium, the insurance's
labs are not always as accurate as they might be.)

I have changed the way I take calcium. I now take it after lunch, tea and dinner, instead of the first 2 in the morning. I might even up to more a day. One should take the final 2 just before bed but that makes my stomach gurgle too much!

I have added dark green lettuce, the curly one, after lunch and dinner, twice a day, am trying to get more sun, at least 15 minutes a day, also going to research
an exercise program.

And I have, for now, added Vitamin K once a day, 10 mg.
(NOT to be taken if you are taking coumadin or some other type of anticoagulant medication.)

I am going to look into taking phospherous, maybe
MegaSoy (whatever that is), possibly DHEA (but that necessitates regular blood tests to check on certain
levels and my doctor doesn't understand about all this,
she just wants me on Actonel once a week, knows only drugs, but not their side fx!!!) I may have to change her for a doctor with a more open mind to all the alternative options with less side fx - if I can find one on my insurance, no easy matter.

Still researching. I can't post links so you can research the same and make up your own minds because this board doesn't like allow links.

Will keep the board informed.
Good luck to everyone.
O


 
Old 06-27-2003, 04:18 PM   #8
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For bone loss we need to take in the right minerals and the best way to do that is with herbs which are food and our body recognises it and utilises it. Nettles and Oatstraw are excellent. Its always best to use herbs in a tea rather than in pills. You take the herbs and measure 1/4 cup of each and cover with boiling water in a quart jar and leave for 4 hours or overnight. Strain and drink 2-3 cups a day. For more info check susunweed.com, she is an herbalist and altho her spiritual persuasions are not mine, I love her books and she gives outstanding advice. Plus its cheap and easy to make the herb teas. I order from a company that sells organic herbs mountainroseherbs. I also juice fresh veggies every day, eat lots of fruits and vegetables and also a vegetarian. I do eat organic yogurt and cheese and organic eggs.
Brit

 
Old 06-27-2003, 10:09 PM   #9
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So, I am wondering if you have seen improvement from this natural herbal method -- did you have osteoporosis before and it improved?? Thanks for the tips. I have read her book (Susun Weed), but felt a little overwhelmed because things like oatstraw and nettles aren't readily available. I will check out the websites and maybe give this angle a try. I am always looking at ways to improve my own program (I went from osteoporosis to osteopenia in 6 months with increased calcium, weight training, more exercise in general, lots of veggies, soy, and even seaweed for the trace minerals, sun exposure (for vitamin D), and natural progesterone cream. But the 2 scans that I have had so far were on 2 different machines unfortunately, so I am not 100% able to claim that lifestyle changes made the difference, but my family doctor told me yesterday that he thought I really had had significant improvement and to keep on doing what I am doing and he will check me next year! Yay! No drugs for now!
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Old 06-28-2003, 04:23 AM   #10
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OppOnn,

Regarding your Crones - I just saw this on a thread for CFIDS at this Healtboard and it is supposed to address Crones and other autoimmune conditions as well:

"Has anyone tried Aloe Mucilaginous Polysaccharide by M o l o c u r e? I have had good results with high doses of Aloe Vera in the past and think a more concentrated dose of AMP might have a more beneficial effect"

I went to the web site and it looks interesting. I have tried aloe vera in the past with good results but this is a very concentrated form which also deals with digestive problems.

Sorry all for posting this at the osteo site, but didn't know how else to get the info. to OppOnn.

P

 
Old 06-29-2003, 02:21 PM   #11
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I'm not saying it's not possible, each of us is different. But the way I see it, though I'm not particularly fond of taking the drugs either, these drugs have been tested with years of clinical research by scientists who know way more than us. The possible side effects are well known. But me, I'll keep taking the regimen my doctor subscribes to and that includes the Fosamax. If and when I do experience a side effect, then I'll try something else. I just don't trust home remedies or herbalists.

 
Old 06-29-2003, 05:48 PM   #12
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Thank you for hope from most of you! I am posting separately about an interesting rheumatologist I saw last Thursday.

First, though, Brit 1 - interesting about the herbs. Can one get nettles and Oatstraw in America anywhere?
Has everyone you done wiht herbs and minerals actually maintained your bones or reversed the loss? Have you had a bone density test since you started doing this?
Let us know if you have, the results, and when you do, what the results are. Very interested.

marciakeeney: what weight training, exactly do you do?
Which calcium do you take, when, how much? I'd love to know that since you have had some results. These doctors, giving us different scans all the time, hard to compare, you are right. I've had 3 different ones!
How much sun exposure? What kind? Interested to know the results next year. Do keep us informed.

peregrine: Thank you so much for Crohn's info.
I will look it up. I have, though, controlled my
Crohn's by an elimination diet which I designed for myself - taking out foods and drinks which I now consider my enemies by trial and error over 6 months,
then fine-tuning my lists. Been in remission for over
3 years now because I still don't risk eating no-no foods, and I take 2 digestive enzymes before my main
meal, which I think helps my success.

Gabriella. To each his own. One must do what one feels comfortable doing. But do think of all the drugs that have also done harm over the long term, even with FDA approval. Just because one's doctor recommends something, doesn't mean one has to follow that advice, not without a 2nd opinion at least. That's my way.
I like being proactive with my body, because I care about it more than any doctor does. See my new post on my new rheuamatologist.
O


 
Old 06-29-2003, 08:40 PM   #13
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Nettles and oatstraw are good but in order to receive the full benefit you have to eat a whole lot. Also scientific evidence which can be read in the American Medical Journals show that while eating green leafy vegs such as collard greens etc and dairy which are good sources of calcium they are not as readily absorbed by the body in quantities we need each and everyday. If that was all we would need to do we need to eat 4 lbs of greens, 3lbs of dairy everyday to sustain our bone mass as is, hardly possible I think. I tried ala natural for a year and did weight bearing etc etc and loss much more bone, in fact no matter how I have done it I still loose, except this time I gained 3% in my lumbar and yet lost another 10% in the hips where I could not afford to lose. I did nothing this time, no drugs just calcium supplements and rigorous exercise, go figure gain and lose at the same time.

 
Old 06-29-2003, 11:17 PM   #14
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Hi OppOnn
Re your questions above: my weight training was largely a program from Miriam Nelson's book Strong Women Strong Bones which shows what exercises to do (with pictures) very clearly and understandably -- and depending on whether you are have osteoporosis or are just on a preventive program. Also has charts you can copy to keep track of your progress. It's really an excellent resource. I found this book in the public library, but it's not too expensive in paperback from amazon.com. I try to eat a high calcium diet, and also take 2 or 3 calcium supplements a day (currently one with boron, one with magnesium and zinc, and one with Vit D; I aim to get 1500 mg a day of calcium). Plus I take a multivitamin, C, and E daily. The sun exposure bit is important because sometimes your body does not absorb the oral vit. D very well. From everything I have read, you need about one quarter the amount of time it would take to make your skin begin to turn pink, several times a week. So that is individual depending on your latitude, time of year, time of day, skin color, etc. But it is the best way to be sure you are getting the D you need which is vital to absorbing calcium. A lot of research is showing that lack of vit D is a factor in various cancers and diseases besides osteoporosis. For the lady who had declining BMD no matter what she did dietarily and otherwise, I would say, don't give up on the lifestyle changes. You may need to take a medication, but the lifestyle things will help to make it more effective. Osteoporosis is not an easy thing to reverse and medication is sometimes necessary. Don't feel bad if you need to go that route. I may have to at some point, but I want to know that I am doing everything else health-wise that I can do to improve my situation now (and then too!).
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Old 06-30-2003, 08:23 AM   #15
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Well I bought myself some Citracal w/Vitamin D3 this weekend. Now all I have to do is try and remember to take it every day. http://www.healthboards.com/ubb/rolleyes.gif

OppOnn - Have you decided what to be taking yet?

Hope you guys have a great 4th of July!

 
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